Re: allBSD's Stop the Blob Campaign
On Sat, 17 Mar 2007 21:25:21 +0100 [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Dag-Erling Smørgrav) wrote: OK. That's a clear trademark violation. I expect AllBSD will be hearing from the FreeBSD Foundation's lawyers... Hopefully FreeBSD isn't that bloody stupid. -- shannon -- Star Wars Moral Number 17: Teddy | ...but a planet of wookies would still bears are dangerous in herds.| have been a lot better. ___ freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: allBSD's Stop the Blob Campaign
Charles Shannon Hendrix wrote: On Sat, 17 Mar 2007 21:25:21 +0100 [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Dag-Erling Smørgrav) wrote: OK. That's a clear trademark violation. I expect AllBSD will be hearing from the FreeBSD Foundation's lawyers... Hopefully FreeBSD isn't that bloody stupid. No, FreeBSD isn't that stupid. Deb Godkin/FreeBSD Foundation asked us to change some things to comply to the guideline here: http://www.freebsdfoundation.org/documents/Guidelines.shtml We changed some things in the flyers, website, poster etc., please check yourself. More changes are to come soon. - Daniel ___ freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: allBSD's Stop the Blob Campaign
On Mon, 19 Mar 2007 06:32:26 +0100 Szilveszter Adam [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I tread very carefully here, after all, the area is full of dead horses and I might accidentally commit violence against some of them by beating them up some more... [snip] The real blobs are quite few on FreeBSD, because vendors do not see enough incentive to develop drivers for FreeBSD yet mostly, not even closed-source. The only prominent example would be the Nvidia drivers, which are a) not in any way included by default b) are not required for the operation of FreeBSD itself, but rather are for Xorg. You can of course decide to not use those, but the simple reality is that for some hardware, they are the only way to work somewhat ok. This is so much so, that even Ubuntu decided to include the Nvidia and ATI blob drivers by default into their next release instead of just by direct request. even Ubuntu? what a nice OS you have chosen to compare FreeBSD with ... Guess what, even Debian does not have blobs in default install. So, even if someone does not like blobs, they are quite well off on FreeBSD. If you do not use the Nvidia drivers, you are mostly ok unless you use some funky vendor-provided third-party stuff but then it is not FreeBSD's but your responsibility. And no, do not let the OpenBSD propagada mislead you: just because *firmware* is licensed and cannot be freely distributed for some hardware, that does not make it a blob. Please do not misguide people. OpenBSD did not ever say that a firmware with a bad license is a blob This is a completeley separate issue, not related to blobs. It is a firmware that can not be distributed It prevents people from using hardware that they have already paid for on their OS of choice. This is a problem that must be solved Not by making compromises, by including the firmware and making your users turn knobs to accept a license. Most of them will not even have an idea that they are actually aggreeing to: Just type sysctl xyz=1 and your wireless will magically work An OS that claims to be free should not make its users jump through legal hoops. It should prevent such nastiness by getting vendors to allow distribution of the firmware (Come on! It is just distribution rights! The damn thing is already in the Windows CDs bundled with your card) Consenting to the vendor's wishes and adding knobs and ugly legal hacks to the code just makes it hard for other people trying to get vendors to allow distribution. This is the only similiarity to blobs: Once a Free OS consents to blobs, it makes it much harder for others to get specs and documentation from the same vendor. Unfortunately, FreeBSD is doing the Open Source world a disservice by allowing blobs and making special deals with vendors for distributing such firmware. It is already hurting us, and will hurt everyone, including FreeBSD much more in the future. Can ___ freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: allBSD's Stop the Blob Campaign
Can Erkin Acar wrote: Unfortunately, FreeBSD is doing the Open Source world a disservice by allowing blobs and making special deals with vendors for distributing such firmware. It is already hurting us, and will hurt everyone, including FreeBSD much more in the future. If you don't agree to the firmware lincense, don't use it. This *is* redistribution of the firmware, exactly as you suggested, and it will have no detrimental impact in ou attempts to negotiate further. You are doing the world a disservice by spreading FUD. -matt -- Matt Olander CTO, iXsystems - Servers for Open Source http://www.iXsystems.com Public Relations, The FreeBSD Project http://www.FreeBSD.org BSD on the Desktop! http://www.pcbsd.org Phone: (408)943-4100 ext. 113 Fax: (408)943-4101 -- ___ freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: allBSD's Stop the Blob Campaign
On Mon, 19 Mar 2007 06:32:26 +0100 Szilveszter Adam [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I tread very carefully here, after all, the area is full of dead horses and I might accidentally commit violence against some of them by beating them up some more... On Mon, Mar 19, 2007 at 02:19:03AM +0100, Jona Joachim wrote: I followed the discussion on openbsd-misc, that's why I started this thread, to hear what the FreeBSD folks have to say about it. It's really unfortunate that FreeBSD-GENERIC ships with that whole bunch of blobs IMHO. Open source projects that distribute proprietary software bite their own tail. I think we agree on the fact that blobs are bad and a lot of other FreeBSD users share that same opinion. It would be interesting to hear what the leaders of the projects have to say about this. Is it more important to support hardware than to claim the right for free documentation? Are there other interests involved? Finally I'd like to remind everyone of the fact that not buying undocumented hardware is a good way to fight it. I think you are quite misguided when you say that FreeBSD ships with a whole bunch of blobs by default. This comes from the fact that - it seems so to me - many people confuse binary closed-source drivers (the ones that really can be could blobs) and closed-source *firmware*. But the difference is quite there. I do not think anyone should have anything against binary *firmware* Just because firmware is no longer soldered into your hardware, but needs to be loaded into it from your HDD every time, it still remains firmware. Just because it is on your filesystem, it still remains firmware. While there are some efforts to produce opensource firmware for certain hardware, there is nothing wrong with using the original closed-source one, this poses *no* threat to opensource developers or users. Most of the blobs that DES listed in this thread are just that: firmware. If you do not like that, fine, but then start by not buying any machine that has a proprietary BIOS. That will somewhat reduce the selection available to... uhm... yeah. To about 0. Reflashing does not count. Yes, I know. I'm aware of three blob drivers that are frequently used on FreeBSD: the NVIDIA graphics driver, the Atheros HAL (could possibly be replaced by OpenHAL) and the Adaptec RAID driver. A whole bunch was perhaps a bit exaggerated but I think it's more a matter of principle than a matter of quantity. The fact that closed-source firmware is inevitable these days is not to be encouraged IMO, it's just a sad fact. But, as you mentioned, things are changing. The real blobs are quite few on FreeBSD, because vendors do not see enough incentive to develop drivers for FreeBSD yet mostly, not even closed-source. The only prominent example would be the Nvidia drivers, which are a) not in any way included by default b) are not required for the operation of FreeBSD itself, but rather are for Xorg. You can of course decide to not use those, but the simple reality is that for some hardware, they are the only way to work somewhat ok. This is so much so, that even Ubuntu decided to include the Nvidia and ATI blob drivers by default into their next release instead of just by direct request. If the vendors released their specs and provided appropriate documentation they wouldn't need to write drivers for *BSD or even Linux. A lot of developers would be more than happy to write good drivers with the help of the vendor instead of having to do reverse engineering. So, even if someone does not like blobs, they are quite well off on FreeBSD. If you do not use the Nvidia drivers, you are mostly ok unless you use some funky vendor-provided third-party stuff but then it is not FreeBSD's but your responsibility. And no, do not let the OpenBSD propagada mislead you: just because *firmware* is licensed and cannot be freely distributed for some hardware, that does not make it a blob. I think I'm able to process information and make up my own opinion. Regards, Jona -- I am chaos. I am the substance from which your artists and scientists build rhythms. I am the spirit with which your children and clowns laugh in happy anarchy. I am chaos. I am alive, and tell you that you are free. Eris, Goddess Of Chaos, Discord Confusion signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: allBSD's Stop the Blob Campaign
Jona Joachim schrieb: On Sat, 17 Mar 2007 21:47:46 +0100 [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Dag-Erling Smørgrav) wrote: Jan Husar [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Dag-Erling Smørgrav [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: OK. That's a clear trademark violation. I expect AllBSD will be hearing from the FreeBSD Foundation's lawyers... What this suppose to mean? Allbsd is doing a pretty awesome job! No matter how good a job they do, they still have to follow the law. What makes you say they violated the law? I'm quite sure some people of the FreeBSD Foundation were shown this before it was made public. Jona Sure, allBSD has permission to use the Freebsd logo etc. and we use it on labels, flyers etc. for years and we are following every advice Deb Godkin has given us and I frequently mail him to take care everything is done according to the policy the FreeBSD foundation has. If somebody is irritated here: Yes, FreeBSD uses Blobs, but a lot of people don't think this is a good idea (to promote that use). This campaign is about telling people why Blobs are bad and why we need support for freely available documentation. The upcoming flyer will explain all the details. This poster is just the beginning please don't forget. Nobody told you Blobs are forbidden or FreeBSD should abandon all Blobs etc. You are the user, you are the one responsible for your machines. If you want to use Blobs please use them. That's the Free in FreeBSD contrary to the policy of OpenBSD and nobody wants to change that ;-) Best regards, Daniel ___ freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: allBSD's Stop the Blob Campaign
Jona Joachim wrote: On Sat, 17 Mar 2007 21:47:46 +0100 [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Dag-Erling Smørgrav) wrote: Jan Husar [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Dag-Erling Smørgrav [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: OK. That's a clear trademark violation. I expect AllBSD will be hearing from the FreeBSD Foundation's lawyers... What this suppose to mean? Allbsd is doing a pretty awesome job! No matter how good a job they do, they still have to follow the law. What makes you say they violated the law? I'm quite sure some people of the FreeBSD Foundation were shown this before it was made public. Jona Sure, allBSD has permission to use the Freebsd logo etc. and we use it on labels, flyers etc. for years and we are following every advice Deb Godkin has given us and I frequently mail him to take care everything is done according to the policy the FreeBSD foundation has. If somebody is irritated here: Yes, FreeBSD uses Blobs, but a lot of people don't think this is a good idea (to promote that use). This campaign is about telling people why Blobs are bad and why we need support for better and freely available documentation. The upcoming flyer will explain all the details. This poster is just the beginning please don't forget. Nobody told you Blobs are forbidden or FreeBSD should abandon all Blobs etc. You are the user, you are the one responsible for your machines. If you want to use Blobs please use them. That's the Free in FreeBSD contrary to the policy of OpenBSD and nobody wants to change that ;-) Best regards, Daniel ___ freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: allBSD's Stop the Blob Campaign
On Sun, 18 Mar 2007 23:52:30 +0100 Daniel Seuffert [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Jona Joachim schrieb: On Sat, 17 Mar 2007 21:47:46 +0100 [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Dag-Erling Smørgrav) wrote: Jan Husar [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Dag-Erling Smørgrav [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: OK. That's a clear trademark violation. I expect AllBSD will be hearing from the FreeBSD Foundation's lawyers... What this suppose to mean? Allbsd is doing a pretty awesome job! No matter how good a job they do, they still have to follow the law. What makes you say they violated the law? I'm quite sure some people of the FreeBSD Foundation were shown this before it was made public. Jona Sure, allBSD has permission to use the Freebsd logo etc. and we use it on labels, flyers etc. for years and we are following every advice Deb Godkin has given us and I frequently mail him to take care everything is done according to the policy the FreeBSD foundation has. If somebody is irritated here: Yes, FreeBSD uses Blobs, but a lot of people don't think this is a good idea (to promote that use). This campaign is about telling people why Blobs are bad and why we need support for freely available documentation. The upcoming flyer will explain all the details. This poster is just the beginning please don't forget. Nobody told you Blobs are forbidden or FreeBSD should abandon all Blobs etc. You are the user, you are the one responsible for your machines. If you want to use Blobs please use them. That's the Free in FreeBSD contrary to the policy of OpenBSD and nobody wants to change that ;-) Hi Daniel! I followed the discussion on openbsd-misc, that's why I started this thread, to hear what the FreeBSD folks have to say about it. It's really unfortunate that FreeBSD-GENERIC ships with that whole bunch of blobs IMHO. Open source projects that distribute proprietary software bite their own tail. I think we agree on the fact that blobs are bad and a lot of other FreeBSD users share that same opinion. It would be interesting to hear what the leaders of the projects have to say about this. Is it more important to support hardware than to claim the right for free documentation? Are there other interests involved? Finally I'd like to remind everyone of the fact that not buying undocumented hardware is a good way to fight it. Regards, Jona -- I am chaos. I am the substance from which your artists and scientists build rhythms. I am the spirit with which your children and clowns laugh in happy anarchy. I am chaos. I am alive, and tell you that you are free. Eris, Goddess Of Chaos, Discord Confusion signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: allBSD's Stop the Blob Campaign
I tread very carefully here, after all, the area is full of dead horses and I might accidentally commit violence against some of them by beating them up some more... On Mon, Mar 19, 2007 at 02:19:03AM +0100, Jona Joachim wrote: I followed the discussion on openbsd-misc, that's why I started this thread, to hear what the FreeBSD folks have to say about it. It's really unfortunate that FreeBSD-GENERIC ships with that whole bunch of blobs IMHO. Open source projects that distribute proprietary software bite their own tail. I think we agree on the fact that blobs are bad and a lot of other FreeBSD users share that same opinion. It would be interesting to hear what the leaders of the projects have to say about this. Is it more important to support hardware than to claim the right for free documentation? Are there other interests involved? Finally I'd like to remind everyone of the fact that not buying undocumented hardware is a good way to fight it. I think you are quite misguided when you say that FreeBSD ships with a whole bunch of blobs by default. This comes from the fact that - it seems so to me - many people confuse binary closed-source drivers (the ones that really can be could blobs) and closed-source *firmware*. But the difference is quite there. I do not think anyone should have anything against binary *firmware* Just because firmware is no longer soldered into your hardware, but needs to be loaded into it from your HDD every time, it still remains firmware. Just because it is on your filesystem, it still remains firmware. While there are some efforts to produce opensource firmware for certain hardware, there is nothing wrong with using the original closed-source one, this poses *no* threat to opensource developers or users. Most of the blobs that DES listed in this thread are just that: firmware. If you do not like that, fine, but then start by not buying any machine that has a proprietary BIOS. That will somewhat reduce the selection available to... uhm... yeah. To about 0. Reflashing does not count. The real blobs are quite few on FreeBSD, because vendors do not see enough incentive to develop drivers for FreeBSD yet mostly, not even closed-source. The only prominent example would be the Nvidia drivers, which are a) not in any way included by default b) are not required for the operation of FreeBSD itself, but rather are for Xorg. You can of course decide to not use those, but the simple reality is that for some hardware, they are the only way to work somewhat ok. This is so much so, that even Ubuntu decided to include the Nvidia and ATI blob drivers by default into their next release instead of just by direct request. So, even if someone does not like blobs, they are quite well off on FreeBSD. If you do not use the Nvidia drivers, you are mostly ok unless you use some funky vendor-provided third-party stuff but then it is not FreeBSD's but your responsibility. And no, do not let the OpenBSD propagada mislead you: just because *firmware* is licensed and cannot be freely distributed for some hardware, that does not make it a blob. -- Regards: Szilveszter ADAM Budapest Hungary ___ freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: allBSD's Stop the Blob Campaign
Jona Joachim [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I heard of the Stop the Blob campaign led by allBSD [1] today. The FreeBSD logo is used in their flyer [2] which means that the FreeBSD Project is supporting the campaign. I don't see a FreeBSD logo there. All I see is the BSD daemon, which is a common mascot for all BSD derivatives. The FreeBSD logo is here: URL:http://www.freebsd.org/logo.html DES -- Dag-Erling Smørgrav - [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: allBSD's Stop the Blob Campaign
On Sat, 17 Mar 2007 19:14:32 +0100 [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Dag-Erling Smørgrav) wrote: Jona Joachim [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I heard of the Stop the Blob campaign led by allBSD [1] today. The FreeBSD logo is used in their flyer [2] which means that the FreeBSD Project is supporting the campaign. I don't see a FreeBSD logo there. All I see is the BSD daemon, which is a common mascot for all BSD derivatives. The FreeBSD logo is here: URL:http://www.freebsd.org/logo.html You have to scroll to the bottom of the flyer. I hope this is not too much of an effort. http://misc.allbsd.de/Kampagnen/NoBlob/NoBlob-en-Poster.jpg Jona -- I am chaos. I am the substance from which your artists and scientists build rhythms. I am the spirit with which your children and clowns laugh in happy anarchy. I am chaos. I am alive, and tell you that you are free. Eris, Goddess Of Chaos, Discord Confusion signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: allBSD's Stop the Blob Campaign
Dag-Erling Smørgrav wrote: Jona Joachim [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Dag-Erling Smørgrav [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Jona Joachim [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I heard of the Stop the Blob campaign led by allBSD [1] today. The FreeBSD logo is used in their flyer [2] which means that the FreeBSD Project is supporting the campaign. I don't see a FreeBSD logo there. All I see is the BSD daemon, which is a common mascot for all BSD derivatives. The FreeBSD logo is here: URL:http://www.freebsd.org/logo.html You have to scroll to the bottom of the flyer. I hope this is not too much of an effort. http://misc.allbsd.de/Kampagnen/NoBlob/NoBlob-en-Poster.jpg OK. That's a clear trademark violation. I expect AllBSD will be hearing from the FreeBSD Foundation's lawyers... What this suppose to mean? Allbsd is doing a pretty awesome job! DES -- --- | Jan Husar | | freedomeurope.blogspot.com | GnuPG 1024D/DDB1C1AE | http://www.opensource.org ___ freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: allBSD's Stop the Blob Campaign
Jan Husar [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Dag-Erling Smørgrav [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: OK. That's a clear trademark violation. I expect AllBSD will be hearing from the FreeBSD Foundation's lawyers... What this suppose to mean? Allbsd is doing a pretty awesome job! No matter how good a job they do, they still have to follow the law. DES -- Dag-Erling Smørgrav - [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: allBSD's Stop the Blob Campaign
Dag-Erling Smørgrav wrote: Jan Husar [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Dag-Erling Smørgrav [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: OK. That's a clear trademark violation. I expect AllBSD will be hearing from the FreeBSD Foundation's lawyers... What this suppose to mean? Allbsd is doing a pretty awesome job! No matter how good a job they do, they still have to follow the law. Definetly, but: Over the years as I'm working as full time opensource activist mostly involved with the community and government/educational sector I must say, the main reason we are so effective and deployable is we are able to cooperate over any communication method know to man. Which means, if I see action somewhere benefiting us as a whole, I'm going to support it, because in the end it does support and help me and my projects. If allbsd did something wrong, we should be able to discuss is and possible fix or try to find a solution, not spaming about lawyers. As a community, we suffer enough, should we have some enemy within and fight a guerilla warfare? When the BSD have enough problems already? Jan DES -- --- | Jan Husar | | freedomeurope.blogspot.com | GnuPG 1024D/DDB1C1AE | http://www.opensource.org ___ freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: allBSD's Stop the Blob Campaign
On Sat, 17 Mar 2007 21:25:21 +0100 [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Dag-Erling Smørgrav) wrote: Jona Joachim [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Dag-Erling Smørgrav [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Jona Joachim [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I heard of the Stop the Blob campaign led by allBSD [1] today. The FreeBSD logo is used in their flyer [2] which means that the FreeBSD Project is supporting the campaign. I don't see a FreeBSD logo there. All I see is the BSD daemon, which is a common mascot for all BSD derivatives. The FreeBSD logo is here: URL:http://www.freebsd.org/logo.html You have to scroll to the bottom of the flyer. I hope this is not too much of an effort. http://misc.allbsd.de/Kampagnen/NoBlob/NoBlob-en-Poster.jpg OK. That's a clear trademark violation. I expect AllBSD will be hearing from the FreeBSD Foundation's lawyers... Does this mean that the FreeBSD Project leaders didn't know that our logo was used for this campaign? Does this mean that the FreeBSD Project encourages blobs? Jona -- I am chaos. I am the substance from which your artists and scientists build rhythms. I am the spirit with which your children and clowns laugh in happy anarchy. I am chaos. I am alive, and tell you that you are free. Eris, Goddess Of Chaos, Discord Confusion signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: allBSD's Stop the Blob Campaign
Jona Joachim [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Dag-Erling Smørgrav [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: OK. That's a clear trademark violation. I expect AllBSD will be hearing from the FreeBSD Foundation's lawyers... Does this mean that the FreeBSD Project leaders didn't know that our logo was used for this campaign? Does this mean that the FreeBSD Project encourages blobs? It means that the matter is now in the hands of those who are qualified to handle it. As for the FreeBSD Project's stance on closed-source drivers, I will let the source tree speak for itself: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ~% find /sys/contrib -name \*.uu /sys/contrib/dev/nve/amd64/nvenetlib.o.bz2.uu /sys/contrib/dev/nve/i386/nvenetlib.o.bz2.uu /sys/contrib/dev/oltr/i386-elf.trlld.o.uu /sys/contrib/dev/ath/public/arm9-le-thumb-elf.hal.o.uu /sys/contrib/dev/ath/public/armv4-be-elf.hal.o.uu /sys/contrib/dev/ath/public/armv4-le-elf.hal.o.uu /sys/contrib/dev/ath/public/i386-elf.hal.o.uu /sys/contrib/dev/ath/public/mips-be-elf.hal.o.uu /sys/contrib/dev/ath/public/mips-le-elf.hal.o.uu /sys/contrib/dev/ath/public/mips1-be-elf.hal.o.uu /sys/contrib/dev/ath/public/mips1-le-elf.hal.o.uu /sys/contrib/dev/ath/public/mipsisa32-be-elf.hal.o.uu /sys/contrib/dev/ath/public/mipsisa32-le-elf.hal.o.uu /sys/contrib/dev/ath/public/powerpc-be-eabi.hal.o.uu /sys/contrib/dev/ath/public/powerpc-le-eabi.hal.o.uu /sys/contrib/dev/ath/public/sh4-le-elf.hal.o.uu /sys/contrib/dev/ath/public/x86_64-elf.hal.o.uu /sys/contrib/dev/ath/public/xscale-be-elf.hal.o.uu /sys/contrib/dev/ath/public/xscale-le-elf.hal.o.uu /sys/contrib/dev/ath/public/alpha-elf.hal.o.uu /sys/contrib/dev/ath/public/powerpc-be-elf.hal.o.uu /sys/contrib/dev/ath/public/sparc64-be-elf.hal.o.uu /sys/contrib/dev/ath/public/ap30.hal.o.uu /sys/contrib/dev/ath/public/ap43.hal.o.uu /sys/contrib/dev/ath/public/ap51.hal.o.uu /sys/contrib/dev/ath/public/ap61.hal.o.uu /sys/contrib/dev/ath/public/sparc-be-elf.hal.o.uu /sys/contrib/dev/ipw/ipw2100-1.3-i.fw.uu /sys/contrib/dev/ipw/ipw2100-1.3-p.fw.uu /sys/contrib/dev/ipw/ipw2100-1.3.fw.uu /sys/contrib/dev/iwi/ipw2200-bss.fw.uu /sys/contrib/dev/iwi/ipw2200-ibss.fw.uu /sys/contrib/dev/iwi/ipw2200-sniffer.fw.uu DES -- Dag-Erling Smørgrav - [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ freebsd-advocacy@freebsd.org mailing list http://lists.freebsd.org/mailman/listinfo/freebsd-advocacy To unsubscribe, send any mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: allBSD's Stop the Blob Campaign
On Sat, 17 Mar 2007 21:47:46 +0100 [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Dag-Erling Smørgrav) wrote: Jan Husar [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Dag-Erling Smørgrav [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: OK. That's a clear trademark violation. I expect AllBSD will be hearing from the FreeBSD Foundation's lawyers... What this suppose to mean? Allbsd is doing a pretty awesome job! No matter how good a job they do, they still have to follow the law. What makes you say they violated the law? I'm quite sure some people of the FreeBSD Foundation were shown this before it was made public. Jona -- I am chaos. I am the substance from which your artists and scientists build rhythms. I am the spirit with which your children and clowns laugh in happy anarchy. I am chaos. I am alive, and tell you that you are free. Eris, Goddess Of Chaos, Discord Confusion signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: allBSD's Stop the Blob Campaign
On Sat, 17 Mar 2007 22:05:32 +0100 [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Dag-Erling Smørgrav) wrote: Jona Joachim [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Dag-Erling Smørgrav [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: OK. That's a clear trademark violation. I expect AllBSD will be hearing from the FreeBSD Foundation's lawyers... Does this mean that the FreeBSD Project leaders didn't know that our logo was used for this campaign? Does this mean that the FreeBSD Project encourages blobs? It means that the matter is now in the hands of those who are qualified to handle it. As for the FreeBSD Project's stance on closed-source drivers, I will let the source tree speak for itself: [EMAIL PROTECTED] ~% find /sys/contrib -name \*.uu snip listing of binaries How about porting OpenHAL to FreeBSD? Jona -- I am chaos. I am the substance from which your artists and scientists build rhythms. I am the spirit with which your children and clowns laugh in happy anarchy. I am chaos. I am alive, and tell you that you are free. Eris, Goddess Of Chaos, Discord Confusion signature.asc Description: PGP signature
allBSD's Stop the Blob Campaign
Hi! I heard of the Stop the Blob campaign led by allBSD [1] today. The FreeBSD logo is used in their flyer [2] which means that the FreeBSD Project is supporting the campaign. However FreeBSD uses binary blobs (even includes them in the source tree), notably those provided by Atheros and NVIDIA. Including third party code in the main tree of FreeBSD makes the project depend on the organization providing the software. On top of that there is a big security concern. The FreeBSD developers have absolutely no idea about how well and how secure the code provided by these companies is written. Not later than October last year a huge security hole was discovered in NVIDIA blob drivers permitting to acquire root privileges [3]. Would it be possible to clarify the position of the project regarding proprietary drivers? Best regards, Jona [1] http://www.allbsd.de/en/ [2] http://misc.allbsd.de/Kampagnen/NoBlob/NoBlob-en-Poster.jpg [3] http://download2.rapid7.com/r7-0025/ -- I am chaos. I am the substance from which your artists and scientists build rhythms. I am the spirit with which your children and clowns laugh in happy anarchy. I am chaos. I am alive, and tell you that you are free. Eris, Goddess Of Chaos, Discord Confusion signature.asc Description: PGP signature
