Re: Off-Topic RE: PayPal: Yea or Nay?
I'm sorry I read all these threads and didn't find any of them off topic... Except for ones like these... Why is it some people have to trash or make some bad comment about what someone says here??? (take what you need and leave the rest) We need to keep the peace here and everywhere in our lives... Life is way too short... -Original Message- From: Paul Stamsen pjs...@bresnan.net Sent: Jan 11, 2010 10:08 PM To: g3-5-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: Off-Topic RE: PayPal: Yea or Nay? Previously, at 9:53 pm -0500 1/11/10, John Musbach wrote: aren't you a nanny? You should know the moderation state of these lists, at least I would think so... no, I'm not a nanny -- If God lived on earth, people would break his windows. -- Jewish Proverb -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Off-Topic RE: PayPal: Yea or Nay?
At 7:14 PM -0700 1/11/2010, Paul Stamsen wrote: Previously, at 6:38 pm -0700 1/11/10, Robert Long wrote: As far as I know you Is this supposed to be on-list? I thought these lists were moderated! The thread is specifically ON TOPIC. The original article, as I cited in my OP, was written by Dan Knight -- you know, the guy that owns lowendmac.com. Many of us use Paypal to buy'n'sell Mac stuff. Understanding its ins and outs is VERY important. - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Off-Topic RE: PayPal: Yea or Nay?
Guess I'm tired of this list being so off G3-G5's then, and should probably unsubscribe if I spend more than 20% of my list reading time, avoiding non-computer topics. I appreciate the help I have gotten in the past, and also enjoyed adding my expertise. Thank You. On Jan 12, 2010, at 10:31 AM, Dan wrote: At 7:14 PM -0700 1/11/2010, Paul Stamsen wrote: Previously, at 6:38 pm -0700 1/11/10, Robert Long wrote: As far as I know you Is this supposed to be on-list? I thought these lists were moderated! The thread is specifically ON TOPIC. The original article, as I cited in my OP, was written by Dan Knight -- you know, the guy that owns lowendmac.com. Many of us use Paypal to buy'n'sell Mac stuff. Understanding its ins and outs is VERY important. - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Off-Topic RE: PayPal: Yea or Nay?
The G3-5-List has become sortof a catchall for LEM. But that's what happens when you spread all the knowlege out among a dozen lists. You could just skip over those threads that don't interest you. Remember: you cannot drink from the fire hydrant if you don't at least catch some of the water. - Dan. At 10:57 AM -0500 1/12/2010, Bill Connelly wrote: Guess I'm tired of this list being so off G3-G5's then, and should probably unsubscribe if I spend more than 20% of my list reading time, avoiding non-computer topics. I appreciate the help I have gotten in the past, and also enjoyed adding my expertise. Thank You. On Jan 12, 2010, at 10:31 AM, Dan wrote: At 7:14 PM -0700 1/11/2010, Paul Stamsen wrote: Previously, at 6:38 pm -0700 1/11/10, Robert Long wrote: As far as I know you Is this supposed to be on-list? I thought these lists were moderated! The thread is specifically ON TOPIC. The original article, as I cited in my OP, was written by Dan Knight -- you know, the guy that owns lowendmac.com. Many of us use Paypal to buy'n'sell Mac stuff. Understanding its ins and outs is VERY important. - Dan. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Off-Topic RE: PayPal: Yea or Nay?
I've just read this entire thread. Thanks to everyone for sharing their experiences and insights on PayPal and credit card companies. To answer a few questions: Yes, this thread is on topic - not because I wrote the article and published it on LEM, but because PayPal is part of the Internet experience for many of us these days. No, it's not specific to G3/4/5 Macs, but it is an issue of importance to G3/4/5 users. The PRAM batteries... What? You didn't use LEM Swap?! humph. LOL. LEM Swap is *not* a dealer list; it's a place for individuals to sell their older Macs and related gear. I have a lot of Macs with dead PRAM batteries, and every few years I buy a big batch (10-15) of fresh ones from OWC or someone else. This time around Amazon.com had the best deal. Paypal, btw, did not remove the funds from your account. That first transaction, that expired, was simply a hold. That's how credit transactions work. I don't leave a lot of money in my PayPal account. Whatever they call it, they made it impossible for me to access over 90% of the funds in my account when they did this. You'd think someone as big as eBay/ PayPal would have a system in place to automatically search for duplicates. Is this supposed to be on-list? I thought these lists were moderated! From the list FAQ: What topics may be discussed? Anything relating to Power Mac G3s and G4s. G-Group is mostly an unmoderated closed group. Unmoderated means messages are sent to the group without prior knowledge of the group owner or managers; closed means only members may post. The group is closed to help fight spam, and first postings from new members must be reviewed and approved by a group manager before they are sent to the group, a step made necessary by spammers. Group managers are authorized to remove the following types of messages from the group archive: spam, test messages, and unsubscribe postings. Content of each message is the responsibility of the person posting it. All new group members are automatically set to moderated status. This is the only way to keep spammers out, which I'm sure all of you will admit we've done quite well. You have no idea how much spam we used to block before de-listing our groups from Google's public index. Since then, it's diminished greatly, but it's still necessary to moderate new members until we can verify that they are not spambots. After that, the group is pretty much unmoderated. If we find someone trolling, cheating members, posting in ALL CAPS, quoting excessively, using a blatantly offensive signature, etc., we will set them to moderated status either temporarily or permanently. When things go too far, we put a permanent ban on them. With few exceptions, the list managers (a.k.a. nannies) do not see messages before they are posted to the list. We don't have the time, resources, or patience to do that. We only moderate new members and those who have violated list rules or netiquette. Dan Knight, list owner -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Off-Topic RE: PayPal: Yea or Nay?
At 8:18 AM -0800 1/12/2010, Dan Knight, LowEndMac.com wrote: Paypal, btw, did not remove the funds from your account. That first transaction, that expired, was simply a hold. That's how credit transactions work. I don't leave a lot of money in my PayPal account. Whatever they call it, they made it impossible for me to access over 90% of the funds in my account when they did this. You'd think someone as big as eBay/PayPal would have a system in place to automatically search for duplicates. The Hold / Confirmation system is ruled by the Visa/MC/Discover networks and contracts, not by the individual processors (eg Paypal). How does the processor tell the difference between an erroneous hold, and a hold for purchase 1 and a hold for purchase 2, that just happen to be the same amount? :\ It is up to the vendor to release the erroneous hold. To protect against vendors that can't be bothered to do so, holds expire after a few days. heh. I've had some big frustrations over this recently. A gas station I frequent takes out a $20 hold then hits your account with a new hold and confirms for the actual gas you get, without releasing the original hold. It then takes three to four days for the first hold to expire. Of course, my account didn't have a lot of $ in it, so I ended up looking like an idiot at a restaurant a few hours later. Each time I've called Paypal about this, they immediately manually released the hold. - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Off-Topic RE: PayPal: Yea or Nay? PRAM batteries
On 1/12/2010 9:18 AM, Dan Knight, LowEndMac.com wrote: I have a lot of Macs with dead PRAM batteries, and every few years I buy a big batch (10-15) of fresh ones from OWC or someone else. This time around Amazon.com had the best deal. Do you know how long the batteries last, if not used. I'd like to buy a few for my Pismo, just to keep them, incase they become hard to find. But if they'd decay while on the holding shelf, that will defeat the purpose. Can someone please address this point? -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Off-Topic RE: PayPal: Yea or Nay?
Remember: you cannot drink from the fire hydrant if you don't at least catch some of the water. Very good! Is this one of your own? Andy -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Off-Topic RE: PayPal: Yea or Nay? PRAM batteries
I can still get mine for my 1993 Mac Perfoma 475 at Radio Shack!!! So I think they will still be around for a while, also I think they are used for other stuff in the electronics world... -Original Message- From: nestamicky nestami...@gmail.com Sent: Jan 12, 2010 2:45 PM To: g3-5-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: Off-Topic RE: PayPal: Yea or Nay? PRAM batteries On 1/12/2010 9:18 AM, Dan Knight, LowEndMac.com wrote: I have a lot of Macs with dead PRAM batteries, and every few years I buy a big batch (10-15) of fresh ones from OWC or someone else. This time around Amazon.com had the best deal. Do you know how long the batteries last, if not used. I'd like to buy a few for my Pismo, just to keep them, incase they become hard to find. But if they'd decay while on the holding shelf, that will defeat the purpose. Can someone please address this point? -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: PayPal: Yea or Nay?
What you can do is call Paypal and tell them to set your account to automatically sweep any available funds to your bank account at the end of each day. You set up a bank account just for use with Paypal and then run down and withdraw the money or transfer it to another account that they don't have access to as soon as it posts so they can't reclaim it if they think there is a problem. You have to tell your bank, though, that you don't want to allow any overdrafts to take place on the Paypal account or else if a request comes through when the account is empty they might honor it then hit you with an overdraft fee. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: PayPal: Yea or Nay?
At 6:46 AM -0800 1/11/2010, PM7500 wrote: What you can do is call Paypal and tell them to set your account to automatically sweep any available funds to your bank account at the end of each day. No need to call. You can set that up online. You set up a bank account just for use with Paypal and then run down and withdraw the money or transfer it to another account that they don't have access to as soon as it posts so they can't reclaim it if they think there is a problem. That works. You have to tell your bank, though, that you don't want to allow any overdrafts to take place on the Paypal account or else if a request comes through when the account is empty they might honor it then hit you with an overdraft fee. Yea. But now there's a problem. Remember: you are legally required to provide funds for refunds and chargebacks. Failure to do so is FRAUD, etc. Since your Paypal account is empty, Paypal will initiate an ACH transfer from your attached bank account. Your bank - instructed to not provide overdraft coverage - will bounce the ACH order, and hit you with a bounce fee. If the amount is small, Paypal will often give up, and let the rest of their policies and/or insurance handle things. But if the amount is large, Paypal could take legal action against you. And if the Buyer used a credit card, and initiated a chargeback, then that bank can also go after you! When all is said and done, and you've delt with the hassle and paid all the legal fees, and felt the dent in your credit rating, there's one final bump: This is the 21st Century: Processors Talk. No matter where you go from then on, you will probably be required to keep an escrow available. Nice services like Paypal may just do a withdrawl delay. Other's will require a large cash balance at all times. Bottom line... This isn't a cash'n'carry garage sale where you can legally take the money and run. You have contracted with the banking system to process payments for you. Now you have to own up to your side of the contract too! - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: PayPal: Yea or Nay?
This might cause PayPal to close the acct and you could loose your PayPal??? They also change their policies and hold your money for 21 days too on each transaction... -Original Message- From: PM7500 jburke...@comcast.net Sent: Jan 11, 2010 9:46 AM To: G-Group g3-5-list@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: PayPal: Yea or Nay? What you can do is call Paypal and tell them to set your account to automatically sweep any available funds to your bank account at the end of each day. You set up a bank account just for use with Paypal and then run down and withdraw the money or transfer it to another account that they don't have access to as soon as it posts so they can't reclaim it if they think there is a problem. You have to tell your bank, though, that you don't want to allow any overdrafts to take place on the Paypal account or else if a request comes through when the account is empty they might honor it then hit you with an overdraft fee. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: PayPal: Yea or Nay?
But now there's a problem. Remember: you are legally required to provide funds for refunds and chargebacks. Failure to do so is FRAUD, etc. Since your Paypal account is empty, Paypal will initiate an ACH transfer from your attached bank account. Your bank - instructed to not provide overdraft coverage - will bounce the ACH order, and hit you with a bounce fee. If the amount is small, Paypal will often give up, and let the rest of their policies and/or insurance handle things. But if the amount is large, Paypal could take legal action against you. And if the Buyer used a credit card, and initiated a chargeback, then that bank can also go after you! When all is said and done, and you've delt with the hassle and paid all the legal fees, and felt the dent in your credit rating, there's one final bump: This is the 21st Century: Processors Talk. No matter where you go from then on, you will probably be required to keep an escrow available. Nice services like Paypal may just do a withdrawl delay. Other's will require a large cash balance at all times. Bottom line... This isn't a cash'n'carry garage sale where you can legally take the money and run. You have contracted with the banking system to process payments for you. Now you have to own up to your side of the contract too! True, . . . but if your are protecting your bank account from being raided unjustly then let PayPal file a civil suite for fraud. If their claims are false you have legal options. Hypothetically, if someone was raiding my bank account on a bogus charge then I would protect it by any means necessary. Of course many folks don't have the motivations to really fight the powers that be. If need be let the lawyers sort it out. I know this is another simplistic solution to this wonderful modern world we live in. And I know this not the country I grew up in during the days of old, but I'm still feisty and and willing to exercise whatever rights I have left. Oh well, --glen -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
RE: PayPal: Yea or Nay?
As far as I know you have been paid. If not, Wednesday some of our Social Security money direct depost and then run it Thursday. I have not seen my statement as of yet. I am unaware of what payments have been through my card. Sorry for your inconvenience. By all means, you will be paid. Robert Long Date: Mon, 11 Jan 2010 17:02:45 -0800 From: glenst...@yahoo.com Subject: Re: PayPal: Yea or Nay? To: g3-5-list@googlegroups.com But now there's a problem. Remember: you are legally required to provide funds for refunds and chargebacks. Failure to do so is FRAUD, etc. Since your Paypal account is empty, Paypal will initiate an ACH transfer from your attached bank account. Your bank - instructed to not provide overdraft coverage - will bounce the ACH order, and hit you with a bounce fee. If the amount is small, Paypal will often give up, and let the rest of their policies and/or insurance handle things. But if the amount is large, Paypal could take legal action against you. And if the Buyer used a credit card, and initiated a chargeback, then that bank can also go after you! When all is said and done, and you've delt with the hassle and paid all the legal fees, and felt the dent in your credit rating, there's one final bump: This is the 21st Century: Processors Talk. No matter where you go from then on, you will probably be required to keep an escrow available. Nice services like Paypal may just do a withdrawl delay. Other's will require a large cash balance at all times. Bottom line... This isn't a cash'n'carry garage sale where you can legally take the money and run. You have contracted with the banking system to process payments for you. Now you have to own up to your side of the contract too! True, . . . but if your are protecting your bank account from being raided unjustly then let PayPal file a civil suite for fraud. If their claims are false you have legal options. Hypothetically, if someone was raiding my bank account on a bogus charge then I would protect it by any means necessary. Of course many folks don't have the motivations to really fight the powers that be. If need be let the lawyers sort it out. I know this is another simplistic solution to this wonderful modern world we live in. And I know this not the country I grew up in during the days of old, but I'm still feisty and and willing to exercise whatever rights I have left. Oh well, --glen _ Hotmail: Powerful Free email with security by Microsoft. http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/196390710/direct/01/-- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Off-Topic RE: PayPal: Yea or Nay?
Previously, at 6:38 pm -0700 1/11/10, Robert Long wrote: As far as I know you Is this supposed to be on-list? I thought these lists were moderated! Paul -- Nobody talks so constantly about God as those who insist that there is no God. -- Heywood Broun -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Off-Topic RE: PayPal: Yea or Nay?
On 1/11/10, Paul Stamsen pjs...@bresnan.net wrote: Previously, at 6:38 pm -0700 1/11/10, Robert Long wrote: As far as I know you Is this supposed to be on-list? I thought these lists were moderated! aren't you a nanny? You should know the moderation state of these lists, at least I would think so... -- Best Regards, John Musbach -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: Off-Topic RE: PayPal: Yea or Nay?
Previously, at 9:53 pm -0500 1/11/10, John Musbach wrote: aren't you a nanny? You should know the moderation state of these lists, at least I would think so... no, I'm not a nanny -- If God lived on earth, people would break his windows. -- Jewish Proverb -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: PayPal: Yea or Nay?
At 9:52 PM -0800 1/8/2010, Michael G.M. wrote: How about use gift cards instead? They're available for eBay's, Amazon's, iTunes', Applebees'. Gift cards could be interesting, if both parties are willing. I would think they aren't much more secure than sending cash, because they're negotiable by anyone. What about verifying their validity and value - can that be done easily, perhaps online? heh. iTunes Gift Cards. Whole new realm of possibilities there, as you can buy them steeply discounted on eBay. I wonder how many of those auctions are bogus? Personally, I might be willing to accept a gift card to a place I frequent - like Wal Mart. No use for cards from other places tho. I really prefer real money. That way I can throw it at whatever needs the most attention - pharmacy, grocery store, pharmacy, pharmacy, ... - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: PayPal: Yea or Nay?
On Jan 10, 2010, at 8:47 AM, Dan wrote: At 9:52 PM -0800 1/8/2010, Michael G.M. wrote: How about use gift cards instead? They're available for eBay's, Amazon's, iTunes', Applebees'. Gift cards could be interesting, if both parties are willing. I would think they aren't much more secure than sending cash, because they're negotiable by anyone. What about verifying their validity and value - can that be done easily, perhaps online? heh. iTunes Gift Cards. Whole new realm of possibilities there, as you can buy them steeply discounted on eBay. I wonder how many of those auctions are bogus? Personally, I might be willing to accept a gift card to a place I frequent - like Wal Mart. No use for cards from other places tho. I really prefer real money. That way I can throw it at whatever needs the most attention - pharmacy, grocery store, pharmacy, pharmacy, ... - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth. Dan, OWC is my choice pharmacies are detrimental to your health. From former addict reformed to a Mac addict. Once an addict always an addict, LOL John Carmonne Yorba Linda USA -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: PayPal: Yea or Nay?
On Fri, Jan 8, 2010 at 2:40 AM, Dan dantear...@gmail.com wrote: Don't get me wrong here. I'm not saying Paypal doesn't have room for improvement. But as services go, they're one of the best out there. And 99.9% of the complaints you see spewed around the 'net are unfounded, usually based on the customer failing to understand how payment processing services, and their own credit cards, work. What about this: http://forums.ebay.com/db2/topic/Seller-Central/21-Day-Hold/520175743start=0? -- Best Regards, John Musbach -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: PayPal: Yea or Nay?
At 12:01 PM -0500 1/8/2010, John Musbach wrote: On Fri, Jan 8, 2010 at 2:40 AM, Dan dantear...@gmail.com wrote: Don't get me wrong here. I'm not saying Paypal doesn't have room for improvement. But as services go, they're one of the best out there. And 99.9% of the complaints you see spewed around the 'net are unfounded, usually based on the customer failing to understand how payment processing services, and their own credit cards, work. What about this: http://forums.ebay.com/db2/topic/Seller-Central/21-Day-Hold/520175743 Give it the smell test. There's an awful lot of information missing here. First... If you received a message like that - and keep in mind that the poster has NOT bothered to provide ANY of the ACTUAL message - from the company handling your business financial account, would you a) post a semi-off topic complaint in the *parent* company's public forum (remember eBay Paypal!), or b) immediately contact that financial company directly -- you know, call or email them? It is your business on the line, after all... This person chose (a). That's nutz IMO; a major red flag. Apparently, it's not a complete account freeze; it's just a back-side delay. That means the account can still receive and process payments -no interference with the normal business-. The owner just cannot withdraw funds *immediately*. Payment processors do this whenever there are problems reported that may result in a customer not getting a refund they're due. The delay is an easy way to cause the account to generate a positive balance in order to cover such. [1] The poster cites their stellar feedback and DSRs and says they've had no complaints. Does that make sense? What are the chances of selling that much stuff - 14,419 feedback (and only a percentage of customers leave feedback!) and getting NO complaints?! I can't imagine even a shipping service that's that good! So what's missing here? What event caused Paypal to take this action? It's possible that it was an error, but it's more likely IMO that this poster ain't as rosy smelling as he/she/it wants you to believe. Can't research further because the person has created separate posting and selling id's - and hasn't bothered to state their selling id. Again, I'm not saying there isn't a legit problem here. I'm just saying that this particular complaint doesn't pass much of a smell test. There's more to the story... Paypal does NOT nail accounts for the heck of it. [1] Paypal lets you sweep all the funds out of your account - basically out of their reach - as often as you want. That's fine in most cases. But it creates an extra level of pain when a customer requires a refund. After a single complaint (valid or not!), MOST payment processors would make the account holder maintain a large escrow balance - sometimes as much as 2 to 3x their normal monthly cash flow! Paypal's policy wrt this awfully pro-Seller. Traditional services would never do this. But can you imagine the scream if Paypal made all the Sellers maintain even a small balance?! (still perusing thru all the pages in that thread; not seeing more real info so far). Got to the posts where they're claiming it's a Paypal system-wide error. Not sure I believe that. The OP still hasn't provided any real details. And if that were the case, a single call to Paypal would fix it. - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: PayPal: Yea or Nay?
At 1:11 PM -0500 1/8/2010, Dan wrote: (still perusing thru all the pages in that thread; not seeing more real info so far). Got to the posts where they're claiming it's a Paypal system-wide error. Not sure I believe that. The OP still hasn't provided any real details. And if that were the case, a single call to Paypal would fix it. Got thru the rest of the thread. Still think there's something fishy going on. The only thing that seems certain is that the account is still under review. - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: PayPal: Yea or Nay?
How about use gift cards instead? They're available for eBay's, Amazon's, iTunes', Applebees'. We really need a LEM lounge board too, maybe. -Michael On Jan 8, 1:23 pm, Dan dantear...@gmail.com wrote: At 1:11 PM -0500 1/8/2010, Dan wrote: (still perusing thru all the pages in that thread; not seeing more real info so far). Got to the posts where they're claiming it's a Paypal system-wide error. Not sure I believe that. The OP still hasn't provided any real details. And if that were the case, a single call to Paypal would fix it. Got thru the rest of the thread. Still think there's something fishy going on. The only thing that seems certain is that the account is still under review. - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
PayPal: Yea or Nay?
Dan Knight wrote in his recent Musings column: PayPal: Yea or Nay? In my case, that's three strikes for PayPal over eight years. It's not a terrible track record, but PayPal's ability to stop you from using the money in your account without warning is a good reason to consider alternatives. Even if you don't stop using PayPal, you may want to have a second option available before you run into an unanticipated account lockout. http://lowendmac.com/musings/10mm/paypal-strikes.html I feel for yee Dan. Paypal's policies and such can feel quite draconian when they slam you in the face. But I gotta tell you - they're a walk in the park compared to they way traditional card processors handle small and medium sized businesses. You ain't lived until one of those has a death grip on your bank account and credit rating, and it takes a judge's signature to even begin to fix it. And then, when all is said and done, you're totally responsible for both your and their legal fees - it's in the contract! A few points: Lockin down your account when they recognized the hijack... You're very lucky they noticed. Banks and regular processors provide $ recovery IF you pay for that service. ( It's a PR thing for residential customers ). Other than that, recovering the $3k is your responsibility - that's why things like business insurances and tax deductions exist. Monday's lockdown... Not sure what the deal is there with the cell phone. I've had no problem there. Have you actually called them? The PRAM batteries... What? You didn't use LEM Swap?! humph. Paypal, btw, did not remove the funds from your account. That first transaction, that expired, was simply a hold. That's how credit transactions work. First you do a hold. Then, some time later, you confirm the transaction in your close-out batch, which causes the funds to be queued for transfer. Queued = they'll do it eventually when their up-steam close out is done. The problem is that a lot of companies are lame about closing things out. They end up letting the hold expire, or re-doing it instead of referencing the original one. It's a bad business practice that the likes of Amazon do all the time. Nothing Paypal can do about it normally; these are processing steps they're under contract to perform, by the likes of Visa and MC. If you have a big hold, that's crippling your account, you can call them. They'll often manually release it. The fax requirement is a PITA. But that's our legal system - doubtful Paypal can do anything there. Careful of them other services. Paypal has gone to great lengths/expense to become licensed all over the world - and thus subject to their regulations and laws. Few of those other's have. Are we having fun yet? Wait until you see the new/higher fees that Visa and MC are hitting processors with this quarter! Not sure if Paypal or any other processor will simply absorb them... :\ FWIW, - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: PayPal: Yea or Nay?
Off topic but We were concerned with this ability of PayPal to lock an account for our non-profit org so we use a separate account and then just transfer funds in/out as needed - Paypal cannot lock that account so we don't worry and if they lock the used account there is little affect on the orgs ability to pay by check. Small hassle for peace of mind. Erik From: Dan dantear...@gmail.com Reply-To: g3-5-list@googlegroups.com g3-5-list@googlegroups.com Date: Thu, 7 Jan 2010 15:45:33 -0500 To: g3-5-list@googlegroups.com g3-5-list@googlegroups.com Subject: PayPal: Yea or Nay? Dan Knight wrote in his recent Musings column: PayPal: Yea or Nay? In my case, that's three strikes for PayPal over eight years. It's not a terrible track record, but PayPal's ability to stop you from using the money in your account without warning is a good reason to consider alternatives. Even if you don't stop using PayPal, you may want to have a second option available before you run into an unanticipated account lockout. http://lowendmac.com/musings/10mm/paypal-strikes.html I feel for yee Dan. Paypal's policies and such can feel quite draconian when they slam you in the face. But I gotta tell you - they're a walk in the park compared to they way traditional card processors handle small and medium sized businesses. You ain't lived until one of those has a death grip on your bank account and credit rating, and it takes a judge's signature to even begin to fix it. And then, when all is said and done, you're totally responsible for both your and their legal fees - it's in the contract! A few points: Lockin down your account when they recognized the hijack... You're very lucky they noticed. Banks and regular processors provide $ recovery IF you pay for that service. ( It's a PR thing for residential customers ). Other than that, recovering the $3k is your responsibility - that's why things like business insurances and tax deductions exist. Monday's lockdown... Not sure what the deal is there with the cell phone. I've had no problem there. Have you actually called them? The PRAM batteries... What? You didn't use LEM Swap?! humph. Paypal, btw, did not remove the funds from your account. That first transaction, that expired, was simply a hold. That's how credit transactions work. First you do a hold. Then, some time later, you confirm the transaction in your close-out batch, which causes the funds to be queued for transfer. Queued = they'll do it eventually when their up-steam close out is done. The problem is that a lot of companies are lame about closing things out. They end up letting the hold expire, or re-doing it instead of referencing the original one. It's a bad business practice that the likes of Amazon do all the time. Nothing Paypal can do about it normally; these are processing steps they're under contract to perform, by the likes of Visa and MC. If you have a big hold, that's crippling your account, you can call them. They'll often manually release it. The fax requirement is a PITA. But that's our legal system - doubtful Paypal can do anything there. Careful of them other services. Paypal has gone to great lengths/expense to become licensed all over the world - and thus subject to their regulations and laws. Few of those other's have. Are we having fun yet? Wait until you see the new/higher fees that Visa and MC are hitting processors with this quarter! Not sure if Paypal or any other processor will simply absorb them... :\ FWIW, - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: PayPal: Yea or Nay?
On Thu, Jan 7, 2010 at 3:45 PM, Dan dantear...@gmail.com wrote: Dan Knight wrote in his recent Musings column: PayPal: Yea or Nay? In my case, that's three strikes for PayPal over eight years. It's not a terrible track record, but PayPal's ability to stop you from using the money in your account without warning is a good reason to consider alternatives. Even if you don't stop using PayPal, you may want to have a second option available before you run into an unanticipated account lockout. http://lowendmac.com/musings/10mm/paypal-strikes.html He's not alone, eBay's own forum is filled with complaints: http://forums.ebay.com/db2/forum/Paypal/97 and there are numerous websites dedicated to PayPal horror stories telling of just such events: http://www.aboutpaypal.org/forums/paypal-horror-stories/ http://www.paypalwarning.com/ http://www.screw-paypal.com/horror_stories/horror_stories.html http://www.paypalsucks.com/ Hence why I do not keep any funds in my account nor keep my bank account associated with my PayPal account. Be careful when you trust PayPal, that's all I have to say about this. -- Best Regards, John Musbach -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
Re: PayPal: Yea or Nay?
At 6:20 PM -0500 1/7/2010, John Musbach wrote: On Thu, Jan 7, 2010 at 3:45 PM, Dan dantear...@gmail.com wrote: Dan Knight wrote in his recent Musings column: PayPal: Yea or Nay? In my case, that's three strikes for PayPal over eight years. It's not a terrible track record, but PayPal's ability to stop you from using the money in your account without warning is a good reason to consider alternatives. Even if you don't stop using PayPal, you may want to have a second option available before you run into an unanticipated account lockout. http://lowendmac.com/musings/10mm/paypal-strikes.html He's not alone, eBay's own forum is filled with complaints: As with any service of this nature, there are a tiny tiny tiny percentage of the *millions* of transactions that don't go smoothly. Do you hear of the millions? No. You hear only the one-sided details of the vocal few. Hence why I do not keep any funds in my account nor keep my bank account associated with my PayPal account. Be careful when you trust PayPal, that's all I have to say about this. Do you give your credit card to your waiter in a restaurant? How 'bout to a gas station attendant? Or to the person in the fast food drive-in window? ... Places where you cannot see your card 1000% of the time while it's in that stranger's possession. It is FAR more likely that one of them will rip you off, than it is to be ripped off by a fully regulated and audited service such as Paypal. Don't get me wrong here. I'm not saying Paypal doesn't have room for improvement. But as services go, they're one of the best out there. And 99.9% of the complaints you see spewed around the 'net are unfounded, usually based on the customer failing to understand how payment processing services, and their own credit cards, work. - Dan. -- - Psychoceramic Emeritus; South Jersey, USA, Earth. -- You received this message because you are a member of G-Group, a group for those using G3, G4, and G5 desktop Macs - with a particular focus on Power Macs. The list FAQ is at http://lowendmac.com/lists/g-list.shtml and our netiquette guide is at http://www.lowendmac.com/lists/netiquette.shtml To post to this group, send email to g3-5-list@googlegroups.com For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/g3-5-list
