Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
+1 2010/12/2 William A. Rowe Jr. > On 11/23/2010 8:11 PM, James Purser wrote: > > While Google owns the Google Wave trademark, they don't own the very > generic > > "Wave". > > > > Apache Wave will be a separate thing and unaffected by any trademark that > > Google owns. > > Wrong. The ASF is always affected by other's Trademarks, which is why we > simply don't use them. These can be either Registered Marks or > unregistered > but well known marks. Wave is now a very well known mark. > > Look, it's simple enough for Google Legal to state that it unconditionally > licenses the of the "Apache Wave" name to the ASF at no cost, retaining all > claims to "Google Wave" and the Google Wave graphic. Of for Google Legal > to simply disclaim all rights or interests in the "Wave" mark, alone. > > The fact is that Wave itself is not a strong mark. But used *in the same > space* as Google Wave, e.g. if Skype introduced Skype Wave to do something > very similar, Google would find itself on strong ground to contest the use > of their [unregistered] mark. > > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org > >
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
On 11/23/2010 8:11 PM, James Purser wrote: > While Google owns the Google Wave trademark, they don't own the very generic > "Wave". > > Apache Wave will be a separate thing and unaffected by any trademark that > Google owns. Wrong. The ASF is always affected by other's Trademarks, which is why we simply don't use them. These can be either Registered Marks or unregistered but well known marks. Wave is now a very well known mark. Look, it's simple enough for Google Legal to state that it unconditionally licenses the of the "Apache Wave" name to the ASF at no cost, retaining all claims to "Google Wave" and the Google Wave graphic. Of for Google Legal to simply disclaim all rights or interests in the "Wave" mark, alone. The fact is that Wave itself is not a strong mark. But used *in the same space* as Google Wave, e.g. if Skype introduced Skype Wave to do something very similar, Google would find itself on strong ground to contest the use of their [unregistered] mark. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
On 11/29/2010 06:08 PM, Santiago Gala wrote:
> On Mon, Nov 29, 2010 at 4:43 PM, Ian Roughley wrote:
>> I'd like to add to what Soren said: we've discussed whether we should
>> include the protocol and the
>> implementation of the protocol in the proposal. What we concluded, is that
>> having everything
>> together would be the simplest for the time being... although I don't think
>> anyone in the discussion
>> had *really* strong opinions in either direction.
>>
>> From my standpoint (as a Novell employee and part of the Novell Vibe
>> project), I'm very interested
>> in ensuring that the protocol and libraries are licensed in a way that they
>> can be leveraged by
>> commercial software to allow for interoperability. I'd also go as far as
>> saying that it's in
>> everyones best interest for this to be the case :-)
>>
>
> A big +1. I think that a very detailed roadmap would be more
> suspicious at this stage than having this open mind. There are two
> long term issues around: who owns central names, such as Wave, and who
> controls long term protocol evolution.
>
> I just thought that this fact should be brought up before the vote.
> IMO the situation is allright for accepting the incubation. The issues
> will be sorted out at due time.
I'm glad it was brought up in this forum. It had been discussed, just before
the Apache proposal
was submitted. We should move those discussions here for continuity.
>
> Regards
> Santiago
>
>> /Ian
>>
>> On 11/29/2010 07:15 AM, Soren Lassen wrote:
>>> On Mon, Nov 29, 2010 at 8:32 PM, Santiago Gala
>>> wrote:
On Mon, Nov 29, 2010 at 8:49 AM, Dan Peterson wrote:
(...)
> To keep things moving, I'd like to go ahead and put this proposal to a
> vote
> starting on Tuesday on the west coast of the US (roughly 24 hours from
> now).
>
I want to get some information about an issue that, like the
name/branding one, is not a blocker for incubator entry, but can
change significantly the level of third party support.
It is the governance model for the protocol suit. If I understood
correctly, the project is scoped towards the software server
component. It does not include development of the protocol libraries.
>>>
>>> The project will include all the source code for the "wave in a box"
>>> server, including all the ("library"?) code for the data model, the
>>> federation protocol implementation, the client-server protocol
>>> implementation, and the robot and data APIs, as well as all the
>>> documentation/specifications for the data model, protocols, and APIs
>>> hosted at waveprotocol.org.
>>>
Does it include test suites beyond the server being a big test harness
itself?
>>>
>>> There are no test suites other than unittests for the abovementioned
>>> implementations.
>>>
It would be great to be able to know the plans for those:
- protocol specification and maintenance
- reference libraries for the protocol
- test suites and specifically test kits if any is planned
I think that clarifying those scopes would be great.
>>>
>>> Presently, we regard the protocol specification as a specification of
>>> the wave-in-a-box implementation and, thus, the specification belongs
>>> together with the implementation in the proposed Apache project.
>>> Eventually, we would like to formally standardize the protocol, i.e.,
>>> agree with external parties outside the project to use the protocol
>>> between different implementations. When we get to the point when we
>>> start negotiating such agreements, we envision that we will spin out
>>> the protocol from the proposed Apache project into a standardisation
>>> working group (probably under the wings of IETF or some other
>>> standards body) which will govern these negotiations. The working
>>> group will need to decide on things like reference libraries and test
>>> suites. We're not deciding now whether the code in the proposed Apache
>>> project will be used for these purposes.
>>>
>>> Soren
>>>
Regards
Santiago
> Regards,
> -Dan
>
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>>>
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>>>
>>
>>
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Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
On Mon, Nov 29, 2010 at 4:43 PM, Ian Roughley wrote:
> I'd like to add to what Soren said: we've discussed whether we should include
> the protocol and the
> implementation of the protocol in the proposal. What we concluded, is that
> having everything
> together would be the simplest for the time being... although I don't think
> anyone in the discussion
> had *really* strong opinions in either direction.
>
> From my standpoint (as a Novell employee and part of the Novell Vibe
> project), I'm very interested
> in ensuring that the protocol and libraries are licensed in a way that they
> can be leveraged by
> commercial software to allow for interoperability. I'd also go as far as
> saying that it's in
> everyones best interest for this to be the case :-)
>
A big +1. I think that a very detailed roadmap would be more
suspicious at this stage than having this open mind. There are two
long term issues around: who owns central names, such as Wave, and who
controls long term protocol evolution.
I just thought that this fact should be brought up before the vote.
IMO the situation is allright for accepting the incubation. The issues
will be sorted out at due time.
Regards
Santiago
> /Ian
>
> On 11/29/2010 07:15 AM, Soren Lassen wrote:
>> On Mon, Nov 29, 2010 at 8:32 PM, Santiago Gala
>> wrote:
>>> On Mon, Nov 29, 2010 at 8:49 AM, Dan Peterson wrote:
>>> (...)
To keep things moving, I'd like to go ahead and put this proposal to a vote
starting on Tuesday on the west coast of the US (roughly 24 hours from
now).
>>>
>>> I want to get some information about an issue that, like the
>>> name/branding one, is not a blocker for incubator entry, but can
>>> change significantly the level of third party support.
>>>
>>> It is the governance model for the protocol suit. If I understood
>>> correctly, the project is scoped towards the software server
>>> component. It does not include development of the protocol libraries.
>>
>> The project will include all the source code for the "wave in a box"
>> server, including all the ("library"?) code for the data model, the
>> federation protocol implementation, the client-server protocol
>> implementation, and the robot and data APIs, as well as all the
>> documentation/specifications for the data model, protocols, and APIs
>> hosted at waveprotocol.org.
>>
>>> Does it include test suites beyond the server being a big test harness
>>> itself?
>>
>> There are no test suites other than unittests for the abovementioned
>> implementations.
>>
>>> It would be great to be able to know the plans for those:
>>> - protocol specification and maintenance
>>> - reference libraries for the protocol
>>> - test suites and specifically test kits if any is planned
>>>
>>> I think that clarifying those scopes would be great.
>>
>> Presently, we regard the protocol specification as a specification of
>> the wave-in-a-box implementation and, thus, the specification belongs
>> together with the implementation in the proposed Apache project.
>> Eventually, we would like to formally standardize the protocol, i.e.,
>> agree with external parties outside the project to use the protocol
>> between different implementations. When we get to the point when we
>> start negotiating such agreements, we envision that we will spin out
>> the protocol from the proposed Apache project into a standardisation
>> working group (probably under the wings of IETF or some other
>> standards body) which will govern these negotiations. The working
>> group will need to decide on things like reference libraries and test
>> suites. We're not deciding now whether the code in the proposed Apache
>> project will be used for these purposes.
>>
>> Soren
>>
>>> Regards
>>> Santiago
>>>
Regards,
-Dan
>>>
>>> -
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
>>>
>>>
>>
>> -
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org
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>>
>
>
> -
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Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
On Mon, Nov 29, 2010 at 11:57 PM, Ian Roughley wrote: > On 11/25/2010 07:35 PM, Niclas Hedhman wrote: > So, I think there's an underlying issue here that hasn't been brought up yet. > And from the many > discussion with Dan, I think it's Google's fault :-) I just want a leveled playing field. If it was required that Yahoo had to sign off on "Apache Traffic Server" being "OK", I think it is only fair that we either ask the same thing from Google, or come up with another name (as instructions were when Traffic Server came up). > The problem is that "Google Wave" was marketed as both the technology (such > as email) and a product > (such as Exchange), causing identity issues. Now, I think we have the same > identity problem with > the trademark discussion. Yes, naming sux... My reservation is noted, I suspect this will be discussed quite a bit, so let's get going with the vote. Cheers -- Niclas Hedhman, Software Developer http://www.qi4j.org - New Energy for Java I live here; http://tinyurl.com/2qq9er I work here; http://tinyurl.com/2ymelc I relax here; http://tinyurl.com/2cgsug - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
On 11/25/2010 07:35 PM, Niclas Hedhman wrote: > On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 1:26 PM, Greg Stein wrote: > >> Simple review: the original email was sent by Dan Peterson from his >> google.com address. I imagine that if Google had a problem with it, >> then he wouldn't be working there tomorrow :-D ... or if this was some >> kind of spurious one-guy-goes-batshit-crazy, then how could he line up >> so many people? >> >> And sure, while you couldn't know this, Dan is a great guy. I worked >> with him while at Google. This proposal is straight-up. >> >> My simple point is: please accept proposals at face value rather than >> pushing back with paranoid thoughts about malfeasance on the part of >> the people wanting to join our efforts here at the ASF. > > Yet, we have in the past had similar situations, where we have not > allowed this kind of position. In the end, you are now encouraging > that Apache WAVE, Google WAVE and Niclas WAVE are totally fine, > possibly not the same thing. > LucidImagination is told that "LucidWorks for Lucene" is a proper > 'association' back to the Apache project. Shouldn't they (in the same > spirit) then be allowed "Lucid Lucene" as well? > Didn't we require Yahoo TrafficServer to assign trademark, or we would > change the name? > Doug Cutting assign trademark to Lucene? > > Although I agree with you, Greg, that if Google has a problem, this is > likely not happening. My point is the reverse; If we allow "Google > Wave", "Niclas Wave" and so forth, we need to allow this for the > Lucenes, Hadoops and TrafficServers as well, otherwise 5 years down > the line, you need to go researching each and every projects history > to figure out how derived products may call themselves. I think it > severely complicates Trademark policies and blurs our definitions. So, I think there's an underlying issue here that hasn't been brought up yet. And from the many discussion with Dan, I think it's Google's fault :-) The problem is that "Google Wave" was marketed as both the technology (such as email) and a product (such as Exchange), causing identity issues. Now, I think we have the same identity problem with the trademark discussion. My concern with NOT including the word "wave" in the name, and instead using something like "bob", is that now we need to re-educate technologist of what "bob" is. Having worked on Novell Pulse/Vibe for as long as Wave has been around, I know that it's much easier to explain our product as being like wave and using wave - even though it's not entirely correct terminology most of the time. > > > -1 to the proposal as it stands with this name and 'Google retains the > trademark "Google Wave"' > > > Cheers - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
I'd like to add to what Soren said: we've discussed whether we should include
the protocol and the
implementation of the protocol in the proposal. What we concluded, is that
having everything
together would be the simplest for the time being... although I don't think
anyone in the discussion
had *really* strong opinions in either direction.
>From my standpoint (as a Novell employee and part of the Novell Vibe project),
>I'm very interested
in ensuring that the protocol and libraries are licensed in a way that they can
be leveraged by
commercial software to allow for interoperability. I'd also go as far as
saying that it's in
everyones best interest for this to be the case :-)
/Ian
On 11/29/2010 07:15 AM, Soren Lassen wrote:
> On Mon, Nov 29, 2010 at 8:32 PM, Santiago Gala
> wrote:
>> On Mon, Nov 29, 2010 at 8:49 AM, Dan Peterson wrote:
>> (...)
>>> To keep things moving, I'd like to go ahead and put this proposal to a vote
>>> starting on Tuesday on the west coast of the US (roughly 24 hours from now).
>>>
>>
>> I want to get some information about an issue that, like the
>> name/branding one, is not a blocker for incubator entry, but can
>> change significantly the level of third party support.
>>
>> It is the governance model for the protocol suit. If I understood
>> correctly, the project is scoped towards the software server
>> component. It does not include development of the protocol libraries.
>
> The project will include all the source code for the "wave in a box"
> server, including all the ("library"?) code for the data model, the
> federation protocol implementation, the client-server protocol
> implementation, and the robot and data APIs, as well as all the
> documentation/specifications for the data model, protocols, and APIs
> hosted at waveprotocol.org.
>
>> Does it include test suites beyond the server being a big test harness
>> itself?
>
> There are no test suites other than unittests for the abovementioned
> implementations.
>
>> It would be great to be able to know the plans for those:
>> - protocol specification and maintenance
>> - reference libraries for the protocol
>> - test suites and specifically test kits if any is planned
>>
>> I think that clarifying those scopes would be great.
>
> Presently, we regard the protocol specification as a specification of
> the wave-in-a-box implementation and, thus, the specification belongs
> together with the implementation in the proposed Apache project.
> Eventually, we would like to formally standardize the protocol, i.e.,
> agree with external parties outside the project to use the protocol
> between different implementations. When we get to the point when we
> start negotiating such agreements, we envision that we will spin out
> the protocol from the proposed Apache project into a standardisation
> working group (probably under the wings of IETF or some other
> standards body) which will govern these negotiations. The working
> group will need to decide on things like reference libraries and test
> suites. We're not deciding now whether the code in the proposed Apache
> project will be used for these purposes.
>
> Soren
>
>> Regards
>> Santiago
>>
>>> Regards,
>>> -Dan
>>>
>>
>> -
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org
>> For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
>>
>>
>
> -
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org
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>
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Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
On Mon, Nov 29, 2010 at 8:32 PM, Santiago Gala wrote:
> On Mon, Nov 29, 2010 at 8:49 AM, Dan Peterson wrote:
> (...)
>> To keep things moving, I'd like to go ahead and put this proposal to a vote
>> starting on Tuesday on the west coast of the US (roughly 24 hours from now).
>>
>
> I want to get some information about an issue that, like the
> name/branding one, is not a blocker for incubator entry, but can
> change significantly the level of third party support.
>
> It is the governance model for the protocol suit. If I understood
> correctly, the project is scoped towards the software server
> component. It does not include development of the protocol libraries.
The project will include all the source code for the "wave in a box"
server, including all the ("library"?) code for the data model, the
federation protocol implementation, the client-server protocol
implementation, and the robot and data APIs, as well as all the
documentation/specifications for the data model, protocols, and APIs
hosted at waveprotocol.org.
> Does it include test suites beyond the server being a big test harness
> itself?
There are no test suites other than unittests for the abovementioned
implementations.
> It would be great to be able to know the plans for those:
> - protocol specification and maintenance
> - reference libraries for the protocol
> - test suites and specifically test kits if any is planned
>
> I think that clarifying those scopes would be great.
Presently, we regard the protocol specification as a specification of
the wave-in-a-box implementation and, thus, the specification belongs
together with the implementation in the proposed Apache project.
Eventually, we would like to formally standardize the protocol, i.e.,
agree with external parties outside the project to use the protocol
between different implementations. When we get to the point when we
start negotiating such agreements, we envision that we will spin out
the protocol from the proposed Apache project into a standardisation
working group (probably under the wings of IETF or some other
standards body) which will govern these negotiations. The working
group will need to decide on things like reference libraries and test
suites. We're not deciding now whether the code in the proposed Apache
project will be used for these purposes.
Soren
> Regards
> Santiago
>
>> Regards,
>> -Dan
>>
>
> -
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org
> For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
>
>
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Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
On Mon, Nov 29, 2010 at 8:49 AM, Dan Peterson wrote: (...) > To keep things moving, I'd like to go ahead and put this proposal to a vote > starting on Tuesday on the west coast of the US (roughly 24 hours from now). > I want to get some information about an issue that, like the name/branding one, is not a blocker for incubator entry, but can change significantly the level of third party support. It is the governance model for the protocol suit. If I understood correctly, the project is scoped towards the software server component. It does not include development of the protocol libraries. Does it include test suites beyond the server being a big test harness itself? It would be great to be able to know the plans for those: - protocol specification and maintenance - reference libraries for the protocol - test suites and specifically test kits if any is planned I think that clarifying those scopes would be great. Regards Santiago > Regards, > -Dan > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
On Fri, Nov 26, 2010 at 9:35 AM, Ralph Goers wrote: > > On Nov 26, 2010, at 7:05 AM, Joe Schaefer wrote: > > > - Original Message > > > >> From: Tad Glines > >> To: general@incubator.apache.org > >> Sent: Fri, November 26, 2010 9:47:33 AM > >> Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation > >> > >> The word "Wave" is far more generic than "TrafficServer", "Lucene" or > >> "Hadoop". > >> When I did a search through the trademark database I found 62 > trademarks on > >> the word "wave". There are others that contain the word wave one of > which is > >> Google's "Google Wave" trademark. While I am neither a lawyer nor a > >> trademark expert, it seems logical to conclude that given the many > "Wave" > >> trademarks and the fact that Google was granted a "Google Wave" > trademark > >> that Apache would have no problem obtaining a trademark on "Apache > Wave" if > >> they wished to. > >> > >> I think it's also fairly safe to conclude that Google is never going to > >> assign a trademark with the word "Google" in it to another entity. > >> > >> If Google had a trademark on the plain word "Wave" in the > >> communication/collaboration space, then I would expect that to be a > problem. > >> But, since they don't, I don't think this is an issue. > >> > >> Perhaps Google could issue some sort of official "We promise not to sue > >> Apache Foundation over the use of the name 'Apache Wave'" just to make > >> everyone happy. > > > > Welcome to the Incubator. Yes trademarks are taken seriously, and yes > > you've made some good points that the situation with "Wave" is relatively > > unique. While these sorts of discussions can be frustrating and annoying > > at times, everyone here at Apache is basically just trying to be fair to > > both all ASF projects and past incubation efforts, and somewhat > consistent in > > what we tell others about Incubation. Different people have different > > perspectives and they are able to openly disagree without disrupting > progress. > > Happens all the time here. > > > > FWIW I can easily foresee the Incubator accepting this proposal as > written > > and kicking around the trademark issue for a while longer post > acceptance. > > This is just how we work. Personally I'd be fine with an Apache Wave > project > > graduating from the incubator, even without asking Google to abandon its > > interest in the Google Wave trademark (just as we haven't asked NCSU to > > abandon its interest in VCL). We just want to avoid any potential > confusion > > about the marks and the software they refer to. > > > > If we need a legal opinion from the org about the propriety of that > solution > > I'd be happy to go fetch one, but for now let's please just move on to > any > > other remaining issues with the proposal. > > > I completely agree with everything you said. Furthermore, I am quite > satisfied based on the responses I got to my questions that Google has > already given us permission to use Apache Wave. > > The real question is whether the ASF is comfortable in having a project > with that name. For example, since Google is retaining the rights to Google > Wave they could at any time ship a version of Apache Wave under that name - > which, I believe, is something not currently allowed for any other ASF > project. OTOH, Wave in a Box (or WIAB) sounds like it is probably quite > unique. Personally, I am torn between being consistent and the fact that a > project named Apache Wave is going to have instant market appeal. > > But a decision on what the formal project name will be should not preclude > entrance to the incubator. However, the project participants should be aware > that there is likely to be more discussion on the issue. Thanks for the summary, Ralph. I also agree with Tad's points. I think the most important thing is that any organization should be free to use Apache Wave, assuming it complies with the Apache open source license. However, most importantly: I'm glad to hear explicit resolution here isn't a blocking issue for entry to the incubator. Overall, since putting this proposal up for discussion last week, we've received: substantive feedback, gained 2 new mentors, heard from potential new contributors, and seen both binding and non-binding votes of support. To keep things moving, I'd like to go ahead and put this proposal to a vote starting on Tuesday on the west coast of the US (roughly 24 hours from now). Regards, -Dan
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
On Nov 26, 2010, at 7:05 AM, Joe Schaefer wrote: > - Original Message > >> From: Tad Glines >> To: general@incubator.apache.org >> Sent: Fri, November 26, 2010 9:47:33 AM >> Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation >> >> The word "Wave" is far more generic than "TrafficServer", "Lucene" or >> "Hadoop". >> When I did a search through the trademark database I found 62 trademarks on >> the word "wave". There are others that contain the word wave one of which is >> Google's "Google Wave" trademark. While I am neither a lawyer nor a >> trademark expert, it seems logical to conclude that given the many "Wave" >> trademarks and the fact that Google was granted a "Google Wave" trademark >> that Apache would have no problem obtaining a trademark on "Apache Wave" if >> they wished to. >> >> I think it's also fairly safe to conclude that Google is never going to >> assign a trademark with the word "Google" in it to another entity. >> >> If Google had a trademark on the plain word "Wave" in the >> communication/collaboration space, then I would expect that to be a problem. >> But, since they don't, I don't think this is an issue. >> >> Perhaps Google could issue some sort of official "We promise not to sue >> Apache Foundation over the use of the name 'Apache Wave'" just to make >> everyone happy. > > Welcome to the Incubator. Yes trademarks are taken seriously, and yes > you've made some good points that the situation with "Wave" is relatively > unique. While these sorts of discussions can be frustrating and annoying > at times, everyone here at Apache is basically just trying to be fair to > both all ASF projects and past incubation efforts, and somewhat consistent in > what we tell others about Incubation. Different people have different > perspectives and they are able to openly disagree without disrupting progress. > Happens all the time here. > > FWIW I can easily foresee the Incubator accepting this proposal as written > and kicking around the trademark issue for a while longer post acceptance. > This is just how we work. Personally I'd be fine with an Apache Wave project > graduating from the incubator, even without asking Google to abandon its > interest in the Google Wave trademark (just as we haven't asked NCSU to > abandon its interest in VCL). We just want to avoid any potential confusion > about the marks and the software they refer to. > > If we need a legal opinion from the org about the propriety of that solution > I'd be happy to go fetch one, but for now let's please just move on to any > other remaining issues with the proposal. I completely agree with everything you said. Furthermore, I am quite satisfied based on the responses I got to my questions that Google has already given us permission to use Apache Wave. The real question is whether the ASF is comfortable in having a project with that name. For example, since Google is retaining the rights to Google Wave they could at any time ship a version of Apache Wave under that name - which, I believe, is something not currently allowed for any other ASF project. OTOH, Wave in a Box (or WIAB) sounds like it is probably quite unique. Personally, I am torn between being consistent and the fact that a project named Apache Wave is going to have instant market appeal. But a decision on what the formal project name will be should not preclude entrance to the incubator. However, the project participants should be aware that there is likely to be more discussion on the issue. Ralph - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
- Original Message > From: Tad Glines > To: general@incubator.apache.org > Sent: Fri, November 26, 2010 9:47:33 AM > Subject: Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation > > On Thu, Nov 25, 2010 at 4:35 PM, Niclas Hedhman wrote: > > > Yet, we have in the past had similar situations, where we have not > > allowed this kind of position. In the end, you are now encouraging > > that Apache WAVE, Google WAVE and Niclas WAVE are totally fine, > > possibly not the same thing. > > LucidImagination is told that "LucidWorks for Lucene" is a proper > > 'association' back to the Apache project. Shouldn't they (in the same > > spirit) then be allowed "Lucid Lucene" as well? > > Didn't we require Yahoo TrafficServer to assign trademark, or we would > > change the name? > > Doug Cutting assign trademark to Lucene? > > > > Although I agree with you, Greg, that if Google has a problem, this is > > likely not happening. My point is the reverse; If we allow "Google > > Wave", "Niclas Wave" and so forth, we need to allow this for the > > Lucenes, Hadoops and TrafficServers as well, otherwise 5 years down > > the line, you need to go researching each and every projects history > > to figure out how derived products may call themselves. I think it > > severely complicates Trademark policies and blurs our definitions. > > > > The word "Wave" is far more generic than "TrafficServer", "Lucene" or > "Hadoop". > When I did a search through the trademark database I found 62 trademarks on > the word "wave". There are others that contain the word wave one of which is > Google's "Google Wave" trademark. While I am neither a lawyer nor a > trademark expert, it seems logical to conclude that given the many "Wave" > trademarks and the fact that Google was granted a "Google Wave" trademark > that Apache would have no problem obtaining a trademark on "Apache Wave" if > they wished to. > > I think it's also fairly safe to conclude that Google is never going to > assign a trademark with the word "Google" in it to another entity. > > If Google had a trademark on the plain word "Wave" in the > communication/collaboration space, then I would expect that to be a problem. > But, since they don't, I don't think this is an issue. > > Perhaps Google could issue some sort of official "We promise not to sue > Apache Foundation over the use of the name 'Apache Wave'" just to make > everyone happy. Welcome to the Incubator. Yes trademarks are taken seriously, and yes you've made some good points that the situation with "Wave" is relatively unique. While these sorts of discussions can be frustrating and annoying at times, everyone here at Apache is basically just trying to be fair to both all ASF projects and past incubation efforts, and somewhat consistent in what we tell others about Incubation. Different people have different perspectives and they are able to openly disagree without disrupting progress. Happens all the time here. FWIW I can easily foresee the Incubator accepting this proposal as written and kicking around the trademark issue for a while longer post acceptance. This is just how we work. Personally I'd be fine with an Apache Wave project graduating from the incubator, even without asking Google to abandon its interest in the Google Wave trademark (just as we haven't asked NCSU to abandon its interest in VCL). We just want to avoid any potential confusion about the marks and the software they refer to. If we need a legal opinion from the org about the propriety of that solution I'd be happy to go fetch one, but for now let's please just move on to any other remaining issues with the proposal. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
On Thu, Nov 25, 2010 at 4:35 PM, Niclas Hedhman wrote: > Yet, we have in the past had similar situations, where we have not > allowed this kind of position. In the end, you are now encouraging > that Apache WAVE, Google WAVE and Niclas WAVE are totally fine, > possibly not the same thing. > LucidImagination is told that "LucidWorks for Lucene" is a proper > 'association' back to the Apache project. Shouldn't they (in the same > spirit) then be allowed "Lucid Lucene" as well? > Didn't we require Yahoo TrafficServer to assign trademark, or we would > change the name? > Doug Cutting assign trademark to Lucene? > > Although I agree with you, Greg, that if Google has a problem, this is > likely not happening. My point is the reverse; If we allow "Google > Wave", "Niclas Wave" and so forth, we need to allow this for the > Lucenes, Hadoops and TrafficServers as well, otherwise 5 years down > the line, you need to go researching each and every projects history > to figure out how derived products may call themselves. I think it > severely complicates Trademark policies and blurs our definitions. > The word "Wave" is far more generic than "TrafficServer", "Lucene" or "Hadoop". When I did a search through the trademark database I found 62 trademarks on the word "wave". There are others that contain the word wave one of which is Google's "Google Wave" trademark. While I am neither a lawyer nor a trademark expert, it seems logical to conclude that given the many "Wave" trademarks and the fact that Google was granted a "Google Wave" trademark that Apache would have no problem obtaining a trademark on "Apache Wave" if they wished to. I think it's also fairly safe to conclude that Google is never going to assign a trademark with the word "Google" in it to another entity. If Google had a trademark on the plain word "Wave" in the communication/collaboration space, then I would expect that to be a problem. But, since they don't, I don't think this is an issue. Perhaps Google could issue some sort of official "We promise not to sue Apache Foundation over the use of the name 'Apache Wave'" just to make everyone happy. -Tad
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
On Nov 26, 2010, at 4:07 AM, Bernd Fondermann wrote: > > > I wouldn't stop the proposal, though. This can be identified as an > issue to be solved in Incubation - either by changing the name away > from 'Wave' or by transferring marks or even by determining that none > of both is required. Yes. Traffic Server went through this same exercise, where transfer of existing marks were done as part of our incubation process, and a requirement for graduation. I'm not saying any of that will be required here, but I agree that if necessary it can be resolved in the PPMC and IPMC. Pointing this out in the proposal would be good, if I recall we had an entire section about trademark "issues" in our TS proposal. I too am very excited to see this proposal, it's good for Apache, and hopefully a great way for the Wave community to grow and continue to prosper. Cheers, -- leif > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
On Fri, 26 Nov 2010 12:07 +0100, "Bernd Fondermann" wrote: > On Fri, Nov 26, 2010 at 01:35, Niclas Hedhman wrote: > > On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 1:26 PM, Greg Stein wrote: > > > >> Simple review: the original email was sent by Dan Peterson from his > >> google.com address. I imagine that if Google had a problem with it, > >> then he wouldn't be working there tomorrow :-D ... or if this was some > >> kind of spurious one-guy-goes-batshit-crazy, then how could he line up > >> so many people? > >> > >> And sure, while you couldn't know this, Dan is a great guy. I worked > >> with him while at Google. This proposal is straight-up. > >> > >> My simple point is: please accept proposals at face value rather than > >> pushing back with paranoid thoughts about malfeasance on the part of > >> the people wanting to join our efforts here at the ASF. > > > > Yet, we have in the past had similar situations, where we have not > > allowed this kind of position. In the end, you are now encouraging > > that Apache WAVE, Google WAVE and Niclas WAVE are totally fine, > > possibly not the same thing. > > LucidImagination is told that "LucidWorks for Lucene" is a proper > > 'association' back to the Apache project. Shouldn't they (in the same > > spirit) then be allowed "Lucid Lucene" as well? > > Didn't we require Yahoo TrafficServer to assign trademark, or we would > > change the name? > > Doug Cutting assign trademark to Lucene? > > > > Although I agree with you, Greg, that if Google has a problem, this is > > likely not happening. My point is the reverse; If we allow "Google > > Wave", "Niclas Wave" and so forth, we need to allow this for the > > Lucenes, Hadoops and TrafficServers as well, otherwise 5 years down > > the line, you need to go researching each and every projects history > > to figure out how derived products may call themselves. I think it > > severely complicates Trademark policies and blurs our definitions. > > > > > > -1 to the proposal as it stands with this name and 'Google retains the > > trademark "Google Wave"' > > In general I agree with Niclas. This clause should be removed. > > I seem to recall podlings where the donating company was required to > transfer trademarks, but don't remember exactly which podling/project > it was. > > I wouldn't stop the proposal, though. This can be identified as an > issue to be solved in Incubation - either by changing the name away > from 'Wave' or by transferring marks or even by determining that none > of both is required. My understanding is that Google claim a trademark on the "Google Wave" term, but no such trademark on "Wave". There are other "Waves", and that Google is quite happy with alternative "Waves", such as "Apache Wave". Personally, I don't see any problem with this at all, given the fact that "Wave" if anything is a term attributed to the protocol itself, rather than any one implementation. Google Wave is just one implementation of the 'wave protocol', just as is (or would be) Apache Wave. If there were some kind of greater reassurance we could gain from Google, maybe that would soothe folk's anxieties, but I don't have an issue with the name in itself. Upayavira - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
On Nov 26, 2010, at 1:07 PM, Bernd Fondermann wrote: > I wouldn't stop the proposal, though. This can be identified as an > issue to be solved in Incubation - either by changing the name away > from 'Wave' or by transferring marks or even by determining that none > of both is required. Exactly, this is an exit requirement, not an entry one. Andrus - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
On Fri, Nov 26, 2010 at 12:26, Jukka Zitting wrote: > Hi, > > On Fri, Nov 26, 2010 at 12:07 PM, Bernd Fondermann > wrote: >> PS: It would've been much better to first [DISCUSS] the proposal >> before putting it up for vote. > > I don't see a [VOTE] here. Ooops, you're right. - Well, in this case, I vote +1. Bernd /me goes cleaning glasses - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
Hi, On Fri, Nov 26, 2010 at 12:07 PM, Bernd Fondermann wrote: > PS: It would've been much better to first [DISCUSS] the proposal > before putting it up for vote. I don't see a [VOTE] here. BR, Jukka Zitting - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
On Fri, Nov 26, 2010 at 01:35, Niclas Hedhman wrote: > On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 1:26 PM, Greg Stein wrote: > >> Simple review: the original email was sent by Dan Peterson from his >> google.com address. I imagine that if Google had a problem with it, >> then he wouldn't be working there tomorrow :-D ... or if this was some >> kind of spurious one-guy-goes-batshit-crazy, then how could he line up >> so many people? >> >> And sure, while you couldn't know this, Dan is a great guy. I worked >> with him while at Google. This proposal is straight-up. >> >> My simple point is: please accept proposals at face value rather than >> pushing back with paranoid thoughts about malfeasance on the part of >> the people wanting to join our efforts here at the ASF. > > Yet, we have in the past had similar situations, where we have not > allowed this kind of position. In the end, you are now encouraging > that Apache WAVE, Google WAVE and Niclas WAVE are totally fine, > possibly not the same thing. > LucidImagination is told that "LucidWorks for Lucene" is a proper > 'association' back to the Apache project. Shouldn't they (in the same > spirit) then be allowed "Lucid Lucene" as well? > Didn't we require Yahoo TrafficServer to assign trademark, or we would > change the name? > Doug Cutting assign trademark to Lucene? > > Although I agree with you, Greg, that if Google has a problem, this is > likely not happening. My point is the reverse; If we allow "Google > Wave", "Niclas Wave" and so forth, we need to allow this for the > Lucenes, Hadoops and TrafficServers as well, otherwise 5 years down > the line, you need to go researching each and every projects history > to figure out how derived products may call themselves. I think it > severely complicates Trademark policies and blurs our definitions. > > > -1 to the proposal as it stands with this name and 'Google retains the > trademark "Google Wave"' In general I agree with Niclas. This clause should be removed. I seem to recall podlings where the donating company was required to transfer trademarks, but don't remember exactly which podling/project it was. I wouldn't stop the proposal, though. This can be identified as an issue to be solved in Incubation - either by changing the name away from 'Wave' or by transferring marks or even by determining that none of both is required. Bernd PS: It would've been much better to first [DISCUSS] the proposal before putting it up for vote. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
+1 Mike On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 3:16 PM, Dan Peterson wrote: > Hello all, > > We'd like to propose Wave for entry into the ASF incubator. > > The draft proposal is available at: > http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/WaveProposal > (for your convenience, a snapshot is also copied below) > > A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich communication. > It can be used like email, chat, or a document. Wave in a Box (WIAB) is the > name of the main product at the moment, which is a server that hosts and > federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and provides a rich web client. > This project also includes an implementation of the Wave Federation > protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems (such as multiple > interoperable Wave In a Box instances). > > As a result of the recent Wave Summit, beyond growing a few new committers, > we've put together the following proposal for migrating the community into > the ASF incubator. More details on the summit & Wave in a Box progress in > this blogpost: > http://googlewavedev.blogspot.com/2010/11/this-weeks-wave-protocol-summit-updates.html > > We are looking forward to your feedback and suggestions. > > By the way, if you're looking to learn more about the technology related to > wave, you can see the videos and presentations from the recent Wave Summit > in: https://wave.google.com/wave/waveref/googlewave.com/w+rwFyiw47A > > Kind regards, > -Dan, on behalf of the Wave Community > > P.S. For those on the wave-protocol Google Group (that aren't yet on > general@incubator.apache.org), please participate in this discussion > by sending a message to general-subscribe at incubator dot apache dot org > > > Apache Wave Proposal (Apache Incubator) > > = Abstract = > > Apache Wave is the project where wave technology is developed at Apache. > Wave in a Box (WIAB) is the name of the main product at the moment, which is > a server that hosts and federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and > provides a rich web client. This project also includes an implementation of > the Wave Federation protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems > (such as multiple interoperable Wave In a Box instances). > > = Proposal = > > A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich communication. > It can be used like email, chat, or a document. > > WIAB is a server that hosts waves. The best analogy for this is a mail > server with a web client. WIAB is comprised of a few high-level components: > the client and the server. They have the following major functionality > (though this is not an exhaustive list): > > * Client > *A dynamic web client for users to create, edit, and search waves. Users > can access this client by directly visiting the server in a browser. > * Gadgets provide the ability to insert, view, and modify the UI -- > exposing the Wave Gadgets API ( > http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/gadgets/guide.html) > * A console client that can create and edit waves via a command-line-like > interface. > * Server > * Hosts and stores waves. WIAB comes with a default storage mechanism. The > administrators of the server may configure it to use alternative storage > mechanisms. > * Indexing, allowing for searching the waves a user has access to. > * Basic authentication, configurable to delegate to other systems. > * Federation, allowing separate Wave in a Box servers to communicate with > each other using the Wave Federation Protocol ( > http://www.waveprotocol.org/federation). > * Robots, using the Wave Robots API, ( > http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/robots/) may interact with waves > on a WIAB instance. > > = Background = > > Wave expresses a new metaphor for communication: hosted conversations. This > was created by Lars and Jens Rasmussen after observation of people's use of > many separate forms of communication to get something done, e.g, email, > chat, docs, blogs, twitter, etc. > > The vision has always been to better the way people communicate and > collaborate. Building open protocols and sharing code available in an open > and free way is a critical part of that vision. Anyone should be able to > bring up their own wave server and communicate with others (much like SMTP). > > We hope this project will allow everyone to easily gain the benefits of Wave > with a standard implementation of Wave – in a box. > > = Rationale = > > Wave has shown it excels at small group collaboration when hosted by Google. > Although Wave will not continue as a standalone Google product, there is a > lot of interest from many organizations in both running Wave and building > upon the technology for new products. > > We are confident that with the community-centric development environment > fostered by the Apache Software Foundation, WIAB will thrive. > > = Initial Goals = > > The initial goals of the project are: > > 1. To migrate the codebase from code.google.com and integrate the project > with the ASF infrastructure (issue mana
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 1:26 PM, Greg Stein wrote: > Simple review: the original email was sent by Dan Peterson from his > google.com address. I imagine that if Google had a problem with it, > then he wouldn't be working there tomorrow :-D ... or if this was some > kind of spurious one-guy-goes-batshit-crazy, then how could he line up > so many people? > > And sure, while you couldn't know this, Dan is a great guy. I worked > with him while at Google. This proposal is straight-up. > > My simple point is: please accept proposals at face value rather than > pushing back with paranoid thoughts about malfeasance on the part of > the people wanting to join our efforts here at the ASF. Yet, we have in the past had similar situations, where we have not allowed this kind of position. In the end, you are now encouraging that Apache WAVE, Google WAVE and Niclas WAVE are totally fine, possibly not the same thing. LucidImagination is told that "LucidWorks for Lucene" is a proper 'association' back to the Apache project. Shouldn't they (in the same spirit) then be allowed "Lucid Lucene" as well? Didn't we require Yahoo TrafficServer to assign trademark, or we would change the name? Doug Cutting assign trademark to Lucene? Although I agree with you, Greg, that if Google has a problem, this is likely not happening. My point is the reverse; If we allow "Google Wave", "Niclas Wave" and so forth, we need to allow this for the Lucenes, Hadoops and TrafficServers as well, otherwise 5 years down the line, you need to go researching each and every projects history to figure out how derived products may call themselves. I think it severely complicates Trademark policies and blurs our definitions. -1 to the proposal as it stands with this name and 'Google retains the trademark "Google Wave"' Cheers -- Niclas Hedhman, Software Developer http://www.qi4j.org - New Energy for Java - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
Sounds good :-) On Nov 24, 2010, at 8:09 PM, Dan Peterson wrote: > Hi Andrus, > > Thanks for your support. I think this'll be a good home for Wave to grow and > mature. > > I've taken the liberty of adding you on the mentor list. :) > > Cheers, > -Dan > > On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 1:20 AM, Andrus Adamchik > wrote: > >> +1 >> >> I am so happy that after all considerations and suggestions that were >> floated in the Wave community, you guys picked Apache as the place to >> develop Wave community and WIAB. Good luck and let me know if you need extra >> mentors (you already have 4, so I figured you are covered and didn't add >> myself to the list). >> >> Cheers, >> Andrus >> >> On Nov 23, 2010, at 10:16 PM, Dan Peterson wrote: >> >>> Hello all, >>> >>> We'd like to propose Wave for entry into the ASF incubator. >>> >>> The draft proposal is available at: >>> http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/WaveProposal >>> (for your convenience, a snapshot is also copied below) >>> >>> A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich >> communication. >>> It can be used like email, chat, or a document. Wave in a Box (WIAB) is >> the >>> name of the main product at the moment, which is a server that hosts and >>> federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and provides a rich web client. >>> This project also includes an implementation of the Wave Federation >>> protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems (such as multiple >>> interoperable Wave In a Box instances). >>> >>> As a result of the recent Wave Summit, beyond growing a few new >> committers, >>> we've put together the following proposal for migrating the community >> into >>> the ASF incubator. More details on the summit & Wave in a Box progress in >>> this blogpost: >>> >> http://googlewavedev.blogspot.com/2010/11/this-weeks-wave-protocol-summit-updates.html >>> >>> We are looking forward to your feedback and suggestions. >>> >>> By the way, if you're looking to learn more about the technology related >> to >>> wave, you can see the videos and presentations from the recent Wave >> Summit >>> in: https://wave.google.com/wave/waveref/googlewave.com/w+rwFyiw47A >>> >>> Kind regards, >>> -Dan, on behalf of the Wave Community >>> >>> P.S. For those on the wave-protocol Google Group (that aren't yet on >>> general@incubator.apache.org), please participate in this discussion >>> by sending a message to general-subscribe at incubator dot apache dot org >>> >>> >>> Apache Wave Proposal (Apache Incubator) >>> >>> = Abstract = >>> >>> Apache Wave is the project where wave technology is developed at Apache. >>> Wave in a Box (WIAB) is the name of the main product at the moment, which >> is >>> a server that hosts and federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and >>> provides a rich web client. This project also includes an implementation >> of >>> the Wave Federation protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems >>> (such as multiple interoperable Wave In a Box instances). >>> >>> = Proposal = >>> >>> A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich >> communication. >>> It can be used like email, chat, or a document. >>> >>> WIAB is a server that hosts waves. The best analogy for this is a mail >>> server with a web client. WIAB is comprised of a few high-level >> components: >>> the client and the server. They have the following major functionality >>> (though this is not an exhaustive list): >>> >>> * Client >>> *A dynamic web client for users to create, edit, and search waves. Users >>> can access this client by directly visiting the server in a browser. >>> * Gadgets provide the ability to insert, view, and modify the UI -- >>> exposing the Wave Gadgets API ( >>> http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/gadgets/guide.html) >>> * A console client that can create and edit waves via a >> command-line-like >>> interface. >>> * Server >>> * Hosts and stores waves. WIAB comes with a default storage mechanism. >> The >>> administrators of the server may configure it to use alternative storage >>> mechanisms. >>> * Indexing, allowing for searching the waves a user has access to. >>> * Basic authentication, configurable to delegate to other systems. >>> * Federation, allowing separate Wave in a Box servers to communicate >> with >>> each other using the Wave Federation Protocol ( >>> http://www.waveprotocol.org/federation). >>> * Robots, using the Wave Robots API, ( >>> http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/robots/) may interact with >> waves >>> on a WIAB instance. >>> >>> = Background = >>> >>> Wave expresses a new metaphor for communication: hosted conversations. >> This >>> was created by Lars and Jens Rasmussen after observation of people's use >> of >>> many separate forms of communication to get something done, e.g, email, >>> chat, docs, blogs, twitter, etc. >>> >>> The vision has always been to better the way people communicate and >>> collaborate. Building open protocols and sharing code available
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
Yes, might even be able to persuade my employer to let me slice out some time, but even it I cant help actively, very interested. Ian On 24 Nov 2010, at 18:15, Dan Peterson wrote: > Ian, > > Cool -- I imagine this project could be rather useful for some of your > education projects. > > -Dan > > On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 3:41 AM, Ian Boston wrote: > >> +1 >> Would be happy to help of you need any (and if I can find time) >> Ian >> >> On 23 Nov 2010, at 20:16, Dan Peterson wrote: >> >>> Hello all, >>> >>> We'd like to propose Wave for entry into the ASF incubator. >>> >>> The draft proposal is available at: >>> http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/WaveProposal >>> (for your convenience, a snapshot is also copied below) >>> >>> A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich >> communication. >>> It can be used like email, chat, or a document. Wave in a Box (WIAB) is >> the >>> name of the main product at the moment, which is a server that hosts and >>> federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and provides a rich web client. >>> This project also includes an implementation of the Wave Federation >>> protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems (such as multiple >>> interoperable Wave In a Box instances). >>> >>> As a result of the recent Wave Summit, beyond growing a few new >> committers, >>> we've put together the following proposal for migrating the community >> into >>> the ASF incubator. More details on the summit & Wave in a Box progress in >>> this blogpost: >>> >> http://googlewavedev.blogspot.com/2010/11/this-weeks-wave-protocol-summit-updates.html >>> >>> We are looking forward to your feedback and suggestions. >>> >>> By the way, if you're looking to learn more about the technology related >> to >>> wave, you can see the videos and presentations from the recent Wave >> Summit >>> in: https://wave.google.com/wave/waveref/googlewave.com/w+rwFyiw47A >>> >>> Kind regards, >>> -Dan, on behalf of the Wave Community >>> >>> P.S. For those on the wave-protocol Google Group (that aren't yet on >>> general@incubator.apache.org), please participate in this discussion >>> by sending a message to general-subscribe at incubator dot apache dot org >>> >>> >>> Apache Wave Proposal (Apache Incubator) >>> >>> = Abstract = >>> >>> Apache Wave is the project where wave technology is developed at Apache. >>> Wave in a Box (WIAB) is the name of the main product at the moment, which >> is >>> a server that hosts and federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and >>> provides a rich web client. This project also includes an implementation >> of >>> the Wave Federation protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems >>> (such as multiple interoperable Wave In a Box instances). >>> >>> = Proposal = >>> >>> A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich >> communication. >>> It can be used like email, chat, or a document. >>> >>> WIAB is a server that hosts waves. The best analogy for this is a mail >>> server with a web client. WIAB is comprised of a few high-level >> components: >>> the client and the server. They have the following major functionality >>> (though this is not an exhaustive list): >>> >>> * Client >>> *A dynamic web client for users to create, edit, and search waves. Users >>> can access this client by directly visiting the server in a browser. >>> * Gadgets provide the ability to insert, view, and modify the UI -- >>> exposing the Wave Gadgets API ( >>> http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/gadgets/guide.html) >>> * A console client that can create and edit waves via a >> command-line-like >>> interface. >>> * Server >>> * Hosts and stores waves. WIAB comes with a default storage mechanism. >> The >>> administrators of the server may configure it to use alternative storage >>> mechanisms. >>> * Indexing, allowing for searching the waves a user has access to. >>> * Basic authentication, configurable to delegate to other systems. >>> * Federation, allowing separate Wave in a Box servers to communicate >> with >>> each other using the Wave Federation Protocol ( >>> http://www.waveprotocol.org/federation). >>> * Robots, using the Wave Robots API, ( >>> http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/robots/) may interact with >> waves >>> on a WIAB instance. >>> >>> = Background = >>> >>> Wave expresses a new metaphor for communication: hosted conversations. >> This >>> was created by Lars and Jens Rasmussen after observation of people's use >> of >>> many separate forms of communication to get something done, e.g, email, >>> chat, docs, blogs, twitter, etc. >>> >>> The vision has always been to better the way people communicate and >>> collaborate. Building open protocols and sharing code available in an >> open >>> and free way is a critical part of that vision. Anyone should be able to >>> bring up their own wave server and communicate with others (much like >> SMTP). >>> >>> We hope this project will allow everyone to easily gain the benefit
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
Ian, Cool -- I imagine this project could be rather useful for some of your education projects. -Dan On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 3:41 AM, Ian Boston wrote: > +1 > Would be happy to help of you need any (and if I can find time) > Ian > > On 23 Nov 2010, at 20:16, Dan Peterson wrote: > > > Hello all, > > > > We'd like to propose Wave for entry into the ASF incubator. > > > > The draft proposal is available at: > > http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/WaveProposal > > (for your convenience, a snapshot is also copied below) > > > > A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich > communication. > > It can be used like email, chat, or a document. Wave in a Box (WIAB) is > the > > name of the main product at the moment, which is a server that hosts and > > federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and provides a rich web client. > > This project also includes an implementation of the Wave Federation > > protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems (such as multiple > > interoperable Wave In a Box instances). > > > > As a result of the recent Wave Summit, beyond growing a few new > committers, > > we've put together the following proposal for migrating the community > into > > the ASF incubator. More details on the summit & Wave in a Box progress in > > this blogpost: > > > http://googlewavedev.blogspot.com/2010/11/this-weeks-wave-protocol-summit-updates.html > > > > We are looking forward to your feedback and suggestions. > > > > By the way, if you're looking to learn more about the technology related > to > > wave, you can see the videos and presentations from the recent Wave > Summit > > in: https://wave.google.com/wave/waveref/googlewave.com/w+rwFyiw47A > > > > Kind regards, > > -Dan, on behalf of the Wave Community > > > > P.S. For those on the wave-protocol Google Group (that aren't yet on > > general@incubator.apache.org), please participate in this discussion > > by sending a message to general-subscribe at incubator dot apache dot org > > > > > > Apache Wave Proposal (Apache Incubator) > > > > = Abstract = > > > > Apache Wave is the project where wave technology is developed at Apache. > > Wave in a Box (WIAB) is the name of the main product at the moment, which > is > > a server that hosts and federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and > > provides a rich web client. This project also includes an implementation > of > > the Wave Federation protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems > > (such as multiple interoperable Wave In a Box instances). > > > > = Proposal = > > > > A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich > communication. > > It can be used like email, chat, or a document. > > > > WIAB is a server that hosts waves. The best analogy for this is a mail > > server with a web client. WIAB is comprised of a few high-level > components: > > the client and the server. They have the following major functionality > > (though this is not an exhaustive list): > > > > * Client > > *A dynamic web client for users to create, edit, and search waves. Users > > can access this client by directly visiting the server in a browser. > > * Gadgets provide the ability to insert, view, and modify the UI -- > > exposing the Wave Gadgets API ( > > http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/gadgets/guide.html) > > * A console client that can create and edit waves via a > command-line-like > > interface. > > * Server > > * Hosts and stores waves. WIAB comes with a default storage mechanism. > The > > administrators of the server may configure it to use alternative storage > > mechanisms. > > * Indexing, allowing for searching the waves a user has access to. > > * Basic authentication, configurable to delegate to other systems. > > * Federation, allowing separate Wave in a Box servers to communicate > with > > each other using the Wave Federation Protocol ( > > http://www.waveprotocol.org/federation). > > * Robots, using the Wave Robots API, ( > > http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/robots/) may interact with > waves > > on a WIAB instance. > > > > = Background = > > > > Wave expresses a new metaphor for communication: hosted conversations. > This > > was created by Lars and Jens Rasmussen after observation of people's use > of > > many separate forms of communication to get something done, e.g, email, > > chat, docs, blogs, twitter, etc. > > > > The vision has always been to better the way people communicate and > > collaborate. Building open protocols and sharing code available in an > open > > and free way is a critical part of that vision. Anyone should be able to > > bring up their own wave server and communicate with others (much like > SMTP). > > > > We hope this project will allow everyone to easily gain the benefits of > Wave > > with a standard implementation of Wave – in a box. > > > > = Rationale = > > > > Wave has shown it excels at small group collaboration when hosted by > Google. > > Although Wave will not continue as a standalone Google produc
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
Hi Vincent, That's great! I've added you as a Mentor. -Dan On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 3:40 AM, Vincent Siveton wrote: > +1 > > @Dan if you need one more mentor, you could count me in. > > Vincent > > 2010/11/23 Dan Peterson : > > Hello all, > > > > We'd like to propose Wave for entry into the ASF incubator. > > > > The draft proposal is available at: > > http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/WaveProposal > > (for your convenience, a snapshot is also copied below) > > > > A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich > communication. > > It can be used like email, chat, or a document. Wave in a Box (WIAB) is > the > > name of the main product at the moment, which is a server that hosts and > > federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and provides a rich web client. > > This project also includes an implementation of the Wave Federation > > protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems (such as multiple > > interoperable Wave In a Box instances). > > > > As a result of the recent Wave Summit, beyond growing a few new > committers, > > we've put together the following proposal for migrating the community > into > > the ASF incubator. More details on the summit & Wave in a Box progress in > > this blogpost: > > > http://googlewavedev.blogspot.com/2010/11/this-weeks-wave-protocol-summit-updates.html > > > > We are looking forward to your feedback and suggestions. > > > > By the way, if you're looking to learn more about the technology related > to > > wave, you can see the videos and presentations from the recent Wave > Summit > > in: https://wave.google.com/wave/waveref/googlewave.com/w+rwFyiw47A > > > > Kind regards, > > -Dan, on behalf of the Wave Community > > > > P.S. For those on the wave-protocol Google Group (that aren't yet on > > general@incubator.apache.org), please participate in this discussion > > by sending a message to general-subscribe at incubator dot apache dot org > > > > > > Apache Wave Proposal (Apache Incubator) > > > > = Abstract = > > > > Apache Wave is the project where wave technology is developed at Apache. > > Wave in a Box (WIAB) is the name of the main product at the moment, which > is > > a server that hosts and federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and > > provides a rich web client. This project also includes an implementation > of > > the Wave Federation protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems > > (such as multiple interoperable Wave In a Box instances). > > > > = Proposal = > > > > A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich > communication. > > It can be used like email, chat, or a document. > > > > WIAB is a server that hosts waves. The best analogy for this is a mail > > server with a web client. WIAB is comprised of a few high-level > components: > > the client and the server. They have the following major functionality > > (though this is not an exhaustive list): > > > > * Client > > *A dynamic web client for users to create, edit, and search waves. Users > > can access this client by directly visiting the server in a browser. > > * Gadgets provide the ability to insert, view, and modify the UI -- > > exposing the Wave Gadgets API ( > > http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/gadgets/guide.html) > > * A console client that can create and edit waves via a > command-line-like > > interface. > > * Server > > * Hosts and stores waves. WIAB comes with a default storage mechanism. > The > > administrators of the server may configure it to use alternative storage > > mechanisms. > > * Indexing, allowing for searching the waves a user has access to. > > * Basic authentication, configurable to delegate to other systems. > > * Federation, allowing separate Wave in a Box servers to communicate > with > > each other using the Wave Federation Protocol ( > > http://www.waveprotocol.org/federation). > > * Robots, using the Wave Robots API, ( > > http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/robots/) may interact with > waves > > on a WIAB instance. > > > > = Background = > > > > Wave expresses a new metaphor for communication: hosted conversations. > This > > was created by Lars and Jens Rasmussen after observation of people's use > of > > many separate forms of communication to get something done, e.g, email, > > chat, docs, blogs, twitter, etc. > > > > The vision has always been to better the way people communicate and > > collaborate. Building open protocols and sharing code available in an > open > > and free way is a critical part of that vision. Anyone should be able to > > bring up their own wave server and communicate with others (much like > SMTP). > > > > We hope this project will allow everyone to easily gain the benefits of > Wave > > with a standard implementation of Wave – in a box. > > > > = Rationale = > > > > Wave has shown it excels at small group collaboration when hosted by > Google. > > Although Wave will not continue as a standalone Google product, there is > a > > lot of interest from many organizatio
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
Hi Andrus, Thanks for your support. I think this'll be a good home for Wave to grow and mature. I've taken the liberty of adding you on the mentor list. :) Cheers, -Dan On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 1:20 AM, Andrus Adamchik wrote: > +1 > > I am so happy that after all considerations and suggestions that were > floated in the Wave community, you guys picked Apache as the place to > develop Wave community and WIAB. Good luck and let me know if you need extra > mentors (you already have 4, so I figured you are covered and didn't add > myself to the list). > > Cheers, > Andrus > > On Nov 23, 2010, at 10:16 PM, Dan Peterson wrote: > > > Hello all, > > > > We'd like to propose Wave for entry into the ASF incubator. > > > > The draft proposal is available at: > > http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/WaveProposal > > (for your convenience, a snapshot is also copied below) > > > > A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich > communication. > > It can be used like email, chat, or a document. Wave in a Box (WIAB) is > the > > name of the main product at the moment, which is a server that hosts and > > federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and provides a rich web client. > > This project also includes an implementation of the Wave Federation > > protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems (such as multiple > > interoperable Wave In a Box instances). > > > > As a result of the recent Wave Summit, beyond growing a few new > committers, > > we've put together the following proposal for migrating the community > into > > the ASF incubator. More details on the summit & Wave in a Box progress in > > this blogpost: > > > http://googlewavedev.blogspot.com/2010/11/this-weeks-wave-protocol-summit-updates.html > > > > We are looking forward to your feedback and suggestions. > > > > By the way, if you're looking to learn more about the technology related > to > > wave, you can see the videos and presentations from the recent Wave > Summit > > in: https://wave.google.com/wave/waveref/googlewave.com/w+rwFyiw47A > > > > Kind regards, > > -Dan, on behalf of the Wave Community > > > > P.S. For those on the wave-protocol Google Group (that aren't yet on > > general@incubator.apache.org), please participate in this discussion > > by sending a message to general-subscribe at incubator dot apache dot org > > > > > > Apache Wave Proposal (Apache Incubator) > > > > = Abstract = > > > > Apache Wave is the project where wave technology is developed at Apache. > > Wave in a Box (WIAB) is the name of the main product at the moment, which > is > > a server that hosts and federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and > > provides a rich web client. This project also includes an implementation > of > > the Wave Federation protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems > > (such as multiple interoperable Wave In a Box instances). > > > > = Proposal = > > > > A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich > communication. > > It can be used like email, chat, or a document. > > > > WIAB is a server that hosts waves. The best analogy for this is a mail > > server with a web client. WIAB is comprised of a few high-level > components: > > the client and the server. They have the following major functionality > > (though this is not an exhaustive list): > > > > * Client > > *A dynamic web client for users to create, edit, and search waves. Users > > can access this client by directly visiting the server in a browser. > > * Gadgets provide the ability to insert, view, and modify the UI -- > > exposing the Wave Gadgets API ( > > http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/gadgets/guide.html) > > * A console client that can create and edit waves via a > command-line-like > > interface. > > * Server > > * Hosts and stores waves. WIAB comes with a default storage mechanism. > The > > administrators of the server may configure it to use alternative storage > > mechanisms. > > * Indexing, allowing for searching the waves a user has access to. > > * Basic authentication, configurable to delegate to other systems. > > * Federation, allowing separate Wave in a Box servers to communicate > with > > each other using the Wave Federation Protocol ( > > http://www.waveprotocol.org/federation). > > * Robots, using the Wave Robots API, ( > > http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/robots/) may interact with > waves > > on a WIAB instance. > > > > = Background = > > > > Wave expresses a new metaphor for communication: hosted conversations. > This > > was created by Lars and Jens Rasmussen after observation of people's use > of > > many separate forms of communication to get something done, e.g, email, > > chat, docs, blogs, twitter, etc. > > > > The vision has always been to better the way people communicate and > > collaborate. Building open protocols and sharing code available in an > open > > and free way is a critical part of that vision. Anyone should be able to > > bring up their own wave server and communicate
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 12:16 PM, Dan Peterson wrote: > Hello all, > > We'd like to propose Wave for entry into the ASF incubator. > > The draft proposal is available at: > http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/WaveProposal > (for your convenience, a snapshot is also copied below) +1 (a bit biased as I was a fan of wave) -- J. Aaron Farr 馮傑仁 www.cubiclemuses.com - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
The lightwave project I was referring to is over at google code: http://code.google.com/p/lightwave/ ~Michael On Nov 24, 2010, at 12:44 AM, Marcel Offermans wrote: > On 24 Nov 2010, at 4:29 , Michael MacFadden wrote: > >> I agree, there are other wave implementations popping up, some of which >> include "wave" in the name and some don't. "Lightwave" for example is one >> such project. I think that Apache Wave and the Wave in a Box product should >> be fine. > > Lightwave? http://www.newtek.com/lightwave/ > > Greetings, Marcel > > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org >
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
+1 (non-binding) -- With best regards / с наилучшими пожеланиями, Alexei Fedotov / Алексей Федотов, http://dataved.ru/ +7 916 562 8095 On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 5:25 PM, Paul Lindner wrote: > A hearty +1 from the designated champion to getting Wave into the > Incubator. I've been especially impressed with the way the community > has rallied behind the open source implementation and know that it > will do well at Apache. > > > On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 12:16 PM, Dan Peterson wrote: >> Hello all, >> >> We'd like to propose Wave for entry into the ASF incubator. >> >> The draft proposal is available at: >> http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/WaveProposal >> (for your convenience, a snapshot is also copied below) >> >> A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich communication. >> It can be used like email, chat, or a document. Wave in a Box (WIAB) is the >> name of the main product at the moment, which is a server that hosts and >> federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and provides a rich web client. >> This project also includes an implementation of the Wave Federation >> protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems (such as multiple >> interoperable Wave In a Box instances). >> >> As a result of the recent Wave Summit, beyond growing a few new committers, >> we've put together the following proposal for migrating the community into >> the ASF incubator. More details on the summit & Wave in a Box progress in >> this blogpost: >> http://googlewavedev.blogspot.com/2010/11/this-weeks-wave-protocol-summit-updates.html >> >> We are looking forward to your feedback and suggestions. >> >> By the way, if you're looking to learn more about the technology related to >> wave, you can see the videos and presentations from the recent Wave Summit >> in: https://wave.google.com/wave/waveref/googlewave.com/w+rwFyiw47A >> >> Kind regards, >> -Dan, on behalf of the Wave Community >> >> P.S. For those on the wave-protocol Google Group (that aren't yet on >> general@incubator.apache.org), please participate in this discussion >> by sending a message to general-subscribe at incubator dot apache dot org >> >> >> Apache Wave Proposal (Apache Incubator) >> >> = Abstract = >> >> Apache Wave is the project where wave technology is developed at Apache. >> Wave in a Box (WIAB) is the name of the main product at the moment, which is >> a server that hosts and federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and >> provides a rich web client. This project also includes an implementation of >> the Wave Federation protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems >> (such as multiple interoperable Wave In a Box instances). >> >> = Proposal = >> >> A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich communication. >> It can be used like email, chat, or a document. >> >> WIAB is a server that hosts waves. The best analogy for this is a mail >> server with a web client. WIAB is comprised of a few high-level components: >> the client and the server. They have the following major functionality >> (though this is not an exhaustive list): >> >> * Client >> *A dynamic web client for users to create, edit, and search waves. Users >> can access this client by directly visiting the server in a browser. >> * Gadgets provide the ability to insert, view, and modify the UI -- >> exposing the Wave Gadgets API ( >> http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/gadgets/guide.html) >> * A console client that can create and edit waves via a command-line-like >> interface. >> * Server >> * Hosts and stores waves. WIAB comes with a default storage mechanism. The >> administrators of the server may configure it to use alternative storage >> mechanisms. >> * Indexing, allowing for searching the waves a user has access to. >> * Basic authentication, configurable to delegate to other systems. >> * Federation, allowing separate Wave in a Box servers to communicate with >> each other using the Wave Federation Protocol ( >> http://www.waveprotocol.org/federation). >> * Robots, using the Wave Robots API, ( >> http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/robots/) may interact with waves >> on a WIAB instance. >> >> = Background = >> >> Wave expresses a new metaphor for communication: hosted conversations. This >> was created by Lars and Jens Rasmussen after observation of people's use of >> many separate forms of communication to get something done, e.g, email, >> chat, docs, blogs, twitter, etc. >> >> The vision has always been to better the way people communicate and >> collaborate. Building open protocols and sharing code available in an open >> and free way is a critical part of that vision. Anyone should be able to >> bring up their own wave server and communicate with others (much like SMTP). >> >> We hope this project will allow everyone to easily gain the benefits of Wave >> with a standard implementation of Wave – in a box. >> >> = Rationale = >> >> Wave has shown it excels at small group collaboration when hosted by Googl
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
A hearty +1 from the designated champion to getting Wave into the Incubator. I've been especially impressed with the way the community has rallied behind the open source implementation and know that it will do well at Apache. On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 12:16 PM, Dan Peterson wrote: > Hello all, > > We'd like to propose Wave for entry into the ASF incubator. > > The draft proposal is available at: > http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/WaveProposal > (for your convenience, a snapshot is also copied below) > > A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich communication. > It can be used like email, chat, or a document. Wave in a Box (WIAB) is the > name of the main product at the moment, which is a server that hosts and > federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and provides a rich web client. > This project also includes an implementation of the Wave Federation > protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems (such as multiple > interoperable Wave In a Box instances). > > As a result of the recent Wave Summit, beyond growing a few new committers, > we've put together the following proposal for migrating the community into > the ASF incubator. More details on the summit & Wave in a Box progress in > this blogpost: > http://googlewavedev.blogspot.com/2010/11/this-weeks-wave-protocol-summit-updates.html > > We are looking forward to your feedback and suggestions. > > By the way, if you're looking to learn more about the technology related to > wave, you can see the videos and presentations from the recent Wave Summit > in: https://wave.google.com/wave/waveref/googlewave.com/w+rwFyiw47A > > Kind regards, > -Dan, on behalf of the Wave Community > > P.S. For those on the wave-protocol Google Group (that aren't yet on > general@incubator.apache.org), please participate in this discussion > by sending a message to general-subscribe at incubator dot apache dot org > > > Apache Wave Proposal (Apache Incubator) > > = Abstract = > > Apache Wave is the project where wave technology is developed at Apache. > Wave in a Box (WIAB) is the name of the main product at the moment, which is > a server that hosts and federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and > provides a rich web client. This project also includes an implementation of > the Wave Federation protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems > (such as multiple interoperable Wave In a Box instances). > > = Proposal = > > A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich communication. > It can be used like email, chat, or a document. > > WIAB is a server that hosts waves. The best analogy for this is a mail > server with a web client. WIAB is comprised of a few high-level components: > the client and the server. They have the following major functionality > (though this is not an exhaustive list): > > * Client > *A dynamic web client for users to create, edit, and search waves. Users > can access this client by directly visiting the server in a browser. > * Gadgets provide the ability to insert, view, and modify the UI -- > exposing the Wave Gadgets API ( > http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/gadgets/guide.html) > * A console client that can create and edit waves via a command-line-like > interface. > * Server > * Hosts and stores waves. WIAB comes with a default storage mechanism. The > administrators of the server may configure it to use alternative storage > mechanisms. > * Indexing, allowing for searching the waves a user has access to. > * Basic authentication, configurable to delegate to other systems. > * Federation, allowing separate Wave in a Box servers to communicate with > each other using the Wave Federation Protocol ( > http://www.waveprotocol.org/federation). > * Robots, using the Wave Robots API, ( > http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/robots/) may interact with waves > on a WIAB instance. > > = Background = > > Wave expresses a new metaphor for communication: hosted conversations. This > was created by Lars and Jens Rasmussen after observation of people's use of > many separate forms of communication to get something done, e.g, email, > chat, docs, blogs, twitter, etc. > > The vision has always been to better the way people communicate and > collaborate. Building open protocols and sharing code available in an open > and free way is a critical part of that vision. Anyone should be able to > bring up their own wave server and communicate with others (much like SMTP). > > We hope this project will allow everyone to easily gain the benefits of Wave > with a standard implementation of Wave – in a box. > > = Rationale = > > Wave has shown it excels at small group collaboration when hosted by Google. > Although Wave will not continue as a standalone Google product, there is a > lot of interest from many organizations in both running Wave and building > upon the technology for new products. > > We are confident that with the community-centric development environment > fostered by the Apache Soft
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
+1 (non-binding) Cheers Daniel On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 9:16 PM, Dan Peterson wrote: > Hello all, > > We'd like to propose Wave for entry into the ASF incubator. > > The draft proposal is available at: > http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/WaveProposal > (for your convenience, a snapshot is also copied below) > > A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich communication. > It can be used like email, chat, or a document. Wave in a Box (WIAB) is the > name of the main product at the moment, which is a server that hosts and > federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and provides a rich web client. > This project also includes an implementation of the Wave Federation > protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems (such as multiple > interoperable Wave In a Box instances). > > As a result of the recent Wave Summit, beyond growing a few new committers, > we've put together the following proposal for migrating the community into > the ASF incubator. More details on the summit & Wave in a Box progress in > this blogpost: > http://googlewavedev.blogspot.com/2010/11/this-weeks-wave-protocol-summit-updates.html > > We are looking forward to your feedback and suggestions. > > By the way, if you're looking to learn more about the technology related to > wave, you can see the videos and presentations from the recent Wave Summit > in: https://wave.google.com/wave/waveref/googlewave.com/w+rwFyiw47A > > Kind regards, > -Dan, on behalf of the Wave Community > > P.S. For those on the wave-protocol Google Group (that aren't yet on > general@incubator.apache.org), please participate in this discussion > by sending a message to general-subscribe at incubator dot apache dot org > > > Apache Wave Proposal (Apache Incubator) > > = Abstract = > > Apache Wave is the project where wave technology is developed at Apache. > Wave in a Box (WIAB) is the name of the main product at the moment, which is > a server that hosts and federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and > provides a rich web client. This project also includes an implementation of > the Wave Federation protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems > (such as multiple interoperable Wave In a Box instances). > > = Proposal = > > A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich communication. > It can be used like email, chat, or a document. > > WIAB is a server that hosts waves. The best analogy for this is a mail > server with a web client. WIAB is comprised of a few high-level components: > the client and the server. They have the following major functionality > (though this is not an exhaustive list): > > * Client > *A dynamic web client for users to create, edit, and search waves. Users > can access this client by directly visiting the server in a browser. > * Gadgets provide the ability to insert, view, and modify the UI -- > exposing the Wave Gadgets API ( > http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/gadgets/guide.html) > * A console client that can create and edit waves via a command-line-like > interface. > * Server > * Hosts and stores waves. WIAB comes with a default storage mechanism. The > administrators of the server may configure it to use alternative storage > mechanisms. > * Indexing, allowing for searching the waves a user has access to. > * Basic authentication, configurable to delegate to other systems. > * Federation, allowing separate Wave in a Box servers to communicate with > each other using the Wave Federation Protocol ( > http://www.waveprotocol.org/federation). > * Robots, using the Wave Robots API, ( > http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/robots/) may interact with waves > on a WIAB instance. > > = Background = > > Wave expresses a new metaphor for communication: hosted conversations. This > was created by Lars and Jens Rasmussen after observation of people's use of > many separate forms of communication to get something done, e.g, email, > chat, docs, blogs, twitter, etc. > > The vision has always been to better the way people communicate and > collaborate. Building open protocols and sharing code available in an open > and free way is a critical part of that vision. Anyone should be able to > bring up their own wave server and communicate with others (much like SMTP). > > We hope this project will allow everyone to easily gain the benefits of Wave > with a standard implementation of Wave – in a box. > > = Rationale = > > Wave has shown it excels at small group collaboration when hosted by Google. > Although Wave will not continue as a standalone Google product, there is a > lot of interest from many organizations in both running Wave and building > upon the technology for new products. > > We are confident that with the community-centric development environment > fostered by the Apache Software Foundation, WIAB will thrive. > > = Initial Goals = > > The initial goals of the project are: > > 1. To migrate the codebase from code.google.com and integrate the project > with the ASF inf
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
+1 Would be happy to help of you need any (and if I can find time) Ian On 23 Nov 2010, at 20:16, Dan Peterson wrote: > Hello all, > > We'd like to propose Wave for entry into the ASF incubator. > > The draft proposal is available at: > http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/WaveProposal > (for your convenience, a snapshot is also copied below) > > A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich communication. > It can be used like email, chat, or a document. Wave in a Box (WIAB) is the > name of the main product at the moment, which is a server that hosts and > federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and provides a rich web client. > This project also includes an implementation of the Wave Federation > protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems (such as multiple > interoperable Wave In a Box instances). > > As a result of the recent Wave Summit, beyond growing a few new committers, > we've put together the following proposal for migrating the community into > the ASF incubator. More details on the summit & Wave in a Box progress in > this blogpost: > http://googlewavedev.blogspot.com/2010/11/this-weeks-wave-protocol-summit-updates.html > > We are looking forward to your feedback and suggestions. > > By the way, if you're looking to learn more about the technology related to > wave, you can see the videos and presentations from the recent Wave Summit > in: https://wave.google.com/wave/waveref/googlewave.com/w+rwFyiw47A > > Kind regards, > -Dan, on behalf of the Wave Community > > P.S. For those on the wave-protocol Google Group (that aren't yet on > general@incubator.apache.org), please participate in this discussion > by sending a message to general-subscribe at incubator dot apache dot org > > > Apache Wave Proposal (Apache Incubator) > > = Abstract = > > Apache Wave is the project where wave technology is developed at Apache. > Wave in a Box (WIAB) is the name of the main product at the moment, which is > a server that hosts and federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and > provides a rich web client. This project also includes an implementation of > the Wave Federation protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems > (such as multiple interoperable Wave In a Box instances). > > = Proposal = > > A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich communication. > It can be used like email, chat, or a document. > > WIAB is a server that hosts waves. The best analogy for this is a mail > server with a web client. WIAB is comprised of a few high-level components: > the client and the server. They have the following major functionality > (though this is not an exhaustive list): > > * Client > *A dynamic web client for users to create, edit, and search waves. Users > can access this client by directly visiting the server in a browser. > * Gadgets provide the ability to insert, view, and modify the UI -- > exposing the Wave Gadgets API ( > http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/gadgets/guide.html) > * A console client that can create and edit waves via a command-line-like > interface. > * Server > * Hosts and stores waves. WIAB comes with a default storage mechanism. The > administrators of the server may configure it to use alternative storage > mechanisms. > * Indexing, allowing for searching the waves a user has access to. > * Basic authentication, configurable to delegate to other systems. > * Federation, allowing separate Wave in a Box servers to communicate with > each other using the Wave Federation Protocol ( > http://www.waveprotocol.org/federation). > * Robots, using the Wave Robots API, ( > http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/robots/) may interact with waves > on a WIAB instance. > > = Background = > > Wave expresses a new metaphor for communication: hosted conversations. This > was created by Lars and Jens Rasmussen after observation of people's use of > many separate forms of communication to get something done, e.g, email, > chat, docs, blogs, twitter, etc. > > The vision has always been to better the way people communicate and > collaborate. Building open protocols and sharing code available in an open > and free way is a critical part of that vision. Anyone should be able to > bring up their own wave server and communicate with others (much like SMTP). > > We hope this project will allow everyone to easily gain the benefits of Wave > with a standard implementation of Wave – in a box. > > = Rationale = > > Wave has shown it excels at small group collaboration when hosted by Google. > Although Wave will not continue as a standalone Google product, there is a > lot of interest from many organizations in both running Wave and building > upon the technology for new products. > > We are confident that with the community-centric development environment > fostered by the Apache Software Foundation, WIAB will thrive. > > = Initial Goals = > > The initial goals of the project are: > > 1. To migrate the codebase from code.
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
+1 @Dan if you need one more mentor, you could count me in. Vincent 2010/11/23 Dan Peterson : > Hello all, > > We'd like to propose Wave for entry into the ASF incubator. > > The draft proposal is available at: > http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/WaveProposal > (for your convenience, a snapshot is also copied below) > > A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich communication. > It can be used like email, chat, or a document. Wave in a Box (WIAB) is the > name of the main product at the moment, which is a server that hosts and > federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and provides a rich web client. > This project also includes an implementation of the Wave Federation > protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems (such as multiple > interoperable Wave In a Box instances). > > As a result of the recent Wave Summit, beyond growing a few new committers, > we've put together the following proposal for migrating the community into > the ASF incubator. More details on the summit & Wave in a Box progress in > this blogpost: > http://googlewavedev.blogspot.com/2010/11/this-weeks-wave-protocol-summit-updates.html > > We are looking forward to your feedback and suggestions. > > By the way, if you're looking to learn more about the technology related to > wave, you can see the videos and presentations from the recent Wave Summit > in: https://wave.google.com/wave/waveref/googlewave.com/w+rwFyiw47A > > Kind regards, > -Dan, on behalf of the Wave Community > > P.S. For those on the wave-protocol Google Group (that aren't yet on > general@incubator.apache.org), please participate in this discussion > by sending a message to general-subscribe at incubator dot apache dot org > > > Apache Wave Proposal (Apache Incubator) > > = Abstract = > > Apache Wave is the project where wave technology is developed at Apache. > Wave in a Box (WIAB) is the name of the main product at the moment, which is > a server that hosts and federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and > provides a rich web client. This project also includes an implementation of > the Wave Federation protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems > (such as multiple interoperable Wave In a Box instances). > > = Proposal = > > A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich communication. > It can be used like email, chat, or a document. > > WIAB is a server that hosts waves. The best analogy for this is a mail > server with a web client. WIAB is comprised of a few high-level components: > the client and the server. They have the following major functionality > (though this is not an exhaustive list): > > * Client > *A dynamic web client for users to create, edit, and search waves. Users > can access this client by directly visiting the server in a browser. > * Gadgets provide the ability to insert, view, and modify the UI -- > exposing the Wave Gadgets API ( > http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/gadgets/guide.html) > * A console client that can create and edit waves via a command-line-like > interface. > * Server > * Hosts and stores waves. WIAB comes with a default storage mechanism. The > administrators of the server may configure it to use alternative storage > mechanisms. > * Indexing, allowing for searching the waves a user has access to. > * Basic authentication, configurable to delegate to other systems. > * Federation, allowing separate Wave in a Box servers to communicate with > each other using the Wave Federation Protocol ( > http://www.waveprotocol.org/federation). > * Robots, using the Wave Robots API, ( > http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/robots/) may interact with waves > on a WIAB instance. > > = Background = > > Wave expresses a new metaphor for communication: hosted conversations. This > was created by Lars and Jens Rasmussen after observation of people's use of > many separate forms of communication to get something done, e.g, email, > chat, docs, blogs, twitter, etc. > > The vision has always been to better the way people communicate and > collaborate. Building open protocols and sharing code available in an open > and free way is a critical part of that vision. Anyone should be able to > bring up their own wave server and communicate with others (much like SMTP). > > We hope this project will allow everyone to easily gain the benefits of Wave > with a standard implementation of Wave – in a box. > > = Rationale = > > Wave has shown it excels at small group collaboration when hosted by Google. > Although Wave will not continue as a standalone Google product, there is a > lot of interest from many organizations in both running Wave and building > upon the technology for new products. > > We are confident that with the community-centric development environment > fostered by the Apache Software Foundation, WIAB will thrive. > > = Initial Goals = > > The initial goals of the project are: > > 1. To migrate the codebase from code.google.com and integrate the project > with t
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
+1 Regards, Ate On 23/11/10 21:16, Dan Peterson wrote: Hello all, We'd like to propose Wave for entry into the ASF incubator. The draft proposal is available at: http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/WaveProposal (for your convenience, a snapshot is also copied below) A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich communication. It can be used like email, chat, or a document. Wave in a Box (WIAB) is the name of the main product at the moment, which is a server that hosts and federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and provides a rich web client. This project also includes an implementation of the Wave Federation protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems (such as multiple interoperable Wave In a Box instances). As a result of the recent Wave Summit, beyond growing a few new committers, we've put together the following proposal for migrating the community into the ASF incubator. More details on the summit& Wave in a Box progress in this blogpost: http://googlewavedev.blogspot.com/2010/11/this-weeks-wave-protocol-summit-updates.html We are looking forward to your feedback and suggestions. By the way, if you're looking to learn more about the technology related to wave, you can see the videos and presentations from the recent Wave Summit in: https://wave.google.com/wave/waveref/googlewave.com/w+rwFyiw47A Kind regards, -Dan, on behalf of the Wave Community P.S. For those on the wave-protocol Google Group (that aren't yet on general@incubator.apache.org), please participate in this discussion by sending a message to general-subscribe at incubator dot apache dot org Apache Wave Proposal (Apache Incubator) = Abstract = Apache Wave is the project where wave technology is developed at Apache. Wave in a Box (WIAB) is the name of the main product at the moment, which is a server that hosts and federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and provides a rich web client. This project also includes an implementation of the Wave Federation protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems (such as multiple interoperable Wave In a Box instances). = Proposal = A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich communication. It can be used like email, chat, or a document. WIAB is a server that hosts waves. The best analogy for this is a mail server with a web client. WIAB is comprised of a few high-level components: the client and the server. They have the following major functionality (though this is not an exhaustive list): * Client *A dynamic web client for users to create, edit, and search waves. Users can access this client by directly visiting the server in a browser. * Gadgets provide the ability to insert, view, and modify the UI -- exposing the Wave Gadgets API ( http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/gadgets/guide.html) * A console client that can create and edit waves via a command-line-like interface. * Server * Hosts and stores waves. WIAB comes with a default storage mechanism. The administrators of the server may configure it to use alternative storage mechanisms. * Indexing, allowing for searching the waves a user has access to. * Basic authentication, configurable to delegate to other systems. * Federation, allowing separate Wave in a Box servers to communicate with each other using the Wave Federation Protocol ( http://www.waveprotocol.org/federation). * Robots, using the Wave Robots API, ( http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/robots/) may interact with waves on a WIAB instance. = Background = Wave expresses a new metaphor for communication: hosted conversations. This was created by Lars and Jens Rasmussen after observation of people's use of many separate forms of communication to get something done, e.g, email, chat, docs, blogs, twitter, etc. The vision has always been to better the way people communicate and collaborate. Building open protocols and sharing code available in an open and free way is a critical part of that vision. Anyone should be able to bring up their own wave server and communicate with others (much like SMTP). We hope this project will allow everyone to easily gain the benefits of Wave with a standard implementation of Wave – in a box. = Rationale = Wave has shown it excels at small group collaboration when hosted by Google. Although Wave will not continue as a standalone Google product, there is a lot of interest from many organizations in both running Wave and building upon the technology for new products. We are confident that with the community-centric development environment fostered by the Apache Software Foundation, WIAB will thrive. = Initial Goals = The initial goals of the project are: 1. To migrate the codebase from code.google.com and integrate the project with the ASF infrastructure (issue management, build, project site, etc). 1. To quickly reach a state where it is possible to continue the development of the Wave In a Box implementation under the ASF project. 1.
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
+1 (non-binding) On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 11:20 AM, Andrus Adamchik wrote: > +1 > > I am so happy that after all considerations and suggestions that were floated > in the Wave community, you guys picked Apache as the place to develop Wave > community and WIAB. Good luck and let me know if you need extra mentors (you > already have 4, so I figured you are covered and didn't add myself to the > list). > > Cheers, > Andrus > > On Nov 23, 2010, at 10:16 PM, Dan Peterson wrote: > >> Hello all, >> >> We'd like to propose Wave for entry into the ASF incubator. >> >> The draft proposal is available at: >> http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/WaveProposal >> (for your convenience, a snapshot is also copied below) >> >> A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich communication. >> It can be used like email, chat, or a document. Wave in a Box (WIAB) is the >> name of the main product at the moment, which is a server that hosts and >> federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and provides a rich web client. >> This project also includes an implementation of the Wave Federation >> protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems (such as multiple >> interoperable Wave In a Box instances). >> >> As a result of the recent Wave Summit, beyond growing a few new committers, >> we've put together the following proposal for migrating the community into >> the ASF incubator. More details on the summit & Wave in a Box progress in >> this blogpost: >> http://googlewavedev.blogspot.com/2010/11/this-weeks-wave-protocol-summit-updates.html >> >> We are looking forward to your feedback and suggestions. >> >> By the way, if you're looking to learn more about the technology related to >> wave, you can see the videos and presentations from the recent Wave Summit >> in: https://wave.google.com/wave/waveref/googlewave.com/w+rwFyiw47A >> >> Kind regards, >> -Dan, on behalf of the Wave Community >> >> P.S. For those on the wave-protocol Google Group (that aren't yet on >> general@incubator.apache.org), please participate in this discussion >> by sending a message to general-subscribe at incubator dot apache dot org >> >> >> Apache Wave Proposal (Apache Incubator) >> >> = Abstract = >> >> Apache Wave is the project where wave technology is developed at Apache. >> Wave in a Box (WIAB) is the name of the main product at the moment, which is >> a server that hosts and federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and >> provides a rich web client. This project also includes an implementation of >> the Wave Federation protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems >> (such as multiple interoperable Wave In a Box instances). >> >> = Proposal = >> >> A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich communication. >> It can be used like email, chat, or a document. >> >> WIAB is a server that hosts waves. The best analogy for this is a mail >> server with a web client. WIAB is comprised of a few high-level components: >> the client and the server. They have the following major functionality >> (though this is not an exhaustive list): >> >> * Client >> *A dynamic web client for users to create, edit, and search waves. Users >> can access this client by directly visiting the server in a browser. >> * Gadgets provide the ability to insert, view, and modify the UI -- >> exposing the Wave Gadgets API ( >> http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/gadgets/guide.html) >> * A console client that can create and edit waves via a command-line-like >> interface. >> * Server >> * Hosts and stores waves. WIAB comes with a default storage mechanism. The >> administrators of the server may configure it to use alternative storage >> mechanisms. >> * Indexing, allowing for searching the waves a user has access to. >> * Basic authentication, configurable to delegate to other systems. >> * Federation, allowing separate Wave in a Box servers to communicate with >> each other using the Wave Federation Protocol ( >> http://www.waveprotocol.org/federation). >> * Robots, using the Wave Robots API, ( >> http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/robots/) may interact with waves >> on a WIAB instance. >> >> = Background = >> >> Wave expresses a new metaphor for communication: hosted conversations. This >> was created by Lars and Jens Rasmussen after observation of people's use of >> many separate forms of communication to get something done, e.g, email, >> chat, docs, blogs, twitter, etc. >> >> The vision has always been to better the way people communicate and >> collaborate. Building open protocols and sharing code available in an open >> and free way is a critical part of that vision. Anyone should be able to >> bring up their own wave server and communicate with others (much like SMTP). >> >> We hope this project will allow everyone to easily gain the benefits of Wave >> with a standard implementation of Wave – in a box. >> >> = Rationale = >> >> Wave has shown it excels at small group collaboration when hosted by Google. >> A
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
+1 I am so happy that after all considerations and suggestions that were floated in the Wave community, you guys picked Apache as the place to develop Wave community and WIAB. Good luck and let me know if you need extra mentors (you already have 4, so I figured you are covered and didn't add myself to the list). Cheers, Andrus On Nov 23, 2010, at 10:16 PM, Dan Peterson wrote: > Hello all, > > We'd like to propose Wave for entry into the ASF incubator. > > The draft proposal is available at: > http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/WaveProposal > (for your convenience, a snapshot is also copied below) > > A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich communication. > It can be used like email, chat, or a document. Wave in a Box (WIAB) is the > name of the main product at the moment, which is a server that hosts and > federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and provides a rich web client. > This project also includes an implementation of the Wave Federation > protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems (such as multiple > interoperable Wave In a Box instances). > > As a result of the recent Wave Summit, beyond growing a few new committers, > we've put together the following proposal for migrating the community into > the ASF incubator. More details on the summit & Wave in a Box progress in > this blogpost: > http://googlewavedev.blogspot.com/2010/11/this-weeks-wave-protocol-summit-updates.html > > We are looking forward to your feedback and suggestions. > > By the way, if you're looking to learn more about the technology related to > wave, you can see the videos and presentations from the recent Wave Summit > in: https://wave.google.com/wave/waveref/googlewave.com/w+rwFyiw47A > > Kind regards, > -Dan, on behalf of the Wave Community > > P.S. For those on the wave-protocol Google Group (that aren't yet on > general@incubator.apache.org), please participate in this discussion > by sending a message to general-subscribe at incubator dot apache dot org > > > Apache Wave Proposal (Apache Incubator) > > = Abstract = > > Apache Wave is the project where wave technology is developed at Apache. > Wave in a Box (WIAB) is the name of the main product at the moment, which is > a server that hosts and federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and > provides a rich web client. This project also includes an implementation of > the Wave Federation protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems > (such as multiple interoperable Wave In a Box instances). > > = Proposal = > > A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich communication. > It can be used like email, chat, or a document. > > WIAB is a server that hosts waves. The best analogy for this is a mail > server with a web client. WIAB is comprised of a few high-level components: > the client and the server. They have the following major functionality > (though this is not an exhaustive list): > > * Client > *A dynamic web client for users to create, edit, and search waves. Users > can access this client by directly visiting the server in a browser. > * Gadgets provide the ability to insert, view, and modify the UI -- > exposing the Wave Gadgets API ( > http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/gadgets/guide.html) > * A console client that can create and edit waves via a command-line-like > interface. > * Server > * Hosts and stores waves. WIAB comes with a default storage mechanism. The > administrators of the server may configure it to use alternative storage > mechanisms. > * Indexing, allowing for searching the waves a user has access to. > * Basic authentication, configurable to delegate to other systems. > * Federation, allowing separate Wave in a Box servers to communicate with > each other using the Wave Federation Protocol ( > http://www.waveprotocol.org/federation). > * Robots, using the Wave Robots API, ( > http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/robots/) may interact with waves > on a WIAB instance. > > = Background = > > Wave expresses a new metaphor for communication: hosted conversations. This > was created by Lars and Jens Rasmussen after observation of people's use of > many separate forms of communication to get something done, e.g, email, > chat, docs, blogs, twitter, etc. > > The vision has always been to better the way people communicate and > collaborate. Building open protocols and sharing code available in an open > and free way is a critical part of that vision. Anyone should be able to > bring up their own wave server and communicate with others (much like SMTP). > > We hope this project will allow everyone to easily gain the benefits of Wave > with a standard implementation of Wave – in a box. > > = Rationale = > > Wave has shown it excels at small group collaboration when hosted by Google. > Although Wave will not continue as a standalone Google product, there is a > lot of interest from many organizations in both running Wave and building > upon the technology f
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
+1 (non binding) loved wave, glad it's not going to die! On Tuesday, November 23, 2010, Dan Peterson wrote: > Hello all, > > We'd like to propose Wave for entry into the ASF incubator. > > The draft proposal is available at: > http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/WaveProposal > (for your convenience, a snapshot is also copied below) > > A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich communication. > It can be used like email, chat, or a document. Wave in a Box (WIAB) is the > name of the main product at the moment, which is a server that hosts and > federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and provides a rich web client. > This project also includes an implementation of the Wave Federation > protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems (such as multiple > interoperable Wave In a Box instances). > > As a result of the recent Wave Summit, beyond growing a few new committers, > we've put together the following proposal for migrating the community into > the ASF incubator. More details on the summit & Wave in a Box progress in > this blogpost: > http://googlewavedev.blogspot.com/2010/11/this-weeks-wave-protocol-summit-updates.html > > We are looking forward to your feedback and suggestions. > > By the way, if you're looking to learn more about the technology related to > wave, you can see the videos and presentations from the recent Wave Summit > in: https://wave.google.com/wave/waveref/googlewave.com/w+rwFyiw47A > > Kind regards, > -Dan, on behalf of the Wave Community > > P.S. For those on the wave-protocol Google Group (that aren't yet on > general@incubator.apache.org), please participate in this discussion > by sending a message to general-subscribe at incubator dot apache dot org > > > Apache Wave Proposal (Apache Incubator) > > = Abstract = > > Apache Wave is the project where wave technology is developed at Apache. > Wave in a Box (WIAB) is the name of the main product at the moment, which is > a server that hosts and federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and > provides a rich web client. This project also includes an implementation of > the Wave Federation protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems > (such as multiple interoperable Wave In a Box instances). > > = Proposal = > > A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich communication. > It can be used like email, chat, or a document. > > WIAB is a server that hosts waves. The best analogy for this is a mail > server with a web client. WIAB is comprised of a few high-level components: > the client and the server. They have the following major functionality > (though this is not an exhaustive list): > > * Client > *A dynamic web client for users to create, edit, and search waves. Users > can access this client by directly visiting the server in a browser. > * Gadgets provide the ability to insert, view, and modify the UI -- > exposing the Wave Gadgets API ( > http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/gadgets/guide.html) > * A console client that can create and edit waves via a command-line-like > interface. > * Server > * Hosts and stores waves. WIAB comes with a default storage mechanism. The > administrators of the server may configure it to use alternative storage > mechanisms. > * Indexing, allowing for searching the waves a user has access to. > * Basic authentication, configurable to delegate to other systems. > * Federation, allowing separate Wave in a Box servers to communicate with > each other using the Wave Federation Protocol ( > http://www.waveprotocol.org/federation). > * Robots, using the Wave Robots API, ( > http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/robots/) may interact with waves > on a WIAB instance. > > = Background = > > Wave expresses a new metaphor for communication: hosted conversations. This > was created by Lars and Jens Rasmussen after observation of people's use of > many separate forms of communication to get something done, e.g, email, > chat, docs, blogs, twitter, etc. > > The vision has always been to better the way people communicate and > collaborate. Building open protocols and sharing code available in an open > and free way is a critical part of that vision. Anyone should be able to > bring up their own wave server and communicate with others (much like SMTP). > > We hope this project will allow everyone to easily gain the benefits of Wave > with a standard implementation of Wave – in a box. > > = Rationale = > > Wave has shown it excels at small group collaboration when hosted by Google. > Although Wave will not continue as a standalone Google product, there is a > lot of interest from many organizations in both running Wave and building > upon the technology for new products. > > We are confident that with the community-centric development environment > fostered by the Apache Software Foundation, WIAB will thrive. > > = Initial Goals = > > The initial goals of the project are: > > 1. To migrate the codebase from code.google.com and integrate
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
> > > Lightwave? http://www.newtek.com/lightwave/ No, he's referring to Torben Weis' lightwave: http://code.google.com/p/lightwave/ -- Chris iotawave.org Singapore
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
On 24 Nov 2010, at 4:29 , Michael MacFadden wrote: > I agree, there are other wave implementations popping up, some of which > include "wave" in the name and some don't. "Lightwave" for example is one > such project. I think that Apache Wave and the Wave in a Box product should > be fine. Lightwave? http://www.newtek.com/lightwave/ Greetings, Marcel - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 5:26 AM, Greg Stein wrote: > On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 22:45, Ralph Goers wrote: >> On Nov 23, 2010, at 6:06 PM, Greg Stein wrote: >>> On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 20:47, Ralph Goers >>> wrote: ... OK - Have they explicitly OK'd Apache Wave? While Apache Wave would certainly be unique to Apache, if Google intends to keep using Google Wave (and Wave as a shorthand) this would get very confusing. >>> >>> Don't you think that by proposing Wave to the Incubator that Google >>> has OK'd this? >> >> I don't work for Google and don't know the people proposing this so no, I >> have no idea whether Google has OK'd this. > > Simple review: the original email was sent by Dan Peterson from his > google.com address. I imagine that if Google had a problem with it, > then he wouldn't be working there tomorrow :-D ... or if this was some > kind of spurious one-guy-goes-batshit-crazy, then how could he line up > so many people? > > And sure, while you couldn't know this, Dan is a great guy. I worked > with him while at Google. This proposal is straight-up. > > My simple point is: please accept proposals at face value rather than > pushing back with paranoid thoughts about malfeasance on the part of > the people wanting to join our efforts here at the ASF. > Ralph's question seemed reasonable to me, the ASF trademarks people are a often mentioning problems with using trademarked names like this. However its something that can be sorted out with those ASF trademarks folks during incubation, its not a barrier for entry to incubation. Anyway, seems like a fine proposal to me, +1 for it coming to Apache. ...ant - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
This sounds really interesting - it would be good to have an Apache Wave project. We already have an implementation of the Wave Gadget API in Wookie (and I contributed a new one recently in Node.js) so there could be some useful crossover there. On 24 Nov 2010, at 07:32, Christian Grobmeier wrote: > Would love to see Google Wave at Apache. I was very excited when > Google once announced it. > > About trademark: there was an Adobe Wave before Google Wave announced > its service. I am not afraid of any trademark issues, when there is an > Apache Wave. > > On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 4:56 AM, Soren Lassen wrote: >> I work for Google and I speak on the behalf of the Google Wave team. I >> can assure you that Google supports the Apache Wave proposal. We >> always wanted to transfer ownership of the open source code to the >> developer community and, with the discontinuation of development of >> Google Wave as a standalone product, we accelerated our efforts to >> spin this out in order to bring certainty to the developer community. >> Apache Wave should stand on its own without concern for Google's >> product strategies or priorities. >> >> Nonetheless, please note that Google is looking at ways to continue >> and extend wave technology in other Google products, specifically ways >> for users to access waves through Google Docs. But Google only retains >> the rights to the trademark "GOOGLE WAVE" and the wave design logo. >> Hopefully, Google will become one of many happy customers of Apache >> Wave. >> >> Soren >> >> On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 2:45 PM, Ralph Goers >> wrote: >>> >>> On Nov 23, 2010, at 6:06 PM, Greg Stein wrote: >>> On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 20:47, Ralph Goers wrote: > ... > OK - Have they explicitly OK'd Apache Wave? While Apache Wave would > certainly be unique to Apache, if Google intends to keep using Google > Wave (and Wave as a shorthand) this would get very confusing. Don't you think that by proposing Wave to the Incubator that Google has OK'd this? >>> >>> I don't work for Google and don't know the people proposing this so no, I >>> have no idea whether Google has OK'd this. This is no different than >>> someone taking an Apache project out of the Attic and starting it somewhere >>> else using the same name without Apache on the front. IIRC we don't allow >>> that. I don't think this is paranoia but just approaching this from the >>> same set of rules that we use for our own projects. >>> >>> Ralph >>> >>> >>> - >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org >>> For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org >>> >>> >> >> - >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org >> For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org >> >> > > > > -- > http://www.grobmeier.de > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org > smime.p7s Description: S/MIME cryptographic signature
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
Would love to see Google Wave at Apache. I was very excited when Google once announced it. About trademark: there was an Adobe Wave before Google Wave announced its service. I am not afraid of any trademark issues, when there is an Apache Wave. On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 4:56 AM, Soren Lassen wrote: > I work for Google and I speak on the behalf of the Google Wave team. I > can assure you that Google supports the Apache Wave proposal. We > always wanted to transfer ownership of the open source code to the > developer community and, with the discontinuation of development of > Google Wave as a standalone product, we accelerated our efforts to > spin this out in order to bring certainty to the developer community. > Apache Wave should stand on its own without concern for Google's > product strategies or priorities. > > Nonetheless, please note that Google is looking at ways to continue > and extend wave technology in other Google products, specifically ways > for users to access waves through Google Docs. But Google only retains > the rights to the trademark "GOOGLE WAVE" and the wave design logo. > Hopefully, Google will become one of many happy customers of Apache > Wave. > > Soren > > On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 2:45 PM, Ralph Goers > wrote: >> >> On Nov 23, 2010, at 6:06 PM, Greg Stein wrote: >> >>> On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 20:47, Ralph Goers >>> wrote: ... OK - Have they explicitly OK'd Apache Wave? While Apache Wave would certainly be unique to Apache, if Google intends to keep using Google Wave (and Wave as a shorthand) this would get very confusing. >>> >>> Don't you think that by proposing Wave to the Incubator that Google >>> has OK'd this? >> >> I don't work for Google and don't know the people proposing this so no, I >> have no idea whether Google has OK'd this. This is no different than >> someone taking an Apache project out of the Attic and starting it somewhere >> else using the same name without Apache on the front. IIRC we don't allow >> that. I don't think this is paranoia but just approaching this from the >> same set of rules that we use for our own projects. >> >> Ralph >> >> >> - >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org >> For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org >> >> > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org > > -- http://www.grobmeier.de - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
Super. Thanks for bringing the trademark issue to our attention and prompting us to add the Trademarks section to the proposal. Soren On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 3:20 PM, Ralph Goers wrote: > Thanks. That answers my only concern. I think this would be a great addition. > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Nov 23, 2010, at 7:56 PM, Soren Lassen wrote: > >> I work for Google and I speak on the behalf of the Google Wave team. I >> can assure you that Google supports the Apache Wave proposal. We >> always wanted to transfer ownership of the open source code to the >> developer community and, with the discontinuation of development of >> Google Wave as a standalone product, we accelerated our efforts to >> spin this out in order to bring certainty to the developer community. >> Apache Wave should stand on its own without concern for Google's >> product strategies or priorities. >> >> Nonetheless, please note that Google is looking at ways to continue >> and extend wave technology in other Google products, specifically ways >> for users to access waves through Google Docs. But Google only retains >> the rights to the trademark "GOOGLE WAVE" and the wave design logo. >> Hopefully, Google will become one of many happy customers of Apache >> Wave. >> >> Soren >> >> On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 2:45 PM, Ralph Goers >> wrote: >>> >>> On Nov 23, 2010, at 6:06 PM, Greg Stein wrote: >>> On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 20:47, Ralph Goers wrote: > ... > OK - Have they explicitly OK'd Apache Wave? While Apache Wave would > certainly be unique to Apache, if Google intends to keep using Google > Wave (and Wave as a shorthand) this would get very confusing. Don't you think that by proposing Wave to the Incubator that Google has OK'd this? >>> >>> I don't work for Google and don't know the people proposing this so no, I >>> have no idea whether Google has OK'd this. This is no different than >>> someone taking an Apache project out of the Attic and starting it somewhere >>> else using the same name without Apache on the front. IIRC we don't allow >>> that. I don't think this is paranoia but just approaching this from the >>> same set of rules that we use for our own projects. >>> >>> Ralph >>> >>> >>> - >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org >>> For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org >>> >>> >> >> - >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org >> For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org >> > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org > > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 22:45, Ralph Goers wrote: > On Nov 23, 2010, at 6:06 PM, Greg Stein wrote: >> On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 20:47, Ralph Goers >> wrote: >>> ... >>> OK - Have they explicitly OK'd Apache Wave? While Apache Wave would >>> certainly be unique to Apache, if Google intends to keep using Google Wave >>> (and Wave as a shorthand) this would get very confusing. >> >> Don't you think that by proposing Wave to the Incubator that Google >> has OK'd this? > > I don't work for Google and don't know the people proposing this so no, I > have no idea whether Google has OK'd this. Simple review: the original email was sent by Dan Peterson from his google.com address. I imagine that if Google had a problem with it, then he wouldn't be working there tomorrow :-D ... or if this was some kind of spurious one-guy-goes-batshit-crazy, then how could he line up so many people? And sure, while you couldn't know this, Dan is a great guy. I worked with him while at Google. This proposal is straight-up. My simple point is: please accept proposals at face value rather than pushing back with paranoid thoughts about malfeasance on the part of the people wanting to join our efforts here at the ASF. Cheers, -g - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
+1 (binding). Cheers, Chris On Nov 23, 2010, at 12:16 PM, Dan Peterson wrote: > Hello all, > > We'd like to propose Wave for entry into the ASF incubator. > > The draft proposal is available at: > http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/WaveProposal > (for your convenience, a snapshot is also copied below) > > A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich communication. > It can be used like email, chat, or a document. Wave in a Box (WIAB) is the > name of the main product at the moment, which is a server that hosts and > federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and provides a rich web client. > This project also includes an implementation of the Wave Federation > protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems (such as multiple > interoperable Wave In a Box instances). > > As a result of the recent Wave Summit, beyond growing a few new committers, > we've put together the following proposal for migrating the community into > the ASF incubator. More details on the summit & Wave in a Box progress in > this blogpost: > http://googlewavedev.blogspot.com/2010/11/this-weeks-wave-protocol-summit-updates.html > > We are looking forward to your feedback and suggestions. > > By the way, if you're looking to learn more about the technology related to > wave, you can see the videos and presentations from the recent Wave Summit > in: https://wave.google.com/wave/waveref/googlewave.com/w+rwFyiw47A > > Kind regards, > -Dan, on behalf of the Wave Community > > P.S. For those on the wave-protocol Google Group (that aren't yet on > general@incubator.apache.org), please participate in this discussion > by sending a message to general-subscribe at incubator dot apache dot org > > > Apache Wave Proposal (Apache Incubator) > > = Abstract = > > Apache Wave is the project where wave technology is developed at Apache. > Wave in a Box (WIAB) is the name of the main product at the moment, which is > a server that hosts and federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and > provides a rich web client. This project also includes an implementation of > the Wave Federation protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems > (such as multiple interoperable Wave In a Box instances). > > = Proposal = > > A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich communication. > It can be used like email, chat, or a document. > > WIAB is a server that hosts waves. The best analogy for this is a mail > server with a web client. WIAB is comprised of a few high-level components: > the client and the server. They have the following major functionality > (though this is not an exhaustive list): > > * Client > *A dynamic web client for users to create, edit, and search waves. Users > can access this client by directly visiting the server in a browser. > * Gadgets provide the ability to insert, view, and modify the UI -- > exposing the Wave Gadgets API ( > http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/gadgets/guide.html) > * A console client that can create and edit waves via a command-line-like > interface. > * Server > * Hosts and stores waves. WIAB comes with a default storage mechanism. The > administrators of the server may configure it to use alternative storage > mechanisms. > * Indexing, allowing for searching the waves a user has access to. > * Basic authentication, configurable to delegate to other systems. > * Federation, allowing separate Wave in a Box servers to communicate with > each other using the Wave Federation Protocol ( > http://www.waveprotocol.org/federation). > * Robots, using the Wave Robots API, ( > http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/robots/) may interact with waves > on a WIAB instance. > > = Background = > > Wave expresses a new metaphor for communication: hosted conversations. This > was created by Lars and Jens Rasmussen after observation of people's use of > many separate forms of communication to get something done, e.g, email, > chat, docs, blogs, twitter, etc. > > The vision has always been to better the way people communicate and > collaborate. Building open protocols and sharing code available in an open > and free way is a critical part of that vision. Anyone should be able to > bring up their own wave server and communicate with others (much like SMTP). > > We hope this project will allow everyone to easily gain the benefits of Wave > with a standard implementation of Wave – in a box. > > = Rationale = > > Wave has shown it excels at small group collaboration when hosted by Google. > Although Wave will not continue as a standalone Google product, there is a > lot of interest from many organizations in both running Wave and building > upon the technology for new products. > > We are confident that with the community-centric development environment > fostered by the Apache Software Foundation, WIAB will thrive. > > = Initial Goals = > > The initial goals of the project are: > > 1. To migrate the codebase from code.google.com and integrate the project > with the ASF infrastructu
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
Ralph, Your due diligence is appropriate and appreciated. Thanks. ~Michael On Nov 23, 2010, at 8:20 PM, Ralph Goers wrote: > Thanks. That answers my only concern. I think this would be a great addition. > > Sent from my iPhone > > On Nov 23, 2010, at 7:56 PM, Soren Lassen wrote: > >> I work for Google and I speak on the behalf of the Google Wave team. I >> can assure you that Google supports the Apache Wave proposal. We >> always wanted to transfer ownership of the open source code to the >> developer community and, with the discontinuation of development of >> Google Wave as a standalone product, we accelerated our efforts to >> spin this out in order to bring certainty to the developer community. >> Apache Wave should stand on its own without concern for Google's >> product strategies or priorities. >> >> Nonetheless, please note that Google is looking at ways to continue >> and extend wave technology in other Google products, specifically ways >> for users to access waves through Google Docs. But Google only retains >> the rights to the trademark "GOOGLE WAVE" and the wave design logo. >> Hopefully, Google will become one of many happy customers of Apache >> Wave. >> >> Soren >> >> On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 2:45 PM, Ralph Goers >> wrote: >>> >>> On Nov 23, 2010, at 6:06 PM, Greg Stein wrote: >>> On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 20:47, Ralph Goers wrote: > ... > OK - Have they explicitly OK'd Apache Wave? While Apache Wave would > certainly be unique to Apache, if Google intends to keep using Google > Wave (and Wave as a shorthand) this would get very confusing. Don't you think that by proposing Wave to the Incubator that Google has OK'd this? >>> >>> I don't work for Google and don't know the people proposing this so no, I >>> have no idea whether Google has OK'd this. This is no different than >>> someone taking an Apache project out of the Attic and starting it somewhere >>> else using the same name without Apache on the front. IIRC we don't allow >>> that. I don't think this is paranoia but just approaching this from the >>> same set of rules that we use for our own projects. >>> >>> Ralph >>> >>> >>> - >>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org >>> For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org >>> >>> >> >> - >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org >> For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org >> > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
Thanks. That answers my only concern. I think this would be a great addition. Sent from my iPhone On Nov 23, 2010, at 7:56 PM, Soren Lassen wrote: > I work for Google and I speak on the behalf of the Google Wave team. I > can assure you that Google supports the Apache Wave proposal. We > always wanted to transfer ownership of the open source code to the > developer community and, with the discontinuation of development of > Google Wave as a standalone product, we accelerated our efforts to > spin this out in order to bring certainty to the developer community. > Apache Wave should stand on its own without concern for Google's > product strategies or priorities. > > Nonetheless, please note that Google is looking at ways to continue > and extend wave technology in other Google products, specifically ways > for users to access waves through Google Docs. But Google only retains > the rights to the trademark "GOOGLE WAVE" and the wave design logo. > Hopefully, Google will become one of many happy customers of Apache > Wave. > > Soren > > On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 2:45 PM, Ralph Goers > wrote: >> >> On Nov 23, 2010, at 6:06 PM, Greg Stein wrote: >> >>> On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 20:47, Ralph Goers >>> wrote: ... OK - Have they explicitly OK'd Apache Wave? While Apache Wave would certainly be unique to Apache, if Google intends to keep using Google Wave (and Wave as a shorthand) this would get very confusing. >>> >>> Don't you think that by proposing Wave to the Incubator that Google >>> has OK'd this? >> >> I don't work for Google and don't know the people proposing this so no, I >> have no idea whether Google has OK'd this. This is no different than >> someone taking an Apache project out of the Attic and starting it somewhere >> else using the same name without Apache on the front. IIRC we don't allow >> that. I don't think this is paranoia but just approaching this from the >> same set of rules that we use for our own projects. >> >> Ralph >> >> >> - >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org >> For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org >> >> > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
I work for Google and I speak on the behalf of the Google Wave team. I can assure you that Google supports the Apache Wave proposal. We always wanted to transfer ownership of the open source code to the developer community and, with the discontinuation of development of Google Wave as a standalone product, we accelerated our efforts to spin this out in order to bring certainty to the developer community. Apache Wave should stand on its own without concern for Google's product strategies or priorities. Nonetheless, please note that Google is looking at ways to continue and extend wave technology in other Google products, specifically ways for users to access waves through Google Docs. But Google only retains the rights to the trademark "GOOGLE WAVE" and the wave design logo. Hopefully, Google will become one of many happy customers of Apache Wave. Soren On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 2:45 PM, Ralph Goers wrote: > > On Nov 23, 2010, at 6:06 PM, Greg Stein wrote: > >> On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 20:47, Ralph Goers >> wrote: >>> ... >>> OK - Have they explicitly OK'd Apache Wave? While Apache Wave would >>> certainly be unique to Apache, if Google intends to keep using Google Wave >>> (and Wave as a shorthand) this would get very confusing. >> >> Don't you think that by proposing Wave to the Incubator that Google >> has OK'd this? > > I don't work for Google and don't know the people proposing this so no, I > have no idea whether Google has OK'd this. This is no different than someone > taking an Apache project out of the Attic and starting it somewhere else > using the same name without Apache on the front. IIRC we don't allow that. I > don't think this is paranoia but just approaching this from the same set of > rules that we use for our own projects. > > Ralph > > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org > > - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
On Nov 23, 2010, at 6:06 PM, Greg Stein wrote: > On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 20:47, Ralph Goers wrote: >> ... >> OK - Have they explicitly OK'd Apache Wave? While Apache Wave would >> certainly be unique to Apache, if Google intends to keep using Google Wave >> (and Wave as a shorthand) this would get very confusing. > > Don't you think that by proposing Wave to the Incubator that Google > has OK'd this? I don't work for Google and don't know the people proposing this so no, I have no idea whether Google has OK'd this. This is no different than someone taking an Apache project out of the Attic and starting it somewhere else using the same name without Apache on the front. IIRC we don't allow that. I don't think this is paranoia but just approaching this from the same set of rules that we use for our own projects. Ralph - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
I agree, there are other wave implementations popping up, some of which include "wave" in the name and some don't. "Lightwave" for example is one such project. I think that Apache Wave and the Wave in a Box product should be fine. Also, as Dan points out "Google Wave" product is going to cease to exist in the near future. The wave.google.com service / application will be shut down sometime after the end of the year. At this point Google's intent (if I understand it correctly) is that the open source community take up wave technology where they left off. This should cut down on any confusion an complications during the transition. Regards, Michael On Nov 23, 2010, at 6:11 PM, James Purser wrote: > While Google owns the Google Wave trademark, they don't own the very generic > "Wave". > > Apache Wave will be a separate thing and unaffected by any trademark that > Google owns. > > James Purser > > On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 1:06 PM, Greg Stein wrote: > >> On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 20:47, Ralph Goers >> wrote: >>> ... >>> OK - Have they explicitly OK'd Apache Wave? While Apache Wave would >> certainly be unique to Apache, if Google intends to keep using Google Wave >> (and Wave as a shorthand) this would get very confusing. >> >> Don't you think that by proposing Wave to the Incubator that Google >> has OK'd this? >> >> Come on... back on off the paranoia :-P >> >> Cheers, >> -g >> >> p.s not to mention that "Apache Wave" would be our trademark and >> nobody can do or say anything about that. >> >> - >> To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org >> For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org >> >> - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
While Google owns the Google Wave trademark, they don't own the very generic "Wave". Apache Wave will be a separate thing and unaffected by any trademark that Google owns. James Purser On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 1:06 PM, Greg Stein wrote: > On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 20:47, Ralph Goers > wrote: > >... > > OK - Have they explicitly OK'd Apache Wave? While Apache Wave would > certainly be unique to Apache, if Google intends to keep using Google Wave > (and Wave as a shorthand) this would get very confusing. > > Don't you think that by proposing Wave to the Incubator that Google > has OK'd this? > > Come on... back on off the paranoia :-P > > Cheers, > -g > > p.s not to mention that "Apache Wave" would be our trademark and > nobody can do or say anything about that. > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org > >
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 20:47, Ralph Goers wrote: >... > OK - Have they explicitly OK'd Apache Wave? While Apache Wave would > certainly be unique to Apache, if Google intends to keep using Google Wave > (and Wave as a shorthand) this would get very confusing. Don't you think that by proposing Wave to the Incubator that Google has OK'd this? Come on... back on off the paranoia :-P Cheers, -g p.s not to mention that "Apache Wave" would be our trademark and nobody can do or say anything about that. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
On Tue, Nov 23, 2010 at 5:47 PM, Ralph Goers wrote: > > On Nov 23, 2010, at 5:29 PM, David Wang wrote: > > > On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 11:19 AM, Ralph Goers < > ralph.go...@dslextreme.com>wrote: > > > >> > >> On Nov 23, 2010, at 3:57 PM, Leif Hedstrom wrote: > >> > >>> On 11/23/2010 04:44 PM, Ralph Goers wrote: > On Nov 23, 2010, at 12:16 PM, Dan Peterson wrote: > > > Hello all, > > > > We'd like to propose Wave for entry into the ASF incubator. > > > > Did Google have any trademarks on Wave and are they allowing them to > be > >> transferred to the ASF? > >>> > >>> Certainly looks like they do have a trademark on "Google Wave", I don't > >> know if that affects this project though, since as far as I can tell, > it's > >> changing names to "Wave in a Box" ? > >> > >> The proposal says the project is Apache Wave and the main product is > Wave > >> in a Box. In either case, it would be good to get confirmation that > Google > >> is giving up the rights to "Wave". > >> > > > > Thanks for picking that out. I've just added a section on trademarks. > > > > = Trademarks = > > > > Google retains all rights to the trademarks "GOOGLE WAVE" and the wave > > design logo, neither of which will be used in the Apache Wave project. > > OK - Have they explicitly OK'd Apache Wave? While Apache Wave would > certainly be unique to Apache, if Google intends to keep using Google Wave > (and Wave as a shorthand) this would get very confusing. > > I'm not a lawyer, but I'm not so sure it is Google's place to "okay" Apache Wave. I don't see it as an issue if there is both Foo Wave and Bar Wave. The concept of a "wave" (lowercase) is such that it is meant to be able to interoperate across a distributed set of products and installations (much like email). That said, Google has already announced that development has effectively ceased on "Google Wave" as a standalone product. -Dan
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
On Nov 23, 2010, at 5:29 PM, David Wang wrote: > On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 11:19 AM, Ralph Goers > wrote: > >> >> On Nov 23, 2010, at 3:57 PM, Leif Hedstrom wrote: >> >>> On 11/23/2010 04:44 PM, Ralph Goers wrote: On Nov 23, 2010, at 12:16 PM, Dan Peterson wrote: > Hello all, > > We'd like to propose Wave for entry into the ASF incubator. > Did Google have any trademarks on Wave and are they allowing them to be >> transferred to the ASF? >>> >>> Certainly looks like they do have a trademark on "Google Wave", I don't >> know if that affects this project though, since as far as I can tell, it's >> changing names to "Wave in a Box" ? >> >> The proposal says the project is Apache Wave and the main product is Wave >> in a Box. In either case, it would be good to get confirmation that Google >> is giving up the rights to "Wave". >> > > Thanks for picking that out. I've just added a section on trademarks. > > = Trademarks = > > Google retains all rights to the trademarks "GOOGLE WAVE" and the wave > design logo, neither of which will be used in the Apache Wave project. OK - Have they explicitly OK'd Apache Wave? While Apache Wave would certainly be unique to Apache, if Google intends to keep using Google Wave (and Wave as a shorthand) this would get very confusing. Ralph
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
On Wed, Nov 24, 2010 at 11:19 AM, Ralph Goers wrote: > > On Nov 23, 2010, at 3:57 PM, Leif Hedstrom wrote: > > > On 11/23/2010 04:44 PM, Ralph Goers wrote: > >> On Nov 23, 2010, at 12:16 PM, Dan Peterson wrote: > >> > >>> Hello all, > >>> > >>> We'd like to propose Wave for entry into the ASF incubator. > >>> > >> > >> Did Google have any trademarks on Wave and are they allowing them to be > transferred to the ASF? > > > > Certainly looks like they do have a trademark on "Google Wave", I don't > know if that affects this project though, since as far as I can tell, it's > changing names to "Wave in a Box" ? > > The proposal says the project is Apache Wave and the main product is Wave > in a Box. In either case, it would be good to get confirmation that Google > is giving up the rights to "Wave". > Thanks for picking that out. I've just added a section on trademarks. = Trademarks = Google retains all rights to the trademarks "GOOGLE WAVE" and the wave design logo, neither of which will be used in the Apache Wave project. > > Ralph > > > - > To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org > > -- David Wang
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
On Nov 23, 2010, at 3:57 PM, Leif Hedstrom wrote: > On 11/23/2010 04:44 PM, Ralph Goers wrote: >> On Nov 23, 2010, at 12:16 PM, Dan Peterson wrote: >> >>> Hello all, >>> >>> We'd like to propose Wave for entry into the ASF incubator. >>> >> >> Did Google have any trademarks on Wave and are they allowing them to be >> transferred to the ASF? > > Certainly looks like they do have a trademark on "Google Wave", I don't know > if that affects this project though, since as far as I can tell, it's > changing names to "Wave in a Box" ? The proposal says the project is Apache Wave and the main product is Wave in a Box. In either case, it would be good to get confirmation that Google is giving up the rights to "Wave". Ralph - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
On 11/23/2010 04:44 PM, Ralph Goers wrote: On Nov 23, 2010, at 12:16 PM, Dan Peterson wrote: Hello all, We'd like to propose Wave for entry into the ASF incubator. Did Google have any trademarks on Wave and are they allowing them to be transferred to the ASF? Certainly looks like they do have a trademark on "Google Wave", I don't know if that affects this project though, since as far as I can tell, it's changing names to "Wave in a Box" ? http://tess2.uspto.gov/bin/showfield?f=doc&state=4008:1557ma.2.1 Also, it seems they have already granted a perpetual license for any patents on the Wave protocol: http://www.waveprotocol.org/patent-license I'm no lawyer, so no idea what all this means practically, but I think it would be a good idea to clarify this in the proposal. Cheers, -- Leif - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
Re: [PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
On Nov 23, 2010, at 12:16 PM, Dan Peterson wrote: > Hello all, > > We'd like to propose Wave for entry into the ASF incubator. > Did Google have any trademarks on Wave and are they allowing them to be transferred to the ASF? Ralph - To unsubscribe, e-mail: general-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org For additional commands, e-mail: general-h...@incubator.apache.org
[PROPOSAL] Accept Wave for incubation
Hello all, We'd like to propose Wave for entry into the ASF incubator. The draft proposal is available at: http://wiki.apache.org/incubator/WaveProposal (for your convenience, a snapshot is also copied below) A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich communication. It can be used like email, chat, or a document. Wave in a Box (WIAB) is the name of the main product at the moment, which is a server that hosts and federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and provides a rich web client. This project also includes an implementation of the Wave Federation protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems (such as multiple interoperable Wave In a Box instances). As a result of the recent Wave Summit, beyond growing a few new committers, we've put together the following proposal for migrating the community into the ASF incubator. More details on the summit & Wave in a Box progress in this blogpost: http://googlewavedev.blogspot.com/2010/11/this-weeks-wave-protocol-summit-updates.html We are looking forward to your feedback and suggestions. By the way, if you're looking to learn more about the technology related to wave, you can see the videos and presentations from the recent Wave Summit in: https://wave.google.com/wave/waveref/googlewave.com/w+rwFyiw47A Kind regards, -Dan, on behalf of the Wave Community P.S. For those on the wave-protocol Google Group (that aren't yet on general@incubator.apache.org), please participate in this discussion by sending a message to general-subscribe at incubator dot apache dot org Apache Wave Proposal (Apache Incubator) = Abstract = Apache Wave is the project where wave technology is developed at Apache. Wave in a Box (WIAB) is the name of the main product at the moment, which is a server that hosts and federates waves, supports extensive APIs, and provides a rich web client. This project also includes an implementation of the Wave Federation protocol, to enable federated collaboration systems (such as multiple interoperable Wave In a Box instances). = Proposal = A wave is a hosted, live, concurrent data structure for rich communication. It can be used like email, chat, or a document. WIAB is a server that hosts waves. The best analogy for this is a mail server with a web client. WIAB is comprised of a few high-level components: the client and the server. They have the following major functionality (though this is not an exhaustive list): * Client *A dynamic web client for users to create, edit, and search waves. Users can access this client by directly visiting the server in a browser. * Gadgets provide the ability to insert, view, and modify the UI -- exposing the Wave Gadgets API ( http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/gadgets/guide.html) * A console client that can create and edit waves via a command-line-like interface. * Server * Hosts and stores waves. WIAB comes with a default storage mechanism. The administrators of the server may configure it to use alternative storage mechanisms. * Indexing, allowing for searching the waves a user has access to. * Basic authentication, configurable to delegate to other systems. * Federation, allowing separate Wave in a Box servers to communicate with each other using the Wave Federation Protocol ( http://www.waveprotocol.org/federation). * Robots, using the Wave Robots API, ( http://code.google.com/apis/wave/extensions/robots/) may interact with waves on a WIAB instance. = Background = Wave expresses a new metaphor for communication: hosted conversations. This was created by Lars and Jens Rasmussen after observation of people's use of many separate forms of communication to get something done, e.g, email, chat, docs, blogs, twitter, etc. The vision has always been to better the way people communicate and collaborate. Building open protocols and sharing code available in an open and free way is a critical part of that vision. Anyone should be able to bring up their own wave server and communicate with others (much like SMTP). We hope this project will allow everyone to easily gain the benefits of Wave with a standard implementation of Wave – in a box. = Rationale = Wave has shown it excels at small group collaboration when hosted by Google. Although Wave will not continue as a standalone Google product, there is a lot of interest from many organizations in both running Wave and building upon the technology for new products. We are confident that with the community-centric development environment fostered by the Apache Software Foundation, WIAB will thrive. = Initial Goals = The initial goals of the project are: 1. To migrate the codebase from code.google.com and integrate the project with the ASF infrastructure (issue management, build, project site, etc). 1. To quickly reach a state where it is possible to continue the development of the Wave In a Box implementation under the ASF project. 1. To add new committers to the project and grow the community in "The Ap
