Re: [RFC] Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
Jason, If you want to get things ready that's okay by me, but if someone weighs in tomorrow, we'll have to wait. Ted - Original Message - From: Jason van Zyl [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, July 11, 2001 11:13 AM Subject: Re: [RFC] Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta On 7/11/01 12:29 PM, Ted Leung [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The XML PMC has voted to accept Helma XML-RPC as an xml.apache.org project. Unless somone from xml.apache.org voices a serious objection by the end of Thursday, we'll start the wheels turning to create the project. Cool and the Gang :-) I will have everything ready for import by Friday, so I'll coordinate with Sam as it looks like everything is a go. I would like to use Anakia to generate the docs, is this acceptable? I already have the docs converted to Anakia so I'd like to use what I have. Ted - Original Message - From: Ted Leung [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, July 06, 2001 10:12 AM Subject: [RFC] Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta Does anyone else from xml.apache.org have any feedback on this proposal one way or the other? Ted - Original Message - From: Sam Ruby [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, July 05, 2001 6:09 PM Subject: Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta Jason van Zyl wrote: Fair enough, I will no longer argue the point. My main concern is that the project be granted full autonomy as a project initially as Hannes and the rest of the committers become accustomed to xml.apache.org than we can discuss the possible integration with Axis. Does this sound reasonable? +1 I'll even volunteer to set up the mailing lists, cvs trees, authorization, etc. And, of course, integrate it into Gump. ;-) - Sam Ruby - In case of troubles, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - In case of troubles, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- jvz. Jason van Zyl http://tambora.zenplex.org http://jakarta.apache.org/turbine http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity http://jakarta.apache.org/alexandria http://jakarta.apache.org/commons - In case of troubles, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RFC] Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
The XML PMC has voted to accept Helma XML-RPC as an xml.apache.org project. Unless somone from xml.apache.org voices a serious objection by the end of Thursday, we'll start the wheels turning to create the project. Ted - Original Message - From: Ted Leung [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, July 06, 2001 10:12 AM Subject: [RFC] Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta Does anyone else from xml.apache.org have any feedback on this proposal one way or the other? Ted - Original Message - From: Sam Ruby [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, July 05, 2001 6:09 PM Subject: Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta Jason van Zyl wrote: Fair enough, I will no longer argue the point. My main concern is that the project be granted full autonomy as a project initially as Hannes and the rest of the committers become accustomed to xml.apache.org than we can discuss the possible integration with Axis. Does this sound reasonable? +1 I'll even volunteer to set up the mailing lists, cvs trees, authorization, etc. And, of course, integrate it into Gump. ;-) - Sam Ruby - In case of troubles, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - In case of troubles, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: [RFC] Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
On 7/11/01 12:29 PM, Ted Leung [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The XML PMC has voted to accept Helma XML-RPC as an xml.apache.org project. Unless somone from xml.apache.org voices a serious objection by the end of Thursday, we'll start the wheels turning to create the project. Cool and the Gang :-) I will have everything ready for import by Friday, so I'll coordinate with Sam as it looks like everything is a go. I would like to use Anakia to generate the docs, is this acceptable? I already have the docs converted to Anakia so I'd like to use what I have. Ted - Original Message - From: Ted Leung [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, July 06, 2001 10:12 AM Subject: [RFC] Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta Does anyone else from xml.apache.org have any feedback on this proposal one way or the other? Ted - Original Message - From: Sam Ruby [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, July 05, 2001 6:09 PM Subject: Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta Jason van Zyl wrote: Fair enough, I will no longer argue the point. My main concern is that the project be granted full autonomy as a project initially as Hannes and the rest of the committers become accustomed to xml.apache.org than we can discuss the possible integration with Axis. Does this sound reasonable? +1 I'll even volunteer to set up the mailing lists, cvs trees, authorization, etc. And, of course, integrate it into Gump. ;-) - Sam Ruby - In case of troubles, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - In case of troubles, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- jvz. Jason van Zyl http://tambora.zenplex.org http://jakarta.apache.org/turbine http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity http://jakarta.apache.org/alexandria http://jakarta.apache.org/commons - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
On 7/5/01 9:09 PM, Sam Ruby [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Jason van Zyl wrote: Fair enough, I will no longer argue the point. My main concern is that the project be granted full autonomy as a project initially as Hannes and the rest of the committers become accustomed to xml.apache.org than we can discuss the possible integration with Axis. Does this sound reasonable? +1 I'll even volunteer to set up the mailing lists, cvs trees, authorization, etc. And, of course, integrate it into Gump. ;-) Cool, so can we coordinate next week sometime. Maybe toward the end of the week we can populate the repository? - Sam Ruby - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- jvz. Jason van Zyl http://tambora.zenplex.org http://jakarta.apache.org/turbine http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity http://jakarta.apache.org/alexandria http://jakarta.apache.org/commons - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
One caveat. Let the XML PMC have it's vote on this. I'm sending the vote request in 2 minutes. Ted - Original Message - From: Jason van Zyl [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, July 06, 2001 6:54 AM Subject: Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta On 7/5/01 9:09 PM, Sam Ruby [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Jason van Zyl wrote: Fair enough, I will no longer argue the point. My main concern is that the project be granted full autonomy as a project initially as Hannes and the rest of the committers become accustomed to xml.apache.org than we can discuss the possible integration with Axis. Does this sound reasonable? +1 I'll even volunteer to set up the mailing lists, cvs trees, authorization, etc. And, of course, integrate it into Gump. ;-) Cool, so can we coordinate next week sometime. Maybe toward the end of the week we can populate the repository? - Sam Ruby - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- jvz. Jason van Zyl http://tambora.zenplex.org http://jakarta.apache.org/turbine http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity http://jakarta.apache.org/alexandria http://jakarta.apache.org/commons - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
On 7/6/01 1:08 PM, Ted Leung [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: One caveat. Let the XML PMC have it's vote on this. I'm sending the vote request in 2 minutes. I'm a positive thinker :-) Ted - Original Message - From: Jason van Zyl [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, July 06, 2001 6:54 AM Subject: Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta On 7/5/01 9:09 PM, Sam Ruby [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Jason van Zyl wrote: Fair enough, I will no longer argue the point. My main concern is that the project be granted full autonomy as a project initially as Hannes and the rest of the committers become accustomed to xml.apache.org than we can discuss the possible integration with Axis. Does this sound reasonable? +1 I'll even volunteer to set up the mailing lists, cvs trees, authorization, etc. And, of course, integrate it into Gump. ;-) Cool, so can we coordinate next week sometime. Maybe toward the end of the week we can populate the repository? - Sam Ruby - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- jvz. Jason van Zyl http://tambora.zenplex.org http://jakarta.apache.org/turbine http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity http://jakarta.apache.org/alexandria http://jakarta.apache.org/commons - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- jvz. Jason van Zyl http://tambora.zenplex.org http://jakarta.apache.org/turbine http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity http://jakarta.apache.org/alexandria http://jakarta.apache.org/commons - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
Hannes Wallnoefer at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: To put it right upfront, I don't think XML-RPC is a natural fit for xml.apache.org, and I'd prefer to see it at Jakarta. Let me explain. Even though I see your point, I'd still prefer seeing it over in XML alongside with the other technologies doing the same exact thing... Jakarta has alrady a wide enough spectrum of problems covered (from build systems, to ioc frameworks). From what I can see, XML-RPC is based on XML (or a subset of it), is used to transmit objects and call methods over HTTP (same as SOAP), s, since it's an alternative to SOAP, it should go alongside with it. -1 for XML-RPC on Jakarta... Pier - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
On 7/5/01 7:55 AM, Pier P. Fumagalli [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hannes Wallnoefer at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: To put it right upfront, I don't think XML-RPC is a natural fit for xml.apache.org, and I'd prefer to see it at Jakarta. Let me explain. Even though I see your point, I'd still prefer seeing it over in XML alongside with the other technologies doing the same exact thing... Jakarta has alrady a wide enough spectrum of problems covered (from build systems, to ioc frameworks). From what I can see, XML-RPC is based on XML (or a subset of it), is used to transmit objects and call methods over HTTP (same as SOAP), s, since it's an alternative to SOAP, it should go alongside with it. -1 for XML-RPC on Jakarta... So you would be amenable to the XML-RPC package being an independent project under the xml.apache.org banner? Pier - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- jvz. Jason van Zyl http://tambora.zenplex.org http://jakarta.apache.org/turbine http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity http://jakarta.apache.org/alexandria http://jakarta.apache.org/commons - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
On 7/5/01 7:55 AM, Pier P. Fumagalli [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hannes Wallnoefer at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: To put it right upfront, I don't think XML-RPC is a natural fit for xml.apache.org, and I'd prefer to see it at Jakarta. Let me explain. Even though I see your point, I'd still prefer seeing it over in XML alongside with the other technologies doing the same exact thing... Jakarta has alrady a wide enough spectrum of problems covered (from build systems, to ioc frameworks). From what I can see, XML-RPC is based on XML (or a subset of it), is used to transmit objects and call methods over HTTP (same as SOAP), s, since it's an alternative to SOAP, it should go alongside with it. -1 for XML-RPC on Jakarta... Would anyone else on the Jakarta PMC care to vote? I think there are 10 Jakarta PMC members can we get a quick vote. So if anyone else has a -1 than that will put an end to the proposal, right? We need 8/10 for the 3/4 minimum so one more -1 and it's a goner. So, this is for the inclusion the XML-RPC package in Jakarta [ ]Peter Donald [-1]Pier Fumagalli [ ]Ted Husted [ ]Ceki Gülcü [ ]Geir Magnusson [ ]Craig McClanahan [-1]Sam Ruby [ ]Dan Savarese [ ]Jon Stevens [+1]Jason van Zyl I would like to try this avenue first as it's what the author wants. -- jvz. Jason van Zyl http://tambora.zenplex.org http://jakarta.apache.org/turbine http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity http://jakarta.apache.org/alexandria http://jakarta.apache.org/commons - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
On 7/5/01 1:08 PM, Ted Leung [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hello all, It is not true that there is no interest in XML-RPC at xml.apache.org. I would be amenable to / in-favor of XML RPC being an independent project under xml.apache.org. I would prefer it if we could find a way to make this fit in with Axis, assuming that the respective committers can get along and make it work. We would prefer that the project be independent at first. None of the initial committers have much experience with xml.apache.org and would like to gradually move toward collaborating. As I've said before this is a self contained project and it is used that way. I have no doubt that the code can be integrated into Axis in some form, but this is not our primary motive for bringing the code to apache. The whole point of having a separate XML project is for XML related code-bases to go there. With a name like XML-RPC, it is hard to argue that XML-RPC is not an XML related project. Please don't try to circumvent the structure that the ASF has put in place. As someone pointed out, If we were talking about a C or C++ implementation of XML-RPC, then I don't think we would be arguing about where this particular code base belongs. Fair enough, I will no longer argue the point. My main concern is that the project be granted full autonomy as a project initially as Hannes and the rest of the committers become accustomed to xml.apache.org than we can discuss the possible integration with Axis. Does this sound reasonable? Ted Leung Chair XML PMC - Original Message - From: Jason van Zyl [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, July 05, 2001 7:18 AM Subject: Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta On 7/5/01 7:55 AM, Pier P. Fumagalli [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hannes Wallnoefer at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: To put it right upfront, I don't think XML-RPC is a natural fit for xml.apache.org, and I'd prefer to see it at Jakarta. Let me explain. Even though I see your point, I'd still prefer seeing it over in XML alongside with the other technologies doing the same exact thing... Jakarta has alrady a wide enough spectrum of problems covered (from build systems, to ioc frameworks). From what I can see, XML-RPC is based on XML (or a subset of it), is used to transmit objects and call methods over HTTP (same as SOAP), s, since it's an alternative to SOAP, it should go alongside with it. -1 for XML-RPC on Jakarta... So you would be amenable to the XML-RPC package being an independent project under the xml.apache.org banner? Pier - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- jvz. Jason van Zyl http://tambora.zenplex.org http://jakarta.apache.org/turbine http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity http://jakarta.apache.org/alexandria http://jakarta.apache.org/commons - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- jvz. Jason van Zyl http://tambora.zenplex.org http://jakarta.apache.org/turbine http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity http://jakarta.apache.org/alexandria http://jakarta.apache.org/commons - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
I believed that xml.apache.org was the appropriate place to try first, and if it can find a happy home there, I still think thats appropriate. However, this is a living community, not just a code base - Hannes and co-conspirators are coming with it. Therefore, I think top level in xml would be nice, but that's only a suggestion - I am not a part of xml.apache community. If they can't be acommodated in a way that is satisfactory to all, +1 for here in Jakarta. geir -- Geir Magnusson Jr. [EMAIL PROTECTED] System and Software Consulting Developing for the web? See http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity/ You have a genius for suggesting things I've come a cropper with! - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
on 7/5/01 5:52 PM, Pier P. Fumagalli [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ok, one day I'll change it (also because it generates 70% of the traffic on daedalus!) And because CollabNet has to pay for that... -jon - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
[ ]Jon Stevens -0 It seems like xml.apache.org should be the place, but I really don't care where it lives that much cause we can always move projects around if we need to. I do think that if it goes to xml.apache.org it should be a top level project. I feel about the same. xml.apache.org seems the logical place for it, but I understand some of the motivation to place it in jakarta. [ 0] Daniel Savarese - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
Jon Stevens at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: on 7/5/01 5:52 PM, Pier P. Fumagalli [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ok, one day I'll change it (also because it generates 70% of the traffic on daedalus!) And because CollabNet has to pay for that... Comes straight out of your paycheck? :) :) :) Pier (being the usual asshole!) - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
Jason van Zyl wrote: Fair enough, I will no longer argue the point. My main concern is that the project be granted full autonomy as a project initially as Hannes and the rest of the committers become accustomed to xml.apache.org than we can discuss the possible integration with Axis. Does this sound reasonable? +1 I'll even volunteer to set up the mailing lists, cvs trees, authorization, etc. And, of course, integrate it into Gump. ;-) - Sam Ruby - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
Hello all, It is not true that there is no interest in XML-RPC at xml.apache.org. I would be amenable to / in-favor of XML RPC being an independent project under xml.apache.org. I would prefer it if we could find a way to make this fit in with Axis, assuming that the respective committers can get along and make it work. The whole point of having a separate XML project is for XML related code-bases to go there. With a name like XML-RPC, it is hard to argue that XML-RPC is not an XML related project. Please don't try to circumvent the structure that the ASF has put in place. As someone pointed out, If we were talking about a C or C++ implementation of XML-RPC, then I don't think we would be arguing about where this particular code base belongs. Ted Leung Chair XML PMC - Original Message - From: Jason van Zyl [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, July 05, 2001 7:18 AM Subject: Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta On 7/5/01 7:55 AM, Pier P. Fumagalli [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hannes Wallnoefer at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: To put it right upfront, I don't think XML-RPC is a natural fit for xml.apache.org, and I'd prefer to see it at Jakarta. Let me explain. Even though I see your point, I'd still prefer seeing it over in XML alongside with the other technologies doing the same exact thing... Jakarta has alrady a wide enough spectrum of problems covered (from build systems, to ioc frameworks). From what I can see, XML-RPC is based on XML (or a subset of it), is used to transmit objects and call methods over HTTP (same as SOAP), s, since it's an alternative to SOAP, it should go alongside with it. -1 for XML-RPC on Jakarta... So you would be amenable to the XML-RPC package being an independent project under the xml.apache.org banner? Pier - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- jvz. Jason van Zyl http://tambora.zenplex.org http://jakarta.apache.org/turbine http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity http://jakarta.apache.org/alexandria http://jakarta.apache.org/commons - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
On Wednesday, July 4, 2001, at 05:19 AM, Ian Kallen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My unsolicited opinion: projects focused on the manipulation and purveyance of data as XML could/should belong in the xml.apache.org project while implementations of Java technologies associate with Jakarta. (BTW this is a general response rather than an opinion about Helma XML-RPC) i believe that xml.apache.org has a strong emphasis on standards. that means that projects focused on the manipulation and purveyance of data as XML which are not standards-based will not necessarily find a home there. excluding projects from jakarta simply because they are xml-related would therefore seem to allow otherwise appropriate projects to 'fall through the cracks' between xml.apache.org and jakarta.apache.org. for what it's worth... what ever happened to the idea that was being floated about jakarta-xml common projects (or was it 'xml-jakarta-commons')? - robert - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
Hi there, I'm the author of the Helma XML-RPC library, and I'd like to deliver some background information as well as my personal view regarding the jakarta/xml dispute. To put it right upfront, I don't think XML-RPC is a natural fit for xml.apache.org, and I'd prefer to see it at Jakarta. Let me explain. XML-RPC is a protocol that has been explicitly frozen since 1998 or so, and even at that time it only used a small subset of XML. Sure, it has the XML in its name, but all it does is define a handful of elements to wrap some common data types - strings, numbers, date objects, structs and so on. No other elements may ever occur in XML-RPC, let alone any of the additional XML add-ons that have been spec'ed out since 1998. To see what I'm talking about have a look at the XML-RPC spec at http://www.xmlrpc.com/spec (if you like compare it to the SOAP spec for contrast). XML-RPC is not about XML, it just uses the minimum XML necessary to pass method calls and data between clients/servers. This means that coupling XML-RPC with a full featured XML environment may not have a lot of benefits - in fact, in my experience all it does is increase memory footprint and download size and decrease performance, simply because XML-RPC doesn't use any but the most primitive parsing facilities. So why Jakarta? One area is HTTP support - XML-RPC works over HTTP, and the code contains both an embedded HTTP server as well as a client and a servlet interface. I'd say most of the feature requests or questions I get revolve around HTTP or Servlet issues, and I definitely think that Jakarta is the ideal environment for this. Another hot development area may be to improve mapping between XML-RPC data types and Java objects. Since XML-RPC data types are carved in stone, there's practically no XML work going on here, but it will be very Java-specific. Of course, development can take place anywhere. I just don't see how XML-RPC would fit into the Apache XML project. If anybody actually does have a proposal please let me know. cheers, Hannes Von: robert burrell donkin [EMAIL PROTECTED] Antworten an: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Datum: Wed, 4 Jul 2001 20:13:07 +0100 An: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Betreff: Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta On Wednesday, July 4, 2001, at 05:19 AM, Ian Kallen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My unsolicited opinion: projects focused on the manipulation and purveyance of data as XML could/should belong in the xml.apache.org project while implementations of Java technologies associate with Jakarta. (BTW this is a general response rather than an opinion about Helma XML-RPC) i believe that xml.apache.org has a strong emphasis on standards. that means that projects focused on the manipulation and purveyance of data as XML which are not standards-based will not necessarily find a home there. excluding projects from jakarta simply because they are xml-related would therefore seem to allow otherwise appropriate projects to 'fall through the cracks' between xml.apache.org and jakarta.apache.org. for what it's worth... what ever happened to the idea that was being floated about jakarta-xml common projects (or was it 'xml-jakarta-commons')? - robert - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
Hannes Wallnoefer wrote: [snip] Short and simple: -1. Good luck getting 3/4 approval... Want to change my vote? Demonstrate some signs that you are willing to work with others, or are at least aware of related work. Criticize SOAP or the Apache implementation thereof if you like - I can take it. Start with introducing yourself on the [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list. - Sam Ruby - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
On 7/4/01 10:04 PM, Sam Ruby [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hannes Wallnoefer wrote: [snip] Short and simple: -1. Good luck getting 3/4 approval... Want to change my vote? I don't think there's anything to change. You decided what you what you wanted very shortly after the proposal was made. That much is clear, even if your answers are not. I answered your questions as best I could, but you completely skirted around answering any of my questions. I asked what you would do with the code if it were brought into xml.apache.org and I wanted to know what the interest is in xml-rpc, and why no one has taken the steps to move toward an xml-rpc implementation in axis? Are these not valid questions and concerns? You are the one intimately involved with xml.apache.org, so I assume you could answer these questions quickly. Demonstrate some signs that you are willing to work with others, I have been working with Hannes and the initial committers for the last month to get to this point. I am interested in the xml-rpc package. You are being unequivocally evasive. I don't think you're being very cooperative. I asked what your proposal would be if the code was to be donated to xml.apache.org and you didn't even bother to answer. Is the answer supposed to be obvious? It's not obvious to me. I think it's important that the code comes here, we have our preferences as to the location but the code is used by a lot of people and it would be a healthy project at apache. or are at least aware of related work. I am aware of other xml-rpc packages, as I must emphasize that is what I'm interested in. Criticize SOAP or the Apache implementation thereof if you like - I can take it. I have absolutely nothing against SOAP, or your implementation of it. I haven't looked that much at SOAP because none of the projects I work on require it's use. To me, SOAP and xml-rpc are mutually exclusive because that is the nature of my work. If xml-rpc is to be a subset of axis than the real nature of the arrangement is that you need xml-rpc but we don't need axis. Start with introducing yourself on the [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailing list. I have zero interest in axis at the moment. Why is the onus on me to participate in something in which I have no interest and no requirement to be involved with. The xml-rpc package works fine as a stand-alone piece of work. I am fully willing to work on the xml-rpc package, but I'm certainly not going to stop you from integrating the package into axis. I don't see why you see this as not cooperating, it is simply not the domain I work in. You can correct me if I'm wrong, but I think your proposal would be the folding of the xml-rpc code into axis and forcing users currently using xml-rpc by itself to use xml-rpc through axis instead. This is expressly something we do not desire. This is what I'm deducing from your emphasis on axis and lack of clear answers to very direct questions. What do you feel about the xml-rpc package being an independent project at xml.apache.org? As a starting point for cooperation between the xml-rpc package and axis. How is that for meeting half way? Then the the collaboration would begin as two autonomous parties. I would first like ask for votes from the Jakarta PMC members to see if the package can be included within Jakarta as this is the express desire of the author. I will make another short message with a voting form. If this fails than I will make a proposal to xml.apache.org if the package could be accepted as an independent project (if this is acceptable to Hannes). If the code is allowed to exist autonomously than I don't have a real problem with where it lands. But I definitely don't like the idea of the code being rolled into another package because right off the bat we would probably be in a minority situation and the code could go in a direction that we don't want. I don't believe that is right. But again Sam, correct me if my assertions are in the wrong. - Sam Ruby - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- jvz. Jason van Zyl http://tambora.zenplex.org http://jakarta.apache.org/turbine http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity http://jakarta.apache.org/alexandria http://jakarta.apache.org/commons - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
I strongly believe that any any such nomination should be to xml.apache.org. - Sam Ruby Jason van Zyl [EMAIL PROTECTED] on 07/03/2001 10:19:36 AM Please respond to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] cc: Subject: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta Hello, I would like to propose the movement of the Helma XML-RCP package (http://xmlrpc.helma.org/) to Jakarta. The Helma XML-RPC package is the most popular OSS XML-RPC package and Hannes Wallnoefer would like to donate the code to the Jakarta project. There is an active community based around the package but organizing the effort is something that Hannes would like some help with. The Helma XML-RPC package is used extensively in Turbine, will be used extensively by CollabNet, and is used in the Helma project itself so interest will not drop off any time in the near future. There is full documentation for the XML-RPC package, and we are working on a test bed so the code is in good shape and healthy. I am also willing to be the PMC member that oversees the project. We have an initial committers list as follows: Hannes Wallnoefer [EMAIL PROTECTED] Jason van Zyl [EMAIL PROTECTED] John Thorhauer [EMAIL PROTECTED] Daniel Rall [EMAIL PROTECTED] Leonard Richardson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Josh Lucas [EMAIL PROTECTED] There are also people on the XML-RPC dev list that are not listed here but who are active. So it is likely that this list will double in size very shortly. Thoughts? -- jvz. Jason van Zyl http://tambora.zenplex.org http://jakarta.apache.org/turbine http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity http://jakarta.apache.org/alexandria http://jakarta.apache.org/commons - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
I would like to propose the movement of the Helma XML-RCP package (http://xmlrpc.helma.org/) to Jakarta. The Helma XML-RPC package is the most popular OSS XML-RPC package and Hannes Wallnoefer would like to donate the code to the Jakarta project. There is an active community based around the package but organizing the effort is something that Hannes would like some help with. The Helma XML-RPC package is used extensively in Turbine, will be used extensively by CollabNet, and is used in the Helma project itself so interest will not drop off any time in the near future. There is full documentation for the XML-RPC package, and we are working on a test bed so the code is in good shape and healthy. I am also willing to be the PMC member that oversees the project. I'm not in PMC but that's an interesting work which may be for usefull in jakarta-tomcat (and its connectors)... - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
on 7/3/01 7:19 AM, Jason van Zyl [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I would like to propose the movement of the Helma XML-RCP package (http://xmlrpc.helma.org/) to Jakarta. The Helma XML-RPC package is the most popular OSS XML-RPC package and Hannes Wallnoefer would like to donate the code to the Jakarta project. Since SOAP is already over on xml.apache.org, shouldn't this go there as well? -jon - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
Jason van Zyl wrote: Hello, I would like to propose the movement of the Helma XML-RCP package (http://xmlrpc.helma.org/) to Jakarta. The Helma XML-RPC package is the most popular OSS XML-RPC package and Hannes Wallnoefer would like to donate the code to the Jakarta project. There is an active community based around the package but organizing the effort is something that Hannes would like some help with. The Helma XML-RPC package is used extensively in Turbine, will be used extensively by CollabNet, and is used in the Helma project itself so interest will not drop off any time in the near future. There is full documentation for the XML-RPC package, and we are working on a test bed so the code is in good shape and healthy. I am also willing to be the PMC member that oversees the project. We have an initial committers list as follows: Hannes Wallnoefer [EMAIL PROTECTED] Jason van Zyl [EMAIL PROTECTED] John Thorhauer [EMAIL PROTECTED] Daniel Rall [EMAIL PROTECTED] Leonard Richardson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Josh Lucas [EMAIL PROTECTED] There are also people on the XML-RPC dev list that are not listed here but who are active. So it is likely that this list will double in size very shortly. Thoughts? Does that belong here in Jakarta or in XML land? Either way, +1 from me, btw. geir -- Geir Magnusson Jr. [EMAIL PROTECTED] System and Software Consulting Developing for the web? See http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity/ You have a genius for suggesting things I've come a cropper with! - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
Jason makes a very good point. I believe we could see XML-RPC become a integral component to other jakarta projects. Terry McBride --- Jason van Zyl [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On 7/3/01 11:27 AM, Sam Ruby [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I strongly believe that any any such nomination should be to xml.apache.org. Reasons? It does use XML, sure, but it is primarily a set of servers and clients which I think fits in more with Jakarta. It's an XML technology, but so is the digester in the commons, Jetspeed was going to move to xml.apache.org but landed in jakarta. Ant is a tool that uses XML exclusively (right now anyway) and it's in Jakarta. I'm not fussy where it is nominated, but being an xml.apache.org project means I cannot volunteer to be the PMC member to watch over it. And that is certainly one of the reasons I proposed it here. I also think it makes sense to have XML-RPC land in the project where most of the initial committers are involved and that¹s Jakarta. What's important is trying to find a home for the XML-RPC package. So if we decide that Jakarta isn't the place for it, though I believe it is, than should I post the same proposal to [EMAIL PROTECTED]? - Sam Ruby Jason van Zyl [EMAIL PROTECTED] on 07/03/2001 10:19:36 AM Please respond to [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] cc: Subject: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta Hello, I would like to propose the movement of the Helma XML-RCP package (http://xmlrpc.helma.org/) to Jakarta. The Helma XML-RPC package is the most popular OSS XML-RPC package and Hannes Wallnoefer would like to donate the code to the Jakarta project. There is an active community based around the package but organizing the effort is something that Hannes would like some help with. The Helma XML-RPC package is used extensively in Turbine, will be used extensively by CollabNet, and is used in the Helma project itself so interest will not drop off any time in the near future. There is full documentation for the XML-RPC package, and we are working on a test bed so the code is in good shape and healthy. I am also willing to be the PMC member that oversees the project. We have an initial committers list as follows: Hannes Wallnoefer [EMAIL PROTECTED] Jason van Zyl [EMAIL PROTECTED] John Thorhauer [EMAIL PROTECTED] Daniel Rall [EMAIL PROTECTED] Leonard Richardson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Josh Lucas [EMAIL PROTECTED] There are also people on the XML-RPC dev list that are not listed here but who are active. So it is likely that this list will double in size very shortly. Thoughts? -- jvz. Jason van Zyl http://tambora.zenplex.org http://jakarta.apache.org/turbine http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity http://jakarta.apache.org/alexandria http://jakarta.apache.org/commons - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- jvz. Jason van Zyl http://tambora.zenplex.org http://jakarta.apache.org/turbine http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity http://jakarta.apache.org/alexandria http://jakarta.apache.org/commons - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
Jason van Zyl wrote: I strongly believe that any any such nomination should be to xml.apache.org. Reasons? The xml-axis project is a restructuring of xml-soap. This restructuring was initiated with the expressed intent of providing a foundation for supporting multiple protocols, including, XML-RPC. To date, however, we have been unsuccessful in getting anyone interested enough to work on supporting the XML-RPC protocol. This being said, I don't want to pre-judge the result as to whether or not the current Axis code base is a good fit; it might very well be appropriate that these two projects belong side by side. Don't get me wrong, my clear preference is for the former, but if the latter is meant to be, then so be it. But side by side, not pitting one PMC against another within Apache land. Additionally, the Jakarta project is a bit on the large side, so I am concerned about growth - that in itself is not a showstopper, but is a concern and if there is at least an equally good fit in xml, then that is a better home. Also note that the XML PMC has taken a different path, there is not a mapping of PMC members to subprojects; this being said, if the right home for XML-RPC is in xml.apache, then I will promise to watch over it (I am a PMC member there). I also noted that a number of other Jakarta PMC members expressed similar concerns, presumably without my prompting. - Sam Ruby P.S. A quick peek at the code base - no Ant, yet another XML parser (non-JAXP, non-Apache). Not insurmountable, but it would be nice to be fixed... - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
On 7/3/01 4:36 PM, Sam Ruby [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Jason van Zyl wrote: I strongly believe that any any such nomination should be to xml.apache.org. Reasons? The xml-axis project is a restructuring of xml-soap. This restructuring was initiated with the expressed intent of providing a foundation for supporting multiple protocols, including, XML-RPC. To date, however, we have been unsuccessful in getting anyone interested enough to work on supporting the XML-RPC protocol. I find that a very unconvincing argument. You suggest having the XML-RPC package housed at xml.apache.org because no one is interested in it. No one at xml.apache.org did the leg work to find an XML-RPC implementation whose author was willing to donate it. If there is such a lack of interest in XML-RPC I definitely feel that Jakarta is a better place for it. If there eventual interest than there is no reason why the XML-RPC package can't be integrated into xml-axis. But at present you say there is no interest, so I would say xml.apache.org is not the right place for the XML-RPC package. You yourself would like to see XML-RPC integrated into xml-axis but as yet no one has done anything about it. This being said, I don't want to pre-judge the result as to whether or not the current Axis code base is a good fit; it might very well be appropriate that these two projects belong side by side. Don't get me wrong, my clear preference is for the former, but if the latter is meant to be, then so be it. But side by side, not pitting one PMC against another within Apache land. I think you're jumping the gun here. I think the project should definitely start on its own. If someone is interested in integrating the XML-RPC code into xml-axis than they are free to do so. Whether the code will fit with axis is an irrelevant question at this point in time. Additionally, the Jakarta project is a bit on the large side, so I am concerned about growth - that in itself is not a showstopper, but is a concern and if there is at least an equally good fit in xml, then that is a better home. I fail to see your reasoning. How is managing another package less a burden to one project and not another? It's another project at Apache and will require time and resources. The initial set of committers will go where the code goes. Jakarta has 18 projects, xml.apache.org has 14. So I don't see that as a convincing argument either. If you are saying that Apache as a whole should slow down in absorbing more projects, than I would probably agree with you. Also note that the XML PMC has taken a different path, there is not a mapping of PMC members to subprojects; this being said, if the right home for XML-RPC is in xml.apache, then I will promise to watch over it (I am a PMC member there). I appreciate the sentiment :-) I also noted that a number of other Jakarta PMC members expressed similar concerns, presumably without my prompting. I think that was a knee jerk reaction to seeing XML in the project name. Fair enough. You've had two people so far. My reasons for Jakarta are 1) The impetus for the proposal came from the initial list of committers who are involved in Jakarta. I think our wishes should count for something. And we decided to make the proposal here after some discussion. 2) I don't think xml.apache.org would provide a good fit because a) no one started an xml-rpc implementation for xml-axis and b) no one tried to find anyone with an existing implementation. How could xml.apache.org be a better or even equal fit. I would like this not to drag out. The initial list of committers would prefer this to be a Jakarta project. I would like to vote and go from there. - Sam Ruby P.S. A quick peek at the code base - no Ant, yet another XML parser (non-JAXP, non-Apache). Not insurmountable, but it would be nice to be fixed... I have the latest code with an Ant build that Josh Lucas cleaned up, and it uses xerces as the default parser. - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- jvz. Jason van Zyl http://tambora.zenplex.org http://jakarta.apache.org/turbine http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity http://jakarta.apache.org/alexandria http://jakarta.apache.org/commons - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
Sam Ruby at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I strongly believe that any any such nomination should be to xml.apache.org. I agree 100% with Sam... Pier - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
Jason van Zyl wrote: I think that was a knee jerk reaction to seeing XML in the project name. Fair enough. You've had two people so far. Not fair. I can't speak for others, but I am an active committer on xml-soap and xml-apache (two different projects only in the sense that Tomcat 3 and 4 are, so it is in all how you count). And Jon specifically did call out the potential relationship with soap. My two cents: the first path should always be to work within existing projects. If/when that fails, then pursue alternatives. I've not seen anybody on your list on the xml-axis mailing list. Give it a whirl. Together, we can do more then separately... - Sam Ruby - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
On 7/3/01 8:10 PM, Pier P. Fumagalli [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Sam Ruby at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I strongly believe that any any such nomination should be to xml.apache.org. I agree 100% with Sam... Again, that's an unqualified response. I responsed to Sam when he clarified his position. I will gladly respond to yours when you do the same. Pier - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- jvz. Jason van Zyl http://tambora.zenplex.org http://jakarta.apache.org/turbine http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity http://jakarta.apache.org/alexandria http://jakarta.apache.org/commons - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
Jason van Zyl wrote: You have totally side stepped the fact that no at xml.apache.org is interested in XML-RPC. What exactly is the interest level in XML-RPC? I honestly don't know a whole lot about SOAP, but I have been using XML-RPC for a long while now and it's simple and works great. Hmmm. I guess it is fair to say that Turbine is not interested in integrating with Cocoon. If you ignore the recent warm welcome that Berin has seen, and focus just on the fact that this work has never bubbled to the top of any existing turbine committers todo list, then I guess it must be true. XML-RPC has not bubble to the top of my todo list at the moment.But I will warmly welcome anybody who wishes to work on it. If you are suggesting that the code be immediately be absorbed into xml-soap than I definitely don't agree. Is that what you're suggesting? Can you honestly say that you have done your homework? All I ask is that if/when you do, you approach the problem with an open mind and a can do attitude, not simply look for reasons why it can't work. And I will promise to meet you more than half way. - Sam Ruby - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Helma XML-RPC @ Jakarta
On 7/3/01 8:56 PM, Sam Ruby [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Jason van Zyl wrote: You have totally side stepped the fact that no at xml.apache.org is interested in XML-RPC. What exactly is the interest level in XML-RPC? I honestly don't know a whole lot about SOAP, but I have been using XML-RPC for a long while now and it's simple and works great. Hmmm. I guess it is fair to say that Turbine is not interested in integrating with Cocoon. If you ignore the recent warm welcome that Berin has seen, and focus just on the fact that this work has never bubbled to the top of any existing turbine committers todo list, then I guess it must be true. I would definitely say that is a fair summation. No one is interested or someone would be working on it. Berin is now, out of a requirement and that¹s great if Turbine and Cocoon work together eventually that's great. XML-RPC has not bubbled to the top of my todo list at the moment. That's because you have no real need for it I would say. It fits in with the plans for axis but it seems xml-rpc hasn't bubbled anywhere near the top of anyone's todo list. I might eventually use axis, but integrating xml-rpc into axis isn't on the top of my todo list either. But I will warmly welcome anybody who wishes to work on it. But that's never happened though, has it? The presence of an xml-rpc package at apache may cause someone to pick up that torch but I don't see why the package being at xml.apache.org would improve those odds. If you are suggesting that the code be immediately be absorbed into xml-soap than I definitely don't agree. Is that what you're suggesting? Can you honestly say that you have done your homework? Again you are not answering the question. What homework do I have to do Sam? I proposed a package that is self contained, self sustaining, and completely independent of any other project at Apache. It may certainly be related to other projects, I agree with that. But my immediate concern is a home for the package, not trying to integrate it with axis. All I ask is that if/when you do, you approach the problem with an open mind and a can do attitude, not simply look for reasons why it can't work. I still don't know what you mean exactly by 'can't work' work because so far it is entirely unclear what you would actually do with the code. Let's say I'm Hannes and offer you the XML-RPC code, what exactly is the proposal you would make on [EMAIL PROTECTED] A simple paragraph stating what you would like to do with the code would help me a lot in understanding your POV. I have tried to contact Hannes to see what he thinks, I've asked him to join the list and join the discussion. And I will promise to meet you more than half way. I would be glad to meet you half way when I know what direction you're walking in. - Sam Ruby - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- jvz. Jason van Zyl http://tambora.zenplex.org http://jakarta.apache.org/turbine http://jakarta.apache.org/velocity http://jakarta.apache.org/alexandria http://jakarta.apache.org/commons - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
