Re: [gentoo-user] udev + /usr
On Thu, Sep 15, 2011 at 11:25:11PM +0200, Joost Roeleveld wrote On Thursday, September 15, 2011 01:43:17 PM Canek Pel??ez Vald??s wrote: On Thu, Sep 15, 2011 at 10:58 AM, Canek Pel??ez Vald??s can...@gmail.com wrote: (This mail is to keep the guys un -user in the loop about -devel). OK, so Joost posted his proposal to -dev: snipped brief discussion on gentoo-dev The thread on gentoo-dev is not yet finished and I intend to try to get some more information. As I mentioned in my other email. I've asked on the busybox list, and one of the people there says he does have a chrooted Gentoo running with mdev (a busybox tool) replacing udev. There were various other changes he had to make to get it working, but it obviously can be done. He's busy for the next couple of weeks, but has offered (offline) to work on generalizing it to work in more general cases. Apparently, the mdev code is a small part of busybox, so he figures it would be simplest to copy the code out of busybox, and make a standalone mdev. The busybox mdev doesn't have all the features of udev, and busybox's developers will obviously want to keep their code lean-and-mean. That's why a standalone mdev seems to be the way to go. -- Walter Dnes waltd...@waltdnes.org
Re: [gentoo-user] udev + /usr
On Sat, 17 Sep 2011 19:31:31 -0400 Michael Mol mike...@gmail.com wrote: There are two principle things I dislike about D-Bus. 1) It doesn't support live upgrading of the daemon. We discussed the reasons behind this several weeks ago, as I recall. Transparent session control handoff is, of course, complicated, and nobody has seen the work as worthwhile. If your 2nd objection changes, this one will probably get looked at. 2) It comes with (or appears to come with) a Linux-centric (sometimes even a Linux-only) view. I love Linux, and I would love to see Linux grow and improve. I also use (and am comfortable with) Windows and Android (which I would consider Not Really Linux) and other platforms*. Attitudes and actions which push Linux as the One Ring smack of 'Embrace, Extend, Extinguish'. dbus is a freedesktop project so will live or die by it's merits. Other systems may start to use it if it proves itself useful. Lucky for us, it doesn't obsolete anything else, just adds functionality to what is already there. -- Alan McKinnnon alan.mckin...@gmail.com
Re: [gentoo-user] [OT rant] udev + /usr
On 2011-09-18 09:37, Alan McKinnon wrote: Other systems may start to use it if it proves itself useful. Lucky for us, it doesn't obsolete anything else, just adds functionality to what is already there. Although, one thing which I find very annoying is that the things that depend on it starts dbus-launch/daemon no matter if I don't want to run it or not (it's not running acc. to rc-update show but ps -ef shows both dbus-launch and dbus-daemon running). I'm using Xfce4 and have Audacious installed which depends on dbus-glib, which of course depends on dbus itself. No other packages uses it (USE= -dbus). Xfce4 and Audacious hasn't used dbus before a certain version (at least it has not been mandatory) and I've been using them for years (haven't had the time to look for alternatives yet). In general I have a problem with packages that pulls in *something* which in turn depends on *something else* which in turn... overlapping functionality etc. It's quite troublesome to keep, for instance, gconf out of my system (masked by me to detect any upgrades that tries to pull it in)... In my world software (in general) should not become an obstacle; it is just a tool to accomplish whatever you want it to do. Ideally the OS (and whatever interfaces the user) shouldn't consume _any_ resources at all (yes, I'm well aware that it's not possible). Resource usage should at least be kept to a minimum, otherwise I have to buy new faster hardware for each upgrade (be it for security, for functionality etc.) and if I liked that I could just go with Windows. My whole complaint about this udev business is that we're ballooning out of control, IMO, becoming the monster that, I assume, most of us wanted to avoid. PS. My animosity towards dbus is historical; I did use it years ago (together with gnome, gconf etc.) which caused me nothing but trouble. I've avoided that crap ever since. I do agree that the idea _behind_ dbus seems sensible but I'm not so sure about the implementation. Best regards Peter K
Re: [gentoo-user] [OT rant] udev + /usr
On 2011-09-18 12:03, Volker Armin Hemmann wrote: And what is your problem with dbus anyway? I bet you can't even measure a difference between dbus running and dbus not running in speed or responsiveness of your gui. Not my specific case(s) but a quick google gave this: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dbus/+bug/737170 Best regards Peter K
Re: OT: Merchant bankers (Was: [gentoo-user] Any big gotcha's when update from several (5) mnths
On 9/17/11, Mark Knecht markkne...@gmail.com wrote: On 9/11/2011 the SP 500 was within about .1% of where it was on 9/10/2001. The 'Lost Decade'... You lucky and prosperous bastards! Take a look at some major European indexes over the same time span. DAX for example. :D -- Arttu V.
Re: [gentoo-user] [OT rant] udev + /usr
Am Sonntag 18 September 2011, 12:44:04 schrieb pk: On 2011-09-18 12:03, Volker Armin Hemmann wrote: And what is your problem with dbus anyway? I bet you can't even measure a difference between dbus running and dbus not running in speed or responsiveness of your gui. Not my specific case(s) but a quick google gave this: https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/dbus/+bug/737170 Best regards Peter K so a single bug is all you got? OH MY GOD! Firefox uses 100% of a core. or OH MY GOD compiz makes my CPU and GPU running hot and noisy! OH MY GOD udev update killed dvb-s!. So you are going from a single bug to 'it must be evil'. If you do that all the time there isn't much software left. -- #163933
Re: [gentoo-user] [OT rant] udev + /usr
On Sun, Sep 18, 2011 at 6:03 AM, Volker Armin Hemmann volkerar...@googlemail.com wrote: Am Sonntag 18 September 2011, 11:23:43 schrieb pk: On 2011-09-18 09:37, Alan McKinnon wrote: Other systems may start to use it if it proves itself useful. Lucky for us, it doesn't obsolete anything else, just adds functionality to what is already there. Although, one thing which I find very annoying is that the things that depend on it starts dbus-launch/daemon no matter if I don't want to run it or not (it's not running acc. to rc-update show but ps -ef shows both dbus-launch and dbus-daemon running). I'm using Xfce4 and have Audacious installed which depends on dbus-glib, which of course depends on dbus itself. No other packages uses it (USE= -dbus). Xfce4 and Audacious hasn't used dbus before a certain version (at least it has not been mandatory) and I've been using them for years (haven't had the time to look for alternatives yet). In general I have a problem with packages that pulls in *something* which in turn depends on *something else* which in turn... overlapping functionality etc. It's quite troublesome to keep, for instance, gconf out of my system (masked by me to detect any upgrades that tries to pull it in)... In my world software (in general) should not become an obstacle; it is just a tool to accomplish whatever you want it to do. Ideally the OS (and whatever interfaces the user) shouldn't consume _any_ resources at all (yes, I'm well aware that it's not possible). Resource usage should at least be kept to a minimum, otherwise I have to buy new faster hardware for each upgrade (be it for security, for functionality etc.) and if I liked that I could just go with Windows. My whole complaint about this udev business is that we're ballooning out of control, IMO, becoming the monster that, I assume, most of us wanted to avoid. PS. My animosity towards dbus is historical; I did use it years ago (together with gnome, gconf etc.) which caused me nothing but trouble. I've avoided that crap ever since. I do agree that the idea _behind_ dbus seems sensible but I'm not so sure about the implementation. Best regards Peter K years ago? is gnome even using dbus for years? They had their broken corba/orbit/bonobo stuff. They used ORBit/bonobo during 1.0 and 1.2 series. With GNOME 2.0, and when dbus got stable (1.0), they started migrating stuff to it, but they keep bonobo around for compatibility reasons. With GNOME 3, bonobo is completely deprecated, and everything needing IPC should use dbus. Regards. -- Canek Peláez Valdés Posgrado en Ciencia e Ingeniería de la Computación Universidad Nacional Autónoma de México
Re: [gentoo-user] [OT rant] udev + /usr
On 2011-09-18 14:32, Volker Armin Hemmann wrote:
So you are going from a single bug to 'it must be evil'. If you do that all
the time there isn't much software left.
You said: I bet you can't even measure a
difference between dbus running and dbus not running in speed or
responsiveness of your gui.
I only pointed out that that was not always correct (I don't run
Ubuntu). And I have had a _lot_ of problems with dbus (again, this was
years ago, running binary distros - it's only recently that I had dbus
installed again due to Xfce4 requiring it); if I get burnt by some piece
of software (usually it's gnome/freedesktop related - seems a lot of bad
ideas/implementations come from that place) I try to go elsewhere.
So if your experience with dbus is different, then fine, by all means
use it; it is your choice. But I choose to avoid it, if possible.
And yes, it seems no matter how hard I try the gnome paradigm ('evil'
software) seems to be inching ever closer... I think developers, in
general, should take some hints from this guy:
http://www.sics.se/~adam/
... he created this:
http://www.contiki-os.org/p/about-contiki.html
... running this:
http://www.c64web.com/
Best regards
Peter k
Re: [gentoo-user] [OT rant] udev + /usr
On Sun, Sep 18, 2011 at 9:19 AM, pk pete...@coolmail.se wrote:
On 2011-09-18 14:32, Volker Armin Hemmann wrote:
So you are going from a single bug to 'it must be evil'. If you do that all
the time there isn't much software left.
You said: I bet you can't even measure a
difference between dbus running and dbus not running in speed or
responsiveness of your gui.
I only pointed out that that was not always correct (I don't run
Ubuntu). And I have had a _lot_ of problems with dbus (again, this was
years ago, running binary distros - it's only recently that I had dbus
installed again due to Xfce4 requiring it); if I get burnt by some piece
of software (usually it's gnome/freedesktop related - seems a lot of bad
ideas/implementations come from that place) I try to go elsewhere.
So if your experience with dbus is different, then fine, by all means
use it; it is your choice. But I choose to avoid it, if possible.
And yes, it seems no matter how hard I try the gnome paradigm ('evil'
software) seems to be inching ever closer... I think developers, in
general, should take some hints from this guy:
http://www.sics.se/~adam/
... he created this:
http://www.contiki-os.org/p/about-contiki.html
... running this:
http://www.c64web.com/
Hey, that's really cool.
Just don't expect everybody to run our systems without the modern
parts of the stack just because a Commodore 64 cannot run it.
Many of us actually like the modern features of the kernel, glibc,
udev, dbus, systemd, pulseaudio, glib, X.org, GStreamer, Gtk+ and
GNOME (or Qt and KDE). In my case (and I have used Linux for a long
time), the whole stack looks full of awsomeness, and stuff just works
most of the time.
So yeah, we use more CPU cycles, more memory and more hard drive. From
my POV, we get more than that in new and improved functionality.
Best regards
Regards.
--
Canek Peláez Valdés
Posgrado en Ciencia e Ingeniería de la Computación
Universidad Nacional Autónoma de México
Re: [gentoo-user] [OT rant] udev + /usr
Am Sonntag 18 September 2011, 09:15:25 schrieb Canek Peláez Valdés: On Sun, Sep 18, 2011 at 6:03 AM, Volker Armin Hemmann volkerar...@googlemail.com wrote: Am Sonntag 18 September 2011, 11:23:43 schrieb pk: On 2011-09-18 09:37, Alan McKinnon wrote: Other systems may start to use it if it proves itself useful. Lucky for us, it doesn't obsolete anything else, just adds functionality to what is already there. Although, one thing which I find very annoying is that the things that depend on it starts dbus-launch/daemon no matter if I don't want to run it or not (it's not running acc. to rc-update show but ps -ef shows both dbus-launch and dbus-daemon running). I'm using Xfce4 and have Audacious installed which depends on dbus-glib, which of course depends on dbus itself. No other packages uses it (USE= -dbus). Xfce4 and Audacious hasn't used dbus before a certain version (at least it has not been mandatory) and I've been using them for years (haven't had the time to look for alternatives yet). In general I have a problem with packages that pulls in *something* which in turn depends on *something else* which in turn... overlapping functionality etc. It's quite troublesome to keep, for instance, gconf out of my system (masked by me to detect any upgrades that tries to pull it in)... In my world software (in general) should not become an obstacle; it is just a tool to accomplish whatever you want it to do. Ideally the OS (and whatever interfaces the user) shouldn't consume _any_ resources at all (yes, I'm well aware that it's not possible). Resource usage should at least be kept to a minimum, otherwise I have to buy new faster hardware for each upgrade (be it for security, for functionality etc.) and if I liked that I could just go with Windows. My whole complaint about this udev business is that we're ballooning out of control, IMO, becoming the monster that, I assume, most of us wanted to avoid. PS. My animosity towards dbus is historical; I did use it years ago (together with gnome, gconf etc.) which caused me nothing but trouble. I've avoided that crap ever since. I do agree that the idea _behind_ dbus seems sensible but I'm not so sure about the implementation. Best regards Peter K years ago? is gnome even using dbus for years? They had their broken corba/orbit/bonobo stuff. They used ORBit/bonobo during 1.0 and 1.2 series. With GNOME 2.0, and when dbus got stable (1.0), they started migrating stuff to it, but they keep bonobo around for compatibility reasons. With GNOME 3, bonobo is completely deprecated, and everything needing IPC should use dbus. Regards. ah, didn't know that. I read about some dbus problems when KDE was moving over caused by dbus being to gnome-centric. But I never cared to much about it. -- #163933
Re: [gentoo-user] [OT rant] udev + /usr
Am Sonntag 18 September 2011, 15:19:29 schrieb pk:
On 2011-09-18 14:32, Volker Armin Hemmann wrote:
So you are going from a single bug to 'it must be evil'. If you do that
all the time there isn't much software left.
You said: I bet you can't even measure a
difference between dbus running and dbus not running in speed or
responsiveness of your gui.
I only pointed out that that was not always correct (I don't run
Ubuntu). And I have had a _lot_ of problems with dbus (again, this was
years ago, running binary distros - it's only recently that I had dbus
installed again due to Xfce4 requiring it); if I get burnt by some piece
of software (usually it's gnome/freedesktop related - seems a lot of bad
ideas/implementations come from that place) I try to go elsewhere.
So if your experience with dbus is different, then fine, by all means
use it; it is your choice. But I choose to avoid it, if possible.
And yes, it seems no matter how hard I try the gnome paradigm ('evil'
software) seems to be inching ever closer... I think developers, in
general, should take some hints from this guy:
http://www.sics.se/~adam/
... he created this:
http://www.contiki-os.org/p/about-contiki.html
... running this:
http://www.c64web.com/
Best regards
Peter k
well, I haven't run in that dbus-uses-100%-cpu bug. But I also take every and
all ubuntu bug reports with a huge amount of salt because of all the patches
they include.
But:
106 2740 0.0 0.0 20296 1484 ?Ss Sep11 0:20
/usr/bin/dbus-daemon --system
1000 4852 0.0 0.0 18124 420 ?SSep11 0:00
/usr/bin/dbus-launch --sh-syntax --exit-with-session
1000 4853 0.1 0.0 16576 4916 ?Ss Sep11 11:20
/usr/bin/dbus-daemon --fork --print-pid 5 --print-address 7 --session
root 5535 0.0 0.0 18268 560 pts/0SSep11 0:00 dbus-launch
--autolaunch bd5372f2e9f3742ccd79bd31000a --binary-syntax --close-stderr
root 5536 0.0 0.0 11268 624 ?Ss Sep11 0:00
/usr/bin/dbus-daemon --fork --print-pid 5 --print-address 7 --session
1000 21585 0.0 0.0 106240 912 pts/5S+ 15:34 0:00 grep dbus
uptime
15:35:37 up 7 days, 14:37, 11 users, load average: 0.14, 0.06, 0.05
again, if it you say 'it must be bad because there is a bug in it' you can
disregard all software ever written. On a normal, not ubuntu system you won't
notice dbus running.
And since you have one standardized IPC system in place, all the apps don't
need to invent another one resulting in less code executed, less code in ram
and less code on your harddisk.
--
#163933
Re: [gentoo-user] [OT rant] udev + /usr
On Sun, Sep 18, 2011 at 9:37 AM, Volker Armin Hemmann volkerar...@googlemail.com wrote: Am Sonntag 18 September 2011, 15:19:29 schrieb pk: again, if it you say 'it must be bad because there is a bug in it' you can disregard all software ever written. This is why, when designing systems, you want as little complexity as possible; the greater the complexity, the greater the incidence of bugs. Yes, it's unavoidable that there are bugs, but lower bug counts are better. (Not making a specific argument against D-Bus here, just the rhetorical device.) -- :wq
Re: [gentoo-user] udev + /usr
On Saturday, September 17, 2011 02:43:00 PM Canek Peláez Valdés wrote: On Sat, Sep 17, 2011 at 10:50 AM, Canek Peláez Valdés can...@gmail.com wrote: On Sat, Sep 17, 2011 at 2:45 AM, Joost Roeleveld jo...@antarean.org wrote: On Friday, September 16, 2011 10:53:47 AM Canek Peláez Valdés wrote: On Fri, Sep 16, 2011 at 5:08 AM, Joost Roeleveld jo...@antarean.org wrote: On Thursday, September 15, 2011 05:05:00 PM Canek Peláez Valdés wrote: Last time I checked, neither GNOME nor Emacs demanded that Gentoo developers or users had to write a fork/replacement for a core component of the system. GNOME and Emacs just need ebuilds and adapting their configuration to Gentoo-isms. Testing and bug reporting, as usual. The only code needed is some small patches for both and around 200 lines of emacslisp for site-gentoo.el. Funny that you mention this. There might be something similar brewing for users of Gnome where quite a few low-level parts will end up being mandatory for Gnome: ...but I'm increasingly seeing talk on the gnome side of the Gnome OS, to include pulse-audio, systemd, policykit, udev/u* (thus forcing lvm as well, at least lvm installation tho nothing forces one to use it... yet, since lvm is required for udisks), etc. I'm pretty sure the last part is false. I certainly have udisk installet (it's pulled by gnome-disk-utility), but I don't use LVM. So there. I don't use Gnome and haven't looked into all this. Udev also doesn't appear to have a LVM-useflag. But as I do use LVM, I can't actually check. Do you have sys-fs/lvm2 on your system? The ebuild does list it as RDEPEND. Yes, I got it installed. I didn't noticed until now. Then again, it takes 1 minute to install in my puny laptop, and uses 7 Mb of hard drive. But anyhow, I was mistaken: it is forced by udisks. I think udisks depending on LVM is an error, so I decided I would took this Saturday and see if I was able to write a patch that makes it optional. However, as per free software rules, I first visited the Freedesktop.org bugzilla. Gustavo Barbieri (who I mentioned before) got there first: https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=37647 As I said before, Gustavo has contributed a lot to systemd, usually making stuff optional. I'm sure his patch (or a similar version of it) will be accepted. I hope so too. I do use LVM, so having LVM used by udisks is logical. But if LVM isn't used, the tools shouldn't have to be present. I did notice on that bug-link that it was raised nearly 4 months ago with no response from the developers even though a patch exists was provided. As I keep saying: code talks. Yes, but the developers are quiet with regards to that patch. I can understand if it takes some time to analyse a patch, but 4 months with no response is, in my view, similar to the devs saying they don't care. -- Joost
[gentoo-user] Re: kde login file ?
Alex Schuster wonko at wonkology.org writes: When you run kde-4 on gentoo and use the kde-login-manager app are the login sessions recorded into a permanent or temporary file? If you want to know, who is logged in and when someone logged in, check the man page for utmp / wtmp. These files are not human readable indeed, but you can use the 'who' or 'w' command to see who is currently logged in, and the last command to see when someone logged in. The 2nd column shows where the login came from (and the 3rd from where), it displays 'ssh' when someone logged in via ssh. ':0' means someone started a login on the first X display. Probably using KDE4, but it may be any other window manager. So I have no answer to your question about KDE logins. And I don't knwo if the feature you are looking for exists at all. Maybe you can hack /usr/share/config/kdm/Xsession, to add an entry in some log file in case KDE is being started. I was looking for the login record, like what last provides, specific for all login attempts, successful or not. I was hoping to capture (grep - whatever) attempted login sessions that failed, mostly from kde-4, but ssh failed sessions would be ok too. But login failure are the target of what I'm really looking for, for systems that each maintain there own password file on a given network. I guess I'd need some security wrapper app that looks for and logs this sort of information explicitly for analysis... Maybe a separate app, one for ssh_fail and one for kde_mgr_fail. Anyone got any suggestions? James
Re: [gentoo-user] Making a init thingy. Step two I guess.
On Sat, Sep 17, 2011 at 7:13 PM, Dale rdalek1...@gmail.com wrote:
SNIP
Ah. I see now. So, it mounts proc and sys but that is in the init then
it mounts the real root outside the init. Then it umounts the proc and sys
under the init and then switches to the real root and starts init there.
Where does /usr and /var come in here? Isn't the init supposed to mount
that too? Do I add that myself? If so, when to fsck get ran?
Dale
Hi Dale,
Let's take a look at the script I sent you yesterday, copied here
again. This system uses a RAID6 for root. This RAID6 is built using
metadata type 1.2. (The newest at the time) Since the kernel only
assembles metadata type 0.9 automatically I had to use the initramfs
to do the assembly and mount.
c2stable / # cat /usr/src/initramfs/init
#!/bin/busybox sh
rescue_shell() {
echo Something went wrong. Dropping you to a shell.
busybox --install -s
exec /bin/sh
}
# Mount the /proc and /sys filesystems.
mount -t proc none /proc
mount -t sysfs none /sys
# Do your stuff here.
echo This script mounts rootfs and boots it up, nothing more!
mdadm --assemble --name=c2stable:3 /dev/md3
# Mount the root filesystem.
mount -o ro /dev/md3 /mnt/root || rescue_shell
# Clean up.
umount /proc
umount /sys
# Boot the real thing.
exec switch_root /mnt/root /sbin/init
c2stable / #
There are really just 3 interesting parts to this:
1) The rescue_shell function
2) The assembly command
3) The mount command
When you read through the script you see I do the assembly and then
the mount. If the mount command fails then I drop into the rescue
shell which is a simple Linux environment where I can run mdadm by
hand to figure out what went wrong. If the mount succeeds then the
script just continues and Linux boots.
The only difference concerning your /usr question would be change the
mount command to something like:
mount -o ro /dev/sdaX /usr || rescue_shell
Does this make basic sense?
One point about static flag. Normally I don't build mdadm with static enabled:
c2stable ~ # emerge -pv mdadm
These are the packages that would be merged, in order:
Calculating dependencies... done!
[ebuild R] sys-fs/mdadm-3.1.4 USE=-static 282 kB
Total: 1 package (1 reinstall), Size of downloads: 282 kB
c2stable ~ #
but for the version I put in the initramfs I did enable it.
Cheers,
Mark
Re: [gentoo-user] udev + /usr
On Sep 18, 2011 9:50 PM, Joost Roeleveld jo...@antarean.org wrote: On Saturday, September 17, 2011 02:43:00 PM Canek Peláez Valdés wrote: As I keep saying: code talks. Yes, but the developers are quiet with regards to that patch. I can understand if it takes some time to analyse a patch, but 4 months with no response is, in my view, similar to the devs saying they don't care. Code talks. Except when it runs counter to the devs'/upstream's wishes, where it will be silenced. Rgds,
[gentoo-user] Re: /etc/portage/patches/
On 09/12/2011 05:42 PM, Nikos Chantziaras wrote:
Thanks! A bashrc with the following in it seems to work here just fine:
post_src_unpack() {
epatch_user
}
Also, the epatch_user() docs mention that it's safe to call epatch_user
multiple times, so I support no breakages should be expected with
ebuilds and eclasses that call this function on their own.
I came across some ebuilds that result in:
* QA Notice: command not found:
*
* /etc/portage/bashrc: line 3: epatch_user: command not found
How do I solve that one?
Re: [gentoo-user] [OT rant] udev + /usr
On 2011-09-18 14:56, Alan McKinnon wrote: And he's using Audacious - a fork of a gigantic bug nest (mms) . According to his earlier post, it forces dbus to run. Xmms, I believe it's called. And it's been working fine for quite a while (I've actually have never encountered a bug with Audacious), for me. Now, when I upgraded to 2.4.x dbus was forced on me (well, that and Xfce4)... I'm used to Audacious because I like the simple interface (non-gtk+). But if you have another player you would like to recommend I'll gladly try it. Requirements: no gconf/gnome/udev/udisk(etc.) dependency (only sane dependencies like libogg/flac etc., possibly gtk or qt for ui but nothing else), simple UI (like Audacious legacy mode), no singin' and dancing crap (simplicity over features)... Now, that can hardly be dbus's fault if some other app has a hardcoded RUNTIME dep on dbus. The fault lies entirely with Audacious, not with dbus. I fully agree to that last sentiment, which is why I'm whining... I thought that was what we were doing here? ;-) But to be fair, it's actually Xfce4 that starts dbus-daemon/launch (I haven't started Audacious yet and I always turn off my computer when not in use). Best regards Peter K
Re: [gentoo-user] [OT rant] udev + /usr
On Sun, 18 Sep 2011 18:55:01 +0200 pk pete...@coolmail.se wrote: Xmms, I believe it's called. And it's been working fine for quite a while (I've actually have never encountered a bug with Audacious), for me. Now, when I upgraded to 2.4.x dbus was forced on me (well, that and Xfce4)... I'm used to Audacious because I like the simple interface (non-gtk+). But if you have another player you would like to recommend I'll gladly try it. Requirements: no gconf/gnome/udev/udisk(etc.) dependency (only sane dependencies like libogg/flac etc., possibly gtk or qt for ui but nothing else), simple UI (like Audacious legacy mode), no singin' and dancing crap (simplicity over features)... Install mpd, mpc, and ncmpc. Read the man pages, live happily ever after. -- caveat utilitor
Re: [gentoo-user] [OT rant] udev + /usr
On 2011-09-18 15:31, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote: Hey, that's really cool. I agree. Just don't expect everybody to run our systems without the modern parts of the stack just because a Commodore 64 cannot run it. I think you need to take a closer look; it does support a lot of modern parts of the stack (as you call it); it's just focused on the things that matters (for an embedded system). It is the mindset that I'm after; it seems even kernel developers are thinking oh, we have so much memory here so it doesn't matter if we use a few GB here (yes, I'm exaggerating). Intel and AMD can't increase the clocks anymore so they've started to throw more hardware on the ever increasing demand for computing power... there will be a time when the bloat will take it's toll on more users. Many of us actually like the modern features of the kernel, glibc, udev, dbus, systemd, pulseaudio, glib, X.org, GStreamer, Gtk+ and There's a lot of people that like Windows 7 and MacOS X too, I hear. What the ultimate goal (in my view) for systemd, pulseaudio etc. seems to be is to mimic (poorly) the mentioned OS's. Why go through all that trouble when they can just go out and buy what they want? The Linux kernel, glibc and X I like, udev used to be nice (well, my currently installed version works fine), the rest is redundant (more or less) - in my view (particularly pulseaudio systemd); I really don't understand what problems they are solving. GNOME (or Qt and KDE). In my case (and I have used Linux for a long I also have used GNU/Linux for quite a while (1995) and have seen it grow from quite humble (but capable) beginnings to what it is today (even Linus Torvalds thinks the kernel is bloated) and I'll refrain from commenting on gnome (and to a lesser extent KDE). The best install I've ever had was a LFS install around 2000 running on a Abit BP6 with two celeron CPUs and a scsi harddrive (9GB)... :-) time), the whole stack looks full of awsomeness, and stuff just works most of the time. No comment. :-/ Best regards Peter K
Re: [gentoo-user] [OT rant] udev + /usr
On 2011-09-18 19:41, Indi wrote: Install mpd, mpc, and ncmpc. Read the man pages, live happily ever after. Ok, I'll look into it. Thanks! Best regards Peter K
[gentoo-user] Question about Chromium
Dear All! I think Google Chrome/Chromium is an excellent browser and I have been using it for a year or more. But there is one issue which is disturbing me and I would like to know what is your experience. If I open more than 2-3 URL fast way the loading tabs and other already opened pages became frozen or terrible slow. I can't scrolling the already loaded or previously loaded pages till all the tabs are loaded. Or If I can scroll them than the scrolling is terribly slow. My network connection is excellent so we can exclude the network issue. On the other hand this behavior depends on how long time runs the browser. The more is the slower. Moreover, the used memory depends on the uptime of the browser as well. When it's reached the 1G than I always restart the browser. I experienced this on Linux and on Windows 7 as well. I'm using the latest (14.x) on Linux and the dev-channel (13.x) on Windows 7. Because of these problem I have to restart my browser once a day. I would like to know what is your experience and what do you do to avoid this issue? Thanks in advance! -- - - -- Csanyi Andras (Sayusi Ando) -- http://sayusi.hu -- http://facebook.com/andras.csanyi -- Trust in God and keep your gunpowder dry! - Cromwell
Re: [gentoo-user] Question about Chromium
András Csányi wrote: Dear All! I think Google Chrome/Chromium is an excellent browser and I have been using it for a year or more. But there is one issue which is disturbing me and I would like to know what is your experience. If I open more than 2-3 URL fast way the loading tabs and other already opened pages became frozen or terrible slow. I can't scrolling the already loaded or previously loaded pages till all the tabs are loaded. Or If I can scroll them than the scrolling is terribly slow. My network connection is excellent so we can exclude the network issue. On the other hand this behavior depends on how long time runs the browser. The more is the slower. Moreover, the used memory depends on the uptime of the browser as well. When it's reached the 1G than I always restart the browser. I experienced this on Linux and on Windows 7 as well. I'm using the latest (14.x) on Linux and the dev-channel (13.x) on Windows 7. Because of these problem I have to restart my browser once a day. I would like to know what is your experience and what do you do to avoid this issue? Thanks in advance! I run into this in Seamonkey/Firefox once in a while. Usually in my case the page has flash or java on it and it seems to slow things down for some reason. It acts like it can't download java or especially flash and deal with other things at the same time. Given how buggy flash is, I suspect flash. If you notice when you emerge flash, it has a warning at the end of the emerge about security problems. If they can't keep it secure, makes me question what else ain't fixed too. May not be related but may want to see what those pages contain. If they do have java or especially flash, then that could be the problem. Dale :-) :-)
[gentoo-user] how to install from ISO without burning it
I've been looking around for a way to install gentoo just by plopping an ISO into a known partition,. I'm not getting much from google on this search string: install gentoo directly from iso. Or I should say: I've found a couple of how toos but they involve quite a lot of mumbo jumbo like this one: http://nlug.ml1.co.uk/2011/06/boot-livecd-iso-image-from-hdd/305 I can follow that alright but first wanted to make sure there is not a well established mainstream way of doing it.
Re: [gentoo-user] [OT rant] udev + /usr
On Sun, 18 Sep 2011 18:55:01 +0200 pk pete...@coolmail.se wrote: And he's using Audacious - a fork of a gigantic bug nest (mms) . According to his earlier post, it forces dbus to run. Xmms, I believe it's called. And it's been working fine for quite a while (I've actually have never encountered a bug with Audacious), for me. Now, when I upgraded to 2.4.x dbus was forced on me (well, that and Xfce4)... I'm used to Audacious because I like the simple interface (non-gtk+). But if you have another player you would like to recommend I'll gladly try it. No, I'm not doing your homework for you. Try them all, and settle on the one YOU like. Maybe you could start with alsa-player and bash -- Alan McKinnnon alan.mckin...@gmail.com
Re: [gentoo-user] udev + /usr
On Sat, 17 Sep 2011 17:13:36 -0400, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote: ORBit was the GNOME implementation of ORB; I don't remember what KDE used, but I believe it was also ORB based. KDE 2/3 used DCOP, their own IPC as there was no decent standard system at the time. DBus was heavily influenced by DCOP and is used by KDE4. -- Neil Bothwick Q: Why is top-posting evil? A: backwards read don't humans because signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-user] how to install from ISO without burning it
On 18.09.2011 21:01, Harry Putnam wrote: I've been looking around for a way to install gentoo just by plopping an ISO into a known partition,. I'm not getting much from google on this search string: install gentoo directly from iso. Or I should say: I've found a couple of how toos but they involve quite a lot of mumbo jumbo like this one: http://nlug.ml1.co.uk/2011/06/boot-livecd-iso-image-from-hdd/305 I can follow that alright but first wanted to make sure there is not a well established mainstream way of doing it. Maybe this helps: Boot the ISO image from the disk using Grub2 http://www.sysresccd.org/Sysresccd-manual-en_Easy_install_SystemRescueCd_on_harddisk#Boot_the_ISO_image_from_the_disk_using_Grub2 Here is my grub config: set isofile=/systemrescuecd-x86-2.3.1.iso loopback loop (vg_8540w-lv_boot)$isofile linux (loop)/isolinux/rescue64 docache setkmap=sg isoloop=$isofile initrd (loop)/isolinux/initram.igz If you use docache, you are able to unmount your partition after booting... I don't know if this works with the Gentoo livecd...
Re: [gentoo-user] [OT rant] udev + /usr
On Sun, Sep 18, 2011 at 1:43 PM, pk pete...@coolmail.se wrote: I think you need to take a closer look; it does support a lot of modern parts of the stack (as you call it); it's just focused on the things that matters (for an embedded system). It is the mindset that I'm after; it seems even kernel developers are thinking oh, we have so much memory here so it doesn't matter if we use a few GB here (yes, I'm exaggerating). Intel and AMD can't increase the clocks anymore so they've started to throw more hardware on the ever increasing demand for computing power... there will be a time when the bloat will take it's toll on more users. The kernel configuration process is actually very nice and very easy. You an remove any features you don't want or need. (I'm referring to, e.g. menuconfig. I haven't really used genkernel) The first time's the hardest. After you know what parts you need for a given box, it's easy. Many of us actually like the modern features of the kernel, glibc, udev, dbus, systemd, pulseaudio, glib, X.org, GStreamer, Gtk+ and There's a lot of people that like Windows 7 and MacOS X too, I hear. What the ultimate goal (in my view) for systemd, pulseaudio etc. seems to be is to mimic (poorly) the mentioned OS's. FWIW, PulseAudio predates Windows Vista, Windows 7, even MacOS X. I ran it on a 200MHz machine back when it was called Enlightenment Sound Daemon. With as much as I've poked at PulseAudio, I'd have to say I like it better than I like the Vista/Win7 implementation of sound daemons. There's probably not much one can do with PA that one couldn't do with jackd, which is probably better in terms of latency, but I never got around to learning jackd. The Linux kernel, glibc and X I like, udev used to be nice (well, my currently installed version works fine), the rest is redundant (more or less) - in my view (particularly pulseaudio systemd); I really don't understand what problems they are solving. While I was using PA (I'm not, currently), it was nice for being able to monitor and tune the volume levels of individual programs. That can be important when trying to manage two different VOIP apps, video games and Pandora at the same time. -- :wq
Re: [gentoo-user] grub and what happens exactly when booting.
On Sat, 17 Sep 2011 00:49:21 +0100, Peter Humphrey wrote: A word of advice when starting from scratch, give your VG(s) unique names. I've seen what happens when someone takes a drive from one Fedora system and puts it in another, so there are two VGs called vg01. It ain't nice (only one is seen, usually not the one you want). That would be nasty, yes, but here at home I don't expect to be switching disks around between machines. A motherboard fails so you connect the disk to your new computer to retrieve the data and it disappears. It happens too often :( -- Neil Bothwick Daddy, what does formatting drive 'C' mean? signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-user] Question about Chromium
On Sun, Sep 18, 2011 at 2:25 PM, András Csányi sayusi.a...@gmail.com wrote: Dear All! I think Google Chrome/Chromium is an excellent browser and I have been using it for a year or more. But there is one issue which is disturbing me and I would like to know what is your experience. If I open more than 2-3 URL fast way the loading tabs and other already opened pages became frozen or terrible slow. I can't scrolling the already loaded or previously loaded pages till all the tabs are loaded. Or If I can scroll them than the scrolling is terribly slow. My network connection is excellent so we can exclude the network issue. On the other hand this behavior depends on how long time runs the browser. The more is the slower. Moreover, the used memory depends on the uptime of the browser as well. When it's reached the 1G than I always restart the browser. I experienced this on Linux and on Windows 7 as well. I'm using the latest (14.x) on Linux and the dev-channel (13.x) on Windows 7. Because of these problem I have to restart my browser once a day. I would like to know what is your experience and what do you do to avoid this issue? I believe Chrome/Chromium as an outstanding bug upstream involving back/fwd navigation queues which lead to browser-wide slowdowns. I've found that, from time to time, I have to close the entire browser (merely closing all open tabs isn't enough) to get things fixed. -- :wq
[gentoo-user] Updating libpng: another libtool cockup?
I just did a routine update on my ~amd64 machine and saw the portage
warning that libpng14 has been replaced by libpng15, and I should run
revdep-rebuild --library '/usr/lib/libpng14.so' and then delete the
obsolete library.
That's what I did. I confess I wasn't watching, so I may have missed
some important errors during the run.
After that I ran plain revdep-rebuild as I do after every update, and
saw that two gnome packages failed to rebuild properly because lpng14
couldn't be found :/
From painful experience I've learned that good-old libtool files (*.la)
are the usual suspects, and grep found -lpng14 in about ten .la files
even after both revdep-rebuilds. Grrr!
This fixed the problem for me (as similar moves have done in the past):
#find /usr/lib64 -name \*.la -exec sed -i s/png14/png15/ '{}' ';'
I ran revdep-rebuild again and the two broken packages emerged nicely
this time.
I hope no one else will hit this problem, but at least this is a good
workaround if you do.
[gentoo-user] Re: /etc/portage/patches/
On 09/18/2011 09:42 AM, Nikos Chantziaras wrote:
On 09/12/2011 05:42 PM, Nikos Chantziaras wrote:
Thanks! A bashrc with the following in it seems to work here just fine:
post_src_unpack() {
epatch_user
}
Also, the epatch_user() docs mention that it's safe to call epatch_user
multiple times, so I support no breakages should be expected with
ebuilds and eclasses that call this function on their own.
I came across some ebuilds that result in:
* QA Notice: command not found:
*
* /etc/portage/bashrc: line 3: epatch_user: command not found
How do I solve that one?
The epatch_user() is defined in /usr/portage/ebuild/eutils.eclass, so
I would guess that the ebuild would need the line inherit eutils, or
at least inherit some other eclass that inherits it.
[gentoo-user] Re: /etc/portage/patches/
On 09/18/2011 11:27 PM, walt wrote:
On 09/18/2011 09:42 AM, Nikos Chantziaras wrote:
On 09/12/2011 05:42 PM, Nikos Chantziaras wrote:
Thanks! A bashrc with the following in it seems to work here just fine:
post_src_unpack() {
epatch_user
}
Also, the epatch_user() docs mention that it's safe to call epatch_user
multiple times, so I support no breakages should be expected with
ebuilds and eclasses that call this function on their own.
I came across some ebuilds that result in:
* QA Notice: command not found:
*
* /etc/portage/bashrc: line 3: epatch_user: command not found
How do I solve that one?
The epatch_user() is defined in /usr/portage/ebuild/eutils.eclass, so
I would guess that the ebuild would need the line inherit eutils, or
at least inherit some other eclass that inherits it.
The whole point is to not touch the ebuild but utilize bashrc instead :-/
Re: [gentoo-user] Updating libpng: another libtool cockup?
On Sun, Sep 18, 2011 at 4:10 PM, walt w41...@gmail.com wrote:
I just did a routine update on my ~amd64 machine and saw the portage
warning that libpng14 has been replaced by libpng15, and I should run
revdep-rebuild --library '/usr/lib/libpng14.so' and then delete the
obsolete library.
That's what I did. I confess I wasn't watching, so I may have missed
some important errors during the run.
After that I ran plain revdep-rebuild as I do after every update, and
saw that two gnome packages failed to rebuild properly because lpng14
couldn't be found :/
From painful experience I've learned that good-old libtool files (*.la)
are the usual suspects, and grep found -lpng14 in about ten .la files
even after both revdep-rebuilds. Grrr!
This fixed the problem for me (as similar moves have done in the past):
#find /usr/lib64 -name \*.la -exec sed -i s/png14/png15/ '{}' ';'
I ran revdep-rebuild again and the two broken packages emerged nicely
this time.
I hope no one else will hit this problem, but at least this is a good
workaround if you do.
If you're not following Diego Pettenò's blog, you probably should. .la
files are one of the things he harps on in his blog.
http://blog.flameeyes.eu/
--
:wq
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: /etc/portage/patches/
Nikos Chantziaras writes: On 09/18/2011 11:27 PM, walt wrote: On 09/18/2011 09:42 AM, Nikos Chantziaras wrote: I came across some ebuilds that result in: * QA Notice: command not found: * * /etc/portage/bashrc: line 3: epatch_user: command not found How do I solve that one? The epatch_user() is defined in /usr/portage/ebuild/eutils.eclass, so I would guess that the ebuild would need the line inherit eutils, or at least inherit some other eclass that inherits it. The whole point is to not touch the ebuild but utilize bashrc instead :-/ Do these ebuilds also need to apply the patches, or do you just want to get rid of the error message? Wonko
Re: [gentoo-user] Updating libpng: another libtool cockup?
on 09/18/2011 11:10 PM walt wrote the following:
I just did a routine update on my ~amd64 machine and saw the portage
warning that libpng14 has been replaced by libpng15, and I should run
revdep-rebuild --library '/usr/lib/libpng14.so' and then delete the
obsolete library.
snip
This fixed the problem for me (as similar moves have done in the past):
#find /usr/lib64 -name \*.la -exec sed -i s/png14/png15/ '{}' ';'
Thanks ! I didn't know we can just edit .la files.
[gentoo-user] Re: /etc/portage/patches/
On 09/18/2011 11:50 PM, Alex Schuster wrote: Nikos Chantziaras writes: On 09/18/2011 11:27 PM, walt wrote: On 09/18/2011 09:42 AM, Nikos Chantziaras wrote: I came across some ebuilds that result in: * QA Notice: command not found: * * /etc/portage/bashrc: line 3: epatch_user: command not found How do I solve that one? The epatch_user() is defined in /usr/portage/ebuild/eutils.eclass, so I would guess that the ebuild would need the line inherit eutils, or at least inherit some other eclass that inherits it. The whole point is to not touch the ebuild but utilize bashrc instead :-/ Do these ebuilds also need to apply the patches, or do you just want to get rid of the error message? It's just the error message. Which means this isn't an issue for now. It will become one if one of them will need patches though. Too bad that I can't put inherit eutils in bashrc though. But even I could, inheriting an eclass twice would probably not work to begin with.
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: /etc/portage/patches/
Nikos Chantziaras writes:
On 09/18/2011 11:50 PM, Alex Schuster wrote:
Do these ebuilds also need to apply the patches, or do you just want
to get rid of the error message?
It's just the error message. Which means this isn't an issue for now.
It will become one if one of them will need patches though.
post_src_unpack()
{
if type epatch_user /dev/null
then
cd ${S}
epatch_user
fi
}
Too bad that I can't put inherit eutils in bashrc though.
It seems to be bash shell code, so you could try sourcing it from bash:
. /usr/portage/eclass/eutils.eclass
Or copy the epatch_user() shell function from that file into
your /etc/portage/bashrc.
But even I
could, inheriting an eclass twice would probably not work to begin with.
Maybe, I have no idea.
Wonko
Re: [gentoo-user] Updating libpng: another libtool cockup?
On Sunday 18 Sep 2011 21:57:29 Thanasis wrote:
on 09/18/2011 11:10 PM walt wrote the following:
I just did a routine update on my ~amd64 machine and saw the portage
warning that libpng14 has been replaced by libpng15, and I should run
revdep-rebuild --library '/usr/lib/libpng14.so' and then delete the
obsolete library.
snip
This fixed the problem for me (as similar moves have done in the past):
#find /usr/lib64 -name \*.la -exec sed -i s/png14/png15/ '{}' ';'
Thanks ! I didn't know we can just edit .la files.
Isn't something like this that lafilefixer does (and now is part of the
default FEATURES in portage)?
--
Regards,
Mick
signature.asc
Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: [gentoo-user] Updating libpng: another libtool cockup?
On Sun, Sep 18 2011, walt wrote:
I just did a routine update on my ~amd64 machine and saw the portage
warning that libpng14 has been replaced by libpng15, and I should run
revdep-rebuild --library '/usr/lib/libpng14.so' and then delete the
obsolete library.
After that I ran plain revdep-rebuild as I do after every update, and
saw that two gnome packages failed to rebuild properly because lpng14
couldn't be found :/
From painful experience I've learned that good-old libtool files (*.la)
are the usual suspects, and grep found -lpng14 in about ten .la files
even after both revdep-rebuilds. Grrr!
This fixed the problem for me (as similar moves have done in the past):
#find /usr/lib64 -name \*.la -exec sed -i s/png14/png15/ '{}' ';'
Thanks for the tip. I wonder when a routing update world tells you to
run
revdep-rebuild --library some-lib
should you run it before or after the normal
revdep-rebuild
that we normally run after updates?
thanks,
allan
Re: [gentoo-user] grub and what happens exactly when booting.
On Saturday 17 September 2011 13:44:39 Alan McKinnon wrote: [GUIDs] are not the best thing to work with admittedly, but they are guaranteed to be unique for all reasonable human needs. In a world when we plug things out of anything and plug them back into anything, a guaranteed unique ID is a necessaity. As I said, I do not expect to move hard disks around willy-nilly in my boxes, so it certainly isn't a necessity - I don't have an armada of hundreds of boxes here. And I still haven't seen a compelling reason not to quote, e.g., /dev/sda3 in fstab. I know where my partitions are and I want to continue to know that. Call it control-freakery if you like, but it's at the core of sys-admin (if I may say that to you, Alan). -- Rgds Peter Linux Counter 5290, 1994-04-23
Re: [gentoo-user] grub and what happens exactly when booting.
On Saturday 17 September 2011 12:34:54 Dale wrote: Does LVM make the heads move around more or anything like that? I'm just thinking it would depending on what lv are on what drives. I dunno, just curious. I haven't thought about that, but my first impression is that LVM won't make any great difference. The data get stored where the data get stored, if you see what I mean. How they're organised is in the implementation layers. (Am I making sense? It's getting late here.) -- Rgds Peter Linux Counter 5290, 1994-04-23
Re: [gentoo-user] HPLIP plugin file
On Sat, 17 Sep 2011 11:25:44 -0500, Paul Hartman wrote: Now I can finally print normally, and removed foo2zjs completely from my computer. Wooohoo. :) What printer do you have. I use foo2zjs with a LaserJet 1022 and thought it was the only way, not that it causes me any problems. -- Neil Bothwick Top Oxymorons Number 30: Business ethics signature.asc Description: PGP signature
Re: [gentoo-user] Updating libpng: another libtool cockup?
On Sun, 18 Sep 2011 17:58:14 -0400
Allan Gottlieb gottl...@nyu.edu wrote:
On Sun, Sep 18 2011, walt wrote:
I just did a routine update on my ~amd64 machine and saw the portage
warning that libpng14 has been replaced by libpng15, and I should
run revdep-rebuild --library '/usr/lib/libpng14.so' and then delete
the obsolete library.
After that I ran plain revdep-rebuild as I do after every update,
and saw that two gnome packages failed to rebuild properly because
lpng14 couldn't be found :/
From painful experience I've learned that good-old libtool files
(*.la) are the usual suspects, and grep found -lpng14 in about
ten .la files even after both revdep-rebuilds. Grrr!
This fixed the problem for me (as similar moves have done in the
past):
#find /usr/lib64 -name \*.la -exec sed -i s/png14/png15/ '{}' ';'
Thanks for the tip. I wonder when a routing update world tells you to
run
revdep-rebuild --library some-lib
should you run it before or after the normal
revdep-rebuild
that we normally run after updates?
Neither.
revdep-rebuild checks everything, revdep-rebuild --library
checks just some things.
ebuilds sometimes issue messages to check just the libraries known to
have been updated, but a full revdep-rebuild after an update will catch
those anyway.
--
Alan McKinnnon
alan.mckin...@gmail.com
Re: [gentoo-user] grub and what happens exactly when booting.
On Sun, 18 Sep 2011 23:02:45 +0100 Peter Humphrey pe...@humphrey.ukfsn.org wrote: On Saturday 17 September 2011 13:44:39 Alan McKinnon wrote: [GUIDs] are not the best thing to work with admittedly, but they are guaranteed to be unique for all reasonable human needs. In a world when we plug things out of anything and plug them back into anything, a guaranteed unique ID is a necessaity. As I said, I do not expect to move hard disks around willy-nilly in my boxes, so it certainly isn't a necessity - I don't have an armada of hundreds of boxes here. And I still haven't seen a compelling reason not to quote, e.g., /dev/sda3 in fstab. I know where my partitions are and I want to continue to know that. Call it control-freakery if you like, but it's at the core of sys-admin (if I may say that to you, Alan). Well, if you are completely confident you can deal with anything that comes up, you should just continue doing what you've always done. That's part of good sysadmining. I express my own paranoia in a different way :-) -- Alan McKinnnon alan.mckin...@gmail.com
[gentoo-user] Re: how to install from ISO without burning it
Harry Putnam reader at newsguy.com writes: http://nlug.ml1.co.uk/2011/06/boot-livecd-iso-image-from-hdd/305 I can follow that alright but first wanted to make sure there is not a well established mainstream way of doing it. Curious. I was going to attempt an installation directly from a new liveDVD 11.2 just for grins. Here is what I found. I have not yet found the time, but it's on my list. Anyone tried this or a similar method for installation? http://en.gentoo-wiki.com/wiki/Install_LiveDVD_11.2_to_hard_disk_drive hth, James
Re: [gentoo-user] udev + /usr
On Thu, Sep 15, 2011 at 06:59:44PM +0100, Mick wrote The only drawback is the 2 minutes it will take a user the first time this change is introduced to build the initramfs and change the kernel line in grub.conf. I am warming up to this proposal because it seems to me that it will end up being less painful that I originally thought. Good for GRUB. But what about those of us who use lilo? -- Walter Dnes waltd...@waltdnes.org
Re: [gentoo-user] grub and what happens exactly when booting.
Peter Humphrey wrote: On Saturday 17 September 2011 12:34:54 Dale wrote: Does LVM make the heads move around more or anything like that? I'm just thinking it would depending on what lv are on what drives. I dunno, just curious. I haven't thought about that, but my first impression is that LVM won't make any great difference. The data get stored where the data get stored, if you see what I mean. How they're organised is in the implementation layers. (Am I making sense? It's getting late here.) -- Rgds Peter Linux Counter 5290, 1994-04-23 Yea, I see the point. I was even thinking that if LVM is on multiple drives and the a lv was spanned across two or more drives, then it could even be faster. Data spanned across two or more drives could result in it reading more data faster since both drives are collecting data at about the same time. But then again, it depends on how the data is spread out too. I guess it is six of one and half a dozen of the other. Dale :-) :-)
Re: [gentoo-user] HPLIP plugin file
On Sun, Sep 18, 2011 at 6:12 PM, Neil Bothwick n...@digimed.co.uk wrote: On Sat, 17 Sep 2011 11:25:44 -0500, Paul Hartman wrote: Now I can finally print normally, and removed foo2zjs completely from my computer. Wooohoo. :) What printer do you have. I use foo2zjs with a LaserJet 1022 and thought it was the only way, not that it causes me any problems. I have the LaserJer 1020, foo2zjs used to be the only way to print for me, too; by chance, I was looking at HPLIP the other day and saw 1020 was now in the supported printers list (it wasn't when I bought the printer). Looks like 1022 is there, too.
