[gentoo-user] which VM do you recommend?
Hi, I've been running a Windows 7 (professional)guest with Virtualbox on my GenToo system for some years. But recently I have a broken network either due to Virtualbox or due to some (automatic) Windows updates. The situation is more than strange. Sometime using a backed up Virtualbox image the network seems to work but only for a very short time (some minutes?) Windows error analyzing tools don't see any network problems but it does not work. Trying ping -n 100 IP only a few packets come back but with a large delay (40-50 times larger delay compared to ping on the GenToo host) I've tried the most recent Virtualbox 4.2.16 as well the oldest one (in the tree) which is 4.1.26 So probably it looks best to me to change to a different (free) VM. What do you recommend? Many thanks for a hint, Helmut
Re: [gentoo-user] conf.d/net and systemd
On Tuesday 30 July 2013 00:53:08 cov...@ccs.covici.com wrote: Hi there. I would like to know how I can use my existing conf.d/net if I were to use systemd, or is there some better way to do this? I have two static networks an internal and external one and use the postup for things which must go online once the external network is up. I had to use modules=!iproute2 to get the route to add properly, but it is working now using openrc. Thanks in advance for any suggestions. There's no way currently to use config from /etc/conf.d/net if you don't make your own systemd unit. I suggest installing net-misc/netctl. Postup will be possible.
Re: [gentoo-user] conf.d/net and systemd
On Mon, Jul 29, 2013 at 11:53 PM, cov...@ccs.covici.com wrote: Hi there. I would like to know how I can use my existing conf.d/net if I were to use systemd, or is there some better way to do this? I have two static networks an internal and external one and use the postup for things which must go online once the external network is up. I had to use modules=!iproute2 to get the route to add properly, but it is working now using openrc. If both networks are static I would use two service files for each, and the things that must go online can go in another service file (which calls a script for all of them), or with several (a service file for each thing), and which depends on the external network. You then not need to install anything else. Regards. -- Canek Peláez Valdés Posgrado en Ciencia e Ingeniería de la Computación Universidad Nacional Autónoma de México
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: gentoo-systemd-only deprecation
On Monday 29 July 2013 14:04:38 Nikos Chantziaras wrote: On 28/07/13 11:22, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote: Basically, systemd is now a first class citizen in Gentoo (on par with OpenRC) This is great. Thanks to everyone involved! Does someone know whether a KDE system can work reliably with systemd, or there still issues? It is reliable, but for now I'll suggest adding -consolekit line into /etc/portage/profile/use.force (at least if you use default/linux/amd64/13.0/desktop/kde profile like me)
Re: [gentoo-user] gentoo-systemd-only deprecation
On Sunday 28 July 2013 03:22:02 Canek Peláez Valdés wrote: William Hubbs closed bug #409385[1] as fixed, introducing virtual/service-manager and adding it to the @system set, and dropping OpenRC from baselayout's post dependencies. Therefore, as of today, anyone can have a Gentoo machine with only systemd, with no OpenRC installed. Really? Bug 373219 is still open.
Re: [gentoo-user] gentoo-systemd-only deprecation
On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 11:09 AM, Pavel Volkov negai...@gmail.com wrote: On Sunday 28 July 2013 03:22:02 Canek Peláez Valdés wrote: Therefore, as of today, anyone can have a Gentoo machine with only systemd, with no OpenRC installed. Really? Bug 373219 is still open. Sorry, I missed your explanation at the end about that one. Ok, thanks for what you've done :)
[gentoo-user] Chromium: questions
I have 2 questions about how Chromium operates with a clean profile. I run it like this: % chromium --user-data-dir=dir Directory dir is empty (at first launch). After the first launch, some entries immediately appear in History. I visited those before, but it's not everything I visited. Approximately 10-20 entries. From where is this information taken? If it's Google servers, what info is used for identification? IP address, system user name, something else? Next question is about certificates. I have 2 personal certificates installed in my main profile and they appear in the clean profile, too. Where are those certificates stored? I couldn't find them in KDE configuration app (System Settings). Are they taken from main profile?
Re: [gentoo-user] which VM do you recommend?
2013/7/30 Helmut Jarausch jarau...@igpm.rwth-aachen.de: Hi, I've been running a Windows 7 (professional)guest with Virtualbox on my GenToo system for some years. But recently I have a broken network either due to Virtualbox or due to some (automatic) Windows updates. The situation is more than strange. Sometime using a backed up Virtualbox image the network seems to work but only for a very short time (some minutes?) Windows error analyzing tools don't see any network problems but it does not work. Trying ping -n 100 IP only a few packets come back but with a large delay (40-50 times larger delay compared to ping on the GenToo host) I've tried the most recent Virtualbox 4.2.16 as well the oldest one (in the tree) which is 4.1.26 So probably it looks best to me to change to a different (free) VM. What do you recommend? Many thanks for a hint, Helmut Hi, I'm using qemu-kvm for hoisting a Windows 7, but always typing the long commandline is anoying, so I wrote a little script to start the VM. I recently switched to libvirt and virt-manager, which do the commandline work for me, and creatting new VMs or starting them is quiet easy. This system also supports running the VM in background, if this is important to you. It needs a couple of kernel modules to work, but emerge will promt to you what it needs. I'm not on my gentoo machine at the moment, so I can't provide you details on USE-flags, but I can say I have the QUEM_TAGET varables set to i386, x86_64 HTH -- Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards Randolph Maaßen
Re: [gentoo-user] conf.d/net and systemd
Pavel Volkov negai...@gmail.com wrote: On Tuesday 30 July 2013 00:53:08 cov...@ccs.covici.com wrote: Hi there. I would like to know how I can use my existing conf.d/net if I were to use systemd, or is there some better way to do this? I have two static networks an internal and external one and use the postup for things which must go online once the external network is up. I had to use modules=!iproute2 to get the route to add properly, but it is working now using openrc. Thanks in advance for any suggestions. There's no way currently to use config from /etc/conf.d/net if you don't make your own systemd unit. I suggest installing net-misc/netctl. Postup will be possible. OK, thanks -- I will look at that. -- Your life is like a penny. You're going to lose it. The question is: How do you spend it? John Covici cov...@ccs.covici.com
Re: [gentoo-user] conf.d/net and systemd
Canek Peláez Valdés can...@gmail.com wrote: On Mon, Jul 29, 2013 at 11:53 PM, cov...@ccs.covici.com wrote: Hi there. I would like to know how I can use my existing conf.d/net if I were to use systemd, or is there some better way to do this? I have two static networks an internal and external one and use the postup for things which must go online once the external network is up. I had to use modules=!iproute2 to get the route to add properly, but it is working now using openrc. If both networks are static I would use two service files for each, and the things that must go online can go in another service file (which calls a script for all of them), or with several (a service file for each thing), and which depends on the external network. You then not need to install anything else. I like that, and I can do what was in the postup in there as well -- if I don't mess up writing it all! -- Your life is like a penny. You're going to lose it. The question is: How do you spend it? John Covici cov...@ccs.covici.com
Re: [gentoo-user] which VM do you recommend?
On 30/07/2013 08:45, Helmut Jarausch wrote: Hi, I've been running a Windows 7 (professional)guest with Virtualbox on my GenToo system for some years. But recently I have a broken network either due to Virtualbox or due to some (automatic) Windows updates. The situation is more than strange. Sometime using a backed up Virtualbox image the network seems to work but only for a very short time (some minutes?) Windows error analyzing tools don't see any network problems but it does not work. Trying ping -n 100 IP only a few packets come back but with a large delay (40-50 times larger delay compared to ping on the GenToo host) I've tried the most recent Virtualbox 4.2.16 as well the oldest one (in the tree) which is 4.1.26 So probably it looks best to me to change to a different (free) VM. What do you recommend? Many thanks for a hint, Helmut Your post is a bit vague, what outcome are you looking for? Do you want to fix the VirtualBox setup and carry on as always? Just looking for a change from VBox and this latest is a good excuse? I have Win7 pro running on virtualbox 4.2.16, no issues here. Host kernel is 3.9.11-gentoo-r1, and the NIC presented to Windows is a nat'ted Intel PRO/1000 -- Alan McKinnon alan.mckin...@gmail.com
Re: [gentoo-user] Chromium: questions
On 30/07/13 at 12:11pm, Pavel Volkov wrote: I have 2 questions about how Chromium operates with a clean profile. I run it like this: % chromium --user-data-dir=dir Directory dir is empty (at first launch). After the first launch, some entries immediately appear in History. I visited those before, but it's not everything I visited. Approximately 10-20 entries. From where is this information taken? If it's Google servers, what info is used for identification? IP address, system user name, something else? Just a hunch but have you signed into Chromium with your google account ? Google has this feature/anti-feature (based on your outlook) where it syncs bookmarks, history among other things with their servers so you have access to it on all your computers where you've signed into Chromium. - - Yohan Pereira The difference between a Miracle and a Fact is exactly the difference between a mermaid and a seal. -- Mark Twain
Re: [gentoo-user] [Preliminary report] Gnome-3.8 update works with openrc :)
On 30/07/13 04:13, Mark David Dumlao wrote: walt, are you using pam_systemd? I have a hunch that systemd-logind should still work. nope, logind no longer works with anything else than systemd since 205 we have given up on logind+openrc, that's why gnome also now pulls in systemd at portage
Re: [gentoo-user] Chromium: questions
On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 12:27 PM, Yohan Pereira yohan.pere...@gmail.comwrote: Just a hunch but have you signed into Chromium with your google account ? Google has this feature/anti-feature (based on your outlook) where it syncs bookmarks, history among other things with their servers so you have access to it on all your computers where you've signed into Chromium. No, of course I haven't. Only launched it with a clean profile and opened History right away.
Re: [gentoo-user] which VM do you recommend?
On 07/30/2013 10:11:54 AM, Randolph Maaßen wrote: Hi, I'm using qemu-kvm for hoisting a Windows 7, but always typing the long commandline is anoying, so I wrote a little script to start the VM. I recently switched to libvirt and virt-manager, which do the commandline work for me, and creatting new VMs or starting them is quiet easy. This system also supports running the VM in background, if this is important to you. It needs a couple of kernel modules to work, but emerge will promt to you what it needs. I'm not on my gentoo machine at the moment, so I can't provide you details on USE-flags, but I can say I have the QUEM_TAGET varables set to i386, x86_64 Is it possible to convert the VirtualBox VDI file to one used by qemu-kvm? Thanks, Helmut
Re: [gentoo-user] which VM do you recommend?
On 07/30/2013 10:20:22 AM, Alan McKinnon wrote: On 30/07/2013 08:45, Helmut Jarausch wrote: Hi, I've been running a Windows 7 (professional)guest with Virtualbox on my GenToo system for some years. But recently I have a broken network either due to Virtualbox or due to some (automatic) Windows updates. The situation is more than strange. Sometime using a backed up Virtualbox image the network seems to work but only for a very short time (some minutes?) Windows error analyzing tools don't see any network problems but it does not work. Trying ping -n 100 IP only a few packets come back but with a large delay (40-50 times larger delay compared to ping on the GenToo host) I've tried the most recent Virtualbox 4.2.16 as well the oldest one (in the tree) which is 4.1.26 So probably it looks best to me to change to a different (free) VM. What do you recommend? Many thanks for a hint, Helmut Your post is a bit vague, what outcome are you looking for? Do you want to fix the VirtualBox setup and carry on as always? Keeping VirtualBox *** if *** I could fix it, is an option but I cannot fix it. I've tried several NICs with no luck. This was with 3.9.x as well as with 3.10.x I'm at the end of my wits! Just looking for a change from VBox and this latest is a good excuse? Probably. I had too many problems with VBox in the past, it's a complicated beast and the documentation didn't help. I have Win7 pro running on virtualbox 4.2.16, no issues here. Host kernel is 3.9.11-gentoo-r1, and the NIC presented to Windows is a nat'ted Intel PRO/1000 So, probably, you are lucky If you could share your luck! Thanks, Helmut
Re: [gentoo-user] which VM do you recommend?
2013/7/30 Helmut Jarausch jarau...@igpm.rwth-aachen.de: On 07/30/2013 10:11:54 AM, Randolph Maaßen wrote: Hi, I'm using qemu-kvm for hoisting a Windows 7, but always typing the long commandline is anoying, so I wrote a little script to start the VM. I recently switched to libvirt and virt-manager, which do the commandline work for me, and creatting new VMs or starting them is quiet easy. This system also supports running the VM in background, if this is important to you. It needs a couple of kernel modules to work, but emerge will promt to you what it needs. I'm not on my gentoo machine at the moment, so I can't provide you details on USE-flags, but I can say I have the QUEM_TAGET varables set to i386, x86_64 Is it possible to convert the VirtualBox VDI file to one used by qemu-kvm? If youn want to give qemu a try, you can open the VDI directly, or convert it as described here http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/QEMU/Images Thanks, Helmut -- Mit freundlichen Grüßen / Best regards Randolph Maaßen
Re: [gentoo-user] which VM do you recommend?
On 30/07/2013 11:28, Helmut Jarausch wrote: On 07/30/2013 10:20:22 AM, Alan McKinnon wrote: On 30/07/2013 08:45, Helmut Jarausch wrote: Hi, I've been running a Windows 7 (professional)guest with Virtualbox on my GenToo system for some years. But recently I have a broken network either due to Virtualbox or due to some (automatic) Windows updates. The situation is more than strange. Sometime using a backed up Virtualbox image the network seems to work but only for a very short time (some minutes?) Windows error analyzing tools don't see any network problems but it does not work. Trying ping -n 100 IP only a few packets come back but with a large delay (40-50 times larger delay compared to ping on the GenToo host) I've tried the most recent Virtualbox 4.2.16 as well the oldest one (in the tree) which is 4.1.26 So probably it looks best to me to change to a different (free) VM. What do you recommend? Many thanks for a hint, Helmut Your post is a bit vague, what outcome are you looking for? Do you want to fix the VirtualBox setup and carry on as always? Keeping VirtualBox *** if *** I could fix it, is an option but I cannot fix it. I've tried several NICs with no luck. This was with 3.9.x as well as with 3.10.x I'm at the end of my wits! Just looking for a change from VBox and this latest is a good excuse? Probably. I had too many problems with VBox in the past, it's a complicated beast and the documentation didn't help. I have Win7 pro running on virtualbox 4.2.16, no issues here. Host kernel is 3.9.11-gentoo-r1, and the NIC presented to Windows is a nat'ted Intel PRO/1000 So, probably, you are lucky If you could share your luck! I wish I could :-) I have nothing special, I just emerged virtualbox, the additions and modules and made the VMs I need. They work like they should just like it says on the box -- Alan McKinnon alan.mckin...@gmail.com
Re: [gentoo-user] fail: kde-base/kdelibs-4.10.5-r1
On 30/07/2013 11:38, Alain Didierjean wrote: - Mail original - De: Neil Bothwick n...@digimed.co.uk À: gentoo-user@lists.gentoo.org Envoyé: Dimanche 28 Juillet 2013 18:06:38 Objet: Re: [gentoo-user] fail: kde-base/kdelibs-4.10.5-r1 On Sun, 28 Jul 2013 17:59:49 +0200 (CEST), Alain Didierjean wrote: the above lib won't compile with a emake error. Is it me or anyone else had that type of problem ? It's just you. Please post emerge output. Thanks. Emerge output: emake error. Your portage installation is seriously screwed if that is all the output you get. Don't try to guess which parts of the output are relevant, if you could do that you could probably work out the cause of the problem. Post the full output plus any other information that output tells you to (and it does). Remember, you are the one sat in front of your terminal, the rest of us only know what you told us, and so far your two mails have said. It doesn't work. It doesn't work because of an error. There are some clever people on this list but, AFAIK, no magicians or mind readers. I could'nt find an emake executable. Which package contains such a beast ? emake is a portage function, not a standalone executable. --[ 16%] Building CXX object kdeui/CMakeFiles/kdeui.dir/widgets/kmenubar.o Neil Bothwick OK. Here's the full output. It happens on a amd64 / 8 cores (AMD 8120) machine. Output is slightly different if I set MAKEOPTs to -j1 or -j8. Here's what I get with -j1: [ 16%] Building CXX object kdeui/CMakeFiles/kdeui.dir/widgets/kmenubar.o .. skipping the full gcc command line . ccache: FATAL: x_calloc: Could not allocate 40 bytes ^^ disable ccache, try again make[2]: *** [kdeui/CMakeFiles/kdeui.dir/widgets/kmenubar.o] Erreur 1 make[2] : on quitte le répertoire « /var/tmp/portage/kde-base/kdelibs-4.10.5-r1/work/kdelibs-4.10.5_build » make[1]: *** [kdeui/CMakeFiles/kdeui.dir/all] Erreur 2 make[1] : on quitte le répertoire « /var/tmp/portage/kde-base/kdelibs-4.10.5-r1/work/kdelibs-4.10.5_build » make: *** [all] Erreur 2 * ERROR: kde-base/kdelibs-4.10.5-r1 failed (compile phase): * emake failed 2 files joined: emergeinfo is the output of emerge --info '=kde-base/kdelibs-4.10.5-r1' and buildlog. Hope one can help. -- Alan McKinnon alan.mckin...@gmail.com
Re: [gentoo-user] SQL Server Advice for Small Business
2013/7/30 Randy Westlund rwest...@gmail.com: Hey guys, I'm planning to set up an SQL server for my dad's small canvas awning business, and I've never done this before. Most of my sysadmin-type skills are self-taught. I could use some advice. spot a girl
Re: [gentoo-user] which VM do you recommend?
On 2013-07-30 4:11 AM, Randolph Maaßen r.maasse...@gmail.com wrote: It needs a couple of kernel modules to work, but emerge will promt to you what it needs. Side question... I want to run the vmware tools on my gentoo VM (so the host can safely power it down), but it also requires modules. For security reasons I have never enabled modules on my servers, but... Is there a way to do this securely, so that *only* the necessary modules could ever be loaded? Thanks
Re: [gentoo-user] which VM do you recommend?
On 30/07/2013 12:36, Tanstaafl wrote: On 2013-07-30 4:11 AM, Randolph Maaßen r.maasse...@gmail.com wrote: It needs a couple of kernel modules to work, but emerge will promt to you what it needs. Side question... I want to run the vmware tools on my gentoo VM (so the host can safely power it down), but it also requires modules. For security reasons I have never enabled modules on my servers, but... Is there a way to do this securely, so that *only* the necessary modules could ever be loaded? No. The best you can do is to is to limit the modules you have to those you want to use. -- Alan McKinnon alan.mckin...@gmail.com
Re: [gentoo-user] which VM do you recommend?
On 30/07/2013 11:36, Tanstaafl wrote: On 2013-07-30 4:11 AM, Randolph Maaßen r.maasse...@gmail.com wrote: It needs a couple of kernel modules to work, but emerge will promt to you what it needs. Side question... I want to run the vmware tools on my gentoo VM (so the host can safely power it down), but it also requires modules. For security reasons I have never enabled modules on my servers, but... It doesn't enhance security unless additional measures are taken (see below). Is there a way to do this securely, so that *only* the necessary modules could ever be loaded? You can use gsecurity (which is in hardened-sources). With CONFIG_GRKERNSEC_MODSTOP enabled, you will be able to run: # echo 1 /proc/sys/kernel/grsecurity/disable_modules After that, no further modules can be loaded. However, you would also need to disable privileged I/O and the ability to write to /dev/kmem, both of which grsecurity also facilitates. --Kerin
Re: [gentoo-user] SQL Server Advice for Small Business
On Tuesday 30 Jul 2013 11:31:05 microcai wrote: 2013/7/30 Randy Westlund rwest...@gmail.com: Hey guys, I'm planning to set up an SQL server for my dad's small canvas awning business, and I've never done this before. Most of my sysadmin-type skills are self-taught. I could use some advice. spot a girl How old are you, sonny and how does your comment address the question of the OP? -- Regards, Mick signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: [gentoo-user] Chromium: questions
On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 3:11 AM, Pavel Volkov negai...@gmail.com wrote: I have 2 questions about how Chromium operates with a clean profile. I run it like this: % chromium --user-data-dir=dir Directory dir is empty (at first launch). After the first launch, some entries immediately appear in History. I visited those before, but it's not everything I visited. Approximately 10-20 entries. From where is this information taken? If it's Google servers, what info is used for identification? IP address, system user name, something else? Next question is about certificates. I have 2 personal certificates installed in my main profile and they appear in the clean profile, too. Where are those certificates stored? I couldn't find them in KDE configuration app (System Settings). Are they taken from main profile? I would look in the ~/.config/ directory for any chrome/chromium/google stuff which might possibly contain this data... (even if you specified otherwise)
Re: [gentoo-user] gentoo-systemd-only deprecation
On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 2:09 AM, Pavel Volkov negai...@gmail.com wrote: On Sunday 28 July 2013 03:22:02 Canek Peláez Valdés wrote: William Hubbs closed bug #409385[1] as fixed, introducing virtual/service-manager and adding it to the @system set, and dropping OpenRC from baselayout's post dependencies. Therefore, as of today, anyone can have a Gentoo machine with only systemd, with no OpenRC installed. Really? Bug 373219 is still open. Yeah, and as I said in my original mail Also, without OpenRC we don't have /etc/init.d/functions.sh , but you can use the alternatives provided in my overlay or in bug #373219[3]. I'm pretty sure someone will close that bug pretty soon. Basically, download elog-functions.sh (or any other alternative provided in the bug, there are several), and put it in /etc/init.d/functions.sh. Problem solved, or at least until someone closes 373219. Besides, /etc/init.d/functions.sh only really affects you when using python-updater, gcc-config, or similar tools. Regards. -- Canek Peláez Valdés Posgrado en Ciencia e Ingeniería de la Computación Universidad Nacional Autónoma de México
Re: [gentoo-user] gentoo-systemd-only deprecation
On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 2:47 AM, Pavel Volkov negai...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 11:09 AM, Pavel Volkov negai...@gmail.com wrote: On Sunday 28 July 2013 03:22:02 Canek Peláez Valdés wrote: Therefore, as of today, anyone can have a Gentoo machine with only systemd, with no OpenRC installed. Really? Bug 373219 is still open. Sorry, I missed your explanation at the end about that one. Ok, thanks for what you've done :) Mmmh, and I missed this last reply of you. Anyway, dealing with /etc/init.d/functions.sh is basically trivial. Regards. -- Canek Peláez Valdés Posgrado en Ciencia e Ingeniería de la Computación Universidad Nacional Autónoma de México
Re: [gentoo-user] [Preliminary report] Gnome-3.8 update works with openrc :)
Am 30.07.2013 07:35, schrieb Canek Peláez Valdés: On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 12:26 AM, Michael Hampicke m...@hadt.biz wrote: Am 30.07.2013 03:04, schrieb walt: As I posted in another thread, after successfully updating to gnome-3.8 on a virtual gentoo machine that's been running systemd for months, I tackled my openrc gentoo virtual machine just to see if I could do it. I just did it :) Gnome-3.8 is running on the openrc machine without running systemd at all. Try suspending/hibernating the machine via Gnome menu. Does that work for you? Never got that to work when I used openrc. Also: • Can you mount (as a normal user) USB drives, CDs, sftp remote directories? I was able to mount usb sticks on openrc/gnome3.8, also sftp shares via gvfs. I have no optical drive, so I don't know • Can you add a new wireless or wired networks with NetworkManager? Never tried NM or wifi on my workstation, but my guess would be that it will not work. • Can you shut down the machine from the GNOME menu? This worked • Bluetooth? Printers? Printing via cups worked, but I don't use BT signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature
Re: [gentoo-user] SQL Server Advice for Small Business
On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 02:35:21PM +0100, Mick wrote: spot a girl How old are you, sonny and how does your comment address the question of the OP? He's Chinese in his early 20s... -- Happy Penguin Computers ') 126 Fenco Drive ( \ Tupelo, MS 38801 ^^ supp...@happypenguincomputers.com 662-269-2706 662-205-6424 http://happypenguincomputers.com/ A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? A: Top-posting. Q: What is the most annoying thing in e-mail? Don't top-post: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Top_post#Top-posting
Re: [gentoo-user] gentoo-systemd-only deprecation
Canek Peláez Valdés can...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 2:47 AM, Pavel Volkov negai...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 11:09 AM, Pavel Volkov negai...@gmail.com wrote: On Sunday 28 July 2013 03:22:02 Canek Peláez Valdés wrote: Therefore, as of today, anyone can have a Gentoo machine with only systemd, with no OpenRC installed. Really? Bug 373219 is still open. Sorry, I missed your explanation at the end about that one. Ok, thanks for what you've done :) Mmmh, and I missed this last reply of you. Anyway, dealing with /etc/init.d/functions.sh is basically trivial. But still, we have lots of packages with no systemd units -- shouldn't they all have a systemd use flag and units to go with it -- basically anything which has something in /etc/init.d . I was looking for a sendmail unit and could find nothing, for one example. -- Your life is like a penny. You're going to lose it. The question is: How do you spend it? John Covici cov...@ccs.covici.com
Re: [gentoo-user] gentoo-systemd-only deprecation
On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 12:53 PM, cov...@ccs.covici.com wrote: Canek Peláez Valdés can...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 2:47 AM, Pavel Volkov negai...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 11:09 AM, Pavel Volkov negai...@gmail.com wrote: On Sunday 28 July 2013 03:22:02 Canek Peláez Valdés wrote: Therefore, as of today, anyone can have a Gentoo machine with only systemd, with no OpenRC installed. Really? Bug 373219 is still open. Sorry, I missed your explanation at the end about that one. Ok, thanks for what you've done :) Mmmh, and I missed this last reply of you. Anyway, dealing with /etc/init.d/functions.sh is basically trivial. But still, we have lots of packages with no systemd units -- shouldn't they all have a systemd use flag and units to go with it -- basically anything which has something in /etc/init.d . I was looking for a sendmail unit and could find nothing, for one example. Yeah, we are not even near 100% coverage. However, one of the many advantages of systemd is that a service unit from a distribution usually works as-is or with minimal changes in any other. For many basic unit files, you can go to https://github.com/vonSchlotzkow/systemd-gentoo-units It has a unit file for postfix, for example. If the one you are looking for is not there, you can search in other distributions. If you download the RPM from http://rpm.pbone.net/index.php3/stat/4/idpl/21317874/dir/fedora_19/com/sendmail-8.14.7-1.fc19.i686.rpm.html, and extract the files with rpm2tarbz2, then you can get the sendmail.service file. It will probably need some changes to work with Gentoo, but it should not be difficult. When is working, you can send your unit to the package maintainer in Gentoo, and at some point it could be included in the package (like the OpenRC init script). That's how we will get 100% coverage, eventually. Regards. -- Canek Peláez Valdés Posgrado en Ciencia e Ingeniería de la Computación Universidad Nacional Autónoma de México
[gentoo-user] Gentoo is so AWESOME
And we need MOAR devs http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/devrel/handbook/handbook.xml?part=1chap=2 https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Project:Gentoo/Staffing_Needs so awesome! srsly! What many people don't seem to get is: you don't need to be a commit monkey doing your 100+ commits per week. Our minimum rate of commits is pretty low before you actually are forced to retire. Better have a lot of devs each one focussing on a few packages than having few devs working on the entire tree and messing up things randomly. It's not that much work, just some regular attention. You want to join!
Re: [gentoo-user] Gentoo is so AWESOME
On 07/30/2013 01:16 PM, hasufell wrote: And we need MOAR devs http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/devrel/handbook/handbook.xml?part=1chap=2 https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Project:Gentoo/Staffing_Needs so awesome! srsly! What many people don't seem to get is: you don't need to be a commit monkey doing your 100+ commits per week. Our minimum rate of commits is pretty low before you actually are forced to retire. Better have a lot of devs each one focussing on a few packages than having few devs working on the entire tree and messing up things randomly. It's not that much work, just some regular attention. You want to join! I was interested in becoming a dev for a little while, but the testing and what looks to be prolonged process kinda put me off of the idea. It just seems like a lot of bureaucratic work. Perhaps my impression is wrong, though... Which projects are most in need of developers or maintainers? I wouldn't mind learning a bit more about package maintenance, portage, and ebuilds...
Re: [gentoo-user] SQL Server Advice for Small Business
On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 07:52:11AM +0200, J. Roeleveld wrote: For that, you could, in time, look into PostGIS (or similar). Interesting, I'll keep that in the back of my mind. Will the server be internet-facing? I would make sure you have a firewall and only open the port needed for the front-end. Don't update the kernel too often, keep an eye out for security fixes and apply where necessary. Keep a seperate machine/VM where you build binary packages. This will significantly reduce the time needed to upgrade the software. No, it'll be LAN only. I'll filter out external connections. There's no wireless network and no adjacent businesses, so I'm not worrying too much about security. The only thing I'll need from the outside is SSH. So your recommendation is to have a VM on the server with the same packages installed, compile things there, then move the binary package to the real server. I might set this up at some point, but I think I'll be okay with updating things in place, so long as I do it at night. That depends on your budget and requirements. For databases, RAID-10 is generally considered the best performance. Also avoid filling the disks and try to use the first half of the disk, rather then the whole. (First half is faster then 2nd half) RAID-10 in software (eg. Linux Software Raid in the kernel) outperforms the cheaper RAID-cards easily. If you have the budget, you could invest in a dedicated hardware raid card (but make sure it is 100% hardware and doesn't use the CPU for the calculations) Okay, RAID-10 sounds good. Thanks for the tip about the first half of the drives. Depends on how much you want in there. If just a simple share, then it will be simple. If you also want the MS Windows machines to authenticate against it, things get a little more complicated. Should just be a simple share, I don't think I'll need any authentication. How mission-critical will this be? For my server (which has become quite critical over the years), I currently use a self-build server with good reliable components. TYAN-mainboard (with built-in iKVM), WD-RED drives, Areca hardware raid-card. When I started running my own server, it was on a cheap no-brand mainboard with simple desktop disks connected via IDE. (yes, ancient :) ) The server will be pretty important. If all goes according to plan, every employee that uses a computer (~15) will be interacting with it throughout the day. The goal is to replace paper records. Aside from the hard drives, are there any other components that are especially important for databases? You want to try to keep the database design optimized for the usage pattern of the client-tools. Which usually means not too much normalization. That helps with reporting, not when you need to do mostly inserts. From what I've read so far, it sounded like everything should be normalized as much as possible even if there's a slight performance hit because it makes the system easier to modify and expand later. In my prototype, I have it divided into as many tables as possible, and each SELECT has mutiple joins. Is this a bad idea? How big will those documents be? Either, as already mentioned, store them as blobs, or on a (samba) share and put metadata (filepath,name,description,...) in the database. I'm expecting job orders to have at most a few images of the job site, blueprints, random things the customer/contractor emailed us, and a few scanned sheets of handwritten notes. Storing them outside the database sounds like asking for trouble. Binary blobs sounds good. Advice: 1) Backup 2) Backup 3) Did I mention backup? ;) A tip, when you decide to put the documents on a share, to ensure the backups are in sync, do the following: 1) stop access to the database 2) snapshot the fileshare (LVM helps here) 3) backup the database 4) allow access to the database again 5) backup the snapshot 6) remove the snapshot Total downtime with this should be less then 1 minute. A full backup using the Postgresql tools is really quick. Step 5 can then take as long as it takes. The environment will still be running. How often should a small database like this be backed up? Once a day? Twice a day? I'm thinking that I should backup to another machine on the network, then copy that to at least one off-side machine. Thanks for your help. Randy
Re: [gentoo-user] Chromium: questions
On Tuesday 30 Jul 2013 09:11:37 Pavel Volkov wrote: I have 2 questions about how Chromium operates with a clean profile. I run it like this: % chromium --user-data-dir=dir Directory dir is empty (at first launch). After the first launch, some entries immediately appear in History. I visited those before, but it's not everything I visited. Approximately 10-20 entries. From where is this information taken? If it's Google servers, what info is used for identification? IP address, system user name, something else? Next question is about certificates. I have 2 personal certificates installed in my main profile and they appear in the clean profile, too. Where are those certificates stored? I couldn't find them in KDE configuration app (System Settings). Are they taken from main profile? I have a number of certificate details and CRLs stored under ~.gnupg/ Additionally, mozilla certificates are stored in the ~/.mozilla/firefox/xx.default/ directory, but I think that these are only used by mozilla apps, not Chromium. -- Regards, Mick signature.asc Description: This is a digitally signed message part.
Re: [gentoo-user] gentoo-systemd-only deprecation
Canek Peláez Valdés can...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 12:53 PM, cov...@ccs.covici.com wrote: Canek Peláez Valdés can...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 2:47 AM, Pavel Volkov negai...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 11:09 AM, Pavel Volkov negai...@gmail.com wrote: On Sunday 28 July 2013 03:22:02 Canek Peláez Valdés wrote: Therefore, as of today, anyone can have a Gentoo machine with only systemd, with no OpenRC installed. Really? Bug 373219 is still open. Sorry, I missed your explanation at the end about that one. Ok, thanks for what you've done :) Mmmh, and I missed this last reply of you. Anyway, dealing with /etc/init.d/functions.sh is basically trivial. But still, we have lots of packages with no systemd units -- shouldn't they all have a systemd use flag and units to go with it -- basically anything which has something in /etc/init.d . I was looking for a sendmail unit and could find nothing, for one example. Yeah, we are not even near 100% coverage. However, one of the many advantages of systemd is that a service unit from a distribution usually works as-is or with minimal changes in any other. For many basic unit files, you can go to https://github.com/vonSchlotzkow/systemd-gentoo-units It has a unit file for postfix, for example. If the one you are looking for is not there, you can search in other distributions. If you download the RPM from http://rpm.pbone.net/index.php3/stat/4/idpl/21317874/dir/fedora_19/com/sendmail-8.14.7-1.fc19.i686.rpm.html, and extract the files with rpm2tarbz2, then you can get the sendmail.service file. It will probably need some changes to work with Gentoo, but it should not be difficult. When is working, you can send your unit to the package maintainer in Gentoo, and at some point it could be included in the package (like the OpenRC init script). That's how we will get 100% coverage, eventually. OK, I will check those -- thanks. I hope package maintainers now start putting those service units in, now that systemd is required by gnome. -- Your life is like a penny. You're going to lose it. The question is: How do you spend it? John Covici cov...@ccs.covici.com
Re: [gentoo-user] gentoo-systemd-only deprecation
There is going to be resistance. Two months ago there was a huge thread in gentoo-dev, because a package maintaner complained that his co-maintainer added a systemd unit to the package: http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.linux.gentoo.devel/85792 In the end, the maintainer rage-quit: http://article.gmane.org/gmane.linux.gentoo.project/2551 However, this is the extreme behaviour: most developers (and rational people) agree to adding systemd unit files to all packages, and we have much better coverage now that some months ago. If users cooperate opening bugs adding systemd unit files (after testing them in their machines), the coverage is going to grow even faster. Regards. On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 5:04 PM, cov...@ccs.covici.com wrote: Canek Peláez Valdés can...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 12:53 PM, cov...@ccs.covici.com wrote: Canek Peláez Valdés can...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 2:47 AM, Pavel Volkov negai...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 11:09 AM, Pavel Volkov negai...@gmail.com wrote: On Sunday 28 July 2013 03:22:02 Canek Peláez Valdés wrote: Therefore, as of today, anyone can have a Gentoo machine with only systemd, with no OpenRC installed. Really? Bug 373219 is still open. Sorry, I missed your explanation at the end about that one. Ok, thanks for what you've done :) Mmmh, and I missed this last reply of you. Anyway, dealing with /etc/init.d/functions.sh is basically trivial. But still, we have lots of packages with no systemd units -- shouldn't they all have a systemd use flag and units to go with it -- basically anything which has something in /etc/init.d . I was looking for a sendmail unit and could find nothing, for one example. Yeah, we are not even near 100% coverage. However, one of the many advantages of systemd is that a service unit from a distribution usually works as-is or with minimal changes in any other. For many basic unit files, you can go to https://github.com/vonSchlotzkow/systemd-gentoo-units It has a unit file for postfix, for example. If the one you are looking for is not there, you can search in other distributions. If you download the RPM from http://rpm.pbone.net/index.php3/stat/4/idpl/21317874/dir/fedora_19/com/sendmail-8.14.7-1.fc19.i686.rpm.html, and extract the files with rpm2tarbz2, then you can get the sendmail.service file. It will probably need some changes to work with Gentoo, but it should not be difficult. When is working, you can send your unit to the package maintainer in Gentoo, and at some point it could be included in the package (like the OpenRC init script). That's how we will get 100% coverage, eventually. OK, I will check those -- thanks. I hope package maintainers now start putting those service units in, now that systemd is required by gnome. -- Your life is like a penny. You're going to lose it. The question is: How do you spend it? John Covici cov...@ccs.covici.com -- Canek Peláez Valdés Posgrado en Ciencia e Ingeniería de la Computación Universidad Nacional Autónoma de México
Re: [gentoo-user] Gentoo is so AWESOME
On 07/30/2013 02:16 PM, hasufell wrote: And we need MOAR devs http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/devrel/handbook/handbook.xml?part=1chap=2 https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Project:Gentoo/Staffing_Needs so awesome! srsly! What many people don't seem to get is: you don't need to be a commit monkey doing your 100+ commits per week. Our minimum rate of commits is pretty low before you actually are forced to retire. Better have a lot of devs each one focussing on a few packages than having few devs working on the entire tree and messing up things randomly. It's not that much work, just some regular attention. You want to join! (old rant) I would like to become a developer. I already proxy maintain a few packages, and have a few more in sunrise that I could take care of. I could also triage bugs in my spare time. But, there's no process to do so. I want to become a dev, what's my next step? There is none. Help out, and maybe someone will notice you? Ok, I'm on it. Been doing it for years, and I know several other people in the same situation. It doesn't work, and recruitment numbers are plummeting. There needs to be an explicit, documented process. And someone devoted full-time to mentoring new recruits. I can think of no better long-term investment of the foundation's money.
Re: [gentoo-user] Gentoo is so AWESOME
On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 07:48:19PM -0400, Michael Orlitzky wrote: On 07/30/2013 02:16 PM, hasufell wrote: And we need MOAR devs http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/devrel/handbook/handbook.xml?part=1chap=2 https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Project:Gentoo/Staffing_Needs so awesome! srsly! What many people don't seem to get is: you don't need to be a commit monkey doing your 100+ commits per week. Our minimum rate of commits is pretty low before you actually are forced to retire. Better have a lot of devs each one focussing on a few packages than having few devs working on the entire tree and messing up things randomly. It's not that much work, just some regular attention. You want to join! (old rant) I would like to become a developer. I already proxy maintain a few packages, and have a few more in sunrise that I could take care of. I could also triage bugs in my spare time. But, there's no process to do so. I want to become a dev, what's my next step? There is none. Help out, and maybe someone will notice you? Ok, I'm on it. Been doing it for years, and I know several other people in the same situation. It doesn't work, and recruitment numbers are plummeting. There needs to be an explicit, documented process. And someone devoted full-time to mentoring new recruits. I can think of no better long-term investment of the foundation's money. Let me second this post. Some months ago after much prodding by someone high up in the Gentoo organization, I tried to take the $PATH. Michael's post above is, IMO, _very_ kind considering what I went through. In the middle of my _tests_ the whole system broke down. For 7 years before coming to Gentoo I was with Slackware. Never wanting any public recognition, most of my patches just went straight to the #2 guy. Pat did sometimes name me in ChangeLogs, but mostly I was allowed to contribute in the background. Gentoo could use an overhaul, especially in the area of communication skills, _most_ especially for those devs whose first language is _not_ English. Just my 2c ... no time atm anyway ... RL demands me to make $ for bills. Don't take my quick, casual comments as criticism of Gentoo as a GNU/Linux distro. For those who have some knowledge, it's far and above the best! But the foundation needs to take a look into revamping this area. Cheers, Bruce -- Happy Penguin Computers ') 126 Fenco Drive ( \ Tupelo, MS 38801 ^^ supp...@happypenguincomputers.com 662-269-2706 662-205-6424 http://happypenguincomputers.com/ A: Because it messes up the order in which people normally read text. Q: Why is top-posting such a bad thing? A: Top-posting. Q: What is the most annoying thing in e-mail? Don't top-post: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Top_post#Top-posting
Re: [gentoo-user] which VM do you recommend?
On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 06:36:57AM -0400, Tanstaafl wrote Side question... I want to run the vmware tools on my gentoo VM (so the host can safely power it down), but it also requires modules. Why do you need vmware tools? From the host, execute... ssh root@guest /sbin/poweroff ...or, if you have sys-power/hibernate-script installed, and want to hibernate... ssh root@guest /usr/sbin/hibernate -- Walter Dnes waltd...@waltdnes.org I don't run desktop environments; I run useful applications
Re: [gentoo-user] [~amd64] Some possibly (?) helpful hints re the big gnome-3.8 update
First and foremost, thank you Canek. On Tue, Jul 30 2013, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote: On Mon, Jul 29, 2013 at 7:56 PM, gottl...@nyu.edu wrote: I am a gnome-3 user, who wants to continue with gnome-3. [ I described my current state--beginning of wiki ] Sounds reasonable. [ I asked about /etc/mtab and /proc/self/mounts If you switch to systemd, you will need to make /etc/mtab a symlink to /proc/self/mounts. Done. After that comes the big one emerge systemd USE=... systemd ... emerge --newuse ... [ a change from previous msg ] /etc/init.d/udev restart Can the system be rebooted at this point (I realize init will still not use systemd) or must the entire conversion (including changing init) be completed before the system is bootable? I am hoping it is the former. If you reboot [now], I don't believe there is any chance your system will boot up correctly. I see. /etc/init.d/udev is installed by sys-fs/udev; sys-apps/systemd doesn't provide anything similar. I don't understand. *After* installing systemd (and setting the USE and executing the emerge --newuse ...), the wiki tells you to /etc/init.d/udev restart Emerging systemd unmerges udev so how can I do the restart? I recommend installing everything necessary (and uninstalling everything that is not) before trying the reboot. How far do I have to get in the wiki? I am hoping to do smaller chunks so that if I have to back out a step (using a bootable CD) to restore bootability to the system, it won't take too long. In particular do I have to switch init to /usr/lib/systemd/systemd before I can boot. I know you have had systemd installed for a long time. Did you always have the init= line or were you for a while running openrc with systemd installed? Also, I would do the whole shebang in a one step, removing all the masked packages you did. You can try to boot to multi-user.target instead of graphical.target, if you want to test that systemd works correctly independently of GNOME. I am not so worried about gnome coming up. If the system boots and I can get the 6 text terminals, I can survive for quite a while with emacs and gnus. Again thanks for the help. allan
Re: [gentoo-user] [~amd64] Some possibly (?) helpful hints re the big gnome-3.8 update
On Tue, Jul 30, 2013 at 8:31 PM, gottl...@nyu.edu wrote: First and foremost, thank you Canek. On Tue, Jul 30 2013, Canek Peláez Valdés wrote: On Mon, Jul 29, 2013 at 7:56 PM, gottl...@nyu.edu wrote: I am a gnome-3 user, who wants to continue with gnome-3. [ I described my current state--beginning of wiki ] Sounds reasonable. [ I asked about /etc/mtab and /proc/self/mounts If you switch to systemd, you will need to make /etc/mtab a symlink to /proc/self/mounts. Done. After that comes the big one emerge systemd USE=... systemd ... emerge --newuse ... [ a change from previous msg ] /etc/init.d/udev restart Can the system be rebooted at this point (I realize init will still not use systemd) or must the entire conversion (including changing init) be completed before the system is bootable? I am hoping it is the former. If you reboot [now], I don't believe there is any chance your system will boot up correctly. I see. /etc/init.d/udev is installed by sys-fs/udev; sys-apps/systemd doesn't provide anything similar. I don't understand. *After* installing systemd (and setting the USE and executing the emerge --newuse ...), the wiki tells you to /etc/init.d/udev restart Emerging systemd unmerges udev so how can I do the restart? The wiki is wrong. The script /etc/init.d/udev is part of sys-fs/udev, which you need to uninstall before installing systemd. Perhaps it's CONFIG_PROTECT'd, but anyway sys-fs/udev and sys-apps/systemd install the udev binary in different directories, so the script is basically useless after the switch. I recommend installing everything necessary (and uninstalling everything that is not) before trying the reboot. How far do I have to get in the wiki? I am hoping to do smaller chunks so that if I have to back out a step (using a bootable CD) to restore bootability to the system, it won't take too long. I thing you should do it all in one big step. sys-fs/udev and sys-apps/systemd conflict each other pretty badly, and the latter changes the init program; also, several programs can work with OpenRC, or systemd, but not both. Doing it in smaller chunks seems to me a great recipe to making your system unbootable. In particular do I have to switch init to /usr/lib/systemd/systemd before I can boot. Yeah, I believe you have to. I know you have had systemd installed for a long time. Did you always have the init= line or were you for a while running openrc with systemd installed? No, I did the switch and almost immediately started to work in the gentoo-systemd-only overlay[1], which I just deprecated. At the very beggining having OpenRC could wreck the whole boot, since some stuff (barely documented at the time) called scripts in /etc/init.d seemingly at random, and at the time OpenRC scripts didn't even consider that the machine was not being booted with OpenRC. I do have an old server *running* with systemd and with OpenRC still installed; it's my last machine waiting to switch to the new service-manager virtual. Also, I would do the whole shebang in a one step, removing all the masked packages you did. You can try to boot to multi-user.target instead of graphical.target, if you want to test that systemd works correctly independently of GNOME. I am not so worried about gnome coming up. If the system boots and I can get the 6 text terminals, I can survive for quite a while with emacs and gnus. GNUS? Damn, that brings back some memories. I stopped using it for reading email in 2002 or 2003, when Evolution become mature enough. If you are comfortable with only a console, do the switch from a VT. A lot of stuff will stopping working *during* the transition, and will not become functional again until you reboot. Regards. -- Canek Peláez Valdés Posgrado en Ciencia e Ingeniería de la Computación Universidad Nacional Autónoma de México
