Re: [Gregorio-users] Gabc syntax for "markers"

[Henry T. So Jr.]

On May 31, 2016 10:15:02 PM "Br. Elijah Schwab, O.Carm" 
 wrote:



On May 30, 2016 08:37, Henry So Jr. wrote:


-  (with no (), which may confuse people used to XML)
-  (this is XML-like, but may be hard to remember)
- $marker$ (which makes it obvious this is different, but is different)



I would be in favor of allowing both  and .


That proposal makes sense, and if we go with that syntax, that's what we'll do.


One question though concerning styles that now span syllables (, ,
etc) would  limit the style to the current syllable only, or are
these tags not affected by the proposed marker syntax?


Existing tags are *not* markers and will need to be closed when their 
effect is no longer desired.


This difference is the reason we are divided.  Using a similar syntax for 
something with different semantics leaves the opening for questions such as 
yours.



Using $..$ seems to be too confusing with math mode.


We can choose some other delimiter, but Jakub Jelinek's point about extra 
things needing escaping is very true as well.


That said, it seems people generally prefer the xml-like syntax, so that's 
probably how it will end up, confusion and all.


Henry



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Re: [Gregorio-users] Gabc syntax for "markers"

[Br. Elijah Schwab, O.Carm]

On May 30, 2016 08:37, Henry So Jr. wrote:
> 
> -  (with no (), which may confuse people used to XML)
> -  (this is XML-like, but may be hard to remember)
> - $marker$ (which makes it obvious this is different, but is different)
> 

I would be in favor of allowing both  and .

One question though concerning styles that now span syllables (, ,
etc) would  limit the style to the current syllable only, or are
these tags not affected by the proposed marker syntax?

Using $..$ seems to be too confusing with math mode.

-Rev. Br. Elijah Schwab, O.Carm.

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[Gregorio-users] ANNOUNCEMENT - v4.2.0-rc1 released

[Br. Samuel Springuel]

New features for 4.2 are now officially frozen.  We are, of course, 
still interested in fixing any bugs you might find, however, so please 
try this out and report back if you find any problems.


Mac Users: If you missed the 4.1.2 (or later) upgrade, then please run 
the Uninstall-Gregorio.pkg first to prevent version conflicts.


Download here:
https://github.com/gregorio-project/gregorio/releases/tag/v4.2.0-rc1

# CHANGELOG
## [4.2.0-rc1] - 2016-05-31
### Fixed
- The `900_gregorio.xml` file for Scribus now matches 
`main-lualatex.tex` again (see 
[#1087](https://github.com/gregorio-project/gregorio/issues/1087)).
- Multiple subsequent lines in gabc no longer cause TeX to fail (see 
[#](https://github.com/gregorio-project/gregorio/issues/)).
- Old bar spacing algorithm will no longer separate the text and bar 
when the bar is preceeded by a puncutm mora (see 
[#1078](https://github.com/gregorio-project/gregorio/issues/1078)).
- Scores which end with a no-note syllable under the new bar spacing 
algorithm will no longer have their text pushed out into the right hand 
margin.  See 
[#1110](https://github.com/gregorio-project/gregorio/issues/1110).

- PlainTeX will now respect underline requests in gabc.
- PlainTeX will now raise a warning when small caps are requested but 
`\sc` has not been defined.


### Added
- Nabc now supports pitches `hn` and `hp` in addition to previously 
supported `ha` through `hm`.
- 32 new St. Gall neume glyphs have been added to the `gregall` font and 
glyphs for nabc `po-1pp2su1sux1` and `po-1su1sux1` have been changed.
- 31 new St. Gall neume glyphs have been added to the `gresgmodern` font 
and glyph for nabc `tr-1` has been changed.
- It is now possible to set `\parskip`, `\lineskip`, `\baselineskip`, 
and `\lineskiplimit` to have different values within a score using 
`\grechangedim`.  See 
[#1038](https://github.com/gregorio-project/gregorio/issues/1038).


### Changed
- Different glyphs are now used for puncta inclinata in an ascent versus 
in a descent.  A heuristic algorithm is used to ensure that the glyphs 
match when grouped together.  If the algorithm chooses the wrong shape, 
use `0` (for descending) or `1` (for ascending) to force an orientation. 
 See [UPGRADE.md](UPGRADE.md) and 
[#856](https://github.com/gregorio-project/gregorio/issues/856) for details.
- The shape of the fused oriscus at ambitus one in the greciliae font 
has been tweaked to form a nicer connection (see 
[#1079](https://github.com/gregorio-project/gregorio/issues/1079)).
- Syllables are now rewritten to improve ligature rendering.  This may 
be disabled by issuing `\gresetsyllablerewriting{off}`.  See GregorioRef 
for details (for the change request, see 
[#1098](https://github.com/gregorio-project/gregorio/issues/1098)).
- Default mode style for PlainTeX no longer tries to invoke small caps 
since they are not defined by default.
- Italic, bold, underlined, small capital, teletype, and colored styles 
now span multiple syllables.  Gregorio will also more consistently raise 
errors when styles are improperly started or ended.  See 
[UPGRADE.md](UPGRADE.md) and 
[#1121](https://github.com/gregorio-project/gregorio/issues/1121) for 
details.



--
✝
Br. Samuel, OSB
St. Anselm’s Abbey
Washington, DC
(R. Padraic Springuel)

PAX ☧ ΧΡΙΣΤΟΣ

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Re: [Gregorio-users] 答复: Gabc syntax for "markers"

[Henry So Jr.]

On Tuesday, 31 May 2016 at 08:02:59 am +0200, CieMaKat . wrote:
> My bad. Of course I meant . IMHO both should be valid as  and
>  are valid in HTML5 (see: http://stackoverflow.com/a/1946452)

That shouldn't be too difficult.  Thus, if we go that route (which
appears to be the most preferable so far--5 for, 3 against, counting the
developers), we would accept ,  (with optional spaces
before the slash), and reject .

Henry

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Re: [Gregorio-users] Gabc syntax for "markers"

[Pierre Couderc]

I like the  XML-like way.

On 05/30/2016 02:37 PM, Henry So Jr. wrote:

Dear all,

The developers are working on a couple of features that will require
"markers" to be placed in syllable text.

For context, see

https://github.com/gregorio-project/gregorio/issues/1029

and

https://github.com/gregorio-project/gregorio/issues/931.

These two features will require some kind of "marker" to be placed in
gabc, but unlike the current tags (like ...), these "markers"
don't need to (and should not) be closed.

The developers are at an impasse as to the best notation for this.
There are three options:

-  (with no (), which may confuse people used to XML)
-  (this is XML-like, but may be hard to remember)
- $marker$ (which makes it obvious this is different, but is different)

Does anyone on the list have an opinion on which form they find least
confusing/difficult-to-use?

Thanks,
Henry

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[Gregorio-users] 答复: 答复: Gabc syntax for "markers"

[Zhang Michael]

Thinking another way around, why not use some generic syntax like 
setting_1[,setting_2[,...setting_n]] instead of creating new 
markups every time we have a new request, while keep the markup consistent.

So the "clear" signal (and the alike in the future) can be marked up as: 
clear. A little lengthy though but I'm not an expert of naming 
:).

Thanks,
Michael


发件人: Henry T. So Jr. 
发送时间: 2016年5月31日 1:33
收件人: Zhang Michael; gregorio-users@gna.org
主题: Re: 答复: [Gregorio-users] Gabc syntax for "markers"

 is actually invalid, and must be rejected as an error because
tolerating it imparts a false meaning to a file that has it.  This is the
exact reason using an entirely different syntax is on the table, so that
people are not tempted to do invalid things like that.

Henry


On May 30, 2016 12:55:02 PM Zhang Michael  wrote:

> I'm in favor of option 1  except that I think  can be
> tolerated as kind of "retrograded" but valid syntax, and it is simply
> ignored by the parser.
>
> Thanks,
> Michael
>
> 
> 发件人: Gregorio-users  代表 Henry So Jr.
> 
> 发送时间: 2016年5月30日 20:37
> 收件人: gregorio-users@gna.org
> 主题: [Gregorio-users] Gabc syntax for "markers"
>
> Dear all,
>
> The developers are working on a couple of features that will require
> "markers" to be placed in syllable text.
>
> For context, see
>
> https://github.com/gregorio-project/gregorio/issues/1029
>
> and
>
> https://github.com/gregorio-project/gregorio/issues/931.
>
> These two features will require some kind of "marker" to be placed in
> gabc, but unlike the current tags (like ...), these "markers"
> don't need to (and should not) be closed.
>
> The developers are at an impasse as to the best notation for this.
> There are three options:
>
> -  (with no (), which may confuse people used to XML)
> -  (this is XML-like, but may be hard to remember)
> - $marker$ (which makes it obvious this is different, but is different)
>
> Does anyone on the list have an opinion on which form they find least
> confusing/difficult-to-use?
>
> Thanks,
> Henry
>
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Re: [Gregorio-users] 答复: Gabc syntax for "markers"

[CieMaKat .]

My bad. Of course I meant . IMHO both should be valid as  and
 are valid in HTML5 (see: http://stackoverflow.com/a/1946452)


2016-05-31 0:34 GMT+02:00 Henry T. So Jr. :

>  in this context is incorrect syntax, so if we go that route,
> this will be flagged as an error.
>
> Henry
>
> On May 30, 2016 4:45:01 PM "CieMaKat ."  wrote:
>
>> How much more work would it take to make both  and 
>> valid?
>>
>> 2016-05-30 21:26 GMT+02:00 Jakub Jelinek :
>>
>>> On Mon, May 30, 2016 at 09:21:19PM +0200, Abbazia Mater Ecclesiae wrote:
>>> > I agree with Henry: I prefer the new $...$ syntax.
>>>
>>> What I don't like on the $ choice is that it makes another character
>>> special, one that also has special meaning in TeX (e.g. for math stuff)
>>> and/or could be (sure, very rarely) be used somewhere in the syllable.
>>> Keeping the number of special characters that need quoting to a minimum
>>> is
>>> IMHO worthwhile.
>>>
>>> Jakub
>>>
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>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> *M.Ciesiółka*
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>


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