Re: [h-cost] More black ruffs?
Message: 1 Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2009 12:08:06 -0800 (PST) From: mlysett mlys...@yahoo.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] More black ruffs? To: h-costume@mail.indra.com Message-ID: 189357.56892...@web53102.mail.re2.yahoo.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I just happened to borrow Strong's English Icon, so I thumbed through it looking for black ruffs. There aren't any all-black ruffs, but there are a few edged in black and a few more that are heavily embroidered with blackwork. I could only find three online: http://www.elizabethan-portraits.com/ThomasHoward1.jpg http://www.elizabethan-portraits.com/FrancisSidney.jpg http://www.uvm.edu/~hag/sca/tudor/blackmary.jpg If you'd like more pictures, email me privately and I'll see if I can get them scanned. Margaret Roe Any call on what the thingy on the floor by the feet of Francis Sidney is? It almost looks like a shield, except it is covered in the same fabric as her gown and kirtle, And lined with fur. Claire ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] More black ruffs?
I am not sure if this is what you are looking for but in gold http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Elizabeth_I_c_1570.jpg Trim of gold http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:MargaretAudley.jpg I thought I had seen one painting with black lace ruff but I can't seem to recall the country. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] More black ruffs?
In a message dated 1/8/2009 3:00:32 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, otsi...@socket.net writes: I thought I had seen one painting with black lace ruff but I can't seem to recall the country. ** I've seen a black ruff somewhere too. But I'm thinking it was a theatrical character like a Comedia characterand later than when ruffs were fashionable. It seems likely SOMEONE wore an all black ruff. Sounds like something they'd embrace on the Iberian peninsula but since ruffs evolve from the chemise or shirt, I would surmise it would be a late development when the ruff had become a complete entity in and of itself (rather than being thought of as just an extension of a chemise) But I'm guessing here. **A Good Credit Score is 700 or Above. See yours in just 2 easy steps! (http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/10075x1215047751x1200957972/aol?redir=http://www.freecreditreport.com/pm/default.aspx?sc=668072%26hmpgID=62%26bcd=De cemailfooterNO62) ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] More black ruffs?
I just happened to borrow Strong's English Icon, so I thumbed through it looking for black ruffs. There aren't any all-black ruffs, but there are a few edged in black and a few more that are heavily embroidered with blackwork. I could only find three online: http://www.elizabethan-portraits.com/ThomasHoward1.jpg http://www.elizabethan-portraits.com/FrancisSidney.jpg http://www.uvm.edu/~hag/sca/tudor/blackmary.jpg If you'd like more pictures, email me privately and I'll see if I can get them scanned. Margaret Roe ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] More black ruffs?
Van Dyck painted silver ruffs on noblewomen from Genoa. Not black but interesting. Also, in one the neck ruff and the wrist ruffs are a different color. Monica -Original Message- From: h-costume-boun...@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-boun...@indra.com]on Behalf Of mlysett Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2009 3:08 PM To: h-costume@mail.indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] More black ruffs? I just happened to borrow Strong's English Icon, so I thumbed through it looking for black ruffs. There aren't any all-black ruffs, but there are a few edged in black and a few more that are heavily embroidered with blackwork. I could only find three online: http://www.elizabethan-portraits.com/ThomasHoward1.jpg http://www.elizabethan-portraits.com/FrancisSidney.jpg http://www.uvm.edu/~hag/sca/tudor/blackmary.jpg If you'd like more pictures, email me privately and I'll see if I can get them scanned. Margaret Roe ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] More black ruffs?
At 20:08 08/01/2009, you wrote: I just happened to borrow Strong's English Icon, so I thumbed through it looking for black ruffs. There aren't any all-black ruffs, but there are a few edged in black and a few more that are heavily embroidered with blackwork. I could only find three online: http://www.elizabethan-portraits.com/ThomasHoward1.jpg http://www.elizabethan-portraits.com/FrancisSidney.jpg http://www.uvm.edu/~hag/sca/tudor/blackmary.jpg If you'd like more pictures, email me privately and I'll see if I can get them scanned. Margaret Roe Just for information, I remember Janet Arnold thinking that the Frances Sydney painting was in fact Queen Elizabeth, citing the chair of state in the background of the painting. Suzi ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] More black ruffs?
Thank you Margaret - if the other pictures are also just edged then these are fine. I am going to pull my hair out...I know I've seen at least one - but where? Strong's book is so great - I used to have access to a copy - but have to get it through ILL - pain in the butt these days - just can't keep it long enough! Sg Date: Thu, 8 Jan 2009 12:08:06 -0800 From: mlys...@yahoo.com To: h-costume@mail.indra.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] More black ruffs? I just happened to borrow Strong's English Icon, so I thumbed through it looking for black ruffs. There aren't any all-black ruffs, but there are a few edged in black and a few more that are heavily embroidered with blackwork. I could only find three online: http://www.elizabethan-portraits.com/ThomasHoward1.jpg http://www.elizabethan-portraits.com/FrancisSidney.jpg http://www.uvm.edu/~hag/sca/tudor/blackmary.jpg If you'd like more pictures, email me privately and I'll see if I can get them scanned. Margaret Roe ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] More black ruffs?
I was almost sure I had seen a discussion on this before, but am unable to find it in the archives of either list. I have scanned QEW but not seen anything...so I figured I'd ask you. I am looking for pictorial or inventory evidence of black ruffs -black lace would be nice. 1500~1600. I found this quote from http://www.thelacemuseum.org/education/lacetypes.html The portrait of Anne of Denmark shows delicate Flemish lace in considerable detail1. A painting of Eleanor of Austria (1498 – 1558) by Thomas de Leu shows a tight bodice edged with a border of very simple black bobbin lace,2 and one painted by Hilliard in 1575 shows Queen Elizabeth wearing a shift edged in black needle lace to match her ruff. Ruffs made of pulled metal of silver and gold were fashionable in this period but a heavy black needle lace was often used instead. I am not sure if these are the pictures: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Anne_of_Denmark_Gheeraerts.jpg http://www.rci.rutgers.edu/~buckley/elizabeth1.jpg Thanks, Sg ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] More black ruffs?
Sorry, I'm confused. Are you looking for entire ruffs that are black. Made from black fabric? Or are you looking for a ruff (colored or white) with black edging? The edging would seem to be not uncommon, I just have never seen portraits of anyone wearing a black ruff for the basis. What an interesting find if you do! Please be sure and share. Regina -Original Message- From: h-costume-boun...@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-boun...@indra.com]on Behalf Of Saragrace Knauf Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 7:45 PM To: therenaissancetai...@yahoogroups.com; h-cost...@indra.com Subject: [h-cost] More black ruffs? I was almost sure I had seen a discussion on this before, but am unable to find it in the archives of either list. I have scanned QEW but not seen anything...so I figured I'd ask you. I am looking for pictorial or inventory evidence of black ruffs -black lace would be nice. 1500~1600. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] More black ruffs?
Actually any of the below. I have pictures of black lace trim on rebattos - on cuffs too. I have pictures of black and saffron colored lace (a little later) but it is only on a neckline border and cuffs. I am pretty sure I have seen a whole black ruff - I just can't find it! Sg From: wan...@hevanet.com To: h-cost...@indra.com Date: Wed, 7 Jan 2009 20:11:52 -0800 Subject: Re: [h-cost] More black ruffs? Sorry, I'm confused. Are you looking for entire ruffs that are black. Made from black fabric? Or are you looking for a ruff (colored or white) with black edging? The edging would seem to be not uncommon, I just have never seen portraits of anyone wearing a black ruff for the basis. What an interesting find if you do! Please be sure and share. Regina -Original Message- From: h-costume-boun...@indra.com [mailto:h-costume-boun...@indra.com]on Behalf Of Saragrace Knauf Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 7:45 PM To: therenaissancetai...@yahoogroups.com; h-cost...@indra.com Subject: [h-cost] More black ruffs? I was almost sure I had seen a discussion on this before, but am unable to find it in the archives of either list. I have scanned QEW but not seen anything...so I figured I'd ask you. I am looking for pictorial or inventory evidence of black ruffs -black lace would be nice. 1500~1600. ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
