Re: Datasets with KEYs

2008-08-15 Thread Rick Arellanes 
Perhaps you can do this with Enterprise PL/I REGIONAL(1) data sets. They are 
non-VSAM data sets with keys.

http://publibfp.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr/BOOKS/ibm3pg60/2.4?
DT=20071108121521

Rick

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Re: Datasets with KEYs

2008-08-10 Thread Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.) 
In <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, on 08/08/2008
   at 04:04 PM, Steve Comstock <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:

>Ah, you're right. There's BPAM,

That too, but I was refering to explicit sequential reading of a data set
with KEYLEN=8, rather than the I/O done by BLDL and STOW.

FWIW, I could have done the job just as easily without reading the keys.

>I don't think BDAM is inefficient.

Unblocked is usually inefficient.

>Again, it depends on what he is trying to accomplish.

Certainly, and he still hasn't said.
 
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Re: Datasets with KEYs

2008-08-08 Thread Steve Comstock 

Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.) wrote:

In <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, on 08/06/2008
   at 09:55 AM, Steve Comstock <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:


Only supported access method for non-VSAM data sets with keys is BDAM,


When did that change?


Ah, you're right. There's BPAM, and maybe that would solve
the OP's requirement. Don't know.




Bill: why do you want to do it? It's horribly inefficient.
 


I don't think BDAM is inefficient. Again, it depends on what
he is trying to accomplish.



Kind regards,

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Re: Datasets with KEYs

2008-08-08 Thread Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.) 
In <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, on 08/06/2008
   at 09:55 AM, Steve Comstock <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:

>Only supported access method for non-VSAM data sets with keys is BDAM,

When did that change?

Bill: why do you want to do it? It's horribly inefficient.
 
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Re: Datasets with KEYs

2008-08-06 Thread Rick Fochtman 

-
I need to create and populate a NON-VSAM Dataset that contains KEYS.

Is there an IBM utility I can use to do this?

If you could supply a bit more background/detail information, we might 
be able to help you make a better decision.


Why NON-VSAM ?? Nearly all high-level programming languages now support 
VSAM reasonably well.


If you're willing to write in Assembler, you might consider BDAM. 
Loading it is fairly straightforward but usage could present problems to 
high-level languages. We realy need to understanding the underlying 
needs to make a valid and usable recommendation.


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Re: Datasets with KEYs

2008-08-06 Thread Rick Fochtman 
NO. BDAM; at least it's got SOME form of support, whereas ISAM has been 
dead for about 25 years.

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Tony B. wrote:


ISAM.



-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
Of William Hecox
Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2008 10:27 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
Subject: Datasets with KEYs

Hi,

I need to create and populate a NON-VSAM Dataset that contains KEYS.

Is there an IBM utility I can use to do this?

Bill 


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Re: Datasets with KEYs

2008-08-06 Thread R.S. 
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List 
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of William Hecox

Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2008 10:27 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
Subject: Datasets with KEYs

Hi,

I need to create and populate a NON-VSAM Dataset that contains KEYS.

Is there an IBM utility I can use to do this?


No one asked, so I dare:
WHY?
Why do you need it?
What do you want to do?
Having no-VSAM dataset with keys is definitely not a business goal.

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Re: Datasets with KEYs

2008-08-06 Thread (IBM Mainframe Discussion List) 
 
 
In a message dated 8/6/2008 10:27:11 A.M. Central Daylight Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
>I need to create and populate a NON-VSAM Dataset that contains  KEYS.
 
Thinking about your query some more made me realize you didn't give us  
enough technical specifications to help you very much.  E.g., what do you  mean 
by 
"populate"?  What do you mean by "contains" keys?  Namely,  will the data set 
be blocked or unblocked?  If unblocked, you might even be  able to use 
IEBGENER and specify the key location and offset through JCL.   If blocked, 
then what 
does the block's key represent - the lowest key of any  record in the block, 
the highest key of any record in the block, or something  else?
 
Must all the keys written onto the tracks be in ascending key sequence,  
descending, or is random OK?  What will happen if there are two blocks  
somewhere 
in the data set with the same key?
 
How will this data set be accessed after its creation?  With what  software 
and/or access method?  What will said accessing programs do if a  key is not 
found?  What happens if a block is found with no key on the  track?  How long 
will this data set exist?  How do you plan to back it  up and restore it if 
necessary?  Will it be automatically managed by some  kind of archival system?
 
I don't expect answers to all of these, but you definitely need to think  
about these issues.
 
Bill  Fairchild
Rocket Software





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Re: Datasets with KEYs

2008-08-06 Thread McKown, John 
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List 
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of William Hecox
> Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2008 10:27 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
> Subject: Datasets with KEYs
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I need to create and populate a NON-VSAM Dataset that contains KEYS.
> 
> Is there an IBM utility I can use to do this?
> 
> Bill 

IMS? ISAM? BDAM? I'd say DB2 except that it uses VSAM as its backstore.

Perhaps a bit more information would help. Why no VSAM? It ain't groovy,
but it don't stink neither.

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Re: Datasets with KEYs

2008-08-06 Thread Tony B. 
Having suggested ISAM, tongue in cheek, I should submit a serious proposal.
Depending on the needs of your resulting application (maybe it's all batch
??) , any sequential disk file can have "keys" in a logical sense if you can
exploit the features of DF/SORT and its SPLICE capability. 

Is there a possibility to create VSAM RRDS ?

   

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
Of Steve Comstock
Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2008 10:56 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Datasets with KEYs

William Hecox wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> I need to create and populate a NON-VSAM Dataset that contains KEYS.
> 
> Is there an IBM utility I can use to do this?
> 
> Bill
> 

Only supported access method for non-VSAM data sets with keys
is BDAM, and you have to write your own code.



Kind regards,

-Steve Comstock
The Trainer's Friend, Inc.

303-393-8716
http://www.trainersfriend.com

   z/OS Application development made easier
 * Our classes include
+ How things work
+ Programming examples with realistic applications
+ Starter / skeleton code
+ Complete working programs
+ Useful utilities and subroutines
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==> application developer toolkits. Sample code in four<==
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Re: Datasets with KEYs - resend w/ correct reply-to

2008-08-06 Thread Steve Comstock 

William Hecox wrote:

Hi,

I need to create and populate a NON-VSAM Dataset that contains KEYS.

Is there an IBM utility I can use to do this?

Bill 


Only supported access method for non-VSAM data sets with keys
is BDAM, and you have to write your own code.

Although Eric Spencer just replied with a couple of interesting
alternatives.

Still, I think you're out of luck for a utility.

Kind regards,

-Steve Comstock
The Trainer's Friend, Inc.

303-393-8716
http://www.trainersfriend.com

  z/OS Application development made easier
* Our classes include
   + How things work
   + Programming examples with realistic applications
   + Starter / skeleton code
   + Complete working programs
   + Useful utilities and subroutines
   + Tips and techniques

==> Check out the Trainer's Friend Store to purchase z/OS  <==
==> application developer toolkits. Sample code in four<==
==> programming languages, JCL to Assemble or compile, <==
==> bind and test. <==
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Re: Datasets with KEYs

2008-08-06 Thread Steve Comstock 

William Hecox wrote:

Hi,

I need to create and populate a NON-VSAM Dataset that contains KEYS.

Is there an IBM utility I can use to do this?

Bill 



Only supported access method for non-VSAM data sets with keys
is BDAM, and you have to write your own code.



Kind regards,

-Steve Comstock
The Trainer's Friend, Inc.

303-393-8716
http://www.trainersfriend.com

  z/OS Application development made easier
* Our classes include
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   + Programming examples with realistic applications
   + Starter / skeleton code
   + Complete working programs
   + Useful utilities and subroutines
   + Tips and techniques

==> Check out the Trainer's Friend Store to purchase z/OS  <==
==> application developer toolkits. Sample code in four<==
==> programming languages, JCL to Assemble or compile, <==
==> bind and test. <==
==>   http://www.trainersfriend.com/TTFStore/index.html<==

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Re: Datasets with KEYs

2008-08-06 Thread Eric Spencer 
Depending on what you are trying to achieve there may be a couple of
options. 

1. ISPF tables
2. There is a standard API available through C/C++ 
Look at dbm_* api - (dbm_open,dbm_store,dbm_firstkey, etc) it implements
"keyed" access in flat files. 


Eric 

> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of (IBM Mainframe Discussion List)
> Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2008 10:46 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Datasets with KEYs
> 
> 
> 
> 
> In a message dated 8/6/2008 10:36:19 A.M. Central Daylight Time,
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
> >>ISAM.
> 
> >-Original Message-
> >From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf
> >Of William Hecox
> >Sent:  Wednesday, August 06, 2008 10:27 AM
> >To:  IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
> >Subject: Datasets with KEYs
> >Hi,
> >I need to create and populate a NON-VSAM Dataset that contains  KEYS.
> >Is there an IBM utility I can use to do this?
> >Bill
> 
> ISAM is not an IBM utility.  It is an access method which is about to
> become
> seriously unsupported by IBM.  I suspect you will have to write your
own
> utility whose design is similar to that of IEBGENER; i.e., read one
> logical
> record using QSAM from the input file, add that record to the output
> buffer;
> repeat until the output buffer is full, then write it to the output
file
> using
> BDAM (q.v.).  Alas, there is no QDAM, so you have to do the blocking
on
> the
> output side yourself.
> 
> If ISAM were to continue to be supported, you could write the logical
> record
> to the output file using QISAM and your one-time special-purpose
utility
> program would be simpler.  But you will still need to write the
utility
> program
> yourself.  Or find it on the CBT, maybe.
> 
> Bill  Fairchild
> Rocket Software
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> **Looking for a car that's sporty, fun and fits in your
> budget?
> Read reviews on AOL Autos.
> (http://autos.aol.com/cars-BMW-128-2008/expert-
> review?ncid=aolaut000517 )
> 
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Re: Datasets with KEYs

2008-08-06 Thread (IBM Mainframe Discussion List) 
 
 
In a message dated 8/6/2008 10:36:19 A.M. Central Daylight Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
>>ISAM.
 
>-Original Message-
>From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
>Of William Hecox
>Sent:  Wednesday, August 06, 2008 10:27 AM
>To:  IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
>Subject: Datasets with KEYs
>Hi,
>I need to create and populate a NON-VSAM Dataset that contains  KEYS.
>Is there an IBM utility I can use to do this?
>Bill
 
ISAM is not an IBM utility.  It is an access method which is about to  become 
seriously unsupported by IBM.  I suspect you will have to write your  own 
utility whose design is similar to that of IEBGENER; i.e., read one logical  
record using QSAM from the input file, add that record to the output buffer;  
repeat until the output buffer is full, then write it to the output file using  
BDAM (q.v.).  Alas, there is no QDAM, so you have to do the blocking on the  
output side yourself.
 
If ISAM were to continue to be supported, you could write the logical  record 
to the output file using QISAM and your one-time special-purpose utility  
program would be simpler.  But you will still need to write the utility  
program 
yourself.  Or find it on the CBT, maybe.
 
Bill  Fairchild
Rocket Software





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Re: Datasets with KEYs

2008-08-06 Thread Eric Spencer 
Not anymore... 

IBM plans to take the following actions effective with z/OS V1.7: 

Support for ISAM data sets will be withdrawn. When this support is
withdrawn, you will no longer be able to process ISAM data sets other
than to delete them. The ISAM Compatibility Interface will remain
available to help you migrate applications to VSAM without application
changes.

Eric Spencer
Neon Enterprise Software Inc. 

> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of Tony B.
> Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2008 10:36 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: Datasets with KEYs
> 
> ISAM.
> 
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf
> Of William Hecox
> Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2008 10:27 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
> Subject: Datasets with KEYs
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I need to create and populate a NON-VSAM Dataset that contains KEYS.
> 
> Is there an IBM utility I can use to do this?
> 
> Bill
> 
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Re: Datasets with KEYs

2008-08-06 Thread Tony B. 
ISAM.

 

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
Of William Hecox
Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2008 10:27 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
Subject: Datasets with KEYs

Hi,

I need to create and populate a NON-VSAM Dataset that contains KEYS.

Is there an IBM utility I can use to do this?

Bill 

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Datasets with KEYs

2008-08-06 Thread William Hecox 
Hi,

I need to create and populate a NON-VSAM Dataset that contains KEYS.

Is there an IBM utility I can use to do this?

Bill

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