date:20211220


On 21/12/21 11:36 am, David Crayford wrote:
Not only do they support granular ENQs and even better in our case 
ENQs they are rip-roaring  fast.



I meant to say "in our case no ENQs"...

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Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS


On 21/12/21 10:58 am, Paul Gilmartin wrote:

*New file system support to access z/OS data sets*

IBM plans to provide a new file system type that will render traditional
z/OS data sets accessible by the z/OS UNIX name space. This will enable
z/OS UNIX applications, tools, and utilities transparent access to data
in these data sets in a secure and consistent manner.


Does this imply support for open() and thereby shell redirection?

How does this interact with SYSDSN ENQ?

How does this interact with ENQ SPFEDIT,rname,E,52,SYSTEMS?

How does this interact with ENQ SPFEDIT,rname,E,12,SYSTEMS?

What about the converse?  I've long wished for support for UNIX
directoriies in STEPLIB, SYSEXEC, ...


Don't know. I have access to IBMs Slack channel so I might ask around.




It has long been an irritant that "cp source //pds(member) issues ENQ EXC
on the entire target data set.  Will this be mitigated?  (I suspect this is a
limitation of the C/C++ RTL.)


I don't use "cp" for data sets. I switched to Dovetails awesome 
getpds/putpds utilities. Not only do they support granular ENQs and even 
better in our case ENQs they are rip-roaring  fast.





A problem was reported here a few weeks ago that:
 //STEP1  EXEC  PGM=BPXBATCH,PARM='pax -wf "//''dat.set'"''
 //STEP3  EXEC  PGM=AMATERSE
 //SYSUT1  DD  DISP=SHR,DSN=data.set
failed on an ENQ on "data.set".  Will this be mitigated?


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Re: How to use dfsort to filter keywords that aren't fixed position

2021-12-20 Thread Jason Cai

Thanks for Kolusu and Massimo's help
 
 We used the following JCL to filter 'CHECK' and 'ERROR' keywords.
It is fine.


Is there an easy way to filter many keywords if we have many keywords? 

For example: Can we put these keywords in a dataset?

Thanks a  lot!

Jason Cai
---

OPTION VLSCMP 
INREC IFTHEN=(WHEN=GROUP,   
BEGIN=(21,5,CH,GT,C' '),  $ IF DATE IS > ' '  
PUSH=(140:ID=9))
SORT FIELDS=COPY
OUTFIL FNAMES=SORTOUT 
OUTFIL FNAMES=CHECK,INCLUDE=(1,137,SS,EQ,C'CHECK')   
OUTFIL FNAMES=ERROR,INCLUDE=(1,137,SS,EQ,C'ERROR')   

copy ERROR and CHECK output to ERRORA

//ST005  EXEC PGM=SORT  
//SYSOUT  DD  SYSOUT=*  
//ERROR  DD DSN=IBMUSER.LOG.ERRORA,DISP=SHR
//ALL   DD DSN=IBMUSER.LOG.ALL,DISP=SHR  
//SORTOUT DD DSN=IBMUSER.LOG.OK,  
// DISP=(,CATLG),  
// SPACE=(TRK,(300,300))   
//SYSIN   DD  *  
 JOINKEYS F1=ERROR,FIELDS=(140,9,A),SORTED 
 JOINKEYS F2=ALL,FIELDS=(140,9,A),SORTED  
 REFORMAT FIELDS=(F2:1,137,F2:140,9)
 SORT FIELDS=COPY  
/*  

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Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS

2021-12-20 Thread CM Poncelet

CTC's SPF/PC V4.0.7 could handle/edit/display/etc. hex data - but they
refuse to resurrect and republish their SPF/PC.
 
As for recovering from unwanted updates, try backing up your system
incrementally and before accepting any updates. I still use Norton's
Ghost V14 for that (i.e. for local backups.) Symantec wishes I did not
and instead used their "cloud" for that. They must be joking . 
 

 


On 20/12/2021 17:50, Bob Bridges wrote:
> Not the same thing, but I pretty much stopped accepting updates for software 
> I like and trust a few years ago.  I'd gone out looking for some text editor 
> that would display in hex when needed, and hit upon Notepad++, which 
> apparently is pretty popular.  Months later, when an update was offered, I 
> accepted without even thinking about it; why not?
>
> Because with the update they discontinued the hex feature, that's why.  I 
> found out too late, and couldn't figure out a way to regress.  I still use 
> Notepad++ from time to time, but it still rankles.  And whenever I'm offered 
> an update nowadays, if it's an app I care about I always decline.  Who knows 
> what they'll do to it?
>
> Speaking of that, can anyone suggest a good editor that handles hex display 
> on demand?  I've never tried ISPF-PC; maybe I should.
>
> ---
> Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313
>
> /* Whatever else is true, it is emphatically not true that the ideas of Jesus 
> of Nazareth were suitable to his time, but are no longer suitable to our 
> time.  Exactly how suitable they were to his time is perhaps suggested in the 
> end of his story.  -G K Chesterton */
>
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
> Tom Brennan
> Sent: Monday, December 20, 2021 11:34
>
> My Windows html/php/etc editor "Dreamweaver" from 2004 still works on Win 
> 10, but suddenly locked up at startup last week.  I assumed it was due to 
> quiet updates to Win 10 and that old unsupported code would never work again. 
> I was staring blankly into space saying, Oh no... oh no...
>
> Then I figured out it was just stuck waiting for Samba on a Raspberry Pi that 
> had died overnight.  Whew!
>
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> .
>

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Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS

On Tue, 21 Dec 2021 09:57:54 +0800, David Crayford wrote:
>...
>*New file system support to access z/OS data sets*
>
>IBM plans to provide a new file system type that will render traditional
>z/OS data sets accessible by the z/OS UNIX name space. This will enable
>z/OS UNIX applications, tools, and utilities transparent access to data
>in these data sets in a secure and consistent manner.
>
Does this imply support for open() and thereby shell redirection?

How does this interact with SYSDSN ENQ?

How does this interact with ENQ SPFEDIT,rname,E,52,SYSTEMS?

How does this interact with ENQ SPFEDIT,rname,E,12,SYSTEMS?

What about the converse?  I've long wished for support for UNIX
directoriies in STEPLIB, SYSEXEC, ...

It has long been an irritant that "cp source //pds(member) issues ENQ EXC
on the entire target data set.  Will this be mitigated?  (I suspect this is a
limitation of the C/C++ RTL.)

A problem was reported here a few weeks ago that:
//STEP1  EXEC  PGM=BPXBATCH,PARM='pax -wf "//''dat.set'"''
//STEP3  EXEC  PGM=AMATERSE
//SYSUT1  DD  DISP=SHR,DSN=data.set
failed on an ENQ on "data.set".  Will this be mitigated?

-- gil

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Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS


On 21/12/21 3:50 am, Seymour J Metz wrote:

Personally, I would like for IBM to fully support all of the popular languages 
in TSO, including languages that I don't particularly like.

Is there a reason that you prefer Python to, e.g., Ruby?


I can't speak for Kirk but to me a no-brainer. Ruby peaked years ago 
when the Ruby on Rails framework was popular. RoR fell off a cliff along 
with Ruby. IMO, it's a poor programming language. It borrows all the bad 
bits from Perl such as ambiguous syntax.


https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&q=%2Fm%2F06ff5

Python was adopted and handsomely funded by Google who employed Guido 
Van Rossum to work full time on Python tools. Python is the dominant 
language for ML and has numerous high performance libraries for math and 
has a massive standard library.


https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&q=%2Fm%2F06ff5





--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of 
Kirk Wolf [k...@dovetail.com]
Sent: Monday, December 20, 2021 2:00 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS

I'm shocked that most ibm-mainers are not convinced by this paper :-)

More seriously, I would add a couple of points:

- Whether or not you like Python or think that it is weak tea compared to REXX, 
you should support getting a good Python implementation on z/OS.Our 
favorite platform will be more attractive if it runs popular languages - and 
Python is king these days.

- Python isn't perfect, but it is seriously nice.  This judgement is based on 
the amazing software that I have seen written in it.  Try one example:  Meld is 
a terrific FOSS visual diff / merge tool that is multi-platform and written in 
Python.  Try it out and then look at the source code.  
https://secure-web.cisco.com/1-DQnXfwpC26ohfHFP3EZHYaim8-tH0agBazkqe2qFbpOzEWMtVJvlurwUg8bbFjwm_BCTOD0wZqh4J4KtMrxcaficvtGyQsBlV7MNk0t3k83HHCO8R2_uXlQPPr-jsnoaPUmbf3SbnujEmDNwRiF267Sv3PAHbpnnaOnVcava3-qAKbtzUmwWzV_UX5KEF49tm4BMYe_ABsztOLPbPoLGp8IFcBKOq5H15sCgIlPyoYFOKdrTwoQxe4CPLvzXNuxRbsqD6KP7C8KEY_c7dF-CnihNwjymVFFQ0i6mrRvntE6rut9KtCKLfK7QeU9q0NY4nuxm-rPuK2WwEXfa5O2YR5X6Qqf0g3jOfAp_TsyW5sHZ_YmDpxaRs-E9fXp5FxRDU4MMu4j07ls5M5Igg7AY8q1h1BWP07uC0Ka733L52OuWvq9d0NVjeruWZsSRLMWu_wLCmXny5ACuavBe4usiQ/https%3A%2F%2Fmeldmerge.org%2F

- I agree that Python on z/OS could use some native libraries to do z/OS 
interfaces like REXX.


Kirk Wolf
Dovetailed Technologies
http://secure-web.cisco.com/1boa1zjXJx_MkxhR1wjVZUxNqcSXHlJo-qLnoubfwzecIhD0urqW8Xf45pV6K1BGMuWHuEBraIZbAX1jEH-FTv5wNoLAMvu1yq_7IkWcBXPE03XjbzWZqFzCDn8YYyNAxbnY0wA0EfVvsrRmzUW2Kv19GCAPZNeJpUWLNkvsa-eQp-3xi6efmSkxc684ciJ5ugDYu3gj78saGlZL4Oo103Tnm8UDctG2qqyeIwdykrJ0HoZfNxz7qAaTtjHwd-jwfh4Cy8Gn3oc3mR7joqjsMiYPHlZMAr8bZwX0Bc-EzTr3zevCoVHh3jpEHd09ilmXYYhmObZ3hfEujNiUBreaBD34slwxpnbOOfQhw-U9AiZF9UaQZtJwIf-a_wp85wmtzasaM4a63VIa1_EsMYbfaPVPXDLv_9DXmxhVfCBXMO0fMQe-wHpdCQKpzDjkiEcRG/http%3A%2F%2Fdovetail.com

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Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS

Wow, meldmerge is awesome. It has Github integrations and syntax
highlighting.

There is a difference between IBMs Python port and Rockets. Rocket have
patched Python to use fopen() so it supports the MVS file system. There
are also other MVS libraries such as a load module call API, IDCAMS,
BPXWDYN etc. IBMs port will of course become dominant so as Matt said
get those RFEs in.

BTW, I noticed in the z/OS 2.5 announcement IBM made the following
statement of direction. This will be a game changer. At Rocket we have
moved a lot of development over to the file system so we can use Git and
DevOps tools. This new file system will enable customers to use tools
like Git without having to migrate their code. For COBOL that's pretty
much a must have.

https://www.ibm.com/common/ssi/ShowDoc.wss?docURL=/common/ssi/rep_ca/0/897/ENUS221-260/index.html&lang=en

*New file system support to access z/OS data sets*

IBM plans to provide a new file system type that will render traditional
z/OS data sets accessible by the z/OS UNIX name space. This will enable
z/OS UNIX applications, tools, and utilities transparent access to data
in these data sets in a secure and consistent manner.

On 21/12/21 3:00 am, Kirk Wolf wrote:

I'm shocked that most ibm-mainers are not convinced by this paper :-)

More seriously, I would add a couple of points:

- Whether or not you like Python or think that it is weak tea compared to REXX,
you should support getting a good Python implementation on z/OS.Our
favorite platform will be more attractive if it runs popular languages - and
Python is king these days.

- Python isn't perfect, but it is seriously nice. This judgement is based on
the amazing software that I have seen written in it. Try one example: Meld is
a terrific FOSS visual diff / merge tool that is multi-platform and written in
Python. Try it out and then look at the source code. https://meldmerge.org/

- I agree that Python on z/OS could use some native libraries to do z/OS
interfaces like REXX.

Kirk Wolf
Dovetailed Technologies
http://dovetail.com

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Re: The Great Resignation ( inappropriate Trash talk)

2021-12-20 Thread Joel C. Ewing

Trash talking is totally inappropriate to this list and unprofessional. 
Nor is this an appropriate forum for debate and/or quarreling on topics 
that are not even remotely germane to IBM mainframes.   Setting my 
Thunderbird email client to auto-delete any future posts on this topic 
or by the more serious offenders of netiquette.  Darren, if those 
involved persist in wasting the bandwidth of the list, you ought to 
consider whether they should be banned from future list postings.   That 
privilege requires some willingness to observe the conventions of the list.


    JC Ewing

On 12/19/21 19:50, Joe Monk wrote:

I've seen your type before

Joe

On Sun, Dec 19, 2021 at 7:47 PM Bill Johnson <
0047540adefe-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:


LOLOLOLOL, you know nothing about me. You’re not book or street smart.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Sunday, December 19, 2021, 8:36 PM, Joe Monk 
wrote:

Clearly not. Youre book smart, but not street smart.

Joe

On Sun, Dec 19, 2021 at 7:01 PM Bill Johnson <
0047540adefe-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:


I’m not your friend and I doubt you’ve read as much as I have regarding
climate change.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Sunday, December 19, 2021, 7:58 PM, Joe Monk 
wrote:

I've read more than you, my friend. I read it every time I go in the sky.

Joe

On Sun, Dec 19, 2021 at 5:48 PM Bill Johnson <
0047540adefe-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:


Read some climate science.


Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


On Sunday, December 19, 2021, 4:53 PM, Joe Monk 
wrote:

NP. Just some things really stick in my craw. Sorry.

Joe

On Sun, Dec 19, 2021 at 3:36 PM Doug  wrote:


Can we PLEASE move this topic off list?
If you are so inclined, look up Post Permian Mass Extinction and
contemplate it's implications.

In the meantime, can we keep this off IBM-Main?

Doug Fuerst


-- Original Message --
From: "Joe Monk" 
To: IBM-MAIN@listserv.ua.edu
Sent: 19-Dec-21 15:34:56
Subject: Re: The Great Resignation


"And as we are seeing, the baby boomers are much to blame for global
warming, the results we are seeing in fires, floods, polar icecaps

melting,

and yes, the recent record setting tornadoes in Kentucky,

Tennessee, &

other states."

Jeez man, get a grip.

The Earth has had a climate since it was formed. Climate change has

been

going on since day 1. Warming, Cooling, whatever. The climate always

goes

thru cycles. Boomers did not create the energy cycles necessary to

generate

a tornado from the immense energy contained in clouds. Think about

this,

the adiabatic energy release of latent heat as moisture in the air

is

lifted, cools and sinks has a lot to do with it. This motion of

parcels

of

air in the clouds is what creates a tornado. And yes, as I am a

licensed

pilot, with a degree in engineering, and a degree in aviation, I

kinda

have

a clue, having actually studied meteorology.

Joe

On Sat, Dec 18, 2021 at 4:50 PM Bill Johnson <
0047540adefe-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:


  I doubt Jesus said a man unwilling or unable to work shouldn’t

eat.

And,

  I’m not surprised the low wage earners are unwilling to work for

$2.13/hour

  (tipped wage) plus tips. The federal minimum wage hasn’t gone up

in

over a

  decade. If the minimum wage I worked for in 1975 had kept pace

with

  inflation, it would be over $20 an hour now. In most of Europe,

restaurant

  workers make a living wage plus benefits. Tipping is optional.

Plus,

their

  health care is single payer and better/cheaper. Don’t get me

started

on

  their fabulous infrastructure, mass transit, and education

systems.

  Factor in many don’t want to go back to work while a fourth wave

of

covid

  is raging. (Thanks to the GOP and trumpers pushing against public

health)

  Then there are women who can’t afford child care because it eats

up

the

  majority of their wages. Funny that the build back better

legislation

  intended to address that and provide child care help like most of

the

rest

  of the world provides.
  My brother in law made a career out of the restaurant business.

He’s

  making 6 figures now as a regional director but works 70 hour

weeks,

has

  had 2 heart attacks, smokes like a chimney, and will never see

retirement

  from the hamster wheel.
  Younger Americans are not buying into the rat race. Conspicuous
  consumption isn’t their religion. And as we are seeing, the baby

boomers

  are much to blame for global warming, the results we are seeing

in

fires,

  floods, polar icecaps melting, and yes, the recent record setting

tornadoes

  in Kentucky, Tennessee, & other states.
  America is in decline when a two bit reality TV show host, who

lies

  incessantly, has molested 20+ women, cheats on his taxes, and

tried

to

  overturn a free and fair election, can get 35% of the populace to

follow

  him.


  Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone


  On Saturday, December 18, 2021, 5:04 PM, Bob Bridges

Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS

On Mon, 20 Dec 2021 18:17:08 +, Seymour J Metz wrote:

>What interfaces does the client support? I'm pretty sure that, in addition to 
>what you list, there are people happily using
>
>* LISP (not me)
>* oorexx
>* ruby
>* scripting language built in to the terminal simulator
>* shell of some flavor, e.g., C, korn
> 
Oops!  I neglected *sh in my list in an earlier ply.

>Within the constraints of support, it's partly a matter of taste.
>
But how can one interface (e.g.) Bash to an editor, a terminal emulator,
or other utility?  The ISPF Ref. has (too many?) examples for COBOL,
CLIST, ... and too few for REXX ADDRESS ISREDIT.

-- gil

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Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS

Personally, I would like for IBM to fully support all of the popular languages 
in TSO, including languages that I don't particularly like.

Is there a reason that you prefer Python to, e.g., Ruby?


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of 
Kirk Wolf [k...@dovetail.com]
Sent: Monday, December 20, 2021 2:00 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS

I'm shocked that most ibm-mainers are not convinced by this paper :-)

More seriously, I would add a couple of points:

- Whether or not you like Python or think that it is weak tea compared to REXX, 
you should support getting a good Python implementation on z/OS.Our 
favorite platform will be more attractive if it runs popular languages - and 
Python is king these days.

- Python isn't perfect, but it is seriously nice.  This judgement is based on 
the amazing software that I have seen written in it.  Try one example:  Meld is 
a terrific FOSS visual diff / merge tool that is multi-platform and written in 
Python.  Try it out and then look at the source code.  
https://secure-web.cisco.com/1-DQnXfwpC26ohfHFP3EZHYaim8-tH0agBazkqe2qFbpOzEWMtVJvlurwUg8bbFjwm_BCTOD0wZqh4J4KtMrxcaficvtGyQsBlV7MNk0t3k83HHCO8R2_uXlQPPr-jsnoaPUmbf3SbnujEmDNwRiF267Sv3PAHbpnnaOnVcava3-qAKbtzUmwWzV_UX5KEF49tm4BMYe_ABsztOLPbPoLGp8IFcBKOq5H15sCgIlPyoYFOKdrTwoQxe4CPLvzXNuxRbsqD6KP7C8KEY_c7dF-CnihNwjymVFFQ0i6mrRvntE6rut9KtCKLfK7QeU9q0NY4nuxm-rPuK2WwEXfa5O2YR5X6Qqf0g3jOfAp_TsyW5sHZ_YmDpxaRs-E9fXp5FxRDU4MMu4j07ls5M5Igg7AY8q1h1BWP07uC0Ka733L52OuWvq9d0NVjeruWZsSRLMWu_wLCmXny5ACuavBe4usiQ/https%3A%2F%2Fmeldmerge.org%2F

- I agree that Python on z/OS could use some native libraries to do z/OS 
interfaces like REXX.


Kirk Wolf
Dovetailed Technologies
http://secure-web.cisco.com/1boa1zjXJx_MkxhR1wjVZUxNqcSXHlJo-qLnoubfwzecIhD0urqW8Xf45pV6K1BGMuWHuEBraIZbAX1jEH-FTv5wNoLAMvu1yq_7IkWcBXPE03XjbzWZqFzCDn8YYyNAxbnY0wA0EfVvsrRmzUW2Kv19GCAPZNeJpUWLNkvsa-eQp-3xi6efmSkxc684ciJ5ugDYu3gj78saGlZL4Oo103Tnm8UDctG2qqyeIwdykrJ0HoZfNxz7qAaTtjHwd-jwfh4Cy8Gn3oc3mR7joqjsMiYPHlZMAr8bZwX0Bc-EzTr3zevCoVHh3jpEHd09ilmXYYhmObZ3hfEujNiUBreaBD34slwxpnbOOfQhw-U9AiZF9UaQZtJwIf-a_wp85wmtzasaM4a63VIa1_EsMYbfaPVPXDLv_9DXmxhVfCBXMO0fMQe-wHpdCQKpzDjkiEcRG/http%3A%2F%2Fdovetail.com

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Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS

I'm not sure which code page. They dropped TSPF decades ago; otherwise I would 
have been cheerfully buying upgrades.

Yes, I consider back references essential, and I certainly exploit them in TSPF 
and Perl scripts. I don't understand why ISPF regexen are so limited.


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of 
Paul Gilmartin [000433f07816-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu]
Sent: Monday, December 20, 2021 2:32 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS

On Mon, 20 Dec 2021 18:22:49 +, Seymour J Metz wrote:

>You can have my copy of Tritus SPF (TSPF) when they pry it out of my cold dead 
>fingers. EBCDIC, Hex. Really close compatibility to ISPF DM and ISPF/PDF EDIT.
>
Which EBCDIIC?  1047?  500?  037?  037-2?  880?  Others?  All>

> ... The regex syntax is somewhat klunky and minimal, but still quite useful.
>
Wouldn't it be nice if ISPF Edit Change  regex supported "back reference"?


>Has anybody looked at BRIEF? THE?

-- gil

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Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS

On Mon, 20 Dec 2021 18:22:49 +, Seymour J Metz wrote:

>You can have my copy of Tritus SPF (TSPF) when they pry it out of my cold dead 
>fingers. EBCDIC, Hex. Really close compatibility to ISPF DM and ISPF/PDF EDIT. 
>
Which EBCDIIC?  1047?  500?  037?  037-2?  880?  Others?  All>

> ... The regex syntax is somewhat klunky and minimal, but still quite useful.
> 
Wouldn't it be nice if ISPF Edit Change  regex supported "back reference"?


>Has anybody looked at BRIEF? THE?

-- gil

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Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS

2021-12-20 Thread Matt Hogstrom

+1 

I agree on the native libraries support for “ADDRESS …” as a set of modules to 
import.

I think there are the basis for a set of RFEs or other open source development. 
 TSO, …   this would be a more intuitive way to move forward than the approach 
taken in Z Open Automation Utilities.

its definitely going to be something that happens over time.

Matt Hogstrom
e-mail m...@hogstrom.org

“Quantity has a quality all its own.”
— Joseph Stalin

> On Dec 20, 2021, at 2:00 PM, Kirk Wolf  wrote:
> 
> I'm shocked that most ibm-mainers are not convinced by this paper :-)
> 
> More seriously, I would add a couple of points:
> 
> - Whether or not you like Python or think that it is weak tea compared to 
> REXX, you should support getting a good Python implementation on z/OS.Our 
> favorite platform will be more attractive if it runs popular languages - and 
> Python is king these days.
> 
> - Python isn't perfect, but it is seriously nice.  This judgement is based on 
> the amazing software that I have seen written in it.  Try one example:  Meld 
> is a terrific FOSS visual diff / merge tool that is multi-platform and 
> written in Python.  Try it out and then look at the source code.  
> https://meldmerge.org/
> 
> - I agree that Python on z/OS could use some native libraries to do z/OS 
> interfaces like REXX.
> 
> 
> Kirk Wolf
> Dovetailed Technologies
> http://dovetail.com
> 
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Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS

2021-12-20 Thread Kirk Wolf

I'm shocked that most ibm-mainers are not convinced by this paper :-)

More seriously, I would add a couple of points:

- Whether or not you like Python or think that it is weak tea compared to REXX, 
you should support getting a good Python implementation on z/OS.Our 
favorite platform will be more attractive if it runs popular languages - and 
Python is king these days.

- Python isn't perfect, but it is seriously nice.  This judgement is based on 
the amazing software that I have seen written in it.  Try one example:  Meld is 
a terrific FOSS visual diff / merge tool that is multi-platform and written in 
Python.  Try it out and then look at the source code.  https://meldmerge.org/

- I agree that Python on z/OS could use some native libraries to do z/OS 
interfaces like REXX.


Kirk Wolf
Dovetailed Technologies
http://dovetail.com

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Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS

2021-12-20 Thread Kerry Liles

Re notepad++ versus the hex display plugin -- NPP will complain about it
and remove it when a new version is installed but you can simply install
the plugin again ..takes only seconds. A bit of a hassle but the hex plugin
works fine. I'm using the 64bit version but I believe it doesn't matter 32
or 64 bit.



On Mon, Dec 20, 2021, 12:50 Bob Bridges  wrote:

> Not the same thing, but I pretty much stopped accepting updates for
> software I like and trust a few years ago.  I'd gone out looking for some
> text editor that would display in hex when needed, and hit upon Notepad++,
> which apparently is pretty popular.  Months later, when an update was
> offered, I accepted without even thinking about it; why not?
>
> Because with the update they discontinued the hex feature, that's why.  I
> found out too late, and couldn't figure out a way to regress.  I still use
> Notepad++ from time to time, but it still rankles.  And whenever I'm
> offered an update nowadays, if it's an app I care about I always decline.
> Who knows what they'll do to it?
>
> Speaking of that, can anyone suggest a good editor that handles hex
> display on demand?  I've never tried ISPF-PC; maybe I should.
>
> ---
> Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313
>
> /* Whatever else is true, it is emphatically not true that the ideas of
> Jesus of Nazareth were suitable to his time, but are no longer suitable to
> our time.  Exactly how suitable they were to his time is perhaps suggested
> in the end of his story.  -G K Chesterton */
>
> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf
> Of Tom Brennan
> Sent: Monday, December 20, 2021 11:34
>
> My Windows html/php/etc editor "Dreamweaver" from 2004 still works on
> Win 10, but suddenly locked up at startup last week.  I assumed it was due
> to quiet updates to Win 10 and that old unsupported code would never work
> again. I was staring blankly into space saying, Oh no... oh no...
>
> Then I figured out it was just stuck waiting for Samba on a Raspberry Pi
> that had died overnight.  Whew!
>
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Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS

I see nothing wrong with being emotionally attached to a programming language 
as long as you remain intellectually honest. IMHO, if you can't identify flaws 
in your preferred language then you don't understand it. If you can't recognize 
a task where, e.g., Perl, is a better tool than, e.g., OREXX, then you have a 
problem.

That cuts both ways. I hate, lathe and despise C, but I once defended it 
against what I considered unjust criticism.

REXX has gotten better in your lifetime; IBM has failed to pick up some new 
features from ANSI and has abandoned new features from OREXX. The folks at 
RexxLA have language that TSO and CMS don't.

Six languages doesn't strike me as a lot; I know more assemblers than that. My 
position is that the CS curriculum should stress learning multiple, radically 
different, langages rather than the language du jour.

--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3

From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of 
David Crayford [dcrayf...@gmail.com]
Sent: Monday, December 20, 2021 9:23 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS

On 20/12/21 8:42 pm, René Jansen wrote:
> Yes, that is what NetRexx is for.

TBH, I'm not interested in NetRexx. It suffers from the same weaknesses
as classic REXX in that it only has one data type. The NetRexx manual
has examples of dynamically calling a JavaScript engine to parse JSON
which is totally lame. If I were to use a JVM language other than Java I
would choose Kotlin which is strongly typed and has null safety baked in
and cool features such as co-routines. REXX is impoverished and it's not
going to get any better in my lifetime. Never get emotionally attached
to a programming language. In my career I've programmed professionally
in at least 6 languages and I would happily switch if a better one
became available. Python has 47M downloads on the VS Code marketplace
which is an indication of it's popularity and why IBM have invested in
bringing it to z/OS.

>> On 20 Dec 2021, at 04:37, David Crayford  wrote:
>>
>> There's a Python client library for Kafka but it would be a very heavy lift 
>> to implement a client on z/OS using REXX.
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Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS

You can have my copy of Tritus SPF (TSPF) when they pry it out of my cold dead 
fingers. EBCDIC, Hex. Really close compatibility to ISPF DM and ISPF/PDF EDIT. 
The regex syntax is somewhat klunky and minimal, but still quite useful.

Has anybody looked at BRIEF? THE?


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of Bob 
Bridges [robhbrid...@gmail.com]
Sent: Monday, December 20, 2021 12:50 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS

Not the same thing, but I pretty much stopped accepting updates for software I 
like and trust a few years ago.  I'd gone out looking for some text editor that 
would display in hex when needed, and hit upon Notepad++, which apparently is 
pretty popular.  Months later, when an update was offered, I accepted without 
even thinking about it; why not?

Because with the update they discontinued the hex feature, that's why.  I found 
out too late, and couldn't figure out a way to regress.  I still use Notepad++ 
from time to time, but it still rankles.  And whenever I'm offered an update 
nowadays, if it's an app I care about I always decline.  Who knows what they'll 
do to it?

Speaking of that, can anyone suggest a good editor that handles hex display on 
demand?  I've never tried ISPF-PC; maybe I should.

---
Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313

/* Whatever else is true, it is emphatically not true that the ideas of Jesus 
of Nazareth were suitable to his time, but are no longer suitable to our time.  
Exactly how suitable they were to his time is perhaps suggested in the end of 
his story.  -G K Chesterton */

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of Tom 
Brennan
Sent: Monday, December 20, 2021 11:34

My Windows html/php/etc editor "Dreamweaver" from 2004 still works on Win 
10, but suddenly locked up at startup last week.  I assumed it was due to quiet 
updates to Win 10 and that old unsupported code would never work again. I was 
staring blankly into space saying, Oh no... oh no...

Then I figured out it was just stuck waiting for Samba on a Raspberry Pi that 
had died overnight.  Whew!

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Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS

What interfaces does the client support? I'm pretty sure that, in addition to 
what you list, there are people happily using

* LISP (not me)
* oorexx
* ruby
* scripting language built in to the terminal simulator
* shell of some flavor, e.g., C, korn

Within the constraints of support, it's partly a matter of taste.


--
Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz
http://mason.gmu.edu/~smetz3


From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] on behalf of 
Paul Gilmartin [000433f07816-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu]
Sent: Monday, December 20, 2021 12:53 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS

On Mon, 20 Dec 2021 08:34:09 -0800, Tom Brennan wrote:

> > Never get emotionally attached to a programming language.
>
>LOL PHP, from my cold dead hands :)
>Still on this list at #6 - 
>https://secure-web.cisco.com/1XbCE_WFJFM2e823mkNy-O6IC7hxmdIPIpZ-OIHRwRaav3qD4PWlJKgIK44Hq5TrixB2En_oF12ur9qwmQhrWvFVwrwaCI_cAehFkNgrp61iteawho4OzHyVOqxC0a3i9-Ixw96jlVQrp-VOwQRjLCUNEQJNVHNiB-dxNTZU_8oD9ozaKxC0KpIaCBPVMuLrBhpTS709L_LZw1ETbxuVZxJvSmWZId5Hq3llOXqfPkOyhbD27kJrD64xoU7hU4tetJ6uFj0bHrCcawfsUqLFFAgNqRWvo9n_MLMlLNk38VBz2m187580RMOn08vdBcfOFCfGpR55BEQPXpQJcHGcq_D89Wf4foyAymrOVvarrQ2Inw2kec_c7fwUcZgV0IxV2tpkUlyzKViYxS3VOweAXXmunHa_6QKTH3sEZluUmkfTis1TdHZZtq__-F91jKTKyQmjhKZ80kwJvHadZFav-lQ/https%3A%2F%2Fpypl.github.io%2FPYPL.html
>
What are good scripting languages for controlling a terminal emulator?
o Visual Basic?
o .BAT?
o Automator?
o Rexx./Regina?
o Python?
o Others?
o idiosyncratic?

-- gil

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Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS

2021-12-20 Thread Ed Jaffe


On 12/20/2021 9:50 AM, Bob Bridges wrote:

Speaking of that, can anyone suggest a good editor that handles hex display on 
demand?


UltraEdit is still my favorite and has hex editing capabilities. It also 
supports EBCDIC.


I'm trying to get used to Notepad++ because of the price.

Notepad++ allows hex editing via the ASCII->HEX and HEX->ASCII plug-ins. 
There is no EBCDIC.



--
Phoenix Software International
Edward E. Jaffe
831 Parkview Drive North
El Segundo, CA 90245
https://www.phoenixsoftware.com/



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Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS

2021-12-20 Thread Rich Smrcina

I’ve just been using bash, but will definitely give Python a look.



> On Dec 20, 2021, at 11:53 AM, Paul Gilmartin 
> <000433f07816-dmarc-requ...@listserv.ua.edu> wrote:
> 
> On Mon, 20 Dec 2021 08:34:09 -0800, Tom Brennan wrote:
> 
>>> Never get emotionally attached to a programming language.
>> 
>> LOL PHP, from my cold dead hands :)
>> Still on this list at #6 - https://pypl.github.io/PYPL.html
>> 
> What are good scripting languages for controlling a terminal emulator?
> o Visual Basic?
> o .BAT?
> o Automator?
> o Rexx./Regina?
> o Python?
> o Others?
> o idiosyncratic?
> 
> -- gil
> 
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Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS

On Mon, 20 Dec 2021 08:34:09 -0800, Tom Brennan wrote:

> > Never get emotionally attached to a programming language.
>
>LOL PHP, from my cold dead hands :)
>Still on this list at #6 - https://pypl.github.io/PYPL.html
> 
What are good scripting languages for controlling a terminal emulator?
o Visual Basic?
o .BAT?
o Automator?
o Rexx./Regina?
o Python?
o Others?
o idiosyncratic?

-- gil

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Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS

2021-12-20 Thread Bob Bridges

Not the same thing, but I pretty much stopped accepting updates for software I 
like and trust a few years ago.  I'd gone out looking for some text editor that 
would display in hex when needed, and hit upon Notepad++, which apparently is 
pretty popular.  Months later, when an update was offered, I accepted without 
even thinking about it; why not?

Because with the update they discontinued the hex feature, that's why.  I found 
out too late, and couldn't figure out a way to regress.  I still use Notepad++ 
from time to time, but it still rankles.  And whenever I'm offered an update 
nowadays, if it's an app I care about I always decline.  Who knows what they'll 
do to it?

Speaking of that, can anyone suggest a good editor that handles hex display on 
demand?  I've never tried ISPF-PC; maybe I should.

---
Bob Bridges, robhbrid...@gmail.com, cell 336 382-7313

/* Whatever else is true, it is emphatically not true that the ideas of Jesus 
of Nazareth were suitable to his time, but are no longer suitable to our time.  
Exactly how suitable they were to his time is perhaps suggested in the end of 
his story.  -G K Chesterton */

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of Tom 
Brennan
Sent: Monday, December 20, 2021 11:34

My Windows html/php/etc editor "Dreamweaver" from 2004 still works on Win 
10, but suddenly locked up at startup last week.  I assumed it was due to quiet 
updates to Win 10 and that old unsupported code would never work again. I was 
staring blankly into space saying, Oh no... oh no...

Then I figured out it was just stuck waiting for Samba on a Raspberry Pi that 
had died overnight.  Whew!

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Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS

2021-12-20 Thread Tom Brennan


> Never get emotionally attached to a programming language.

LOL PHP, from my cold dead hands :)
Still on this list at #6 - https://pypl.github.io/PYPL.html

And there are other things I've grown way too attached to.  My Windows 
html/php/etc editor "Dreamweaver" from 2004 still works on Win 10, but 
suddenly locked up at startup last week.  I assumed it was due to quiet 
updates to Win 10 and that old unsupported code would never work again. 
I was staring blankly into space saying, Oh no... oh no...


Then I figured out it was just stuck waiting for Samba on a Raspberry Pi 
that had died overnight.  Whew!


On 12/20/2021 6:23 AM, David Crayford wrote:

On 20/12/21 8:42 pm, René Jansen wrote:

Yes, that is what NetRexx is for.


TBH, I'm not interested in NetRexx. It suffers from the same weaknesses 
as classic REXX in that it only has one data type. The NetRexx manual 
has examples of dynamically calling a JavaScript engine to parse JSON 
which is totally lame. If I were to use a JVM language other than Java I 
would choose Kotlin which is strongly typed and has null safety baked in 
and cool features such as co-routines. REXX is impoverished and it's not 
going to get any better in my lifetime. Never get emotionally attached 
to a programming language. In my career I've programmed professionally 
in at least 6 languages and I would happily switch if a better one 
became available. Python has 47M downloads on the VS Code marketplace 
which is an indication of it's popularity and why IBM have invested in 
bringing it to z/OS.




On 20 Dec 2021, at 04:37, David Crayford  wrote:

There's a Python client library for Kafka but it would be a very 
heavy lift to implement a client on z/OS using REXX.

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Re: How to use dfsort to filter keywords that aren't fixed position

2021-12-20 Thread Sri h Kolusu

> If we put them together, the output isn't what we need.

Jason,

It is quite easy to get the multi-line messages.  Looks like you are
interested in extracting messages which begins with HSAM...

Basically a multi-line message will NOT have the date and time for the
continuation lines. And the message id are at fixed position on the first
line (position 58)

Assuming your syslog is FBM and LRECL=133 here is a job that would extract
the HSAM.. messages (single and multi-line)

//STEP0100 EXEC PGM=SORT
//SYSOUT   DD SYSOUT=*
//SORTIN   DD DISP=SHR,DSN=Your Input Syslog/Operlog
//SORTOUT  DD SYSOUT=*
//SYSINDD *
  OPTION COPY
  INREC IFTHEN=(WHEN=GROUP,
   BEGIN=(21,5,CH,GT,C' '),   $ IF DATE IS > ' '
PUSH=(134:58,08)) $ MESSAGE ID

  OUTFIL BUILD=(01,133),  $ ORIGINAL LRECL
  INCLUDE=(134,4,CH,EQ,C'HSAM')   $ ONLY HSAM MESSAGES
/*

Thanks,
Kolusu
DFSORT Development
IBM Corporation



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Re: z/OS freelance trainer

2021-12-20 Thread

I am interested in this opportunity.  Mostly retired after 45 years in 
mainframe.  I have worked for ProTech and Verhoef training part time in the 
last few years.
ming...@prodigy.net
317 903-9455 Cell Phone

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List  On Behalf Of 
Peter
Sent: Saturday, December 18, 2021 12:13 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU
Subject: z/OS freelance trainer

Hello All,

I am looking for some z/OS experienced freelance trainer or retired mainframers 
who is willing to share or mentor on various topics of mainframe operating 
system. I am willing to pay for this service. Please contact me offline if you 
are interested.

Regards
Peter

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Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS


On 20/12/21 8:42 pm, René Jansen wrote:

Yes, that is what NetRexx is for.


TBH, I'm not interested in NetRexx. It suffers from the same weaknesses 
as classic REXX in that it only has one data type. The NetRexx manual 
has examples of dynamically calling a JavaScript engine to parse JSON 
which is totally lame. If I were to use a JVM language other than Java I 
would choose Kotlin which is strongly typed and has null safety baked in 
and cool features such as co-routines. REXX is impoverished and it's not 
going to get any better in my lifetime. Never get emotionally attached 
to a programming language. In my career I've programmed professionally 
in at least 6 languages and I would happily switch if a better one 
became available. Python has 47M downloads on the VS Code marketplace 
which is an indication of it's popularity and why IBM have invested in 
bringing it to z/OS.




On 20 Dec 2021, at 04:37, David Crayford  wrote:

There's a Python client library for Kafka but it would be a very heavy lift to 
implement a client on z/OS using REXX.

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Re: CF structure type SERLIST

2021-12-20 Thread Bill Neiman

"I just found a coupling facility structure of type Serialized List. aka
SERLIST aka SLIST.
Is it documented anywhere?

The only documentation which mention serlist is ...z/TPF manual. I
browsed z/OS doco, up to V2R5, but only found good old lock, cache and
list. No serlist"


A serialized list is simply a list structure with an associated lock table.  It 
allows the exploiting application to serialize list operations.  It is 
discussed in z/OS MVS Setting Up a Sysplex chapter "Using List Services 
(IXLLIST)", section "List Structure Concepts" ->  "Understanding the Serialized 
List Structure" and in the sections of that publication that describe the 
various IXLLIST (IXLLSTE / IXLLSTM / IXLLSTC) request options.

Bill Neiman
z/OS Parallel Sysplex development
IBM

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Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS

2021-12-20 Thread René Jansen

Prolog - yes, it seems that every program one writes implements some 
functionality that Prolog does better. I wonder where AD/Prolog went? That 
would be something to Open Source. In the meantime, just SWI-Prolog ported, or 
even gnuprolog would be good.

And OCaml - yes, that is also a great language, with a very fast code 
generator. I have the French OCaml O’Reilly book that never made it to English. 
That would also be a very welcome z port.

René.

> On 20 Dec 2021, at 05:02, Tomasz Rola  wrote:
> 
> Prolog - quite interesting language which I should learn one day...

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Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS

2021-12-20 Thread René Jansen

Yes, that is what NetRexx is for.

> On 20 Dec 2021, at 04:37, David Crayford  wrote:
> 
> There's a Python client library for Kafka but it would be a very heavy lift 
> to implement a client on z/OS using REXX.

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Re: How to use dfsort to filter keywords that aren't fixed position

2021-12-20 Thread Massimo Biancucci

Jason,

sorry for me being a bit confused 
If it's true a ML WTO cannot be interrupted, if you need to recognize the
WTO groups try this (the syslog dataset I used is a 137 VBM):

//*---*

//*   *

//*---*

//ST010EXEC  PGM=SORT

//SYSOUTDD   SYSOUT=*

//SORTIN   DD DISP=SHR,DSN=MYLOG

//SORTOUT  DD DSN=&ALL,DISP=(,PASS),

// SPACE=(TRK,(300,300))

//ERRORDD DSN=&ERR,DISP=(,PASS),

// SPACE=(TRK,(300,300))

//SYSIN DD   *

 OPTION VLSCMP

 INREC IFTHEN=(WHEN=GROUP,BEGIN=(33,1,CH,NE,C' '),   POS OF FIRST TS BYTE


  PUSH=(140:ID=9))

 SORT FIELDS=COPY

 OUTFIL FNAMES=SORTOUT

 OUTFIL FNAMES=ERROR,INCLUDE=(6,137,SS,EQ,C'ERROR')

/*

//*---*

//*   *

//*---*

//ST020EXEC  PGM=IDCAMS

//SYSPRINT DD   SYSOUT=*

//SYSINDD   *

 DELETE MYLOG.OK

 IF MAXCC=8 THEN SET MAXCC=0

/*

//*---*

//*   *

//*---*

//ST004EXEC  PGM=SORT

//SYSOUTDD   SYSOUT=*

//ERRORDD DSN=&ERR,DISP=(OLD,DELETE)

//ALL  DD DSN=&ALL,DISP=(OLD,DELETE)

//SORTOUT  DD DSN=MYLOG.OK,

// DISP=(,CATLG),DATACLAS=UEFSQCMP,

// SPACE=(TRK,(300,300))

//SYSIN DD   *

 JOINKEYS F1=ERROR,FIELDS=(140,9,A),SORTED

 JOINKEYS F2=ALL,FIELDS=(140,9,A),SORTED

 REFORMAT FIELDS=(F2:1,137,F2:140,9)


 SORT FIELDS=COPY
/*

Now, at position 140, you'll find the 9 bytes zoned group ID.
So, in your sample:

+1+2+3+4+5+6+7+8+9+0+1+2+3+4+---
N C00 CUK1   18179 16:07:33.83 0090 HSAM5400I
HISTO
1
N C00 CUK1   18179 16:07:33.85 0090 HSAM1003I ARM
R
2
S
  TYPE=HSAMGR RES   2

Actually I use a REXX approach to analyze a small set of messages, if this
will work I'll try to change it.
In my experience SYSLOG dataset (at switch time) can be truncated so
sometimes the very first and last piece of it could contain "remainders"
from the previous day or not the complete infos for the actual one.

Hope this helps.
Max



Mail
priva di virus. www.avast.com

<#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>

Il giorno lun 20 dic 2021 alle ore 05:58 Jason Cai  ha
scritto:

> Thanks for  Martin, Massimo, and Kolusu's help
>
> As Massino mention that a multiline WTO
> cannot be interrupted, we need to handle multiline messages in OPERLOG or
> SYSLOG that cannot be interrupted.
>
> for IBM manul
>
> Each SYSLOG record is prefaced by a two-character record type field.
> Valid first characters are:
> N - single-line message
> W - single-line message with reply
> WTOR messages are not processed by Message Flood Automation.
> M - first line of a multi-line message
> Message Flood Automation can only react to the first line of a multiline
> message, not to any of the label, data or end lines
> L - multi-line message label line
> D - multi-line message data line
> E - multi-line message data/end line
> S - continuation of previous line
> O - LOG command input
> X - non-hardcopy or LOG command source
>
> There are at least three kinds of groups.
>
> 1. N  single-line message
>INREC IFTHEN=(WHEN=GROUP,BEGIN=(2,1,CH,EQ,C'N'),
>END=(2,1,CH,EQ,C'N')
> 2.  M - first line of a multi-line message
> INREC IFTHEN=(WHEN=GROUP,BEGIN=(2,1,CH,EQ,C'M'),
> END=(2,1,CH,EQ,C'E')
> 3. S - continuation of previous line
> INREC IFTHEN=(WHEN=GROUP,BEGIN=(2,1,CH,EQ,C'N'),
> END=(2,1,CH,EQ,C'S')
>
> for example:
> N C00 CUK1   18179 16:07:33.83 0090 HSAM5400I HISTO
> N C00 CUK1   18179 16:07:33.85 0090 HSAM1003I ARM R
> S
>   TYPE=HSAMGR RES
>
> If we put them together, the output isn't what we need. Please see the
> following statement.
>
> OPTION VLSCMP
>  INREC IFTHEN=(WHEN=GROUP,BEGIN=(2,1,CH,EQ,C'M',OR,2,1,CH,EQ,C'N'),
>  END=(2,1,CH,EQ,C'E',OR,2,1,CH,EQ,C'S',OR,2,1,CH,EQ,C'N'),
>  PUSH=(140:ID=9))
>
> Could you help us to handle multiline messages in syslog by dfsort ?
>
> Any suggestions are greatly appreciated!
>
> Thanks a lot!
>
> --
> For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions,
> send email to lists...@listser

Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS

2021-12-20 Thread Tomasz Rola

On Sat, Dec 18, 2021 at 11:40:48PM +, Seymour J Metz wrote:
[...]
> 1. Python programmers are more plentiful

I was "great enthusiast" of Python but that was in days of 1.x . With
2.x, I my enthusiasm became a bit relaxed, but since it could execute
1.x code without problem (for what I know), I just kept doing it like
it was 1990-ties and spicing 2.x features here and there. When 3.x
came, my enthusiasm went away. There was a number of projects which
delayed transition 2->3, some perhaps never did it. Code from 2.x had
to be upgraded in order to run on 3.x interpreter. There was automatic
tool for automatic translation of the code. Somehow, not everybody was
convinced and the community kept on dragging 2.x interpreter for more
than five years or so. I do not care much, since it does not affect
me, but a new project of mine (if there is any) is not going to be
written in Python, I am afraid.

Compare to OCaml - the language quite different from Python. Not long
ago the developers were celebrating 25th anniversary of their
compiler. Someone mentioned his 20 years old code still compiles today
without requiring changes.

All of the above are just my subjective observations. So take with
salt, or pepper or what have you. And, I am not proposing OCaml as
replacement for Python, because I have only read about it, never coded
a line in it. I remember some folks actually rewrote their Python
program(s) in OCaml. Pehaps gog will know.

[...]
> 8. Python is the language of AI
> 
> LISP? Prolog?

"Python and AI" probably means "Python as a frontend to C libraries
calling GPU and Deep Learning - something - something". Just what I
would think if someone told me that Python is great for numerical
simulation - in my mind it would just boil down to "libraries in
Fortran being called from Python" becase Fortran programmers are rare
and Python programmers are abundant. Some also say such things about
Julia and R...

LISP is kind of being resuscitated. Or was, last time I had a look. In
case of Common Lisp, there are lots of new libraries and there is
quicklisp, a very nice library installer. It works, I tried, was very
happy. Some libraries are poorly written, but overally the whole
effort around Common Lisp made good impression on me.

Cons: the CL Hyperspec describes a standard vocabulary of CL, which is
almost a thousand words, some with rich semantics (format, loop, maybe
some other). It takes a bit of time to get it all (and I am still not
there, perhaps I just do not push for it).

Pros: see cons.

There are other LISP flavours/dialects, but, well, land of Scheme is
quite fragmented. There was some effort to define common set of
libraries which would work on many Scheme implementations but I am not
sure if their websites are responding. There is nice effort named SRFI
which defines subsets of functions for different tasks and then Scheme
implementations are free to choose which ones they want to support -
so, for example, some Schemes will support Unicode, some will only
support ASCII. 

Other LISP dialects are even a bit more limited in their use.

Prolog - quite interesting language which I should learn one day...

-- 
Regards,
Tomasz Rola

--
** A C programmer asked whether computer had Buddha's nature.  **
** As the answer, master did "rm -rif" on the programmer's home**
** directory. And then the C programmer became enlightened...  **
** **
** Tomasz Rola  mailto:tomasz_r...@bigfoot.com **

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Re: Top 8 Reasons for using Python instead of REXX for z/OS