Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
This is getting pretty ridiculous now, in my view. So let's say that IBM increases a particular price for sake of argument. What does that mean? Well, in effect it means you may be slightly off the financial part of your forecast for the remainder of your ELA. Which means you may be closer or less close to perfect in your capacity forecast relative to the financial one. (If your utilizations are running under forecast, the price increase soaks up some gap and probably the payments don't change, so you're actually closer to perfect. If you're running over, you may have a bit more overage to pay at the end, so you've left some benefit on the table.) A *perfect* forecast maximizes ELA benefits. An imperfect forecast...STILL YIELDS ELA BENEFITS! This isn't a question of whether or not you should have an ELA. You probably should -- talk with your IBM representative. If perfect is defined as 10 units worth of benefit (with 100% hindsight), sure, maybe you'll only get 8 units when the books are closed. Is 8 better than zero benefit? Heck yes! And many organizations like smoothed billing anyway for budgetary reasons, so that's another benefit in many cases. By the way, when IBM announced the Mainframe Charter 10 years ago, it promised to deliver on a few important principles. One of the most important was to improve the value of zSeries (now zEnterprise). Very importantly, IBM did not specify exactly what form those ongoing improvements would take, at least in part because IBM couldn't predict everything. I'm pretty sure IBM didn't predict the DB2 Analytics Accelerator in 2003, for example -- at least not in detail. IBM hasn't issued many charters -- maybe two? -- and I think many observers missed how seriously IBM took (and takes) the Mainframe Charter. OK, fast forward 10 years. We've seen substantial net unit price decreases in myriad forms (speciality engines, more and more business-friendly sub-capacity licensing, accelerators, hardware capacity, memory, maintenance, Capacity for Planned Events, Solution Editions, Value Unit Editions, Rational Unit Test feature, and many others). We've also seen functionality which previously required paying extra now not requiring extra payment -- the WebSphere Liberty Profile in CICS TS V5.1 and IMS Connect are two among many examples. We've seen serious (and ongoing) path length reductions throughout the portfolio -- yes even including COBOL, CICS, and IMS. (Welcome, Enterprise COBOL Version 5.) We've seen IBM compete aggressively but fairly in the tools and utilities market, and on a sub-capacity basis. We've seen price inflation and even some currency devaluations in the world at large, and yes we've even seen IBM raise a few price numbers a bit so that everything is not falling *too* quickly. And, oh yes, we have 5.5 GHz cores! I think this whole picture over the past decade is a very good result. There's lots more value-for-money than there was 10 years ago -- there was a lot even then -- and IBM continues to be well positioned to keep delivering on the Mainframe Charter's promises. Anybody who wants to trade today for 10 years ago, raise your hand. :-) Writing only for myself. Timothy Sipples GMU VCT Architect Executive (Based in Singapore) E-Mail: sipp...@sg.ibm.com -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Mainframe Charter (Was: Predict WLC invoice amount ...)
On 5/22/2013 11:38 PM, Timothy Sipples wrote: By the way, when IBM announced the Mainframe Charter 10 years ago, it promised to deliver on a few important principles. One of the most important was to improve the value of zSeries (now zEnterprise). Very importantly, IBM did not specify exactly what form those ongoing improvements would take, at least in part because IBM couldn't predict everything. I'm pretty sure IBM didn't predict the DB2 Analytics Accelerator in 2003, for example -- at least not in detail. IBM hasn't issued many charters -- maybe two? -- and I think many observers missed how seriously IBM took (and takes) the Mainframe Charter. I really liked the Mainframe Charter. It was a great way to kick-off the mainframe's 40th anniversary celebrations! I was disappointed when IBM started systematically scrubbing away every trace of the Mainframe Charter from its web sites. (Fortunately, they left this FAQ that explains what it was all about: http://www.ibm.com/servers/eserver/includes/download/mainframe_charter_faq.pdf). I hope they plan to do another all new one next year to help celebrate the mainframe's 50th anniversary! -- Edward E Jaffe Phoenix Software International, Inc 831 Parkview Drive North El Segundo, CA 90245 http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Mainframe Charter (Was: Predict WLC invoice amount ...)
Gee, thanks, Ed. You mentioned the link below and I get a 404 error. You told IBM it was there so they scrubbed it too! grin Seriously, I got a 404 not found error using the link. I found it here: http://www-07.ibm.com/servers/eserver/includes/download/mainframe_charter_faq.pdf Rex -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Ed Jaffe Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2013 9:52 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Mainframe Charter (Was: Predict WLC invoice amount ...) On 5/22/2013 11:38 PM, Timothy Sipples wrote: By the way, when IBM announced the Mainframe Charter 10 years ago, it promised to deliver on a few important principles. One of the most important was to improve the value of zSeries (now zEnterprise). Very importantly, IBM did not specify exactly what form those ongoing improvements would take, at least in part because IBM couldn't predict everything. I'm pretty sure IBM didn't predict the DB2 Analytics Accelerator in 2003, for example -- at least not in detail. IBM hasn't issued many charters -- maybe two? -- and I think many observers missed how seriously IBM took (and takes) the Mainframe Charter. I really liked the Mainframe Charter. It was a great way to kick-off the mainframe's 40th anniversary celebrations! I was disappointed when IBM started systematically scrubbing away every trace of the Mainframe Charter from its web sites. (Fortunately, they left this FAQ that explains what it was all about: http://www.ibm.com/servers/eserver/includes/download/mainframe_charter_faq.pdf). I hope they plan to do another all new one next year to help celebrate the mainframe's 50th anniversary! -- Edward E Jaffe Phoenix Software International, Inc 831 Parkview Drive North El Segundo, CA 90245 http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN The information contained in this e-mail may contain confidential and/or privileged information and is intended for the sole use of the intended recipient. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any unauthorized use, disclosure, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited and that you will be held responsible for any such unauthorized activity, including liability for any resulting damages. As appropriate, such incident(s) may also be reported to law enforcement. If you received this e-mail in error, please reply to sender and destroy or delete the message and any attachments. Thank you. NOTICE: This e-mail message, including any attachments and appended messages, is for the sole use of the intended recipients and may contain confidential and legally privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, any review, dissemination, distribution, copying, storage or other use of all or any portion of this message is strictly prohibited. If you received this message in error, please immediately notify the sender by reply e-mail and delete this message in its entirety. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Mainframe Charter (Was: Predict WLC invoice amount ...)
Do you have a firewall issue? I was able to use this link to get to the document. Lizette -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Pommier, Rex R. Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2013 8:33 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Mainframe Charter (Was: Predict WLC invoice amount ...) Gee, thanks, Ed. You mentioned the link below and I get a 404 error. You told IBM it was there so they scrubbed it too! grin Seriously, I got a 404 not found error using the link. I found it here: http://www-07.ibm.com/servers/eserver/includes/download/mainframe_charter_fa q.pdf Rex -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Ed Jaffe Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2013 9:52 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Mainframe Charter (Was: Predict WLC invoice amount ...) On 5/22/2013 11:38 PM, Timothy Sipples wrote: By the way, when IBM announced the Mainframe Charter 10 years ago, it promised to deliver on a few important principles. One of the most important was to improve the value of zSeries (now zEnterprise). Very importantly, IBM did not specify exactly what form those ongoing improvements would take, at least in part because IBM couldn't predict everything. I'm pretty sure IBM didn't predict the DB2 Analytics Accelerator in 2003, for example -- at least not in detail. IBM hasn't issued many charters -- maybe two? -- and I think many observers missed how seriously IBM took (and takes) the Mainframe Charter. I really liked the Mainframe Charter. It was a great way to kick-off the mainframe's 40th anniversary celebrations! I was disappointed when IBM started systematically scrubbing away every trace of the Mainframe Charter from its web sites. (Fortunately, they left this FAQ that explains what it was all about: http://www.ibm.com/servers/eserver/includes/download/mainframe_charter_faq.p df). I hope they plan to do another all new one next year to help celebrate the mainframe's 50th anniversary! -- Edward E Jaffe Phoenix Software International, Inc 831 Parkview Drive North El Segundo, CA 90245 -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Mainframe Charter (Was: Predict WLC invoice amount ...)
Just a bit of clarification. I got the 404 error using the link Ed had provided. When I changed the www. to www-07. I was able to get the PDF. The firewall question Liz asked was the first thing that popped into my mind as well (along with blocked sites, etc) so I sent ED's e-mail to my home address which has nothing blocked, and I got the 404 there as well. That was when I searched IBM-land and got the hit using the www-07 link. Great list - I've definitely gotten more help from it than I have been able to return. Rex -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Lizette Koehler Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2013 10:56 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Mainframe Charter (Was: Predict WLC invoice amount ...) Do you have a firewall issue? I was able to use this link to get to the document. Lizette -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Pommier, Rex R. Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2013 8:33 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Mainframe Charter (Was: Predict WLC invoice amount ...) Gee, thanks, Ed. You mentioned the link below and I get a 404 error. You told IBM it was there so they scrubbed it too! grin Seriously, I got a 404 not found error using the link. I found it here: http://www-07.ibm.com/servers/eserver/includes/download/mainframe_charter_fa q.pdf Rex -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Ed Jaffe Sent: Thursday, May 23, 2013 9:52 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Mainframe Charter (Was: Predict WLC invoice amount ...) On 5/22/2013 11:38 PM, Timothy Sipples wrote: By the way, when IBM announced the Mainframe Charter 10 years ago, it promised to deliver on a few important principles. One of the most important was to improve the value of zSeries (now zEnterprise). Very importantly, IBM did not specify exactly what form those ongoing improvements would take, at least in part because IBM couldn't predict everything. I'm pretty sure IBM didn't predict the DB2 Analytics Accelerator in 2003, for example -- at least not in detail. IBM hasn't issued many charters -- maybe two? -- and I think many observers missed how seriously IBM took (and takes) the Mainframe Charter. I really liked the Mainframe Charter. It was a great way to kick-off the mainframe's 40th anniversary celebrations! I was disappointed when IBM started systematically scrubbing away every trace of the Mainframe Charter from its web sites. (Fortunately, they left this FAQ that explains what it was all about: http://www.ibm.com/servers/eserver/includes/download/mainframe_charter_faq.p df). I hope they plan to do another all new one next year to help celebrate the mainframe's 50th anniversary! -- Edward E Jaffe Phoenix Software International, Inc 831 Parkview Drive North El Segundo, CA 90245 -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN The information contained in this e-mail may contain confidential and/or privileged information and is intended for the sole use of the intended recipient. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any unauthorized use, disclosure, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited and that you will be held responsible for any such unauthorized activity, including liability for any resulting damages. As appropriate, such incident(s) may also be reported to law enforcement. If you received this e-mail in error, please reply to sender and destroy or delete the message and any attachments. Thank you. NOTICE: This e-mail message, including any attachments and appended messages, is for the sole use of the intended recipients and may contain confidential and legally privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient, any review, dissemination, distribution, copying, storage or other use of all or any portion of this message is strictly prohibited. If you received this message in error, please immediately notify the sender by reply e-mail and delete this message in its entirety. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
Or perhaps wait until their ELA is up, depending on where they are within their caps. It certainly will make the upgrade discussion more difficult. My initial hope / expectation was that the recent z/OS price increase was to grease the skids for v2.1, but I'm not quite as hopeful. But the main point for the discussion at hand is that there isn't a number available to factor into one's ELA planning. On Tue, 21 May 2013 18:39:45 +, Bob Shannon bshan...@rocketsoftware.com wrote: The salient point is that customers need to know of price increases in advance of GA. If 2.1 isn't in a customer's budget they will wait until next year to install it. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
It is difficult to accurately predict unannounced IBM price increases and unannounced product release dates. Both of which, over a 2-3 year ELA, will happen. Is z/OS v2 going to carry a price increase? AFAIK, that hasn't been announced, but to plan for a 2 or 3 year ELA at this point I need to plan for what that price increase might be and when we might migrate to it. What about DB2 v11? What is it going to be priced at? When is it going to be released? What benefits might it have that will drive us to install it when? Really, my main gripe is that the IBM ELAs (at least as far as I've experienced, and been told) do not include price protection. Other vendors' ELAs do. Now perhaps some customers negotiate better and do get price protection included or even an avoidance of true-up included. From my discussions with other customers and IBMers, my guess is that's an exception that would be granted in a small number of cases, at best. As I said before, I see no benefit to an ELA from an MLC perspective. If an IBMer can explain to me such a benefit for MLC, I'd like to understand it. I see discussion about staying below caps and so not worrying, but to me that just means that you paid for x MSUs and only used 0.9x, which means that you paid more than you would have if you didn't have an ELA (from an MLC perspective, perhaps not from a PPA / zOTC perspective). Again, unless somebody has negotiated MLC pricing less than published list, which my understanding is not the case in NA. (Although some numbers I've seen publicly presented does suggest that Solution Edition pricing greatly discounts MLC. At least initially.) While I genuinely do like my local IBM folks and get along well with them, there is by necessity a certain adversarial aspect to any negotiated pricing contract. While I'd like to think that we'd always come to a fair and equitable arrangement for all parties, the fact of the matter is that my obligation to my employer is that I should work to secure the best deal for my employer. I would consider it an ethical breach to not do so. The same is of course true for the IBM employees. It is perhaps more complicated for IBM because there may be more intangible aspects of customer retention/happiness to consider. I have a great deal of respect for IBM, but IBM makes business decisions that are good for IBM. Such decisions aren't always ideal for customers. But that's the way business works: suppliers work to maximize their profits which requires balancing pricing vs customer retention and customers seek to minimize costs. Note as always, opinions are my own, not my employers, and not even necessarily the same as anybody else's in my organization. Scott On Mon, 20 May 2013 05:52:11 -0400, Richards, Robert B. robert.richa...@opm.gov wrote: I am in total agreement with Timothy. Whether or not you maximize the ELA benefits is not the fault of IBM. The numbers are known in advance. You should plan accordingly or have negotiated more favorable terms in the ELA beforehand. Even if management lays waste to your planning, one assumes that it would be for a good business (think unplanned growth and/or a new, financially attractive) reason to do so. I wonder why one views their relationship with IBM as adversarial. It should be a partnership. Then again, I am ever the optimist. Bob -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Timothy Sipples Sent: Monday, May 20, 2013 1:14 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ... Words have meaning. ...Which probably at least reduce the intensity... almost never means *zero* worry. Why else would I have typed those words? Let's try again. Enterprise License Agreements (ELAs) still require SCRT collection and submission. I didn't claim otherwise. How much you worry about those monthly reports -- the intensity of worry -- will depend in large measure on your caps relative to your utilization. I strongly disagree with the statement that Tails IBM wins, heads you lose with ELAs. The ideal case is that you choose caps (a utilization forecast) that are exactly as you experience. However, if you don't -- if you're either too high or too low -- YOU STILL ENJOY ELA BENEFITS! You haven't *maximized* those benefits, but you still come out way ahead unless you've totally screwed up. It's a gamble, but the odds of winning that bet are HEAVILY weighted in your favor. Ask your IBM representative. Timothy Sipples GMU VCT Architect Executive (Based in Singapore) E-Mail: sipp...@sg.ibm.com -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
On 5/21/2013 4:14 AM, Scott Chapman wrote: Is z/OS v2 going to carry a price increase? AFAIK, that hasn't been announced, but to plan for a 2 or 3 year ELA at this point I need to plan for what that price increase might be and when we might migrate to it. Good question in light of IBM's recent pricing schizophrenia. When the z196 came out, they killed off the Technology Dividend which had for years helped to normalize prices for the entire software ecosystem: MLC, IPLA, ISV. At the same time they announced AWLC pricing which lowered z/OS MLC prices by about 5%, for those who installed the new hardware, but left IPLA and ISV prices unchanged. Then they implemented a sweeping 6% z/OS MLC price increase in April 2012 that affected _ALL_ customers on all hardware. (Yikes!) Then, when zEC12 came out they announced Technology Update Pricing for AWLC which lowered z/OS MLC prices by about 5% for those who installed the new hardware. Some analysts viewed the April 2012 MLC price increase as likely having set the stage for a roll-out of z/OS V2 without a price increase to make the transition to z/OS V2, with an all-new (more restrictive) customer agreement, an obvious no-brainer. But, it might have been just another inducement for customers to upgrade their hardware to zEC12. If so, IBM's plan seems to have worked--based on their record high 4Q12 MIPS growth numbers! AINFA and my crystal ball seems to be on the fritz, but I would be _highly_ surprised if IBM doesn't use the occasion of the first z/OS version change in 13 years to raise prices. After all, it seems like everything else we buy in this world has has seen recent, significant, price increases. Why should operating system software be immune from this trend? -- Edward E Jaffe Phoenix Software International, Inc 831 Parkview Drive North El Segundo, CA 90245 http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
but I would be _highly_ surprised if IBM doesn't use the occasion of the first z/OS version change in 13 years to raise prices It's awfully late in the game to announce a price increase. One would hope that would have been done when 2.1 was previewed. Bob Shannon Rocket Software -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
On 5/21/2013 10:35 AM, Bob Shannon wrote: but I would be _highly_ surprised if IBM doesn't use the occasion of the first z/OS version change in 13 years to raise prices It's awfully late in the game to announce a price increase. One would hope that would have been done when 2.1 was previewed. Generally, I don't think announcement previews include pricing information. Usually, only official announcements have that. -- Edward E Jaffe Phoenix Software International, Inc 831 Parkview Drive North El Segundo, CA 90245 http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
but I would be _highly_ surprised if IBM doesn't use the occasion of the first z/OS version change in 13 years to raise prices It's awfully late in the game to announce a price increase. One would hope that would have been done when 2.1 was previewed. Generally, I don't think announcement previews include pricing information. Usually, only official announcements have that. The salient point is that customers need to know of price increases in advance of GA. If 2.1 isn't in a customer's budget they will wait until next year to install it. Bob Shannon Rocket software -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
On Tue, May 21, 2013 at 1:39 PM, Bob Shannon bshan...@rocketsoftware.com wrote: Generally, I don't think announcement previews include pricing information. Usually, only official announcements have that. The salient point is that customers need to know of price increases in advance of GA. If 2.1 isn't in a customer's budget they will wait until next year to install it. Bob Shannon Most customers were installing every other year anyway. With 2 years between releases now, it will be less of an issue. -- Mike A Schwab, Springfield IL USA Where do Forest Rangers go to get away from it all? -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
I am in total agreement with Timothy. Whether or not you maximize the ELA benefits is not the fault of IBM. The numbers are known in advance. You should plan accordingly or have negotiated more favorable terms in the ELA beforehand. Even if management lays waste to your planning, one assumes that it would be for a good business (think unplanned growth and/or a new, financially attractive) reason to do so. I wonder why one views their relationship with IBM as adversarial. It should be a partnership. Then again, I am ever the optimist. Bob -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Timothy Sipples Sent: Monday, May 20, 2013 1:14 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ... Words have meaning. ...Which probably at least reduce the intensity... almost never means *zero* worry. Why else would I have typed those words? Let's try again. Enterprise License Agreements (ELAs) still require SCRT collection and submission. I didn't claim otherwise. How much you worry about those monthly reports -- the intensity of worry -- will depend in large measure on your caps relative to your utilization. I strongly disagree with the statement that Tails IBM wins, heads you lose with ELAs. The ideal case is that you choose caps (a utilization forecast) that are exactly as you experience. However, if you don't -- if you're either too high or too low -- YOU STILL ENJOY ELA BENEFITS! You haven't *maximized* those benefits, but you still come out way ahead unless you've totally screwed up. It's a gamble, but the odds of winning that bet are HEAVILY weighted in your favor. Ask your IBM representative. Timothy Sipples GMU VCT Architect Executive (Based in Singapore) E-Mail: sipp...@sg.ibm.com -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
On Mon, 20 May 2013 05:52:11 -0400, Richards, Robert B. wrote: Even if management lays waste to your planning, one assumes that it would be for a good business (think unplanned growth and/or a new, financially attractive) reason to do so. ??? Whoa I want to meet *your* management fella. Damn, things must be different over there. Shane ... -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
Remember that I stated that I am ever the optimist! grin In reality, I finished that ELA (valued at over $8M with a 1.5M breather) and spent all but $27K of that $1.5M and did not go over the cap. My reward? RIF'd the next month. Oh well. Got my current job within weeks of my last day. :-) -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Shane Ginnane Sent: Monday, May 20, 2013 6:43 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ... On Mon, 20 May 2013 05:52:11 -0400, Richards, Robert B. wrote: Even if management lays waste to your planning, one assumes that it would be for a good business (think unplanned growth and/or a new, financially attractive) reason to do so. ??? Whoa I want to meet *your* management fella. Damn, things must be different over there. Shane ... -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
Robert Richards wrote: In reality, I finished that ELA (valued at over $8M with a 1.5M breather) and spent all but $27K of that $1.5M and did not go over the cap. That's about 1.8% on the under side according to my math, and that's very, very good. I have no idea what Robert's organization's contract was, but I have to assume they would have done very nicely with the sort of numbers Robert describes. However, even if you're not as good as Robert -- even if you deviate under or over by a rather considerable amount -- you're still very likely to do well. In my view if you can reasonably predict a somewhat conservative (but not too conservative!) utilization forecast which includes growth -- most organizations can do that -- talk with your IBM representative. And, in my view, be sure to aim at least some of those benefits back onto your zEnterprise, and be sure to handle any internal cost accounting correctly and without fostering perverse incentives. Note that the without...perverse incentives comment also means not resorting to unnatural acts to fit within a particular capacity, because that usually only squeezes the balloon in perverse ways. Sure, optimize and tune everywhere, starting with the most financially impactful stuff which may not be your mainframe. I hope we all understand by now that marginal total costs on mainframes are comparatively much lower than the initial ones -- the IBM-related costs, anyway, and usually the others as well. The cost curves are truly very curvy. That's not as true elsewhere, typically. Adding a couple more non-mainframe cores to save a couple MIPS is generally a very bad financial proposition and increasingly so over time it seems, and it may not even accomplish that minus couple MIPS anyway. Timothy Sipples GMU VCT Architect Executive (Based in Singapore) E-Mail: sipp...@sg.ibm.com -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
Words have meaning. ...Which probably at least reduce the intensity... almost never means *zero* worry. Why else would I have typed those words? Let's try again. Enterprise License Agreements (ELAs) still require SCRT collection and submission. I didn't claim otherwise. How much you worry about those monthly reports -- the intensity of worry -- will depend in large measure on your caps relative to your utilization. I strongly disagree with the statement that Tails IBM wins, heads you lose with ELAs. The ideal case is that you choose caps (a utilization forecast) that are exactly as you experience. However, if you don't -- if you're either too high or too low -- YOU STILL ENJOY ELA BENEFITS! You haven't *maximized* those benefits, but you still come out way ahead unless you've totally screwed up. It's a gamble, but the odds of winning that bet are HEAVILY weighted in your favor. Ask your IBM representative. Timothy Sipples GMU VCT Architect Executive (Based in Singapore) E-Mail: sipp...@sg.ibm.com -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
That is *not* how I remember it. Otherwise, what is the point of the ELA? I don't know that there is a point for MLC. But as part of an ELA, you may be able to get discounts on PPA and zOTC and your total spend (including MLC) supposedly goes into the calculation for what kind of discount you get. Scott Chapman -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
There are also Enterprise License Agreements (ELAs) which probably at least reduce the intensity of worrying about this stuff month to month. Ask your IBM representative. Timothy Sipples GMU VCT Architect Executive (Based in Singapore) E-Mail: sipp...@sg.ibm.com -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
W dniu 2013-05-14 23:23, Ed Jaffe pisze: On 5/14/2013 2:05 PM, R.S. wrote: Why IBM does not provide price per MSU of z/OS, DB2, IMS, CICS, etc? With possible discounts on n-th MSU, maybe as a formula. Here in the U.S., we logon to https://www.ibm.com/ibmlink/eswprice/PriceESW.wss to see System z software prices for all metrics, including 'possible discounts on the n-th MSU' (SIC) You don't have access to this tool in your country? You have attempted to access an IBMLink application which is currently not available in your country. In my country the only way to get info about prices is to ask IBMer and the IBMer can input data (software set, MSU) to the black box and get an answer. In that way, using several queries, you can have some idea about the curve price=f(MSU). BTW: Since you have access to the IBM prices - what is the reason for purchasing third party tools like LCS? IMHO the only thing I need is spreadsheet + price information from IBM + information what software is used and what MSU. Only second part seems to be a problem. -- Radoslaw Skorupka Lodz, Poland -- Tre tej wiadomoci moe zawiera informacje prawnie chronione Banku przeznaczone wycznie do uytku subowego adresata. Odbiorc moe by jedynie jej adresat z wyczeniem dostpu osób trzecich. Jeeli nie jeste adresatem niniejszej wiadomoci lub pracownikiem upowanionym do jej przekazania adresatowi, informujemy, e jej rozpowszechnianie, kopiowanie, rozprowadzanie lub inne dziaanie o podobnym charakterze jest prawnie zabronione i moe by karalne. Jeeli otrzymae t wiadomo omykowo, prosimy niezwocznie zawiadomi nadawc wysyajc odpowied oraz trwale usun t wiadomo wczajc w to wszelkie jej kopie wydrukowane lub zapisane na dysku. This e-mail may contain legally privileged information of the Bank and is intended solely for business use of the addressee. This e-mail may only be received by the addressee and may not be disclosed to any third parties. If you are not the intended addressee of this e-mail or the employee authorised to forward it to the addressee, be advised that any dissemination, copying, distribution or any other similar activity is legally prohibited and may be punishable. If you received this e-mail by mistake please advise the sender immediately by using the reply facility in your e-mail software and delete permanently this e-mail including any copies of it either printed or saved to hard drive. BRE Bank SA, 00-950 Warszawa, ul. Senatorska 18, tel. +48 (22) 829 00 00, fax +48 (22) 829 00 33, www.brebank.pl, e-mail: i...@brebank.pl Sd Rejonowy dla m. st. Warszawy XII Wydzia Gospodarczy Krajowego Rejestru Sdowego, nr rejestru przedsibiorców KRS 025237, NIP: 526-021-50-88. Wedug stanu na dzie 01.01.2013 r. kapita zakadowy BRE Banku SA (w caoci wpacony) wynosi 168.555.904 zotych. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
Timothy, That is not exactly true. Even with an ELA, you are required to still collect the SMF data and submit the SCRT reports as before. It is just that the monthly invoice should be substantially lower! When I had an ELA, I compared the monthly LCS invoice against the monthly ELA amount to demonstrate to executive management the exact value of the ELA on a monthly basis. Bob -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Timothy Sipples Sent: Wednesday, May 15, 2013 2:07 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ... There are also Enterprise License Agreements (ELAs) which probably at least reduce the intensity of worrying about this stuff month to month. Ask your IBM representative. Timothy Sipples GMU VCT Architect Executive (Based in Singapore) E-Mail: sipp...@sg.ibm.com -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
EMEA pricing is generally higher than the US pricing. At least that was my experience when I was a S/390 Client Rep. in Saudi Arabia sixteen years ago. Price lifts occurred sometimes by EMEA and also sometimes by the IBM x company (substitute your favorite country for x). As to LCS, auditing the SCRT numbers was its original purpose. Also, it had the capability to exclude timeframes long before SCRT was enhanced to support it. In my years of using LCS, it has paid for itself every year in software savings. There is a column in the SCRT spreadsheets labeled Customer MSUs. I have used it on a monthly basis for COBOL charges for over a decade. As shipped, IBM's LPAR charges for COBOL are close to their z/OS peak consumption. LCS tracks actual usage using SMF 30 records and reports it real usage. There is much more to LCS than I have described, but I'll leave that as an exercise for the reader to pursue at www.sherkow.com. Suffice it to say that I know of no other product that pays for itself many times over, in REAL dollars/euros/your currency. Bob -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of R.S. Sent: Wednesday, May 15, 2013 3:20 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ... W dniu 2013-05-14 23:23, Ed Jaffe pisze: On 5/14/2013 2:05 PM, R.S. wrote: Why IBM does not provide price per MSU of z/OS, DB2, IMS, CICS, etc? With possible discounts on n-th MSU, maybe as a formula. Here in the U.S., we logon to https://www.ibm.com/ibmlink/eswprice/PriceESW.wss to see System z software prices for all metrics, including 'possible discounts on the n-th MSU' (SIC) You don't have access to this tool in your country? You have attempted to access an IBMLink application which is currently not available in your country. In my country the only way to get info about prices is to ask IBMer and the IBMer can input data (software set, MSU) to the black box and get an answer. In that way, using several queries, you can have some idea about the curve price=f(MSU). BTW: Since you have access to the IBM prices - what is the reason for purchasing third party tools like LCS? IMHO the only thing I need is spreadsheet + price information from IBM + information what software is used and what MSU. Only second part seems to be a problem. -- Radoslaw Skorupka Lodz, Poland -- Tre tej wiadomoci moe zawiera informacje prawnie chronione Banku przeznaczone wycznie do uytku subowego adresata. Odbiorc moe by jedynie jej adresat z wyczeniem dostpu osób trzecich. Jeeli nie jeste adresatem niniejszej wiadomoci lub pracownikiem upowanionym do jej przekazania adresatowi, informujemy, e jej rozpowszechnianie, kopiowanie, rozprowadzanie lub inne dziaanie o podobnym charakterze jest prawnie zabronione i moe by karalne. Jeeli otrzymae t wiadomo omykowo, prosimy niezwocznie zawiadomi nadawc wysyajc odpowied oraz trwale usun t wiadomo wczajc w to wszelkie jej kopie wydrukowane lub zapisane na dysku. This e-mail may contain legally privileged information of the Bank and is intended solely for business use of the addressee. This e-mail may only be received by the addressee and may not be disclosed to any third parties. If you are not the intended addressee of this e-mail or the employee authorised to forward it to the addressee, be advised that any dissemination, copying, distribution or any other similar activity is legally prohibited and may be punishable. If you received this e-mail by mistake please advise the sender immediately by using the reply facility in your e-mail software and delete permanently this e-mail including any copies of it either printed or saved to hard drive. BRE Bank SA, 00-950 Warszawa, ul. Senatorska 18, tel. +48 (22) 829 00 00, fax +48 (22) 829 00 33, www.brebank.pl, e-mail: i...@brebank.pl Sd Rejonowy dla m. st. Warszawy XII Wydzia Gospodarczy Krajowego Rejestru Sdowego, nr rejestru przedsibiorców KRS 025237, NIP: 526-021-50-88. Wedug stanu na dzie 01.01.2013 r. kapita zakadowy BRE Banku SA (w caoci wpacony) wynosi 168.555.904 zotych. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
In everything I've been lead to believe is true (in the US), an ELA doesn't relieve you from paying for the actual cost of MLC software capacity that you've consumed. You may have budgeted an amount of $x/month for MLC in the ELA and that's the amount of the check you send IBM every month. But they track the actual amount that you've used as reported via SCRT. At the end of each year, the total SCRT-reported charges are compared to the amount you paid IBM. If you paid IBM too much, good for them, too bad for you. If you paid them too little, you owe them the difference. Tails IBM wins, heads you lose. So if you're in an ELA, you should be tracking that difference so you know whether to be prepared for the bill, or possibly turn up your caps a little bit to get some more work done. Planning for an ELA is an interesting combination of capacity planning, timing of software and hardware upgrades and unannounced price change guessing. Predicting all those things more than 15 months out is mostly guesswork. If somebody knows of ELAs working differently, then I'd desperately like to hear about it. Scott Chapman On Wed, 15 May 2013 05:19:45 -0400, Richards, Robert B. robert.richa...@opm.gov wrote: Timothy, That is not exactly true. Even with an ELA, you are required to still collect the SMF data and submit the SCRT reports as before. It is just that the monthly invoice should be substantially lower! When I had an ELA, I compared the monthly LCS invoice against the monthly ELA amount to demonstrate to executive management the exact value of the ELA on a monthly basis. Bob -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Timothy Sipples Sent: Wednesday, May 15, 2013 2:07 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ... There are also Enterprise License Agreements (ELAs) which probably at least reduce the intensity of worrying about this stuff month to month. Ask your IBM representative. Timothy Sipples GMU VCT Architect Executive (Based in Singapore) E-Mail: sipp...@sg.ibm.com -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
Scott, That is *not* how I remember it. Otherwise, what is the point of the ELA? I could be wrong as I am six years removed from doing a lot of IBM software asset management for my previous employer. Bob -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Scott Chapman Sent: Wednesday, May 15, 2013 6:52 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ... In everything I've been lead to believe is true (in the US), an ELA doesn't relieve you from paying for the actual cost of MLC software capacity that you've consumed. You may have budgeted an amount of $x/month for MLC in the ELA and that's the amount of the check you send IBM every month. But they track the actual amount that you've used as reported via SCRT. At the end of each year, the total SCRT-reported charges are compared to the amount you paid IBM. If you paid IBM too much, good for them, too bad for you. If you paid them too little, you owe them the difference. Tails IBM wins, heads you lose. So if you're in an ELA, you should be tracking that difference so you know whether to be prepared for the bill, or possibly turn up your caps a little bit to get some more work done. Planning for an ELA is an interesting combination of capacity planning, timing of software and hardware upgrades and unannounced price change guessing. Predicting all those things more than 15 months out is mostly guesswork. If somebody knows of ELAs working differently, then I'd desperately like to hear about it. Scott Chapman On Wed, 15 May 2013 05:19:45 -0400, Richards, Robert B. robert.richa...@opm.gov wrote: Timothy, That is not exactly true. Even with an ELA, you are required to still collect the SMF data and submit the SCRT reports as before. It is just that the monthly invoice should be substantially lower! When I had an ELA, I compared the monthly LCS invoice against the monthly ELA amount to demonstrate to executive management the exact value of the ELA on a monthly basis. Bob -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Timothy Sipples Sent: Wednesday, May 15, 2013 2:07 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ... There are also Enterprise License Agreements (ELAs) which probably at least reduce the intensity of worrying about this stuff month to month. Ask your IBM representative. --- - Timothy Sipples GMU VCT Architect Executive (Based in Singapore) E-Mail: sipp...@sg.ibm.com -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Predict WLC invoice amount ...
Hi all, we have a contract type WLC with IBM (license calculated on the basis of the charge consumed monthly). Can we predict the amount of the invoice based on the charge consumed for a month (using a rule of three, for example). thank you. Best regards/Cordialement. ** This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. www.gbp.ma ** -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
Hi, if with predict you mean calculate I think the answer is yes. As far as I know, the calculation is based on: 1) CPU consumption from the 2th day of the month to the 1st of the next one 2) Software license price You have the (1) running the WLC Tool provided by IBM after providing the SMF records needed. You have the (2) from the IBM contract or from the previous invoice (if nothing changed). Last but not least, I think you have to calculate in order to double check IBM invoice. Regards. Massimo 2013/5/14 Moussadak Mostafa mmoussa...@cpm.co.ma Hi all, we have a contract type WLC with IBM (license calculated on the basis of the charge consumed monthly). Can we predict the amount of the invoice based on the charge consumed for a month (using a rule of three, for example). thank you. Best regards/Cordialement. ** This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. www.gbp.ma ** -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
Predicting future usage based on previous consumption might tempting but is a fool's errand. Unless, of course, your users always do the same things month after month and your applications/business experiences no growth, etc. Now if you are asking if there are tools to predict what your charges will be based on a current peak 4-hour rolling average MSU usage, then yes. Go to www.sherkow.com and look at Al's LCS software. It does that down to the penny for IBM variable workload license charges. It also audits IBM's subcapacity reporting tool (SCRT). Bob -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Moussadak Mostafa Sent: Tuesday, May 14, 2013 4:28 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Predict WLC invoice amount ... Hi all, we have a contract type WLC with IBM (license calculated on the basis of the charge consumed monthly). Can we predict the amount of the invoice based on the charge consumed for a month (using a rule of three, for example). thank you. Best regards/Cordialement. ** This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. www.gbp.ma ** -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
Predicting is possible by capping the usage, so you know what you will deliver and how much this will cost. Raising the capping due to performance problems will allow you to recalculate your prediction. Kees. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Richards, Robert B. Sent: Tuesday, May 14, 2013 12:51 To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ... Predicting future usage based on previous consumption might tempting but is a fool's errand. Unless, of course, your users always do the same things month after month and your applications/business experiences no growth, etc. Now if you are asking if there are tools to predict what your charges will be based on a current peak 4-hour rolling average MSU usage, then yes. Go to www.sherkow.com and look at Al's LCS software. It does that down to the penny for IBM variable workload license charges. It also audits IBM's subcapacity reporting tool (SCRT). Bob -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Moussadak Mostafa Sent: Tuesday, May 14, 2013 4:28 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Predict WLC invoice amount ... Hi all, we have a contract type WLC with IBM (license calculated on the basis of the charge consumed monthly). Can we predict the amount of the invoice based on the charge consumed for a month (using a rule of three, for example). thank you. Best regards/Cordialement. ** This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. If you have received this email in error please notify the system manager. This footnote also confirms that this email message has been swept by MIMEsweeper for the presence of computer viruses. www.gbp.ma ** -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN For information, services and offers, please visit our web site: http://www.klm.com. This e-mail and any attachment may contain confidential and privileged material intended for the addressee only. If you are not the addressee, you are notified that no part of the e-mail or any attachment may be disclosed, copied or distributed, and that any other action related to this e-mail or attachment is strictly prohibited, and may be unlawful. If you have received this e-mail by error, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail, and delete this message. Koninklijke Luchtvaart Maatschappij NV (KLM), its subsidiaries and/or its employees shall not be liable for the incorrect or incomplete transmission of this e-mail or any attachments, nor responsible for any delay in receipt. Koninklijke Luchtvaart Maatschappij N.V. (also known as KLM Royal Dutch Airlines) is registered in Amstelveen, The Netherlands, with registered number 33014286 -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
Last, but not least: What is the price? Having MSU used and software installed does not mean you know the price. IBM provides power consumption calculators, CF structure wizards, but I haven't heard about license fee calculators available. Did I miss something? -- Radoslaw Skorupka Lodz, Poland W dniu 2013-05-14 13:19, Vernooij, CP - SPLXM pisze: Predicting is possible by capping the usage, so you know what you will deliver and how much this will cost. Raising the capping due to performance problems will allow you to recalculate your prediction. Kees. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Richards, Robert B. Sent: Tuesday, May 14, 2013 12:51 To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ... Predicting future usage based on previous consumption might tempting but is a fool's errand. Unless, of course, your users always do the same things month after month and your applications/business experiences no growth, etc. Now if you are asking if there are tools to predict what your charges will be based on a current peak 4-hour rolling average MSU usage, then yes. Go to www.sherkow.com and look at Al's LCS software. It does that down to the penny for IBM variable workload license charges. It also audits IBM's subcapacity reporting tool (SCRT). Bob -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Moussadak Mostafa Sent: Tuesday, May 14, 2013 4:28 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Predict WLC invoice amount ... Hi all, we have a contract type WLC with IBM (license calculated on the basis of the charge consumed monthly). Can we predict the amount of the invoice based on the charge consumed for a month (using a rule of three, for example). thank you. -- Tre tej wiadomoci moe zawiera informacje prawnie chronione Banku przeznaczone wycznie do uytku subowego adresata. Odbiorc moe by jedynie jej adresat z wyczeniem dostpu osób trzecich. Jeeli nie jeste adresatem niniejszej wiadomoci lub pracownikiem upowanionym do jej przekazania adresatowi, informujemy, e jej rozpowszechnianie, kopiowanie, rozprowadzanie lub inne dziaanie o podobnym charakterze jest prawnie zabronione i moe by karalne. Jeeli otrzymae t wiadomo omykowo, prosimy niezwocznie zawiadomi nadawc wysyajc odpowied oraz trwale usun t wiadomo wczajc w to wszelkie jej kopie wydrukowane lub zapisane na dysku. This e-mail may contain legally privileged information of the Bank and is intended solely for business use of the addressee. This e-mail may only be received by the addressee and may not be disclosed to any third parties. If you are not the intended addressee of this e-mail or the employee authorised to forward it to the addressee, be advised that any dissemination, copying, distribution or any other similar activity is legally prohibited and may be punishable. If you received this e-mail by mistake please advise the sender immediately by using the reply facility in your e-mail software and delete permanently this e-mail including any copies of it either printed or saved to hard drive. BRE Bank SA, 00-950 Warszawa, ul. Senatorska 18, tel. +48 (22) 829 00 00, fax +48 (22) 829 00 33, www.brebank.pl, e-mail: i...@brebank.pl Sd Rejonowy dla m. st. Warszawy XII Wydzia Gospodarczy Krajowego Rejestru Sdowego, nr rejestru przedsibiorców KRS 025237, NIP: 526-021-50-88. Wedug stanu na dzie 01.01.2013 r. kapita zakadowy BRE Banku SA (w caoci wpacony) wynosi 168.555.904 zotych. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
You have agreed on something with IBM, o.a. the price structure. My colleague has an XLS that allows him to calculate the cost of additional MSU consumption, one for the simple AWLC Euros and one for eventual OTC/SS costs. Kees. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of R.S. Sent: Tuesday, May 14, 2013 13:26 To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ... Last, but not least: What is the price? Having MSU used and software installed does not mean you know the price. IBM provides power consumption calculators, CF structure wizards, but I haven't heard about license fee calculators available. Did I miss something? -- Radoslaw Skorupka Lodz, Poland W dniu 2013-05-14 13:19, Vernooij, CP - SPLXM pisze: Predicting is possible by capping the usage, so you know what you will deliver and how much this will cost. Raising the capping due to performance problems will allow you to recalculate your prediction. Kees. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Richards, Robert B. Sent: Tuesday, May 14, 2013 12:51 To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ... Predicting future usage based on previous consumption might tempting but is a fool's errand. Unless, of course, your users always do the same things month after month and your applications/business experiences no growth, etc. Now if you are asking if there are tools to predict what your charges will be based on a current peak 4-hour rolling average MSU usage, then yes. Go to www.sherkow.com and look at Al's LCS software. It does that down to the penny for IBM variable workload license charges. It also audits IBM's subcapacity reporting tool (SCRT). Bob -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Moussadak Mostafa Sent: Tuesday, May 14, 2013 4:28 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Predict WLC invoice amount ... Hi all, we have a contract type WLC with IBM (license calculated on the basis of the charge consumed monthly). Can we predict the amount of the invoice based on the charge consumed for a month (using a rule of three, for example). thank you. -- Tre tej wiadomoci moe zawiera informacje prawnie chronione Banku przeznaczone wycznie do uytku subowego adresata. Odbiorc moe by jedynie jej adresat z wyczeniem dostpu osób trzecich. Jeeli nie jeste adresatem niniejszej wiadomoci lub pracownikiem upowanionym do jej przekazania adresatowi, informujemy, e jej rozpowszechnianie, kopiowanie, rozprowadzanie lub inne dziaanie o podobnym charakterze jest prawnie zabronione i moe by karalne. Jeeli otrzymae t wiadomo omykowo, prosimy niezwocznie zawiadomi nadawc wysyajc odpowied oraz trwale usun t wiadomo wczajc w to wszelkie jej kopie wydrukowane lub zapisane na dysku. This e-mail may contain legally privileged information of the Bank and is intended solely for business use of the addressee. This e-mail may only be received by the addressee and may not be disclosed to any third parties. If you are not the intended addressee of this e-mail or the employee authorised to forward it to the addressee, be advised that any dissemination, copying, distribution or any other similar activity is legally prohibited and may be punishable. If you received this e-mail by mistake please advise the sender immediately by using the reply facility in your e-mail software and delete permanently this e-mail including any copies of it either printed or saved to hard drive. BRE Bank SA, 00-950 Warszawa, ul. Senatorska 18, tel. +48 (22) 829 00 00, fax +48 (22) 829 00 33, www.brebank.pl, e-mail: i...@brebank.pl Sd Rejonowy dla m. st. Warszawy XII Wydzia Gospodarczy Krajowego Rejestru Sdowego, nr rejestru przedsibiorców KRS 025237, NIP: 526-021-50-88. Wedug stanu na dzie 01.01.2013 r. kapita zakadowy BRE Banku SA (w caoci wpacony) wynosi 168.555.904 zotych. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN For information, services and offers, please visit our web site: http://www.klm.com. This e-mail and any attachment may contain confidential and privileged material intended for the addressee only. If you are not the addressee, you are notified that no part of the e-mail or any attachment may be disclosed, copied or distributed, and that any other action related to this e-mail or attachment is strictly prohibited, and may be unlawful. If you have received this e-mail by error, please notify the sender immediately by return e-mail, and delete this message. Koninklijke
Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
LCS can calculate IBM software based on a combination of WLC, FWLC, VWLC, PSLC, etc. At my previous employer, I knew what my IBM software invoices were going to be down to the penny. And I knew it at least 30 days prior to receiving the invoice. As I said, see www.sherkow.com. Bob -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of R.S. Sent: Tuesday, May 14, 2013 7:26 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ... Last, but not least: What is the price? Having MSU used and software installed does not mean you know the price. IBM provides power consumption calculators, CF structure wizards, but I haven't heard about license fee calculators available. Did I miss something? -- Radoslaw Skorupka Lodz, Poland W dniu 2013-05-14 13:19, Vernooij, CP - SPLXM pisze: Predicting is possible by capping the usage, so you know what you will deliver and how much this will cost. Raising the capping due to performance problems will allow you to recalculate your prediction. Kees. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Richards, Robert B. Sent: Tuesday, May 14, 2013 12:51 To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ... Predicting future usage based on previous consumption might tempting but is a fool's errand. Unless, of course, your users always do the same things month after month and your applications/business experiences no growth, etc. Now if you are asking if there are tools to predict what your charges will be based on a current peak 4-hour rolling average MSU usage, then yes. Go to www.sherkow.com and look at Al's LCS software. It does that down to the penny for IBM variable workload license charges. It also audits IBM's subcapacity reporting tool (SCRT). Bob -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Moussadak Mostafa Sent: Tuesday, May 14, 2013 4:28 AM To: IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Subject: Predict WLC invoice amount ... Hi all, we have a contract type WLC with IBM (license calculated on the basis of the charge consumed monthly). Can we predict the amount of the invoice based on the charge consumed for a month (using a rule of three, for example). thank you. -- Tre tej wiadomoci moe zawiera informacje prawnie chronione Banku przeznaczone wycznie do uytku subowego adresata. Odbiorc moe by jedynie jej adresat z wyczeniem dostpu osób trzecich. Jeeli nie jeste adresatem niniejszej wiadomoci lub pracownikiem upowanionym do jej przekazania adresatowi, informujemy, e jej rozpowszechnianie, kopiowanie, rozprowadzanie lub inne dziaanie o podobnym charakterze jest prawnie zabronione i moe by karalne. Jeeli otrzymae t wiadomo omykowo, prosimy niezwocznie zawiadomi nadawc wysyajc odpowied oraz trwale usun t wiadomo wczajc w to wszelkie jej kopie wydrukowane lub zapisane na dysku. This e-mail may contain legally privileged information of the Bank and is intended solely for business use of the addressee. This e-mail may only be received by the addressee and may not be disclosed to any third parties. If you are not the intended addressee of this e-mail or the employee authorised to forward it to the addressee, be advised that any dissemination, copying, distribution or any other similar activity is legally prohibited and may be punishable. If you received this e-mail by mistake please advise the sender immediately by using the reply facility in your e-mail software and delete permanently this e-mail including any copies of it either printed or saved to hard drive. BRE Bank SA, 00-950 Warszawa, ul. Senatorska 18, tel. +48 (22) 829 00 00, fax +48 (22) 829 00 33, www.brebank.pl, e-mail: i...@brebank.pl Sd Rejonowy dla m. st. Warszawy XII Wydzia Gospodarczy Krajowego Rejestru Sdowego, nr rejestru przedsibiorców KRS 025237, NIP: 526-021-50-88. Wedug stanu na dzie 01.01.2013 r. kapita zakadowy BRE Banku SA (w caoci wpacony) wynosi 168.555.904 zotych. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
Thanks Bob! If you are using sub-capacity WLC (in any flavor) then you can use the MSUs from the SCRT reports you are sending to IBM to calculate the invoice for the month just completed. For sites in the US my tool LPAR Capacity and Software Usage Analysis Software (LCS) does calculate the resulting invoice to the penny for commercial and GSA (government) customers. If you are in another geography IBM may supply you with the prices for the products you are using and those can be entered into LCS and then LCS can calculate these other invoices. Sites have done this in Switzerland, United Kingdom, Australia, Canada and perhaps more. LCS fully understand aggregation of PricingPlexes and both MLC and IPLA products. We also provide XLS tools that can calculate the prices if you want to estimate future MSUs. As Kees pointed out the future is easier to understand if you are using capping. A site with good, mature, reliable capacity planning, is probably focused on the hardware. The Hardware MSUs may not be the same as the software MSUs, but that would provide an upper bound estimate of future software prices. Software MSUs is not necessarily the same as SCRT's calculated four hour rolling average either. -- Al Sherkow, I/S Management Strategies, Ltd. Consulting Expertise on IBM Workload License Charges (WLC), LPARs and LCS Software Seminars on IBM Mainframe Software Pricing +1 414 332-3062 -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
Everyone: Just to add some competitiveness to this string, RSM Partners also provides this type of capability, and, can identify where you can reduce your software costs by anywhere from 10% to 25% (or more in some cases). Check them out at www.rsmpartners.com. With Regards, Mitch McCluhan, Legacy Modernization Consultant -Original Message- From: Al Sherkow a...@sherkow.com To: IBM-MAIN IBM-MAIN@LISTSERV.UA.EDU Sent: Tue, May 14, 2013 10:32 am Subject: Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ... Thanks Bob! If you are using sub-capacity WLC (in any flavor) then you can use the MSUs from he SCRT reports you are sending to IBM to calculate the invoice for the month ust completed. For sites in the US my tool LPAR Capacity and Software Usage nalysis Software (LCS) does calculate the resulting invoice to the penny for ommercial and GSA (government) customers. If you are in another geography IBM may supply you with the prices for the roducts you are using and those can be entered into LCS and then LCS can alculate these other invoices. Sites have done this in Switzerland, United ingdom, Australia, Canada and perhaps more. LCS fully understand aggregation of PricingPlexes and both MLC and IPLA roducts. We also provide XLS tools that can calculate the prices if you want to stimate future MSUs. As Kees pointed out the future is easier to understand if ou are using capping. A site with good, mature, reliable capacity planning, is probably focused on he hardware. The Hardware MSUs may not be the same as the software MSUs, but hat would provide an upper bound estimate of future software prices. Software SUs is not necessarily the same as SCRT's calculated four hour rolling average ither. -- l Sherkow, I/S Management Strategies, Ltd. onsulting Expertise on IBM Workload License Charges (WLC), PARs and LCS Software eminars on IBM Mainframe Software Pricing 1 414 332-3062 - or IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, end email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
W dniu 2013-05-14 13:37, Richards, Robert B. pisze: LCS can calculate IBM software based on a combination of WLC, FWLC, VWLC, PSLC, etc. Isn't it oddity? Price-list is available as third-party tool! Especially for the prices which are not negotiable (which actually untrue). Why IBM does not provide price per MSU of z/OS, DB2, IMS, CICS, etc? With possible discounts on n-th MSU, maybe as a formula. THe price list need not to be public, it can be different for every customer and available only to the customer. BUT IT'S NOT! It's fine there is LCS tool, but IMNSHO this information should be available directly from IBM, of course for free (price-list for price-list?) BTW: Fortunately LCS has a price known to public. There is no need for special tool ;-) -- Radoslaw Skorupka Lodz, Poland -- Tre tej wiadomoci moe zawiera informacje prawnie chronione Banku przeznaczone wycznie do uytku subowego adresata. Odbiorc moe by jedynie jej adresat z wyczeniem dostpu osób trzecich. Jeeli nie jeste adresatem niniejszej wiadomoci lub pracownikiem upowanionym do jej przekazania adresatowi, informujemy, e jej rozpowszechnianie, kopiowanie, rozprowadzanie lub inne dziaanie o podobnym charakterze jest prawnie zabronione i moe by karalne. Jeeli otrzymae t wiadomo omykowo, prosimy niezwocznie zawiadomi nadawc wysyajc odpowied oraz trwale usun t wiadomo wczajc w to wszelkie jej kopie wydrukowane lub zapisane na dysku. This e-mail may contain legally privileged information of the Bank and is intended solely for business use of the addressee. This e-mail may only be received by the addressee and may not be disclosed to any third parties. If you are not the intended addressee of this e-mail or the employee authorised to forward it to the addressee, be advised that any dissemination, copying, distribution or any other similar activity is legally prohibited and may be punishable. If you received this e-mail by mistake please advise the sender immediately by using the reply facility in your e-mail software and delete permanently this e-mail including any copies of it either printed or saved to hard drive. BRE Bank SA, 00-950 Warszawa, ul. Senatorska 18, tel. +48 (22) 829 00 00, fax +48 (22) 829 00 33, www.brebank.pl, e-mail: i...@brebank.pl Sd Rejonowy dla m. st. Warszawy XII Wydzia Gospodarczy Krajowego Rejestru Sdowego, nr rejestru przedsibiorców KRS 025237, NIP: 526-021-50-88. Wedug stanu na dzie 01.01.2013 r. kapita zakadowy BRE Banku SA (w caoci wpacony) wynosi 168.555.904 zotych. -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
On 5/14/2013 2:05 PM, R.S. wrote: Why IBM does not provide price per MSU of z/OS, DB2, IMS, CICS, etc? With possible discounts on n-th MSU, maybe as a formula. Here in the U.S., we logon to https://www.ibm.com/ibmlink/eswprice/PriceESW.wss to see System z software prices for all metrics, including 'possible discounts on the n-th MSU' (SIC) You don't have access to this tool in your country? -- Edward E Jaffe Phoenix Software International, Inc 831 Parkview Drive North El Segundo, CA 90245 http://www.phoenixsoftware.com/ -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
Re: Predict WLC invoice amount ...
IBM's PriceESW application is only available in the US as far as I know. Customers in other countries are able to get the pricing tables for their products from IBM, though it is not as simple as in the US. I don't know why. This is how the customers in other countries were able to load their particular prices into LCS for their estimated invoices. Some prices are occasionally in the announcement letters. The purpose of LCS is to audit the SCRT reports. One of the early LCS customers requested that as long as LCS had the MSUs and IBM provided the pricing tables could LCS estimate the invoice? So that was implemented. Now customers can audit SCRT which is the input to the invoice, and the resultant invoice itself. Best regards, Al -- Al Sherkow, I/S Management Strategies, Ltd. Consulting Expertise on IBM Workload License Charges (WLC), LPARs and LCS Software Seminars on IBM Mainframe Software Pricing +1 414 332-3062 -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@listserv.ua.edu with the message: INFO IBM-MAIN
