Re: [Lazarus] Find dialog too tight for translations

2014-11-01 Thread Giuliano Colla


Il 27/10/2014 09:41, Mattias Gaertner ha scritto:



Giuliano Colla giuliano.co...@fastwebnet.it hat am 26. Oktober 2014 um 23:58
geschrieben:
[...]



Please report the bug.


A cleaner solution would be to build those dialogs in code, like the
other ones in the Dialogs unit, without loading an lfm file from stream.

+1


After fighting some times with AutoSize, Anchoring and Constraints to 
provide acceptable layouts with the different options enabled or not, 
and the different lengths of translations, I've posted in the bugtracker 
a patch to get rid of the .lfm and build the Find Dialogue in code.


http://bugs.freepascal.org/view.php?id=26980

The default layout is similar to the original one, but I've added a new 
option (frButtonsAtBottom) to provide an alternative layout.
If approved, I'll clean it up from the debug code, and apply the same 
recipe to the Replace Dialogue, which is in the same conditions.


Giuliano

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Re: [Lazarus] Find dialog too tight for translations

2014-10-28 Thread Frederic Da Vitoria
2014-10-24 23:34 GMT+02:00 Giuliano Colla giuliano.co...@fastwebnet.it:


 Il 24/10/2014 17:19, waldo kitty ha scritto:

 On 10/24/2014 4:39 AM, Jürgen Hestermann wrote:

 Why is the Direction box placed on the right of all other options?
 IMO it is just another option as all the others so it should be put below
 these other options. This would also avoid the problem of moving
 this box when text becomes long.


 this is similar to my suggestion posted previously ;)


 Taking into account all suggestions, I came out with two possible layouts:

 Option 1 = Buttons at the bottom of the form (like in my previous version)

 Option 2 = Buttons at the right of the form (like in the original version)

 (there's also a help button, which is not visible by default, but it may
 become visible, if the appropriate option is selected. It would go either
 at the extreme right, or at the bottom, moving nearby button right or up
 because of anchoring):

 http://www.bononiadocta.it/Lazarus/Dialogues/Dialogues.png

 I've put in the image also a localized version, to see what it looks like
 when strings become much longer.
 I'd choose option 2 because bottom line risks to become crowded if the
 help button is added, but I'd like to hear other opinions.

 Giuliano


I believe there is another difference in your layouts: the width of the
input fields is different, so that the screen copies are misleading, if the
input zones had the same width, the version with buttons at the right would
be always wider than the version with buttons at the bottom. I prefer
putting the buttons at the bottom because of this: it either allows to have
a window less wide (I prefer to have this dialog high than wide because I
feel it has less chances of getting in the way) or it allows to make the
input zone wider, which is nice when inputting large search strings. I
don't have Lazarus here now, so that I can't check: are these dialogues
real dialogues (non-resizable) or can they be resized?

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Re: [Lazarus] Find dialog too tight for translations

2014-10-28 Thread Giuliano Colla


Il 28/10/2014 06:27, Vincent Snijders ha scritto:



[..]


I prefer http://www.bononiadocta.it/Lazarus/Finddialog2.en.png and if 
it is not clear that the options are in two columns, maybe a there 
should be groupbox around it both columns. To me it seems foolish to 
leave such an area wasted because you want search direction in the 
same column.



There's already a panel to help anchoring, but with no border to keep 
previous appearance.
However I'm more and more convinced that a configurable layout is the 
best way to go. As soon as I'm rid of some urgencies I'll submit a patch 
to this effect, so that it can be judged if it provides enough options 
to satisfy different tastes/needs.


Giuliano

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Re: [Lazarus] Find dialog too tight for translations

2014-10-28 Thread Giuliano Colla


Il 28/10/2014 09:51, Frederic Da Vitoria ha scritto:

[..]
I believe there is another difference in your layouts: the width of 
the input fields is different, so that the screen copies are 
misleading, if the input zones had the same width, the version with 
buttons at the right would be always wider than the version with 
buttons at the bottom. I prefer putting the buttons at the bottom 
because of this: it either allows to have a window less wide (I prefer 
to have this dialog high than wide because I feel it has less chances 
of getting in the way) or it allows to make the input zone wider, 
which is nice when inputting large search strings. I don't have 
Lazarus here now, so that I can't check: are these dialogues real 
dialogues (non-resizable) or can they be resized?




Those dialogues are just forms, and therefore resizeable. Your comments 
add to the others to help defining which layout options to provide.


Giuliano

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Re: [Lazarus] Find dialog too tight for translations

2014-10-28 Thread waldo kitty

On 10/27/2014 5:45 PM, Giuliano Colla wrote:


Il 25/10/2014 19:13, waldo kitty ha scritto:

On 10/24/2014 5:34 PM, Giuliano Colla wrote:

Taking into account all suggestions, I came out with two possible layouts:

Option 1 = Buttons at the bottom of the form (like in my previous version)

Option 2 = Buttons at the right of the form (like in the original version)


i forgot to ask in my previous post... have you seen the find/replace dialog
in notepad++? it is tabbed with four tabs and is similar to your option 2...



No, I didn't because I don't use Windows. Therefore I'm unfamiliar with
Windows-only applications.


i'll try to attach the four views, one of each tab in the dialogue... this is 
for informational purposes only and to maybe help develop further ideas...


one thing i found interesting is that while one tab might appear to have a lot 
of white space, that space is used when other tabs are selected as you can see 
in each image... my cropping may not be accurate but the dialog's size doesn't 
change at all when each tab is selected...



[aside][ramble] i use notepad++ a lot... especially for editing multiple
files... largest project so far was editing 1000 data files with searches and
replaces across all of them at once... they were for a satellite tracking
program's ability to use different common names for the objects... when you
have hundreds of objects that result from explosions or collisions and you
want to use a different name, it comes in handy to work across multiple files
as well... [/ramble] [/aside]



Well, if you had had a nicer Find/Replace dialogue, you could have developed a
Lazarus application (possibly multi-threaded) to perform your simultaneous
search/replace across thousands of files ;-)


hahahaha!! nice topic save ;)  but seriously, what i needed at the time was an 
editor to handle many many text files at once and allow me to see and approve 
each change... i definitely didn't need to be trying to develop my own editor ;)


in any case, here's the attachments... hopefully ;)



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Re: [Lazarus] Find dialog too tight for translations

2014-10-27 Thread Mattias Gaertner


 Giuliano Colla giuliano.co...@fastwebnet.it hat am 26. Oktober 2014 um 23:58
 geschrieben:
[...]
 IOW quite a complicate situation, not too clean.

True.

 I gather that this is made necessary to avoid a circular dependency: you
 cannot include a unit which uses LCLBase into the package LCLBase itself.

Actually it is more complicated:
The LCLBase contains abstract units, while the LCL contains the implementation.
A form needs the LCL to function.
Please report the bug.

 A cleaner solution would be to build those dialogs in code, like the
 other ones in the Dialogs unit, without loading an lfm file from stream.

+1

Mattias

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Re: [Lazarus] Find dialog too tight for translations

2014-10-27 Thread Giuliano Colla


Il 25/10/2014 19:13, waldo kitty ha scritto:

On 10/24/2014 5:34 PM, Giuliano Colla wrote:
Taking into account all suggestions, I came out with two possible 
layouts:


Option 1 = Buttons at the bottom of the form (like in my previous 
version)


Option 2 = Buttons at the right of the form (like in the original 
version)


i forgot to ask in my previous post... have you seen the find/replace 
dialog in notepad++? it is tabbed with four tabs and is similar to 
your option 2...




No, I didn't because I don't use Windows. Therefore I'm unfamiliar with 
Windows-only applications.
[aside][ramble] i use notepad++ a lot... especially for editing 
multiple files... largest project so far was editing 1000 data files 
with searches and replaces across all of them at once... they were for 
a satellite tracking program's ability to use different common names 
for the objects... when you have hundreds of objects that result from 
explosions or collisions and you want to use a different name, it 
comes in handy to work across multiple files as well... [/ramble] 
[/aside]




Well, if you had had a nicer Find/Replace dialogue, you could have 
developed a Lazarus application (possibly multi-threaded) to perform 
your simultaneous search/replace across thousands of files ;-)


Giuliano

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Re: [Lazarus] Find dialog too tight for translations

2014-10-27 Thread Vincent Snijders
2014-10-24 23:34 GMT+02:00 Giuliano Colla giuliano.co...@fastwebnet.it:


 Il 24/10/2014 17:19, waldo kitty ha scritto:

 On 10/24/2014 4:39 AM, Jürgen Hestermann wrote:

 Why is the Direction box placed on the right of all other options?
 IMO it is just another option as all the others so it should be put below
 these other options. This would also avoid the problem of moving
 this box when text becomes long.


 this is similar to my suggestion posted previously ;)


 Taking into account all suggestions, I came out with two possible layouts:

 Option 1 = Buttons at the bottom of the form (like in my previous version)

 Option 2 = Buttons at the right of the form (like in the original version)

 (there's also a help button, which is not visible by default, but it may
 become visible, if the appropriate option is selected. It would go either
 at the extreme right, or at the bottom, moving nearby button right or up
 because of anchoring):

 http://www.bononiadocta.it/Lazarus/Dialogues/Dialogues.png

 I've put in the image also a localized version, to see what it looks like
 when strings become much longer.
 I'd choose option 2 because bottom line risks to become crowded if the
 help button is added, but I'd like to hear other opinions.

 I prefer http://www.bononiadocta.it/Lazarus/Finddialog2.en.png and if it
is not clear that the options are in two columns, maybe a there should be
groupbox around it both columns. To me it seems foolish to leave such an
area wasted because you want search direction in the same column.


Vincent
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Re: [Lazarus] Find dialog too tight for translations

2014-10-26 Thread Giuliano Colla


Il 25/10/2014 18:49, waldo kitty ha scritto:

On 10/24/2014 5:34 PM, Giuliano Colla wrote:
Taking into account all suggestions, I came out with two possible 
layouts:


Option 1 = Buttons at the bottom of the form (like in my previous 
version)


Option 2 = Buttons at the right of the form (like in the original 
version)


i like them both... option 2 is like a lot of stuff that i work 
with... i have no preference between them at this time... maybe 
provide both so that implementers can choose which they prefer in 
their project?




It would appear that the majority is for Option 2. However, before 
submitting a patch, I'd like to see if the proposal of a user selectable 
layout is viable. Not only to satisfy also the minority, but also to 
clean up the situation, which currently IMO isn't too much satisfactory.


The idea of a selectable configuration has triggered the following 
considerations.


What happens now is that in lcl/forms you have two units, one for the 
Find dialog and one for the Replace dialog, each one with its form. You 
must use them to design your forms. Once you're happy with them, you 
must copy the code into one of the files included by the Dialogs unit 
which loads also the lfm files generated when compiling the other units. 
IOW quite a complicate situation, not too clean.
I gather that this is made necessary to avoid a circular dependency: you 
cannot include a unit which uses LCLBase into the package LCLBase itself.


A cleaner solution would be to build those dialogs in code, like the 
other ones in the Dialogs unit, without loading an lfm file from stream. 
Besides the advantage of providing a configurable layout, this solution 
could be implemented with an ancestor class of a generic Find/replace 
dialog, from which those two dialogs could be derived. This would 
provide the extra bonus to give to users the option of building their 
own custom dialogs, deriving them from the ancestor class, for special 
usage. A find/replace dialog used in an editor of po files may need the 
options of selecting MsgId/MsgStr, an application may need to 
enable/disable a search based on regular expressions, etc.
I'd like to investigate if this path can be followed without too many 
difficulties.


Any observations?

Giuliano

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Re: [Lazarus] Find dialog too tight for translations

2014-10-25 Thread Jürgen Hestermann


Am 2014-10-24 um 23:34 schrieb Giuliano Colla:

Taking into account all suggestions, I came out with two possible layouts:
Option 1 = Buttons at the bottom of the form (like in my previous version)
Option 2 = Buttons at the right of the form (like in the original version)
(there's also a help button, which is not visible by default, but it may become 
visible, if the appropriate option is selected. It would go either at the 
extreme right, or at the bottom, moving nearby button right or up because of 
anchoring):
http://www.bononiadocta.it/Lazarus/Dialogues/Dialogues.png
I've put in the image also a localized version, to see what it looks like when 
strings become much longer.
I'd choose option 2 because bottom line risks to become crowded if the help 
button is added, but I'd like to hear other opinions.
Giuliano



I would prefer option 1.
It is a clear list with bottons on the bottom as usual.
The other options look more or less confusing to me.
Having the buttons on the right looks as if
they have nothing to do with the whole dialog.


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Re: [Lazarus] Find dialog too tight for translations

2014-10-25 Thread Bart
On 10/24/14, Giuliano Colla giuliano.co...@fastwebnet.it wrote:


 Option 1 = Buttons at the bottom of the form (like in my previous version)

 Option 2 = Buttons at the right of the form (like in the original version)

I prefer buttons on right, especially in ReplaceDlg, otherwise there
is a lot of empty space next to the checkboxes.

Just my opinion.

Bart

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Re: [Lazarus] Find dialog too tight for translations

2014-10-25 Thread Jürgen Hestermann


Am 2014-10-25 um 13:26 schrieb Bart:

I prefer buttons on right, especially in ReplaceDlg, otherwise there is a lot 
of empty space next to the checkboxes.


With the buttons on the right the same empty space
exists between the options on the left and the buttons
which tears apart what should be together.
Empty space is no issue if it is just that: Empty space (see Google web page).
But if things that belong to each other are put so far apart it is confusing 
IMO.


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Re: [Lazarus] Find dialog too tight for translations

2014-10-25 Thread waldo kitty

On 10/24/2014 5:34 PM, Giuliano Colla wrote:

Taking into account all suggestions, I came out with two possible layouts:

Option 1 = Buttons at the bottom of the form (like in my previous version)

Option 2 = Buttons at the right of the form (like in the original version)


i like them both... option 2 is like a lot of stuff that i work with... i have 
no preference between them at this time... maybe provide both so that 
implementers can choose which they prefer in their project?


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Re: [Lazarus] Find dialog too tight for translations

2014-10-25 Thread waldo kitty

On 10/24/2014 5:34 PM, Giuliano Colla wrote:

Taking into account all suggestions, I came out with two possible layouts:

Option 1 = Buttons at the bottom of the form (like in my previous version)

Option 2 = Buttons at the right of the form (like in the original version)


i forgot to ask in my previous post... have you seen the find/replace dialog in 
notepad++? it is tabbed with four tabs and is similar to your option 2...


[aside][ramble] i use notepad++ a lot... especially for editing multiple 
files... largest project so far was editing 1000 data files with searches and 
replaces across all of them at once... they were for a satellite tracking 
program's ability to use different common names for the objects... when you 
have hundreds of objects that result from explosions or collisions and you want 
to use a different name, it comes in handy to work across multiple files as 
well... [/ramble] [/aside]


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Re: [Lazarus] Find dialog too tight for translations

2014-10-24 Thread Jürgen Hestermann


Am 2014-10-24 um 00:09 schrieb Giuliano Colla:

Not to reinvent the wheel, I've taken as a guideline the find/replace dialog of 
the IDE editor, and the changes just made by Matthias.
What has come out is:
http://www.bononiadocta.it/Lazarus/Finddialog1.en.png
and:
http://www.bononiadocta.it/Lazarus/Finddialog2.en.png
In both all translations I tested fit without problems. The Directions box 
moves to the right following the length of the strings of the checkboxes.
If nobody comes out with better ideas/suggestion, I'll post the patch in the 
bugtracker.
Giuliano


Why is the Direction box placed on the right of all other options?
IMO it is just another option as all the others so it should be put below
these other options. This would also avoid the problem of moving
this box when text becomes long.

And I would change the text from Direction to Search Direction to
make it clear, of what purpose this direction option is.

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Re: [Lazarus] Find dialog too tight for translations

2014-10-24 Thread Giuliano Colla


Il 24/10/2014 10:39, Jürgen Hestermann ha scritto:


Am 2014-10-24 um 00:09 schrieb Giuliano Colla:
Not to reinvent the wheel, I've taken as a guideline the find/replace 
dialog of the IDE editor, and the changes just made by Matthias.

What has come out is:
http://www.bononiadocta.it/Lazarus/Finddialog1.en.png
and:
http://www.bononiadocta.it/Lazarus/Finddialog2.en.png
In both all translations I tested fit without problems. The 
Directions box moves to the right following the length of the 
strings of the checkboxes.
If nobody comes out with better ideas/suggestion, I'll post the patch 
in the bugtracker.

Giuliano


Why is the Direction box placed on the right of all other options?
IMO it is just another option as all the others so it should be put below
these other options. This would also avoid the problem of moving
this box when text becomes long.

And I would change the text from Direction to Search Direction to
make it clear, of what purpose this direction option is.



Thank you for the feedback. The reason to keep it to the right was 
simply that it was there before.

I'll try your layout and we'll see what comes out.

Giuliano

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Re: [Lazarus] Find dialog too tight for translations

2014-10-24 Thread waldo kitty

On 10/24/2014 4:39 AM, Jürgen Hestermann wrote:

Why is the Direction box placed on the right of all other options?
IMO it is just another option as all the others so it should be put below
these other options. This would also avoid the problem of moving
this box when text becomes long.


this is similar to my suggestion posted previously ;)

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Re: [Lazarus] Find dialog too tight for translations

2014-10-24 Thread Giuliano Colla


Il 24/10/2014 17:19, waldo kitty ha scritto:

On 10/24/2014 4:39 AM, Jürgen Hestermann wrote:

Why is the Direction box placed on the right of all other options?
IMO it is just another option as all the others so it should be put 
below

these other options. This would also avoid the problem of moving
this box when text becomes long.


this is similar to my suggestion posted previously ;)



Taking into account all suggestions, I came out with two possible layouts:

Option 1 = Buttons at the bottom of the form (like in my previous version)

Option 2 = Buttons at the right of the form (like in the original version)

(there's also a help button, which is not visible by default, but it may 
become visible, if the appropriate option is selected. It would go 
either at the extreme right, or at the bottom, moving nearby button 
right or up because of anchoring):


http://www.bononiadocta.it/Lazarus/Dialogues/Dialogues.png

I've put in the image also a localized version, to see what it looks 
like when strings become much longer.
I'd choose option 2 because bottom line risks to become crowded if the 
help button is added, but I'd like to hear other opinions.


Giuliano

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[Lazarus] Find dialog too tight for translations

2014-10-23 Thread Giuliano Colla
I've found a problem in the find dialogue, when used in a language 
different from English.


In English it's already a bit crowded:

http://www.bononiadocta.it/Lazarus/Finddialog.en.png

but once translated it becomes horrible:

http://www.bononiadocta.it/Lazarus/Finddialog.it.png
http://www.bononiadocta.it/Lazarus/Finddialog.hu.png

The same problem arises with the Replace dialogue.
With some resizing they could be fixed, but I've stumbled into a problem.

The source containing the form is FindDlgUnit in /lcl/forms (which is 
part of the LCLBase package), while the .lrs is loaded by the Dialogs 
unit (also part of the same package).
But editing the form and then recompiling the package apparently doesn't 
update the .lrs, because the dialogue appears unchanged.


What's the proper way of updating the .lrs, in order to have a dialogue 
which can fit non-English languages?


Giuliano

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Re: [Lazarus] Find dialog too tight for translations

2014-10-23 Thread Mattias Gaertner


 Giuliano Colla giuliano.co...@fastwebnet.it hat am 23. Oktober 2014 um 14:12
 geschrieben:
 
 
 I've found a problem in the find dialogue, when used in a language
 different from English.
 
 In English it's already a bit crowded:
 
 http://www.bononiadocta.it/Lazarus/Finddialog.en.png

I changed the layout a bit so that the options do not overlap anymore. The
buttons are now autosized.


[...]
 The source containing the form is FindDlgUnit in /lcl/forms (which is
 part of the LCLBase package), while the .lrs is loaded by the Dialogs
 unit (also part of the same package).

There is no lrs file anymore. What version are you using?

 But editing the form and then recompiling the package apparently doesn't
 update the .lrs, because the dialogue appears unchanged.
 
 What's the proper way of updating the .lrs, in order to have a dialogue
 which can fit non-English languages?

Mattias

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Re: [Lazarus] Find dialog too tight for translations

2014-10-23 Thread Giuliano Colla


Il 23/10/2014 14:49, Mattias Gaertner ha scritto:

[...]



In English it's already a bit crowded:

http://www.bononiadocta.it/Lazarus/Finddialog.en.png

I changed the layout a bit so that the options do not overlap anymore. The
buttons are now autosized.


Thanks a lot.

[...]
The source containing the form is FindDlgUnit in /lcl/forms (which is
part of the LCLBase package), while the .lrs is loaded by the Dialogs
unit (also part of the same package).

There is no lrs file anymore. What version are you using?


The trunk version, and I took for good the comments I found there.
However, for my information, what should I have done to make it accept 
my correction?
Apparently recompiling the LCLBase Package, with just FindDialogUnit 
modified wasn't enough.


Giuliano

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Re: [Lazarus] Find dialog too tight for translations

2014-10-23 Thread waldo kitty

On 10/23/2014 8:12 AM, Giuliano Colla wrote:

I've found a problem in the find dialogue, when used in a language different
from English.

In English it's already a bit crowded:

http://www.bononiadocta.it/Lazarus/Finddialog.en.png

but once translated it becomes horrible:


is that your layout? i've never used it but my first suggestion would be to 
place direction under text and the forward/backward selectors under the 
text field... that moves everything else down a line... ignore me if i'm 
(way?) off-base ;)


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Re: [Lazarus] Find dialog too tight for translations

2014-10-23 Thread Giuliano Colla


Il 23/10/2014 19:35, waldo kitty ha scritto:


is that your layout? i've never used it but my first suggestion would 
be to place direction under text and the forward/backward 
selectors under the text field... that moves everything else down a 
line... ignore me if i'm (way?) off-base ;)




No, that's the official layout provided by LCL.
It's rather old, I think, and, I presume,  not much used.
The IDE editor uses his own dialogue, which is larger but much better 
organized.
Maybe it's worth a revision, together with the replace dialogue, which 
suffers of the same problems.


Giuliano

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Re: [Lazarus] Find dialog too tight for translations

2014-10-23 Thread Juha Manninen
On Thu, Oct 23, 2014 at 9:19 PM, Giuliano Colla
giuliano.co...@fastwebnet.it wrote:
 Maybe it's worth a revision, together with the replace dialogue, which
 suffers of the same problems.

+1

Juha

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Re: [Lazarus] Find dialog too tight for translations

2014-10-23 Thread Giuliano Colla


Il 23/10/2014 20:52, Juha Manninen ha scritto:

On Thu, Oct 23, 2014 at 9:19 PM, Giuliano Colla
giuliano.co...@fastwebnet.it wrote:

Maybe it's worth a revision, together with the replace dialogue, which
suffers of the same problems.

+1


Not to reinvent the wheel, I've taken as a guideline the find/replace 
dialog of the IDE editor, and the changes just made by Matthias.

What has come out is:

http://www.bononiadocta.it/Lazarus/Finddialog1.en.png

and:

http://www.bononiadocta.it/Lazarus/Finddialog2.en.png

In both all translations I tested fit without problems. The Directions 
box moves to the right following the length of the strings of the 
checkboxes.


If nobody comes out with better ideas/suggestion, I'll post the patch in 
the bugtracker.


Giuliano

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Project planning question: when it's 90% done, are we halfway or not yet?


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