Re: Question about driver for Mantis
Gernot Pansy wrote: > will CI be supported and are you willing to finish development and merge it > to > mainline anytime? > > i think i was one of the first SP400 owner but i had to sold my card for a > Nova > HD2 because the driver was not reliable (some i2c errors, slow tunning, > sometimes tunning failed). And now i need a dvb-s2 card with ci working. so > i'm searching again for a new card. their seems to be only the tt-3200 out, > which seems to work - no newer card. > I believe a friend of mine chose KNC1+ clone, they are working in Linux and also have a working CI interface. That's how he uses it anyway. I'd recommend especially his Mystique SaTiX-S2. They have a high quality finish and the CI slot is nicely prepared for 3.5" drive integration: http://www.cesarex.com/images/Mystique-CI-1.jpg http://www.sat-servis.cz/data/eshop/fotky/produkty/velke/619.jpg -- Dave -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-media" in the body of a message to majord...@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
Re: Re : [linux-dvb] Most stable DVB-S2 PCI Card?
Manu wrote: > Le 23/05/2009 01:51:15, David Lister a écrit : > >> Manu Abraham wrote: >> >>> On Sat, May 23, 2009 at 1:30 AM, David Lister >>> >> wrote: >> >>> >>> >>>> Actually, there are many DVB-S2 cards supporting 45 MS/s, even >>>> >> TeVii S460 >> >>>> can do 2-45 MS/s. I spoke with a fellow TeVii owner, who confirmed >>>> >> the card >> >>>> is working with a 45 MS/s transponder on Express AM2 without *any* >>>> >> issues. >> >>>> All this aside, there aren't any transponders with higher rates >>>> >> than this >> >>>> and there won't be for many years. Who knows how stable would TT >>>> >> even be >> >>>> with such rates? For now, it's irrelevant anyway. I have no >>>> >> problem >> >>>> upgrading to a new card in 3-4 years, providing there will be a >>>> >> stable, >> >>>> fully supported card for Linux with as many satisfied owners as >>>> >> e.g. Nova S2 >> >>>> HD has. >>>> >>>> >>> You are talking about a 45 MSPS DVB-S stream on a DVB-S2 >>> >> demodulator, >> >>> while i was talking about a 45 MSPS DVB-S2 stream on a DVB-S2 >>> >> demodulator. >> >>> Big difference ! >>> >>> >> This point is moot in the first place, mate. Especially in USA >> (original >> poster), where it'll take twice the time to reach those rates on >> DVB-S2. >> All current 45 MS/s transponders are QPSK, at least as far as I can >> tell. Even if that "technology preview" 8PSK transponder of yours >> existed (somewhere above Asia), it's hardly a reason to buy >> Linux-unstable cards in EU or USA. Especially considering OP's quest >> > > Just a quick note: Manu is right at least here in the French Caribbean > Islands where, under the pretext of streaming more HD channels, > CanalSat Caraibes (which is strongly affiliated with Canal+ France) is > broadcasting DVB-S2 QPSK 45 MSPS. People are really upset about it > because it basically boils down to lock everybody into renting their > decoder. > So yes, some people (read me ;-) desperately needs DVB-S2 HW supporting > high SPS rates (plus I need CI also). For now I dont see this rare > bird! If someone knows one with good linux driver... > Yes, that would be the Intelsat 903 we talked about. Btw, you sure it's QPSK? If so, it's not S2, but S. :) Never mind that anyway, dear, our discussion wasn't about existence or non-existence of high rate 8PSK signals. In the beginning of the thread we established that there are places on Earth with these signals (your bird seems the only one, but there may be more!). The question was their relevance for typical US / EU citizens *now*. There's no doubt in my mind that higher rates will become used eventually, perhaps sooner that we think even if it may seem unlikely - a year, two? Even during this "short time", I'll be using standard HW which has been good enough for everybody for years and when the time comes, there will be new HW to choose from - perhaps even better than TT-1600. :) This is my point, the rest are just reactions to Manu. Btw, *Manu*, I just read your on-line resume. You're in Bangalore, right? Funny thing, I'm in India too - for half a year already, but I'll be leaving soon. It's business crap as usual, but India for the first time. I kinda like it here. Destinations without proper engineers call upon us, the European *Jedi* of the HA/HP computing, to build & install IBM supercomputers for them and design new infrastructures. :o) If you want to come and smash my face with a hammer, feel free to visit me in Koregaon Park. :o) -- Dave -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-media" in the body of a message to majord...@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
Re: Question about driver for Mantis
hermann pitton wrote: > Am Samstag, den 23.05.2009, 22:12 +0200 schrieb David Lister: > >> Manu Abraham wrote: >> >>> On Sat, May 23, 2009 at 9:42 PM, David Lister wrote: >>> >>> >>>> Manu Abraham wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>>> 2009/5/23 David Lister : >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> Not sure if you didn't get this email already, I had a slip-up while >>>>>> sending it. :) Anyway, there's also another supported card with a CI. A >>>>>> friend of mine has it, so I guess it works quite well with Linux. It's >>>>>> Mystique SaTiX-S2 (AFAIK, similar to KNC1+). Mystiques have rather >>>>>> quality finish and the CI module is ready for 3.5" drive installation. >>>>>> Some pictures from google: >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.cesarex.com/images/Mystique-CI-1.jpg >>>>>> http://www.sat-servis.cz/data/eshop/fotky/produkty/velke/619.jpg >>>>>> >>>>>> Others might be able to tell you more details, I just know it works - >>>>>> friend has a Cryptoworks CAM in it. Take a look around, bye. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> The Mystique is just a rebranded KNC1+ which just uses the same >>>>> STB0899 module, FYI. :-) >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> Not exactly. People usually say it is a rebrand/clone of KNC1+, but it's >>>> not. :) There are couple of differences -- Mystique is a lighter version >>>> missing these features: >>>> 1) Signal passthrough via loop-out connector >>>> 2) Video input port for analogue capture >>>> >>>> I'm glad you reminded me of this misconception, the differences might be >>>> important for somebody. I was considering Mystique for myself, but chose >>>> CX24116 over STB0899, because this time, I wanted official support. I >>>> don't need analogue capture and CI anyway (I use softcam and for analog, >>>> much better Hauppauge PVR-500). I suggest Mystique instead of KNC1+ for >>>> purely practical reasons - it's more available, cheaper and nicer. :) >>>> >>>> >>> No misconceptions: >>> >>> >> Oh, but there are. We were both talking about the sat version of KNC1+, >> not KNC1! You said and I quote: "The Mystique is just a rebranded >> KNC1+", which is not true. That's why I originally said that it's >> *similar* to Mystique, which *is* true. It might be the same as plain >> KNC1 or dozens of other rebranded versions, but that wasn't the point. >> The misconception is that "Mystique is KNC1+ clone" -- it is not. >> Perhaps I could have mentioned basic TV Station DVB-S too, but I didn't >> expect I'll have to defend every word I say. Now that I think about it, >> I'm glad I didn't - your inability to comprehend the simplest of >> meanings shines like the sun. >> >> Your follow-up comment was completely useless, arbitrary trolling. If >> you could face the life like a man instead of a cry baby, you wouldn't >> have the need to patronise me (unsuccessfully:)) in an unrelated thread >> just because of our earlier argument. You should be ashamed of yourself. >> You're a DVB driver developer and you have a hard time arguing with >> somebody who has seen DVB-S for the first time in his life a month ago! >> >> >>> So support for it just appeared like magic ? >>> >>> >> Were you arguing with one of your other personalities in your head that >> I missed something? I'm afraid you are a bit confused today, or you >> misinterpret the meaning of my words on purpose, or are just pissed off >> at me. :) Whatever. Because it might be your weak English, I'm not going >> to call you an idiot like you called me a few times today, even though >> this time it *would* be appropriate. It's the same thing as in the other >> thread all over again. It's impossible to have a normal intelligent >> conversation with you. I'm not going to support your trolling any more. >> >> As usual, I wish you good luck in your efforts. Looks like you need it. >> > > David, > > as said previously, you can't mark whole companies a
Re: [linux-dvb] Most stable DVB-S2 PCI Card?
Manu Abraham wrote: > On Sat, May 23, 2009 at 10:16 PM, David Lister wrote: > >> *OT* I just remembered in connection with Linux DVB-S2 cards: in case >> some of you also heard about that new dual DVB-S2-CI tuner for PC's with >> full Linux support, you can forget about it. Or at least I can. When I >> pre-ordered directly from the Russian manufacturer (NetUP), they said >> the price for one would be $1000. What a rip-off... >> > > Indeed it is. > > Maybe you will get a DVB card with dual DVB-S2 and CI with hardware > H.264 decoder and HDMI out for a better deal. You might need to wait for > the hardware to be available though. > You appear to have different information. Their site and mail announcements don't mention any H.264 decoder, nor HDMI out. Even the photo says otherwise. This is the one I mean: http://www.netup.tv/en-EN/dual_dvb-s2-ci_card.php If what you say was true, (I wish it would), if it weren't a "budget" card, I wouldn't call it a rip-off -- it would be a pretty neat piece of HW. Still a bit pricey, but within limits. Unfortunately, from what I've gathered from the site, announcements and mails with the manufacturer, it is just a dual budget card. If so, it is a rip-off. :) -- Dave -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-media" in the body of a message to majord...@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
Re: Question about driver for Mantis
Manu Abraham wrote: > On Sat, May 23, 2009 at 9:42 PM, David Lister wrote: > >> Manu Abraham wrote: >> >>> 2009/5/23 David Lister : >>> >>> >>>> Not sure if you didn't get this email already, I had a slip-up while >>>> sending it. :) Anyway, there's also another supported card with a CI. A >>>> friend of mine has it, so I guess it works quite well with Linux. It's >>>> Mystique SaTiX-S2 (AFAIK, similar to KNC1+). Mystiques have rather >>>> quality finish and the CI module is ready for 3.5" drive installation. >>>> Some pictures from google: >>>> >>>> http://www.cesarex.com/images/Mystique-CI-1.jpg >>>> http://www.sat-servis.cz/data/eshop/fotky/produkty/velke/619.jpg >>>> >>>> Others might be able to tell you more details, I just know it works - >>>> friend has a Cryptoworks CAM in it. Take a look around, bye. >>>> >>>> >>> The Mystique is just a rebranded KNC1+ which just uses the same >>> STB0899 module, FYI. :-) >>> >>> >> Not exactly. People usually say it is a rebrand/clone of KNC1+, but it's >> not. :) There are couple of differences -- Mystique is a lighter version >> missing these features: >> 1) Signal passthrough via loop-out connector >> 2) Video input port for analogue capture >> >> I'm glad you reminded me of this misconception, the differences might be >> important for somebody. I was considering Mystique for myself, but chose >> CX24116 over STB0899, because this time, I wanted official support. I >> don't need analogue capture and CI anyway (I use softcam and for analog, >> much better Hauppauge PVR-500). I suggest Mystique instead of KNC1+ for >> purely practical reasons - it's more available, cheaper and nicer. :) >> > No misconceptions: > Oh, but there are. We were both talking about the sat version of KNC1+, not KNC1! You said and I quote: "The Mystique is just a rebranded KNC1+", which is not true. That's why I originally said that it's *similar* to Mystique, which *is* true. It might be the same as plain KNC1 or dozens of other rebranded versions, but that wasn't the point. The misconception is that "Mystique is KNC1+ clone" -- it is not. Perhaps I could have mentioned basic TV Station DVB-S too, but I didn't expect I'll have to defend every word I say. Now that I think about it, I'm glad I didn't - your inability to comprehend the simplest of meanings shines like the sun. Your follow-up comment was completely useless, arbitrary trolling. If you could face the life like a man instead of a cry baby, you wouldn't have the need to patronise me (unsuccessfully:)) in an unrelated thread just because of our earlier argument. You should be ashamed of yourself. You're a DVB driver developer and you have a hard time arguing with somebody who has seen DVB-S for the first time in his life a month ago! > > So support for it just appeared like magic ? > Were you arguing with one of your other personalities in your head that I missed something? I'm afraid you are a bit confused today, or you misinterpret the meaning of my words on purpose, or are just pissed off at me. :) Whatever. Because it might be your weak English, I'm not going to call you an idiot like you called me a few times today, even though this time it *would* be appropriate. It's the same thing as in the other thread all over again. It's impossible to have a normal intelligent conversation with you. I'm not going to support your trolling any more. As usual, I wish you good luck in your efforts. Looks like you need it. -- Dave -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-media" in the body of a message to majord...@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
Re: [linux-dvb] Most stable DVB-S2 PCI Card?
Andreas Regel wrote: > David Lister schrieb: >> I didn't want to write a long mail, but here goes: >> >> The TechnoTrend company, as of Februay 2009, doesn't exists any more. >> *It is bankrupt*. First, its owner Novabase sold as many of its shares >> as it could in 2007, in hope that the proceeds would allow TechnoTrend >> to get back on track. No such luck. A few months back this year, the >> company was finally dumped and sold as a whole to some German telco >> company in the Kathrein Group for liquidation, because of the tremendous >> drop in it's market value and forthcoming bankruptcy. This might also be >> of some interest to prospective buyers of it's former products. :) I >> don't want to search for all the press releases, but you can verify this >> claim here: >> http://www.euronext.com/fic/000/044/480/444806.pdf > > As written there the Görler Telekom bought the business and stock of > TT, that includes the brand name, all products and most of the > developers. They formed a new Company called TechnoTrend Görler GmbH, > that will continue development, production and sales. > > See here: http://www.kathrein.de//en/press/cont/texte2009/pi0910.htm > > Even if not explicitely mentioned there, PC products are included in > that deal. > > New web site is still under construction: http://www.ttgoerler.de/ > That is good news, thanks for the update! Everything falling apart last time I checked was a rather disturbing experience, even though I've never been their greatest fan. There's just a handful of companies making usable PC tuners and TT was one of the bigger ones. If KG are serious, I am quite relieved. Kathrein not only has extensive know-how and capital, it seems to like Linux. We might even see official Linux support for their new products. That would be cool! :) I'd definitely support such a manufacturer. *OT* I just remembered in connection with Linux DVB-S2 cards: in case some of you also heard about that new dual DVB-S2-CI tuner for PC's with full Linux support, you can forget about it. Or at least I can. When I pre-ordered directly from the Russian manufacturer (NetUP), they said the price for one would be $1000. What a rip-off... -- Dave -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-media" in the body of a message to majord...@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
Re: Question about driver for Mantis
Manu Abraham wrote: > 2009/5/23 David Lister : > >> Not sure if you didn't get this email already, I had a slip-up while >> sending it. :) Anyway, there's also another supported card with a CI. A >> friend of mine has it, so I guess it works quite well with Linux. It's >> Mystique SaTiX-S2 (AFAIK, similar to KNC1+). Mystiques have rather >> quality finish and the CI module is ready for 3.5" drive installation. >> Some pictures from google: >> >> http://www.cesarex.com/images/Mystique-CI-1.jpg >> http://www.sat-servis.cz/data/eshop/fotky/produkty/velke/619.jpg >> >> Others might be able to tell you more details, I just know it works - >> friend has a Cryptoworks CAM in it. Take a look around, bye. >> > > The Mystique is just a rebranded KNC1+ which just uses the same > STB0899 module, FYI. :-) > Not exactly. People usually say it is a rebrand/clone of KNC1+, but it's not. :) There are couple of differences -- Mystique is a lighter version missing these features: 1) Signal passthrough via loop-out connector 2) Video input port for analogue capture I'm glad you reminded me of this misconception, the differences might be important for somebody. I was considering Mystique for myself, but chose CX24116 over STB0899, because this time, I wanted official support. I don't need analogue capture and CI anyway (I use softcam and for analog, much better Hauppauge PVR-500). I suggest Mystique instead of KNC1+ for purely practical reasons - it's more available, cheaper and nicer. :) -- Dave -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-media" in the body of a message to majord...@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
Re: Question about driver for Mantis
Gernot Pansy wrote: > will CI be supported and are you willing to finish development and merge it > to > mainline anytime? > > i think i was one of the first SP400 owner but i had to sold my card for a > Nova > HD2 because the driver was not reliable (some i2c errors, slow tunning, > sometimes tunning failed). And now i need a dvb-s2 card with ci working. so > i'm searching again for a new card. their seems to be only the tt-3200 out, > which seems to work - no newer card. > Not sure if you didn't get this email already, I had a slip-up while sending it. :) Anyway, there's also another supported card with a CI. A friend of mine has it, so I guess it works quite well with Linux. It's Mystique SaTiX-S2 (AFAIK, similar to KNC1+). Mystiques have rather quality finish and the CI module is ready for 3.5" drive installation. Some pictures from google: http://www.cesarex.com/images/Mystique-CI-1.jpg http://www.sat-servis.cz/data/eshop/fotky/produkty/velke/619.jpg Others might be able to tell you more details, I just know it works - friend has a Cryptoworks CAM in it. Take a look around, bye. -- Dave -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-media" in the body of a message to majord...@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
Re: [linux-dvb] Most stable DVB-S2 PCI Card?
Manu Abraham wrote: > LOL, As stable as CX88, you must be joking. As far as the number of > developers on the card, if you are as capable of reading what you claim, > you can see that from the changelogs, in the main tree itself. > > You mean the SAA7146 driver is young ? Hmm.. pretty ignorant comments, > you seem to make. The 7146 is one of the oldest driver that exists. > Exception is bttv which is still older. > Indeed "LOL", as you say. I do not wish to torment you any longer. :) It is always sad to see people switch to personal insults, when they run out of arguments. This wasn't my intention and therefore I'm withdrawing from this thread with my apologies for making you angry. Some last replies: I wasn't talking about the number of developers on cx88, was I? I was talking about your driver and you being its sole developer; cx88 has the advantage of being proven by time as stable (in contrast to your *new* TT-1600 support, where things like number of developers has objective informational value). You also seem to confuse chips (i.e. the building blocks) and complete products. Is it not true that your first attempt at S2-1600 support was submited on April 23rd, 2009? You see for me, this is *new*. >> Also considering the fact that none of these >> drivers even report signal stats properly. Then, of course, there's my >> recent experience with your SkyStar HD2 driver. :) >> > Which card are you talking about ? Your experience with the Skystar HD > driver == USER Error, that's what some people would think. > > Well, that is what *you* think, because you weren't able to explain why it didn't work properly. There were some driver difficulties, but what did you expect when there are at least three different branches of the driver, all devel: http://jusst.de/hg/mantis http://mercurial.intuxication.org//hg//s2-liplianin http://jusst.de/hg/mantis-v4l I used the last driver a few hours after it was uploaded (and suggested on the list), so don't make this a USER issue. > The mantis driver is a driver which is very much in development. You > should've read it on the ML's itself. It's really sad that you are pretty much > ignorant. A driver which is in development, you expect all sorts of issues. > That's why it is in an external tree. > Oh, but I've read the list before buying the card, just like I've done for over 10 years for all HW for my Linux setups. Plus the reference information on the linuxtv.org says the driver is in development for over 3 years. When you see people discussing just lame & minor details on the lists and when there's a 3yr old driver, you usually expect no problems (not many anyway). But this is not my issue - please understand that I'm not complaining at all, this is just a reply to your previous statement. It is OT in this argument. > Now, you managed to get hold of the wrong tree, burned your demodulator, > inspite of me warning users on the ML's many times. So you are still > ignorant on that. You decided to do, what it pleased you. Not my fault. > As I wrote above, s2-liplianin was the latest tree available for general public at the time. My only other option was multiproto. I used mantis-v4l tree even before it was completely uploaded. As soon as the new S2API mantis tree was mentioned on the list, I used it. But most importantly, your only explanation that it still doesn't work, because I burned my demodulator using the current s2-liplianin tree is *absolutely* ridiculous. You might work it out with Liplianin himself, but if you had read my followup, you would know that I exchanged the card for new samples, had those samples *verified* by TechniSat (your second and last explanation was that my HW is fake, LOL) and I used *only* your latest driver. Of course it demonstrated the same exact issues as previous "burned" (haha) cards. > I guess, you don't understand the term "Development", "Stable" etc either. > I did not expect everything rosy, I have my share of Linux HW experiences. I've also written a complete Linux driver for a device I had, which wasn't supported - that driver is now part of the kernel. So believe me, not only I know how open source development works, I even know how kernel driver development works. What I did not expect was almost total ignorance of my issues by the driver author himself. One would expect at least some cooperation, I know how hard it is to find testers of one's code. You offered two explanations why your devel driver didn't work: the HW is broken or fake. Nice! In the end, I didn't return the cards because of the driver. I could live without PWR, SNR monitoring and unstable locks. I gave up, because even when everything worked, there were two major HW problems (caused by driver): 1) Card's HW emitted high pitched noise (like old TV's, but louder) as soon as I got DVB-S2 lock (mantis-v4l) 2) All DVB-S/S2 channels were corrupted, the picture looked as if there was a weak signal (STB reports 95%!). Intolerable. Yet, cx88
Re: [linux-dvb] Most stable DVB-S2 PCI Card?
Manu Abraham wrote: > On Sat, May 23, 2009 at 9:51 AM, David Lister wrote: > >> This point is moot in the first place, mate. Especially in USA (original >> poster), where it'll take twice the time to reach those rates on DVB-S2. >> All current 45 MS/s transponders are QPSK, at least as far as I can >> tell. Even if that "technology preview" 8PSK transponder of yours >> existed (somewhere above Asia), it's hardly a reason to buy >> Linux-unstable cards in EU or USA. >> > Have you tried the card, to state that it is unstable ? I would like > to know the basis > for your comments to state that it is unstable. > I was not talking specifically about TT-1600, but with your drivers being relatively young, not in wide use, and you being the only developer (right?), it's common sense to assume that they are not as stable as e.g. cx88. Also considering the fact that none of these drivers even report signal stats properly. Then, of course, there's my recent experience with your SkyStar HD2 driver. :) You have to understand that me, in this case just a common user, do not wish to invest into a product with an unfinished driver. If it was for me, I wouldn't really care, but with the whole family using the HTPC... I didn't want to write a long mail, but here goes: The TechnoTrend company, as of Februay 2009, doesn't exists any more. *It is bankrupt*. First, its owner Novabase sold as many of its shares as it could in 2007, in hope that the proceeds would allow TechnoTrend to get back on track. No such luck. A few months back this year, the company was finally dumped and sold as a whole to some German telco company in the Kathrein Group for liquidation, because of the tremendous drop in it's market value and forthcoming bankruptcy. This might also be of some interest to prospective buyers of it's former products. :) I don't want to search for all the press releases, but you can verify this claim here: http://www.euronext.com/fic/000/044/480/444806.pdf Nevertheless, I tried to get the data-sheet for this dead product from their closed down & discontinued sites. Google cache is a great thing, I managed to find TechnoTrend's S2-1600 data-sheet PDF: http://www.pt.technotrend.com/Dokumente/87/Manuals_PC/specs_eng/TechSpec_S2-1600_engl.pdf As much as I'd like to believe your "S2-1600 supports 63 MS/s", I cannot ignore the fact that the manufacturer disagrees with you: DVB-S: 2 - 45 MS/s DVB-S2: 10 - 30 MS/s Pretty standard specs, if you ask me. Obviously, you must have proven the *manufacturer* wrong by verifying your claim in practice. I just wonder how you did it, when no existing DVB-S2 transponder uses rates over 30 MS/s. Wasn't it perhaps just some "dry" testing without any signal, like gradually raising the HW parameters and sniffing for smoke? :) That's all I had to say. I know that the TT bankruptcy thing is irrelevant in a technical discussion, but it is important nonetheless. I wouldn't recommend TT products, nor SkyStar HD2, which is kinda infamous on some EU sat forums (not only in connection with Linux). See you around, -- Dave -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-media" in the body of a message to majord...@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
Re: [linux-dvb] Most stable DVB-S2 PCI Card?
Manu Abraham wrote: > On Sat, May 23, 2009 at 1:30 AM, David Lister wrote: > >> Actually, there are many DVB-S2 cards supporting 45 MS/s, even TeVii S460 >> can do 2-45 MS/s. I spoke with a fellow TeVii owner, who confirmed the card >> is working with a 45 MS/s transponder on Express AM2 without *any* issues. >> All this aside, there aren't any transponders with higher rates than this >> and there won't be for many years. Who knows how stable would TT even be >> with such rates? For now, it's irrelevant anyway. I have no problem >> upgrading to a new card in 3-4 years, providing there will be a stable, >> fully supported card for Linux with as many satisfied owners as e.g. Nova S2 >> HD has. >> > > You are talking about a 45 MSPS DVB-S stream on a DVB-S2 demodulator, > while i was talking about a 45 MSPS DVB-S2 stream on a DVB-S2 demodulator. > > Big difference ! > This point is moot in the first place, mate. Especially in USA (original poster), where it'll take twice the time to reach those rates on DVB-S2. All current 45 MS/s transponders are QPSK, at least as far as I can tell. Even if that "technology preview" 8PSK transponder of yours existed (somewhere above Asia), it's hardly a reason to buy Linux-unstable cards in EU or USA. Especially considering OP's quest for super-stable HW. HD is pretty much beginning and none of it goes over 30 MS/p. Why hurry, I ask? In 2-3 years time, when your driver is finished and stable, we'll all happily switch to "generation 2" HW (your term), if need be. Don't get me wrong, I have nothing against TT, it's just more sensible to go with proven HW. On a different note, I'm quite grateful for your development efforts and wish you success & best of luck. If only there were more people dedicated as you are. Seriously. Keep it up! -- Dave -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-media" in the body of a message to majord...@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
Re: [linux-dvb] Technisat SkyStar USB 2 HD CI
g.se...@tiscali.it wrote: > Hi, > I have Technisat SkyStar USB 2 HD CI > I use Ubuntu 9.04 > I need help > to make it work > Thank you I don't know if it's the same HW as SkyStar HD2, but if it is (you _will_ know) exchange it for a cx2388x-based card (Hauppauge, TeVii, etc) or even saa7134-based card (KNC One, Mystique) while you can. SkyStar HD2 was a real nightmare - generally unstable, S2 mostly unusable, reports of frequently corrupted picture (all channels), very low sensitivity, some things not supported by the driver for over 3 years (HW signal, SNR, BER reporting; CI). Few weeks ago, I had three PCI SS-HD2+CI cards with the newest driver (tried all other repositories as well) and I had to return them all. While I was still trying, many people contacted me with the same experiences. It might work for some people under certain conditions, but are you willing to take the risk, when there are cards with high quality HW, better tuner, sensitivity & Linux support for the same price? -- Dave -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-media" in the body of a message to majord...@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
Re: Support for Skystar S2 and Twinhan AD-SP200/VP-1027
Bob Ingraham wrote: > Hi All, > > Running Fedora Core 10 (2.6.27) and have looked through the wiki for support > for: > > - Skystar S2 (DVB-S2) PCI > - Twinhan AD-SP200/VP-1027 (DVB-S) PCI > > I'm guessing the wiki is out of date with regards to current status. > > Are there patches or a snapshot I can pull that has stable support for either > of these cards? > I went though all this like a 7-14 days ago. Everything is on the list, all repositories, all results. I had SkyStar HD2, but the driver is the same. AFAIK these are two very different cards and SkyStar S2 is probably working. I think it is used more frequently than my HD2, which, alas, was a total CRAP. I had 3 SkyStar HD2 cards in total and had to return them all. Why? Low quality HW (interference, no shielding...), Linux driver support exists (some, mainly the author, claim full support), but: DVB-S2 not working at all (unless you want to reboot every few minutes), zero HW sensitivity (90-95% signal strength -> broken picture), MythTV cannot cope with it and breaks down all the time, little things like PWR/SNR/BER reporting not working, etc. Look up my mails and reports. There are even links to all the repositories. The newest one: hg clone http://jusst.de/hg/mantis-v4l As for my story: I exchanged the cards for TeVii S640 DVB-S2. After inserting the new cards and booting, my whole setup started to work - out of the box, with the setup I had for SkyStar, which was unusable previously. It was the HW/mantis driver after all. Just issuing my WARNING against TWINHAN chipsets generally. :) -- David -- To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-media" in the body of a message to majord...@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info at http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
Re: [linux-dvb] SkyStar HD2 issues, signal sensitivity, etc.
Hello all, I took my time with this reply to gather verified data and information. I wanted to be sure of my facts and have pristine HW for testing (you mentioned the possibility of broken/fake HW). 1) My cards are 100% genuine - confirmed by Twinhan. 2) I had one of the cards replaced for tests using new mantis-v4l S2API 3) Testing was conducted using mantis-v4l exclusively, with a single card and with both cards connected (same results). Manu Abraham wrote: > Manu Abraham wrote: >> Dave Lister wrote: On Sat, Apr 11, 2009 at 5:47 AM, Dave Lister wrote: > RESULTS (using "s2" dvb-apps): > - scanning DVB-S works > - scanning DVB-S2 doesn't work > - zapping DVB-S is fast > >>> For other SkyStar HD2 users, this is a summary as of 2009.04.14: >>> - kernel 2.6.29 + mantis-v4l works (except DiSEqC as far as I can tell) >> >> Diseqc works fine over here, with the VP-1041 and other cards, using >> the mantis-v4l tree. You were right, DiSEqC is working. The reason was forgotten loop through my STB. Once removed from the cable, DiSEqC started working. >> The s2-liplianin tree doesn't use an updated tree for the mantis >> based devices unfortunately. It is stuck with older changesets of >> the mantis tree. Driver mantis-v4l suffers from the same issues as s2-liplianin (see the next paragraph). >>> Common issues: >>> - zapping DVB-S2 channel causes tuner HW lockup (loss of signal until >>> reboot) >>> - zap DVB-S2 channel => AWFUL ultra-high pitched noise emitted from >>> the card (capacitors or coils?) - makes your head hurt in about 30mins >>> - very poor TS (picture data) quality; signal = 95%, SNR = 70%, >>> STB/TV gives superb picture, but SkyStar/PC picture is corrupted every >>> few seconds, sound glitches, etc. (as if the signal was like 40% on >>> STB) - confirmed in VDR (Xine), MythTV, mplayer. - Unusable DVB-S2 is a fact. It locks up the card and prevents further usage. Some S2 transponders cannot be locked even after reboot, which means this card is basically just DVB-S. There are MANY better supported DVB-S and even DVB-S2 cards out there. - High-pitched noise is NOT present with the new card + mantis-v4l. That might have been HW or s2-liplianin issue. - Poor TS quality is a fact. This card doesn't even have freq. shielding on the board, which might be the reason on its own. >> * If you had those changes on your hardware and your card was >> susceptible to such issues, then that could be a possible reason. >> * There are quite some hardware pirates, as noted here .. Not possible, I have a new card (verified by Twinhan as genuine), which has been used with mantis-v4l only and has the same issues. >> In any of your cases, If you have hardware related issues please >> contact to your supplier to have it checked/replaced by them. My problems are not caused by defective or fake HW. This has been confirmed above all suspicions. >> NOTE: Always try to stick with a tree that's a mainline tree or the >> development tree, rather than tree's with unknown changes. When there are 3-4 different driver trees of various maturity, none of which is working properly, one has no other alternative than to try everything. Not to mention that mantis-v4l was first uploaded several day AFTER I began installations. Back then, s2-liplianin was the only S2API choice. My signal is now at 95-99% and SNR reported by the STB is 70%. With SkyStar I can see these numbers: # femon -a0 FE: STB0899 Multistandard (DVBS) Problem retrieving frontend information: Operation not supported status CVYL | signal 014c | snr 006b | ber | unc | FE_HAS_LOCK Problem retrieving frontend information: Operation not supported status CVYL | signal 014c | snr 006b | ber | unc | FE_HAS_LOCK Problem retrieving frontend information: Operation not supported status CVYL | signal 014c | snr 006a | ber | unc | FE_HAS_LOCK >From other people reports, I can only conclude that this is an exceptionally good signal and almost ideal conditions. Unfortunately, SkyStar is unable to provide acceptable picture. VDR reports "TS continuity errors" every few seconds and MPlayer is spouting warnings like these all the time: [mpeg2video @ 0x8963220]ac-tex damaged at 12 22 43 3% 1% 5.2% 0 0 [mpeg2video @ 0x8963220]Warning MVs not available [mpeg2video @ 0x8963220]concealing 495 DC, 495 AC, 495 MV errors [mpeg2video @ 0x8963220]concealing 0 DC, 0 AC, 0 MV errors 16.3% 0 0 [mpeg2video @ 0x8963220]Warning MVs not available7 3% 0% 18.0% 0 0 [mpeg2video @ 0x8963220]concealing 0 DC, 0 AC, 0 MV errors [mpeg2video @ 0x8963220]concealing 0 DC, 0 AC, 0 MV errors 18.6% 0 0 [mpeg2video @ 0x8963220]concealing 0 DC, 0 AC, 0 MV errors 18.9% 0 0 [mpeg2video @ 0x8963220]concealing 0 DC, 0 AC, 0 MV errors 20.6% 0 0 [mpeg2video @ 0x8963220]ac-tex damaged at 29 8/745 3% 0% 22.6% 0 0 [mpeg2video @ 0x8963220]concealing 0 DC, 0 AC, 0 MV errors [mpeg2video @
