Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Steve Litt]

On Friday 01 May 2009 02:23:04 pm Thomas Løcke wrote:
 2009/4/29 Steve Litt sl...@troubleshooters.com:

  Now I'm going to give you some very controversial advice, and many will
  argue with it. DO NOT use the facilities of your document class for your
  frontmatter -- instead use custom styles and ERT (inserted LaTeX code) to
  fine-tune your front matter exactly how you want it. There's nothing
  sadder than the guy who picks a document class to get the frontmatter
  just right, and then has to live with that document class's
  ideosyncracies throughout the book. Personally, I always start with the
  plain old Book document class, and use a layout file to add the features
  I need.

 I'm not quite sure I understand what you mean: If I don't use any of
 the styles of a document class, why use the class in the first place?
 Or am I missing something?

I meant don't use them for your FRONTMATTER. By all means use them for your 
MAINMATTER.

SteveT
 
Steve Litt
Recession Relief Package
http://www.recession-relief.US
Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/stevelitt

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Steve Litt]

On Friday 01 May 2009 02:23:04 pm Thomas Løcke wrote:
 2009/4/29 Steve Litt sl...@troubleshooters.com:

  Now I'm going to give you some very controversial advice, and many will
  argue with it. DO NOT use the facilities of your document class for your
  frontmatter -- instead use custom styles and ERT (inserted LaTeX code) to
  fine-tune your front matter exactly how you want it. There's nothing
  sadder than the guy who picks a document class to get the frontmatter
  just right, and then has to live with that document class's
  ideosyncracies throughout the book. Personally, I always start with the
  plain old Book document class, and use a layout file to add the features
  I need.

 I'm not quite sure I understand what you mean: If I don't use any of
 the styles of a document class, why use the class in the first place?
 Or am I missing something?

I meant don't use them for your FRONTMATTER. By all means use them for your 
MAINMATTER.

SteveT
 
Steve Litt
Recession Relief Package
http://www.recession-relief.US
Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/stevelitt

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Steve Litt]

On Friday 01 May 2009 02:23:04 pm Thomas Løcke wrote:
> 2009/4/29 Steve Litt :

> > Now I'm going to give you some very controversial advice, and many will
> > argue with it. DO NOT use the facilities of your document class for your
> > frontmatter -- instead use custom styles and ERT (inserted LaTeX code) to
> > fine-tune your front matter exactly how you want it. There's nothing
> > sadder than the guy who picks a document class to get the frontmatter
> > just right, and then has to live with that document class's
> > ideosyncracies throughout the book. Personally, I always start with the
> > plain old Book document class, and use a layout file to add the features
> > I need.
>
> I'm not quite sure I understand what you mean: If I don't use any of
> the styles of a document class, why use the class in the first place?
> Or am I missing something?

I meant don't use them for your FRONTMATTER. By all means use them for your 
MAINMATTER.

SteveT
 
Steve Litt
Recession Relief Package
http://www.recession-relief.US
Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/stevelitt

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Thomas Løcke]

2009/4/29 Steve Litt sl...@troubleshooters.com:
 Hi Thomas,

 In my opinion, LyX is exactly the right tool for what you're doing. With its
 WYSIAWYG (What You See Is Almost What You Get) environment, you can pound out
 content as fast as your fingers can type, and never have to spend time
 remembering codes or have codes get in your way when proofreading. Almost all
 appearance will be done by styles, so during authoring you needn't spend time
 fine tuning the look of the book. And because LyX uses LaTeX under the hood,
 your book comes out typeset very pleasingly.


I'm currently working my way through the tutorial and the user's
guide, and already I'm impressed at how nice output looks. I can't
quite put my finger on what it is, but there's definitely something
slick about it.


 I've used LyX to write a 309 page 8.5x11, a 201 page 8.5x11, a 231 page 8.5x11
 eBook, 2 more eBooks in the 100+ page range, one that was 90 pages, and I'm
 working on one that's probably going to weigh in at about 150.

 You mentioned this is a programming book and you want to avoid getting painted
 into corners. You need to figure out ahead of time what styles you'll need.
 You'll definitely need a paragraph style for code (paragraph styles are
 called environments in LyX). Personally I make my own (mycode), which is
 really just a copystyle of lyx-code. You'll also need a character style for
 code (mycodec).

 Presumably you're going to need styles Tip, Warning, Caution, and Note for
 callouts. You might also need a generic callout, so if you want a box with
 heading DON'T RETURN A LOCAL POINTER FROM A FUNCTION and text explainging why
 the pointer went out of scope, you can do so.

 If necessary I can send you my code for these styles.


I would like that very much! I tend to learn things faster/easier when
I have some actual working code to look at.


 I'd suggest you read all the LyX help files, especially the customization one.
 I'd also suggest you read Litt's LyX Library at
 http://www.troubleshooters.com/linux/lyx/index.htm. Search the Internet for a
 doc called TeX for the Impatient and read it. There's also a Not So Short
 Introduction to LaTeX or something like that, read it. The Memoir document
 class has some must-read documentation -- read it, but I don't recommend you
 actually use the Memoir document class. A guy named Herbert Voss, who used to
 be a mainstay on the LyX list, has a website with all sorts of cool LaTeX
 riffs. Last but not least, there are a few dead-trees books on LaTeX. They're
 expensive, but helpful. By spending the first 3 days of your project reading,
 you'll understand all the corners you can get out of, and you'll probably
 discover any you can't.


All good stuff. Thank you.


 Remember when you're creating your styles that they don't have to be perfect
 the first time around -- you can change them later. Make em quick and dirty
 at first, but just be sure to use them every time. The docs on my website are
 a pretty good reference for how to make your own styles.


It appears to be quite an involved process, but I'm sure I can manage,
and if not, I can always post here and hope for some expert
assistance.  :o)


 Now I'm going to give you some very controversial advice, and many will argue
 with it. DO NOT use the facilities of your document class for your
 frontmatter -- instead use custom styles and ERT (inserted LaTeX code) to
 fine-tune your front matter exactly how you want it. There's nothing sadder
 than the guy who picks a document class to get the frontmatter just right,
 and then has to live with that document class's ideosyncracies throughout the
 book. Personally, I always start with the plain old Book document class, and
 use a layout file to add the features I need.


I'm not quite sure I understand what you mean: If I don't use any of
the styles of a document class, why use the class in the first place?
Or am I missing something?


 You've picked a great tool to write your book.

I'm sure I have. I look forward to learning how to use it.

/Thomas

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Rich Shepard]

On Fri, 1 May 2009, Thomas L?cke wrote:


I'm currently working my way through the tutorial and the user's guide,
and already I'm impressed at how nice output looks. I can't quite put my
finger on what it is, but there's definitely something slick about it.


  Word processors work with each line as a formatting unit. TeX uses the
paragraph and the page as units for formatting. We are used to seeing
typeset output in published books and magazines so we unconsiously register
the appearance of the entire page.

  If you want to see the differences very clearly, print one page of text
using your favorite word processor, then the same text using LyX. When seen
side-by-side the differences are immediately obvious.


I'm not quite sure I understand what you mean: If I don't use any of the
styles of a document class, why use the class in the first place? Or am I
missing something?


  When you select a document class it provides all the typographic styles
you need ... unless there's something specific and non-standard. The layout
of an article is different from that of a report, and both are different
from that of a book.

Rich

--
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.   |  IntegrityCredibility
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.|Innovation
http://www.appl-ecosys.com Voice: 503-667-4517  Fax: 503-667-8863

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Marcelo Acuña]

 Many like to use one file per chapter. Lyx can handle a
 single 150-page document, but you may get tired of scrolling
 around in it.
 

I am not tired with a book of 726 pages. I always have outlook screen open. 
When I need go to any section, go by a click in TOC of outlook.
Regards
Marcelo

 I want to say outline instead outlook.
 Marcelo


  Yahoo! Cocina
Recetas prácticas y comida saludable
http://ar.mujer.yahoo.com/cocina/

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Bruce Pourciau]

On May 1, 2009, at 1:42 PM, Rich Shepard wrote:

I'm not quite sure I understand what you mean: If I don't use any  
of the
styles of a document class, why use the class in the first place?  
Or am I

missing something?


 When you select a document class it provides all the typographic  
styles
you need ... unless there's something specific and non-standard. The  
layout
of an article is different from that of a report, and both are  
different

from that of a book.

Rich


When Rich wrote


DO NOT use the facilities of your document class for your
frontmatter -- instead use custom styles and ERT (inserted LaTeX  
code) to

fine-tune your front matter exactly how you want it.


he was speaking of the front matter only -- the title page and so on.  
The main body of the work uses the standard features and styles of the  
given document class.


Bruce

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Rich Shepard]

On Fri, 1 May 2009, Bruce Pourciau wrote:


When you select a document class it provides all the typographic styles
you need ... unless there's something specific and non-standard. The layout
of an article is different from that of a report, and both are different
from that of a book.

Rich


When Rich wrote


DO NOT use the facilities of your document class for your
frontmatter -- instead use custom styles and ERT (inserted LaTeX code) to
fine-tune your front matter exactly how you want it.


he was speaking of the front matter only -- the title page and so on. The 
main body of the work uses the standard features and styles of the given 
document class.


Bruce,

  I will accept authorship of the first quote because I wrote it. However, I
did not write the second quote. Don't know who did. When I wrote my book for
Springer-Verlag I used their svmono class for the whole thing. I did need to
start the frontmatter at page 4 so they could insert the usual short title
and other publishing stuff.

Rich

--
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.   |  IntegrityCredibility
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.|Innovation
http://www.appl-ecosys.com Voice: 503-667-4517  Fax: 503-667-8863

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Typhoon]

On Fri, 1 May 2009 16:33:37 -0700 (PDT)
Rich Shepard rshep...@appl-ecosys.com wrote:

 On Fri, 1 May 2009, Bruce Pourciau wrote:
 
  When you select a document class it provides all the typographic
  styles you need ... unless there's something specific and
  non-standard. The layout of an article is different from that of a
  report, and both are different from that of a book.
  
  Rich
 
  When Rich wrote
 
  DO NOT use the facilities of your document class for your
  frontmatter -- instead use custom styles and ERT (inserted LaTeX
  code) to fine-tune your front matter exactly how you want it.
 
  he was speaking of the front matter only -- the title page and so
  on. The main body of the work uses the standard features and styles
  of the given document class.
 
 Bruce,
 
I will accept authorship of the first quote because I wrote it.
 However, I did not write the second quote. Don't know who did. When I
 wrote my book for Springer-Verlag I used their svmono class for the
 whole thing. I did need to start the frontmatter at page 4 so they
 could insert the usual short title and other publishing stuff.

Steve Litt wrote it, but I agree with him on frontmatter, at least the
first four pages: Half title page (recto),  second page (verso, blank
or containing printing history), full title page (recto), and copyright
page (verso - containing copyright stuff, ISBN/CIP information and
usually printed in a smaller type).

Alan

 
 Rich
 
 -- 
 Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.   |  Integrity
 Credibility Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.|
 Innovation http://www.appl-ecosys.com Voice: 503-667-4517
 Fax: 503-667-8863
 

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Thomas Løcke]

2009/4/29 Steve Litt sl...@troubleshooters.com:
 Hi Thomas,

 In my opinion, LyX is exactly the right tool for what you're doing. With its
 WYSIAWYG (What You See Is Almost What You Get) environment, you can pound out
 content as fast as your fingers can type, and never have to spend time
 remembering codes or have codes get in your way when proofreading. Almost all
 appearance will be done by styles, so during authoring you needn't spend time
 fine tuning the look of the book. And because LyX uses LaTeX under the hood,
 your book comes out typeset very pleasingly.


I'm currently working my way through the tutorial and the user's
guide, and already I'm impressed at how nice output looks. I can't
quite put my finger on what it is, but there's definitely something
slick about it.


 I've used LyX to write a 309 page 8.5x11, a 201 page 8.5x11, a 231 page 8.5x11
 eBook, 2 more eBooks in the 100+ page range, one that was 90 pages, and I'm
 working on one that's probably going to weigh in at about 150.

 You mentioned this is a programming book and you want to avoid getting painted
 into corners. You need to figure out ahead of time what styles you'll need.
 You'll definitely need a paragraph style for code (paragraph styles are
 called environments in LyX). Personally I make my own (mycode), which is
 really just a copystyle of lyx-code. You'll also need a character style for
 code (mycodec).

 Presumably you're going to need styles Tip, Warning, Caution, and Note for
 callouts. You might also need a generic callout, so if you want a box with
 heading DON'T RETURN A LOCAL POINTER FROM A FUNCTION and text explainging why
 the pointer went out of scope, you can do so.

 If necessary I can send you my code for these styles.


I would like that very much! I tend to learn things faster/easier when
I have some actual working code to look at.


 I'd suggest you read all the LyX help files, especially the customization one.
 I'd also suggest you read Litt's LyX Library at
 http://www.troubleshooters.com/linux/lyx/index.htm. Search the Internet for a
 doc called TeX for the Impatient and read it. There's also a Not So Short
 Introduction to LaTeX or something like that, read it. The Memoir document
 class has some must-read documentation -- read it, but I don't recommend you
 actually use the Memoir document class. A guy named Herbert Voss, who used to
 be a mainstay on the LyX list, has a website with all sorts of cool LaTeX
 riffs. Last but not least, there are a few dead-trees books on LaTeX. They're
 expensive, but helpful. By spending the first 3 days of your project reading,
 you'll understand all the corners you can get out of, and you'll probably
 discover any you can't.


All good stuff. Thank you.


 Remember when you're creating your styles that they don't have to be perfect
 the first time around -- you can change them later. Make em quick and dirty
 at first, but just be sure to use them every time. The docs on my website are
 a pretty good reference for how to make your own styles.


It appears to be quite an involved process, but I'm sure I can manage,
and if not, I can always post here and hope for some expert
assistance.  :o)


 Now I'm going to give you some very controversial advice, and many will argue
 with it. DO NOT use the facilities of your document class for your
 frontmatter -- instead use custom styles and ERT (inserted LaTeX code) to
 fine-tune your front matter exactly how you want it. There's nothing sadder
 than the guy who picks a document class to get the frontmatter just right,
 and then has to live with that document class's ideosyncracies throughout the
 book. Personally, I always start with the plain old Book document class, and
 use a layout file to add the features I need.


I'm not quite sure I understand what you mean: If I don't use any of
the styles of a document class, why use the class in the first place?
Or am I missing something?


 You've picked a great tool to write your book.

I'm sure I have. I look forward to learning how to use it.

/Thomas

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Rich Shepard]

On Fri, 1 May 2009, Thomas L?cke wrote:


I'm currently working my way through the tutorial and the user's guide,
and already I'm impressed at how nice output looks. I can't quite put my
finger on what it is, but there's definitely something slick about it.


  Word processors work with each line as a formatting unit. TeX uses the
paragraph and the page as units for formatting. We are used to seeing
typeset output in published books and magazines so we unconsiously register
the appearance of the entire page.

  If you want to see the differences very clearly, print one page of text
using your favorite word processor, then the same text using LyX. When seen
side-by-side the differences are immediately obvious.


I'm not quite sure I understand what you mean: If I don't use any of the
styles of a document class, why use the class in the first place? Or am I
missing something?


  When you select a document class it provides all the typographic styles
you need ... unless there's something specific and non-standard. The layout
of an article is different from that of a report, and both are different
from that of a book.

Rich

--
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.   |  IntegrityCredibility
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.|Innovation
http://www.appl-ecosys.com Voice: 503-667-4517  Fax: 503-667-8863

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Marcelo Acuña]

 Many like to use one file per chapter. Lyx can handle a
 single 150-page document, but you may get tired of scrolling
 around in it.
 

I am not tired with a book of 726 pages. I always have outlook screen open. 
When I need go to any section, go by a click in TOC of outlook.
Regards
Marcelo

 I want to say outline instead outlook.
 Marcelo


  Yahoo! Cocina
Recetas prácticas y comida saludable
http://ar.mujer.yahoo.com/cocina/

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Bruce Pourciau]

On May 1, 2009, at 1:42 PM, Rich Shepard wrote:

I'm not quite sure I understand what you mean: If I don't use any  
of the
styles of a document class, why use the class in the first place?  
Or am I

missing something?


 When you select a document class it provides all the typographic  
styles
you need ... unless there's something specific and non-standard. The  
layout
of an article is different from that of a report, and both are  
different

from that of a book.

Rich


When Rich wrote


DO NOT use the facilities of your document class for your
frontmatter -- instead use custom styles and ERT (inserted LaTeX  
code) to

fine-tune your front matter exactly how you want it.


he was speaking of the front matter only -- the title page and so on.  
The main body of the work uses the standard features and styles of the  
given document class.


Bruce

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Rich Shepard]

On Fri, 1 May 2009, Bruce Pourciau wrote:


When you select a document class it provides all the typographic styles
you need ... unless there's something specific and non-standard. The layout
of an article is different from that of a report, and both are different
from that of a book.

Rich


When Rich wrote


DO NOT use the facilities of your document class for your
frontmatter -- instead use custom styles and ERT (inserted LaTeX code) to
fine-tune your front matter exactly how you want it.


he was speaking of the front matter only -- the title page and so on. The 
main body of the work uses the standard features and styles of the given 
document class.


Bruce,

  I will accept authorship of the first quote because I wrote it. However, I
did not write the second quote. Don't know who did. When I wrote my book for
Springer-Verlag I used their svmono class for the whole thing. I did need to
start the frontmatter at page 4 so they could insert the usual short title
and other publishing stuff.

Rich

--
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.   |  IntegrityCredibility
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.|Innovation
http://www.appl-ecosys.com Voice: 503-667-4517  Fax: 503-667-8863

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Typhoon]

On Fri, 1 May 2009 16:33:37 -0700 (PDT)
Rich Shepard rshep...@appl-ecosys.com wrote:

 On Fri, 1 May 2009, Bruce Pourciau wrote:
 
  When you select a document class it provides all the typographic
  styles you need ... unless there's something specific and
  non-standard. The layout of an article is different from that of a
  report, and both are different from that of a book.
  
  Rich
 
  When Rich wrote
 
  DO NOT use the facilities of your document class for your
  frontmatter -- instead use custom styles and ERT (inserted LaTeX
  code) to fine-tune your front matter exactly how you want it.
 
  he was speaking of the front matter only -- the title page and so
  on. The main body of the work uses the standard features and styles
  of the given document class.
 
 Bruce,
 
I will accept authorship of the first quote because I wrote it.
 However, I did not write the second quote. Don't know who did. When I
 wrote my book for Springer-Verlag I used their svmono class for the
 whole thing. I did need to start the frontmatter at page 4 so they
 could insert the usual short title and other publishing stuff.

Steve Litt wrote it, but I agree with him on frontmatter, at least the
first four pages: Half title page (recto),  second page (verso, blank
or containing printing history), full title page (recto), and copyright
page (verso - containing copyright stuff, ISBN/CIP information and
usually printed in a smaller type).

Alan

 
 Rich
 
 -- 
 Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.   |  Integrity
 Credibility Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.|
 Innovation http://www.appl-ecosys.com Voice: 503-667-4517
 Fax: 503-667-8863
 

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Thomas Løcke]

2009/4/29 Steve Litt :
> Hi Thomas,
>
> In my opinion, LyX is exactly the right tool for what you're doing. With its
> WYSIAWYG (What You See Is Almost What You Get) environment, you can pound out
> content as fast as your fingers can type, and never have to spend time
> remembering codes or have codes get in your way when proofreading. Almost all
> appearance will be done by styles, so during authoring you needn't spend time
> fine tuning the look of the book. And because LyX uses LaTeX under the hood,
> your book comes out typeset very pleasingly.


I'm currently working my way through the tutorial and the user's
guide, and already I'm impressed at how nice output looks. I can't
quite put my finger on what it is, but there's definitely something
slick about it.


> I've used LyX to write a 309 page 8.5x11, a 201 page 8.5x11, a 231 page 8.5x11
> eBook, 2 more eBooks in the 100+ page range, one that was 90 pages, and I'm
> working on one that's probably going to weigh in at about 150.
>
> You mentioned this is a programming book and you want to avoid getting painted
> into corners. You need to figure out ahead of time what styles you'll need.
> You'll definitely need a paragraph style for code (paragraph styles are
> called "environments" in LyX). Personally I make my own (mycode), which is
> really just a copystyle of lyx-code. You'll also need a character style for
> code (mycodec).
>
> Presumably you're going to need styles Tip, Warning, Caution, and Note for
> callouts. You might also need a generic callout, so if you want a box with
> heading DON'T RETURN A LOCAL POINTER FROM A FUNCTION and text explainging why
> the pointer went out of scope, you can do so.
>
> If necessary I can send you my code for these styles.


I would like that very much! I tend to learn things faster/easier when
I have some actual working "code" to look at.


> I'd suggest you read all the LyX help files, especially the customization one.
> I'd also suggest you read "Litt's LyX Library" at
> http://www.troubleshooters.com/linux/lyx/index.htm. Search the Internet for a
> doc called "TeX for the Impatient" and read it. There's also a "Not So Short
> Introduction to LaTeX" or something like that, read it. The Memoir document
> class has some must-read documentation -- read it, but I don't recommend you
> actually use the Memoir document class. A guy named Herbert Voss, who used to
> be a mainstay on the LyX list, has a website with all sorts of cool LaTeX
> riffs. Last but not least, there are a few dead-trees books on LaTeX. They're
> expensive, but helpful. By spending the first 3 days of your project reading,
> you'll understand all the corners you can get out of, and you'll probably
> discover any you can't.


All good stuff. Thank you.


> Remember when you're creating your styles that they don't have to be perfect
> the first time around -- you can change them later. Make em quick and dirty
> at first, but just be sure to use them every time. The docs on my website are
> a pretty good reference for how to make your own styles.


It appears to be quite an involved process, but I'm sure I can manage,
and if not, I can always post here and hope for some expert
assistance.  :o)


> Now I'm going to give you some very controversial advice, and many will argue
> with it. DO NOT use the facilities of your document class for your
> frontmatter -- instead use custom styles and ERT (inserted LaTeX code) to
> fine-tune your front matter exactly how you want it. There's nothing sadder
> than the guy who picks a document class to get the frontmatter just right,
> and then has to live with that document class's ideosyncracies throughout the
> book. Personally, I always start with the plain old Book document class, and
> use a layout file to add the features I need.


I'm not quite sure I understand what you mean: If I don't use any of
the styles of a document class, why use the class in the first place?
Or am I missing something?


> You've picked a great tool to write your book.

I'm sure I have. I look forward to learning how to use it.

/Thomas

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Rich Shepard]

On Fri, 1 May 2009, Thomas L?cke wrote:


I'm currently working my way through the tutorial and the user's guide,
and already I'm impressed at how nice output looks. I can't quite put my
finger on what it is, but there's definitely something slick about it.


  Word processors work with each line as a formatting unit. TeX uses the
paragraph and the page as units for formatting. We are used to seeing
typeset output in published books and magazines so we unconsiously register
the appearance of the entire page.

  If you want to see the differences very clearly, print one page of text
using your favorite word processor, then the same text using LyX. When seen
side-by-side the differences are immediately obvious.


I'm not quite sure I understand what you mean: If I don't use any of the
styles of a document class, why use the class in the first place? Or am I
missing something?


  When you select a document class it provides all the typographic styles
you need ... unless there's something specific and non-standard. The layout
of an article is different from that of a report, and both are different
from that of a book.

Rich

--
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.   |  IntegrityCredibility
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.|Innovation
 Voice: 503-667-4517  Fax: 503-667-8863

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Marcelo Acuña]

>> Many like to use one file per chapter. Lyx can handle a
>> single 150-page document, but you may get tired of scrolling
>> around in it.
>> 

>I am not tired with a book of 726 pages. I always have outlook screen >open. 
>When I need go to any section, go by a click in TOC of outlook.
>Regards
>Marcelo

 I want to say outline instead outlook.
 Marcelo


  Yahoo! Cocina
Recetas prácticas y comida saludable
http://ar.mujer.yahoo.com/cocina/

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Bruce Pourciau]

On May 1, 2009, at 1:42 PM, Rich Shepard wrote:

I'm not quite sure I understand what you mean: If I don't use any  
of the
styles of a document class, why use the class in the first place?  
Or am I

missing something?


 When you select a document class it provides all the typographic  
styles
you need ... unless there's something specific and non-standard. The  
layout
of an article is different from that of a report, and both are  
different

from that of a book.

Rich


When Rich wrote


DO NOT use the facilities of your document class for your
frontmatter -- instead use custom styles and ERT (inserted LaTeX  
code) to

fine-tune your front matter exactly how you want it.


he was speaking of the front matter only -- the title page and so on.  
The main body of the work uses the standard features and styles of the  
given document class.


Bruce

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Rich Shepard]

On Fri, 1 May 2009, Bruce Pourciau wrote:


When you select a document class it provides all the typographic styles
you need ... unless there's something specific and non-standard. The layout
of an article is different from that of a report, and both are different
from that of a book.

Rich


When Rich wrote


DO NOT use the facilities of your document class for your
frontmatter -- instead use custom styles and ERT (inserted LaTeX code) to
fine-tune your front matter exactly how you want it.


he was speaking of the front matter only -- the title page and so on. The 
main body of the work uses the standard features and styles of the given 
document class.


Bruce,

  I will accept authorship of the first quote because I wrote it. However, I
did not write the second quote. Don't know who did. When I wrote my book for
Springer-Verlag I used their svmono class for the whole thing. I did need to
start the frontmatter at page 4 so they could insert the usual short title
and other publishing stuff.

Rich

--
Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.   |  IntegrityCredibility
Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.|Innovation
 Voice: 503-667-4517  Fax: 503-667-8863

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Typhoon]

On Fri, 1 May 2009 16:33:37 -0700 (PDT)
Rich Shepard  wrote:

> On Fri, 1 May 2009, Bruce Pourciau wrote:
> 
> >> When you select a document class it provides all the typographic
> >> styles you need ... unless there's something specific and
> >> non-standard. The layout of an article is different from that of a
> >> report, and both are different from that of a book.
> >> 
> >> Rich
> >
> > When Rich wrote
> >
> >> DO NOT use the facilities of your document class for your
> >> frontmatter -- instead use custom styles and ERT (inserted LaTeX
> >> code) to fine-tune your front matter exactly how you want it.
> >
> > he was speaking of the front matter only -- the title page and so
> > on. The main body of the work uses the standard features and styles
> > of the given document class.
> 
> Bruce,
> 
>I will accept authorship of the first quote because I wrote it.
> However, I did not write the second quote. Don't know who did. When I
> wrote my book for Springer-Verlag I used their svmono class for the
> whole thing. I did need to start the frontmatter at page 4 so they
> could insert the usual short title and other publishing stuff.

Steve Litt wrote it, but I agree with him on frontmatter, at least the
first four pages: Half title page (recto),  second page (verso, blank
or containing printing history), full title page (recto), and copyright
page (verso - containing copyright stuff, ISBN/CIP information and
usually printed in a smaller type).

Alan

> 
> Rich
> 
> -- 
> Richard B. Shepard, Ph.D.   |  Integrity
> Credibility Applied Ecosystem Services, Inc.|
> Innovation  Voice: 503-667-4517
> Fax: 503-667-8863
> 

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Wolfgang Keller]

Hello,

 But before I start writing, I'd like to ask if there are any good
 resources on using LyX for writing what is essentially a book on
 programming.

You'd probably want to have a look at koma-script:

ftp://ftp.dante.de/tex-archive/macros/latex/contrib/koma-script/scrguien.pdf

Sincerely,

Wolfgang

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Helge Hafting]

Thomas Løcke wrote:

Hey,

I'm about to start the process of writing the 2nd edition of a fairly
long (+150 A4 pages) internal manual. It's about a set of software
systems and programming practices in my business. The 1st edition was
written using OpenOffice. I remember spending a lot of time trying to
make things look good, and when I'm reading the manual today, I'm
constantly reminded of how hard I failed at that.  :o)

So for this 2nd edition, I've been looking for some better tools, and
this has brought me to LyX. I've installed LyX and TexLive on my
Slackware 12.1 system, and I've tinkered some with it. It appears to
be *exactly* what I'm looking for.

Yes, LyX ought to be the right tool for making a book look good. And 
size will not be a problem.


Many like to use one file per chapter. Lyx can handle a single 150-page 
document, but you may get tired of scrolling around in it.



But before I start writing, I'd like to ask if there are any good
resources on using LyX for writing what is essentially a book on
programming. I'd really like to avoid painting myself into a corner,
like I did with OpenOffice.


Spend some time in the beginning, finding out how you want to do things. 
This so you don't have to re-do a lot of stuff. For example, lets say 
you need code examples in your book on programming practices. Should 
code examples exist inside the LyX file, or should LyX pull lines of 
code from real source files? The former approach gives you all in one 
document, the latter approach means you can change your code and the 
document is updated automatically. (No need to sync the document with 
code revisions.)


Figure out what kind of numbering scheme you want for sectioning. See if 
you have something special, like: per-chapter TOCs, a special font or 
customized running headers.


Skim through the user guide (and all the other help documents), look for 
things that could be useful. The listing package can do automatic syntax 
highlighting and numbering of code lines, for example.


After a while, you have everything way you want in a 3-4 page test 
book that contains all the types of material and formatting you plan on 
using. The book can then be finished almost as fast as you can come up 
with material. There is normally very little tweaking to do in the end.


If you feel a need to do tweaks like an occational manual page break, 
don't do it until the book is finished. Otherwise, you risk disrupting 
such tweaks if you edit any content earlier in the book. Ideally, there 
shouldn't be any manual breaks but they are handy occationally.


Helge Hafting

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Wolfgang Keller]

Hello,

 But before I start writing, I'd like to ask if there are any good
 resources on using LyX for writing what is essentially a book on
 programming.

You'd probably want to have a look at koma-script:

ftp://ftp.dante.de/tex-archive/macros/latex/contrib/koma-script/scrguien.pdf

Sincerely,

Wolfgang

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Helge Hafting]

Thomas Løcke wrote:

Hey,

I'm about to start the process of writing the 2nd edition of a fairly
long (+150 A4 pages) internal manual. It's about a set of software
systems and programming practices in my business. The 1st edition was
written using OpenOffice. I remember spending a lot of time trying to
make things look good, and when I'm reading the manual today, I'm
constantly reminded of how hard I failed at that.  :o)

So for this 2nd edition, I've been looking for some better tools, and
this has brought me to LyX. I've installed LyX and TexLive on my
Slackware 12.1 system, and I've tinkered some with it. It appears to
be *exactly* what I'm looking for.

Yes, LyX ought to be the right tool for making a book look good. And 
size will not be a problem.


Many like to use one file per chapter. Lyx can handle a single 150-page 
document, but you may get tired of scrolling around in it.



But before I start writing, I'd like to ask if there are any good
resources on using LyX for writing what is essentially a book on
programming. I'd really like to avoid painting myself into a corner,
like I did with OpenOffice.


Spend some time in the beginning, finding out how you want to do things. 
This so you don't have to re-do a lot of stuff. For example, lets say 
you need code examples in your book on programming practices. Should 
code examples exist inside the LyX file, or should LyX pull lines of 
code from real source files? The former approach gives you all in one 
document, the latter approach means you can change your code and the 
document is updated automatically. (No need to sync the document with 
code revisions.)


Figure out what kind of numbering scheme you want for sectioning. See if 
you have something special, like: per-chapter TOCs, a special font or 
customized running headers.


Skim through the user guide (and all the other help documents), look for 
things that could be useful. The listing package can do automatic syntax 
highlighting and numbering of code lines, for example.


After a while, you have everything way you want in a 3-4 page test 
book that contains all the types of material and formatting you plan on 
using. The book can then be finished almost as fast as you can come up 
with material. There is normally very little tweaking to do in the end.


If you feel a need to do tweaks like an occational manual page break, 
don't do it until the book is finished. Otherwise, you risk disrupting 
such tweaks if you edit any content earlier in the book. Ideally, there 
shouldn't be any manual breaks but they are handy occationally.


Helge Hafting

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Wolfgang Keller]

Hello,

> But before I start writing, I'd like to ask if there are any good
> resources on using LyX for writing what is essentially a book on
> programming.

You'd probably want to have a look at koma-script:

ftp://ftp.dante.de/tex-archive/macros/latex/contrib/koma-script/scrguien.pdf

Sincerely,

Wolfgang

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Helge Hafting]

Thomas Løcke wrote:

Hey,

I'm about to start the process of writing the 2nd edition of a fairly
long (+150 A4 pages) internal manual. It's about a set of software
systems and programming practices in my business. The 1st edition was
written using OpenOffice. I remember spending a lot of time trying to
make things "look good", and when I'm reading the manual today, I'm
constantly reminded of how hard I failed at that.  :o)

So for this 2nd edition, I've been looking for some better tools, and
this has brought me to LyX. I've installed LyX and TexLive on my
Slackware 12.1 system, and I've tinkered some with it. It appears to
be *exactly* what I'm looking for.

Yes, LyX ought to be the right tool for making a book "look good". And 
size will not be a problem.


Many like to use one file per chapter. Lyx can handle a single 150-page 
document, but you may get tired of scrolling around in it.



But before I start writing, I'd like to ask if there are any good
resources on using LyX for writing what is essentially a book on
programming. I'd really like to avoid painting myself into a corner,
like I did with OpenOffice.


Spend some time in the beginning, finding out how you want to do things. 
This so you don't have to re-do a lot of stuff. For example, lets say 
you need code examples in your book on programming practices. Should 
code examples exist inside the LyX file, or should LyX pull lines of 
code from real source files? The former approach gives you all in one 
document, the latter approach means you can change your code and the 
document is updated automatically. (No need to sync the document with 
code revisions.)


Figure out what kind of numbering scheme you want for sectioning. See if 
you have something special, like: per-chapter TOCs, a special font or 
customized running headers.


Skim through the user guide (and all the other help documents), look for 
things that could be useful. The listing package can do automatic syntax 
highlighting and numbering of code lines, for example.


After a while, you have everything way you want in a 3-4 page "test 
book" that contains all the types of material and formatting you plan on 
using. The book can then be finished almost as fast as you can come up 
with material. There is normally very little tweaking to do in the end.


If you feel a need to do tweaks like an occational manual page break, 
don't do it until the book is finished. Otherwise, you risk disrupting 
such tweaks if you edit any content earlier in the book. Ideally, there 
shouldn't be any manual breaks but they are handy occationally.


Helge Hafting

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Typhoon]

On Wed, 29 Apr 2009 08:19:34 +0200
Thomas Løcke thomas.granv...@gmail.com wrote:

 Hey,
 
 I'm about to start the process of writing the 2nd edition of a fairly
 long (+150 A4 pages) internal manual. It's about a set of software
 systems and programming practices in my business. The 1st edition was
 written using OpenOffice. I remember spending a lot of time trying to
 make things look good, and when I'm reading the manual today, I'm
 constantly reminded of how hard I failed at that.  :o)
 
 So for this 2nd edition, I've been looking for some better tools, and
 this has brought me to LyX. I've installed LyX and TexLive on my
 Slackware 12.1 system, and I've tinkered some with it. It appears to
 be *exactly* what I'm looking for.
 
 But before I start writing, I'd like to ask if there are any good
 resources on using LyX for writing what is essentially a book on
 programming. I'd really like to avoid painting myself into a corner,
 like I did with OpenOffice.
 
 Any and all advice is more than welcome.

Steve Litt is your man - he has done several books that sound similar
to this.

I have done a 600 page law textbook with LyX (but the publisher
insisted on a Word file). Lots of indexing, table of statutes, table of
cases. Worked flawlessly.

I also did a (smaller format) cookbook which had lots of minipages and
images. Again, no problems at all: http://books.lulu.com/content/728996

HTH,
Alan

 
 Sincerely,
 Thomas Løcke
 

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Guenter Milde]

On 2009-04-29, Thomas Løcke wrote:

 But before I start writing, I'd like to ask if there are any good
 resources on using LyX for writing what is essentially a book on
 programming. I'd really like to avoid painting myself into a corner,
 like I did with OpenOffice.

Writing a 150+ pages book with LyX is a common task.

There are some usage examples and lots of advice (partially outdated) on
wiki.lyx.org.

Günter

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Piero Faustini]

Guenter Milde mi...@... writes:

 Writing a 150+ pages book with LyX is a common task.

No problem with my dissertation of 130+ (and growing) pages.

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Uwe Stöhr]

Thomas Løcke schrieb:


But before I start writing, I'd like to ask if there are any good
resources on using LyX for writing what is essentially a book on
programming.


I recommend that you work yourself through LyX's Intro _and_ Tutorial manual, that you find in LyX's 
Help menu, before you start writing. A look at chapter 6 of the UserGuide will also help because 
there the book-specific tasks like Indexing are described.


The UserGuide, the Math, and the EmbeddedObjects manual can also be taken as example because they 
are written to be a printable book in the PDF output.


regards Uwe

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Marcelo Acuña]

 Hey,
 
 I'm about to start the process of writing the 2nd
 edition of a fairly
 long (+150 A4 pages) internal manual. It's about a set
 of software
 systems and programming practices in my business. The 1st
 edition was
 written using OpenOffice. I remember spending a lot of time
 trying to
 make things look good, and when I'm reading
 the manual today, I'm
 constantly reminded of how hard I failed at that.  :o)
 
 So for this 2nd edition, I've been looking for some
 better tools, and
 this has brought me to LyX. I've installed LyX and
 TexLive on my
 Slackware 12.1 system, and I've tinkered some with it.
 It appears to
 be *exactly* what I'm looking for.
 
 But before I start writing, I'd like to ask if there
 are any good
 resources on using LyX for writing what is essentially a
 book on
 programming. I'd really like to avoid painting myself
 into a corner,
 like I did with OpenOffice.
 
 Any and all advice is more than welcome.
 
 Sincerely,
 Thomas Løcke

 I´am sure that Lyx is the better choice.
 No problem with longer stuff.
 If the stuff is complex, the advantage over openoffice or word or another word 
like text processor became more great.
 Marcelo


  Yahoo! Cocina
Recetas prácticas y comida saludable
http://ar.mujer.yahoo.com/cocina/

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Steve Litt]

On Wednesday 29 April 2009 02:19:34 am Thomas Løcke wrote:
 Hey,

 I'm about to start the process of writing the 2nd edition of a fairly
 long (+150 A4 pages) internal manual. It's about a set of software
 systems and programming practices in my business. The 1st edition was
 written using OpenOffice. I remember spending a lot of time trying to
 make things look good, and when I'm reading the manual today, I'm
 constantly reminded of how hard I failed at that.  :o)

 So for this 2nd edition, I've been looking for some better tools, and
 this has brought me to LyX. I've installed LyX and TexLive on my
 Slackware 12.1 system, and I've tinkered some with it. It appears to
 be *exactly* what I'm looking for.

 But before I start writing, I'd like to ask if there are any good
 resources on using LyX for writing what is essentially a book on
 programming. I'd really like to avoid painting myself into a corner,
 like I did with OpenOffice.

 Any and all advice is more than welcome.

 Sincerely,
 Thomas Løcke

Hi Thomas,

In my opinion, LyX is exactly the right tool for what you're doing. With its 
WYSIAWYG (What You See Is Almost What You Get) environment, you can pound out 
content as fast as your fingers can type, and never have to spend time 
remembering codes or have codes get in your way when proofreading. Almost all 
appearance will be done by styles, so during authoring you needn't spend time 
fine tuning the look of the book. And because LyX uses LaTeX under the hood, 
your book comes out typeset very pleasingly.

I've used LyX to write a 309 page 8.5x11, a 201 page 8.5x11, a 231 page 8.5x11 
eBook, 2 more eBooks in the 100+ page range, one that was 90 pages, and I'm 
working on one that's probably going to weigh in at about 150.

You mentioned this is a programming book and you want to avoid getting painted 
into corners. You need to figure out ahead of time what styles you'll need. 
You'll definitely need a paragraph style for code (paragraph styles are 
called environments in LyX). Personally I make my own (mycode), which is 
really just a copystyle of lyx-code. You'll also need a character style for 
code (mycodec).

Presumably you're going to need styles Tip, Warning, Caution, and Note for 
callouts. You might also need a generic callout, so if you want a box with 
heading DON'T RETURN A LOCAL POINTER FROM A FUNCTION and text explainging why 
the pointer went out of scope, you can do so.

If necessary I can send you my code for these styles.

You might also want to change the listing styles. For instance, I always 
modify the listing environments to make them take less vertical space. When I 
do that, I give the modified styles new names.

Presumably you'll also need a convention of how you're going to do 
screenshots. Do you want them always exactly in line with the surrounding 
text, or would you prefer they be able to float to nearby pages so LaTeX 
can optimize page filling?

Are you going to personalize the books? Personalization puts the reader on 
notice that if he/she makes the choice to republish the book on the Internet, 
his/her name goes with it. In my opinion, personalization is a must with 
eBooks, and it's easy with LyX.

I'd suggest you read all the LyX help files, especially the customization one. 
I'd also suggest you read Litt's LyX Library at 
http://www.troubleshooters.com/linux/lyx/index.htm. Search the Internet for a 
doc called TeX for the Impatient and read it. There's also a Not So Short 
Introduction to LaTeX or something like that, read it. The Memoir document 
class has some must-read documentation -- read it, but I don't recommend you 
actually use the Memoir document class. A guy named Herbert Voss, who used to 
be a mainstay on the LyX list, has a website with all sorts of cool LaTeX 
riffs. Last but not least, there are a few dead-trees books on LaTeX. They're 
expensive, but helpful. By spending the first 3 days of your project reading, 
you'll understand all the corners you can get out of, and you'll probably 
discover any you can't.

Remember when you're creating your styles that they don't have to be perfect 
the first time around -- you can change them later. Make em quick and dirty 
at first, but just be sure to use them every time. The docs on my website are 
a pretty good reference for how to make your own styles.

Now I'm going to give you some very controversial advice, and many will argue 
with it. DO NOT use the facilities of your document class for your 
frontmatter -- instead use custom styles and ERT (inserted LaTeX code) to 
fine-tune your front matter exactly how you want it. There's nothing sadder 
than the guy who picks a document class to get the frontmatter just right, 
and then has to live with that document class's ideosyncracies throughout the 
book. Personally, I always start with the plain old Book document class, and 
use a layout file to add the features I need.

You've picked a great tool to write your book.

SteveT

-- 
Steve Litt

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Typhoon]

On Wed, 29 Apr 2009 08:19:34 +0200
Thomas Løcke thomas.granv...@gmail.com wrote:

 Hey,
 
 I'm about to start the process of writing the 2nd edition of a fairly
 long (+150 A4 pages) internal manual. It's about a set of software
 systems and programming practices in my business. The 1st edition was
 written using OpenOffice. I remember spending a lot of time trying to
 make things look good, and when I'm reading the manual today, I'm
 constantly reminded of how hard I failed at that.  :o)
 
 So for this 2nd edition, I've been looking for some better tools, and
 this has brought me to LyX. I've installed LyX and TexLive on my
 Slackware 12.1 system, and I've tinkered some with it. It appears to
 be *exactly* what I'm looking for.
 
 But before I start writing, I'd like to ask if there are any good
 resources on using LyX for writing what is essentially a book on
 programming. I'd really like to avoid painting myself into a corner,
 like I did with OpenOffice.
 
 Any and all advice is more than welcome.

Steve Litt is your man - he has done several books that sound similar
to this.

I have done a 600 page law textbook with LyX (but the publisher
insisted on a Word file). Lots of indexing, table of statutes, table of
cases. Worked flawlessly.

I also did a (smaller format) cookbook which had lots of minipages and
images. Again, no problems at all: http://books.lulu.com/content/728996

HTH,
Alan

 
 Sincerely,
 Thomas Løcke
 

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Guenter Milde]

On 2009-04-29, Thomas Løcke wrote:

 But before I start writing, I'd like to ask if there are any good
 resources on using LyX for writing what is essentially a book on
 programming. I'd really like to avoid painting myself into a corner,
 like I did with OpenOffice.

Writing a 150+ pages book with LyX is a common task.

There are some usage examples and lots of advice (partially outdated) on
wiki.lyx.org.

Günter

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Piero Faustini]

Guenter Milde mi...@... writes:

 Writing a 150+ pages book with LyX is a common task.

No problem with my dissertation of 130+ (and growing) pages.

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Uwe Stöhr]

Thomas Løcke schrieb:


But before I start writing, I'd like to ask if there are any good
resources on using LyX for writing what is essentially a book on
programming.


I recommend that you work yourself through LyX's Intro _and_ Tutorial manual, that you find in LyX's 
Help menu, before you start writing. A look at chapter 6 of the UserGuide will also help because 
there the book-specific tasks like Indexing are described.


The UserGuide, the Math, and the EmbeddedObjects manual can also be taken as example because they 
are written to be a printable book in the PDF output.


regards Uwe

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Marcelo Acuña]

 Hey,
 
 I'm about to start the process of writing the 2nd
 edition of a fairly
 long (+150 A4 pages) internal manual. It's about a set
 of software
 systems and programming practices in my business. The 1st
 edition was
 written using OpenOffice. I remember spending a lot of time
 trying to
 make things look good, and when I'm reading
 the manual today, I'm
 constantly reminded of how hard I failed at that.  :o)
 
 So for this 2nd edition, I've been looking for some
 better tools, and
 this has brought me to LyX. I've installed LyX and
 TexLive on my
 Slackware 12.1 system, and I've tinkered some with it.
 It appears to
 be *exactly* what I'm looking for.
 
 But before I start writing, I'd like to ask if there
 are any good
 resources on using LyX for writing what is essentially a
 book on
 programming. I'd really like to avoid painting myself
 into a corner,
 like I did with OpenOffice.
 
 Any and all advice is more than welcome.
 
 Sincerely,
 Thomas Løcke

 I´am sure that Lyx is the better choice.
 No problem with longer stuff.
 If the stuff is complex, the advantage over openoffice or word or another word 
like text processor became more great.
 Marcelo


  Yahoo! Cocina
Recetas prácticas y comida saludable
http://ar.mujer.yahoo.com/cocina/

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Steve Litt]

On Wednesday 29 April 2009 02:19:34 am Thomas Løcke wrote:
 Hey,

 I'm about to start the process of writing the 2nd edition of a fairly
 long (+150 A4 pages) internal manual. It's about a set of software
 systems and programming practices in my business. The 1st edition was
 written using OpenOffice. I remember spending a lot of time trying to
 make things look good, and when I'm reading the manual today, I'm
 constantly reminded of how hard I failed at that.  :o)

 So for this 2nd edition, I've been looking for some better tools, and
 this has brought me to LyX. I've installed LyX and TexLive on my
 Slackware 12.1 system, and I've tinkered some with it. It appears to
 be *exactly* what I'm looking for.

 But before I start writing, I'd like to ask if there are any good
 resources on using LyX for writing what is essentially a book on
 programming. I'd really like to avoid painting myself into a corner,
 like I did with OpenOffice.

 Any and all advice is more than welcome.

 Sincerely,
 Thomas Løcke

Hi Thomas,

In my opinion, LyX is exactly the right tool for what you're doing. With its 
WYSIAWYG (What You See Is Almost What You Get) environment, you can pound out 
content as fast as your fingers can type, and never have to spend time 
remembering codes or have codes get in your way when proofreading. Almost all 
appearance will be done by styles, so during authoring you needn't spend time 
fine tuning the look of the book. And because LyX uses LaTeX under the hood, 
your book comes out typeset very pleasingly.

I've used LyX to write a 309 page 8.5x11, a 201 page 8.5x11, a 231 page 8.5x11 
eBook, 2 more eBooks in the 100+ page range, one that was 90 pages, and I'm 
working on one that's probably going to weigh in at about 150.

You mentioned this is a programming book and you want to avoid getting painted 
into corners. You need to figure out ahead of time what styles you'll need. 
You'll definitely need a paragraph style for code (paragraph styles are 
called environments in LyX). Personally I make my own (mycode), which is 
really just a copystyle of lyx-code. You'll also need a character style for 
code (mycodec).

Presumably you're going to need styles Tip, Warning, Caution, and Note for 
callouts. You might also need a generic callout, so if you want a box with 
heading DON'T RETURN A LOCAL POINTER FROM A FUNCTION and text explainging why 
the pointer went out of scope, you can do so.

If necessary I can send you my code for these styles.

You might also want to change the listing styles. For instance, I always 
modify the listing environments to make them take less vertical space. When I 
do that, I give the modified styles new names.

Presumably you'll also need a convention of how you're going to do 
screenshots. Do you want them always exactly in line with the surrounding 
text, or would you prefer they be able to float to nearby pages so LaTeX 
can optimize page filling?

Are you going to personalize the books? Personalization puts the reader on 
notice that if he/she makes the choice to republish the book on the Internet, 
his/her name goes with it. In my opinion, personalization is a must with 
eBooks, and it's easy with LyX.

I'd suggest you read all the LyX help files, especially the customization one. 
I'd also suggest you read Litt's LyX Library at 
http://www.troubleshooters.com/linux/lyx/index.htm. Search the Internet for a 
doc called TeX for the Impatient and read it. There's also a Not So Short 
Introduction to LaTeX or something like that, read it. The Memoir document 
class has some must-read documentation -- read it, but I don't recommend you 
actually use the Memoir document class. A guy named Herbert Voss, who used to 
be a mainstay on the LyX list, has a website with all sorts of cool LaTeX 
riffs. Last but not least, there are a few dead-trees books on LaTeX. They're 
expensive, but helpful. By spending the first 3 days of your project reading, 
you'll understand all the corners you can get out of, and you'll probably 
discover any you can't.

Remember when you're creating your styles that they don't have to be perfect 
the first time around -- you can change them later. Make em quick and dirty 
at first, but just be sure to use them every time. The docs on my website are 
a pretty good reference for how to make your own styles.

Now I'm going to give you some very controversial advice, and many will argue 
with it. DO NOT use the facilities of your document class for your 
frontmatter -- instead use custom styles and ERT (inserted LaTeX code) to 
fine-tune your front matter exactly how you want it. There's nothing sadder 
than the guy who picks a document class to get the frontmatter just right, 
and then has to live with that document class's ideosyncracies throughout the 
book. Personally, I always start with the plain old Book document class, and 
use a layout file to add the features I need.

You've picked a great tool to write your book.

SteveT

-- 
Steve Litt

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Typhoon]

On Wed, 29 Apr 2009 08:19:34 +0200
Thomas Løcke  wrote:

> Hey,
> 
> I'm about to start the process of writing the 2nd edition of a fairly
> long (+150 A4 pages) internal manual. It's about a set of software
> systems and programming practices in my business. The 1st edition was
> written using OpenOffice. I remember spending a lot of time trying to
> make things "look good", and when I'm reading the manual today, I'm
> constantly reminded of how hard I failed at that.  :o)
> 
> So for this 2nd edition, I've been looking for some better tools, and
> this has brought me to LyX. I've installed LyX and TexLive on my
> Slackware 12.1 system, and I've tinkered some with it. It appears to
> be *exactly* what I'm looking for.
> 
> But before I start writing, I'd like to ask if there are any good
> resources on using LyX for writing what is essentially a book on
> programming. I'd really like to avoid painting myself into a corner,
> like I did with OpenOffice.
> 
> Any and all advice is more than welcome.

Steve Litt is your man - he has done several books that sound similar
to this.

I have done a 600 page law textbook with LyX (but the publisher
insisted on a Word file). Lots of indexing, table of statutes, table of
cases. Worked flawlessly.

I also did a (smaller format) cookbook which had lots of minipages and
images. Again, no problems at all: http://books.lulu.com/content/728996

HTH,
Alan

> 
> Sincerely,
> Thomas Løcke
> 

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Guenter Milde]

On 2009-04-29, Thomas Løcke wrote:

> But before I start writing, I'd like to ask if there are any good
> resources on using LyX for writing what is essentially a book on
> programming. I'd really like to avoid painting myself into a corner,
> like I did with OpenOffice.

Writing a 150+ pages book with LyX is a common task.

There are some usage examples and lots of advice (partially outdated) on
wiki.lyx.org.

Günter

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Piero Faustini]

Guenter Milde  writes:

> Writing a 150+ pages book with LyX is a common task.

No problem with my dissertation of 130+ (and growing) pages.

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Uwe Stöhr]

Thomas Løcke schrieb:


But before I start writing, I'd like to ask if there are any good
resources on using LyX for writing what is essentially a book on
programming.


I recommend that you work yourself through LyX's Intro _and_ Tutorial manual, that you find in LyX's 
Help menu, before you start writing. A look at chapter 6 of the UserGuide will also help because 
there the book-specific tasks like Indexing are described.


The UserGuide, the Math, and the EmbeddedObjects manual can also be taken as example because they 
are written to be a printable book in the PDF output.


regards Uwe

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Marcelo Acuña]

> Hey,
> 
> I'm about to start the process of writing the 2nd
> edition of a fairly
> long (+150 A4 pages) internal manual. It's about a set
> of software
> systems and programming practices in my business. The 1st
> edition was
> written using OpenOffice. I remember spending a lot of time
> trying to
> make things "look good", and when I'm reading
> the manual today, I'm
> constantly reminded of how hard I failed at that.  :o)
> 
> So for this 2nd edition, I've been looking for some
> better tools, and
> this has brought me to LyX. I've installed LyX and
> TexLive on my
> Slackware 12.1 system, and I've tinkered some with it.
> It appears to
> be *exactly* what I'm looking for.
> 
> But before I start writing, I'd like to ask if there
> are any good
> resources on using LyX for writing what is essentially a
> book on
> programming. I'd really like to avoid painting myself
> into a corner,
> like I did with OpenOffice.
> 
> Any and all advice is more than welcome.
> 
> Sincerely,
> Thomas Løcke

 I´am sure that Lyx is the better choice.
 No problem with longer stuff.
 If the stuff is complex, the advantage over openoffice or word or another word 
like text processor became more great.
 Marcelo


  Yahoo! Cocina
Recetas prácticas y comida saludable
http://ar.mujer.yahoo.com/cocina/

Re: Using LyX for writing a very long manual

[Steve Litt]

On Wednesday 29 April 2009 02:19:34 am Thomas Løcke wrote:
> Hey,
>
> I'm about to start the process of writing the 2nd edition of a fairly
> long (+150 A4 pages) internal manual. It's about a set of software
> systems and programming practices in my business. The 1st edition was
> written using OpenOffice. I remember spending a lot of time trying to
> make things "look good", and when I'm reading the manual today, I'm
> constantly reminded of how hard I failed at that.  :o)
>
> So for this 2nd edition, I've been looking for some better tools, and
> this has brought me to LyX. I've installed LyX and TexLive on my
> Slackware 12.1 system, and I've tinkered some with it. It appears to
> be *exactly* what I'm looking for.
>
> But before I start writing, I'd like to ask if there are any good
> resources on using LyX for writing what is essentially a book on
> programming. I'd really like to avoid painting myself into a corner,
> like I did with OpenOffice.
>
> Any and all advice is more than welcome.
>
> Sincerely,
> Thomas Løcke

Hi Thomas,

In my opinion, LyX is exactly the right tool for what you're doing. With its 
WYSIAWYG (What You See Is Almost What You Get) environment, you can pound out 
content as fast as your fingers can type, and never have to spend time 
remembering codes or have codes get in your way when proofreading. Almost all 
appearance will be done by styles, so during authoring you needn't spend time 
fine tuning the look of the book. And because LyX uses LaTeX under the hood, 
your book comes out typeset very pleasingly.

I've used LyX to write a 309 page 8.5x11, a 201 page 8.5x11, a 231 page 8.5x11 
eBook, 2 more eBooks in the 100+ page range, one that was 90 pages, and I'm 
working on one that's probably going to weigh in at about 150.

You mentioned this is a programming book and you want to avoid getting painted 
into corners. You need to figure out ahead of time what styles you'll need. 
You'll definitely need a paragraph style for code (paragraph styles are 
called "environments" in LyX). Personally I make my own (mycode), which is 
really just a copystyle of lyx-code. You'll also need a character style for 
code (mycodec).

Presumably you're going to need styles Tip, Warning, Caution, and Note for 
callouts. You might also need a generic callout, so if you want a box with 
heading DON'T RETURN A LOCAL POINTER FROM A FUNCTION and text explainging why 
the pointer went out of scope, you can do so.

If necessary I can send you my code for these styles.

You might also want to change the listing styles. For instance, I always 
modify the listing environments to make them take less vertical space. When I 
do that, I give the modified styles new names.

Presumably you'll also need a convention of how you're going to do 
screenshots. Do you want them always exactly in line with the surrounding 
text, or would you prefer they be able to "float" to nearby pages so LaTeX 
can optimize page filling?

Are you going to personalize the books? Personalization puts the reader on 
notice that if he/she makes the choice to republish the book on the Internet, 
his/her name goes with it. In my opinion, personalization is a must with 
eBooks, and it's easy with LyX.

I'd suggest you read all the LyX help files, especially the customization one. 
I'd also suggest you read "Litt's LyX Library" at 
http://www.troubleshooters.com/linux/lyx/index.htm. Search the Internet for a 
doc called "TeX for the Impatient" and read it. There's also a "Not So Short 
Introduction to LaTeX" or something like that, read it. The Memoir document 
class has some must-read documentation -- read it, but I don't recommend you 
actually use the Memoir document class. A guy named Herbert Voss, who used to 
be a mainstay on the LyX list, has a website with all sorts of cool LaTeX 
riffs. Last but not least, there are a few dead-trees books on LaTeX. They're 
expensive, but helpful. By spending the first 3 days of your project reading, 
you'll understand all the corners you can get out of, and you'll probably 
discover any you can't.

Remember when you're creating your styles that they don't have to be perfect 
the first time around -- you can change them later. Make em quick and dirty 
at first, but just be sure to use them every time. The docs on my website are 
a pretty good reference for how to make your own styles.

Now I'm going to give you some very controversial advice, and many will argue 
with it. DO NOT use the facilities of your document class for your 
frontmatter -- instead use custom styles and ERT (inserted LaTeX code) to 
fine-tune your front matter exactly how you want it. There's nothing sadder 
than the guy who picks a document class to get the frontmatter just right, 
and then has to live with that document class's ideosyncracies throughout the 
book. Personally, I always start with the plain old Book document class, and 
use a layout file to add the features I need.

You've picked a great tool to write your