Re: Text output encodings
Via Markedown export? el On 2018-02-19 20:44 , F M Salter wrote: > On 19/02/18 07:55, F M Salter wrote: >> Hi >> >> When plain text is used as output, emphasised text loses emphasis. >> >> Is there any way by which text output may be specified with utf-8 >> encoding? Emphasis could then be maintained. >> >> Regards >> >> Frank Salter [...]
Re: Text output encodings
On 2018-02-19, F M Salter wrote: > To explain in more detail. LyX uses utf-8. utf-8 is standard on > most operating systems. > RTF is obsolescent and is not a text file. > If I insert utf-8 italic characters into a LyX file, the plain text > output contains italic characters. Fine. You mean the italic characters in the "Mathematical Alphanumeric Symbols" block , right? > I wanted to know if there was a LyX method which would produce > italic utf-8 characters from emphasised text. No. This would go against the intended use of the Mathematical Alphanumeric Symbols. The Unicode standard says: @@ 1D400 Mathematical Alphanumeric Symbols 1D7FF @@+ @+ To be used for mathematical variables where style variations are important semantically. For general text, use standard Latin and Greek letters with markup. Most fonts will also display these mathematical letters different from text (no kerning, wider spacing) and there are many missing characters (Umlauts ...). > If not, this would become a feature request. An Unicode-compatible option would be to underline emphasized text with compose-characters, but I don't know whether this would be regarded a good idea by the developers. I could rather imagine export to a minimalistic markup format like reStructuredText or MarkDown. sincerely, Günter
Re: Text output encodings
On 02/19/2018 04:43 PM, Daniel Kian Mc Kiernan wrote: On 02/19/2018 10:44 AM, F M Salter wrote: To explain in more detail. LyX uses utf-8. utf-8 is standard on most operating systems. RTF is obsolescent and is not a text file. If I insert utf-8 italic characters into a LyX file, the plain text output contains italic characters. I wanted to know if there was a LyX method which would produce italic utf-8 characters from emphasised text. If not, this would become a feature request. You are confusing characters with glyphs. The letter ‘a’ may be drawn many ways, but it is always the same character no matter how it is drawn; the distinct ways of drawing it are glyphs. Unicode is supposed to distinguish characters from glyphs. Its designers have done this imperfectly, sometimes making inexcusable mistakes, but they still basically do this. There are no italics characters as such. There are characters whose typical glyphs might seem to be italic, but these characters are not their glyphs, nor are the character with such typical glyphs the same characters as you take for the non-italicized versions. There is no distinct _character_ italicized ‘a’, though there are distinct characters that are not ‘a’ but may look like italicized ‘a’ to you. A font file that rendered them without italicization would not violate the standards. In theory, Unicode could have a combing character, such that following a character with the combining character would signal that the first character were in some way to be emphasized. Right now, Unicode does not have this, and I doubt that it ever will, because of the struggles that would result over how many such characters there should be to support distinct forms of emphasis. Now, you might suggest that LyX _fake_ it, identifying characters from one range that typically _look_ like italicizations of the characters found in standard European alphabets. I'm not sure how well it could be implemented. But, in any case, I don't think that this suggestion would be well received. And, if you make it, then you need to be _very_ clear about what would provoke this device. (All emphasis? textit?) I probably should add this point: If you have an interface that is indeed italicizing characters on demand, then it is using something other that Unicode as such to do it; any editor that italicizes some substrings and not others is actually using mark-up of some sort in its files.
Re: Text output encodings
On 02/19/2018 04:43 PM, Daniel Kian Mc Kiernan wrote: On 02/19/2018 10:44 AM, F M Salter wrote: To explain in more detail. LyX uses utf-8. utf-8 is standard on most operating systems. RTF is obsolescent and is not a text file. If I insert utf-8 italic characters into a LyX file, the plain text output contains italic characters. I wanted to know if there was a LyX method which would produce italic utf-8 characters from emphasised text. If not, this would become a feature request. You are confusing characters with glyphs. The letter ‘a’ may be drawn many ways, but it is always the same character no matter how it is drawn; the distinct ways of drawing it are glyphs. Unicode is supposed to distinguish characters from glyphs. Its designers have done this imperfectly, sometimes making inexcusable mistakes, but they still basically do this. There are no italics characters as such. There are characters whose typical glyphs might seem to be italic, but these characters are not their glyphs, nor are the character with such typical glyphs the same characters as you take for the non-italicized versions. There is no distinct _character_ italicized ‘a’, though there are distinct characters that are not ‘a’ but may look like italicized ‘a’ to you. A font file that rendered them without italicization would not violate the standards. In theory, Unicode could have a combing character, such that following a character with the combining character would signal that the first character were in some way to be emphasized. Right now, Unicode does not have this, and I doubt that it ever will, because of the struggles that would result over how many such characters there should be to support distinct forms of emphasis. Now, you might suggest that LyX _fake_ it, identifying characters from one range that typically _look_ like italicizations of the characters found in standard European alphabets. I'm not sure how well it could be implemented. But, in any case, I don't think that this suggestion would be well received. And, if you make it, then you need to be _very_ clear about what would provoke this device. (All emphasis? textit?) I probably should add this point: If you have an interface that is indeed italicizing characters on demand, then it is using something other that Unicode as such to do it; any editor that italicizes some substrings and not others is actually using mark-up of some sort in its files.
Re: Text output encodings
On 02/19/2018 10:44 AM, F M Salter wrote: To explain in more detail. LyX uses utf-8. utf-8 is standard on most operating systems. RTF is obsolescent and is not a text file. If I insert utf-8 italic characters into a LyX file, the plain text output contains italic characters. I wanted to know if there was a LyX method which would produce italic utf-8 characters from emphasised text. If not, this would become a feature request. You are confusing characters with glyphs. The letter ‘a’ may be drawn many ways, but it is always the same character no matter how it is drawn; the distinct ways of drawing it are glyphs. Unicode is supposed to distinguish characters from glyphs. Its designers have done this imperfectly, sometimes making inexcusable mistakes, but they still basically do this. There are no italics characters as such. There are characters whose typical glyphs might seem to be italic, but these characters are not their glyphs, nor are the character with such typical glyphs the same characters as you take for the non-italicized versions. There is no distinct _character_ italicized ‘a’, though there are distinct characters that are not ‘a’ but may look like italicized ‘a’ to you. A font file that rendered them without italicization would not violate the standards. In theory, Unicode could have a combing character, such that following a character with the combining character would signal that the first character were in some way to be emphasized. Right now, Unicode does not have this, and I doubt that it ever will, because of the struggles that would result over how many such characters there should be to support distinct forms of emphasis. Now, you might suggest that LyX _fake_ it, identifying characters from one range that typically _look_ like italicizations of the characters found in standard European alphabets. I'm not sure how well it could be implemented. But, in any case, I don't think that this suggestion would be well received. And, if you make it, then you need to be _very_ clear about what would provoke this device. (All emphasis? textit?)
Re: Text output encodings
On 19/02/18 07:55, F M Salter wrote: > Hi > > When plain text is used as output, emphasised text loses emphasis. > > Is there any way by which text output may be specified with utf-8 > encoding? Emphasis could then be maintained. > > Regards > > Frank Salter > ... ... To explain in more detail. LyX uses utf-8. utf-8 is standard on most operating systems. RTF is obsolescent and is not a text file. If I insert utf-8 italic characters into a LyX file, the plain text output contains italic characters. I wanted to know if there was a LyX method which would produce italic utf-8 characters from emphasised text. If not, this would become a feature request. Regards Frank Salter
Re: Text output encodings
On 02/19/2018 02:25 AM, F M Salter wrote: On 19/02/18 08:06, Daniel Kian Mc Kiernan wrote: The very definition of “plain text” precludes what you're hoping toget. The closest thing of which I know to what you want is RTF(rich-text format) Plain text is the export option offered by LyX. There is no RTF option! First, if that were simply true, it wouldn't change the point that plain text simply does not have italics, boldface, underlining, And that was my essential point. Second, when last I knew, users could configure LyX to work with LaTeX2rtf on some OSs (Linux, Mac OS X, and Windows). How this configuration is effected varies with OS. If you really want to export to RTF, google “LaTeX2rtf site:lyx.org”. But, since I don't know what your ultimate objective be, I don't know whether converting to RTF would really get you closer, or just send you on a goose-chase.
Re: Text output encodings
F M Salter wrote: > On 19/02/18 08:06, Daniel Kian Mc Kiernan wrote: > > The very definition of ???plain text??? precludes what you're hoping > > to get. The closest thing of which I know to what you want is > > RTF (rich-text format) > > > Plain text is the export option offered by LyX. > There is no RTF option! Try installing latex2rtf first (http://www.lyx.org/AdditionalSoftware). Pavel
Re: Text output encodings
On 19/02/18 08:06, Daniel Kian Mc Kiernan wrote: > The very definition of “plain text” precludes what you're hoping > to get. The closest thing of which I know to what you want is > RTF (rich-text format) > Plain text is the export option offered by LyX. There is no RTF option! Regards Frank Salter
Re: Text output encodings
The very definition of “plain text” precludes what you're hoping to get. The closest thing of which I know to what you want is RTF (rich-text format). On 02/18/2018 11:55 PM, F M Salter wrote: Hi When plain text is used as output, emphasised text loses emphasis. Is there any way by which text output may be specified with utf-8 encoding? Emphasis could then be maintained. Regards Frank Salter
Text output encodings
Hi When plain text is used as output, emphasised text loses emphasis. Is there any way by which text output may be specified with utf-8 encoding? Emphasis could then be maintained. Regards Frank Salter
