Re: Tables [was:] Re: numbers
Oh yes, I'm going to write to the developer. Who knows what the next update brings. But what I like better on Mac developers than on them for Windows is they seem to be more open to the needs of the customers. Very often it is possible to find their ear. ;-) All the best Jürgen Am 24.02.2012 um 07:49 schrieb Simon Cavendish: Dear Jurgen, I am afraid I had made the wretched mistake of updating Tables to its latest version as I moved to Lion so I do not have the Tables version where editing cells was easier and worked better. I too like Tables a lot. It has quite a few shortcut keys that seem to work like for selecting cells and it will also tell you if the cell you have input text is clipped by another cell to the right or left which may be significant. Maybe you could try and e-mail the Tables designer as well to let him know that we are having some issues. I found his e-mail on the Tables website but I can't find it now and I will be off to work shortly. With best wishes Simon On 24 Feb 2012, at 06:41, Jürgen Fleger wrote: Hello Simon, that workes, thanks. The only issue: VO doesn't anounce the character when using the arrow keys. Is that the issue in the latest version you meant? Could you send me the version you work with? j.fle...@gmx.de Because actually it seems to be a great program. Navigating is much faster then in Numbers. And there are features I miss in Numbers such as CMD + arrow keys and Option + arrow keys to reach specific parts of a sheet. Thanks and all the best Jürgen Am 24.02.2012 um 07:34 schrieb Simon Cavendish: When focused on the cell you wish to change data in, press F2 key which will put you in the editing mode. Then you should be able to use your cursor keys. Once done, press tab. In the previous version of Tables, this worked very well. The latest update has rendered this important function more difficult. I noticed it as soon as I had installed the latest version. I reported it to the developer but had no answer from him. I only hope that he is going to improve it. In the past, he was rather sympathetic to Voiceover users. I was disappointed with this negative change as Tables worked for me far better than Numbers. Sorry I have no better news. On 23 Feb 2012, at 06:47, Jürgen Fleger wrote: No Rafael, that's not what I asked for. I know how to enter data. But I want to change existing data in the cells. Imagine you have an address of a friend in a cell. His telephone number changes and you want to change just the number. How to do this in Tables? I don't see this important possibility accessible with VoiceOver. Again: how to change specific data in a cell? Not entering data in an empty cell. That's easy. Hopefully my question is clearer now. Jürgen Am 22.02.2012 um 16:26 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: Tables has a data entry field. That is where data are entered into each cell. If you cannot find the data entry field on your own, you may benefit from sighted help to find it the first time. Place your cursor in the field, making sure VO is not locked. You can then type or paste in data and formulae. If you type in the data entry field, press the return (enter) key to get the data into the cell. The arrow keys are used to move between cells. Rafael On Feb 22, 2012, at 2:17 AM, Jürgen Fleger wrote: Hello Rafael, thanks for your hints. So far Tables works fine. But what I meant was how to edit a cell and change inserted content. That doesn't work here for me. As far as I could find out I have to enter the edit mode of a chosen cell by pressing F2. VO anounces edit. But then it's not possible to read or delete single characters or to navigate through the content of a cell just by using the arrow keys. Of course I can navigate by using VO + arrow keys but. I should say that I use a sheet like a two dimensional notepad. I don't use it as a calculator and so I don't need formulas in a cell. But to take notes and so I enter a lot of text in it. So it's quite important for me to delete parts of the text and enter new content. So: How do you delete parts of text in a cell and how to enter just one word in a text of a cell? Deleting a whole cell is easily possible. Thanks and all the best Jürgen Am 22.02.2012 um 05:45 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: If you are using an Intel-based Mac, then the first thing to do when you open the Tables application is to get the cursor out of the table. Press Shift, Control, Option, up-arrow together, in order to get out of the table where the cursor is pointing. Press this key combination again to get out of the spreadsheet. Do these things first, or the following instructions won't make sense. Basically, there are two ways to read a cell's contents in Tables. The first way is to place the cursor over the field in which one enters numbers, formulae, and so on. If you choose
RE: Tables [was:] Re: numbers
When I want to change the contents of a particular cell, I position the cursor on the data-entry field. Then, I arrow over to the cell that I want to edit. Next, I press the delete (back-space) key to delete the cell's contents. Finally, I type in the new information that I wish to store in that cell. From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Jürgen Fleger [apple-engl...@fleger.net] Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2012 12:47 AM To: Mac Visionaries Visionaries Subject: Tables [was:] Re: numbers No Rafael, that's not what I asked for. I know how to enter data. But I want to change existing data in the cells. Imagine you have an address of a friend in a cell. His telephone number changes and you want to change just the number. How to do this in Tables? I don't see this important possibility accessible with VoiceOver. Again: how to change specific data in a cell? Not entering data in an empty cell. That's easy. Hopefully my question is clearer now. Jürgen Am 22.02.2012 um 16:26 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: Tables has a data entry field. That is where data are entered into each cell. If you cannot find the data entry field on your own, you may benefit from sighted help to find it the first time. Place your cursor in the field, making sure VO is not locked. You can then type or paste in data and formulae. If you type in the data entry field, press the return (enter) key to get the data into the cell. The arrow keys are used to move between cells. Rafael On Feb 22, 2012, at 2:17 AM, Jürgen Fleger wrote: Hello Rafael, thanks for your hints. So far Tables works fine. But what I meant was how to edit a cell and change inserted content. That doesn't work here for me. As far as I could find out I have to enter the edit mode of a chosen cell by pressing F2. VO anounces edit. But then it's not possible to read or delete single characters or to navigate through the content of a cell just by using the arrow keys. Of course I can navigate by using VO + arrow keys but. I should say that I use a sheet like a two dimensional notepad. I don't use it as a calculator and so I don't need formulas in a cell. But to take notes and so I enter a lot of text in it. So it's quite important for me to delete parts of the text and enter new content. So: How do you delete parts of text in a cell and how to enter just one word in a text of a cell? Deleting a whole cell is easily possible. Thanks and all the best Jürgen Am 22.02.2012 um 05:45 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: If you are using an Intel-based Mac, then the first thing to do when you open the Tables application is to get the cursor out of the table. Press Shift, Control, Option, up-arrow together, in order to get out of the table where the cursor is pointing. Press this key combination again to get out of the spreadsheet. Do these things first, or the following instructions won't make sense. Basically, there are two ways to read a cell's contents in Tables. The first way is to place the cursor over the field in which one enters numbers, formulae, and so on. If you choose this option, make sure VO is not locked, so that you can use the arrow keys to move from cell to cell (i.e., left arrow to move to the left, bottom arrow to move down, etc.). This is a simple option that allows you to navigate from cell to cell, to read each cell's contents, and to enter data into individual cells, all from the data-entry field. The second way to move around in Tables is somewhat more complicated. To make things easier, first lock VO (by pressing control-option-semicolon). Next, enter the spreadsheet, by pressing shift and the down-arrow key together. At this level, you will be able to move the VO cursor with the arrow keys and read the letters designating the columns (i.e., Column A, Column B, etc.), as well as the row numbers (i.e., Row 1, Row 2, etc.). To access the individual cells, navigate to the table (VO says table when you've found it). With VO still locked, press the shift and down-arrow keys together again. That will put you in the table of cells, from which point onward you can just use the arrow keys to navigate from cell to cell. I hope this helps. Let me know if you have any other questions, and I'll do my best to try to answer them. Cordially, Rafael From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Jürgen Fleger [apple-engl...@fleger.net] Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2012 3:52 PM To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: numbers Hi Rafael, I tried Tables and it's much faster to work with then with Numbers. But what I didn't understand was how to read text in a cell. I pressed F2 to edit the cell and couldn't have VO to read text by pressing arrow keys. Did I something wrong
Re: Tables [was:] Re: numbers
OK, that's interesting. I thought you might do it this way. So it is not possible to change just a part of the content of a cell. You have to change the whole content. I opened an excel file with several sheets in Tables and tried to switch between the sheets by pressing CMD + Option + arrow right or left. It didn't work. Tables was always busy. Do you have experiences with switching sheets in Tables? Did it work for you? Jürgen Am 23.02.2012 um 17:51 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: When I want to change the contents of a particular cell, I position the cursor on the data-entry field. Then, I arrow over to the cell that I want to edit. Next, I press the delete (back-space) key to delete the cell's contents. Finally, I type in the new information that I wish to store in that cell. From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Jürgen Fleger [apple-engl...@fleger.net] Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2012 12:47 AM To: Mac Visionaries Visionaries Subject: Tables [was:] Re: numbers No Rafael, that's not what I asked for. I know how to enter data. But I want to change existing data in the cells. Imagine you have an address of a friend in a cell. His telephone number changes and you want to change just the number. How to do this in Tables? I don't see this important possibility accessible with VoiceOver. Again: how to change specific data in a cell? Not entering data in an empty cell. That's easy. Hopefully my question is clearer now. Jürgen Am 22.02.2012 um 16:26 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: Tables has a data entry field. That is where data are entered into each cell. If you cannot find the data entry field on your own, you may benefit from sighted help to find it the first time. Place your cursor in the field, making sure VO is not locked. You can then type or paste in data and formulae. If you type in the data entry field, press the return (enter) key to get the data into the cell. The arrow keys are used to move between cells. Rafael On Feb 22, 2012, at 2:17 AM, Jürgen Fleger wrote: Hello Rafael, thanks for your hints. So far Tables works fine. But what I meant was how to edit a cell and change inserted content. That doesn't work here for me. As far as I could find out I have to enter the edit mode of a chosen cell by pressing F2. VO anounces edit. But then it's not possible to read or delete single characters or to navigate through the content of a cell just by using the arrow keys. Of course I can navigate by using VO + arrow keys but. I should say that I use a sheet like a two dimensional notepad. I don't use it as a calculator and so I don't need formulas in a cell. But to take notes and so I enter a lot of text in it. So it's quite important for me to delete parts of the text and enter new content. So: How do you delete parts of text in a cell and how to enter just one word in a text of a cell? Deleting a whole cell is easily possible. Thanks and all the best Jürgen Am 22.02.2012 um 05:45 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: If you are using an Intel-based Mac, then the first thing to do when you open the Tables application is to get the cursor out of the table. Press Shift, Control, Option, up-arrow together, in order to get out of the table where the cursor is pointing. Press this key combination again to get out of the spreadsheet. Do these things first, or the following instructions won't make sense. Basically, there are two ways to read a cell's contents in Tables. The first way is to place the cursor over the field in which one enters numbers, formulae, and so on. If you choose this option, make sure VO is not locked, so that you can use the arrow keys to move from cell to cell (i.e., left arrow to move to the left, bottom arrow to move down, etc.). This is a simple option that allows you to navigate from cell to cell, to read each cell's contents, and to enter data into individual cells, all from the data-entry field. The second way to move around in Tables is somewhat more complicated. To make things easier, first lock VO (by pressing control-option-semicolon). Next, enter the spreadsheet, by pressing shift and the down-arrow key together. At this level, you will be able to move the VO cursor with the arrow keys and read the letters designating the columns (i.e., Column A, Column B, etc.), as well as the row numbers (i.e., Row 1, Row 2, etc.). To access the individual cells, navigate to the table (VO says table when you've found it). With VO still locked, press the shift and down-arrow keys together again. That will put you in the table of cells, from which point onward you can just use the arrow keys to navigate from cell to cell. I hope this helps. Let me know if you have any other questions, and I'll do my best to try to answer them. Cordially, Rafael
Re: Tables [was:] Re: numbers
Hi Jürgen, Have you tried cutting the info from the cell and pasting it in to text edit and make your edits than paste it back to the same cell? Some times when I am in Pro tools I do this and it is much faster and less frustrating! :) Your mileage May Vary! ;) CHUCK REICHEL 954-742-0019 www.SoundPictureRecording.com In GOD I Trust On Feb 23, 2012, at 2:47 PM, Jürgen Fleger wrote: OK, that's interesting. I thought you might do it this way. So it is not possible to change just a part of the content of a cell. You have to change the whole content. I opened an excel file with several sheets in Tables and tried to switch between the sheets by pressing CMD + Option + arrow right or left. It didn't work. Tables was always busy. Do you have experiences with switching sheets in Tables? Did it work for you? Jürgen Am 23.02.2012 um 17:51 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: When I want to change the contents of a particular cell, I position the cursor on the data-entry field. Then, I arrow over to the cell that I want to edit. Next, I press the delete (back-space) key to delete the cell's contents. Finally, I type in the new information that I wish to store in that cell. From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Jürgen Fleger [apple-engl...@fleger.net] Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2012 12:47 AM To: Mac Visionaries Visionaries Subject: Tables [was:] Re: numbers No Rafael, that's not what I asked for. I know how to enter data. But I want to change existing data in the cells. Imagine you have an address of a friend in a cell. His telephone number changes and you want to change just the number. How to do this in Tables? I don't see this important possibility accessible with VoiceOver. Again: how to change specific data in a cell? Not entering data in an empty cell. That's easy. Hopefully my question is clearer now. Jürgen Am 22.02.2012 um 16:26 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: Tables has a data entry field. That is where data are entered into each cell. If you cannot find the data entry field on your own, you may benefit from sighted help to find it the first time. Place your cursor in the field, making sure VO is not locked. You can then type or paste in data and formulae. If you type in the data entry field, press the return (enter) key to get the data into the cell. The arrow keys are used to move between cells. Rafael On Feb 22, 2012, at 2:17 AM, Jürgen Fleger wrote: Hello Rafael, thanks for your hints. So far Tables works fine. But what I meant was how to edit a cell and change inserted content. That doesn't work here for me. As far as I could find out I have to enter the edit mode of a chosen cell by pressing F2. VO anounces edit. But then it's not possible to read or delete single characters or to navigate through the content of a cell just by using the arrow keys. Of course I can navigate by using VO + arrow keys but. I should say that I use a sheet like a two dimensional notepad. I don't use it as a calculator and so I don't need formulas in a cell. But to take notes and so I enter a lot of text in it. So it's quite important for me to delete parts of the text and enter new content. So: How do you delete parts of text in a cell and how to enter just one word in a text of a cell? Deleting a whole cell is easily possible. Thanks and all the best Jürgen Am 22.02.2012 um 05:45 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: If you are using an Intel-based Mac, then the first thing to do when you open the Tables application is to get the cursor out of the table. Press Shift, Control, Option, up-arrow together, in order to get out of the table where the cursor is pointing. Press this key combination again to get out of the spreadsheet. Do these things first, or the following instructions won't make sense. Basically, there are two ways to read a cell's contents in Tables. The first way is to place the cursor over the field in which one enters numbers, formulae, and so on. If you choose this option, make sure VO is not locked, so that you can use the arrow keys to move from cell to cell (i.e., left arrow to move to the left, bottom arrow to move down, etc.). This is a simple option that allows you to navigate from cell to cell, to read each cell's contents, and to enter data into individual cells, all from the data-entry field. The second way to move around in Tables is somewhat more complicated. To make things easier, first lock VO (by pressing control-option-semicolon). Next, enter the spreadsheet, by pressing shift and the down-arrow key together. At this level, you will be able to move the VO cursor with the arrow keys and read the letters designating the columns (i.e., Column A, Column B, etc.), as well as the row numbers (i.e., Row 1, Row 2, etc.). To access the individual cells
Re: Tables [was:] Re: numbers
Y hi guys I have had some success with attitude on the end of a sale on what I do to make sure that I don't erase the whole thing, is to press command right arrow on my MacBook Pro, and then I can backspace out on the end and delete text-only in. A few instances have I been able to successfully edit in the middle of a sale in numbers Regards Gigi Sent from my iPhone On Feb 23, 2012, at 1:47 PM, Jürgen Fleger apple-engl...@fleger.net wrote: OK, that's interesting. I thought you might do it this way. So it is not possible to change just a part of the content of a cell. You have to change the whole content. I opened an excel file with several sheets in Tables and tried to switch between the sheets by pressing CMD + Option + arrow right or left. It didn't work. Tables was always busy. Do you have experiences with switching sheets in Tables? Did it work for you? Jürgen Am 23.02.2012 um 17:51 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: When I want to change the contents of a particular cell, I position the cursor on the data-entry field. Then, I arrow over to the cell that I want to edit. Next, I press the delete (back-space) key to delete the cell's contents. Finally, I type in the new information that I wish to store in that cell. From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Jürgen Fleger [apple-engl...@fleger.net] Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2012 12:47 AM To: Mac Visionaries Visionaries Subject: Tables [was:] Re: numbers No Rafael, that's not what I asked for. I know how to enter data. But I want to change existing data in the cells. Imagine you have an address of a friend in a cell. His telephone number changes and you want to change just the number. How to do this in Tables? I don't see this important possibility accessible with VoiceOver. Again: how to change specific data in a cell? Not entering data in an empty cell. That's easy. Hopefully my question is clearer now. Jürgen Am 22.02.2012 um 16:26 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: Tables has a data entry field. That is where data are entered into each cell. If you cannot find the data entry field on your own, you may benefit from sighted help to find it the first time. Place your cursor in the field, making sure VO is not locked. You can then type or paste in data and formulae. If you type in the data entry field, press the return (enter) key to get the data into the cell. The arrow keys are used to move between c -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups MacVisionaries group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
Re: Tables [was:] Re: numbers
Hi guys I know I may be one of the weird folks out there, but I actually like wordprocessors better for inputting data like phone numbers. Dismiss this is because, even in Windows, I have found getting around a spreadsheet with speech to be a pain pain However, if I were going to do that, am you can copy a cell to text edit and edit the thing and paste it back into a sale. Cats so it's not that it's an accessible with voiceover, it's just not is easy to do Regards Gigi Sent from my iPhone On Feb 23, 2012, at 12:47 AM, Jürgen Fleger apple-engl...@fleger.net wrote: No Rafael, that's not what I asked for. I know how to enter data. But I want to change existing data in the cells. Imagine you have an address of a friend in a cell. His telephone number changes and you want to change just the number. How to do this in Tables? I don't see this important possibility accessible with VoiceOver. Again: how to change specific data in a cell? Not entering data in an empty cell. That's easy. Hopefully my question is clearer now. Jürgen Am 22.02.2012 um 16:26 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: Tables has a data entry field. That is where data are entered into each cell. If you cannot find the data entry field on your own, you may benefit from sighted help to find it the first time. Place your cursor in the field, making sure VO is not locked. You can then type or paste in data and formulae. If you type in the data entry field, press the return (enter) key to get the data into the cell. The arrow keys are used to move between cells. Rafael On Feb 22, 2012, at 2:17 AM, Jürgen Fleger wrote: Hello Rafael, thanks for your hints. So far Tables works fine. But what I meant was how to edit a cell and change inserted content. That doesn't work here for me. As far as I could find out I have to enter the edit mode of a chosen cell by pressing F2. VO anounces edit. But then it's not possible to read or delete single characters or to navigate through the content of a cell just by using the arrow keys. Of course I can navigate by using VO + arrow keys but. I should say that I use a sheet like a two dimensional notepad. I don't use it as a calculator and so I don't need formulas in a cell. But to take notes and so I enter a lot of text in it. So it's quite important for me to delete parts of the text and enter new content. So: How do you delete parts of text in a cell and how to enter just one word in a text of a cell? Deleting a whole cell is easily possible. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups MacVisionaries group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
Re: Tables [was:] Re: numbers
I have not tried Tables in eons so I'm not sure if it will work the same as in for me in Numbers but, in Numbers, if I Interact with the Formula entry field, then arrow (just arrow, no VO keys) right. VO will announce as it goes past characters and you can edit along the way. The only limitation is that cell references are imbedded so you can't change the reference from, let's say, c2 to c5 by simply deleting the 2 and replacing it with 5. What you need to do is hit the Backspace twice and re-enter the entire cell reference. Note that it's just the specific cell reference, not the entire formula. So, editing simple text entries within the cell is straight forward as long as you do it from within the Formula Entry field. Actually, this is standard practice even for sighted users. Later... On 2012-02-23, at 3:34 PM, Gigi wrote: Y hi guys I have had some success with attitude on the end of a sale on what I do to make sure that I don't erase the whole thing, is to press command right arrow on my MacBook Pro, and then I can backspace out on the end and delete text-only in. A few instances have I been able to successfully edit in the middle of a sale in numbers Regards Gigi Sent from my iPhone On Feb 23, 2012, at 1:47 PM, Jürgen Fleger apple-engl...@fleger.net wrote: OK, that's interesting. I thought you might do it this way. So it is not possible to change just a part of the content of a cell. You have to change the whole content. I opened an excel file with several sheets in Tables and tried to switch between the sheets by pressing CMD + Option + arrow right or left. It didn't work. Tables was always busy. Do you have experiences with switching sheets in Tables? Did it work for you? Jürgen Am 23.02.2012 um 17:51 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: When I want to change the contents of a particular cell, I position the cursor on the data-entry field. Then, I arrow over to the cell that I want to edit. Next, I press the delete (back-space) key to delete the cell's contents. Finally, I type in the new information that I wish to store in that cell. From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Jürgen Fleger [apple-engl...@fleger.net] Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2012 12:47 AM To: Mac Visionaries Visionaries Subject: Tables [was:] Re: numbers No Rafael, that's not what I asked for. I know how to enter data. But I want to change existing data in the cells. Imagine you have an address of a friend in a cell. His telephone number changes and you want to change just the number. How to do this in Tables? I don't see this important possibility accessible with VoiceOver. Again: how to change specific data in a cell? Not entering data in an empty cell. That's easy. Hopefully my question is clearer now. Jürgen Am 22.02.2012 um 16:26 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: Tables has a data entry field. That is where data are entered into each cell. If you cannot find the data entry field on your own, you may benefit from sighted help to find it the first time. Place your cursor in the field, making sure VO is not locked. You can then type or paste in data and formulae. If you type in the data entry field, press the return (enter) key to get the data into the cell. The arrow keys are used to move between c -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups MacVisionaries group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. Tim Kilburn Fort McMurray, AB Canada -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups MacVisionaries group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
Re: Tables [was:] Re: numbers
Another way to edit cells in Numbers is to move to the cell you want to change and hit Option+Enter. This will put your cursor in the cell for editing. You can navigate to any point in the cell by using the arrow keys or arrow keys + the option key. Once I discovered this, working with Numbers got a whole lot more manageable. -Greg On Feb 23, 2012, at 6:39 PM, Tim Kilburn wrote: I have not tried Tables in eons so I'm not sure if it will work the same as in for me in Numbers but, in Numbers, if I Interact with the Formula entry field, then arrow (just arrow, no VO keys) right. VO will announce as it goes past characters and you can edit along the way. The only limitation is that cell references are imbedded so you can't change the reference from, let's say, c2 to c5 by simply deleting the 2 and replacing it with 5. What you need to do is hit the Backspace twice and re-enter the entire cell reference. Note that it's just the specific cell reference, not the entire formula. So, editing simple text entries within the cell is straight forward as long as you do it from within the Formula Entry field. Actually, this is standard practice even for sighted users. Later... On 2012-02-23, at 3:34 PM, Gigi wrote: Y hi guys I have had some success with attitude on the end of a sale on what I do to make sure that I don't erase the whole thing, is to press command right arrow on my MacBook Pro, and then I can backspace out on the end and delete text-only in. A few instances have I been able to successfully edit in the middle of a sale in numbers Regards Gigi Sent from my iPhone On Feb 23, 2012, at 1:47 PM, Jürgen Fleger apple-engl...@fleger.net wrote: OK, that's interesting. I thought you might do it this way. So it is not possible to change just a part of the content of a cell. You have to change the whole content. I opened an excel file with several sheets in Tables and tried to switch between the sheets by pressing CMD + Option + arrow right or left. It didn't work. Tables was always busy. Do you have experiences with switching sheets in Tables? Did it work for you? Jürgen Am 23.02.2012 um 17:51 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: When I want to change the contents of a particular cell, I position the cursor on the data-entry field. Then, I arrow over to the cell that I want to edit. Next, I press the delete (back-space) key to delete the cell's contents. Finally, I type in the new information that I wish to store in that cell. From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Jürgen Fleger [apple-engl...@fleger.net] Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2012 12:47 AM To: Mac Visionaries Visionaries Subject: Tables [was:] Re: numbers No Rafael, that's not what I asked for. I know how to enter data. But I want to change existing data in the cells. Imagine you have an address of a friend in a cell. His telephone number changes and you want to change just the number. How to do this in Tables? I don't see this important possibility accessible with VoiceOver. Again: how to change specific data in a cell? Not entering data in an empty cell. That's easy. Hopefully my question is clearer now. Jürgen Am 22.02.2012 um 16:26 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: Tables has a data entry field. That is where data are entered into each cell. If you cannot find the data entry field on your own, you may benefit from sighted help to find it the first time. Place your cursor in the field, making sure VO is not locked. You can then type or paste in data and formulae. If you type in the data entry field, press the return (enter) key to get the data into the cell. The arrow keys are used to move between c -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups MacVisionaries group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. Tim Kilburn Fort McMurray, AB Canada -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups MacVisionaries group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups MacVisionaries group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en.
Re: Tables [was:] Re: numbers
Hi Chuck, yes, that would work. But actually then Numbers is faster to use. To copy something from one App to another and back is like what my Boss recently did to get a pdf file: He wrote a letter, printed it out, scanned it and saved it as pdf. :-) Worked but there are much easier ways to do it. All the best Jürgen Am 23.02.2012 um 21:31 schrieb CHUCK REICHEL: Hi Jürgen, Have you tried cutting the info from the cell and pasting it in to text edit and make your edits than paste it back to the same cell? Some times when I am in Pro tools I do this and it is much faster and less frustrating! :) Your mileage May Vary! ;) CHUCK REICHEL 954-742-0019 www.SoundPictureRecording.com In GOD I Trust On Feb 23, 2012, at 2:47 PM, Jürgen Fleger wrote: OK, that's interesting. I thought you might do it this way. So it is not possible to change just a part of the content of a cell. You have to change the whole content. I opened an excel file with several sheets in Tables and tried to switch between the sheets by pressing CMD + Option + arrow right or left. It didn't work. Tables was always busy. Do you have experiences with switching sheets in Tables? Did it work for you? Jürgen Am 23.02.2012 um 17:51 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: When I want to change the contents of a particular cell, I position the cursor on the data-entry field. Then, I arrow over to the cell that I want to edit. Next, I press the delete (back-space) key to delete the cell's contents. Finally, I type in the new information that I wish to store in that cell. From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Jürgen Fleger [apple-engl...@fleger.net] Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2012 12:47 AM To: Mac Visionaries Visionaries Subject: Tables [was:] Re: numbers No Rafael, that's not what I asked for. I know how to enter data. But I want to change existing data in the cells. Imagine you have an address of a friend in a cell. His telephone number changes and you want to change just the number. How to do this in Tables? I don't see this important possibility accessible with VoiceOver. Again: how to change specific data in a cell? Not entering data in an empty cell. That's easy. Hopefully my question is clearer now. Jürgen Am 22.02.2012 um 16:26 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: Tables has a data entry field. That is where data are entered into each cell. If you cannot find the data entry field on your own, you may benefit from sighted help to find it the first time. Place your cursor in the field, making sure VO is not locked. You can then type or paste in data and formulae. If you type in the data entry field, press the return (enter) key to get the data into the cell. The arrow keys are used to move between cells. Rafael On Feb 22, 2012, at 2:17 AM, Jürgen Fleger wrote: Hello Rafael, thanks for your hints. So far Tables works fine. But what I meant was how to edit a cell and change inserted content. That doesn't work here for me. As far as I could find out I have to enter the edit mode of a chosen cell by pressing F2. VO anounces edit. But then it's not possible to read or delete single characters or to navigate through the content of a cell just by using the arrow keys. Of course I can navigate by using VO + arrow keys but. I should say that I use a sheet like a two dimensional notepad. I don't use it as a calculator and so I don't need formulas in a cell. But to take notes and so I enter a lot of text in it. So it's quite important for me to delete parts of the text and enter new content. So: How do you delete parts of text in a cell and how to enter just one word in a text of a cell? Deleting a whole cell is easily possible. Thanks and all the best Jürgen Am 22.02.2012 um 05:45 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: If you are using an Intel-based Mac, then the first thing to do when you open the Tables application is to get the cursor out of the table. Press Shift, Control, Option, up-arrow together, in order to get out of the table where the cursor is pointing. Press this key combination again to get out of the spreadsheet. Do these things first, or the following instructions won't make sense. Basically, there are two ways to read a cell's contents in Tables. The first way is to place the cursor over the field in which one enters numbers, formulae, and so on. If you choose this option, make sure VO is not locked, so that you can use the arrow keys to move from cell to cell (i.e., left arrow to move to the left, bottom arrow to move down, etc.). This is a simple option that allows you to navigate from cell to cell, to read each cell's contents, and to enter data into individual cells, all from the data-entry field. The second way to move around in Tables is somewhat more complicated. To make things
Re: Tables [was:] Re: numbers
You could also try to press VO + Spacebar. There you can interact with the formular area and work with it. All the best Jürgen Am 24.02.2012 um 05:45 schrieb Greg Aikens: Another way to edit cells in Numbers is to move to the cell you want to change and hit Option+Enter. This will put your cursor in the cell for editing. You can navigate to any point in the cell by using the arrow keys or arrow keys + the option key. Once I discovered this, working with Numbers got a whole lot more manageable. -Greg On Feb 23, 2012, at 6:39 PM, Tim Kilburn wrote: I have not tried Tables in eons so I'm not sure if it will work the same as in for me in Numbers but, in Numbers, if I Interact with the Formula entry field, then arrow (just arrow, no VO keys) right. VO will announce as it goes past characters and you can edit along the way. The only limitation is that cell references are imbedded so you can't change the reference from, let's say, c2 to c5 by simply deleting the 2 and replacing it with 5. What you need to do is hit the Backspace twice and re-enter the entire cell reference. Note that it's just the specific cell reference, not the entire formula. So, editing simple text entries within the cell is straight forward as long as you do it from within the Formula Entry field. Actually, this is standard practice even for sighted users. Later... On 2012-02-23, at 3:34 PM, Gigi wrote: Y hi guys I have had some success with attitude on the end of a sale on what I do to make sure that I don't erase the whole thing, is to press command right arrow on my MacBook Pro, and then I can backspace out on the end and delete text-only in. A few instances have I been able to successfully edit in the middle of a sale in numbers Regards Gigi Sent from my iPhone On Feb 23, 2012, at 1:47 PM, Jürgen Fleger apple-engl...@fleger.net wrote: OK, that's interesting. I thought you might do it this way. So it is not possible to change just a part of the content of a cell. You have to change the whole content. I opened an excel file with several sheets in Tables and tried to switch between the sheets by pressing CMD + Option + arrow right or left. It didn't work. Tables was always busy. Do you have experiences with switching sheets in Tables? Did it work for you? Jürgen Am 23.02.2012 um 17:51 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: When I want to change the contents of a particular cell, I position the cursor on the data-entry field. Then, I arrow over to the cell that I want to edit. Next, I press the delete (back-space) key to delete the cell's contents. Finally, I type in the new information that I wish to store in that cell. From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Jürgen Fleger [apple-engl...@fleger.net] Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2012 12:47 AM To: Mac Visionaries Visionaries Subject: Tables [was:] Re: numbers No Rafael, that's not what I asked for. I know how to enter data. But I want to change existing data in the cells. Imagine you have an address of a friend in a cell. His telephone number changes and you want to change just the number. How to do this in Tables? I don't see this important possibility accessible with VoiceOver. Again: how to change specific data in a cell? Not entering data in an empty cell. That's easy. Hopefully my question is clearer now. Jürgen Am 22.02.2012 um 16:26 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: Tables has a data entry field. That is where data are entered into each cell. If you cannot find the data entry field on your own, you may benefit from sighted help to find it the first time. Place your cursor in the field, making sure VO is not locked. You can then type or paste in data and formulae. If you type in the data entry field, press the return (enter) key to get the data into the cell. The arrow keys are used to move between c -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups MacVisionaries group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. Tim Kilburn Fort McMurray, AB Canada -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups MacVisionaries group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups MacVisionaries group. To post to this group, send email to macvisionaries@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group
Re: Tables [was:] Re: numbers
When focused on the cell you wish to change data in, press F2 key which will put you in the editing mode. Then you should be able to use your cursor keys. Once done, press tab. In the previous version of Tables, this worked very well. The latest update has rendered this important function more difficult. I noticed it as soon as I had installed the latest version. I reported it to the developer but had no answer from him. I only hope that he is going to improve it. In the past, he was rather sympathetic to Voiceover users. I was disappointed with this negative change as Tables worked for me far better than Numbers. Sorry I have no better news. On 23 Feb 2012, at 06:47, Jürgen Fleger wrote: No Rafael, that's not what I asked for. I know how to enter data. But I want to change existing data in the cells. Imagine you have an address of a friend in a cell. His telephone number changes and you want to change just the number. How to do this in Tables? I don't see this important possibility accessible with VoiceOver. Again: how to change specific data in a cell? Not entering data in an empty cell. That's easy. Hopefully my question is clearer now. Jürgen Am 22.02.2012 um 16:26 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: Tables has a data entry field. That is where data are entered into each cell. If you cannot find the data entry field on your own, you may benefit from sighted help to find it the first time. Place your cursor in the field, making sure VO is not locked. You can then type or paste in data and formulae. If you type in the data entry field, press the return (enter) key to get the data into the cell. The arrow keys are used to move between cells. Rafael On Feb 22, 2012, at 2:17 AM, Jürgen Fleger wrote: Hello Rafael, thanks for your hints. So far Tables works fine. But what I meant was how to edit a cell and change inserted content. That doesn't work here for me. As far as I could find out I have to enter the edit mode of a chosen cell by pressing F2. VO anounces edit. But then it's not possible to read or delete single characters or to navigate through the content of a cell just by using the arrow keys. Of course I can navigate by using VO + arrow keys but. I should say that I use a sheet like a two dimensional notepad. I don't use it as a calculator and so I don't need formulas in a cell. But to take notes and so I enter a lot of text in it. So it's quite important for me to delete parts of the text and enter new content. So: How do you delete parts of text in a cell and how to enter just one word in a text of a cell? Deleting a whole cell is easily possible. Thanks and all the best Jürgen Am 22.02.2012 um 05:45 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: If you are using an Intel-based Mac, then the first thing to do when you open the Tables application is to get the cursor out of the table. Press Shift, Control, Option, up-arrow together, in order to get out of the table where the cursor is pointing. Press this key combination again to get out of the spreadsheet. Do these things first, or the following instructions won't make sense. Basically, there are two ways to read a cell's contents in Tables. The first way is to place the cursor over the field in which one enters numbers, formulae, and so on. If you choose this option, make sure VO is not locked, so that you can use the arrow keys to move from cell to cell (i.e., left arrow to move to the left, bottom arrow to move down, etc.). This is a simple option that allows you to navigate from cell to cell, to read each cell's contents, and to enter data into individual cells, all from the data-entry field. The second way to move around in Tables is somewhat more complicated. To make things easier, first lock VO (by pressing control-option-semicolon). Next, enter the spreadsheet, by pressing shift and the down-arrow key together. At this level, you will be able to move the VO cursor with the arrow keys and read the letters designating the columns (i.e., Column A, Column B, etc.), as well as the row numbers (i.e., Row 1, Row 2, etc.). To access the individual cells, navigate to the table (VO says table when you've found it). With VO still locked, press the shift and down-arrow keys together again. That will put you in the table of cells, from which point onward you can just use the arrow keys to navigate from cell to cell. I hope this helps. Let me know if you have any other questions, and I'll do my best to try to answer them. Cordially, Rafael From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Jürgen Fleger [apple-engl...@fleger.net] Sent: Tuesday, February 21, 2012 3:52 PM To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: numbers Hi Rafael, I tried Tables and it's much faster to work with then with Numbers. But what I didn't
Re: Tables [was:] Re: numbers
Jurgen, changing sheets in Tables has always worked for me by pressing command + option + right or left arrow key. The larger the sheet the longer it takes though for Tables to change to the next sheet. In the latest update, again you do not necessarily know that the sheet has been changed so you have to try and move your cursor to see weather you can start reading it. On 23 Feb 2012, at 19:47, Jürgen Fleger wrote: OK, that's interesting. I thought you might do it this way. So it is not possible to change just a part of the content of a cell. You have to change the whole content. I opened an excel file with several sheets in Tables and tried to switch between the sheets by pressing CMD + Option + arrow right or left. It didn't work. Tables was always busy. Do you have experiences with switching sheets in Tables? Did it work for you? Jürgen Am 23.02.2012 um 17:51 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: When I want to change the contents of a particular cell, I position the cursor on the data-entry field. Then, I arrow over to the cell that I want to edit. Next, I press the delete (back-space) key to delete the cell's contents. Finally, I type in the new information that I wish to store in that cell. From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Jürgen Fleger [apple-engl...@fleger.net] Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2012 12:47 AM To: Mac Visionaries Visionaries Subject: Tables [was:] Re: numbers No Rafael, that's not what I asked for. I know how to enter data. But I want to change existing data in the cells. Imagine you have an address of a friend in a cell. His telephone number changes and you want to change just the number. How to do this in Tables? I don't see this important possibility accessible with VoiceOver. Again: how to change specific data in a cell? Not entering data in an empty cell. That's easy. Hopefully my question is clearer now. Jürgen Am 22.02.2012 um 16:26 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: Tables has a data entry field. That is where data are entered into each cell. If you cannot find the data entry field on your own, you may benefit from sighted help to find it the first time. Place your cursor in the field, making sure VO is not locked. You can then type or paste in data and formulae. If you type in the data entry field, press the return (enter) key to get the data into the cell. The arrow keys are used to move between cells. Rafael On Feb 22, 2012, at 2:17 AM, Jürgen Fleger wrote: Hello Rafael, thanks for your hints. So far Tables works fine. But what I meant was how to edit a cell and change inserted content. That doesn't work here for me. As far as I could find out I have to enter the edit mode of a chosen cell by pressing F2. VO anounces edit. But then it's not possible to read or delete single characters or to navigate through the content of a cell just by using the arrow keys. Of course I can navigate by using VO + arrow keys but. I should say that I use a sheet like a two dimensional notepad. I don't use it as a calculator and so I don't need formulas in a cell. But to take notes and so I enter a lot of text in it. So it's quite important for me to delete parts of the text and enter new content. So: How do you delete parts of text in a cell and how to enter just one word in a text of a cell? Deleting a whole cell is easily possible. Thanks and all the best Jürgen Am 22.02.2012 um 05:45 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: If you are using an Intel-based Mac, then the first thing to do when you open the Tables application is to get the cursor out of the table. Press Shift, Control, Option, up-arrow together, in order to get out of the table where the cursor is pointing. Press this key combination again to get out of the spreadsheet. Do these things first, or the following instructions won't make sense. Basically, there are two ways to read a cell's contents in Tables. The first way is to place the cursor over the field in which one enters numbers, formulae, and so on. If you choose this option, make sure VO is not locked, so that you can use the arrow keys to move from cell to cell (i.e., left arrow to move to the left, bottom arrow to move down, etc.). This is a simple option that allows you to navigate from cell to cell, to read each cell's contents, and to enter data into individual cells, all from the data-entry field. The second way to move around in Tables is somewhat more complicated. To make things easier, first lock VO (by pressing control-option-semicolon). Next, enter the spreadsheet, by pressing shift and the down-arrow key together. At this level, you will be able to move the VO cursor with the arrow keys and read the letters designating the columns (i.e., Column A, Column B, etc.), as well as the row numbers (i.e., Row 1, Row 2, etc
Re: Tables [was:] Re: numbers
Hello Simon, that workes, thanks. The only issue: VO doesn't anounce the character when using the arrow keys. Is that the issue in the latest version you meant? Could you send me the version you work with? j.fle...@gmx.de Because actually it seems to be a great program. Navigating is much faster then in Numbers. And there are features I miss in Numbers such as CMD + arrow keys and Option + arrow keys to reach specific parts of a sheet. Thanks and all the best Jürgen Am 24.02.2012 um 07:34 schrieb Simon Cavendish: When focused on the cell you wish to change data in, press F2 key which will put you in the editing mode. Then you should be able to use your cursor keys. Once done, press tab. In the previous version of Tables, this worked very well. The latest update has rendered this important function more difficult. I noticed it as soon as I had installed the latest version. I reported it to the developer but had no answer from him. I only hope that he is going to improve it. In the past, he was rather sympathetic to Voiceover users. I was disappointed with this negative change as Tables worked for me far better than Numbers. Sorry I have no better news. On 23 Feb 2012, at 06:47, Jürgen Fleger wrote: No Rafael, that's not what I asked for. I know how to enter data. But I want to change existing data in the cells. Imagine you have an address of a friend in a cell. His telephone number changes and you want to change just the number. How to do this in Tables? I don't see this important possibility accessible with VoiceOver. Again: how to change specific data in a cell? Not entering data in an empty cell. That's easy. Hopefully my question is clearer now. Jürgen Am 22.02.2012 um 16:26 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: Tables has a data entry field. That is where data are entered into each cell. If you cannot find the data entry field on your own, you may benefit from sighted help to find it the first time. Place your cursor in the field, making sure VO is not locked. You can then type or paste in data and formulae. If you type in the data entry field, press the return (enter) key to get the data into the cell. The arrow keys are used to move between cells. Rafael On Feb 22, 2012, at 2:17 AM, Jürgen Fleger wrote: Hello Rafael, thanks for your hints. So far Tables works fine. But what I meant was how to edit a cell and change inserted content. That doesn't work here for me. As far as I could find out I have to enter the edit mode of a chosen cell by pressing F2. VO anounces edit. But then it's not possible to read or delete single characters or to navigate through the content of a cell just by using the arrow keys. Of course I can navigate by using VO + arrow keys but. I should say that I use a sheet like a two dimensional notepad. I don't use it as a calculator and so I don't need formulas in a cell. But to take notes and so I enter a lot of text in it. So it's quite important for me to delete parts of the text and enter new content. So: How do you delete parts of text in a cell and how to enter just one word in a text of a cell? Deleting a whole cell is easily possible. Thanks and all the best Jürgen Am 22.02.2012 um 05:45 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: If you are using an Intel-based Mac, then the first thing to do when you open the Tables application is to get the cursor out of the table. Press Shift, Control, Option, up-arrow together, in order to get out of the table where the cursor is pointing. Press this key combination again to get out of the spreadsheet. Do these things first, or the following instructions won't make sense. Basically, there are two ways to read a cell's contents in Tables. The first way is to place the cursor over the field in which one enters numbers, formulae, and so on. If you choose this option, make sure VO is not locked, so that you can use the arrow keys to move from cell to cell (i.e., left arrow to move to the left, bottom arrow to move down, etc.). This is a simple option that allows you to navigate from cell to cell, to read each cell's contents, and to enter data into individual cells, all from the data-entry field. The second way to move around in Tables is somewhat more complicated. To make things easier, first lock VO (by pressing control-option-semicolon). Next, enter the spreadsheet, by pressing shift and the down-arrow key together. At this level, you will be able to move the VO cursor with the arrow keys and read the letters designating the columns (i.e., Column A, Column B, etc.), as well as the row numbers (i.e., Row 1, Row 2, etc.). To access the individual cells, navigate to the table (VO says table when you've found it). With VO still locked, press the shift and down-arrow keys together again. That will put you in the table of cells, from which point onward you can just use the arrow keys to
Re: Tables [was:] Re: numbers
Simon, I tried it and after nearly 5 minutes of hearing the message Tables busy I gave up. But as I mentioned before: I use Sheets as a two dimensional note pad and so it might be because of a lot of text in each sheet. Am 24.02.2012 um 07:37 schrieb Simon Cavendish: Jurgen, changing sheets in Tables has always worked for me by pressing command + option + right or left arrow key. The larger the sheet the longer it takes though for Tables to change to the next sheet. In the latest update, again you do not necessarily know that the sheet has been changed so you have to try and move your cursor to see weather you can start reading it. On 23 Feb 2012, at 19:47, Jürgen Fleger wrote: OK, that's interesting. I thought you might do it this way. So it is not possible to change just a part of the content of a cell. You have to change the whole content. I opened an excel file with several sheets in Tables and tried to switch between the sheets by pressing CMD + Option + arrow right or left. It didn't work. Tables was always busy. Do you have experiences with switching sheets in Tables? Did it work for you? Jürgen Am 23.02.2012 um 17:51 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: When I want to change the contents of a particular cell, I position the cursor on the data-entry field. Then, I arrow over to the cell that I want to edit. Next, I press the delete (back-space) key to delete the cell's contents. Finally, I type in the new information that I wish to store in that cell. From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Jürgen Fleger [apple-engl...@fleger.net] Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2012 12:47 AM To: Mac Visionaries Visionaries Subject: Tables [was:] Re: numbers No Rafael, that's not what I asked for. I know how to enter data. But I want to change existing data in the cells. Imagine you have an address of a friend in a cell. His telephone number changes and you want to change just the number. How to do this in Tables? I don't see this important possibility accessible with VoiceOver. Again: how to change specific data in a cell? Not entering data in an empty cell. That's easy. Hopefully my question is clearer now. Jürgen Am 22.02.2012 um 16:26 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: Tables has a data entry field. That is where data are entered into each cell. If you cannot find the data entry field on your own, you may benefit from sighted help to find it the first time. Place your cursor in the field, making sure VO is not locked. You can then type or paste in data and formulae. If you type in the data entry field, press the return (enter) key to get the data into the cell. The arrow keys are used to move between cells. Rafael On Feb 22, 2012, at 2:17 AM, Jürgen Fleger wrote: Hello Rafael, thanks for your hints. So far Tables works fine. But what I meant was how to edit a cell and change inserted content. That doesn't work here for me. As far as I could find out I have to enter the edit mode of a chosen cell by pressing F2. VO anounces edit. But then it's not possible to read or delete single characters or to navigate through the content of a cell just by using the arrow keys. Of course I can navigate by using VO + arrow keys but. I should say that I use a sheet like a two dimensional notepad. I don't use it as a calculator and so I don't need formulas in a cell. But to take notes and so I enter a lot of text in it. So it's quite important for me to delete parts of the text and enter new content. So: How do you delete parts of text in a cell and how to enter just one word in a text of a cell? Deleting a whole cell is easily possible. Thanks and all the best Jürgen Am 22.02.2012 um 05:45 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: If you are using an Intel-based Mac, then the first thing to do when you open the Tables application is to get the cursor out of the table. Press Shift, Control, Option, up-arrow together, in order to get out of the table where the cursor is pointing. Press this key combination again to get out of the spreadsheet. Do these things first, or the following instructions won't make sense. Basically, there are two ways to read a cell's contents in Tables. The first way is to place the cursor over the field in which one enters numbers, formulae, and so on. If you choose this option, make sure VO is not locked, so that you can use the arrow keys to move from cell to cell (i.e., left arrow to move to the left, bottom arrow to move down, etc.). This is a simple option that allows you to navigate from cell to cell, to read each cell's contents, and to enter data into individual cells, all from the data-entry field. The second way to move around in Tables is somewhat more complicated. To make things easier, first lock VO (by pressing control-option-semicolon). Next, enter
Re: Tables [was:] Re: numbers
Dear Jurgen, I am afraid I had made the wretched mistake of updating Tables to its latest version as I moved to Lion so I do not have the Tables version where editing cells was easier and worked better. I too like Tables a lot. It has quite a few shortcut keys that seem to work like for selecting cells and it will also tell you if the cell you have input text is clipped by another cell to the right or left which may be significant. Maybe you could try and e-mail the Tables designer as well to let him know that we are having some issues. I found his e-mail on the Tables website but I can't find it now and I will be off to work shortly. With best wishes Simon On 24 Feb 2012, at 06:41, Jürgen Fleger wrote: Hello Simon, that workes, thanks. The only issue: VO doesn't anounce the character when using the arrow keys. Is that the issue in the latest version you meant? Could you send me the version you work with? j.fle...@gmx.de Because actually it seems to be a great program. Navigating is much faster then in Numbers. And there are features I miss in Numbers such as CMD + arrow keys and Option + arrow keys to reach specific parts of a sheet. Thanks and all the best Jürgen Am 24.02.2012 um 07:34 schrieb Simon Cavendish: When focused on the cell you wish to change data in, press F2 key which will put you in the editing mode. Then you should be able to use your cursor keys. Once done, press tab. In the previous version of Tables, this worked very well. The latest update has rendered this important function more difficult. I noticed it as soon as I had installed the latest version. I reported it to the developer but had no answer from him. I only hope that he is going to improve it. In the past, he was rather sympathetic to Voiceover users. I was disappointed with this negative change as Tables worked for me far better than Numbers. Sorry I have no better news. On 23 Feb 2012, at 06:47, Jürgen Fleger wrote: No Rafael, that's not what I asked for. I know how to enter data. But I want to change existing data in the cells. Imagine you have an address of a friend in a cell. His telephone number changes and you want to change just the number. How to do this in Tables? I don't see this important possibility accessible with VoiceOver. Again: how to change specific data in a cell? Not entering data in an empty cell. That's easy. Hopefully my question is clearer now. Jürgen Am 22.02.2012 um 16:26 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: Tables has a data entry field. That is where data are entered into each cell. If you cannot find the data entry field on your own, you may benefit from sighted help to find it the first time. Place your cursor in the field, making sure VO is not locked. You can then type or paste in data and formulae. If you type in the data entry field, press the return (enter) key to get the data into the cell. The arrow keys are used to move between cells. Rafael On Feb 22, 2012, at 2:17 AM, Jürgen Fleger wrote: Hello Rafael, thanks for your hints. So far Tables works fine. But what I meant was how to edit a cell and change inserted content. That doesn't work here for me. As far as I could find out I have to enter the edit mode of a chosen cell by pressing F2. VO anounces edit. But then it's not possible to read or delete single characters or to navigate through the content of a cell just by using the arrow keys. Of course I can navigate by using VO + arrow keys but. I should say that I use a sheet like a two dimensional notepad. I don't use it as a calculator and so I don't need formulas in a cell. But to take notes and so I enter a lot of text in it. So it's quite important for me to delete parts of the text and enter new content. So: How do you delete parts of text in a cell and how to enter just one word in a text of a cell? Deleting a whole cell is easily possible. Thanks and all the best Jürgen Am 22.02.2012 um 05:45 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: If you are using an Intel-based Mac, then the first thing to do when you open the Tables application is to get the cursor out of the table. Press Shift, Control, Option, up-arrow together, in order to get out of the table where the cursor is pointing. Press this key combination again to get out of the spreadsheet. Do these things first, or the following instructions won't make sense. Basically, there are two ways to read a cell's contents in Tables. The first way is to place the cursor over the field in which one enters numbers, formulae, and so on. If you choose this option, make sure VO is not locked, so that you can use the arrow keys to move from cell to cell (i.e., left arrow to move to the left, bottom arrow to move down, etc.). This is a simple option that allows you to navigate from cell to cell, to read each cell's contents, and to enter data into individual cells, all from the data-entry
Re: Tables [was:] Re: numbers
Yes, I agree. When I had a lot of data in Tables, I had to wait for ever. This is a problem in Tables. I have never discovered a way round it. On 24 Feb 2012, at 06:44, Jürgen Fleger wrote: Simon, I tried it and after nearly 5 minutes of hearing the message Tables busy I gave up. But as I mentioned before: I use Sheets as a two dimensional note pad and so it might be because of a lot of text in each sheet. Am 24.02.2012 um 07:37 schrieb Simon Cavendish: Jurgen, changing sheets in Tables has always worked for me by pressing command + option + right or left arrow key. The larger the sheet the longer it takes though for Tables to change to the next sheet. In the latest update, again you do not necessarily know that the sheet has been changed so you have to try and move your cursor to see weather you can start reading it. On 23 Feb 2012, at 19:47, Jürgen Fleger wrote: OK, that's interesting. I thought you might do it this way. So it is not possible to change just a part of the content of a cell. You have to change the whole content. I opened an excel file with several sheets in Tables and tried to switch between the sheets by pressing CMD + Option + arrow right or left. It didn't work. Tables was always busy. Do you have experiences with switching sheets in Tables? Did it work for you? Jürgen Am 23.02.2012 um 17:51 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: When I want to change the contents of a particular cell, I position the cursor on the data-entry field. Then, I arrow over to the cell that I want to edit. Next, I press the delete (back-space) key to delete the cell's contents. Finally, I type in the new information that I wish to store in that cell. From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Jürgen Fleger [apple-engl...@fleger.net] Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2012 12:47 AM To: Mac Visionaries Visionaries Subject: Tables [was:] Re: numbers No Rafael, that's not what I asked for. I know how to enter data. But I want to change existing data in the cells. Imagine you have an address of a friend in a cell. His telephone number changes and you want to change just the number. How to do this in Tables? I don't see this important possibility accessible with VoiceOver. Again: how to change specific data in a cell? Not entering data in an empty cell. That's easy. Hopefully my question is clearer now. Jürgen Am 22.02.2012 um 16:26 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: Tables has a data entry field. That is where data are entered into each cell. If you cannot find the data entry field on your own, you may benefit from sighted help to find it the first time. Place your cursor in the field, making sure VO is not locked. You can then type or paste in data and formulae. If you type in the data entry field, press the return (enter) key to get the data into the cell. The arrow keys are used to move between cells. Rafael On Feb 22, 2012, at 2:17 AM, Jürgen Fleger wrote: Hello Rafael, thanks for your hints. So far Tables works fine. But what I meant was how to edit a cell and change inserted content. That doesn't work here for me. As far as I could find out I have to enter the edit mode of a chosen cell by pressing F2. VO anounces edit. But then it's not possible to read or delete single characters or to navigate through the content of a cell just by using the arrow keys. Of course I can navigate by using VO + arrow keys but. I should say that I use a sheet like a two dimensional notepad. I don't use it as a calculator and so I don't need formulas in a cell. But to take notes and so I enter a lot of text in it. So it's quite important for me to delete parts of the text and enter new content. So: How do you delete parts of text in a cell and how to enter just one word in a text of a cell? Deleting a whole cell is easily possible. Thanks and all the best Jürgen Am 22.02.2012 um 05:45 schrieb Bejarano, Rafael P.: If you are using an Intel-based Mac, then the first thing to do when you open the Tables application is to get the cursor out of the table. Press Shift, Control, Option, up-arrow together, in order to get out of the table where the cursor is pointing. Press this key combination again to get out of the spreadsheet. Do these things first, or the following instructions won't make sense. Basically, there are two ways to read a cell's contents in Tables. The first way is to place the cursor over the field in which one enters numbers, formulae, and so on. If you choose this option, make sure VO is not locked, so that you can use the arrow keys to move from cell to cell (i.e., left arrow to move to the left, bottom arrow to move down, etc.). This is a simple option that allows you to navigate from cell to cell, to read each cell's contents, and to enter data into individual cells, all from
