Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase
David Brodbeck wrote: Really? I would think a Michelin was a Michelin. Do they provide a lower spec tire specifically for Wal Mart? Michelin makes dozens and dozens of different tires. They are all Michelin tires. They are NOT all equal. A particular Michelin tire with a particular name and DOT rating will be the same at ANY dealer. If the dealer (Wal-Mart or any other dealer) is selling a tire made to a different specification, it will have a different rating and name! Marshall -- Marshall Booth (who doesn't respond to unsigned questions) der Dieseling Doktor [EMAIL PROTECTED] '87 300TD 182Kmi, '85 190D 2.0 161Kmi, '87 190D 2.5 turbo 237kmi, '84 190D 2.2 229Kmi (retired)
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase
Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: No, the tires at walmart are lower spec than the same tire elsewhere, its a fact, they do that to get a cheaper tire. NOT A FACT. The quality of the Wal-Mart product is reflected in the name and specifications (speed/load/temperature/treadlife for tires). It CAN'T be bought elsewhere using the same model name/number and specifications if the products are NOT the same. Some products will have a very different warranty as well. For the consumer to assume that ALL Michelin or Snapper or Mobil products are identical in quality is naive, but many manufacturers of commodities, can't economically make different quality products. I feel sure that the content of the CocaCola container that you buy at WalMart is identical to the content of the Coke container you buy down the street at the gas station despite the disparate price. Same is true of Mobil 1 oil, but Exxon/Mobil has every right to make a different products that meets a different specification - BUT it must be distinguishable or the threat of hundreds or thousands of lawsuits is created. To reduce the price that dealers must pay for the merchandise they sell, they can often buy products WITHOUT any warranty. When YOU buy a product from a merchant that has NOT purchased a warranty, you buy it devoid of ANY manufacturer's warranty - only the warranty that the packager or merchant chooses to supply. Many cameras and Japanese electronics were sold that way back when I was buying such stuff. The DVD transport in a Dell or HP computer has NO warranty from the maker, but only from HP or Dell. The warranty for parts in a new car seldom come from the actual manufacturer, but from the car maker. The original Bilsteins in a Mercedes have ONLY Mercedes' warranty, but the identical shock, bought later from an authorized dealer carries a warranty for the life of the car. Marshall -- Marshall Booth (who doesn't respond to unsigned questions) der Dieseling Doktor [EMAIL PROTECTED] '87 300TD 182Kmi, '85 190D 2.0 161Kmi, '87 190D 2.5 turbo 237kmi, '84 190D 2.2 229Kmi (retired)
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase DIY
archer wrote: Note: Many years ago (30-40-50?) when Sears first started selling Michelin tires, Consumers Reports tested them and found that Sears Michelins did not last as long as Dealer Michelins. Sear purchased and sold many Michelin tires with both the Sears and Michelin names on them. They were NEVER advertised as being identical to other Michelin tires (although in fact the few I bought gave excellent service) but they were equal to other Michelin tires selling for about the same price or a little more. The Sears/Michelin Roadhandler X tire was NOT identical to the Michelin X-one tire sold at about the same time, but the Sears tire sold for considerably less - and for a period of time Sears sold BOTH tires. Sears also sold a Michelin Rainhandler and Roadhandler Sport tire at the same time they sold Michelin MXV-4/MXV-4+ with the former selling for about 60% what the latter tires sold for, but the names and specifications were VERY different. Anyone that could read could read what the difference was. It was written on the sidewalls Marshall -- Marshall Booth (who doesn't respond to unsigned questions) der Dieseling Doktor [EMAIL PROTECTED] '87 300TD 182Kmi, '85 190D 2.0 161Kmi, '87 190D 2.5 turbo 237kmi, '84 190D 2.2 229Kmi (retired)
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase
Hi Marcus, This is a submission about tire quality from a Mercedes repair and discussion list. Several people have also made these claims. There are engineers, mechanics, and many other types on this list who are not shy about disputing a claim such as this. Do you think this might be true? Love, Pop -- - Original Message - From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Saturday, May 20, 2006 6:51 PM Subject: Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase yep Alex Chamberlain wrote: On 5/18/06, Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Yes, its more than tires that are different, many items that you can get elsewhere are of different cheaper specs at walmart. Electronics, too. For example, Compaq, Toshiba, Dell, etc. make particular laptops just for certain chain stores---along with Walmart-only models, there are Frye's-only models, Best Buy-only models, etc. This is done in order to hit that particular store's price point by including components of varying cheapness, and also so as to make it harder to comparison shop since you can't just call around or look at ads and check prices at more than one store on the same serial number. Alex Chamberlain '87 300D Turbo '93 Isuzu Trooper ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 91 300D 2.5 Turbo, 90 420SEL, 89 560SEL, 87 420SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 84 190D 2.2, 83 300TD, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 73 280SEL 4.5, 72 250C, 69 250 http://www.striplin.net ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase DIY
Which is why I only take the wheels and tires to the tire shop. They don't have an opportunity to make a mistake, and I don't have anyone else to blame. If only I could mount the things myself. Local shop forgot that I wanted to torque the rims myself; caught after the first tire was done. Somehow an 80# torque stick managed to apply at least 140# of torque. Neither the tech or writer appeared to know what a torque wrench was. Tony Wirtel -- OK Don, KD5NRO Norman, OK The Americans will always do the right thing... after they've exhausted all the alternatives. Sir Winston Churchill '90 300D, '87 300SDL, '81 240D, '78 450SLC, '97 Ply Grand Voyager
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase DIY
I bought a set of kumhos from tire rack to install on my 85 300D, have not done it yet. Everyone here says they are great. Tony Wirtel wrote: yea, sears is another one that has different spec tires than a dealer, in fact, they will have the sears logo on them. --- I've liked Kumho tires for some time. Went to Sears to replace a set on my wifes Passat and guess what- the tire that is dressed to look/sound like their current 60k mile tire is actually only the new tread pattern onto an old carcass, is good for only 40k miles and (drum roll please) is made especially for Sears in China. Same price- no thanks. Didn't see the Sears name on it though. Now, all of my Kumhos (20 so far) as well as the 2 just bought from Tire Rack instead of Sears have been made in Korea. Makes a difference to me. If only I could mount the things myself. Local shop forgot that I wanted to torque the rims myself; caught after the first tire was done. Somehow an 80# torque stick managed to apply at least 140# of torque. Neither the tech or writer appeared to know what a torque wrench was. Tony Wirtel ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 91 300D 2.5 Turbo, 90 420SEL, 89 560SEL, 87 420SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 84 190D 2.2, 83 300TD, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 73 280SEL 4.5, 72 250C, 69 250 http://www.striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase DIY
I'm happy with the tires I got for my Taurus at WalMart last Christmas. The cheapest tires in the store, they stick as well or better than the Continentals I had, and go through 1 of water at 50mph with no trouble. Tire guy put the wheels on with quick burps of a air gun, backed up by what was probably the weakest torque stick in his kit. He then put the car on the ground, and hit each nut twice with the torque wrench. Then he handed the wrench to the service porter, and drove around the building. When he got back, she went around the car with the torque wrench. Two months later, I broke a spring and it poked a hole in a sidewall. The replacement was free, but they charged me 89 cents to dispose of the ruined tire. I'm quite satisfied with Walmart tire service. OTOH, I recently overheard a conversation in which it sounded like they were insisting on overfilling a guy's Colorado in an oil change. He was telling them what factory spec was, they were saying it took at least a qt more to hit the full mark. I should have told him to let them overfill it, then check again after it sat overnight and make them fix it if it read high in the morning. Mitch.
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase DIY
On May 21, 2006, at 10:34 AM, Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: I bought a set of kumhos from tire rack to install on my 85 300D, have not done it yet. Everyone here says they are great. Yesterday I had the Falken Ziex ZE512 185-65R15 88H-speed rated tires mounted and balanced at our local Sunoco station. I was going to get them mounted at Wally-World but my buddy, the gas station owner, had the time and an empty lift. Wal-Mart was going to charge $3.75 ea dismount, $3.75 ea to mount, $7.50 ea for balancing and $4.00 ea for disposal ($81.32 for all 4). I could have just done the work myself for free at Sunoco but I opted to have them do it for $60.00, no tax and I dropped the worn out tires at the town dump, which usually charges $2.00/tire, for free because they love me. I chose the Falkens after doing some research and upon road-testing in torrential rain, I am very satisfied with their wet road-holding. I also had the opportunity to put them through their paces on dry twisties and I am impressed with the dry handling too. I ran the car to about 110mph and the balance was perfect, not even a hint of vibration at any speed. New tires almost always feel great, when compared to the worn-out tires that come off. I'll report my driving impression after 10,000mi or so, to be fair. FWIW, these Falken Ziex ZE512s are made in Japan and although they are shown on www.tiresavings.com for $48.00ea I was only charged $43.00ea, shipping was $35.36. It seems they knocked off $5.00/tire because I bought 4 of them. All told, I paid $267.36 Johnny B. I Mac Therefore I am
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase DIY
I've been to Sears before for tires and last I knew their policy was to use a torque wrench on alloy wheels. If they don't know what a torque wrench is they shouldn't be working there 69 280 SEL 120,000 Miles 72 350SL 108,000 Miles 2004 VW Passat 4 Motion 1999 Mazda Miata -Original Message- From: Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sun, 21 May 2006 09:34:56 -0500 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase DIY I bought a set of kumhos from tire rack to install on my 85 300D, have not done it yet. Everyone here says they are great. Tony Wirtel wrote: yea, sears is another one that has different spec tires than a dealer, in fact, they will have the sears logo on them. --- I've liked Kumho tires for some time. Went to Sears to replace a set on my wifes Passat and guess what- the tire that is dressed to look/sound like their current 60k mile tire is actually only the new tread pattern onto an old carcass, is good for only 40k miles and (drum roll please) is made especially for Sears in China. Same price- no thanks. Didn't see the Sears name on it though. Now, all of my Kumhos (20 so far) as well as the 2 just bought from Tire Rack instead of Sears have been made in Korea. Makes a difference to me. If only I could mount the things myself. Local shop forgot that I wanted to torque the rims myself; caught after the first tire was done. Somehow an 80# torque stick managed to apply at least 140# of torque. Neither the tech or writer appeared to know what a torque wrench was. Tony Wirtel ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 91 300D 2.5 Turbo, 90 420SEL, 89 560SEL, 87 420SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 84 190D 2.2, 83 300TD, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 73 280SEL 4.5, 72 250C, 69 250 http://www.striplin.net ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net ___ Try the New Netscape Mail Today! Virtually Spam-Free | More Storage | Import Your Contact List http://mail.netscape.com
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase
On 5/18/06, Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Yes, its more than tires that are different, many items that you can get elsewhere are of different cheaper specs at walmart. Electronics, too. For example, Compaq, Toshiba, Dell, etc. make particular laptops just for certain chain stores---along with Walmart-only models, there are Frye's-only models, Best Buy-only models, etc. This is done in order to hit that particular store's price point by including components of varying cheapness, and also so as to make it harder to comparison shop since you can't just call around or look at ads and check prices at more than one store on the same serial number. Alex Chamberlain '87 300D Turbo '93 Isuzu Trooper
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase
yep Alex Chamberlain wrote: On 5/18/06, Kaleb C. Striplin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Yes, its more than tires that are different, many items that you can get elsewhere are of different cheaper specs at walmart. Electronics, too. For example, Compaq, Toshiba, Dell, etc. make particular laptops just for certain chain stores---along with Walmart-only models, there are Frye's-only models, Best Buy-only models, etc. This is done in order to hit that particular store's price point by including components of varying cheapness, and also so as to make it harder to comparison shop since you can't just call around or look at ads and check prices at more than one store on the same serial number. Alex Chamberlain '87 300D Turbo '93 Isuzu Trooper ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 91 300D 2.5 Turbo, 90 420SEL, 89 560SEL, 87 420SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 84 190D 2.2, 83 300TD, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 73 280SEL 4.5, 72 250C, 69 250 http://www.striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase
yep, they sure do. David Brodbeck wrote: Really? I would think a Michelin was a Michelin. Do they provide a lower spec tire specifically for Wal Mart? -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 91 300D 2.5 Turbo, 90 420SEL, 89 560SEL, 87 420SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 84 190D 2.2, 83 300TD, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 73 280SEL 4.5, 72 250C, 69 250 http://www.striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase
No, the tires at walmart are lower spec than the same tire elsewhere, its a fact, they do that to get a cheaper tire. Desert Rat wrote: Oh yeah, and the Mobil 1 is watered down, etc, etc. Good grief! -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 91 300D 2.5 Turbo, 90 420SEL, 89 560SEL, 87 420SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 84 190D 2.2, 83 300TD, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 73 280SEL 4.5, 72 250C, 69 250 http://www.striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase DIY
Note: Many years ago (30-40-50?) when Sears first started selling Michelin tires, Consumers Reports tested them and found that Sears Michelins did not last as long as Dealer Michelins. . This discussion probably explains why the last two sets of 70,000 mile Michelin tires bought from Tire Kingdom lasted less than 30,000 miles. Although Tire Kingdom pro-rated the first set, I think we still lost money on the deal. The last tires purchased were a brand recommended by Marshall from Tire Rack. They were much cheaper than Michelins and still seem to be wearing well. Getting them mounted and balanced is the problem in this area. I tried changing tires the way we did years ago with tire irons, but was unable to break the bead. Harry Watkins says that he does his own tire repairs which involves mounting/dismounting. He wrote: I bought Harbor freight and JC Whitney equipment, a few patch supplies and I now do my own. After experiencing the same kind of bad things I hear about and read on these lists, I am giving it a try. Actually, even though its grunt work, I get real satisfaction from doing a quality repair. I first use soapy water to find and mark the leaks, do a quick clean, dismount the tire, do an inside inspection with a spreader, wire brush the rim, patch from the inside with a mushroom patch, remount, apply bead seal, air it up, check for leaks, balance and reinstall with proper torque. The first one took me two hours but I've cut that in half. Anyone out there that can share knowledge and experience with me? Harry Watkins Newton, MS 86 SDL Silver 85 300D Euro 86 SDL Gold 81 240D manual trans ... The name or catalog numbers, etc. of the equipment you bought; especially the bead-breaker; would be appreciated, Harry. Gerry Archer '83 300D and 240D - Original Message - From: Desert Rat [EMAIL PROTECTED] Oh yeah, and the Mobil 1 is watered down, etc, etc. Good grief! On 5/18/06, David Brodbeck [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Really? I would think a Michelin was a Michelin. Do they provide a lower spec tire specifically for Wal Mart? Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: Their tires are also not of the same quality as what you would get at a real tire store/tirerack. I just purchased a set of Michelins for the Powerstroke at Wal-mart. Out the door price of $166.00 each, which included lifetime rotation and balance, tire disposal, taxes, etc for a set of 235/85/R16's. I normally limit my exposure to Wally World, but these prices were cheaper than anyone else. James Jetton 1987 300SDL 143k 1996 Ford F-250 Powerstroke 171k ___
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase
WALMART, WALMART, WALMART, WALMART, that is what we are talking about. The tires WALMART sells are different than OTHER places. Its a WALMART spec tire, not a discout outlet spec tire, only WALMART Desert Rat wrote: So, Michelin has a different warranty on tires purchased at discount outlets? Wouldn't Tirerack be the ultimate Discount Outlet? Are they produced offshore as well? Sorry, but I am not in the auto trade. Where can one look up this well known fact to verify this rumor? -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 91 300D 2.5 Turbo, 90 420SEL, 89 560SEL, 87 420SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 84 190D 2.2, 83 300TD, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 73 280SEL 4.5, 72 250C, 69 250 http://www.striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase
Yes, its more than tires that are different, many items that you can get elsewhere are of different cheaper specs at walmart. Lawn mowers would be one thing that comes to mind. In fact, there was an article posted about some maker of high quality lawn mowers, I think snapper, that was being sold at walmart but where of much cheaper quality. Eventually snapper(or whoever) pulled out of walmart because it was hurting their reputation. Steve MacSween wrote: My my, counsellor, would this be a good time to suggest you switch to decaf ;-)? If you want to find out about something in the auto trade, then I'd suggest you sit around and chew the fat with people who work there. That would be a good start. Or have close friends in it who share information. Or all of the preceeding, including having worked in it, as I did. Tire Rack and Discount Tire Online are volume sellers who operate via the Net with low overheads, but they are TIRE DEALERS. DISCOUNT OUTLETS would include WallyMart, K-mart, Costco. They sell tires. I would not define them as tire dealers, any more than a supermarket with a big aisle of vitamins and toothpaste qualifies as a pharmacy. What I have said about tires applies to many items sold through discount outlets. That is why you MAY find you have trouble if you comparison-shop SOME things (e.g., small appliances) between, say, JC Penney and, say WallyMart, when you try to match up actual model numbers on products. Some manufacturers produce model variations solely for sale through WallyMart or other discounters. In the case of WM I would not suggest that this has any quality implications, as WM is tough on suppliers. As to whether Michelin has a different warranty, I have no idea, however one point to check would be if Michelins bought at (for example) Costco are covered at all Michelin dealers, or just through Costco outlets. Mac -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 91 300D 2.5 Turbo, 90 420SEL, 89 560SEL, 87 420SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 84 190D 2.2, 83 300TD, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 73 280SEL 4.5, 72 250C, 69 250 http://www.striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase
yep, thats the one I was thinking about. dave walton wrote: It's no secret that Walmart wants cheap products from their suppliers that last 1 season and then require replacement. People expect more than 1 year from tires, but I suspect they are working on that too. http://www.fastcompany.com/magazine/102/open_snapper.html -Dave Walton 94S350, 99E300 -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 91 300D 2.5 Turbo, 90 420SEL, 89 560SEL, 87 420SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 84 190D 2.2, 83 300TD, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 73 280SEL 4.5, 72 250C, 69 250 http://www.striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase DIY
yea, sears is another one that has different spec tires than a dealer, in fact, they will have the sears logo on them. archer wrote: Note: Many years ago (30-40-50?) when Sears first started selling Michelin tires, Consumers Reports tested them and found that Sears Michelins did not last as long as Dealer Michelins. . This discussion probably explains why the last two sets of 70,000 mile Michelin tires bought from Tire Kingdom lasted less than 30,000 miles. Although Tire Kingdom pro-rated the first set, I think we still lost money on the deal. The last tires purchased were a brand recommended by Marshall from Tire Rack. They were much cheaper than Michelins and still seem to be wearing well. Getting them mounted and balanced is the problem in this area. I tried changing tires the way we did years ago with tire irons, but was unable to break the bead. Harry Watkins says that he does his own tire repairs which involves mounting/dismounting. He wrote: Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 91 300D 2.5 Turbo, 90 420SEL, 89 560SEL, 87 420SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 84 190D 2.2, 83 300TD, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 73 280SEL 4.5, 72 250C, 69 250 http://www.striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase
On May 18, 2006, at 4:51 PM, Peter T. Arnold wrote: Note: Wall Mart no longer sells SNAPPER lawnmower. SNAPPER refused to drop price, which would have required a quality reduction. Do you think the John Deer at Home Depot is the same machine as that at a John Deer dealer? I recently bought an Ariens snowblower. I shopped for Ariens only due to my experience with their product. Lowes had similar but not the same models, being sold quite a bit cheaper than professional model I was shopping for. They had machines with the same horsepower and width but they were cheaped out. The pro model has an actual differential and cast iron gearcase while the cheaper one has a live axle that you drop a pin into to lock the wheels and an aluminum gearcase. The cheaper model was available at Ariens dealers but the pro model was not sold at Lowes. Johnny B. I Mac Therefore I am
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase
on 5/18/06 4:39 PM, dave walton at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It's no secret that Walmart wants cheap products from their suppliers that last 1 season and then require replacement. People expect more than 1 year from tires, but I suspect they are working on that too. http://www.fastcompany.com/magazine/102/open_snapper.html Actually, hate to tell you but the tires WallyMart now sells in Canada are apparently about that bad (not the brand name ones, the cheapo brand... sorry I have forgotten the name just now). WallyWorld has a policy of demanding lower prices from its suppliers every year, after I believe year two or three of doing business with them. In the real world, this can only translate into one (or both) of two things: once the producer has eaten as far into its margins as it can, for the sake of keeping the volume production that a contract with WM brings, the products for WM get cheaped out, or production moves offshore. And yes, there is PLENTY of evidence available for my claim concerning how WM squeezes its suppliers (and often forces production offshore), I believe Consumer Reports did a report on the phenomenon two years ago. Mac
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase
AFAIK Wal-Mart is tough on suppliers for price only. If you can find it online read the story of how Snapper walked away from Wal-Mart because they wouldn't be pressured to lower quality to match the pricepoint Wal-Mart wanted. That took guts. When I need to buy a new mower I'll seriously consider Snapper. -Curt Date: Thu, 18 May 2006 16:27:50 -0400 From: Steve MacSween [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase To: Mercedes Discussion List [EMAIL PROTECTED] Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII *SNIP* Some manufacturers produce model variations solely for sale through WallyMart or other discounters. In the case of WM I would not suggest that this has any quality implications, as WM is tough on suppliers. As to whether Michelin has a different warranty, I have no idea, however one point to check would be if Michelins bought at (for example) Costco are covered at all Michelin dealers, or just through Costco outlets. Mac - Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Make PC-to-Phone Calls to the US (and 30+ countries) for 2ยข/min or less. From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fri May 19 13:35:41 2006 Received: from web32813.mail.mud.yahoo.com ([68.142.206.43]) by server5.arterytc5.net with smtp (Exim 4.52) id 1Fh58n-0005Uc-Jo for [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Fri, 19 May 2006 13:35:41 + Received: (qmail 51653 invoked by uid 60001); 19 May 2006 13:35:38 - DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=s1024; d=yahoo.com; h=Message-ID:Received:Date:From:Subject:To:In-Reply-To:MIME-Version:Content-Type:Content-Transfer-Encoding; b=TglAz299wHKKqfHs0qHeJXFNAlIctDl6b6MOnGAmw4YiPYoTIfI4CBmlyMrpItyBuf1Zbj/+yxAbYeOphlnnw1TeQTSgDiQ36PRE+PtX48QVq2HiT5FQgRMpdmxJobTOaRhdMseISSAaNI++d2MVMDozxQy3fFU3Dsn5wv4thss= ; Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Received: from [198.51.119.130] by web32813.mail.mud.yahoo.com via HTTP; Fri, 19 May 2006 06:35:38 PDT Date: Fri, 19 May 2006 06:35:38 -0700 (PDT) From: Curt Raymond [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In-Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.6 Subject: Re: [MBZ] The wave X-BeenThere: [EMAIL PROTECTED] X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.6 Precedence: list Reply-To: Mercedes Discussion List [EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Id: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes_striplin.net.striplin.net List-Unsubscribe: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Archive: http://striplin.net/pipermail/mercedes_striplin.net List-Post: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Help: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Subscribe: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 19 May 2006 13:35:41 - Excellent words Bill, I don't ever get on a motorcycle without my helmet, bright red kevlar jacket and good heavy jeans. Its been harder to find good heavy jeans in the last few years, seems like everybody is selling thin cheap crap, so I've also been wearing double thickness ripstop nylon work pants I got at the hardware store. I'm actually thinking about moving up to a full jumpsuit because it'll be easier to get in and out of and I can wear shorts underneith. I wear big heavy protective gloves that have kevlar reenforcing pads in them to protect my hands. One time I was following a kid on a Ninja down the highway (in my 240D no less). He was in a tee shirt, shorts and flip flops. He decided he was going to practice wheelies at 65mph. He brought it up and I noticed the rear wobbled pretty bad so I slowed down. He brought it up again with even more wobble so I slowed WAY down. The third time he brought it up he went over onto the left side. Some how managed to not be under the bike when it went down. Slid to a stop in the breakdown lane. I jumped out and unbelievably the kid STOOD UP. I was stunned for a second but booted it back to the car to get a tarp, blood was pouring out of him as he didn't have much skin left on his upper body. The wierd thing was his lower body was okay, hardly a scratch from his bellybutton down. I got him to laydown on the tarp but he was still real jumpy, kept wanting to get up and look at his bike which didn't so much resemble a bike as it did roadkill. The kid lived, I still see him around and he still rides but now he doesn't pull wheelies and he's a regional sales rep for one of the kevlar coat makers... -Curt Date: Thu, 18 May 2006 17:42:16 -0400 From: BillR [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] The wave To: 'Mercedes Discussion List' [EMAIL PROTECTED] Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Levi - Just a word of caution. *SNIP
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase
Unfortunately, it is quite likely that you soon will not be able to buy the better model at any cost. The average person is drawn to the lower price and does not care if the value is not there. We are a throw away society and it is becoming more and more difficult to have anything repaired. The result is that the consumer replaces rather than fixes anything that causes trouble. Cheaper is better if you know you will ultimately toss it on the scrap heap. An example is a 14 Delta Bandsaw. There are several models - some made in the far east and one still made in the USA. The american made one costs close to double the cost of the aisian one. They look about the same and perform similarly. The castings on the american made model are nicer but maybe not nice enough to encourage the average woodworker to pay double the price. A trade person working in a shop day in and day out will appreciate the better model in years to come. I struggled with this very issue a year ago. I bought the aisian model as I am not a tradesman or a very high level home woodworker. I really liked the american model better but there are always lots of places for the money to go and I just found it really difficult to spend almost twice as much for something I will use occasionally. Randy B -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Peter T. Arnold Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2006 3:51 PM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase On Thu, 18 May 2006 10:08:12 -0700, you wrote: Note: Wall Mart no longer sells SNAPPER lawnmower. SNAPPER refused to drop price, which would have required a quality reduction. Do you think the John Deer at Home Depot is the same machine as that at a John Deer dealer? Several years ago, I needed a washing machine. Fellow in my church was regional sales rep for Westinghouse. He said go to XYZ, one of his dealers and the fellow would do the best he could do. That was how he got his appliances! 3 weeks later the same model was on sale about $25 cheaper at a big discount store. I mentioned it to my buddy. He told me not so, I should compare the Long Form of the S/N on the back of both machines. I did, they were both the same model on the front but were different in the Long Form. Any manufacturer of electric motors (for instance) will tell you that there are several grades (and costs) for the same frame size motor. The better and more costly one runs cooler, draws less power and lasts longer. Guess who gets the culls? YMMV -- Regards, Peter T. Arnold 1987 300SDL 24KMI 1995 F-250 PowerChoke 194Kmi 1954 Metropolitan Convertible, Hanger Queen Wife has a Cruizer, 80 Kmi, as reliable as an Ice Box, the car that is! ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase
Curt Raymond wrote: AFAIK Wal-Mart is tough on suppliers for price only. If you can find it online read the story of how Snapper walked away from Wal-Mart because they wouldn't be pressured to lower quality to match the pricepoint Wal-Mart wanted. That took guts. When I need to buy a new mower I'll seriously consider Snapper. The Frontline documentary Is Wal Mart Good For America? talks about that, too. There are a few interviews with Wal Mart suppliers who admit they moved production overseas because Wal Mart told them they had to get their prices down. It's viewable online at www.frontline.org.
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase
Hi Randy, I've been seeing the throwaway mentality even during my house search. We looked at several houses I was interested in that the realtors said Oh you'd be better to just tear this down and build a new one. In the case of the house we're looking at we may get it because all the other offers are based on tearing the house down. I don't want a new house, the house thats there has character, it needs work but nothing all that major. I can't imagine why you'd tear it down -Curt Date: Fri, 19 May 2006 11:41:41 -0500 From: R A Bennell [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase To: Mercedes Discussion List [EMAIL PROTECTED] Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Unfortunately, it is quite likely that you soon will not be able to buy the better model at any cost. The average person is drawn to the lower price and does not care if the value is not there. We are a throw away society and it is becoming more and more difficult to have anything repaired. The result is that the consumer replaces rather than fixes anything that causes trouble. Cheaper is better if you know you will ultimately toss it on the scrap heap. An example is a 14 Delta Bandsaw. There are several models - some made in the far east and one still made in the USA. The american made one costs close to double the cost of the aisian one. They look about the same and perform similarly. The castings on the american made model are nicer but maybe not nice enough to encourage the average woodworker to pay double the price. A trade person working in a shop day in and day out will appreciate the better model in years to come. I struggled with this very issue a year ago. I bought the aisian model as I am not a tradesman or a very high level home woodworker. I really liked the american model better but there are always lots of places for the money to go and I just found it really difficult to spend almost twice as much for something I will use occasionally. Randy B - New Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Call regular phones from your PC and save big. From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fri May 19 19:16:26 2006 Received: from nf-out-0910.google.com ([64.233.182.190]) by server5.arterytc5.net with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1FhASX-0006in-Um for [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Fri, 19 May 2006 19:16:26 + Received: by nf-out-0910.google.com with SMTP id y38so100453nfb for [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Fri, 19 May 2006 12:16:22 -0700 (PDT) DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws; s=beta; d=gmail.com; h=received:message-id:date:from:to:subject:in-reply-to:mime-version:content-type:references; b=Lbw59l8O5YSC2iFr8xLXYpc6Iwik/3vmHKHIDAiwEiwtuz4Z4buP8tnOecx2BVfCL8XiB0IJKPVO4FQlfRyu5i23J6BKTqH3/JY4eMNwdQwe2qQMGlhS8QX7x1Zp5cyPfoCR1hVdgeacpuJW+fvGxkEs5YlhUdkcp2lP08t9oEI= Received: by 10.49.78.6 with SMTP id f6mr1701476nfl; Fri, 19 May 2006 12:16:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: by 10.49.8.11 with HTTP; Fri, 19 May 2006 12:16:21 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Fri, 19 May 2006 15:16:21 -0400 From: dave walton [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Mercedes Discussion List [EMAIL PROTECTED] In-Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] MIME-Version: 1.0 References: [EMAIL PROTECTED] X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Disposition: inline X-Content-Filtered-By: Mailman/MimeDel 2.1.6 Subject: Re: [MBZ] another eBay OM60x head case X-BeenThere: [EMAIL PROTECTED] X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.6 Precedence: list Reply-To: Mercedes Discussion List [EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Id: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes_striplin.net.striplin.net List-Unsubscribe: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Archive: http://striplin.net/pipermail/mercedes_striplin.net List-Post: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Help: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Subscribe: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 19 May 2006 19:16:26 - Thanks for the heads-up Luther. My saved search on eBay missed this one. The car is only 2 hours away, but the seller refused to show it to me (at his convenience) before the auction ends. I'm getting a weird feeling about this one... Buyer beware. -Dave Walton 94S350, 99E300 On 5/19/06, Luther Gulseth [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItemitem=3D806758817= 7 -- Luther KB5QHU Alma, Ark '83 300SD (231,xxx kmi) '82 300CD (159,222 kmi) '82 300D (74,000 kmi) needs MAJOR work ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase
They need to watch This Old House with Norm Abram - especially some of the early shows. One can repair almost anything and often the older houses were better than a lot of the new junk. We are repairing our cottage at the lake. It sat too low for many years and the sills were quite rotted on part of it. We had professionals lift and level it last October and now the task falls to me to repair anything rotted above the new sills. Will have to mess about with some of the lower plates and studs etc but it is certainly not so bad that I would consider tearing it down. The old place has character and was built by my father in the early 50's. I hope it will one day be cherished by my children and grand children. Randy B -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Curt Raymond Sent: Friday, May 19, 2006 1:46 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase Hi Randy, I've been seeing the throwaway mentality even during my house search. We looked at several houses I was interested in that the realtors said Oh you'd be better to just tear this down and build a new one. In the case of the house we're looking at we may get it because all the other offers are based on tearing the house down. I don't want a new house, the house thats there has character, it needs work but nothing all that major. I can't imagine why you'd tear it down -Curt Date: Fri, 19 May 2006 11:41:41 -0500 From: R A Bennell [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase To: Mercedes Discussion List [EMAIL PROTECTED] Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Unfortunately, it is quite likely that you soon will not be able to buy the better model at any cost. The average person is drawn to the lower price and does not care if the value is not there. We are a throw away society and it is becoming more and more difficult to have anything repaired. The result is that the consumer replaces rather than fixes anything that causes trouble. Cheaper is better if you know you will ultimately toss it on the scrap heap. An example is a 14 Delta Bandsaw. There are several models - some made in the far east and one still made in the USA. The american made one costs close to double the cost of the aisian one. They look about the same and perform similarly. The castings on the american made model are nicer but maybe not nice enough to encourage the average woodworker to pay double the price. A trade person working in a shop day in and day out will appreciate the better model in years to come. I struggled with this very issue a year ago. I bought the aisian model as I am not a tradesman or a very high level home woodworker. I really liked the american model better but there are always lots of places for the money to go and I just found it really difficult to spend almost twice as much for something I will use occasionally. Randy B - New Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Call regular phones from your PC and save big. ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase
Oh yeah, and the Mobil 1 is watered down, etc, etc. Good grief! On 5/18/06, David Brodbeck [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Really? I would think a Michelin was a Michelin. Do they provide a lower spec tire specifically for Wal Mart? Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: Their tires are also not of the same quality as what you would get at a real tire store/tirerack. James Jetton wrote: Johnny, I just purchased a set of Michelins for the Powerstroke at Wal-mart. Out the door price of $166.00 each, which included lifetime rotation and balance, tire disposal, taxes, etc for a set of 235/85/R16's. I normally limit my exposure to Wally World, but these prices were cheaper than anyone else. James Jetton 1987 300SDL 143k 1996 Ford F-250 Powerstroke 171k ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- John Freer Palm Springs, CA 1992 500 SEL 143K Stardust 1985 380SL 143K Blue Belle 1996 Sidekick 57K Kermit
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase
I put a set of Goodyear light truck tires on my old 68 Chevy pickup at WalMart a couple of years back. No problems so far. They seemed much more professional about the whole thing than most tire shops that I have dealt with in recent years. They were quite apologetic about the fact that their reference material did not go far enough back to tell them the proper torque specs. They took an educated guess and begged me to come back in a day or two so they could check them. I checked myself and did not worry about it after that. Randy B -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Desert Rat Sent: Thursday, May 18, 2006 12:34 PM To: Mercedes Discussion List Subject: Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase Oh yeah, and the Mobil 1 is watered down, etc, etc. Good grief! On 5/18/06, David Brodbeck [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Really? I would think a Michelin was a Michelin. Do they provide a lower spec tire specifically for Wal Mart? Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: Their tires are also not of the same quality as what you would get at a real tire store/tirerack. James Jetton wrote: Johnny, I just purchased a set of Michelins for the Powerstroke at Wal-mart. Out the door price of $166.00 each, which included lifetime rotation and balance, tire disposal, taxes, etc for a set of 235/85/R16's. I normally limit my exposure to Wally World, but these prices were cheaper than anyone else. James Jetton 1987 300SDL 143k 1996 Ford F-250 Powerstroke 171k ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- John Freer Palm Springs, CA 1992 500 SEL 143K Stardust 1985 380SL 143K Blue Belle 1996 Sidekick 57K Kermit ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase
Uh, negative on the Mobil 1, but it's well known in the auto trade that the Michelin tires sold through discount outlets (Wal Mart, in Canada also Canadian Tire) are produced offshore in the Third World. In the case of Michelin, I know at one time the tires they sold to the discounter market even carried different model designations (for example, the X-One was called the X when bought through Costco). Not sure if that is still true, but if you are comparison shopping check that the entire model name AND the treadwear and load rating specs are the same. BTW, this is also happening here in Canada with Bosch parts sold through Crappy Tire stores (mostly starters and alternators). You are in for a surprise when you try to pull one and get core or warranty for it, from an actual Bosch dealer. Bosch won't accept them back as cores or warranty them. Of course, you KNOW that the current joke among German mechanics is: What does 'Bosch-Germany' labelled on a part mean? Answer: 'Made in India'. LoL. Cheers Mac on 5/18/06 1:34 PM, Desert Rat at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Oh yeah, and the Mobil 1 is watered down, etc, etc. Good grief! On 5/18/06, David Brodbeck [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Really? I would think a Michelin was a Michelin. Do they provide a lower spec tire specifically for Wal Mart? Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: Their tires are also not of the same quality as what you would get at a real tire store/tirerack. James Jetton wrote: Johnny, I just purchased a set of Michelins for the Powerstroke at Wal-mart. Out the door price of $166.00 each, which included lifetime rotation and balance, tire disposal, taxes, etc for a set of 235/85/R16's. I normally limit my exposure to Wally World, but these prices were cheaper than anyone else. James Jetton 1987 300SDL 143k 1996 Ford F-250 Powerstroke 171k ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase
So, Michelin has a different warranty on tires purchased at discount outlets? Wouldn't Tirerack be the ultimate Discount Outlet? Are they produced offshore as well? Sorry, but I am not in the auto trade. Where can one look up this well known fact to verify this rumor? On 5/18/06, Steve MacSween [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Uh, negative on the Mobil 1, but it's well known in the auto trade that the Michelin tires sold through discount outlets (Wal Mart, in Canada also Canadian Tire) are produced offshore in the Third World. In the case of Michelin, I know at one time the tires they sold to the discounter market even carried different model designations (for example, the X-One was called the X when bought through Costco). Not sure if that is still true, but if you are comparison shopping check that the entire model name AND the treadwear and load rating specs are the same. BTW, this is also happening here in Canada with Bosch parts sold through Crappy Tire stores (mostly starters and alternators). You are in for a surprise when you try to pull one and get core or warranty for it, from an actual Bosch dealer. Bosch won't accept them back as cores or warranty them. Of course, you KNOW that the current joke among German mechanics is: What does 'Bosch-Germany' labelled on a part mean? Answer: 'Made in India'. LoL. Cheers Mac on 5/18/06 1:34 PM, Desert Rat at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Oh yeah, and the Mobil 1 is watered down, etc, etc. Good grief! On 5/18/06, David Brodbeck [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Really? I would think a Michelin was a Michelin. Do they provide a lower spec tire specifically for Wal Mart? Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: Their tires are also not of the same quality as what you would get at a real tire store/tirerack. James Jetton wrote: Johnny, I just purchased a set of Michelins for the Powerstroke at Wal-mart. Out the door price of $166.00 each, which included lifetime rotation and balance, tire disposal, taxes, etc for a set of 235/85/R16's. I normally limit my exposure to Wally World, but these prices were cheaper than anyone else. James Jetton 1987 300SDL 143k 1996 Ford F-250 Powerstroke 171k ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- John Freer Palm Springs, CA 1992 500 SEL 143K Stardust 1985 380SL 143K Blue Belle 1996 Sidekick 57K Kermit
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase
I think they key thing is that are different models of tires. Michelin is a brand name. Just cause they make a really great tire, doesn't mean they don't make some really crappy ones as well. I don't exactly consider B.F. Goodrich to be my favorite tires, but I'd consider them a good name. However, my 83' 300D came with a set that the guy got at Sam's. At least two of them have had bubbles in the sidewalls since I got them. I pretty well view them as crap tires. The difference is: Wal-mart sells CHEAP TIRES. Tirerack sells GOOD TIRES CHEAP... Not to say you couldn't find a crap tire at Tirerack, or a good tire at Wal-mart. But personally, I buy what I can look on tirerack and see good reviews for both from tirerack and other customers, and then take it to Wal-mart or whereever to have it mounted and balanced. And every time I've checked so far, it's still been cheaper than just getting whatever no-name brand crap tire that Wal-mart had and having them mount and balance it... Personally, I haven't looked up the exact specs, but for the size that was previously listed where Michelin's were got at Wal-mart for $165, I would have just paid $85 for Kumho's from Tirerack and had Wally world mount them. I've had great luck with the Kumho's I've gotten so far... (I don't know what model the michelin's were, but tirerack did have a michelin in that size that was $160...) Levi On 5/18/06, Desert Rat [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So, Michelin has a different warranty on tires purchased at discount outlets? Wouldn't Tirerack be the ultimate Discount Outlet? Are they produced offshore as well? Sorry, but I am not in the auto trade. Where can one look up this well known fact to verify this rumor? On 5/18/06, Steve MacSween [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Uh, negative on the Mobil 1, but it's well known in the auto trade that the Michelin tires sold through discount outlets (Wal Mart, in Canada also Canadian Tire) are produced offshore in the Third World. In the case of Michelin, I know at one time the tires they sold to the discounter market even carried different model designations (for example, the X-One was called the X when bought through Costco). Not sure if that is still true, but if you are comparison shopping check that the entire model name AND the treadwear and load rating specs are the same. BTW, this is also happening here in Canada with Bosch parts sold through Crappy Tire stores (mostly starters and alternators). You are in for a surprise when you try to pull one and get core or warranty for it, from an actual Bosch dealer. Bosch won't accept them back as cores or warranty them. Of course, you KNOW that the current joke among German mechanics is: What does 'Bosch-Germany' labelled on a part mean? Answer: 'Made in India'. LoL. Cheers Mac on 5/18/06 1:34 PM, Desert Rat at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Oh yeah, and the Mobil 1 is watered down, etc, etc. Good grief! On 5/18/06, David Brodbeck [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Really? I would think a Michelin was a Michelin. Do they provide a lower spec tire specifically for Wal Mart? Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: Their tires are also not of the same quality as what you would get at a real tire store/tirerack. James Jetton wrote: Johnny, I just purchased a set of Michelins for the Powerstroke at Wal-mart. Out the door price of $166.00 each, which included lifetime rotation and balance, tire disposal, taxes, etc for a set of 235/85/R16's. I normally limit my exposure to Wally World, but these prices were cheaper than anyone else. James Jetton 1987 300SDL 143k 1996 Ford F-250 Powerstroke 171k ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- John Freer Palm Springs, CA 1992 500 SEL 143K Stardust 1985 380SL 143K Blue Belle 1996 Sidekick 57K Kermit ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase
My my, counsellor, would this be a good time to suggest you switch to decaf ;-)? If you want to find out about something in the auto trade, then I'd suggest you sit around and chew the fat with people who work there. That would be a good start. Or have close friends in it who share information. Or all of the preceeding, including having worked in it, as I did. Tire Rack and Discount Tire Online are volume sellers who operate via the Net with low overheads, but they are TIRE DEALERS. DISCOUNT OUTLETS would include WallyMart, K-mart, Costco. They sell tires. I would not define them as tire dealers, any more than a supermarket with a big aisle of vitamins and toothpaste qualifies as a pharmacy. What I have said about tires applies to many items sold through discount outlets. That is why you MAY find you have trouble if you comparison-shop SOME things (e.g., small appliances) between, say, JC Penney and, say WallyMart, when you try to match up actual model numbers on products. Some manufacturers produce model variations solely for sale through WallyMart or other discounters. In the case of WM I would not suggest that this has any quality implications, as WM is tough on suppliers. As to whether Michelin has a different warranty, I have no idea, however one point to check would be if Michelins bought at (for example) Costco are covered at all Michelin dealers, or just through Costco outlets. Mac on 5/18/06 4:02 PM, Desert Rat at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So, Michelin has a different warranty on tires purchased at discount outlets? Wouldn't Tirerack be the ultimate Discount Outlet? Are they produced offshore as well? Sorry, but I am not in the auto trade. Where can one look up this well known fact to verify this rumor? On 5/18/06, Steve MacSween [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Uh, negative on the Mobil 1, but it's well known in the auto trade that the Michelin tires sold through discount outlets (Wal Mart, in Canada also Canadian Tire) are produced offshore in the Third World. In the case of Michelin, I know at one time the tires they sold to the discounter market even carried different model designations (for example, the X-One was called the X when bought through Costco). Not sure if that is still true, but if you are comparison shopping check that the entire model name AND the treadwear and load rating specs are the same. BTW, this is also happening here in Canada with Bosch parts sold through Crappy Tire stores (mostly starters and alternators). You are in for a surprise when you try to pull one and get core or warranty for it, from an actual Bosch dealer. Bosch won't accept them back as cores or warranty them. Of course, you KNOW that the current joke among German mechanics is: What does 'Bosch-Germany' labelled on a part mean? Answer: 'Made in India'. LoL. Cheers Mac on 5/18/06 1:34 PM, Desert Rat at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Oh yeah, and the Mobil 1 is watered down, etc, etc. Good grief! On 5/18/06, David Brodbeck [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Really? I would think a Michelin was a Michelin. Do they provide a lower spec tire specifically for Wal Mart? Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: Their tires are also not of the same quality as what you would get at a real tire store/tirerack. James Jetton wrote: Johnny, I just purchased a set of Michelins for the Powerstroke at Wal-mart. Out the door price of $166.00 each, which included lifetime rotation and balance, tire disposal, taxes, etc for a set of 235/85/R16's. I normally limit my exposure to Wally World, but these prices were cheaper than anyone else. James Jetton 1987 300SDL 143k 1996 Ford F-250 Powerstroke 171k ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase
Agree 100 percent Levi, Point is Michelin doesn't make a XXX tire for everone but Wallyworld and then let Wallyworld sell a XXX tire which is inferior to others. Just not going to happen. Bought Kuhmo's recently from Tirerack mounted and balanced and then drop shipped to my Indie. Great tire and great deal. No complaints at all, for the money anyway. On 5/18/06, Levi Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think they key thing is that are different models of tires. Michelin is a brand name. Just cause they make a really great tire, doesn't mean they don't make some really crappy ones as well. I don't exactly consider B.F. Goodrich to be my favorite tires, but I'd consider them a good name. However, my 83' 300D came with a set that the guy got at Sam's. At least two of them have had bubbles in the sidewalls since I got them. I pretty well view them as crap tires. The difference is: Wal-mart sells CHEAP TIRES. Tirerack sells GOOD TIRES CHEAP... Not to say you couldn't find a crap tire at Tirerack, or a good tire at Wal-mart. But personally, I buy what I can look on tirerack and see good reviews for both from tirerack and other customers, and then take it to Wal-mart or whereever to have it mounted and balanced. And every time I've checked so far, it's still been cheaper than just getting whatever no-name brand crap tire that Wal-mart had and having them mount and balance it... Personally, I haven't looked up the exact specs, but for the size that was previously listed where Michelin's were got at Wal-mart for $165, I would have just paid $85 for Kumho's from Tirerack and had Wally world mount them. I've had great luck with the Kumho's I've gotten so far... (I don't know what model the michelin's were, but tirerack did have a michelin in that size that was $160...) Levi On 5/18/06, Desert Rat [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So, Michelin has a different warranty on tires purchased at discount outlets? Wouldn't Tirerack be the ultimate Discount Outlet? Are they produced offshore as well? Sorry, but I am not in the auto trade. Where can one look up this well known fact to verify this rumor? On 5/18/06, Steve MacSween [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Uh, negative on the Mobil 1, but it's well known in the auto trade that the Michelin tires sold through discount outlets (Wal Mart, in Canada also Canadian Tire) are produced offshore in the Third World. In the case of Michelin, I know at one time the tires they sold to the discounter market even carried different model designations (for example, the X-One was called the X when bought through Costco). Not sure if that is still true, but if you are comparison shopping check that the entire model name AND the treadwear and load rating specs are the same. BTW, this is also happening here in Canada with Bosch parts sold through Crappy Tire stores (mostly starters and alternators). You are in for a surprise when you try to pull one and get core or warranty for it, from an actual Bosch dealer. Bosch won't accept them back as cores or warranty them. Of course, you KNOW that the current joke among German mechanics is: What does 'Bosch-Germany' labelled on a part mean? Answer: 'Made in India'. LoL. Cheers Mac on 5/18/06 1:34 PM, Desert Rat at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Oh yeah, and the Mobil 1 is watered down, etc, etc. Good grief! On 5/18/06, David Brodbeck [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Really? I would think a Michelin was a Michelin. Do they provide a lower spec tire specifically for Wal Mart? Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: Their tires are also not of the same quality as what you would get at a real tire store/tirerack. James Jetton wrote: Johnny, I just purchased a set of Michelins for the Powerstroke at Wal-mart. Out the door price of $166.00 each, which included lifetime rotation and balance, tire disposal, taxes, etc for a set of 235/85/R16's. I normally limit my exposure to Wally World, but these prices were cheaper than anyone else. James Jetton 1987 300SDL 143k 1996 Ford F-250 Powerstroke 171k ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase
Hello Levi, I really like Tire Rack but I find that in West Virginia that shipping to my local indy eats up the cost saving and that the similar tire from Wal-Mart is cheaper counting 6% sales tax. The last couple of sets I ordered from Tire Rack were well over comparable tires at Wal-Mart. The big difference for me is selections since I can get any tire that I want from Tire Rack and only a few from anywhere else. Todd Smith '85 300CD 248K -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Levi Smith Not to say you couldn't find a crap tire at Tirerack, or a good tire at Wal-mart. But personally, I buy what I can look on tirerack and see good reviews for both from tirerack and other customers, and then take it to Wal-mart or whereever to have it mounted and balanced. And every time I've checked so far, it's still been cheaper than just getting whatever no-name brand crap tire that Wal-mart had and having them mount and balance it... Personally, I haven't looked up the exact specs, but for the size that was previously listed where Michelin's were got at Wal-mart for $165, I would have just paid $85 for Kumho's from Tirerack and had Wally world mount them. I've had great luck with the Kumho's I've gotten so far... (I don't know what model the michelin's were, but tirerack did have a michelin in that size that was $160...) Levi
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase
It's no secret that Walmart wants cheap products from their suppliers that last 1 season and then require replacement. People expect more than 1 year from tires, but I suspect they are working on that too. http://www.fastcompany.com/magazine/102/open_snapper.html -Dave Walton 94S350, 99E300 On 5/18/06, Steve MacSween [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My my, counsellor, would this be a good time to suggest you switch to decaf ;-)? If you want to find out about something in the auto trade, then I'd suggest you sit around and chew the fat with people who work there. That would be a good start. Or have close friends in it who share information. Or all of the preceeding, including having worked in it, as I did. Tire Rack and Discount Tire Online are volume sellers who operate via the Net with low overheads, but they are TIRE DEALERS. DISCOUNT OUTLETS would include WallyMart, K-mart, Costco. They sell tires. I would not define them as tire dealers, any more than a supermarket with a big aisle of vitamins and toothpaste qualifies as a pharmacy. What I have said about tires applies to many items sold through discount outlets. That is why you MAY find you have trouble if you comparison-shop SOME things (e.g., small appliances) between, say, JC Penney and, say WallyMart, when you try to match up actual model numbers on products. Some manufacturers produce model variations solely for sale through WallyMart or other discounters. In the case of WM I would not suggest that this has any quality implications, as WM is tough on suppliers. As to whether Michelin has a different warranty, I have no idea, however one point to check would be if Michelins bought at (for example) Costco are covered at all Michelin dealers, or just through Costco outlets. Mac on 5/18/06 4:02 PM, Desert Rat at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So, Michelin has a different warranty on tires purchased at discount outlets? Wouldn't Tirerack be the ultimate Discount Outlet? Are they produced offshore as well? Sorry, but I am not in the auto trade. Where can one look up this well known fact to verify this rumor? On 5/18/06, Steve MacSween [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Uh, negative on the Mobil 1, but it's well known in the auto trade that the Michelin tires sold through discount outlets (Wal Mart, in Canada also Canadian Tire) are produced offshore in the Third World. In the case of Michelin, I know at one time the tires they sold to the discounter market even carried different model designations (for example, the X-One was called the X when bought through Costco). Not sure if that is still true, but if you are comparison shopping check that the entire model name AND the treadwear and load rating specs are the same. BTW, this is also happening here in Canada with Bosch parts sold through Crappy Tire stores (mostly starters and alternators). You are in for a surprise when you try to pull one and get core or warranty for it, from an actual Bosch dealer. Bosch won't accept them back as cores or warranty them. Of course, you KNOW that the current joke among German mechanics is: What does 'Bosch-Germany' labelled on a part mean? Answer: 'Made in India'. LoL. Cheers Mac on 5/18/06 1:34 PM, Desert Rat at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Oh yeah, and the Mobil 1 is watered down, etc, etc. Good grief! On 5/18/06, David Brodbeck [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Really? I would think a Michelin was a Michelin. Do they provide a lower spec tire specifically for Wal Mart? Kaleb C. Striplin wrote: Their tires are also not of the same quality as what you would get at a real tire store/tirerack. James Jetton wrote: Johnny, I just purchased a set of Michelins for the Powerstroke at Wal-mart. Out the door price of $166.00 each, which included lifetime rotation and balance, tire disposal, taxes, etc for a set of 235/85/R16's. I normally limit my exposure to Wally World, but these prices were cheaper than anyone else. James Jetton 1987 300SDL 143k 1996 Ford F-250 Powerstroke 171k ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase
On Thu, 18 May 2006 10:08:12 -0700, you wrote: Note: Wall Mart no longer sells SNAPPER lawnmower. SNAPPER refused to drop price, which would have required a quality reduction. Do you think the John Deer at Home Depot is the same machine as that at a John Deer dealer? Several years ago, I needed a washing machine. Fellow in my church was regional sales rep for Westinghouse. He said go to XYZ, one of his dealers and the fellow would do the best he could do. That was how he got his appliances! 3 weeks later the same model was on sale about $25 cheaper at a big discount store. I mentioned it to my buddy. He told me not so, I should compare the Long Form of the S/N on the back of both machines. I did, they were both the same model on the front but were different in the Long Form. Any manufacturer of electric motors (for instance) will tell you that there are several grades (and costs) for the same frame size motor. The better and more costly one runs cooler, draws less power and lasts longer. Guess who gets the culls? YMMV -- Regards, Peter T. Arnold 1987 300SDL 24KMI 1995 F-250 PowerChoke 194Kmi 1954 Metropolitan Convertible, Hanger Queen Wife has a Cruizer, 80 Kmi, as reliable as an Ice Box, the car that is!
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase
Their tires are also not of the same quality as what you would get at a real tire store/tirerack. James Jetton wrote: Johnny, I just purchased a set of Michelins for the Powerstroke at Wal-mart. Out the door price of $166.00 each, which included lifetime rotation and balance, tire disposal, taxes, etc for a set of 235/85/R16's. I normally limit my exposure to Wally World, but these prices were cheaper than anyone else. James Jetton 1987 300SDL 143k 1996 Ford F-250 Powerstroke 171k ___ http://www.striplin.net For new parts see official list sponsor: http://www.buymbparts.com/ For used parts email [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net -- Kaleb C. Striplin/Claremore, OK 90 420SEL, 89 560SEL, 87 420SEL, 87 300SDL, 85 380SE, 85 300D, 84 190D 2.2, 83 300TD, 81 300TD, 81 240D, 76 240D, 76 300D, 74 240D, 73 280SEL 4.5, 72 250C, 69 250 http://www.striplin.net
Re: [MBZ] Tire Purchase
Johnny, I just purchased a set of Michelins for the Powerstroke at Wal-mart. Out the door price of $166.00 each, which included lifetime rotation and balance, tire disposal, taxes, etc for a set of 235/85/R16's. I normally limit my exposure to Wally World, but these prices were cheaper than anyone else. James Jetton 1987 300SDL 143k 1996 Ford F-250 Powerstroke 171k From [EMAIL PROTECTED] Tue May 16 17:15:55 2006 Received: from rwcrmhc11.comcast.net ([204.127.192.81]) by server5.arterytc5.net with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1Fg39H-0006OX-Bi for [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Tue, 16 May 2006 17:15:55 + Received: from [192.168.1.2] (c-24-3-195-27.hsd1.pa.comcast.net[24.3.195.27]) by comcast.net (rwcrmhc11) with ESMTP id 20060516171550m11009elsse; Tue, 16 May 2006 17:15:50 + Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Tue, 16 May 2006 13:15:49 -0400 From: Marshall Booth [EMAIL PROTECTED] Organization: University of Pittsburgh School of Medicine User-Agent: Thunderbird 1.5.0.2 (Windows/20060308) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Mercedes Discussion List [EMAIL PROTECTED] References: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] In-Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Antivirus-Scanner: Clean mail though you should still use an Antivirus Subject: Re: [MBZ] Heat stuck on 83' 300D X-BeenThere: [EMAIL PROTECTED] X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.6 Precedence: list Reply-To: Mercedes Discussion List [EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Id: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes_striplin.net.striplin.net List-Unsubscribe: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Archive: http://striplin.net/pipermail/mercedes_striplin.net List-Post: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Help: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Subscribe: http://striplin.net/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_striplin.net, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 16 May 2006 17:15:55 - Levi Smith wrote: It's been raining a lot lately so I haven't had the chance to get in there and take a look at the monovalve, but here's my question: If it's simply sticking on and allowing coolant flow, why is it not even putting out cold air when the engine is still cold? I could understand the coolant overpowering the AC once it's hot, but when the engine is cold, it seems that the fan speed should kick up and put out cold air. But it doesn't. It's trying as hard as it can not to put out cold air, and waits till the engine temp picks up and then blows in hot air... In the absence of power, the monovalve results in full heat (full heat is the default so that defrost ALWAYS works if the engine is running - it's the law in Germany). Most insert failures result in full heat. It is ONLY when power is applied and the insert functions as designed that heat is shut off. If the insert is torn, there will be full heat at low engine speeds, and heat will diminish at higher engine speeds, only to return at lower engine speeds. AFTER you get the monovalve working properly, THEN you can start to diagnose the AC system. Marshall -- Marshall Booth (who doesn't respond to unsigned questions) der Dieseling Doktor [EMAIL PROTECTED] '87 300TD 182Kmi, '85 190D 2.0 161Kmi, '87 190D 2.5 turbo 237kmi, '84 190D 2.2 229Kmi (retired)
