RE: [meteorite-list] THANKS
Hello all Sincerely to feel itself to say pizzano is a species of offense towards other persons of other nations, like the classic eats spaghetti to the the Italians. it is like if I said to the Americans eats hamburger, task that is not a lot tolerated this? Those that it disturbs me of Steve Arnold is its continues messages - also others 6 few day ago - sincerely I not never put 6 messages in a single day, except when there are of the arguments in course, and in the sale email I have put few messagges, same thing for the auctions, one to the beginning and one to the end, but not 6 for day. However Steve is not of gets worse, would be very other personages to throw outside from the list for their gross behavior with email said not in public but in private. I am not an administrator of the list, therefore I cannot take decisions, but I can put the person that I do not tolerate in the Spam box. Sorry for my english, if someone wants writes the message in Italian and then it translate it. Regards Matteo --- Rhett Bourland [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Perhaps Matteo would be willing to shed a little light on this issue? Sincerely, Rhett Bourland www.asteroidmodels.com www.asteroidmodels.com/personal www.meteoritecollectors.org = M come Meteorite - Matteo Chinellato Via Triestina 126/A - 30030 - TESSERA, VENEZIA, ITALY Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sale Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.com Collection Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.info International Meteorite Collectors Association #2140 MSN Messanger: [EMAIL PROTECTED] EBAY.COM:http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Cyclic mass extinction?
I happened to catch the last few minutes of a show on PBS about extinction. One of the scientist had compiled data on thousands of extinct species and graphed the times of their extinction. In the timeline he created there seemed to be above normal rates of mass extinction every 26 million years. Another scientist is working on a theory that the sun has a companion star, "Nemesis" that perturbs the orbit of comets in the Oort cloud which impact the Earth roughly every 26 million years. Who can shed some light on this topic? Wouldn't there be clear evidence of meteoritic dust fallout in clay deposits in strata spanning every 26my? Interesting, very interesting. Didn't catch the name of the show, or the names of the scientists.- Edward Edward R. Hodges www.meteoriteonline.com IMCA#4173
Re: [meteorite-list] Cyclic mass extinction?
Hi Edward and List, I took a course in college called Catastrophes and Mass Extinctions. Our "textbook" was called "Nemesis the Death Star and Other Theories of Mass Extinction." As I recall, Nemesis was not one of the more compelling theories, but interesting to contemplate nonetheless. I will look around for the book and if I can find any more info, I will let you know. Regards and Good Night from rainy rainy Alaska, Jeannie The Museum Store/The Nature Source IMCA #9236 www.thenaturesource.com - Original Message - From: Edward R. Hodges To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, July 24, 2002 10:58 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Cyclic mass extinction? I happened to catch the last few minutes of a show on PBS about extinction. One of the scientist had compiled data on thousands of extinct species and graphed the times of their extinction. In the timeline he created there seemed to be above normal rates of mass extinction every 26 million years. Another scientist is working on a theory that the sun has a companion star, "Nemesis" that perturbs the orbit of comets in the Oort cloud which impact the Earth roughly every 26 million years. Who can shed some light on this topic? Wouldn't there be clear evidence of meteoritic dust fallout in clay deposits in strata spanning every 26my? Interesting, very interesting. Didn't catch the name of the show, or the names of the scientists.- Edward Edward R. Hodges www.meteoriteonline.com IMCA#4173
Re: [meteorite-list] Cyclic mass extinction?
I must be more organized than I thought! Found the book smushed between abiography of Alexander the Great and "How to Clean Just About Anything". OK, maybe I'm not that organizedbut I did find it! : ) NEMESIS The Death-Star and Other Theories of Mass Extinction by Donald Goldsmith, copyright 1985 (I've dated myself!!!) and published by Berkley Books, NY. A blurb: "(The Nemesistheory) relies on an entirely unknown object to cause the (cometary) perturbations. Hence, thetheory can assign the Nemesis star the most effective orbit to produce the observed results, which the Nemesis theorists insist is a period close to 26 million years in the extinction rate, and close to 28.4 million years in the impact crater record Skeptics say the Nemesis Theory requires that the sun be a member of an unusual star system, a double-star system in which a low mass companion moves in an extremely large orbit around the system's center of mass, which would be close to the much more massive star in the system, our sun. Such a double star system would be unlike almost all the stars and star systems we observe around us. (snip) Nemesis would have to move in a highly, but not tremendously elongated orbit, one in which its distance from the sun falls to a minimum of 26,000 A.U. and increases to a maximum of 150,000 A.USince the force of gravity increases in proportion to one over the square of the distance between two objects, Nemesis at its close approaches to the sun would have a far stronger effect on comets in the Oort cloud, most of which are from 10,000 to 40,000 A.U. from the sun, than it would at its average distance (88,000 A.U.) let alone at its maximum distances from the sun." It goes on to talk more about the theorists, and the theoretical orbit, mass and luminosity of Nemesis. If anyone would like more information on anything regarding this, let me know and I'll look it up. Off to bed, Jeannie - Original Message - From: Edward R. Hodges To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, July 24, 2002 10:58 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Cyclic mass extinction? I happened to catch the last few minutes of a show on PBS about extinction. One of the scientist had compiled data on thousands of extinct species and graphed the times of their extinction. In the timeline he created there seemed to be above normal rates of mass extinction every 26 million years. Another scientist is working on a theory that the sun has a companion star, "Nemesis" that perturbs the orbit of comets in the Oort cloud which impact the Earth roughly every 26 million years. Who can shed some light on this topic? Wouldn't there be clear evidence of meteoritic dust fallout in clay deposits in strata spanning every 26my? Interesting, very interesting. Didn't catch the name of the show, or the names of the scientists.- Edward Edward R. Hodges www.meteoriteonline.com IMCA#4173
[meteorite-list] Earth Impactors and Meteor Crater
Hello All, Walter wrote: Hello Everyone, I have been asked a question for which I have no answer. how large does an object have to be for it not to vaporize completely upon plunging through Earth's atmosphere, i.e., for there to be anything sizeable left to cause wide destruction once it hits the ground (or water)? I know that the answer is not an easy one and there are numerous variables involved (e.g., type of material involved, angle of entry, definition of wide destruction, etc.) but does anyone have a guess (or a SWAG) as to the answer. I would like to draw your attention to R. Norton's CEM (Cambridge Encyclopedia of Meteorites), especially pp. 39-45: Meteoroids to meteorites: a lesson in survival and furthermore, pp. 49-50, where you'll find useful information on the sizes of meteorites and their chances of survival. Those among us who are lucky enough to own the Buchwald trilogy, will find a lot of useful information in chapters 1-4: Chapter 1: The Minor Bodies of the Solar System Chapter 2: Physics of the Fall Chapter 3: On Multiple Falls: End Point Height and Sound Phenomena Chapter 4: Meteorite Craters And I would like to remind you of the famous graphs from Heide (1964). You also find them in R. Norton's RFS II, pp. 49-53: - The Ablation Process - Mass Loss - Effects of Impact and again, in CEM, pp. 33-34: - Meteoroid velocity - Atmospheric drag or you can also find pertinent info in the introductory chapter of McSween's Meteorites and Their Parent Planets, p. 15 ff.: = A Fiery Passage (with the same graph on p. 17, figure 1.9). Rob Matson wrote: wasn't the iron that created Meteor Crater estimated to be about 150 meters in diameter? RODDY D.J. and SHOEMAKER E.M. (1995) Meteor Crater: Summary of impact conditions (Meteoritics 30-5, 1995, 567): ... the meteorite had a velocity in the range of about 13 to 20 km/s, probably in the lower part of this range ..., the coherent meteorite diameter is estimated to have been 45-50 m with a mass of 300,000 - 400,000 t, i.e., large enough to experience less than 1% in both mass ablation and velocity deceleration. Best wishes, Bernd __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
RE: [meteorite-list] THANKS
Hi all, Matteo, although Steve has posted what amounts to the same sales or trade pitch more than once in a day, I cannot recall ever seeing 6 similar messages from him in one day. I think it is possible that you've received multiple copies of his posts, which really wouldn't be his fault. I know where one or two list-members are concerned, I receive multiple copies when they post. Charlie ---BeginMessage--- Hello all Sincerely to feel itself to say pizzano is a species of offense towards other persons of other nations, like the classic eats spaghetti to the the Italians. it is like if I said to the Americans eats hamburger, task that is not a lot tolerated this? Those that it disturbs me of Steve Arnold is its continues messages - also others 6 few day ago - sincerely I not never put 6 messages in a single day, except when there are of the arguments in course, and in the sale email I have put few messagges, same thing for the auctions, one to the beginning and one to the end, but not 6 for day. However Steve is not of gets worse, would be very other personages to throw outside from the list for their gross behavior with email said not in public but in private. I am not an administrator of the list, therefore I cannot take decisions, but I can put the person that I do not tolerate in the Spam box. Sorry for my english, if someone wants writes the message in Italian and then it translate it. Regards Matteo --- Rhett Bourland [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Perhaps Matteo would be willing to shed a little light on this issue? Sincerely, Rhett Bourland www.asteroidmodels.com www.asteroidmodels.com/personal www.meteoritecollectors.org = M come Meteorite - Matteo Chinellato Via Triestina 126/A - 30030 - TESSERA, VENEZIA, ITALY Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sale Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.com Collection Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.info International Meteorite Collectors Association #2140 MSN Messanger: [EMAIL PROTECTED] EBAY.COM:http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list ---End Message---
Re: [meteorite-list] THANKS
Matteo, We understand your english, never apologize for it. You hang in there and do not let one person bring you down. Mark M. - Original Message - From: Matteo Chinellato [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Walter Branch [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Steve Arnold, Chicago!!! [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, July 24, 2002 11:49 PM Subject: RE: [meteorite-list] THANKS Hello all Sincerely to feel itself to say pizzano is a species of offense towards other persons of other nations, like the classic eats spaghetti to the the Italians. it is like if I said to the Americans eats hamburger, task that is not a lot tolerated this? Those that it disturbs me of Steve Arnold is its continues messages - also others 6 few day ago - sincerely I not never put 6 messages in a single day, except when there are of the arguments in course, and in the sale email I have put few messagges, same thing for the auctions, one to the beginning and one to the end, but not 6 for day. However Steve is not of gets worse, would be very other personages to throw outside from the list for their gross behavior with email said not in public but in private. I am not an administrator of the list, therefore I cannot take decisions, but I can put the person that I do not tolerate in the Spam box. Sorry for my english, if someone wants writes the message in Italian and then it translate it. Regards Matteo --- Rhett Bourland [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Perhaps Matteo would be willing to shed a little light on this issue? Sincerely, Rhett Bourland www.asteroidmodels.com www.asteroidmodels.com/personal www.meteoritecollectors.org = M come Meteorite - Matteo Chinellato Via Triestina 126/A - 30030 - TESSERA, VENEZIA, ITALY Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sale Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.com Collection Site: http://www.mcomemeteorite.info International Meteorite Collectors Association #2140 MSN Messanger: [EMAIL PROTECTED] EBAY.COM:http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] TRADE OFFER: DaG400/gao/NWA869/etc
Hello List Members I have just a few items left and want to offer these as a one time trade offer. I am looking for a stable iron of any type or form (but MUST be stable, bigger the better). Best deal gets the last of them 0.2g DaG 400 dust in vial with documentation from lunar testing lab-this is unique in provenance! 2 Oriented Gao individuals of about 4g total weight-these are nice and one has a good overflow lip Tatahouine (Diogenite, Fell 1931) 2.84g (3 nice pieces green with dark veins in Riker) NWA 869 (L5 chondrite with ???/impact melt/inclusions) 123g (Slab, dark ??? areas surrounding light breccia) plus another at 110g (Quarter of individual), with breccia and 2cm ??? inclusion)-this is a great piece Kainsaz (0.2g part slice with crust) Bilanga (about 0.5g in vial) thanks Mike __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] TV program on ASTEROIDS/ Cont. Drift/ OT
That happens a lot with computer recreations I guess no one wants to make a texture map for the ancient earth and it's easier to use NASA made (current) maps to create earth models in 3D. Maybe I'll make one one day. Take care, Ron __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Cyclic mass extinction?
Hi Edward and all, Recently it was announced (on this list) that the Sun was made primarily of iron and doesn't have the hydrogen that was once thought. This is a new theory based on observations by astronomers. It was said that the sun formed from a single supernova event and probably was a single star. It will be interesting to see if this new idea holds true. If it is correct then perhaps there is no Nemesis (companion star) as we have thought, although we may pass near other stars in our galaxy that might cause this effect every 26 million years. Perhaps there is something else going on that we aren't yet aware. Just a thought and comment. --AL __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] ***AD*** Visit WWW.METEORITEONLINE.COM ***AD***
Please come visit www.meteoriteonline.com Let us know you saw our ad on the list and receive 20% off your order. Thank You.- Edward R. Hodges www.meteoriteonline.com IMCA#4173
[meteorite-list] Visa is now on-line
Wow, my Visa pass this time, test on eBay.com. On eBay.de too ! Thanks to all who help me. -[ MARCIN CIMALA ]--[ IMCA#3667 ]- http://www.meteoryt.net Meteorite Information Center http://www.polandmet.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.studiomc.com.pl[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.vistapro.prv.pl +GSM (607) 535 195 - __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Collection For Sale (AD)
Hello to all, To those that are interested, I have been given a collection to sell which contain many interesting and unique meteorites. These are name brand specimens, most with a history and not NWA (not that NWA is bad, I have many). For those interested in this collection, email me off list and I'll send you a list of these items. I am fist looking to sell them as a whole. I will not entertain offers on individuals at this time. In the event that these can't be sold as a whole group then I will take offers on individuals. A sampling of these are: Albin,Wyoming (pal) Richfield,Ks (LL3.7) Esquel, Argentina (pal) Mt. Egerton, Australia (aubrite with iron) Millbillillie, Australia(eucrite) Reid 013, Australia (brachinite) Zagami, Nigeria (SNC) DAG 262 (first low cost Lunar offered) and many others. --AL __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
RE: [meteorite-list] THANKS
Rhett, Me too. It is a rare commodity in this world. Keep up the great work. One GOOD thing is that the rules for governing both lists were made stronger by all of this. All the best, Greg Redfern IMCA #5781 www.meteoritecollectors.org -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Walter Branch Sent: Wednesday, July 24, 2002 8:40 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] THANKS Rhett, Thanks very much for the explanation. I appreciate your honesty and candor. -Walter --- Walter Branch, Ph.D. Branch Meteorites 322 Stephenson Ave., Suite B Savannah, GA 31405 USA www.branchmeteorites.com - Original Message - From: Rhett Bourland [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Walter Branch [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Steve Arnold, Chicago!!! [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, July 24, 2002 8:27 PM Subject: RE: [meteorite-list] THANKS Actualy Walter, I think that Steve has confused this list with the mailing list for the IMCA. I am the one that has called him a racist because he made racist comments towards Matteo Chinellato after Matteo expressed discontent with getting Steve's multiple messages for the same material. If making racist comments towards someone isn't reason enough to call someone a racist I'm not sure what is. He almost got kicked out of the IMCA because I will not tolerate such comments among the INTERNATIONAL Meteorite Collectors Association but since there was nothing against that on the website he wasn't kicked out but if you'll check various pages there are now statements saying that such actions are now grounds for removal and I can't believe I had to actually make such statements and they are only there because Steve proved me wrong. His comments to Matteo put him on a sort of probation with the IMCA where he would be watched a bit more closely than other members. Last night, despite the following statement on the IMCA's website The purpose of the mailing list is to alert people of frauds and if a new person to wishes to join the association that we don't personally know then we will post to the list asking for any experiences that anyone has had. If you would like to post about anything meteorite related (discoveries, questions, good natured debate) that is welcomed as well. Please, DO NOT post any sales or flames to this list. There are plenty of other lists for those puposes. Failure to adhere to that rule will result in you being removed from it (but not out of the group). Steve decided to post another one of his sales messages for the same old material to that list and as a result got removed from the mailing list but not the IMCA. Also, despite what Mr. Arnold may think, I do not hate him. I don't particulary care for him because of his comments to Matteo as well as some rather rude comments that have been made to other people off list that I have been told about but I do not care for him because of those actions. I apologize to anyone who may not care about this but I wanted to go on the record as being the one who called Steve a racist because of his racist comments made towards Matteo. Perhaps Matteo would be willing to shed a little light on this issue? Sincerely, Rhett Bourland www.asteroidmodels.com www.asteroidmodels.com/personal www.meteoritecollectors.org -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Walter Branch Sent: Wednesday, July 24, 2002 7:02 PM To: Steve Arnold, Chicago!!!; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] THANKS Steve, The only person who could kick you off the list is Art Jones, the list administrator and I am certain that you have done nothing to warrant being kicked off the list. Who has threatened to kick you off the list and who has called you a racist? -Walter --- Walter Branch, Ph.D. Branch Meteorites 322 Stephenson Ave., Suite B Savannah, GA 31405 USA www.branchmeteorites.com - Original Message - From: Steve Arnold, Chicago!!! [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, July 24, 2002 7:42 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] THANKS Hi list. I want to thank alot of you good folks for supporting me. I never intended to cause such an uproar. I just wanted to know about LA 002. Now I know. If we can get some great, if not no biggy. I'm just tired of being threatend of being kicked out of this list. I love this List and all the great guys and gals that make up this great list. I'll slow down the posts and spamming. I just want to get along with my fellow meteorite friends and can hardly wait to meet you in Tucson. It is hard to swallow when I'm called a racist! I do not have a racist bone in my body. I know I should not let 1 person get to me, but I do not believe in my heart of hearts that I should be kicked around
Re: [meteorite-list] Cyclic mass extinction?
The trouble with many of these theories (Nemesis star, iron sun, etc.) is that they are on the wacko fringe. The evidence for them is not sufficiently established yet that they can be taken as a serious challenge, which is not to say that they are completely ridiculous. There needs to be more research by independent groups, and the data need to be checked against each other and build more of a case before these theories will get anywhere near mainstream thought. Go, scientific method! Tracy Latimer __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
RE: [meteorite-list] THANKS
Greetings all, I don't want to speak for Steve Arnold, but I believe there has been a misunderstanding. If the racist comment is his use of the word pizzano, it was misinterpreted. The word he was trying to convey was (I don't know the spelling so will write it phoenitically) pie-zon-o. Which from what he (Steve) thinks and from what I've always thought, is a word meaning my friend or something to that effect. Maybe I've always misunderstood the word and it is racist, but I've heard it used quite a bit as a term of endearment. When I met Steve he was truly upset and didn't understand why Matteo was mad at him. I honestly believe that no foul was intended. thanx, Steve --- Greg Redfern [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Rhett, Me too. It is a rare commodity in this world. Keep up the great work. One GOOD thing is that the rules for governing both lists were made stronger by all of this. All the best, Greg Redfern IMCA #5781 www.meteoritecollectors.org -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Walter Branch Sent: Wednesday, July 24, 2002 8:40 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] THANKS Rhett, Thanks very much for the explanation. I appreciate your honesty and candor. -Walter --- Walter Branch, Ph.D. Branch Meteorites 322 Stephenson Ave., Suite B Savannah, GA 31405 USA www.branchmeteorites.com - Original Message - From: Rhett Bourland [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Walter Branch [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Steve Arnold, Chicago!!! [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, July 24, 2002 8:27 PM Subject: RE: [meteorite-list] THANKS Actualy Walter, I think that Steve has confused this list with the mailing list for the IMCA. I am the one that has called him a racist because he made racist comments towards Matteo Chinellato after Matteo expressed discontent with getting Steve's multiple messages for the same material. If making racist comments towards someone isn't reason enough to call someone a racist I'm not sure what is. He almost got kicked out of the IMCA because I will not tolerate such comments among the INTERNATIONAL Meteorite Collectors Association but since there was nothing against that on the website he wasn't kicked out but if you'll check various pages there are now statements saying that such actions are now grounds for removal and I can't believe I had to actually make such statements and they are only there because Steve proved me wrong. His comments to Matteo put him on a sort of probation with the IMCA where he would be watched a bit more closely than other members. Last night, despite the following statement on the IMCA's website The purpose of the mailing list is to alert people of frauds and if a new person to wishes to join the association that we don't personally know then we will post to the list asking for any experiences that anyone has had. If you would like to post about anything meteorite related (discoveries, questions, good natured debate) that is welcomed as well. Please, DO NOT post any sales or flames to this list. There are plenty of other lists for those puposes. Failure to adhere to that rule will result in you being removed from it (but not out of the group). Steve decided to post another one of his sales messages for the same old material to that list and as a result got removed from the mailing list but not the IMCA. Also, despite what Mr. Arnold may think, I do not hate him. I don't particulary care for him because of his comments to Matteo as well as some rather rude comments that have been made to other people off list that I have been told about but I do not care for him because of those actions. I apologize to anyone who may not care about this but I wanted to go on the record as being the one who called Steve a racist because of his racist comments made towards Matteo. Perhaps Matteo would be willing to shed a little light on this issue? Sincerely, Rhett Bourland www.asteroidmodels.com www.asteroidmodels.com/personal www.meteoritecollectors.org -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Walter Branch Sent: Wednesday, July 24, 2002 7:02 PM To: Steve Arnold, Chicago!!!; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] THANKS Steve, The only person who could kick you off the list is Art Jones, the list administrator and I am certain that you have done nothing to warrant being kicked off the list. Who has threatened to kick you off the list and who has called you a racist? -Walter --- Walter Branch, Ph.D. Branch Meteorites 322 Stephenson Ave., Suite B Savannah, GA 31405 USA www.branchmeteorites.com - Original
[meteorite-list] Asteroid Comic
A new method of getting rid of those pesky asteroids that threaten our planet from time to time. http://members.aol.com/majesticgallery//ScientistComic.gif enjoy, Ron
Re: [meteorite-list] THANKS
Rhett, I am really confused with this action so if I am out of line please correct me. I just want to be sure that Mr. Arnold is indeed a racist because this is a very serious charge and now his reputation is sullied by making it public. Racists slurs are very damaging and hurtful to the recipients. They should not be tolerated. However the intentions behind the slur are equally important. ( Some Afro-Americans use the n word in friendship when addressing each other but would not tolerate it from another race) So, are you sure Mr. Arnold was trying to hurt the feelings of Matteo? Are you sure Mr. Arnold is a racist? Did Matteo contact him personally first to rectify matters? Obviously Matteo must have contacted you at some time. Did you contact Mr. Arnold privately to get his side of the matter? Should Mr. Arnold be judged by rules that did not exist when the offense was committed? Why would IMCA be involved when this has nothing to do with meteorites or meteorite sales? Why has Mr. Arnold been banned from the IMCA group list when (according to my e-mails) - HE HAS NEVER USED IT? NOT EVEN ONE POST!! So is IMCA going to monitor posts on the LIST and put the big dealers on a sort of probation when they get into undue assaults or racial comments (I've read a lot worse than a racial slur- i.e. sexual slur) or is this just for the little new people? Do you think the same rules should apply to all members? If the IMCA is now going to concern itself with relationships as well as authenticity, I'm concerned with its new direction and to what it might lead! Did the majority of board members approve of this change? I think this situation could have been handled privately without accusations and without IMCA involvement. But now it is public and the IMCA has opened itself to a possible slander charge.. I have found Mr. Arnold very open to suggestion. He loves this group and I don't think he would intentionally hurt anyone. I don't believe he is racist. His lack of experience may irritate others, but none of us wants our freeness of speech regulated. I do not take Matteo's hurt feelings lightly unless he failed to contact Mr. Arnold to straighten things out privately. Rhettt, again if I am out of line, please correct me. (these are questions - not flames) Thanks, Ken Newton #9632 Rhett Bourland wrote: Actualy Walter, I think that Steve has confused this list with the mailing list for the IMCA. I am the one that has called him a racist because he made racist comments towards Matteo Chinellato after Matteo expressed discontent with getting Steve's multiple messages for the same material. If making racist comments towards someone isn't reason enough to call someone a racist I'm not sure what is. He almost got kicked out of the IMCA because I will not tolerate such comments among the INTERNATIONAL Meteorite Collectors Association but since there was nothing against that on the website he wasn't kicked out but if you'll check various pages there are now statements saying that such actions are now grounds for removal and I can't believe I had to actually make such statements and they are only there because Steve proved me wrong. His comments to Matteo put him on a sort of probation with the IMCA where he would be watched a bit more closely than other members. Last night, despite the following statement on the IMCA's website The purpose of the mailing list is to alert people of frauds and if a new person to wishes to join the association that we don't personally know then we will post to the list asking for any experiences that anyone has had. If you would like to post about anything meteorite related (discoveries, questions, good natured debate) that is welcomed as well. Please, DO NOT post any sales or flames to this list. There are plenty of other lists for those puposes. Failure to adhere to that rule will result in you being removed from it (but not out of the group). Steve decided to post another one of his sales messages for the same old material to that list and as a result got removed from the mailing list but not the IMCA. Also, despite what Mr. Arnold may think, I do not hate him. I don't particulary care for him because of his comments to Matteo as well as some rather rude comments that have been made to other people off list that I have been told about but I do not care for him because of those actions. I apologize to anyone who may not care about this but I wanted to go on the record as being the one who called Steve a racist because of his racist comments made towards Matteo. Perhaps Matteo would be willing to shed a little light on this issue? Sincerely, Rhett Bourland www.asteroidmodels.com www.asteroidmodels.com/personal www.meteoritecollectors.org -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Walter Branch Sent: Wednesday, July 24, 2002 7:02 PM To: Steve Arnold, Chicago!!!; [EMAIL
[meteorite-list] Torino Scale
Walter wrote: how large does an object have to be for it not to vaporize completely upon plunging through Earth's atmosphere, i.e., for there to be anything sizeable left to cause wide destruction once it hits the ground (or water)? Hello Again, According to G. Verschuur, the consequences may be something like: Very Large (10 km) - Global - Mass extinctions Large (2-10 km) - Global - Some extinctions Medium (0.2-2 km) - Regional - Threat to civilisation Small (30-200 m)- Local - Severe Very Small (10-30 m)- Local - Minor If a really big one hit the Earth, as big as the the impactor that killed the dinosaurs (10-15 km), its destructive force and the conse- quences would be horrifying. It would hit us with the force of about 100 million megatons of TNT - this is more than 10,000 times the entire arsenal of nuclear weapons. If it plunged into an ocean, there would be tsunamis hundreds of feet high. House-sized chunks of rock would be tossed hundreds of miles and our atmosphere would be saturated with dust for years. Best regards, Bernd __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] THANKS
Appears that Steve may have meant paisano but spelled it pizzano, if that's the case this whole big thing is based on bad spelling rather than an ethnic slur. My understanding is that paisan or paisano is roughly equivalent to dude or bro, and is a term of endearment rather than an insult. Gregory __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] THANKS
Correct me if I am wrong but I think Rhett revoked Steve's posting privileges based upon the following statement: The purpose of the mailing list is to alert people of frauds Steve decided to post another one of his sales messages for the same old material to that list and as a result got removed from the mailing list but not the IMCA. However, I went back and looked at the past messages for the groups and it seems that Steve HAS NOT posted sales messages to the collectorsassociation group mailing list. Perhaps in the flood of sales updates to other mailing lists, Rhett thought they were coming from the collectors association :D~ Jim Strope 421 Fourth Street Glen Dale, WV 26038 Catch a Falling Star Meteorites http://www.catchafallingstar.com - Original Message - From: magellon [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, August 25, 2002 2:45 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] THANKS Rhett, I am really confused with this action so if I am out of line please correct me. I just want to be sure that Mr. Arnold is indeed a racist because this is a very serious charge and now his reputation is sullied by making it public. Racists slurs are very damaging and hurtful to the recipients. They should not be tolerated. However the intentions behind the slur are equally important. ( Some Afro-Americans use the n word in friendship when addressing each other but would not tolerate it from another race) So, are you sure Mr. Arnold was trying to hurt the feelings of Matteo? Are you sure Mr. Arnold is a racist? Did Matteo contact him personally first to rectify matters? Obviously Matteo must have contacted you at some time. Did you contact Mr. Arnold privately to get his side of the matter? Should Mr. Arnold be judged by rules that did not exist when the offense was committed? Why would IMCA be involved when this has nothing to do with meteorites or meteorite sales? Why has Mr. Arnold been banned from the IMCA group list when (according to my e-mails) - HE HAS NEVER USED IT? NOT EVEN ONE POST!! So is IMCA going to monitor posts on the LIST and put the big dealers on a sort of probation when they get into undue assaults or racial comments (I've read a lot worse than a racial slur- i.e. sexual slur) or is this just for the little new people? Do you think the same rules should apply to all members? If the IMCA is now going to concern itself with relationships as well as authenticity, I'm concerned with its new direction and to what it might lead! Did the majority of board members approve of this change? I think this situation could have been handled privately without accusations and without IMCA involvement. But now it is public and the IMCA has opened itself to a possible slander charge.. I have found Mr. Arnold very open to suggestion. He loves this group and I don't think he would intentionally hurt anyone. I don't believe he is racist. His lack of experience may irritate others, but none of us wants our freeness of speech regulated. I do not take Matteo's hurt feelings lightly unless he failed to contact Mr. Arnold to straighten things out privately. Rhettt, again if I am out of line, please correct me. (these are questions - not flames) Thanks, Ken Newton #9632 Rhett Bourland wrote: Actualy Walter, I think that Steve has confused this list with the mailing list for the IMCA. I am the one that has called him a racist because he made racist comments towards Matteo Chinellato after Matteo expressed discontent with getting Steve's multiple messages for the same material. If making racist comments towards someone isn't reason enough to call someone a racist I'm not sure what is. He almost got kicked out of the IMCA because I will not tolerate such comments among the INTERNATIONAL Meteorite Collectors Association but since there was nothing against that on the website he wasn't kicked out but if you'll check various pages there are now statements saying that such actions are now grounds for removal and I can't believe I had to actually make such statements and they are only there because Steve proved me wrong. His comments to Matteo put him on a sort of probation with the IMCA where he would be watched a bit more closely than other members. Last night, despite the following statement on the IMCA's website The purpose of the mailing list is to alert people of frauds and if a new person to wishes to join the association that we don't personally know then we will post to the list asking for any experiences that anyone has had. If you would like to post about anything meteorite related (discoveries, questions, good natured debate) that is welcomed as well. Please, DO NOT post any sales or flames to this list. There are plenty of other lists for those puposes. Failure to adhere to that rule will result in you being removed from it (but not out
Re: [meteorite-list] Cyclic mass extinction?
When Lowell spotted canals on Mars everyone though he was crazy, one hundred years ago. He was wrong, but his willingness to offer up theories lead to more exploration. That's why I find this theory interesting, because who knows where it will lead. The Iron Sun theory at least we can answer in own lifetime. -Edward Edward R. Hodges www.meteoriteonline.com IMCA #4173 - Original Message - From: Tracy Latimer [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, July 25, 2002 11:11 AM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] Cyclic mass extinction? The trouble with many of these theories (Nemesis star, iron sun, etc.) is that they are on the wacko fringe. The evidence for them is not sufficiently established yet that they can be taken as a serious challenge, which is not to say that they are completely ridiculous. There needs to be more research by independent groups, and the data need to be checked against each other and build more of a case before these theories will get anywhere near mainstream thought. Go, scientific method! Tracy Latimer __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
RE: [meteorite-list] THANKS
In a nutshell, I saw someone making comments that seemed to be belittling someone else because of the country that person lives in which were explained by Steve in a private email to me as getting carried away in the heat of battle. I took action, privately, based on those comments to make sure that a friendly atmosphere is preserved for our friends in other countries. One of those actions was basically putting someone on probation. This same person attempted to post a sales message to a list that clearly says DON'T POST SALES OR YOU WILL BE REMOVED and is removed, privately, for it. Not once did I ever make any public comments about any of this until various people started asking what he was talking about. I do apologize to anyone who doesn't care about this private matter that I would have liked to have kept that way. I stand by my actions and would do the exact same thing if I had the chance again. If anyone else has a better solution for this situation where they don't know everything that went on and should have stayed private I invite you to present it. To anyone who even cares, continue to read for an extended version of the above paragraph. In this email that Steve sent Matteo he was rather unfriendly to say the least. I don't remember the exact wording of it but I do remember that his comments were along the lines of how this is a free country and despite how it may be over in his backward country here in America he's free to say what he wants and he doesn't appreciate pizzanos like Matteo trying to tell him what to do which would hardly make it a term of endearment in this case. That certainly seemed rather racist (if for nothing other than a lack of better word) to me and also, please remember that I'm running an organization that prides itself on the fact that many people from many different countries are members. While it is true that the directors are American and most of the membership is American as well I do everything possible to make it friendly for people of all nations to not only join but feel comfortable with other members regardless of where they may be coming from. Don't get me wrong, I'm an american and wouldn't want to live anywhere else but I totally respect people from other countries. Admittedly, this doesn't involve authenticity of meteorites but what it does involve is the fact that one person is making an unfriendly enviroment for another person because that other person is from a different culture. I do apologize if I detracted from racism in its most horrible forms but please try to take into account where I'm coming from as well. Also remember that I NEVER did any of this stuff publicly until last tonight and I would have been perfectly happy keeping every single bit of it private but it was Steve who started whining to everyone else. I also did contact Steve about it and his excuse was that he just got carried away in the heat of battle. It was only after that had taken place that he started going on and on about it to other people who had no idea what he was talking about. Also keep in mind that there were no rules in place about this sort of thing only because we expected that people were above this sort of crap and they just weren't needed but apparently we were proven wrong. We will NOT be the polite police but on the other hand I will not sit idley by and let one person attempt to belittle another person because they may be from another countryand create a hostile enviroment for our friends in other countries. The reason you didn't see Steve's advertisement post on the IMCA's mailing list is because the guy's messages need approval before they are passed on to the rest of the list because of his actions with Matteo and I blocked that message. Also, as a few of you know, there have been disputes between various members of the IMCA that they wanted us to take part in and we declined because there just wasn't anything for us to do. I would ask anyone who falls in that catagory to please provide more insigtht but quite frankly, its all private and I'd like to keep it that way. If anyone else thinks they could handle all of this better I invite you to step up and take over the IMCA and all the stuff that comes with it. The pay is non existant. You'll need to have a good understanding of HTML and javascript so you can work on the website. You'll also get to make sure all the webserver and DNS stuff stays up and running. You should also be able to handle multiple emails from people who think they may have found a meteorite in their backyard and want to know how to sell their amazing finds. You will need to make this group as accomodating to people from all backgrounds as possible so that other people don't start screaming and crying that the group somehow persecutes them for whatever reasons, real or imagined. So what do you get out of all of this? The thought that somehow you may possibly be making a difference in this world and you also get to
RE: [meteorite-list] THANKS
His posts need my approval before they go out to the IMCA's mailing list because he was put on a sort of probation because of his past actions. He attempted to post a sales message to the IMCA's list despite the fact that such messages are prohibited and that message was blocked before it went out to everyone and he was subsequently removed for attempting to post a sales message. Rhett Bourland www.asteroidmodels.com www.asteroidmodels.com/personal www.meteoritecollectors.org -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Jim Strope Sent: Thursday, July 25, 2002 2:53 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] THANKS Correct me if I am wrong but I think Rhett revoked Steve's posting privileges based upon the following statement: The purpose of the mailing list is to alert people of frauds Steve decided to post another one of his sales messages for the same old material to that list and as a result got removed from the mailing list but not the IMCA. However, I went back and looked at the past messages for the groups and it seems that Steve HAS NOT posted sales messages to the collectorsassociation group mailing list. Perhaps in the flood of sales updates to other mailing lists, Rhett thought they were coming from the collectors association :D~ Jim Strope 421 Fourth Street Glen Dale, WV 26038 Catch a Falling Star Meteorites http://www.catchafallingstar.com - Original Message - From: magellon [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Sunday, August 25, 2002 2:45 PM Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] THANKS Rhett, I am really confused with this action so if I am out of line please correct me. I just want to be sure that Mr. Arnold is indeed a racist because this is a very serious charge and now his reputation is sullied by making it public. Racists slurs are very damaging and hurtful to the recipients. They should not be tolerated. However the intentions behind the slur are equally important. ( Some Afro-Americans use the n word in friendship when addressing each other but would not tolerate it from another race) So, are you sure Mr. Arnold was trying to hurt the feelings of Matteo? Are you sure Mr. Arnold is a racist? Did Matteo contact him personally first to rectify matters? Obviously Matteo must have contacted you at some time. Did you contact Mr. Arnold privately to get his side of the matter? Should Mr. Arnold be judged by rules that did not exist when the offense was committed? Why would IMCA be involved when this has nothing to do with meteorites or meteorite sales? Why has Mr. Arnold been banned from the IMCA group list when (according to my e-mails) - HE HAS NEVER USED IT? NOT EVEN ONE POST!! So is IMCA going to monitor posts on the LIST and put the big dealers on a sort of probation when they get into undue assaults or racial comments (I've read a lot worse than a racial slur- i.e. sexual slur) or is this just for the little new people? Do you think the same rules should apply to all members? If the IMCA is now going to concern itself with relationships as well as authenticity, I'm concerned with its new direction and to what it might lead! Did the majority of board members approve of this change? I think this situation could have been handled privately without accusations and without IMCA involvement. But now it is public and the IMCA has opened itself to a possible slander charge.. I have found Mr. Arnold very open to suggestion. He loves this group and I don't think he would intentionally hurt anyone. I don't believe he is racist. His lack of experience may irritate others, but none of us wants our freeness of speech regulated. I do not take Matteo's hurt feelings lightly unless he failed to contact Mr. Arnold to straighten things out privately. Rhettt, again if I am out of line, please correct me. (these are questions - not flames) Thanks, Ken Newton #9632 Rhett Bourland wrote: Actualy Walter, I think that Steve has confused this list with the mailing list for the IMCA. I am the one that has called him a racist because he made racist comments towards Matteo Chinellato after Matteo expressed discontent with getting Steve's multiple messages for the same material. If making racist comments towards someone isn't reason enough to call someone a racist I'm not sure what is. He almost got kicked out of the IMCA because I will not tolerate such comments among the INTERNATIONAL Meteorite Collectors Association but since there was nothing against that on the website he wasn't kicked out but if you'll check various pages there are now statements saying that such actions are now grounds for removal and I can't believe I had to actually make such statements and they are only there because Steve proved me wrong. His comments to Matteo put him on a sort of probation with the
RE: [meteorite-list] THANKS
Steve, I'm Irish-American but until the age of 13 lived in an all-Italian neighborhood. Rhode Island has a large Italian-American population. The word, borrowing your phonetic spelling, pie-zon-o, is spoken quite a bit around here, by both Italians and non-Italians. I've never known it to imply anything other then my good friend. Best wishes, Charlie ---BeginMessage--- Greetings all, I don't want to speak for Steve Arnold, but I believe there has been a misunderstanding. If the racist comment is his use of the word pizzano, it was misinterpreted. The word he was trying to convey was (I don't know the spelling so will write it phoenitically) pie-zon-o. Which from what he (Steve) thinks and from what I've always thought, is a word meaning my friend or something to that effect. Maybe I've always misunderstood the word and it is racist, but I've heard it used quite a bit as a term of endearment. When I met Steve he was truly upset and didn't understand why Matteo was mad at him. I honestly believe that no foul was intended. thanx, Steve --- Greg Redfern [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Rhett, Me too. It is a rare commodity in this world. Keep up the great work. One GOOD thing is that the rules for governing both lists were made stronger by all of this. All the best, Greg Redfern IMCA #5781 www.meteoritecollectors.org -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Walter Branch Sent: Wednesday, July 24, 2002 8:40 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] THANKS Rhett, Thanks very much for the explanation. I appreciate your honesty and candor. -Walter --- Walter Branch, Ph.D. Branch Meteorites 322 Stephenson Ave., Suite B Savannah, GA 31405 USA www.branchmeteorites.com - Original Message - From: Rhett Bourland [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Walter Branch [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Steve Arnold, Chicago!!! [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, July 24, 2002 8:27 PM Subject: RE: [meteorite-list] THANKS Actualy Walter, I think that Steve has confused this list with the mailing list for the IMCA. I am the one that has called him a racist because he made racist comments towards Matteo Chinellato after Matteo expressed discontent with getting Steve's multiple messages for the same material. If making racist comments towards someone isn't reason enough to call someone a racist I'm not sure what is. He almost got kicked out of the IMCA because I will not tolerate such comments among the INTERNATIONAL Meteorite Collectors Association but since there was nothing against that on the website he wasn't kicked out but if you'll check various pages there are now statements saying that such actions are now grounds for removal and I can't believe I had to actually make such statements and they are only there because Steve proved me wrong. His comments to Matteo put him on a sort of probation with the IMCA where he would be watched a bit more closely than other members. Last night, despite the following statement on the IMCA's website The purpose of the mailing list is to alert people of frauds and if a new person to wishes to join the association that we don't personally know then we will post to the list asking for any experiences that anyone has had. If you would like to post about anything meteorite related (discoveries, questions, good natured debate) that is welcomed as well. Please, DO NOT post any sales or flames to this list. There are plenty of other lists for those puposes. Failure to adhere to that rule will result in you being removed from it (but not out of the group). Steve decided to post another one of his sales messages for the same old material to that list and as a result got removed from the mailing list but not the IMCA. Also, despite what Mr. Arnold may think, I do not hate him. I don't particulary care for him because of his comments to Matteo as well as some rather rude comments that have been made to other people off list that I have been told about but I do not care for him because of those actions. I apologize to anyone who may not care about this but I wanted to go on the record as being the one who called Steve a racist because of his racist comments made towards Matteo. Perhaps Matteo would be willing to shed a little light on this issue? Sincerely, Rhett Bourland www.asteroidmodels.com www.asteroidmodels.com/personal www.meteoritecollectors.org -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Walter Branch Sent: Wednesday, July 24, 2002 7:02 PM To: Steve Arnold, Chicago!!!; [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [meteorite-list] THANKS Steve, The only person who could kick you off the list is Art Jones, the list
[meteorite-list] (no subject)
Hi everybody.. I am looking for gem cases to put some of my meteorites in. I thought I saw someone offering some for sale a while back. Does anyone have them for sale or have an idea where I might buy them? Thanks Rosie
Re: [meteorite-list] Torino Scale
Bernd, House-sized chunks of rock would be tossed hundreds of miles and our atmosphere would be saturated with dust for years. This would be bad... Thanks for all the information. -Walter --- Walter Branch, Ph.D. Branch Meteorites 322 Stephenson Ave., Suite B Savannah, GA 31405 USA www.branchmeteorites.com - Original Message - From: Bernd Pauli HD [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: meteorite-list [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, July 25, 2002 2:45 PM Subject: [meteorite-list] Torino Scale Walter wrote: how large does an object have to be for it not to vaporize completely upon plunging through Earth's atmosphere, i.e., for there to be anything sizeable left to cause wide destruction once it hits the ground (or water)? Hello Again, According to G. Verschuur, the consequences may be something like: Very Large (10 km) - Global - Mass extinctions Large (2-10 km) - Global - Some extinctions Medium (0.2-2 km) - Regional - Threat to civilisation Small (30-200 m) - Local - Severe Very Small (10-30 m) - Local - Minor If a really big one hit the Earth, as big as the the impactor that killed the dinosaurs (10-15 km), its destructive force and the conse- quences would be horrifying. It would hit us with the force of about 100 million megatons of TNT - this is more than 10,000 times the entire arsenal of nuclear weapons. If it plunged into an ocean, there would be tsunamis hundreds of feet high. House-sized chunks of rock would be tossed hundreds of miles and our atmosphere would be saturated with dust for years. Best regards, Bernd __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] Cyclic mass extinction?
Hi Al, Tracy, Edward and others interested in the mass extinction periodicity problem... For newcomers, we had a brief exchange on this subject about a year and a half ago. Here's an excerpt from one of my posts in reply to Sam Kimpton: Matson 1/22/2001: - I've heard various figures, with several million year error bars, but there does seem to be some evidence of periodicity. Naturally, one would like to identify the 'trigger'. ... the proposed Nemesis star would have to be a red dwarf or a brown dwarf. It would not be that difficult with current technology to see such a star at aphelion (which is about where the star would be for the current cycle). But simply observing the star is only part of the battle; the hard part is observing it for a long enough baseline to determine that it is co-orbiting with the sun. Phil Bagnall once e-mailed me that the proposed orbit of this star would have to be so elongated that it would not remain stable (and that the orbit could not have survived for the duration of the Solar System). He may be correct -- I cannot say without seeing the model assumptions and the resulting data. A 26-million-year period requires an orbital semi-major axis of 87,760 a.u. Assuming the orbit is extremely elliptical, and the star is currently at aphelion, its distance would be twice this, or ~175,500 a.u. This is about 2.8 light-years -- more than half the distance to the nearest known star system. Depending on the plane of the orbit relative to Alpha-, Beta- and Proxima Centauri (and/or possibly Barnard's star, Wolf 359, and the other 6 stars within 10 light-years of the solar system), the orbit might be unstable. At best it is chaotic long-term because of the gravitational perturbations of the Centaurus trinary system. But suppose perihelion lies between our solar system and Centaurus. If so, it would take quite some time (tens of orbits, more?) before the line of apsides would precess to bring aphelion in the direction of Centaurus. If the Nemesis period has remained at roughly 26 million years, then there hasn't been time for even 200 orbits. - - - - Now, in 2002, I'd say it's highly unlikely that a dwarf companion to the sun -- even in such a highly elliptical orbit -- would have evaded detection by Hubble or other telescopes. Others have theorized that the sun's orbit around the galactic center causes it to periodically pass through the galactic plane (presumably twice per orbit -- one ascending node, one descending node), and that this plane passage somehow perturbs comets in the Oort cloud leading to increased chaos and impacts in the inner solar system. But I see two problems with this theory, which perhaps someone out there can help me with. One is that this plane passage is really a non-event; the local stellar density really doesn't oscillate that much since the galactic plane is not really a plane in the geometric sense. It has considerable thickness -- on the order of 2000 light-years. The sun is currently only ~50 light-years north of the galactic plane, so the local stellar density is about as thick as it gets. Unless the sun's orbit takes it far above and below the plane (say +/- 500 light-years), it doesn't seem like the density is going to oscillate much. I considered that it might not be the plane crossings of a slightly inclined solar orbit that produces the disruptions, but the periapsis of a slightly eccentric orbit that takes the sun closer to the denser galactic center once per orbit. The problem with this is that the sun's orbit around the galactic center is almost perfectly circular. But the second (and larger) problem is that even if there is a galactic carousel effect, the period is wrong. The sun orbits the galactic plane about once every 225-250 million years, so plane crossings would occur every 112-125 million years (and periapsis once every 225-250 million years). Not a good match to the much shorter extinction cycle. What about the spiral arms? Passage through these, I think, would have a much more disruptive effect. But from what I've read, this occurs very rarely since the sun is at a distance from the galactic center that has an orbital period very close to that of the spiral arms. So the question remains: what sort of natural events can occur that have a periodicity of ~26 million years? Gravitational laws place limits on the range of a sun-orbiting trigger -- something in the 1.5 to 3 light-year range. Gravimetric events associated with motion through the galactic plane appear to have periods much longer than the observed mass-extinction period. It's an interesting problem... --Rob __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
[meteorite-list] dry gas for irons?
Good evening Listees, Anybody know whether there are brands of pressurized air cans (as used to blow dust out of computers, off photo negs, etc) that features a dry gas suitable for displacing the air and preserving iron meteorites in sealed containers? Most, if not all cans tout that they are HCFC and CFC-free, but no other info. Seems like an easy way to give those irons some added protection if you can go to Office Max and get a squirt can of air for a few bucks to shoot into those sealed baggies and display boxes we all have. Best, Dave and Sarah __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Cyclic mass extinction?
Hi: Actually, there's even some skepticism about whether or not the 26 million year periodicity is even real. It's certainly not clockwork. Scientific American has some interesting stuff about this at http://www.sciam.com/askexpert_topic.cfm?topicID=22. Scroll down the page about 2/3 of the way and look for the FAQ question about it. There are a couple of other questions there that some listees might find of interest, too. Dave Hostetter Curator of the Planetarium Lafayette (LA) Natural History Museum and Planetarium Hi Al, Tracy, Edward and others interested in the mass extinction periodicity problem... __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] Praise well deserved
Hi Steve and list, I'll easily second your sentiments on Rob, I've ordered a number of meteorites from him in the last few years and he's very quick at shipping and very helpful as well. I've ordered from quite a few people from this list (not everyone...YET!) and everyone was quick with shipping and very nice and helpful. Al Mitterling is another great dealer, Mike Farmer, Mike Blood, Mike Cottingham (Is there a pattern here?!), Eric Twelker, etc. I don't want to leave anyone out as I'd imagine all others on the list are great as well. Eventually I'll be getting something from everyone but I've only got so much money to spread around. I think everyone has their favorite dealer(s) but to avoid trouble I'll keep mine to myself. ;) Regards, Tom Randall IMCA # 6170 Greetings List, In the past when I've gotten good customer service from a meteorite dealer I've posted kudos to that specific dealer. I think we should share our good experiences. I must admit that I've always been a little tentative about ordering from dealers across the Big Pond. My thought was that the delivery would take forever or get lost or never show up at all. I recently had the priviledge of meeting Rob Elliot (Fernlea Meteorites) in the Chicago area. I found him to be a very down to earth, personable gentleman. He explained his shipping policies to me and I was quite surprised. He told me that orders from him in the U.K. usually got to their destinations, in the U.S. faster than state to state shipments here in our own country. I have to admit, I was a bit skeptical. I'd had my eye on a nice slice of Cumberland Falls on Rob's site for some time and made the decision this past Sunday to go for it. Order placed Sunday afternoon. Rob notified me that the specimen would ship Monday 7/22. The Cumberland Falls specimen was safely in my hands this afternoon Weds 7/24/ at 1:30 P.M. Central. Less than 48 hours from the U.K. to my front door. This to me is phenominal service. Packaging was above and beyond what was needed to ensure that the specimen arrived in one piece, and the Cumberland is absolutely beautiful! Thanks Rob! I now think I had a pre-conceived prejudice that ordering from overseas simply wouldn't work. I now know better. I have to say that this was the most professional, time efficinet and best packaged purchase that I've made in the four years that I've been collecting. If you've been hesitant about ordering from Rob because he's overseas, there's absollutely no need to be. Give him a try. I know you'll be very pleasantly surprised. I know I was. Thanx, Steve = Steve Witt IMCA #9020 http://www.meteoritecollectors.org __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Health - Feel better, live better http://health.yahoo.com __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list -- __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
Re: [meteorite-list] THANKS
Rhett, I am even more confused? Steve said "pisano" in a private e-mail that Matteo made public... Then Steve admits his mistake to you privately, and you then teach him a lesson by putting him on "probation"? Does he still receive posts from the IMCA group site? Or did you stop those? If he admitted he was mad and wrong, why punish him? He's not racist - He was just being mad and wrong. Rhett, I may not know the whole story but I know this was between two people. Why are you bringing the IMCA into this? To establish "peace" is NOT a good reason. The IMCA is for the authenticity of meteorites "period". Are things more peaceful now? You know as well as anyone that people get mad and say things they should not. First, it is up to the two individuals to try to straighten things out on their own. It saddens me that you say you would do it again. Rhett, this appears not be a matter of racism but more an excuse to push someone around you admittedly don't like. No? Just substitute any other big dealer in Steve's place. If Mike Farmer (not picking on you Mike :>) had said this to Matteo, would you have reacted the same way? If you answer "yes," then why haven't you in the past? You can not force people to be nice but they can learn from your good example. You have kindly and privately reproved me when I broke IMCA rules. So, I know you can create a harmonious environment when you try without changing the path of IMCA. I could not understand from your comment if the board had any say so in the new change to IMCA or not? It sounded as if you did it on your own. Does the board no longer make these type of policy changing decisions? Please don't start talking about quitting like you did before. We all appreciate your past achievements. But, If you are serious (which I doubt), I will be glad accept the position. (thank you) Best case scenario, I would share it with Jake Delgato or another member) Thanks, Ken Newton How fights get started #9632
[meteorite-list] ATTENTION: MeteoriteCollectors List Update
Hello everyone. I have been away from meteorites and these lists for almost a year. I do not know everything that has taken place or what was said. Several members of our community brought to my attention that one of our members was using language and making comments on the list that are unfit for our meteorite community. Please remember, there are children on these lists. It's our responsibility to set a good example for the future generations of meteorite collectors. Joel Warren has been permantly removed and banned from the MeteoriteCollectors list. Also, in the future, any comments about how I maintain the MeteoriteCollectors list should be made to me in private. If you don't like something I'm doing (or not doing), please email me privately to discuss it. Thank you for your time. Sincerely, Brice D. Hornback http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MeteoriteCollectors/ __ Meteorite-list mailing list [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/meteorite-list
