Re: [nycwireless] Re: Of no commercial value(?)
I think just *having* the access is a step in the right direction for these communities - I spent 2 years living in bedford-stuyvesant(sp?) and in that time met quite a few people who actually had hardware that could work on such a network (though they lacked the wireless pcmcia or pci cards) - partnering with other groups and institutions that have unwanted computers would probably help as well - my employer literally throws away hundreds of useable machines every year, and I'm sure many others have similar situations. How feasible would it be to harvest these puppies and build up a small stock of NYCWireless workstations and put them in community access locations? I also wonder how cheap it would be to provide barebones laptops for people - I realize even 100 dollars is a lot of money for someone on a fixed income, but there *must* be other groups trying to do this in the city :) This does sound like an exciting thing to do though! -Original Message- From: "Darrel O'Pry" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Date: Mon, 09 Aug 2004 16:22:59 To:"'Anthony Townsend'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: [nycwireless] Re: Of no commercial value(?) I think it would be nice to contact community oriented places such as Taino Towers up in Harlem around 2nd Ave & 120 st There are four tall building, with excellent line of sight in upper Manhattan. I'd think a group like NYC wireless introducing the idea of free wireless internet access to their community and providing resources for education, outreach, youth activities groups, communications tools would be considered. I think contacting groups that represent immigrant interests would also be interested in providing infrastructure for new immigrants to communicates with their families in friends still in their countries of origin, opening up access to resources that could help some new immigrants learn thr truth of what needs to be done to become a citizen instead of taking the hearsay they get on the street for truth. However I have some concerns with the idea of moving outside of the places and communities that have been targeted. Sure many people in Manhattan own laptops, wifi cards, and are knowledgeable of wireless networks. If you are looking to move the focus away from "providing network access to the rich folk of Manhattan who could afford it anyway" to paraphrase something I remember reading, probably completely in accurate, to finding other underserved communities. Who in these other communities, if they couldn't afford the luxury of for pay wireless network access, could afford the luxury of a laptop, or nice computer, with wifi hardware? While I'm in love with the concept of ubiquitous network access, are there underserved communities that have demand for it? Can the demand be built? Will it benefit the community, or encourage gentrification and its impact on cost of living? I think effectively targeting low-income neighborhoods will require going beyond just setting up a hotspot. I see those neighbor hoods as having more of a need for wireless bridging and shared internet access to make it cost efficient to provide access to the community as a whole. I think meshing would be a good idea in those neighborhoods. If funding can be found it may also be a way to put computers into the homes of people who could benefit from them, but cannot afford them and build out a wireless network by placing nodes in the homes of people who volunteer to help setup and manage the mesh node. Maybe make it some sort of contest. Win a free computer, as long as you're willing to participate in the wireless mesh for the time you have it. If you choose not to participate the computer must be returned or paid for. Ok I'm rambling. I'll bugger off now. ---Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:nycwireless- > [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Anthony Townsend > Sent: Sunday, August 08, 2004 7:56 AM > To: Rob Kelley > Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: Re: [nycwireless] Re: Of no commercial value(?) > > i think what they meant is that we should confine our proposal to > neighborhoods that are not likely to attract commercial wireless > carriers in the near- to mid-range future > > On Aug 8, 2004, at 4:42 PM, Rob Kelley wrote: > > >> only if its something that they can show has no > >> commercial value (otherwise the city would get sued by the people who > > paid for franchises). > > > > Anthony: > > > > That's a hard one. What product of benefit to a community does not > > have > > some "commercial value"? Something the user couldn't afford on the > > open > > market? Something that is not currently sold in any market? Art? > > > > Can you give some general examp
RE: [nycwireless] Re: Of no commercial value(?)
I think it would be nice to contact community oriented places such as Taino Towers up in Harlem around 2nd Ave & 120 st There are four tall building, with excellent line of sight in upper Manhattan. I'd think a group like NYC wireless introducing the idea of free wireless internet access to their community and providing resources for education, outreach, youth activities groups, communications tools would be considered. I think contacting groups that represent immigrant interests would also be interested in providing infrastructure for new immigrants to communicates with their families in friends still in their countries of origin, opening up access to resources that could help some new immigrants learn thr truth of what needs to be done to become a citizen instead of taking the hearsay they get on the street for truth. However I have some concerns with the idea of moving outside of the places and communities that have been targeted. Sure many people in Manhattan own laptops, wifi cards, and are knowledgeable of wireless networks. If you are looking to move the focus away from "providing network access to the rich folk of Manhattan who could afford it anyway" to paraphrase something I remember reading, probably completely in accurate, to finding other underserved communities. Who in these other communities, if they couldn't afford the luxury of for pay wireless network access, could afford the luxury of a laptop, or nice computer, with wifi hardware? While I'm in love with the concept of ubiquitous network access, are there underserved communities that have demand for it? Can the demand be built? Will it benefit the community, or encourage gentrification and its impact on cost of living? I think effectively targeting low-income neighborhoods will require going beyond just setting up a hotspot. I see those neighbor hoods as having more of a need for wireless bridging and shared internet access to make it cost efficient to provide access to the community as a whole. I think meshing would be a good idea in those neighborhoods. If funding can be found it may also be a way to put computers into the homes of people who could benefit from them, but cannot afford them and build out a wireless network by placing nodes in the homes of people who volunteer to help setup and manage the mesh node. Maybe make it some sort of contest. Win a free computer, as long as you're willing to participate in the wireless mesh for the time you have it. If you choose not to participate the computer must be returned or paid for. Ok I'm rambling. I'll bugger off now. ---Original Message- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:nycwireless- > [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Anthony Townsend > Sent: Sunday, August 08, 2004 7:56 AM > To: Rob Kelley > Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: Re: [nycwireless] Re: Of no commercial value(?) > > i think what they meant is that we should confine our proposal to > neighborhoods that are not likely to attract commercial wireless > carriers in the near- to mid-range future > > On Aug 8, 2004, at 4:42 PM, Rob Kelley wrote: > > >> only if its something that they can show has no > >> commercial value (otherwise the city would get sued by the people who > > paid for franchises). > > > > Anthony: > > > > That's a hard one. What product of benefit to a community does not > > have > > some "commercial value"? Something the user couldn't afford on the > > open > > market? Something that is not currently sold in any market? Art? > > > > Can you give some general examples? > > > > Thanks, > > > > Rob > > > > > > -- > > NYCwireless - http://www.nycwireless.net/ > > Un/Subscribe: > > http://lists.nycwireless.net/mailman/listinfo/nycwireless/ > > Archives: http://lists.nycwireless.net/pipermail/nycwireless/ > > > > -- > NYCwireless - http://www.nycwireless.net/ > Un/Subscribe: http://lists.nycwireless.net/mailman/listinfo/nycwireless/ > Archives: http://lists.nycwireless.net/pipermail/nycwireless/ -- NYCwireless - http://www.nycwireless.net/ Un/Subscribe: http://lists.nycwireless.net/mailman/listinfo/nycwireless/ Archives: http://lists.nycwireless.net/pipermail/nycwireless/
Re: [nycwireless] Re: Of no commercial value(?)
On Sun, 8 Aug 2004, Rob Kelley wrote: > > only if its something that they can show has no commercial value > > (otherwise the city would get sued by the people who > paid for franchises). > > Anthony: > > That's a hard one. What product of benefit to a community does not have > some "commercial value"? Something the user couldn't afford on the open > market? Something that is not currently sold in any market? Art? I *suppose* if you don't try to charge for the service, that would qualify. > Can you give some general examples? -- NYCwireless - http://www.nycwireless.net/ Un/Subscribe: http://lists.nycwireless.net/mailman/listinfo/nycwireless/ Archives: http://lists.nycwireless.net/pipermail/nycwireless/
Re: [nycwireless] Re: Of no commercial value(?)
i think what they meant is that we should confine our proposal to neighborhoods that are not likely to attract commercial wireless carriers in the near- to mid-range future On Aug 8, 2004, at 4:42 PM, Rob Kelley wrote: only if its something that they can show has no commercial value (otherwise the city would get sued by the people who paid for franchises). Anthony: That's a hard one. What product of benefit to a community does not have some "commercial value"? Something the user couldn't afford on the open market? Something that is not currently sold in any market? Art? Can you give some general examples? Thanks, Rob -- NYCwireless - http://www.nycwireless.net/ Un/Subscribe: http://lists.nycwireless.net/mailman/listinfo/nycwireless/ Archives: http://lists.nycwireless.net/pipermail/nycwireless/ -- NYCwireless - http://www.nycwireless.net/ Un/Subscribe: http://lists.nycwireless.net/mailman/listinfo/nycwireless/ Archives: http://lists.nycwireless.net/pipermail/nycwireless/
[nycwireless] Re: Of no commercial value(?)
> only if its something that they can show has no > commercial value (otherwise the city would get sued by the people who paid for franchises). Anthony: That's a hard one. What product of benefit to a community does not have some "commercial value"? Something the user couldn't afford on the open market? Something that is not currently sold in any market? Art? Can you give some general examples? Thanks, Rob -- NYCwireless - http://www.nycwireless.net/ Un/Subscribe: http://lists.nycwireless.net/mailman/listinfo/nycwireless/ Archives: http://lists.nycwireless.net/pipermail/nycwireless/
