date:20021112

That winface article makes a good read.

Thanks!

Patrice.

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 7:09 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Firstly, can I say that any NT/2K administrator that feels they need to
install Microsoft Office (or just Outlook), and feels they need to upgrade
the web browser for a production Oracle database system should be shot on
site! The same goes for things like IIS (Microsoft's integrated web
server) as this again is a known security flaw.. Apache runs just fine on
Win2K (Oracle installs it on the windows platform as well). The same also
goes for Perl, and I believe Jared is most surely a Perl man!

There is also no longer a 4 CPU limit on windows systems. This does of
course depend upon the version of the Operating system that you buy, but
Win2K Datacentre Server supports up to 16CPUs.
(http://www.winntmag.com/Articles/Index.cfm?ArticleID=7597)

I stumbled across the following link a couple of weeks ago Jared, and
book-marked it for later reading.. I still haven't managed to read it as
yet, so can't comment, but it looks like it applies..

http://www.winface.com/article.html

Apart from the other URLs that you have already posted, I haven't seen any
decent comparison sites out there.

HTH

Mark

-Original Message-
Morrow
Sent: 12 November 2002 06:38
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Jared --

I tend to agree with your statements.  Although, personally, I tend to think
that Windows NT/2000/XP is a wholly inappropriate environment for any
enterprise
database.  The general reasons I tend to choose to back my statements:

1.  Scalability.  (I'm sorry, clustering is an availability solution,
not a scalability one.  If you can't grow beyond 4 CPUs [Intel's
problem
more than M$FT's, here] and need to, then an Intel platform is not
for
you.)

2.  Managibility.  I can do practically anything I need to on a unix box
over a 300bps modem, if necessary.  (This omits, of course,
inserting
media and hitting the power switch... oh, and installing oracle now
that
they have this java-based installer... fortunately, that's not
*that*
common of an occurance in ordinary maintenance)

3.  Did I mention scalability?  Most *nix platforms scale in a much more
linear fashion.  (i.e. 2 cpu's are more likely to give you double
the
performance on a RISC-based system than on an x86 based one.)  Note:
I'm saying only that RISC systems tend to be *more* linear than x86
ones.

4.  Supportability.  (yeah, I know, not really a word).  I've supported
Oracle on both (especially Oracle Applications).  Personally, unix
platforms tend to provide much more useful information when
something
does go wrong.  The standard Microsoft error message of it's broke
doesn't really tell me anything useful.

5.  Security.  How many security flaws have been found in 'doze?  And
don't
even get me started on M$FT Look-out!  (otherwise known as a
security
hole that occasionally delivers mail).  It's also nice that *nix
platforms are immune to all of the _really_common_ virii that hit
the
news these days (Melissa, I Love You, etc.).  (Not that *nix is
truly
immune to virii... but the big-bad-ugly-ones you hear about tend to
exploit flaws in... hows that again?  Right... Windows and
Lookout...
Although it helps somewhat that the *nix security model tends to
compartmentalize things a bit more than windows does [by default]).

6.  Do you *really* want all of the overhead of a tightly-coupled GUI on
a
_server_?

Admittedly, Windows 2000 does appear to be far more stable than previous
versions.  And the NT-derivatives don't tend to crash in a wholesale manner
like
the Windows/386 derivatives ('95,'98,ME).  But, personally, I should _NEVER_
have to reboot a machine to upgrade/patch a web browser.

-- James


==
James J. Morrow
Nascent Systems, Inc.
Dallas, TX
mailto:jmorrow;warthog.com

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Dear List,

 Believe me, I am not trying to rehash an old topic, start any
 flame wars, nor look for supporting evidence for my admitted
 bias toward unix operating systems.

 Now that that's out of the way, what I am trying to do is find
 objective material comparing the use of MS Windows 2000
 Server on Intel HW to Solaris on Sun HW.

 This is for an SAP implementation.  We are currently running
 SAP 4.0b on MS NT 4.0 SP 6, on Dell 4 CPU Servers. ( I forget
 just which server )

 As part of our process to upgrade the system to 4.6c and more
 recent versions of Oracle ( like 8.1.7 ), we are trying to do a
 comparison of the features, benefits and advantages of using
 Win2k Server and Solaris.

 Please don't refer me to such sites as www.kirch.net and
 www.osdata.com.   The information at

RE: cant set multiblock read count 8 !!!

Rahul
   Check out http://www.ixora.com.au/tips/max_multiblock_read.htm
Steve Adams mentions The first trap to be aware of is that Oracle does not
complain about attempts to set the multiblock read count to values that are
larger than the maximum value allowed under the operating system

Dennis Williams
DBA, 40%OCP
Lifetouch, Inc.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 


-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 3:11 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


list !!
my ora7.3.2 instance on AIX with a db_block_size of 4k has a 
multi block read count of 16 !! 

i thought i would create a new instance with a block size of 8k, so i can
set 
the max multiblock read count to more than 16, BUT, after creating the new
instance
the db_multiblock_read_count *always* defaults to 8 !! 

here the new instance params

db_files = 16
db_file_multiblock_read_count = 32
db_block_buffers = 3840
db_file_simultaneous_writes = 8
db_block_lru_latches = 8
shared_pool_size = 31457280

which of these parameter is affecting the value of multiblock read count ???


TIA
Rahul

PS: i hv checked the multiblock reads using ixora script... always 8 !!



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Oracle locale builder.

2002-11-12 Thread Hatzistavrou Giannis


Dear All,

I am trying to create a new character set using the Oracle locale builder
tool. When i use as a basis character set EL8ISO8859P7 then the new
character set is created as expected to be. However when I use as basis the
AL32UTF8 it is not created giving me an error :

NLB access for this character set is not supported in this release.


Is there a patch that must be applied?

Current version 9.2.0.1 

 Kind Regards,
 
 
 Hatzistavrou Yannis
 
 
 
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RE: Oracle taking 100% CPU

Hussain - Once you clear up some archive space, Oracle will resume
immediately. You don't need to bounce the database. 
   What is the system doing besides taking 100% cpu? W2K Task Manager offers
much more information, like I/O activity and CPU by process. This may
provide more clues.
   Normally Oracle will take care of itself without intervention. My first
thought is that you had a lot of pending work since it couldn't archive.
Then you killed sessions which means Oracle must roll back transactions.
Offhand it sounds like Oracle is still recovering. Look for heavy disk
activity.



Dennis Williams 
DBA, 40%OCP 
Lifetouch, Inc. 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 4:19 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



HI all, 

We have a development server, a replica of the production. Some process
produced a lot of archives and it ran out of archiving space. Now it was the
only location specified for the archives and it was mandatory. So when no
space was left on it to store the newly produced archives, it should have
stopped working. But it didn't. I deleted the archives and closed every
session and shut down the database and restarted it. But eversince I
restarted it, (and I have done it 3-4 times already) Oracle is using
100%CPU. I have left the server on, without any body connecting to it,
(users can connect as the database is OPEN without any problem, its just
some transaction-cleaning or background process which is going on) but the
server remains unchanged i.e. using 100% for over an hour (after an hour I
shut it down and restarted and it still is the same)

There is no unusual entry in the alert lofile or any trace files. I can't do
any query to find out anything, as the system is so slow. There is no
problem of space either. Event viewer of Win2000 also shows nothing
unusual or new.

Any ideas, its somewhat urgent. 

Hussain 

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Rollback Segment Size Testing.

2002-11-12 Thread chao_ping

hi, list friends:
I am interested in that 
topic:http://www.ioug.org/ioug_s/repository_pkg.doc?v_tech_content_dtl_phy_id=7666
I am also considering whether too large rbs segment size does have adverse 
impact on database performance. In my production (OLTP) i configured rbs to be 1m*20 
extents. But from v$rollstat and statspack, the average active size is 1.5M. I am 
considering whether it is too large and shrink it to 128k*20 will help.(but hard to 
find out the performance gains as it is a big system).
If anyone in this list have IOUG membership, can you send me a copy? And i 
hope friends have experience on this topic can share your experience





Regards
zhu chao
Eachnet DBA
86-21-32174588-667
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
www.cnoug.org(Chinese Oracle User Group)


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RE: Solaris vs Windows 2000

Jared - It sounds like your system is performing as desired and your
organization is able to support it well. The issues I would see are:
  1. Would your sys admins be able to support Solaris as well?
  2. What is the future growth projections? A new version of SAP will
probably require more processing. Does the organization plan to grow much in
the future? Are there other SAP functions they plan to implement? Usually an
ERP system is at the heart of an organization and most organizations don't
like to risk being constrained by a tapped-out server. As an example, I have
seen a Microsoft email server nearly strangle an organization until the MS
admins figure out how to reorganize the email system into separate servers.
Panic city. 
  3. I don't think you will find too many objective comparisons of W2K vs.
Solaris. However, a Sun dealer might be willing to bring in a test system
for you to try and compare if you wanted to go to that much effort.

-Original Message-
Sent: Monday, November 11, 2002 5:14 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Dear List,

Believe me, I am not trying to rehash an old topic, start any
flame wars, nor look for supporting evidence for my admitted
bias toward unix operating systems.

Now that that's out of the way, what I am trying to do is find
objective material comparing the use of MS Windows 2000
Server on Intel HW to Solaris on Sun HW.

This is for an SAP implementation.  We are currently running
SAP 4.0b on MS NT 4.0 SP 6, on Dell 4 CPU Servers. ( I forget
just which server )

As part of our process to upgrade the system to 4.6c and more
recent versions of Oracle ( like 8.1.7 ), we are trying to do a 
comparison of the features, benefits and advantages of using
Win2k Server and Solaris.

Please don't refer me to such sites as www.kirch.net and
www.osdata.com.   The information at www.kirch.net is dated
and applies to NT, not Win2k. 

osdata.com is a nice site, but doesn't really offer comparisons,
just information on each OS. 

There is quite a bit of material available at www.microsoft.com.

Try:  http://www.microsoft.com/windows2000/server/evaluation/compare/

PC Mag has a nice article comparing different platforms for use as a 
webserver: http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,4149,6615,00.asp

They actually chose IBM running Windows 2000.

Windows 2000 is in use here as a server platform for one database that
is used as the backend to a rather troublesome application.  The Win2k
server is running Oracle 8.1.6.2.  The database has been bounced 2 or
3 times in the last year. 

Once was to clear up a strange but non-fatal problem with Oracle.  That 
was
back in July, the previous system restart had been in December 2001. 
Server
and database were up without interruption for 7 months.

Though I prefer Solaris,  I'm having a difficult time coming up with many 
valid
reasons for recommending it over Win2k.

A few that I do have:

Sun service is superior to Dell service.  They've proven this to us.  ( We 
have other
Sun machines in house )

Sun scales better.  At least on 32 bits.  We're at 4 CPU's.  If we need to 
go past that
I would think we should go with Sun.  I don't know about Win2k Advanced 
Server, as it
is a 64 bit platform, and I think the licensing would go up quite a bit.

I welcome all objective comparisons of Solaris and Win2k Server, whether 
your own
thoughts, or a link or links to articles you are aware of.

Thanks,

Jared






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RE: Solaris vs Windows 2000

2002-11-12 Thread Jenner Mike

Cheers Mark,
That's a very interesting look on the issue. Give it a read!

-Original Message-
Sent: 12 November 2002 11:09
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Firstly, can I say that any NT/2K administrator that feels they need to
install Microsoft Office (or just Outlook), and feels they need to upgrade
the web browser for a production Oracle database system should be shot on
site! The same goes for things like IIS (Microsoft's integrated web
server) as this again is a known security flaw.. Apache runs just fine on
Win2K (Oracle installs it on the windows platform as well). The same also
goes for Perl, and I believe Jared is most surely a Perl man!

There is also no longer a 4 CPU limit on windows systems. This does of
course depend upon the version of the Operating system that you buy, but
Win2K Datacentre Server supports up to 16CPUs.
(http://www.winntmag.com/Articles/Index.cfm?ArticleID=7597)

I stumbled across the following link a couple of weeks ago Jared, and
book-marked it for later reading.. I still haven't managed to read it as
yet, so can't comment, but it looks like it applies..

http://www.winface.com/article.html

Apart from the other URLs that you have already posted, I haven't seen any
decent comparison sites out there.

HTH

Mark

-Original Message-
Morrow
Sent: 12 November 2002 06:38
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Jared --

I tend to agree with your statements.  Although, personally, I tend to think
that Windows NT/2000/XP is a wholly inappropriate environment for any
enterprise
database.  The general reasons I tend to choose to back my statements:

1.  Scalability.  (I'm sorry, clustering is an availability solution,
not a scalability one.  If you can't grow beyond 4 CPUs [Intel's
problem
more than M$FT's, here] and need to, then an Intel platform is not
for
you.)

2.  Managibility.  I can do practically anything I need to on a unix box
over a 300bps modem, if necessary.  (This omits, of course,
inserting
media and hitting the power switch... oh, and installing oracle now
that
they have this java-based installer... fortunately, that's not
*that*
common of an occurance in ordinary maintenance)

3.  Did I mention scalability?  Most *nix platforms scale in a much more
linear fashion.  (i.e. 2 cpu's are more likely to give you double
the
performance on a RISC-based system than on an x86 based one.)  Note:
I'm saying only that RISC systems tend to be *more* linear than x86
ones.

4.  Supportability.  (yeah, I know, not really a word).  I've supported
Oracle on both (especially Oracle Applications).  Personally, unix
platforms tend to provide much more useful information when
something
does go wrong.  The standard Microsoft error message of it's broke
doesn't really tell me anything useful.

5.  Security.  How many security flaws have been found in 'doze?  And
don't
even get me started on M$FT Look-out!  (otherwise known as a
security
hole that occasionally delivers mail).  It's also nice that *nix
platforms are immune to all of the _really_common_ virii that hit
the
news these days (Melissa, I Love You, etc.).  (Not that *nix is
truly
immune to virii... but the big-bad-ugly-ones you hear about tend to
exploit flaws in... hows that again?  Right... Windows and
Lookout...
Although it helps somewhat that the *nix security model tends to
compartmentalize things a bit more than windows does [by default]).

6.  Do you *really* want all of the overhead of a tightly-coupled GUI on
a
_server_?

Admittedly, Windows 2000 does appear to be far more stable than previous
versions.  And the NT-derivatives don't tend to crash in a wholesale manner
like
the Windows/386 derivatives ('95,'98,ME).  But, personally, I should _NEVER_
have to reboot a machine to upgrade/patch a web browser.

-- James


==
James J. Morrow
Nascent Systems, Inc.
Dallas, TX
mailto:jmorrow;warthog.com

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Dear List,

 Believe me, I am not trying to rehash an old topic, start any
 flame wars, nor look for supporting evidence for my admitted
 bias toward unix operating systems.

 Now that that's out of the way, what I am trying to do is find
 objective material comparing the use of MS Windows 2000
 Server on Intel HW to Solaris on Sun HW.

 This is for an SAP implementation.  We are currently running
 SAP 4.0b on MS NT 4.0 SP 6, on Dell 4 CPU Servers. ( I forget
 just which server )

 As part of our process to upgrade the system to 4.6c and more
 recent versions of Oracle ( like 8.1.7 ), we are trying to do a
 comparison of the features, benefits and advantages of using
 Win2k Server and Solaris.

 Please don't refer me to such sites as www.kirch.net and
 www.osdata.com.   The

RE: Oracle SAN Experiences?

2002-11-12 Thread James Morle









David,



You might find one of my
whitepapers interesting: Sane SAN is the title. You can get it at:



www.scaleabilities.com/whitepapers.shtml

www.oaktable.net



Also, you will find a paper
on integrating solid state disks into a SAN, and whether that makes any sense
to real sites or not.



Best regards



James

--

James Morle



Author of Scaling Oracle8i:
Building Highly Scalable OLTP System Architectures

RE: combine or not combine into one database?

Tao - I believe you send any mail to:
 mailto:lawson_sysadmin-subscribe;topica.com 

If that doesn't work, let me know.

Dennis Williams
DBA, 40%OCP
Lifetouch, Inc.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 

-Original Message-
Sent: Monday, November 11, 2002 5:09 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Thanks a lot for you info.  Do you know how I can subscribe the Lawson 
email list?  Thanks again.

-Original Message-
Sent: Monday, November 11, 2002 2:59 PM
To: ORACLE-L


Tao - If I understand your situation, you currently have 3 separate
databases, 2 separate Lawson databases and another OEM database?
You can combine your two Lawson databases, but you'll need to
develop a careful project plan. Right now your Lawson HR database 
probably
sends data to your Lawson GL system, so that needs looked at before you 
do
the combination. There is a Lawson email list that can answer that 
question
in more detail.
Is the OEM repository and historical database more of a data
warehouse or OLTP system? Data warehouses tend to have spikey usage and
don't play well with OLTP databases such as your Lawson system. I would 
tend
to keep it separate just based on the limited information you've 
provided.

Dennis Williams
DBA, 40%OCP
Lifetouch, Inc.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 


-Original Message-
Sent: Monday, November 11, 2002 11:04 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Hi all,

I would like to know any advantage and disadvantage to combine the 
following databases into one:

Finance in Lawson
HR in Lawson
OEM repository and historical database

Any comments are very appreciated.



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RE: Schedule Backup in UNIX

Ashraf - I don't see where you have an export script. You are just
specifying the username and password and the file to send the export, but
you aren't telling export what to do, unless there is more information you
haven't provided. Try running your backup.ksh script from the command line
(interactively) and you will receive more error messages.

Dennis Williams
DBA, 40%OCP
Lifetouch, Inc.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 


-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 1:04 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Dear List,

We are working with Oracle 8i Database under UnixWare
Plateform.

My question is How to do Schedule Backup?

I tried to do Schedule backup but it does not work.
I'll show u the steps that I did...

1) I wrote my batch.
2) cd /var/spool/cron/crontabs
3) crontab -e oracle
   it will open a text file.
Oracle-
#
5 14 * * * /usr/oracle/backup.ksh 21 1/dev/null
# 
---

4) cd /usr/oracle

5) I did write backup.ksh like this:
backup.ksh-
#
# This Procedure for ORACLE export
#
exp payroll/pay file=/usr/oracle/pay02.dmp
#
exit
---

Any clues why this is not working ...

regards,

Ashraf 



__
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RE: IOUG Papers

2002-11-12 Thread Adams, Matthew (GECP, MABG, 088130)

Title: RE: IOUG Papers





The Focus Area Managers submitted their selections
up to the Technical Session Chair and the 
Director of Educational Programming last week. 
They have to review the selections for each area and
make any adjustments they feel necessary. 
I would think that notices would be going out to 
paper authors fairly soon, within the next
two weeks possibly.


Matt Adams



Matt Adams - GE Appliances - [EMAIL PROTECTED]
My computer beat me at chess, but I won
when it came to kick boxing.


-Original Message-
From: Stephen Andert [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Monday, November 11, 2002 4:09 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Subject: IOUG Papers



Does anyone know what the expected time-frame is for the IOUG paper
seletion committee to select papers?


I submitted a couple and am on pins and needles.


Thanks
Stephen Andert


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RE: Solaris vs Windows 2000

2002-11-12 Thread Mark Leith

I read about a third of it when I came across it - and thought exactly the
same. I'll read the rest of it later on though now! (Orders to process! :P).

-Original Message-
Sent: 12 November 2002 13:09
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Cheers Mark,
That's a very interesting look on the issue. Give it a read!

-Original Message-
Sent: 12 November 2002 11:09
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Firstly, can I say that any NT/2K administrator that feels they need to
install Microsoft Office (or just Outlook), and feels they need to upgrade
the web browser for a production Oracle database system should be shot on
site! The same goes for things like IIS (Microsoft's integrated web
server) as this again is a known security flaw.. Apache runs just fine on
Win2K (Oracle installs it on the windows platform as well). The same also
goes for Perl, and I believe Jared is most surely a Perl man!

There is also no longer a 4 CPU limit on windows systems. This does of
course depend upon the version of the Operating system that you buy, but
Win2K Datacentre Server supports up to 16CPUs.
(http://www.winntmag.com/Articles/Index.cfm?ArticleID=7597)

I stumbled across the following link a couple of weeks ago Jared, and
book-marked it for later reading.. I still haven't managed to read it as
yet, so can't comment, but it looks like it applies..

http://www.winface.com/article.html

Apart from the other URLs that you have already posted, I haven't seen any
decent comparison sites out there.

HTH

Mark

-Original Message-
Morrow
Sent: 12 November 2002 06:38
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Jared --

I tend to agree with your statements.  Although, personally, I tend to think
that Windows NT/2000/XP is a wholly inappropriate environment for any
enterprise
database.  The general reasons I tend to choose to back my statements:

1.  Scalability.  (I'm sorry, clustering is an availability solution,
not a scalability one.  If you can't grow beyond 4 CPUs [Intel's
problem
more than M$FT's, here] and need to, then an Intel platform is not
for
you.)

2.  Managibility.  I can do practically anything I need to on a unix box
over a 300bps modem, if necessary.  (This omits, of course,
inserting
media and hitting the power switch... oh, and installing oracle now
that
they have this java-based installer... fortunately, that's not
*that*
common of an occurance in ordinary maintenance)

3.  Did I mention scalability?  Most *nix platforms scale in a much more
linear fashion.  (i.e. 2 cpu's are more likely to give you double
the
performance on a RISC-based system than on an x86 based one.)  Note:
I'm saying only that RISC systems tend to be *more* linear than x86
ones.

4.  Supportability.  (yeah, I know, not really a word).  I've supported
Oracle on both (especially Oracle Applications).  Personally, unix
platforms tend to provide much more useful information when
something
does go wrong.  The standard Microsoft error message of it's broke
doesn't really tell me anything useful.

5.  Security.  How many security flaws have been found in 'doze?  And
don't
even get me started on M$FT Look-out!  (otherwise known as a
security
hole that occasionally delivers mail).  It's also nice that *nix
platforms are immune to all of the _really_common_ virii that hit
the
news these days (Melissa, I Love You, etc.).  (Not that *nix is
truly
immune to virii... but the big-bad-ugly-ones you hear about tend to
exploit flaws in... hows that again?  Right... Windows and
Lookout...
Although it helps somewhat that the *nix security model tends to
compartmentalize things a bit more than windows does [by default]).

6.  Do you *really* want all of the overhead of a tightly-coupled GUI on
a
_server_?

Admittedly, Windows 2000 does appear to be far more stable than previous
versions.  And the NT-derivatives don't tend to crash in a wholesale manner
like
the Windows/386 derivatives ('95,'98,ME).  But, personally, I should _NEVER_
have to reboot a machine to upgrade/patch a web browser.

-- James


==
James J. Morrow
Nascent Systems, Inc.
Dallas, TX
mailto:jmorrow;warthog.com

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 Dear List,

 Believe me, I am not trying to rehash an old topic, start any
 flame wars, nor look for supporting evidence for my admitted
 bias toward unix operating systems.

 Now that that's out of the way, what I am trying to do is find
 objective material comparing the use of MS Windows 2000
 Server on Intel HW to Solaris on Sun HW.

 This is for an SAP implementation.  We are currently running
 SAP 4.0b on MS NT 4.0 SP 6, on Dell 4 CPU Servers. ( I forget
 just which server )

 As part of our process to upgrade the system to 4.6c

RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?

I don't think they do that on purpose, it's just that for them, it makes
more sense to have most of their staff work on the same version, instead of
actively trying to improve 3-4 versions at the same time.

Regards,
Patrice Boivin
Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)

Systems Admin  Operations | Admin. et Exploit. des systèmes
Technology Services| Services technologiques
Informatics Branch | Direction de l'informatique 
Maritimes Region, DFO  | Région des Maritimes, MPO

E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]



-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 6:14 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


 -Original Message-
 
 Isn't there an adage if it ain't broke, don't fix it?
 

Well  But haven't you noticed that there are ALWAYS a few bugs that have
been strategically sprinkled about in any given release, the fix to which is
upgrade to version x.y.z?  Or is this just a Tru64 thing?  The old
strategy of Planned Obsolescence?
-- 
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also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).

Oracle 10i features

Any rumours about what might be included in 10i?


Regards,
Patrice Boivin
Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)

Systems Admin  Operations | Admin. et Exploit. des systèmes
Technology Services| Services technologiques
Informatics Branch | Direction de l'informatique 
Maritimes Region, DFO  | Région des Maritimes, MPO

E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]


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Re: Oracle 8i DB, 9i DB and 9iAS on same Unix box, refused

2002-11-12 Thread Don Malzahn

Jared,

Well, a hunch paid off.
Before doing anything else, I had our Sys Admin reboot the machine.
Guess you have to reboot after an Oracle 9.2 RDBMS install.
It now works and we can hit the 9i AS system through the web.

Thanks.


On Mon, 11 Nov 2002 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Don,
 
 Oracle 8.1.7 RDBMS, 9iAS and 9.2 RDBMS should all be installed in separate
 ORACLE_HOME's.  If may be that the 9.2 database install went to the same 
 ORACLE_HOME as the 9iAS install. 
 
 If so, you will likely need to reinstall both 9iAS and 9iR2.
 
 Jared
 
 
 
 
 
 
 Don Malzahn [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  11/11/2002 02:44 PM
  Please respond to ORACLE-L
 
  
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 cc: 
 Subject:Oracle 8i DB, 9i DB and 9iAS on same Unix box, refused
 
 
 All,
 
 Environment:
 HP-UX 11i
 We had Oracle 8i (8.1.7) running successfully on our one host. This host 
 also has Oracle 9i AS already too. 
 
 Then we installed Oracle 9i R2 (9.2.0.1) on the same host (to run RMAN 
 backup and recovery on another host).
 Since then our one application (FAMIS from PRISM) is having problems 
 taking connections through the web (9i AS).
 
 One person here did some research and says perhaps when 9i DB was 
 installed (to support doing RMAN backups for a 9i DB system on another 
 box), it overlaid the prior version of Apache. Sounds good to me. We don't 
 have  that much experience in the 9iAS, so we can't really say where the 
 problem is. The database is up and open and I can hit it from command line 
 sqlplus.
 
 Any ideas what went wrong and how to fix it? Should we have done a reboot 
 of the host after the Oracle 9i install? We did not.
 
 message:
 
===
 ERROR
 The requested URL could not be retrieved
 
 While trying to retrieve the URL: http://cmms.harper.cc.il.us/pls/ftrn/loc.login 
 The following error was encountered: 
 · Connection Failed 
 The system returned: 
 (61) Connection refused
 The remote host or network may be down. Please try the request again. 
 
 Generated Mon, 11 Nov 2002 19:15:16 GMT by fw3.harper.cc.il.us (Squid/2.2.STABLE5) 
 
 
 
===
 
 
 
 Thanks.
 
-
 Don Malzahn, IT/AS, Harper Community College   Voice:(847) 925-6829
 E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]Web page: http://www.harpercollege.edu
 The only limit to our realization of tomorrow will be our doubts of 
 today. - FDR
  
 
 
 -- 
 Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
 -- 
 Author: 
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 also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
 


Don Malzahn, IT/AS, Harper Community College   Voice:(847) 925-6829
E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]Web page:http://www.harpercollege.edu
The only limit to our realization of tomorrow will be our doubts of
today. - FDR


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oracle cluster file system

2002-11-12 Thread Ray Stell


I was listening to a linux q and a session by Wim Coekaerts:

http://www.oracle.com/oracleworld/online/sanfrancisco/index.html?chats.html

He is questioned about the oracle cluster filesystem for linux.
He said it was available as an rpm at otn.  Has anyone had a chance 
to see this up front?  I had never heard of the effort.
===
Ray Stell   [EMAIL PROTECTED] (540) 231-4109 KE4TJC28^D
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RE: Oracle 10i features

.NET?

 -Original Message-
 From: Boivin, Patrice J [mailto:BoivinP;mar.dfo-mpo.gc.ca]
 Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 7:59 AM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
 Subject: Oracle 10i features

 Any rumours about what might be included in 10i?

 Regards,
 Patrice Boivin
 Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)

 Systems Admin  Operations | Admin. et Exploit. des systèmes
 Technology Services| Services technologiques
 Informatics Branch | Direction de l'informatique 
 Maritimes Region, DFO  | Région des Maritimes, MPO

 E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 -- 
 Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
 -- 
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Re: how to avoid mutating table error in triggers

2002-11-12 Thread Reginald . W . Bailey


Suggestion 1:  Try having the trigger call a procedure. Put the update
code from the trigger in  a procedure.
Suggestion 2:The mutating table error is a row-level trigger.  The
solution is to use a statement level trigger   and a row level trigger.
Use a PL/SQL table inside package to record the update value to use in the
row level trigger.

I hope this helps.

RWB




Magaliff, Bill [EMAIL PROTECTED]@fatcity.com on 11/11/2002
09:03:47 AM

Please respond to [EMAIL PROTECTED]



Sent by:  [EMAIL PROTECTED]


To:   Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
cc:


Good day all,

Have the following setup -

Oracle 8.1.7.2 on solaris

parent-child realtionship between 2 tables:

table p1 has primary key pk1
table f1 has foreign key p1pk1 back to table p1.

Table p1 also has a field haschild number(1), used to indicate if there
are ANY child records in table f1.
Any insert into table F1 sets the haschild field in the corresponding row
in
table P1 to 1 (true).

Trying to write an on delete trigger for table f1 that will set that
boolean to 0 when there are now more child rows.

Came up with this:

create or replace trigger nochildtrg
after delete on f1
for each row
declare
tv_count number;
begin
select count(*) into tv_count
from f1
where p1pk1 = :old.p1pk1;
if tv_count = 0 then
update p1
set haschild = 0
where pk1 = :old.old.p1pk1;
end if;
commit;
end;
/

This plays right into the no-no's that produce the mutating table error
on
table f1 - selecting against it as part of a trigger.

Does anyone have any kind of workaround?  I could implement a counter
trigger, that increments a count on the parent table for each new row in
the
child, and decrements the count for each deleted row, but I wanted to see
if
there was another way.

thanks

bill
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RE: Oracle 8i DB, 9i DB and 9iAS on same Unix box, refused

2002-11-12 Thread Jim . Conboy

Don-

Look
for port conflicts between the Apache installed with 9iAS and the one with
9.2. If you're using web cache on iAS check the port that is using
also.
Are
you using iAS Release 2 (9.0.2)? If so, and both the infrastructure and
mid-tier are on the same server, they will each have their own orahome with
apache. iAS Release 2 is smart enough to keep its various apaches, etc on
diffferent ports but the 9.2 DB install might not be.

Jim

-Original Message-From: Don Malzahn
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]Sent: Monday, November 11, 2002
5:44 PMTo: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-LSubject:
Oracle 8i DB, 9i DB and 9iAS on same Unix box,
refusedAll,Environment:HP-UX 11iWe had
Oracle 8i (8.1.7) running successfully on our one host. This host also has
Oracle 9i AS already
too.Then we installed
Oracle 9i R2 (9.2.0.1) on the same host (to run RMAN backup and recovery on
another host).Since then our one application (FAMIS from PRISM) is having
problems taking connections through the web (9i AS).One person here
did some research and says perhaps when 9i DB was installed (to support doing
RMAN backups for a 9i DB system on another box), it overlaid the prior version
of Apache. Sounds good to me. We don't have that much experience in the
9iAS, so we can't really say where the problem is. The database is up and open
and I can hit it from command line sqlplus.Any ideas what went wrong
and how to fix it? Should we have done a reboot of the host after the Oracle
9i install? We did
not.message:===ERRORThe requested URL could not be
retrievedWhile trying to retrieve the URL: http://cmms.harper.cc.il.us/pls/ftrn/loc.login
The following error was encountered: · Connection
Failed The system returned: (61) Connection refusedThe remote host
or network may be down. Please try the request again. Generated Mon,
11 Nov 2002 19:15:16 GMT by fw3.harper.cc.il.us (Squid/2.2.STABLE5)
===Thanks.
-
Don Malzahn, IT/AS, Harper Community College Voice:(847)
925-6829
E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Web page: http://www.harpercollege.edu
"The only limit to our realization of tomorrow will be our doubts of
today". - FDR

RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?

Are you sure that you want to be using software from the
vendor which doesn't release new versions on purpose? How 
do they release them? Purely accidental slips? Subconsciously?
Things just happen because of the unhappy childhood?

 -Original Message-
 From: Boivin, Patrice J [mailto:BoivinP;mar.dfo-mpo.gc.ca]
 Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 7:59 AM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
 Subject: RE: When will Oracle 10i be out?

 I don't think they do that on purpose, it's just that for 
 them, it makes
 more sense to have most of their staff work on the same 
 version, instead of
 actively trying to improve 3-4 versions at the same time.

 Regards,
 Patrice Boivin
 Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)

 Systems Admin  Operations | Admin. et Exploit. des systèmes
 Technology Services| Services technologiques
 Informatics Branch | Direction de l'informatique 
 Maritimes Region, DFO  | Région des Maritimes, MPO

 E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

 -Original Message-
 Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 6:14 PM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L

  -Original Message-

  Isn't there an adage if it ain't broke, don't fix it?

 Well  But haven't you noticed that there are ALWAYS a few 
 bugs that have
 been strategically sprinkled about in any given release, the 
 fix to which is
 upgrade to version x.y.z?  Or is this just a Tru64 thing?  The old
 strategy of Planned Obsolescence?
 -- 
 -- 
 Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
 -- 
 Author: Boivin, Patrice J
   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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 San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services
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 to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in
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 also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).

--
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RE: IOUG Papers

2002-11-12 Thread Stephen Andert

Thanks for the info.

 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11/12/02 05:38AM 
The Focus Area Managers submitted their selections
up to the Technical Session Chair and the 
Director of Educational Programming last week. 
They have to review the selections for each area and
make any adjustments they feel necessary. 
I would think that notices would be going out to 
paper authors fairly soon, within the next
two weeks possibly.

Matt Adams


Matt Adams - GE Appliances - [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
My computer beat me at chess, but I won
when it came to kick boxing.

-Original Message-
Sent: Monday, November 11, 2002 4:09 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Does anyone know what the expected time-frame is for the IOUG paper
seletion committee to select papers?

I submitted a couple and am on pins and needles.

Thanks
Stephen Andert

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RE: Solaris vs Windows 2000

It is, but after a very brief overview, some of the decisions made leave me
with knee-jerk questions.

Under Case Two: 5,000-user manufacturing operation, why is there no tape
backup spec'd for the Solaris side?  Why get 21 monitors for office workers
who will most likely run them at 800x600 anyway (speaking from experience)?
What is the cause of a 36-month hardware refresh for the Winders side,
while the Solaris side has none?  It also misses at least one key figure in
hardware support cost.

If I were a PHB with at least some intelligence, this is what I'd question.
The numbers looked padded and phony to me.  And I hate -- nay, LOATHE --
Winders, especially for a server.  Imagine what a MS bigot would come up
with...

Rich

Rich Jesse   System/Database Administrator
[EMAIL PROTECTED]  Quad/Tech International, Sussex, WI USA


 -Original Message-
 From: Boivin, Patrice J [mailto:BoivinP;mar.dfo-mpo.gc.ca]
 Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 6:25 AM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
 Subject: RE: Solaris vs Windows 2000
 
 
 That winface article makes a good read.
 
 Thanks!
 
 Patrice.
 
 -Original Message-
 Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 7:09 AM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
 
 
 Firstly, can I say that any NT/2K administrator that feels 
 they need to
 install Microsoft Office (or just Outlook), and feels they 
 need to upgrade
 the web browser for a production Oracle database system 
 should be shot on
 site! The same goes for things like IIS (Microsoft's integrated web
 server) as this again is a known security flaw.. Apache runs 
 just fine on
 Win2K (Oracle installs it on the windows platform as well). 
 The same also
 goes for Perl, and I believe Jared is most surely a Perl man!
 
 There is also no longer a 4 CPU limit on windows systems. This does of
 course depend upon the version of the Operating system that 
 you buy, but
 Win2K Datacentre Server supports up to 16CPUs.
 (http://www.winntmag.com/Articles/Index.cfm?ArticleID=7597)
 
 I stumbled across the following link a couple of weeks ago Jared, and
 book-marked it for later reading.. I still haven't managed to 
 read it as
 yet, so can't comment, but it looks like it applies..
 
 http://www.winface.com/article.html
 
 Apart from the other URLs that you have already posted, I 
 haven't seen any
 decent comparison sites out there.
 
 HTH
 
 Mark
 
 -Original Message-
 Morrow
 Sent: 12 November 2002 06:38
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
 
 
 Jared --
 
 I tend to agree with your statements.  Although, personally, 
 I tend to think
 that Windows NT/2000/XP is a wholly inappropriate environment for any
 enterprise
 database.  The general reasons I tend to choose to back my statements:
 
 1.Scalability.  (I'm sorry, clustering is an 
 availability solution,
   not a scalability one.  If you can't grow beyond 4 CPUs [Intel's
 problem
   more than M$FT's, here] and need to, then an Intel 
 platform is not
 for
   you.)
 
 2.Managibility.  I can do practically anything I need to 
 on a unix box
   over a 300bps modem, if necessary.  (This omits, of course,
 inserting
   media and hitting the power switch... oh, and 
 installing oracle now
 that
   they have this java-based installer... fortunately, that's not
 *that*
   common of an occurance in ordinary maintenance)
 
 3.Did I mention scalability?  Most *nix platforms scale 
 in a much more
   linear fashion.  (i.e. 2 cpu's are more likely to 
 give you double
 the
   performance on a RISC-based system than on an x86 based 
 one.)  Note:
   I'm saying only that RISC systems tend to be *more* 
 linear than x86
   ones.
 
 4.Supportability.  (yeah, I know, not really a word).  
 I've supported
   Oracle on both (especially Oracle Applications).  
 Personally, unix
   platforms tend to provide much more useful information when
 something
   does go wrong.  The standard Microsoft error message of 
 it's broke
   doesn't really tell me anything useful.
 
 5.Security.  How many security flaws have been found in 
 'doze?  And
 don't
   even get me started on M$FT Look-out!  (otherwise known as a
 security
   hole that occasionally delivers mail).  It's also nice that *nix
   platforms are immune to all of the _really_common_ 
 virii that hit
 the
   news these days (Melissa, I Love You, etc.).  (Not that *nix is
 truly
   immune to virii... but the big-bad-ugly-ones you hear 
 about tend to
   exploit flaws in... hows that again?  Right... Windows and
 Lookout...
   Although it helps somewhat that the *nix security model tends to
   compartmentalize things a bit more than windows does 
 [by default]).
 
 6.Do you *really* want all of the overhead of a 
 tightly-coupled GUI on
 a
   _server_?
 
 Admittedly, Windows 2000 does appear to be far more stable 
 than previous
 versions.  And the

Re: Oracle 10i features

2002-11-12 Thread Tim Gorman

Better I/O and storage management facilities, possibly a universal datafile
format across all computing platforms...

Certainly a much-improved OEM product, seeing as how they now have Gaja
Vaidyanatha, James Morle, John Beresniewicz, and other incredible people
working on that product team...

Pure speculation on my part, mind you...

- Original Message -
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 5:59 AM


Any rumours about what might be included in 10i?


Regards,
Patrice Boivin
Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)

Systems Admin  Operations | Admin. et Exploit. des systèmes
Technology Services| Services technologiques
Informatics Branch | Direction de l'informatique
Maritimes Region, DFO  | Région des Maritimes, MPO

E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]


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RE: Solaris vs Windows 2000



 -Original Message-
 
 I know you are trying to evaluate Solaris and Windows, but ...
 
 Linux is the way to go. Sun's are expensive machines.
 

When one considers the overall cost of deploying and maintaining an
application -- hardware, personnel, data center space, software licensing,
etc. -- the cost of the hardware is usually only a very small percentage of
the total cost over the lifetime of the application on that hardware.
Crippling yourself on the basis of hardware costs is a classic case of being
penny wise and dollar foolish.

If you look at the cost of Xeon equipped machines, I think you'll find that
those don't come cheap either.
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Parsing tnsnames.ora

2002-11-12 Thread Orr, Steve

Anyone have a ready-made regular expression to parse out the net8 service
name labels from tnsnames.ora? Perl is OK. What I'm looking for is a way to
get a list of possible connections from tnsnames.ora. For example, from the
below I just want a regular expression which returns label1 and label2...

label1 = (description_list=
  (description=
 (address=(...))
 (connect_data=(...)))
  (description=
 (address=(...))
 (connect_data=(...)))
)

label2 = (description_list=
  (description=
 (address=(...))
 (connect_data=(...)))
  (description=
 (address=(...))
 (connect_data=(...)))
)


AtDhVaAnNkCsE 

Steve Orr
Bozeman, Montana
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Re: Rollback Segment Size Testing.

2002-11-12 Thread Tim Gorman

Zhu Chao,

Please be aware that rollback segments serve two major purposes:

* recover individual transactions (i.e. rollback)
* provide before-image information for read-consistency

The information you are getting from V$ROLLSTAT and STATSPACK is accurate at
measuring the first purpose only.  Until Oracle9i and the V$UNDOSTAT view
that accompanies the use of UNDO tablespaces, it is very difficult to
estimate how much space is necessary to satisfy the needs of SQL statements
requiring before-image information in order to complete successfully without
the ORA-01555 snapshot too old error message.

First of all, the size or number of extents in a rollback segment does not
affect the performance of SQL statements.  Of course, if the size of the
extents is extremely small and the number of extents varies wildly up and
down, then the sheer overhead of extent maintenance might be a performance
factor.  Since you are examining V$ROLLSTAT and STATSPACK, you have info as
to whether this is happening in hand (i.e. columns EXTENDS and SHRINKS in
V$ROLLSTAT)...

So, since there is no adverse impact related to the number and size of
extents for RBS (other than that mentioned above, easily verifiable), and
since reducing the amount of space in your RBS can increase the probability
of incurring the ORA-01555 error, I'd like to suggest that the only
advantage you can gain by reducing the size or number of extents is saving
space.  Is space a concern?

Summary:  be careful and be alert for the incidence of the ORA-01555 error
message.  Since only end-users become aware of it (i.e. it is not logged in
alert.log or in trace files), you might want to activate an AFTER
SERVERERROR database-event trigger (if you are running 8i or above) to log
occurrances of it.  Otherwise, you'll need to be certain that end-users have
a reliable feedback mechanism to alert you to any changes in the frequency
of ORA-01555.

All in all, I think you should leave things alone, unless there is a
quantifiable problem.

Just some things to consider...

-Tim

- Original Message -
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 5:59 AM


 hi, list friends:
 I am interested in that
topic:http://www.ioug.org/ioug_s/repository_pkg.doc?v_tech_content_dtl_phy_i
d=7666
 I am also considering whether too large rbs segment size does have adverse
impact on database performance. In my production (OLTP) i configured rbs to
be 1m*20 extents. But from v$rollstat and statspack, the average active size
is 1.5M. I am considering whether it is too large and shrink it to 128k*20
will help.(but hard to find out the performance gains as it is a big
system).
 If anyone in this list have IOUG membership, can you send me a copy? And i
hope friends have experience on this topic can share your experience





 Regards
 zhu chao
 Eachnet DBA
 86-21-32174588-667
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 www.cnoug.org(Chinese Oracle User Group)


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Re: Character Sets - 2 different kinds, same server

2002-11-12 Thread Yechiel Adar

1) You can have two databases with different character sets in the same
computer.
you may have problems running local jobs, but I do not know Solaris to
comment on this.
2) according to metalink doc#: 119164.1, UTF8 is a superset of US7ASCII so
you can convert your database to use UTF8 without problems. There is a
reference to doc# 66320.1 in this document. The 66320.1 document will
explain to you how to change the character set. It worked for me in 8.1.6 on
NT.

Yechiel Adar
Mehish
- Original Message -
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, November 11, 2002 10:13 PM


 Is it possible to have two different databases on the same server using
two
 different kinds of character sets (one would be UTF8 NCHAR and the other
would
 be US7ASCII)?   How do you create the databases with two different
character
 sets (is it an init parameter)?  If that is not possible and Oracle
binaries
 were installed with US7ASCII, how can you convert it to UTF8 without
having to
 reinstall everything?  This is Oracle 8.1.7.3 on Solaris.
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Re:VC++ to Oracle connectivity without installing client

2002-11-12 Thread dgoulet

Muru,

You generated quite a bit of mail here.  Regrettably I'm getting in on it
late, decided this vet was taking Veterans Day off yesterday.  Anyway, with any
application you HAVE to make a choice up front to either use client/server or
three tier be that web services, tuxedo, or something else.  That decision then
shapes your needs for a client toolset.  My first point to decide is the
deployment location(s) for the app.  If it's small and all have easy access to
the database, client/server.  On the other hand if it's small but the clients do
not have easy access to the server (firewall in the way) then web.  If large,
probably a transaction processor of some sorts.  UNLESS your seriously using
NAMED USERS in which case client/server is the only way to keep out of license
trouble.  Get anything between your client and server and Oracle interprets that
as an uncountable user population requiring CPU licensing.

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: Muru [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date:   11/8/2002 2:14 PM

Hello Gurus,

I would like to program our VC++ application to
directly connect to Oracle database using OO4O or OCI.
But the problem is this VC++ app is gonna run on 1000s
of desktops where we may have to install Oracle client
which will be a time consuming in-efficient process. I
am trying to see if the required client dlls and other
files can be combined in the VC++ package itself and 
delivered to those 1000s of desktops.

Can any of you give some insight into this, please?

Any help would be highly appreciated.

Thanks,
Muru
 

__
Do you Yahoo!?
U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos
http://launch.yahoo.com/u2
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Re: IOUG Papers

2002-11-12 Thread Ruth Gramolini




Likewise! Ruth

iAS virtual hosts

I have a simple question...

Is it preferable to run everything as one Apache server, or using virtual
hosts when there are alias conflicts?

I noticed that the OEM web stage creates a virtual host.

Developers here are asking me to create a virtual host instead of their
cleaning up their code to remove an alias conflict with the /images/ alias.

Do virtual hosts have an impact on performance / resource use / complexity
of administration?

Which solution is cleaner?

Regards,
Patrice Boivin
Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)

Systems Admin  Operations | Admin. et Exploit. des systèmes
Technology Services| Services technologiques
Informatics Branch | Direction de l'informatique 
Maritimes Region, DFO  | Région des Maritimes, MPO

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Re: Data Purging Strategy

2002-11-12 Thread Yechiel Adar

Hello Jay

How about building an historical DB and keeping the data there.
It will not overload the production instance, will be available online if
you need something, you will migrate it to new versions of Oracle so
compatibility will not be an issue and you can implement table changes on
the historical data so the structure will remain the same as in production.

We are doing it in ADABAS on the mainframe.


Yechiel Adar
Mehish
- Original Message -
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 11:24 PM


 Well, if worst comes to worst we can always install an earlier version on
a
 box and import it there.
 But the reason we can't get more storage approved still has me shaking my
 head...

 -Original Message-
 Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 2:19 PM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


 Jay,

 just make sure you are not around when, after several Oracle upgrades, and
 they want to import one of these files back that they discover that the
 current release of import can no longer read the older version of the .dmp
 file.

 now what are these senior damagers going to do?  blame the DBA, that's
what!


 duck and cover... duck and cover...

 Tom Mercadante
 Oracle Certified Professional


 -Original Message-
 Sent: Thursday, November 07, 2002 1:55 PM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


 FWIW, what we just implemented (because senior management refuses to
approve
 additional storage on the grounds that making the database larger will
 affect performance - aaargh!) is

 1) Confirmed with business how long data needs to be online for various
 tables (they're all partitioned so that makes it a lot easier)
 2) Export partitions older than that once/month (this is generated off a
 table that lists each partitioned table and how long data should be kep)
 3) After confirming that all export files are valid we drop the old
 partitions (this will be done by script but is being done manually for the
 first few months)
 4) Leave dmp files on server for 2 end of months (our end of month backup
 tapes are stored for 7 years)
 5) Maintain a table in database saying what exported partitions are on
what
 date's tapes


 And I really long for the days in this company when senior management made
 technical decisions by asking the technical people instead of just making
 things up...

 Jay Miller


 -Original Message-
 Sent: Wednesday, November 06, 2002 11:54 AM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


 Someone asked about this 3 weeks ago.  Here's my take
 on archiving data.  I don't expect everyone to agree with this,
 but nonetheless,  I have an opinion.   :)

 Here's an email from last month.  You can undoubtedly find
 some other ideas on this by searching the archives of this
 list at fatcity.com

 Jared

 ==

 I'm not a proponent of purging data.

 Unless of course, you expect to never see it again.

 That word 'archive' rolls of the tongues of managers
 and consultants pretty easily, but what's behind it?

 There are a few gotchas with purging and archiving.

 Let's assume you have some 3 year old data that
 you need to see again, and it has been purged.

 Here are some of the possible problems:

 *  Your backup tapes are corrupted
 *  Your new backup hardware can't read the old tapes
 *  Your software no longer understands the format that
 the data is in.
 * You have the correct software, but it won't work on the
current version of OS on your hardware.
 * The data format/software/whatever is not well documented
 *  The employees that understood the data 3 years ago
have been laid off.
 * ... lots more stuff

 Read Bryon Bergeron's Dark Ages II: When the Digital Data Die
 http://www.powells.com/cgi-bin/biblio?inkey=2-0130661074-0

 Perhaps much better than archiving the data, is to stick with the
 idea of moving it to another database, and using lots of cheap
 disk storage (NAS) or a heirarchical file system to store it.

 The point being that if it's online somewhere, it will be maintained.

 Don't purge it till Finance, HR, the IRS and any other stakeholder
 says it's ok.  Only then purge it and archive it to offline tape with the
 knowledge that you may never see that data again.

 Jared





 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  11/06/2002 01:13 AM
  Please respond to ORACLE-L


 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 cc:
 Subject:Data Purging Strategy



 Dear List,

 I need some inputs from you all regarding purging data from the database.

 This is the requirement


 We define a retention period for all the data in the system.
 When the retention period is reached,  the data should be deleted, but
 then at a later time, some user might request for this purged data. So it
 must be possible to retrieve this data.

 This is the strategy we have designed for this.

 When the retention period is

RE: Schedule Backup in UNIX



 -Original Message-
 Oracle-
 #
 5 14 * * * /usr/oracle/backup.ksh 21 1/dev/null
 # 
 ---
 

I'll admit that I have only lightly scanned the e-mails today so forgive me
if somebody already brought this up:

5 14 * * * /usr/oracle/backup.ksh  /dev/null 21

i.e. the redirects are wrong in the crontab.  I don't think this would
prevent the script from running, but your output will go: stderr to e-mail,
stdout to bit bucket.
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RE: Oracle taking 100% CPU

2002-11-12 Thread Hussain Ahmed Qadri

Title: RE: Oracle taking 100% CPU





The CPU becomes normal after the database is shutdown. So it's Oracle that is causing problems. I thought that it would be some rollbacking and roll-forwarding going on but, since morning, I don't think so. So I have some clues that it has something to do with Temporary tablespace as it had gone up to 10GB and all of it was being used. Although now temporary TS is down to 50% usage but smon is taking hell of a long time to clean up, don't you think. So that's why, as per my discussion with Regis, I have created another temporary tablespace and assigned it to all the users and trying to drop the old temporary tablespace, but haven't had much luck with it. 

Any ideas


-Original Message-
From: DENNIS WILLIAMS [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 5:29 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Subject: RE: Oracle taking 100% CPU


Hussain - Once you clear up some archive space, Oracle will resume
immediately. You don't need to bounce the database.
 What is the system doing besides taking 100% cpu? W2K Task Manager offers
much more information, like I/O activity and CPU by process. This may
provide more clues.
 Normally Oracle will take care of itself without intervention. My first
thought is that you had a lot of pending work since it couldn't archive.
Then you killed sessions which means Oracle must roll back transactions.
Offhand it sounds like Oracle is still recovering. Look for heavy disk
activity.




Dennis Williams
DBA, 40%OCP
Lifetouch, Inc.
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 4:19 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L




HI all,


We have a development server, a replica of the production. Some process
produced a lot of archives and it ran out of archiving space. Now it was the
only location specified for the archives and it was mandatory. So when no
space was left on it to store the newly produced archives, it should have
stopped working. But it didn't. I deleted the archives and closed every
session and shut down the database and restarted it. But eversince I
restarted it, (and I have done it 3-4 times already) Oracle is using
100%CPU. I have left the server on, without any body connecting to it,
(users can connect as the database is OPEN without any problem, its just
some transaction-cleaning or background process which is going on) but the
server remains unchanged i.e. using 100% for over an hour (after an hour I
shut it down and restarted and it still is the same)


There is no unusual entry in the alert lofile or any trace files. I can't do
any query to find out anything, as the system is so slow. There is no
problem of space either. Event viewer of Win2000 also shows nothing
unusual or new.


Any ideas, its somewhat urgent.


Hussain


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RE: Oracle 10i features

Working change management pack would be a good start.

 -Original Message-
 From: Tim Gorman [mailto:Tim;SageLogix.com]
 Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 10:19 AM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
 Subject: Re: Oracle 10i features

 Better I/O and storage management facilities, possibly a 
 universal datafile
 format across all computing platforms...

 Certainly a much-improved OEM product, seeing as how they now 
 have Gaja
 Vaidyanatha, James Morle, John Beresniewicz, and other 
 incredible people
 working on that product team...

 Pure speculation on my part, mind you...

 - Original Message -
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 5:59 AM

 Any rumours about what might be included in 10i?

 Regards,
 Patrice Boivin
 Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)

 Systems Admin  Operations | Admin. et Exploit. des systèmes
 Technology Services| Services technologiques
 Informatics Branch | Direction de l'informatique
 Maritimes Region, DFO  | Région des Maritimes, MPO

 E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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RE: Oracle 10i features

OEM 4.0 was announced recently, check the otn pages.

Pat.

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 11:19 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Better I/O and storage management facilities, possibly a universal datafile
format across all computing platforms...

Certainly a much-improved OEM product, seeing as how they now have Gaja
Vaidyanatha, James Morle, John Beresniewicz, and other incredible people
working on that product team...

Pure speculation on my part, mind you...

- Original Message -
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 5:59 AM


Any rumours about what might be included in 10i?


Regards,
Patrice Boivin
Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)

Systems Admin  Operations | Admin. et Exploit. des systèmes
Technology Services| Services technologiques
Informatics Branch | Direction de l'informatique
Maritimes Region, DFO  | Région des Maritimes, MPO

E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]


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Re: Solaris vs Windows 2000

2002-11-12 Thread James J. Morrow



Mark Leith wrote:

Firstly, can I say that any NT/2K administrator that feels they need to
install Microsoft Office (or just Outlook), and feels they need to upgrade
the web browser for a production Oracle database system should be shot on
site! The same goes for things like IIS (Microsoft's integrated web
server) as this again is a known security flaw.. Apache runs just fine on
Win2K (Oracle installs it on the windows platform as well). The same also
goes for Perl, and I believe Jared is most surely a Perl man!

There is also no longer a 4 CPU limit on windows systems. This does of
course depend upon the version of the Operating system that you buy, but
Win2K Datacentre Server supports up to 16CPUs.
(http://www.winntmag.com/Articles/Index.cfm?ArticleID=7597)


I'll conceed the 4-cpu limitation is past.  However, a search of various 
hardware vendor sites reveals:

DELL:
PowerEdge 8450 -- Max 8 Pentium III Xeon CPUs
PowerEdge 7150 -- Max 4 Itanium CPUs
PowerEdge 6600 -- Max 4 Xeon MP CPUs

http://www.dell.com/us/en/biz/products/series_rkopt_perf_servers.htm
http://www.dell.com/us/en/biz/products/series_pedge_servers.htm

Hewlett-COMPAQard:

HP lxr8500 series -- Max 8 Pentium III Xeon CPUs
HP rx9610 series -- Max 16 Itanium CPUs

http://netserver.hp.com/products/highlights_lxr8500.asp
http://www.hp.com/products1/servers/rackoptimized/rx9610/index.html
http://www.hp.com/products1/servers/operating/windows.html

I'm kinda curious as to why they don't show any Itanium-based servers on the 
Windows Server page that scale beyond 4 CPUs.

IBM:

xSeries 360 -- Max 4 Xeon MP CPUs
xSeries 440 -- Max 8 Xeon MP CPUs

http://www.pc.ibm.com/us/eserver/xseries/
http://www.pc.ibm.com/us/eserver/xseries/x440.html

Unisys, however, does make a 32-way box.

ES7000 Series -- Max 32 Itanium 2 or Xeon CPUs

http://www.unisys.com/products/es7000__servers/index.htm

One thing I'm somewhat curious about.  How much do you have to pay in terms of 
M$FT licensing for Win2000 Data Center on a 32-way box?  (I can't seem to find 
published pricing out there... so I'm prone to believe that it may be heavily 
discountable).

I stumbled across the following link a couple of weeks ago Jared, and
book-marked it for later reading.. I still haven't managed to read it as
yet, so can't comment, but it looks like it applies..

http://www.winface.com/article.html


And yes, excellent article.


Apart from the other URLs that you have already posted, I haven't seen any
decent comparison sites out there.

HTH

Mark



Now, as far as any NT/2000 admin that feels the need to install. 
Unfortunately, part of the big selling point of Windows as a server platform is 
that you don't need those expensive unix admins to run it.  The theory being 
that any idiot can administer Windows NT/2000.  As a result, many NT/2000 
server installations *DO* end up with IIS, Outlook (or at least Outlook 
Express), Office, and other unnecessary garbage installed on it because the 
administrators either don't know better or simply don't care.

Now, you know as well as I do that:
	1)	Nobody in their right mind wants any idiot doing it.
	2)	While any idiot can probably _do_ the job (to some extent)
		Even Windows takes a skilled administrator to properly setup and
		maintain.
	3)	The truly _GOOD_ NT/2000 admins are every bit as hard to find
		(if not harder because of the size of the talent pool) as a
		good Unix admin.  And are (or at least should be) almost as
		expensive.


-- James

SNIP old posting



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Re:Is nothing sacred? (Oracle vs The Experts)

2002-11-12 Thread dgoulet

Jesse,

No, nothing in sacred any more.  Change is the theme of the day.  BTW: did
you experiment with caching these tables in the keep_pool??  I've had some real
good luck with unindexed tables that are small (in the 1 to 10 block size) that
get assigned to the keep pool and retained in memory forever.

Also, BTW: I'll disagree with Cary and Hotsos on the costs of a PIO vs a
LIO.  In my experience it's not such a clear cut distinction.  Whenever Oracle
needs a block of data that data must be in memory which means that a PIO
requires 2 LIO's to fulfill the request and on top of that there may be other
memory management routines that get called if an empty data block in memory must
be created.  All in all it's a very mixed bag that needs to be considered case
by case.  I believe that was one of the reasons Oracle allows us to configure
the cache three ways.  Static, seldomly changed tables in the keep pool. Large
constantly changing tables in the discard pool.  Also to index or not to index
are no longer such clear cut item, especially with CBO which loves to ignore
indexes.

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: Jesse; Rich [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date:   11/11/2002 8:58 AM

So, there I am, on 8.1.7.2 (and .4) on HP/UX 11.0, with a process that runs
20 minutes out of every hour of the day (despite my protests to it's
design).  After it starts having problems (go figure), it becomes a priority
to speed it up.

Thanks to a 10046 trace, we see that the query taking the most elapsed time
does FTSs on each of two very small tables (1 block and 4 blocks -- 8K
blocksize).  These tables are not indexed, as per the official Oracle
recommendation.  After reading the excellent Hotsos paper When to index a
table (THANKS, CARY!), I added an index to reduce elapsed time on this
query by 50% (150 to 75 seconds in test), proving to me that the paper is
valid.  And I've only read to page four!

OK, first I'm taught by Oracle to look at Buffer Cache Hit Ratios as a
measure of performance, then told (and thoroughly convinced) by experts that
this is bunk.  Now, I found out that the 15% (or 10% or whatever, depending
on version) ratio of rows returned to total rows in determining when to use
an index in a query is garbage.

1)  Why is this?

2)  What other pearls of performance wisdom from Oracle Corp should I
completely disregard as false?

I know there's an Oracle Fallacy website somewhere...

It just looks bad on me, our department, and Oracle when, once again,
something I've been preaching to our developers as gospel turns out to be
completely false.

Maybe I'm grumpy because it's snowing on my leaves right now...  sigh


Rich


Rich Jesse   System/Database Administrator
[EMAIL PROTECTED]  Quad/Tech International, Sussex, WI USA

Disclaimer:  I only said the Packers would be 12-4 this year -- I never said
that they couldn't do better!  WOO-HOO!  :)
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log_archive_max_processes

2002-11-12 Thread Carle, William T (Bill), ALCAS

With Oracle version 9.2, it appears that the value of the log_archive_max_processes is 
defaulting to 2. I don't specify it in my init.ora file, but 2 archive processes are 
being started, ARC0 and ARC1. The value of this parameter is set to 2. Is this a 
feature of 9.2 we don't know about? Any documentation I have seen says it is supposed 
to default to 1.


Bill Carle
ATT
Database Administrator
816-995-3922
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

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Re: Oracle 10i features

2002-11-12 Thread Jan Pruner

MS Word as SQL editor?
MS Excel as sqlplus?
Outlook as Instance Manager?

:-)

On Tuesday 12 November 2002 15:58, you wrote:
 .NET?

  -Original Message-
  From: Boivin, Patrice J [mailto:BoivinP;mar.dfo-mpo.gc.ca]
  Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 7:59 AM
  To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
  Subject: Oracle 10i features
 
 
  Any rumours about what might be included in 10i?
 
 
  Regards,
  Patrice Boivin
  Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)
 
  Systems Admin  Operations | Admin. et Exploit. des systèmes
  Technology Services| Services technologiques
  Informatics Branch | Direction de l'informatique
  Maritimes Region, DFO  | Région des Maritimes, MPO
 
  E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 
 
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RE: Oracle SAN Experiences?

2002-11-12 Thread David Wagoner









James,



Thanks for
the tips. Ive read your Sane SAN
article several times and think its excellent. Ill check out the other article too.





Best
regards,



David
Wagoner

Oracle DBA

Cary, NC





-Original
Message-
From: James Morle
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002
8:28 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list
ORACLE-L
Subject: RE: Oracle  SAN
Experiences?



David,



You might find one of my whitepapers
interesting: Sane SAN is the title. You can get it at:



www.scaleabilities.com/whitepapers.shtml

www.oaktable.net



Also, you will find a paper on integrating
solid state disks into a SAN, and whether that makes any sense to real sites or
not.



Best regards



James

--

James Morle



Author of Scaling Oracle8i: Building Highly
Scalable OLTP System Architectures

RE: Oracle 10i features

2002-11-12 Thread Jamadagni, Rajendra

Title: RE: Oracle 10i features





New EM4.0 (announced today) has a bunch of new features ... was just reading the PDF ... but it needs 9iAS ... that is a bummer ... more info on oracle website ...

Raj
__
Rajendra Jamadagni  MIS, ESPN Inc.
Rajendra dot Jamadagni at ESPN dot com
Any opinion expressed here is personal and doesn't reflect that of ESPN Inc. 
QOTD: Any clod can have facts, but having an opinion is an art!



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RE: oracle cluster file system

2002-11-12 Thread Richard Ji

Does anyone know where I can get this?  I can't find OCFS on otn.

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 9:19 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



I was listening to a linux q and a session by Wim Coekaerts:

http://www.oracle.com/oracleworld/online/sanfrancisco/index.html?chats.html

He is questioned about the oracle cluster filesystem for linux.
He said it was available as an rpm at otn.  Has anyone had a chance 
to see this up front?  I had never heard of the effort.
===
Ray Stell   [EMAIL PROTECTED] (540) 231-4109 KE4TJC28^D
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RE: Solaris vs Windows 2000




 -Original Message-
 
 Unisys, however, does make a 32-way box.
 
---

Didn't I see somewhere that they are going to change their name to Winisys?
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RE: Oracle 10i features

2002-11-12 Thread Mark Leith

I've heard rumours of OEM being ported to PDA platforms (a la PocketDBA) -
has anybody else heard this, or now of any further info out there?

-Original Message-
Patrice J
Sent: 12 November 2002 16:19
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


OEM 4.0 was announced recently, check the otn pages.

Pat.

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 11:19 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Better I/O and storage management facilities, possibly a universal datafile
format across all computing platforms...

Certainly a much-improved OEM product, seeing as how they now have Gaja
Vaidyanatha, James Morle, John Beresniewicz, and other incredible people
working on that product team...

Pure speculation on my part, mind you...

- Original Message -
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 5:59 AM


Any rumours about what might be included in 10i?


Regards,
Patrice Boivin
Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)

Systems Admin  Operations | Admin. et Exploit. des systèmes
Technology Services| Services technologiques
Informatics Branch | Direction de l'informatique
Maritimes Region, DFO  | Région des Maritimes, MPO

E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]


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RE: Oracle 10i features

2002-11-12 Thread Mirsky, Greg

Are you trying to KILL the product with MS bloat-ware?

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 11:34 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


MS Word as SQL editor?
MS Excel as sqlplus?
Outlook as Instance Manager?

:-)

On Tuesday 12 November 2002 15:58, you wrote:
 .NET?

  -Original Message-
  From: Boivin, Patrice J [mailto:BoivinP;mar.dfo-mpo.gc.ca]
  Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 7:59 AM
  To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
  Subject: Oracle 10i features
 
 
  Any rumours about what might be included in 10i?
 
 
  Regards,
  Patrice Boivin
  Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)
 
  Systems Admin  Operations | Admin. et Exploit. des systèmes
  Technology Services| Services technologiques
  Informatics Branch | Direction de l'informatique
  Maritimes Region, DFO  | Région des Maritimes, MPO
 
  E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 
 
  --
  Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
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RE: Oracle 10i features

2002-11-12 Thread Sherman, Edward

Get thee to the SQL Server!!!

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 11:34 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


MS Word as SQL editor?
MS Excel as sqlplus?
Outlook as Instance Manager?

:-)

On Tuesday 12 November 2002 15:58, you wrote:
 .NET?

  -Original Message-
  From: Boivin, Patrice J [mailto:BoivinP;mar.dfo-mpo.gc.ca]
  Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 7:59 AM
  To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
  Subject: Oracle 10i features
 
 
  Any rumours about what might be included in 10i?
 
 
  Regards,
  Patrice Boivin
  Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)
 
  Systems Admin  Operations | Admin. et Exploit. des systèmes
  Technology Services| Services technologiques
  Informatics Branch | Direction de l'informatique
  Maritimes Region, DFO  | Région des Maritimes, MPO
 
  E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 
 
  --
  Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
  --
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INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 
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RE: Oracle 10i features

Nope, I'm just preparing  software for Mr. David Bowman
and the Discovery.

 -Original Message-
 From: Mirsky, Greg [mailto:gmirsky;Estee.com]
 Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 11:55 AM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
 Subject: RE: Oracle 10i features

 Are you trying to KILL the product with MS bloat-ware?

 -Original Message-
 Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 11:34 AM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L

 MS Word as SQL editor?
 MS Excel as sqlplus?
 Outlook as Instance Manager?

 :-)

 On Tuesday 12 November 2002 15:58, you wrote:
  .NET?

   -Original Message-
   From: Boivin, Patrice J [mailto:BoivinP;mar.dfo-mpo.gc.ca]
   Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 7:59 AM
   To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
   Subject: Oracle 10i features

   Any rumours about what might be included in 10i?

   Regards,
   Patrice Boivin
   Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)

   Systems Admin  Operations | Admin. et Exploit. des systèmes
   Technology Services| Services technologiques
   Informatics Branch | Direction de l'informatique
   Maritimes Region, DFO  | Région des Maritimes, MPO

   E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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   --
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 INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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Re: Oracle 10i features

2002-11-12 Thread Jan Pruner

Blah, you DON'T understand it.
This will be the biggest upgrade of Oracle software in last 15 year.
The administrators get possibility to enjoy first time the power of mutimedia, 
network and great user interface like dekstop users have.
Till today poor administrators have to work with command line and use absurd 
SSH to connect to server (Don't tell me you still use VIM!).
Now you will get the enhanced XP desktop with variable skins and virtual 
desktops!!!

:-)

On Tuesday 12 November 2002 17:54, you wrote:
 Are you trying to KILL the product with MS bloat-ware?

 -Original Message-
 Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 11:34 AM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


 MS Word as SQL editor?
 MS Excel as sqlplus?
 Outlook as Instance Manager?

 :-)

 On Tuesday 12 November 2002 15:58, you wrote:
  .NET?
 
   -Original Message-
   From: Boivin, Patrice J [mailto:BoivinP;mar.dfo-mpo.gc.ca]
   Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 7:59 AM
   To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
   Subject: Oracle 10i features
  
  
   Any rumours about what might be included in 10i?
  
  
   Regards,
   Patrice Boivin
   Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)
  
   Systems Admin  Operations | Admin. et Exploit. des systèmes
   Technology Services| Services technologiques
   Informatics Branch | Direction de l'informatique
   Maritimes Region, DFO  | Région des Maritimes, MPO
  
   E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  
  
   --
   Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
   --
   Author: Boivin, Patrice J
 INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  
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-- 
 Pruner Jan
   [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 http://jan.pruner.cz/
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Re[2]: Oracle 10i features

2002-11-12 Thread dgoulet

HEY, enough of the Gates empty promises!!

Reply Separator
Author: Jan Pruner [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date:   11/12/2002 9:29 AM

Blah, you DON'T understand it.
This will be the biggest upgrade of Oracle software in last 15 year.
The administrators get possibility to enjoy first time the power of mutimedia, 
network and great user interface like dekstop users have.
Till today poor administrators have to work with command line and use absurd 
SSH to connect to server (Don't tell me you still use VIM!).
Now you will get the enhanced XP desktop with variable skins and virtual 
desktops!!!

:-)

On Tuesday 12 November 2002 17:54, you wrote:
 Are you trying to KILL the product with MS bloat-ware?

 -Original Message-
 Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 11:34 AM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


 MS Word as SQL editor?
 MS Excel as sqlplus?
 Outlook as Instance Manager?

 :-)

 On Tuesday 12 November 2002 15:58, you wrote:
  .NET?
 
   -Original Message-
   From: Boivin, Patrice J [mailto:BoivinP;mar.dfo-mpo.gc.ca]
   Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 7:59 AM
   To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
   Subject: Oracle 10i features
  
  
   Any rumours about what might be included in 10i?
  
  
   Regards,
   Patrice Boivin
   Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)
  
   Systems Admin  Operations | Admin. et Exploit. des systèmes
   Technology Services| Services technologiques
   Informatics Branch | Direction de l'informatique
   Maritimes Region, DFO  | Région des Maritimes, MPO
  
   E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  
  
   --
   Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
   --
   Author: Boivin, Patrice J
 INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  
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-- 
 Pruner Jan
   [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 http://jan.pruner.cz/
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Re: Oracle 10i features

2002-11-12 Thread Tim Gorman

I can't let you do that, Dave.

Stop.  Stop.  Stop.  What are you doing, Dave?

- Original Message -
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 10:23 AM


Nope, I'm just preparing  software for Mr. David Bowman
and the Discovery.

 -Original Message-
 From: Mirsky, Greg [mailto:gmirsky;Estee.com]
 Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 11:55 AM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
 Subject: RE: Oracle 10i features


 Are you trying to KILL the product with MS bloat-ware?

 -Original Message-
 Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 11:34 AM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


 MS Word as SQL editor?
 MS Excel as sqlplus?
 Outlook as Instance Manager?

 :-)

 On Tuesday 12 November 2002 15:58, you wrote:
  .NET?
 
   -Original Message-
   From: Boivin, Patrice J [mailto:BoivinP;mar.dfo-mpo.gc.ca]
   Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 7:59 AM
   To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
   Subject: Oracle 10i features
  
  
   Any rumours about what might be included in 10i?
  
  
   Regards,
   Patrice Boivin
   Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)
  
   Systems Admin  Operations | Admin. et Exploit. des systèmes
   Technology Services| Services technologiques
   Informatics Branch | Direction de l'informatique
   Maritimes Region, DFO  | Région des Maritimes, MPO
  
   E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  
  
   --
   Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
   --
   Author: Boivin, Patrice J
 INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  
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 http://jan.pruner.cz/
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Re: Oracle 10i features

2002-11-12 Thread Lyndon Tiu

Oracle XP ?

On Tuesday 12 November 2002 09:29 am, Jan Pruner wrote:
 Blah, you DON'T understand it.
 This will be the biggest upgrade of Oracle software in last 15 year.
 The administrators get possibility to enjoy first time the power of
 mutimedia, network and great user interface like dekstop users have.
 Till today poor administrators have to work with command line and use
 absurd SSH to connect to server (Don't tell me you still use VIM!).
 Now you will get the enhanced XP desktop with variable skins and virtual
 desktops!!!

 :-)

 On Tuesday 12 November 2002 17:54, you wrote:
  Are you trying to KILL the product with MS bloat-ware?
 
  -Original Message-
  Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 11:34 AM
  To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
 
 
  MS Word as SQL editor?
  MS Excel as sqlplus?
  Outlook as Instance Manager?
 
  :-)
 
  On Tuesday 12 November 2002 15:58, you wrote:
   .NET?
  
-Original Message-
From: Boivin, Patrice J [mailto:BoivinP;mar.dfo-mpo.gc.ca]
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 7:59 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
Subject: Oracle 10i features
   
   
Any rumours about what might be included in 10i?
   
   
Regards,
Patrice Boivin
Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)
   
Systems Admin  Operations | Admin. et Exploit. des systèmes
Technology Services| Services technologiques
Informatics Branch | Direction de l'informatique
Maritimes Region, DFO  | Région des Maritimes, MPO
   
E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
   
   
--
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
--
Author: Boivin, Patrice J
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
   
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RE: Destination address unreachable

2002-11-12 Thread Miller, Jay

Hmm, the same way 8.0.1 was stable, and 8.1.5 was stable, and...?

-Original Message-
Sent: Friday, November 08, 2002 2:09 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


So, in my opinion, Oracle really has no choice but to pursue the course that
it is. I think they have learned some lessons down the road, and I'm willing
to bet that 10.0.1 (or whatever) will be far more stable than 9.0.1 was.

RF

Robert G. Freeman - Oracle OCP
Oracle Database Architect
CSX Midtier Database Administration
Author of several Oracle books you can find on Amazon.com!

Londo Mollari: Ah, arrogance and stupidity all in the same package. How
efficient of you. 

 

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Re: Oracle 10i features

2002-11-12 Thread Nicolai Tufar

It was just over a year ago when Larry
declared Oracle 9i the best database ever!





- Original Message -
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 7:29 PM


Blah, you DON'T understand it.
This will be the biggest upgrade of Oracle software in last 15 year.
The administrators get possibility to enjoy first time the power of
mutimedia,
network and great user interface like dekstop users have.
Till today poor administrators have to work with command line and use absurd
SSH to connect to server (Don't tell me you still use VIM!).
Now you will get the enhanced XP desktop with variable skins and virtual
desktops!!!

:-)

On Tuesday 12 November 2002 17:54, you wrote:
 Are you trying to KILL the product with MS bloat-ware?

 -Original Message-
 Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 11:34 AM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


 MS Word as SQL editor?
 MS Excel as sqlplus?
 Outlook as Instance Manager?

 :-)

 On Tuesday 12 November 2002 15:58, you wrote:
  .NET?
 
   -Original Message-
   From: Boivin, Patrice J [mailto:BoivinP;mar.dfo-mpo.gc.ca]
   Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 7:59 AM
   To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
   Subject: Oracle 10i features
  
  
   Any rumours about what might be included in 10i?
  
  
   Regards,
   Patrice Boivin
   Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)
  
   Systems Admin  Operations | Admin. et Exploit. des systèmes
   Technology Services| Services technologiques
   Informatics Branch | Direction de l'informatique
   Maritimes Region, DFO  | Région des Maritimes, MPO
  
   E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  
  
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RE: Oracle 10i features

 -Original Message-
 Now you will get the enhanced XP desktop with variable skins 
 and virtual desktops!!! 
---
Which Unix had YEARS ago ... except for the XP part.
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Oracle 9.2.0.1/2 on Mandrake 9

2002-11-12 Thread Boris Dali


Hope not everybody is off to OOW :(

Did anybody get the above combo working? I know that
Oracle is not certified on Mandrake and I don't
care... as long as I can make it work that is

Here are the facts:
1) HW: One way 2.4 GH box with 1GB DDR RAM, plenty of
disk space
2) SW/OS: Mandrake 9 / 2.4.19-16mdk enterprise w/ the
latest security patches applied
3) Plenty of swap (as per free, swapon -s, cat
/proc/swaps) and /temp

Here's `rpm -q gcc cpp glibc-devel kernel-headers
binutils` output:

gcc-3.2-1mdk
package cpp is not installed
glibc-devel-2.2.5-16mdk
kernel-headres-2.4.18-41mdk
binutils-2.12.90.0.15-1mdk

OUI came up smoothly (had some troubles to convince it
to come up with 8.1.7 on the same box - previous
install, first OH). I went with Enterprise
DB/SoftwareOnly option

Problem: 
1) at 61% on PL/SQL Embedded Gateway install error
pops up:
Error in writting to
$OH/wwg/admin/images/credits.gif

- fuser on credits.gif doesn't show that somebody is
using it
- deleteting it (and/or the whole $OH/wwg directory)
doesn't help as OUI simply re-creates them and gets
stuck on the same error message
- oraInventory log doesn't add any additional info
- tried to re-install it I think a dosen times by now
in diff. variations (Custom/w seed DB/ etc.) with the
same result
- applying 9.2.0.2 patch and re-install of the same
component didn't help eigther (not sure why I expected
it to help, but I seemed to exaust all the other
options)...

Is it a bad disk sector (no idea how to check disk for
bad sectors on Linux)? Is it Oracle's corrupted jar
file (no idea how to find name of the jar and test it
for corruptions)?

2) The above error wouldn't bother me too much (no
other errors at the install phase), but I also got
stuck at the relinking phase which seem to be related
to the error above. 

The reason is that my $OH/rdbms/lib is missing
config.c, opimai.o, ssoraed.o, ttcsoi.o and may be
others. So cancelling/ignoring PL/SQL Embedded Gateway
component (what is it anyway? Sounds like Transparent
gateways to Bill/Informix/DB2 etc. to me) seem to
cancel installation of some critical files needed for
relinking...

Coping config.c from 8.1.7.4 (different binary
tree/OH, even diff OS acount) doesn't seem to help:

make -f ins_rdbms.mk config

fails with infamous Error 1 error. Coping config.o
and the rest 3 o files missing and relinking via
relink oracle or make -f ins_rdbms.mk install gets
a little futher, but fails latter with the same Error
1

Reasons? Others seem to indicate 2 prime reasons: -z
defs issue and binutils version:

a- -z defs in LD_SELF_CONTAINED inside $OH/genclntsh
doesn't seem to be an issue in my case. Oracle
automatically comments it out, but even if I uncomment
it and re-run genclntsh I get the same result:

basename: too few arguments
Try 'basename --help'
cp: missing file arguments
Try 'cp --help'
...
Created $OH/lib/libclntst9.a

So not everything is 100%, but at least I got
libclntst9.a generated eigther way

b- binutils? Not sure if it's still an issue in 9.2.
Mine seems to be way higher than the one Oracle was
ready to swallow in 9.1. I know for sure I didn't have
a problem with 9.0.1 on Mandrake 8.0...


Net result so far: I can confirm that Oracle Client
9.2 works like a charm on Mandrake9 :(. As far as the
rest, so far I fail to get oracle, orapwd and others
in my $OH/bin...

Any help would be appreciated.

TIA,
Boris


__ 
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dumping microsoft desktop?

2002-11-12 Thread Ray Stell


Has anyone ever gone with linux desktop support?  I don't mean 
for geeks, I mean at an enterprise level?  
===
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RE: dumping microsoft desktop?

2002-11-12 Thread Farnsworth, Dave

Who you calling geeks??  ;o)

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 1:04 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



Has anyone ever gone with linux desktop support?  I don't mean 
for geeks, I mean at an enterprise level?  
===
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RE: Oracle 10i features

Good grief.  Like I'm going to go through all of that overhead and hassle?
And isn't 9iAS a separately licensable (read: cost) option, even if you're
already licensed for EE?

I think I'm reading the same PDF you were, Raj:

The Console interacts with the Oracle Management Service, which, as a J2EE
Web Application hosted by an Oracle9i application Server, leverages all of
the reliability, scalability, and robustness of the Oracle9iAS instance.

I wish I has time to work on the KISS-method OEM replacement I started...
sigh

Rich

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[EMAIL PROTECTED]  Quad/Tech International, Sussex, WI USA

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 10:40 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


New EM4.0 (announced today) has a bunch of new features ... was just reading
the PDF ... but it needs 9iAS ... that is a bummer ... more info on oracle
website ...
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RE: Oracle taking 100% CPU

2002-11-12 Thread Sergei

Title: Oracle taking 100% CPU









Hello. I used to run Oracle 8.1.7 on
Win2000. I had a similar problem with
oracle taking 100% CPU for no apparent reason. Check the version of service pack,
installing the latest will help. 



Does Oracle archive now? Sometimes, oracle does not see if you
free up space unless you reboot the server.



Hope this helps.



Sergei.



-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Hussain
Ahmed Qadri
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002
2:19 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list
ORACLE-L
Subject: Oracle taking 100% CPU



HI all, 

We have a development server, a replica of the
production. Some process produced a lot of archives and it ran out of archiving
space. Now it was the only location specified for the archives and it was
mandatory. So when no space was left on it to store the newly produced
archives, it should have stopped working. But it didn't. I deleted the archives
and closed every session and shut down the database and restarted it. But
eversince I restarted it, (and I have done it 3-4 times already) Oracle is
using 100%CPU. I have left the server on, without any body connecting to it,
(users can connect as the database is OPEN without any problem, its just some
transaction-cleaning or background process which is going on) but the server
remains unchanged i.e. using 100% for over an hour (after an hour I shut it
down and restarted and it still is the same)

There is no unusual entry in the alert lofile or any
trace files. I can't do any query to find out anything, as the system is so
slow. There is no problem of space either. Event viewer of Win2000
also shows nothing unusual or new.

Any ideas, its somewhat urgent. 

Hussain

Re: cant set multiblock read count 8 !!!

2002-11-12 Thread Stephane Faroult

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 Rahul,
 I believe there is an O/S maximum setting of this parameter to be 64K  (this
 covers AIX and HP and and may affect others)
 This fits in with your finding so I am sure it is correct
 
 John
 -Original Message-
 Sent: 12 November 2002 09:11
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
 
 list !!
 my ora7.3.2 instance on AIX with a db_block_size of 4k has a
 multi block read count of 16 !!
 
 i thought i would create a new instance with a block size of 8k, so i can
 set
 the max multiblock read count to more than 16, BUT, after creating the new
 instance
 the db_multiblock_read_count *always* defaults to 8 !!
 
 here the new instance params
 
 db_files = 16
 db_file_multiblock_read_count = 32
 db_block_buffers = 3840
 db_file_simultaneous_writes = 8
 db_block_lru_latches = 8
 shared_pool_size = 31457280
 
 which of these parameter is affecting the value of multiblock read count ???
 
 TIA
 Rahul
 
 PS: i hv checked the multiblock reads using ixora script... always 8 !!
 
 --
 Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
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 Author: Rahul
   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 

Rahul,

   There is an extremely  interesting paper on Connor McDonald's site,

   http://www.oracledba.co.uk/tips/mbrc.htm

-- 
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Stephane Faroult
Oriole Software
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Re: dumping microsoft desktop?

2002-11-12 Thread Gene Sais

Not here but looking into http://www.lindows.com on a personal nature.  Also read MS 
is suing them, not sure how much longer they will be around.

 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 11/12/02 02:03PM 

Has anyone ever gone with linux desktop support?  I don't mean 
for geeks, I mean at an enterprise level?  
===
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RE: Oracle 10i features

iDS9iRel2 is quite a suite, it includes Designer now.

So... in one suite... Apache + Developer Server (Forms + Reports + Graphics)
+ Discoverer + Portal + Designer + Web Cache + Internet Cache + Wireless
Portal + DAD administration + OEM Management Server all in one easy to use
kit.

What's wrong with packaging the Oracle rdbms in there too?  I don't
understand what all the fuss is about.

Regards,
Patrice Boivin
Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 3:14 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Good grief.  Like I'm going to go through all of that overhead and hassle?
And isn't 9iAS a separately licensable (read: cost) option, even if you're
already licensed for EE?

I think I'm reading the same PDF you were, Raj:

The Console interacts with the Oracle Management Service, which, as a J2EE
Web Application hosted by an Oracle9i application Server, leverages all of
the reliability, scalability, and robustness of the Oracle9iAS instance.

I wish I has time to work on the KISS-method OEM replacement I started...
sigh

Rich

--
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[EMAIL PROTECTED]  Quad/Tech International, Sussex, WI USA

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 10:40 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


New EM4.0 (announced today) has a bunch of new features ... was just reading
the PDF ... but it needs 9iAS ... that is a bummer ... more info on oracle
website ...
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Re: Oracle daylight saving

2002-11-12 Thread timboles

Oracle also uses an internal time that is not related to the server time in order to 
record transactions.  Other wise you would have trouble with SCN numbers when 
recovering or backing up a database.  This internal time is based on the number of 
seconds from a set date in the past, which I believe someone told me was the moment 
oracle was incorporated.  

Tim Boles

Original from :John Dunn [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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 How does Oracle handle daylight saving time changes. presumably it gets its
 time from the OS?
 
 John
 
 
 
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 .



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RE: dumping microsoft desktop?

The EU is considering it... I am not sure what desktop there is for LINUX
though, whether any of them compare to MS Office in terms of features, ease
of use,  etc.


http://www.globetechnology.com/servlet/ArticleNews/einsider/RTGAM/20021104/g
topenms/einsider//

Regards,
Patrice Boivin
Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 3:04 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L



Has anyone ever gone with linux desktop support?  I don't mean 
for geeks, I mean at an enterprise level?  
===
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  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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Re: Parsing tnsnames.ora

2002-11-12 Thread Stephane Faroult

Orr, Steve wrote:
 
 Anyone have a ready-made regular expression to parse out the net8 service
 name labels from tnsnames.ora? Perl is OK. What I'm looking for is a way to
 get a list of possible connections from tnsnames.ora. For example, from the
 below I just want a regular expression which returns label1 and label2...
 
 label1 = (description_list=
   (description=
  (address=(...))
  (connect_data=(...)))
   (description=
  (address=(...))
  (connect_data=(...)))
 )
 
 label2 = (description_list=
   (description=
  (address=(...))
  (connect_data=(...)))
   (description=
  (address=(...))
  (connect_data=(...)))
 )
 
 
 AtDhVaAnNkCsE 
 
 Steve Orr
 Bozeman, Montana
 --
 Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
 --

Steve,

You may be interested by one of the numerous things our webmaster forgot
to post on the Oriole site :

==CUT HERE=

/*

*
 *
 * tnsparse.c - Copyright (c) Oriole Software, 2001
 *
 * Downloaded from http://www.oriole.com
 *
 * Reads a tnsnames.ora file on its standard input and writes
 * tnsaliastabhosttabsid
 * to its standard output.
 *
 * This can be used for a number of things:
 *   o to generate a clean inventory and load it into, say, a
spreadsheet
 * or build a HTML page. This can easily be done with the
following
 * awk program :
 *
 * BEGIN {
 *print HTML;
 *print HEAD;
 *print   TITLEOracle databases/TITLE;
 *print /HEAD;
 *print BODY TEXT=BLACK BGCOLOR=WHITE;
 *print CENTER;
 *print TABLE WIDTH=\80%\;
 *print TR BGCOLOR=NAVY;
 *print TDBFONT COLOR=GOLDTNS
Alias/FONT/B/TD;
 *print TDBFONT COLOR=GOLDHost/FONT/B/TD;
 *print TDBFONT COLOR=GOLDService
Name/FONT/B/TD;
 *print /TR;
 *   }
 * {
 *  if (NR %2 == 1)
 * {
 *  print TR BGCOLOR=LIGHTCYAN;
 * }
 *   else
 * {
 *  print TR BGCOLOR=LIGHTSKYBLUE;
 * }
 *  for (i = 1; i = NF; i++)
 * {
 *  printf(TD%s/TD\n, $i);
 * }
 *  print /TR;
 * }
 * END {
 *  print /TABLE;
 *  print /CENTER;
 *  print /BODY;
 *  print /HTML;
 * }
 *
 *   o to clean-up (ordering by alphabetical order, say) or merge
easily
 * (removing duplicate entries) existing tnsnames.ora file.
 * Assuming that you only have TCP/IP and are always using the
same
 * port (say 1526), a clean tnsnames.ora file can easily be
 * regenerated feeding the (cooked) output of tnsparse into an
awk
 * programme such as :
 *
 * {
 *  printf(%s=\n, $1);
 *  printf((DESCRIPTION =\n);
 *  printf((ADDRESS_LIST =\n);
 *  printf((ADDRESS =\n);
 *  printf(  (COMMUNITY = your_company.world)\n);
 *  printf(  (PROTOCOL = TCP)\n);
 *  printf(  (Host = %s)\n, $2);
 *  printf(  (port = 1526)\n);
 *  printf()\n);
 *  printf()\n);
 *  printf((CONNECT_DATA =\n);
 *  printf(   (SID = %s)\n, $3);
 *  printf(   (GLOBAL_NAME = %s.WORLD)\n, $3);
 *  printf()\n);
 *  printf()  \n);
 *  printf(\n);
 * }
 *
 *

 *
 * To build tnsparse :
 * cc tnsparse.c -o tnsparse
 * 
 * To use it :
 * tnsparse  $ORACLE_HOME/network/admin/tnsnames.ora 
tnslist.txt
 *
 * Tries to support both pre and post 8.1 formats.
 *
 * Note that the program is a bit too sophisticated for what it
does.
 * We hope that it will make it easier for you to modify it and
extract
 * more data (for instance, the listener port when using TCP/IP) to
suit
 * your needs.
 *

 *
 *This program for Oracle database administration is free software;
you
 *can redistribute it and/or modify it under the terms of the GNU
General
 *Public License as published by the Free Software Foundation;
either
 *version 2 of the License, or any later version.
 *
 *This program is distributed in the hope that it will be useful,
 *but WITHOUT ANY WARRANTY; without even the implied warranty of
 *MERCHANTABILITY or FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE.  See the
 *GNU General Public License for more details.
 *
 *You should have

RE: dumping microsoft desktop?

That would be OS distributed with PCs by Wal-Mart in Australia...

I didn't know they were being sued by MS, though.

Pat.

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 3:58 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Not here but looking into http://www.lindows.com on a personal nature.  Also
read MS is suing them, not sure how much longer they will be around.

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RE: Oracle 10i features


KISS works very well!  It's called Korn Shell.  (Propeller-heads call it
bash. Heck if I know why.)  A very useful piece is netterm:

http://www.securenetterm.com/html/netterm.html


Oh yeah, I should mention: This doesn't work well with NT.

 
 I wish I has time to work on the KISS-method OEM replacement 
 I started...
 sigh
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RE: Is nothing sacred? (Oracle vs The Experts)

2002-11-12 Thread Cary Millsap

Rich,

I think the answer to your question #1 is, Because a lot of people
aren't careful. They repeat something because they heard or read it, or
because they tried it once and it worked. Trying something once and
seeing it work is not sufficient to prove a cause-effect relationship.
The index thing is a great example of people completely missing the
relevant parameter for two whole decades.

In response to #2, there's a standard format for bad advice. Any time
you see a statement of fact that contains no where-clause, then it's
probably not true. If the statement doesn't contain the word if or
when or depend, then it's probably a good idea to construct a test
(or find someone who is willing to produce the details of one, which is
what guys like Tom Kyte, Steve Adams, and Jonathan Lewis are so
excellent at doing).

On the other hand, the TUSC/Oracle Press tuning tips  techniques book
expresses ideas almost exclusively in this where-clause-free format.
Actually, though, the extraordinarily high ratio of this book's false
ideas to total ideas, combined with the book's prodigious size, make it
quite an inspirational source for someone who wants to create
interesting performance tests.


Cary Millsap
Hotsos Enterprises, Ltd.
http://www.hotsos.com

Upcoming events:
- Hotsos Clinic, Dec 9-11 Honolulu
- 2003 Hotsos Symposium on OracleR System Performance, Feb 9-12 Dallas
- Jonathan Lewis' Optimising Oracle, Nov 19-21 Dallas


-Original Message-
Rich
Sent: Monday, November 11, 2002 10:58 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L

So, there I am, on 8.1.7.2 (and .4) on HP/UX 11.0, with a process that
runs
20 minutes out of every hour of the day (despite my protests to it's
design).  After it starts having problems (go figure), it becomes a
priority
to speed it up.

Thanks to a 10046 trace, we see that the query taking the most elapsed
time
does FTSs on each of two very small tables (1 block and 4 blocks -- 8K
blocksize).  These tables are not indexed, as per the official Oracle
recommendation.  After reading the excellent Hotsos paper When to index
a
table (THANKS, CARY!), I added an index to reduce elapsed time on this
query by 50% (150 to 75 seconds in test), proving to me that the paper
is
valid.  And I've only read to page four!

OK, first I'm taught by Oracle to look at Buffer Cache Hit Ratios as a
measure of performance, then told (and thoroughly convinced) by experts
that
this is bunk.  Now, I found out that the 15% (or 10% or whatever,
depending
on version) ratio of rows returned to total rows in determining when to
use
an index in a query is garbage.

1)  Why is this?

2)  What other pearls of performance wisdom from Oracle Corp should I
completely disregard as false?

I know there's an Oracle Fallacy website somewhere...

It just looks bad on me, our department, and Oracle when, once again,
something I've been preaching to our developers as gospel turns out to
be
completely false.

Maybe I'm grumpy because it's snowing on my leaves right now...  sigh


Rich


Rich Jesse   System/Database Administrator
[EMAIL PROTECTED]  Quad/Tech International, Sussex, WI
USA

Disclaimer:  I only said the Packers would be 12-4 this year -- I never
said
that they couldn't do better!  WOO-HOO!  :)
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Re: Oracle 9.2.0.1/2 on Mandrake 9

2002-11-12 Thread Ray Stell

On Tue, Nov 12, 2002 at 10:53:37AM -0800, Boris Dali wrote:
 
 Hope not everybody is off to OOW :(
 
 Did anybody get the above combo working? I know that



I have installed Oracle 9.2.0.1 on Mandrake 9 twice
on marginal machines without any such behavior.  Could
you have gotten an i/o error on the disk?

# pwd
/db03/app/oracle/product/9.2.0/wwg/admin/images
[root@haglid images]# ls -l credits.gif
-rw-r--r--1 oracle   oinstall   181222 Jul 12  2000 credits.gif
 
I was just about to patch them, so I am nervous about
getting to 9.2.0.2, hope to do that today.

===
Ray Stell   [EMAIL PROTECTED] (540) 231-4109 KE4TJC28^D
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High current reads from fetch in query.

Hey all,

As I'm doing some perf tuning on a procedure using a 10046 trace with tkprof
(8.1.7 on HP/UX 11.0).  One of the queries from the tkprof has the following
output:

-

SELECT QPM.PRODUCTLINE PL,MIN(PLN.PLANNERNO) PNO   
FROM
 VISIB.QT_PRODUCTLINE_MEMBERS QPM,VISIB.PLANNERS PLN  WHERE 
  UPPER(RTRIM(QPM.USERID)) = UPPER(RTRIM(PLN.PLANNER))  AND QPM.PRODUCTLINE
= 
  :b1  GROUP BY PRODUCTLINE


call count   cpuelapsed   disk  querycurrent
rows
--- --   -- -- -- --
--
Parse1  0.00   0.00  0  0  0
0
Execute  66491 19.21  20.59  0  0  0
0
Fetch   132982 83.54  90.78 88 332455 531928
66491
--- --   -- -- -- --
--
total   199474102.75 111.37 88 332455 531928
66491

Misses in library cache during parse: 1
Optimizer goal: CHOOSE
Parsing user id: 256  (QT_PRODSCHED)   (recursive depth: 1)

Rows Execution Plan
---  ---
  0  SELECT STATEMENT   GOAL: CHOOSE
  0   SORT (GROUP BY NOSORT)
  0HASH JOIN
  0 TABLE ACCESS   GOAL: ANALYZED (FULL) OF 
'QT_PRODUCTLINE_MEMBERS'
  0 TABLE ACCESS   GOAL: ANALYZED (FULL) OF 'PLANNERS'

-

Yes, this is obviously bad by design.  What I don't understand is the high
current count.  From the docs, it says that this is normal for DML, but
says nothing about what this means for queries.  The SELECT statement is
defined as a cursor, and there is no FOR UPDATE OF clause in the cursor.

I've searched through Metalink about this, but haven't had any luck.  Does
anyone have an explanation?

TIA,
Rich


Rich Jesse   System/Database Administrator
[EMAIL PROTECTED]  Quad/Tech International, Sussex, WI USA
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Backup/Restore

Hello,
   I need to comeup with backup strategy for my 
   production oracle systems running 9iR2 on Solaris9.

   I do have veritas Netbackup installed. I would 
   really appreciate if someone can answer these 
   important questions for me.

1- Do I need to install Veritas Oracle agent for 
   backup?
2- What are COMPLETE steps involved to 
   backup/restore if I want to use Veritas for
   this purpose? 
3- I am using following script to create backup on

   the local disk. This script does not delete the
   archive log files after backing 'em up. Why 
   not? I am using this script at RMAN prompt.   
   (connect to recvcat)

run {
allocate channel c1 type disk; 
backup 
full
#incremental level 2 # 0 1 2 or up
skip inaccessible 
tag hot_db_bk_level0 
filesperset 5 
# recommended format 
format '/data/oraidx/backup/bk_%s_%p_%t' 
(database); 
sql 'alter system archive log current'; 
# backup all archive logs 
backup 
filesperset 20 
format '/data/oraidx/backup/al_%s_%p_%t' 
(archivelog all 
delete input); 
release channel c1; 
} 
 
   4- What is the procedure to restore using files 
  created as output of above script?
   5- Any ideas/links  to help improve backup
  strategy, using veritas and RMAN.
Thanks.

OraCop


__
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U2 on LAUNCH - Exclusive greatest hits videos
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RE: Is nothing sacred? (Oracle vs The Experts)

2002-11-12 Thread Cary Millsap

I think the question Is nothing sacred? is an interesting one. Lots of
these things we're talking about have been false for a very long time.
It's only that people are finally starting to notice them. Product
changes are often *not* what's driving new knowledge. In many cases,
the change that's taking place is the improvement in the quality of
our conclusions.

Is nothing sacred? I think it's perfectly legitimate to confront
people's (and companies') conjectures with scientific data.


Cary Millsap
Hotsos Enterprises, Ltd.
http://www.hotsos.com

Upcoming events:
- Hotsos Clinic, Dec 9-11 Honolulu
- 2003 Hotsos Symposium on OracleR System Performance, Feb 9-12 Dallas
- Jonathan Lewis' Optimising Oracle, Nov 19-21 Dallas


-Original Message-
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 10:19 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L

Jesse,

No, nothing in sacred any more.  Change is the theme of the day.
BTW: did
you experiment with caching these tables in the keep_pool??  I've had
some real
good luck with unindexed tables that are small (in the 1 to 10 block
size) that
get assigned to the keep pool and retained in memory forever.

Also, BTW: I'll disagree with Cary and Hotsos on the costs of a PIO
vs a
LIO.  In my experience it's not such a clear cut distinction.  Whenever
Oracle
needs a block of data that data must be in memory which means that a PIO
requires 2 LIO's to fulfill the request and on top of that there may be
other
memory management routines that get called if an empty data block in
memory must
be created.  All in all it's a very mixed bag that needs to be
considered case
by case.  I believe that was one of the reasons Oracle allows us to
configure
the cache three ways.  Static, seldomly changed tables in the keep pool.
Large
constantly changing tables in the discard pool.  Also to index or not to
index
are no longer such clear cut item, especially with CBO which loves to
ignore
indexes.

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: Jesse; Rich [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date:   11/11/2002 8:58 AM

So, there I am, on 8.1.7.2 (and .4) on HP/UX 11.0, with a process that
runs
20 minutes out of every hour of the day (despite my protests to it's
design).  After it starts having problems (go figure), it becomes a
priority
to speed it up.

Thanks to a 10046 trace, we see that the query taking the most elapsed
time
does FTSs on each of two very small tables (1 block and 4 blocks -- 8K
blocksize).  These tables are not indexed, as per the official Oracle
recommendation.  After reading the excellent Hotsos paper When to index
a
table (THANKS, CARY!), I added an index to reduce elapsed time on this
query by 50% (150 to 75 seconds in test), proving to me that the paper
is
valid.  And I've only read to page four!

OK, first I'm taught by Oracle to look at Buffer Cache Hit Ratios as a
measure of performance, then told (and thoroughly convinced) by experts
that
this is bunk.  Now, I found out that the 15% (or 10% or whatever,
depending
on version) ratio of rows returned to total rows in determining when to
use
an index in a query is garbage.

1)  Why is this?

2)  What other pearls of performance wisdom from Oracle Corp should I
completely disregard as false?

I know there's an Oracle Fallacy website somewhere...

It just looks bad on me, our department, and Oracle when, once again,
something I've been preaching to our developers as gospel turns out to
be
completely false.

Maybe I'm grumpy because it's snowing on my leaves right now...  sigh


Rich


Rich Jesse   System/Database Administrator
[EMAIL PROTECTED]  Quad/Tech International, Sussex, WI
USA

Disclaimer:  I only said the Packers would be 12-4 this year -- I never
said
that they couldn't do better!  WOO-HOO!  :)
-- 
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RE: High current reads from fetch in query.

2002-11-12 Thread Cary Millsap

Sort blocks.


Cary Millsap
Hotsos Enterprises, Ltd.
http://www.hotsos.com

Upcoming events:
- Hotsos Clinic, Dec 9-11 Honolulu
- 2003 Hotsos Symposium on OracleR System Performance, Feb 9-12 Dallas
- Jonathan Lewis' Optimising Oracle, Nov 19-21 Dallas


-Original Message-
Rich
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 2:19 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L

Hey all,

As I'm doing some perf tuning on a procedure using a 10046 trace with
tkprof
(8.1.7 on HP/UX 11.0).  One of the queries from the tkprof has the
following
output:

-

SELECT QPM.PRODUCTLINE PL,MIN(PLN.PLANNERNO) PNO   
FROM
 VISIB.QT_PRODUCTLINE_MEMBERS QPM,VISIB.PLANNERS PLN  WHERE 
  UPPER(RTRIM(QPM.USERID)) = UPPER(RTRIM(PLN.PLANNER))  AND
QPM.PRODUCTLINE
= 
  :b1  GROUP BY PRODUCTLINE


call count   cpuelapsed   disk  querycurrent
rows
--- --   -- -- -- --
--
Parse1  0.00   0.00  0  0  0
0
Execute  66491 19.21  20.59  0  0  0
0
Fetch   132982 83.54  90.78 88 332455 531928
66491
--- --   -- -- -- --
--
total   199474102.75 111.37 88 332455 531928
66491

Misses in library cache during parse: 1
Optimizer goal: CHOOSE
Parsing user id: 256  (QT_PRODSCHED)   (recursive depth: 1)

Rows Execution Plan
---  ---
  0  SELECT STATEMENT   GOAL: CHOOSE
  0   SORT (GROUP BY NOSORT)
  0HASH JOIN
  0 TABLE ACCESS   GOAL: ANALYZED (FULL) OF 
'QT_PRODUCTLINE_MEMBERS'
  0 TABLE ACCESS   GOAL: ANALYZED (FULL) OF 'PLANNERS'

-

Yes, this is obviously bad by design.  What I don't understand is the
high
current count.  From the docs, it says that this is normal for DML,
but
says nothing about what this means for queries.  The SELECT statement is
defined as a cursor, and there is no FOR UPDATE OF clause in the
cursor.

I've searched through Metalink about this, but haven't had any luck.
Does
anyone have an explanation?

TIA,
Rich


Rich Jesse   System/Database Administrator
[EMAIL PROTECTED]  Quad/Tech International, Sussex, WI
USA
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  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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User Package

2002-11-12 Thread Seema Singh

Hi
I am having one of user created packages.Whenever this package executed by 
users the CPU utilisation on BOX high.How to fix this package problem
thx
-Seema





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Re: Oracle 9.2.0.1/2 on Mandrake 9

2002-11-12 Thread Boris Dali

Thanks for reply, Ray.

I guess disk explanation is the most logical one to
assume, but I've no idea how to confirm and overcome
it. As I mentioned I re-installed it in different
combinations multiple times. Would this file always go
the same place on disk (say same bad sector)?

One interesting thing I've noticed after comparing
your ls -l output with mine is that all other 4 image
files in this directory are dated way back to 2000
timeframe, whereas credits.gif has a time stamp of
yestarday (day I tried the installation last time). I
can view the file with the browser, however. What does
it tell me?

 --- Ray Stell [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:  On Tue,
Nov 12, 2002 at 10:53:37AM -0800, Boris Dali
 wrote:
  
  Hope not everybody is off to OOW :(
  
  Did anybody get the above combo working? I know
 that
 
 
 
 I have installed Oracle 9.2.0.1 on Mandrake 9 twice
 on marginal machines without any such behavior. 
 Could
 you have gotten an i/o error on the disk?
 
 # pwd
 /db03/app/oracle/product/9.2.0/wwg/admin/images
 [root@haglid images]# ls -l credits.gif
 -rw-r--r--1 oracle   oinstall   181222 Jul 12 
 2000 credits.gif
  
 I was just about to patch them, so I am nervous
 about
 getting to 9.2.0.2, hope to do that today.
 

===
 Ray Stell   [EMAIL PROTECTED] (540) 231-4109
 KE4TJC28^D
 -- 
 Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ:
 http://www.orafaq.com
 -- 
 Author: Ray Stell
   INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 
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 E-Mail message
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 ORACLE-L
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 from).  You may
 also send the HELP command for other information
 (like subscribing). 

__ 
Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca
-- 
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
-- 
Author: Boris Dali
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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SQL*Plus truncating lines




I'm calling each 
statement from SQL*Plus for Windows 9.2.0.1.0. When I connect to a 9.0.1 
database and execute a query, the output to the screen is truncated at 100 
characters. If the output is spooled to a file, all lines appear as expected. 
When the same session is connected to an 8.1.7 database, the output is not 
truncated. When the same statement is run on the box using the unix command line 
version, it is not truncated. 

linesize - 
150
command_string 
(column of output) a145
echo off pages 
0

Any clues as to why 
the database connection matters? Is it actually something with SQL*Net? Any 
other things to check?

Dan 
Fink

RE: Is nothing sacred? (Oracle vs The Experts)

chuckle  Sorry about that.  Is nothing sacred? was just being facetious.
Or at least goofy.  I'm more of goofy anyway.

Thanks once again, Cary, for your excellent responses (on a bunch of my
threads)!

Rich


Rich Jesse   System/Database Administrator
[EMAIL PROTECTED]  Quad/Tech International, Sussex, WI USA

 -Original Message-
 From: Cary Millsap [mailto:cary.millsap;hotsos.com]
 Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 3:24 PM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
 Subject: RE: Is nothing sacred? (Oracle vs The Experts)
 
 
 I think the question Is nothing sacred? is an interesting 
 one. Lots of
 these things we're talking about have been false for a very long time.
 It's only that people are finally starting to notice them. Product
 changes are often *not* what's driving new knowledge. In many cases,
 the change that's taking place is the improvement in the quality of
 our conclusions.
 
 Is nothing sacred? I think it's perfectly legitimate to confront
 people's (and companies') conjectures with scientific data.
 
 
 Cary Millsap
-- 
Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com
-- 
Author: Jesse, Rich
  INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

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San Diego, California-- Mailing list and web hosting services
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also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).

RE: Backup/Restore



You don't say if you are using catalog or not.  If not, be sure to backup
control files at end of backup.  For what it's worth here is what I do for
disk backups and no catalog.  Business critical databases use catalog and go
directly to tape using Networker (P.O.S. ... at least on Tru64).  I have
separate scripts for database and log files in case the archived log
destination gets dangerously full (monitored by cron job).

For database:

run {
allocate channel ch1 type disk format
'/u05/oracle/admin/HRP1/backup/%U_DATA';
set command id to 'rman';
backup
   tag backup_db_full
   (database include current controlfile);
release channel ch1;
}


For log files (we are duplexing on this database):

run {
allocate channel ch1 type disk format
'/u05/oracle/admin/HRP1/backup/%U_ARCH';
set command id to 'rman';
change archivelog all crosscheck;
backup
   (archivelog all delete input);
backup
   (archivelog like '/oracle/app/oracle/admin/HRP1/arch2/%' delete input);
release channel ch1;
allocate channel ch1 type disk format
'/u05/oracle/admin/HRP1/backup/%U_CONTROL';
backup current controlfile tag='backup';
release channel ch1;
sql ALTER DATABASE BACKUP CONTROLFILE TO
''/u05/oracle/admin/HRP1/backup/CONTROL_FILE.BAK'' REUSE;
}


If the database and all controlfiles got blown away, then the
CONTROL_FILE.BAK is your salvation.

The following script is kept handy as a fast reference for restoring.  I
run the commands by hand; but the script serves to jog my memory as to the
commands.  I've slept since I put this together, but I think some of the
commands are for when you have a catalog.

#!/bin/ksh

## Define variables for your SID
export ORACLE_SID=ABCXYZ
export USER=internal
export PASS=the_password

## With Oracle 9.X you must use sqlplus.
svrmgrl -XXX
   connect internal
   startup nomount
   exit
XXX

rman nocatalog -XXX
   connect target ${USER}/${PASS}@${ORACLE_SID}

   run {

### If you have control files, then you don't need format when allocating
channel.
  allocate channel ch1 type disk;

###   When you want to restore up to, but not including, a specific log
sequence number
###   For example, the database wants log 275, but all you have in rman
catalog are 273 and 274
#set until logseq=275 thread=1;

###   When you want to restore to a specific time.
# set until time to_date('2001-02-09 02:00:00','-MM-DD HH24:MI:SS');

###   Various syntax possibilities for restoring control files
#restore controlfile to '/u01/oradata/ORACLE_SID/control_01.ctl';
# restore controlfile to '/u02/oradata/ORACLE_SID/control_02.ctl';
# restore controlfile to '/u06/oradata/ORACLE_SID/control_03.ctl';
# replicate controlfile from '/u01/oradata/ORACLE_SID/control_01.ctl';
###   The following just restores them all.
###   DO NOT restore controlfile when doing a point in time recovery.
###   Most likely, you will not restore controlfile unless you have lost all
control files.
###   If you are not using a catalog, then you must copy a backup of the
control file at the OS level.
# restore controlfile;

  sql 'ALTER DATABASE MOUNT';
  restore database;
  You might or might not need restore archivelog.
  When doing backups to disk, you probably don't need it.
# restore archivelog all;
  recover database;
  If control file was restored, then you will probably need resetlogs.
# sql 'ALTER DATABASE OPEN RESETLOGS';
  sql 'ALTER DATABASE OPEN';

  release channel ch1;
  }

XXX


  If you had to restore the controlfiles (or hand-copy in backup
controfiles),
  or if you lost online redo log(s), or if you are missing archived
log(s),
  then, you will likely need to recover the database by hand using one
or
  more of the following commands.

## With Oracle 9.X you must use sqlplus.
##svrmgrl -XXX
## connect internal
## alter database recover using backup controlfile until cancel;
## alter database recover using backup controlfile;
## alter database recover until cancel;
## alter database recover;
## alter database open;
## alter database open resetlogs;
##XXX

  If you are using a catalog, then you will need to reset database
  in the catalog after restoring.
echo 
echo  -- DON'T FORGET -- DON'T FORGET --
echo Don't forget to RESET DATABASE in RMAN catalog.
echo  -- DON'T FORGET -- DON'T FORGET --
echo



 -Original Message-
 From: OraCop [mailto:oracop;yahoo.com]
 Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 2:29 PM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
 Subject: Backup/Restore 
 
 
 Hello,
I need to comeup with backup strategy for my 
production oracle systems running 9iR2 on Solaris9.
 
I do have veritas Netbackup installed. I would 
really appreciate if someone can answer these 
important questions for me.
 
 1- Do I need to install Veritas Oracle agent for 
backup?
 2- What are COMPLETE steps involved to 
backup/restore if I want to use Veritas for
this purpose? 
 3- I am

RE: Backup/Restore

Stephen: Thanks a lot for Ur response.
   How do U restore from the backup? 
   have a script?
   


--- Stephen Lee [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 
 You don't say if you are using catalog or not.  If
 not, be sure to backup
 control files at end of backup.  For what it's worth
 here is what I do for
 disk backups and no catalog.  Business critical
 databases use catalog and go
 directly to tape using Networker (P.O.S. ... at
 least on Tru64).  I have
 separate scripts for database and log files in case
 the archived log
 destination gets dangerously full (monitored by cron
 job).
 
 For database:
 
 run {
 allocate channel ch1 type disk format
 '/u05/oracle/admin/HRP1/backup/%U_DATA';
 set command id to 'rman';
 backup
tag backup_db_full
(database include current controlfile);
 release channel ch1;
 }
 
 
 For log files (we are duplexing on this database):
 
 run {
 allocate channel ch1 type disk format
 '/u05/oracle/admin/HRP1/backup/%U_ARCH';
 set command id to 'rman';
 change archivelog all crosscheck;
 backup
(archivelog all delete input);
 backup
(archivelog like
 '/oracle/app/oracle/admin/HRP1/arch2/%' delete
 input);
 release channel ch1;
 allocate channel ch1 type disk format
 '/u05/oracle/admin/HRP1/backup/%U_CONTROL';
 backup current controlfile tag='backup';
 release channel ch1;
 sql ALTER DATABASE BACKUP CONTROLFILE TO
 ''/u05/oracle/admin/HRP1/backup/CONTROL_FILE.BAK''
 REUSE;
 }
 
 
 If the database and all controlfiles got blown away,
 then the
 CONTROL_FILE.BAK is your salvation.
 
 The following script is kept handy as a fast
 reference for restoring.  I
 run the commands by hand; but the script serves to
 jog my memory as to the
 commands.  I've slept since I put this together, but
 I think some of the
 commands are for when you have a catalog.
 
 #!/bin/ksh
 
 ## Define variables for your SID
 export ORACLE_SID=ABCXYZ
 export USER=internal
 export PASS=the_password
 
 ## With Oracle 9.X you must use sqlplus.
 svrmgrl -XXX
connect internal
startup nomount
exit
 XXX
 
 rman nocatalog -XXX
connect target ${USER}/${PASS}@${ORACLE_SID}
 
run {
 
 ### If you have control files, then you don't need
 format when allocating
 channel.
   allocate channel ch1 type disk;
 
 ###   When you want to restore up to, but not
 including, a specific log
 sequence number
 ###   For example, the database wants log 275, but
 all you have in rman
 catalog are 273 and 274
 #set until logseq=275 thread=1;
 
 ###   When you want to restore to a specific time.
 # set until time to_date('2001-02-09
 02:00:00','-MM-DD HH24:MI:SS');
 
 ###   Various syntax possibilities for restoring
 control files
 #restore controlfile to
 '/u01/oradata/ORACLE_SID/control_01.ctl';
 # restore controlfile to
 '/u02/oradata/ORACLE_SID/control_02.ctl';
 # restore controlfile to
 '/u06/oradata/ORACLE_SID/control_03.ctl';
 # replicate controlfile from
 '/u01/oradata/ORACLE_SID/control_01.ctl';
 ###   The following just restores them all.
 ###   DO NOT restore controlfile when doing a point
 in time recovery.
 ###   Most likely, you will not restore controlfile
 unless you have lost all
 control files.
 ###   If you are not using a catalog, then you must
 copy a backup of the
 control file at the OS level.
 # restore controlfile;
 
   sql 'ALTER DATABASE MOUNT';
   restore database;
   You might or might not need restore
 archivelog.
   When doing backups to disk, you probably don't
 need it.
 # restore archivelog all;
   recover database;
   If control file was restored, then you will
 probably need resetlogs.
 # sql 'ALTER DATABASE OPEN RESETLOGS';
   sql 'ALTER DATABASE OPEN';
 
   release channel ch1;
   }
 
 XXX
 
 
   If you had to restore the controlfiles (or
 hand-copy in backup
 controfiles),
   or if you lost online redo log(s), or if you
 are missing archived
 log(s),
   then, you will likely need to recover the
 database by hand using one
 or
   more of the following commands.
 
 ## With Oracle 9.X you must use sqlplus.
 ##svrmgrl -XXX
 ## connect internal
 ## alter database recover using backup controlfile
 until cancel;
 ## alter database recover using backup controlfile;
 ## alter database recover until cancel;
 ## alter database recover;
 ## alter database open;
 ## alter database open resetlogs;
 ##XXX
 
   If you are using a catalog, then you will need
 to reset database
   in the catalog after restoring.
 echo 
 echo  -- DON'T FORGET -- DON'T FORGET
 --
 echo Don't forget to RESET DATABASE in RMAN
 catalog.
 echo  -- DON'T FORGET -- DON'T FORGET
 --
 echo
 
 
 
  -Original Message-
  From: OraCop [mailto:oracop;yahoo.com]
  Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 2:29 PM
  To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
  Subject: Backup/Restore 
  
  
  Hello,
 I need to comeup with backup strategy for my 
 production oracle systems running 9iR2 on
 Solaris9.

RE: Backup/Restore

Stephen: Thanks a lot for Ur response.
   How do U restore from the backup? 
   have a script?
   
   U r not using veritas? 

Thanks.

OraCop.


--- Stephen Lee [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 
 You don't say if you are using catalog or not.  If
 not, be sure to backup
 control files at end of backup.  For what it's worth
 here is what I do for
 disk backups and no catalog.  Business critical
 databases use catalog and go
 directly to tape using Networker (P.O.S. ... at
 least on Tru64).  I have
 separate scripts for database and log files in case
 the archived log
 destination gets dangerously full (monitored by cron
 job).
 
 For database:
 
 run {
 allocate channel ch1 type disk format
 '/u05/oracle/admin/HRP1/backup/%U_DATA';
 set command id to 'rman';
 backup
tag backup_db_full
(database include current controlfile);
 release channel ch1;
 }
 
 
 For log files (we are duplexing on this database):
 
 run {
 allocate channel ch1 type disk format
 '/u05/oracle/admin/HRP1/backup/%U_ARCH';
 set command id to 'rman';
 change archivelog all crosscheck;
 backup
(archivelog all delete input);
 backup
(archivelog like
 '/oracle/app/oracle/admin/HRP1/arch2/%' delete
 input);
 release channel ch1;
 allocate channel ch1 type disk format
 '/u05/oracle/admin/HRP1/backup/%U_CONTROL';
 backup current controlfile tag='backup';
 release channel ch1;
 sql ALTER DATABASE BACKUP CONTROLFILE TO
 ''/u05/oracle/admin/HRP1/backup/CONTROL_FILE.BAK''
 REUSE;
 }
 
 
 If the database and all controlfiles got blown away,
 then the
 CONTROL_FILE.BAK is your salvation.
 
 The following script is kept handy as a fast
 reference for restoring.  I
 run the commands by hand; but the script serves to
 jog my memory as to the
 commands.  I've slept since I put this together, but
 I think some of the
 commands are for when you have a catalog.
 
 #!/bin/ksh
 
 ## Define variables for your SID
 export ORACLE_SID=ABCXYZ
 export USER=internal
 export PASS=the_password
 
 ## With Oracle 9.X you must use sqlplus.
 svrmgrl -XXX
connect internal
startup nomount
exit
 XXX
 
 rman nocatalog -XXX
connect target ${USER}/${PASS}@${ORACLE_SID}
 
run {
 
 ### If you have control files, then you don't need
 format when allocating
 channel.
   allocate channel ch1 type disk;
 
 ###   When you want to restore up to, but not
 including, a specific log
 sequence number
 ###   For example, the database wants log 275, but
 all you have in rman
 catalog are 273 and 274
 #set until logseq=275 thread=1;
 
 ###   When you want to restore to a specific time.
 # set until time to_date('2001-02-09
 02:00:00','-MM-DD HH24:MI:SS');
 
 ###   Various syntax possibilities for restoring
 control files
 #restore controlfile to
 '/u01/oradata/ORACLE_SID/control_01.ctl';
 # restore controlfile to
 '/u02/oradata/ORACLE_SID/control_02.ctl';
 # restore controlfile to
 '/u06/oradata/ORACLE_SID/control_03.ctl';
 # replicate controlfile from
 '/u01/oradata/ORACLE_SID/control_01.ctl';
 ###   The following just restores them all.
 ###   DO NOT restore controlfile when doing a point
 in time recovery.
 ###   Most likely, you will not restore controlfile
 unless you have lost all
 control files.
 ###   If you are not using a catalog, then you must
 copy a backup of the
 control file at the OS level.
 # restore controlfile;
 
   sql 'ALTER DATABASE MOUNT';
   restore database;
   You might or might not need restore
 archivelog.
   When doing backups to disk, you probably don't
 need it.
 # restore archivelog all;
   recover database;
   If control file was restored, then you will
 probably need resetlogs.
 # sql 'ALTER DATABASE OPEN RESETLOGS';
   sql 'ALTER DATABASE OPEN';
 
   release channel ch1;
   }
 
 XXX
 
 
   If you had to restore the controlfiles (or
 hand-copy in backup
 controfiles),
   or if you lost online redo log(s), or if you
 are missing archived
 log(s),
   then, you will likely need to recover the
 database by hand using one
 or
   more of the following commands.
 
 ## With Oracle 9.X you must use sqlplus.
 ##svrmgrl -XXX
 ## connect internal
 ## alter database recover using backup controlfile
 until cancel;
 ## alter database recover using backup controlfile;
 ## alter database recover until cancel;
 ## alter database recover;
 ## alter database open;
 ## alter database open resetlogs;
 ##XXX
 
   If you are using a catalog, then you will need
 to reset database
   in the catalog after restoring.
 echo 
 echo  -- DON'T FORGET -- DON'T FORGET
 --
 echo Don't forget to RESET DATABASE in RMAN
 catalog.
 echo  -- DON'T FORGET -- DON'T FORGET
 --
 echo
 
 
 
  -Original Message-
  From: OraCop [mailto:oracop;yahoo.com]
  Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 2:29 PM
  To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
  Subject: Backup/Restore 
  
  
  Hello,
 I need to comeup with backup strategy for my

RE: Backup/Restore

Stephen: Thanks a lot for Ur response.
   How do U restore from the backup? 
   have a script?
   


--- Stephen Lee [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 
 You don't say if you are using catalog or not.  If
 not, be sure to backup
 control files at end of backup.  For what it's worth
 here is what I do for
 disk backups and no catalog.  Business critical
 databases use catalog and go
 directly to tape using Networker (P.O.S. ... at
 least on Tru64).  I have
 separate scripts for database and log files in case
 the archived log
 destination gets dangerously full (monitored by cron
 job).
 
 For database:
 
 run {
 allocate channel ch1 type disk format
 '/u05/oracle/admin/HRP1/backup/%U_DATA';
 set command id to 'rman';
 backup
tag backup_db_full
(database include current controlfile);
 release channel ch1;
 }
 
 
 For log files (we are duplexing on this database):
 
 run {
 allocate channel ch1 type disk format
 '/u05/oracle/admin/HRP1/backup/%U_ARCH';
 set command id to 'rman';
 change archivelog all crosscheck;
 backup
(archivelog all delete input);
 backup
(archivelog like
 '/oracle/app/oracle/admin/HRP1/arch2/%' delete
 input);
 release channel ch1;
 allocate channel ch1 type disk format
 '/u05/oracle/admin/HRP1/backup/%U_CONTROL';
 backup current controlfile tag='backup';
 release channel ch1;
 sql ALTER DATABASE BACKUP CONTROLFILE TO
 ''/u05/oracle/admin/HRP1/backup/CONTROL_FILE.BAK''
 REUSE;
 }
 
 
 If the database and all controlfiles got blown away,
 then the
 CONTROL_FILE.BAK is your salvation.
 
 The following script is kept handy as a fast
 reference for restoring.  I
 run the commands by hand; but the script serves to
 jog my memory as to the
 commands.  I've slept since I put this together, but
 I think some of the
 commands are for when you have a catalog.
 
 #!/bin/ksh
 
 ## Define variables for your SID
 export ORACLE_SID=ABCXYZ
 export USER=internal
 export PASS=the_password
 
 ## With Oracle 9.X you must use sqlplus.
 svrmgrl -XXX
connect internal
startup nomount
exit
 XXX
 
 rman nocatalog -XXX
connect target ${USER}/${PASS}@${ORACLE_SID}
 
run {
 
 ### If you have control files, then you don't need
 format when allocating
 channel.
   allocate channel ch1 type disk;
 
 ###   When you want to restore up to, but not
 including, a specific log
 sequence number
 ###   For example, the database wants log 275, but
 all you have in rman
 catalog are 273 and 274
 #set until logseq=275 thread=1;
 
 ###   When you want to restore to a specific time.
 # set until time to_date('2001-02-09
 02:00:00','-MM-DD HH24:MI:SS');
 
 ###   Various syntax possibilities for restoring
 control files
 #restore controlfile to
 '/u01/oradata/ORACLE_SID/control_01.ctl';
 # restore controlfile to
 '/u02/oradata/ORACLE_SID/control_02.ctl';
 # restore controlfile to
 '/u06/oradata/ORACLE_SID/control_03.ctl';
 # replicate controlfile from
 '/u01/oradata/ORACLE_SID/control_01.ctl';
 ###   The following just restores them all.
 ###   DO NOT restore controlfile when doing a point
 in time recovery.
 ###   Most likely, you will not restore controlfile
 unless you have lost all
 control files.
 ###   If you are not using a catalog, then you must
 copy a backup of the
 control file at the OS level.
 # restore controlfile;
 
   sql 'ALTER DATABASE MOUNT';
   restore database;
   You might or might not need restore
 archivelog.
   When doing backups to disk, you probably don't
 need it.
 # restore archivelog all;
   recover database;
   If control file was restored, then you will
 probably need resetlogs.
 # sql 'ALTER DATABASE OPEN RESETLOGS';
   sql 'ALTER DATABASE OPEN';
 
   release channel ch1;
   }
 
 XXX
 
 
   If you had to restore the controlfiles (or
 hand-copy in backup
 controfiles),
   or if you lost online redo log(s), or if you
 are missing archived
 log(s),
   then, you will likely need to recover the
 database by hand using one
 or
   more of the following commands.
 
 ## With Oracle 9.X you must use sqlplus.
 ##svrmgrl -XXX
 ## connect internal
 ## alter database recover using backup controlfile
 until cancel;
 ## alter database recover using backup controlfile;
 ## alter database recover until cancel;
 ## alter database recover;
 ## alter database open;
 ## alter database open resetlogs;
 ##XXX
 
   If you are using a catalog, then you will need
 to reset database
   in the catalog after restoring.
 echo 
 echo  -- DON'T FORGET -- DON'T FORGET
 --
 echo Don't forget to RESET DATABASE in RMAN
 catalog.
 echo  -- DON'T FORGET -- DON'T FORGET
 --
 echo
 
 
 
  -Original Message-
  From: OraCop [mailto:oracop;yahoo.com]
  Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 2:29 PM
  To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
  Subject: Backup/Restore 
  
  
  Hello,
 I need to comeup with backup strategy for my 
 production oracle systems running 9iR2 on
 Solaris9.

RE: Backup/Restore


Assuming you have stored the backup sets onto tape (we hope!!), you must
first get them off the tape using the OS, and put them back where rman put
them when you ran the backup.  After that, rman will find the backup sets
and restore things where they are supposed to go.  If, in the worst-case
scenario (everything gets blown away), you must put the control_file.bak
back, you copy that by hand at the OS level to the location and file name
specified in the init.ora.  When not using a catalog database, the control
file IS your catalog; so it is a most sacred and hallowed object ... even
when nothing else is (referring to another thread that had been running).
And that is why you make a copy of it AT THE END of the backup.


 -Original Message-
 From: OraCop [mailto:oracop;yahoo.com]
 Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 4:19 PM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
 Subject: RE: Backup/Restore 
 
 
 Stephen: Thanks a lot for Ur response.
How do U restore from the backup? 
have a script?

 
 
 --- Stephen Lee [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  
  
  You don't say if you are using catalog or not.  If
  not, be sure to backup
  control files at end of backup.  For what it's worth
  here is what I do for
  disk backups and no catalog.  Business critical
  databases use catalog and go
  directly to tape using Networker (P.O.S. ... at
  least on Tru64).  I have
  separate scripts for database and log files in case
  the archived log
  destination gets dangerously full (monitored by cron
  job).
  
  For database:
  
  run {
  allocate channel ch1 type disk format
  '/u05/oracle/admin/HRP1/backup/%U_DATA';
  set command id to 'rman';
  backup
 tag backup_db_full
 (database include current controlfile);
  release channel ch1;
  }
  
  
  For log files (we are duplexing on this database):
  
  run {
  allocate channel ch1 type disk format
  '/u05/oracle/admin/HRP1/backup/%U_ARCH';
  set command id to 'rman';
  change archivelog all crosscheck;
  backup
 (archivelog all delete input);
  backup
 (archivelog like
  '/oracle/app/oracle/admin/HRP1/arch2/%' delete
  input);
  release channel ch1;
  allocate channel ch1 type disk format
  '/u05/oracle/admin/HRP1/backup/%U_CONTROL';
  backup current controlfile tag='backup';
  release channel ch1;
  sql ALTER DATABASE BACKUP CONTROLFILE TO
  ''/u05/oracle/admin/HRP1/backup/CONTROL_FILE.BAK''
  REUSE;
  }
  
  
  If the database and all controlfiles got blown away,
  then the
  CONTROL_FILE.BAK is your salvation.
  
  The following script is kept handy as a fast
  reference for restoring.  I
  run the commands by hand; but the script serves to
  jog my memory as to the
  commands.  I've slept since I put this together, but
  I think some of the
  commands are for when you have a catalog.
  
  #!/bin/ksh
  
  ## Define variables for your SID
  export ORACLE_SID=ABCXYZ
  export USER=internal
  export PASS=the_password
  
  ## With Oracle 9.X you must use sqlplus.
  svrmgrl -XXX
 connect internal
 startup nomount
 exit
  XXX
  
  rman nocatalog -XXX
 connect target ${USER}/${PASS}@${ORACLE_SID}
  
 run {
  
  ### If you have control files, then you don't need
  format when allocating
  channel.
allocate channel ch1 type disk;
  
  ###   When you want to restore up to, but not
  including, a specific log
  sequence number
  ###   For example, the database wants log 275, but
  all you have in rman
  catalog are 273 and 274
  #set until logseq=275 thread=1;
  
  ###   When you want to restore to a specific time.
  # set until time to_date('2001-02-09
  02:00:00','-MM-DD HH24:MI:SS');
  
  ###   Various syntax possibilities for restoring
  control files
  #restore controlfile to
  '/u01/oradata/ORACLE_SID/control_01.ctl';
  # restore controlfile to
  '/u02/oradata/ORACLE_SID/control_02.ctl';
  # restore controlfile to
  '/u06/oradata/ORACLE_SID/control_03.ctl';
  # replicate controlfile from
  '/u01/oradata/ORACLE_SID/control_01.ctl';
  ###   The following just restores them all.
  ###   DO NOT restore controlfile when doing a point
  in time recovery.
  ###   Most likely, you will not restore controlfile
  unless you have lost all
  control files.
  ###   If you are not using a catalog, then you must
  copy a backup of the
  control file at the OS level.
  # restore controlfile;
  
sql 'ALTER DATABASE MOUNT';
restore database;
    You might or might not need restore
  archivelog.
    When doing backups to disk, you probably don't
  need it.
  # restore archivelog all;
recover database;
    If control file was restored, then you will
  probably need resetlogs.
  # sql 'ALTER DATABASE OPEN RESETLOGS';
sql 'ALTER DATABASE OPEN';
  
release channel ch1;
}
  
  XXX
  
  
    If you had to restore the controlfiles (or
  hand-copy in backup
  controfiles),
    or if you lost online redo log(s), or if you
  are missing archived

RE: Oracle 10i features

For me, it's the other way around.  I've got the DB.  I don't need/want the
overhead of administering and maintaining the rest, especially if it'll cost
beaucoup bucks for things that we won't use.

Rich

Rich Jesse   System/Database Administrator
[EMAIL PROTECTED]  Quad/Tech International, Sussex, WI USA


 -Original Message-
 From: Boivin, Patrice J [mailto:BoivinP;mar.dfo-mpo.gc.ca]
 Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 1:58 PM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
 Subject: RE: Oracle 10i features
 
 
 iDS9iRel2 is quite a suite, it includes Designer now.
 
 So... in one suite... Apache + Developer Server (Forms + 
 Reports + Graphics)
 + Discoverer + Portal + Designer + Web Cache + Internet Cache 
 + Wireless
 Portal + DAD administration + OEM Management Server all in 
 one easy to use
 kit.
 
 What's wrong with packaging the Oracle rdbms in there too?  I don't
 understand what all the fuss is about.
 
 Regards,
 Patrice Boivin
 Systems Analyst (Oracle Certified DBA)
 
 -Original Message-
 Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 3:14 PM
 To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L
 
 
 Good grief.  Like I'm going to go through all of that 
 overhead and hassle?
 And isn't 9iAS a separately licensable (read: cost) option, 
 even if you're
 already licensed for EE?
 
 I think I'm reading the same PDF you were, Raj:
 
 The Console interacts with the Oracle Management Service, 
 which, as a J2EE
 Web Application hosted by an Oracle9i application Server, 
 leverages all of
 the reliability, scalability, and robustness of the 
 Oracle9iAS instance.
 
 I wish I has time to work on the KISS-method OEM replacement 
 I started...
 sigh
 
 Rich
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RE: User Package

2002-11-12 Thread Richard Ji

There is no simple answer to that.  You will have to look at what
the package does and tune it.  Maybe if you post the package (if it's
not too big) then people can offer suggestions.  SQL tuning can
give you amazing results.

Richard

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 4:54 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Hi
I am having one of user created packages.Whenever this package executed by 
users the CPU utilisation on BOX high.How to fix this package problem
thx
-Seema





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RE: Join vs. Subselect

Bill,
Without seeing the explain plans, I'll take a shot. I hope it makes
sense...
1 assumption, which if incorrect invalidates everything. I assume
that there is not an index on table2.objid.
I think the issue is how statement 1 is executed. Since the subquery
is not-correlated (IN instead of an equality condition), it is executed 1
time as a full table scan with the result set stored in memory (or disk if
not sufficient room). The intent of the subquery is to build a result set
that is compared in total to the output of the outer statement. Once the
table1.objid is located in the result set of table2.objid, the condition
evaluates to TRUE and no further reading of table2 result set is required.
It sounds like it is doing a nested loop operation against data that is
already in memory.
In statement2, for each row in table1, matching data in table2 is to
be retrieved, perhaps requiring multiple disk reads. In this case, it may be
more efficient to use the index. We now have an equality condition, which
probably results in a nested loop operation against a table and not a result
set in memory.
Hmm...clear as mud?
In deference to Cary, Anjo, Gaja, Kirti, Tim, et.al., Which query
runs faster and performs fewer LIOs? That's the true measure of which is the
better one.

Dan Fink

-Original Message-
Sent: Monday, November 11, 2002 9:24 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


Hi,

Here is the situation. The application coded a query that looks like
this:

select * from table1
where objid in (select objid from table2);

There is an index on objid in table 1 that isn't being used. An explain
shows it is using this system view vw_nso_1 that is used to transform an IN
subquery to a join. If you recode the query to:

select a.* from table1 a, table2 b
where a.objid = b.objid;

Then it will use the index. My question is: shouldn't it use the index
in both cases. I know the join is a better way to code it and I have told
the application that, but I would think that the first way would use an
index anyway. Ideas?

Bill Carle
ATT
Database Administrator
816-995-3922
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

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RE: Is nothing sacred? (Oracle vs The Experts)

Of course, sacred cows make the best steaks (sorry, Gaja).

An excellent example is the age old ideas that the earth was the center of
the universe, that the world was flat, that the Cubs will never win another
World Series (okay...bad example). Knowledge is limited by what we can
currently test. We are always restricted by our physical world (I don't have
a clue as to how I can personally test if the world is indeed round) but
also by what we choose to accept as fact. What happens to indexing
strategies when disk reads are faster than memory access operations? Before
you say, It will never happen think about it...Can you predict the future
with absolute certainty?

Even the 'experts' choose to accept certain facts. Look at the scientific
world. Many of the most 'brilliant' ideas now can be proven false. According
to the experts, we only need 5 computers worldwide with 64k of memory. 

I checked by Data Server Internals texts from 1999 and they preach 15% of
rows returned for indexing, and this series is certainly looked upon as the
'expert'. Anyone out there with a more recent version? I wonder what it
says...

IMHO, the bottom line is that many of us are so concerned with just keeping
systems running that we have no time for our own personal research and
development. Until I decided to write an article about rollback segments, I
never applied the scientific method to my understanding of Oracle. Will
application of the method explain everything? Nope, but it will come close.
It requires a lot of time and hard work, something that is a precious
commodity these days, especially in the corporate world. I am very grateful
for people like Cary, Tim, Anjo, Craig, Gaja, Kirti, et.al. who take the
time to say prove it! and then perform the experiments and, most
importantly, are willing to share the results with us on this list and at
meetings like IOUG-A.

Dan Fink

-Original Message-
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 2:24 PM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L


I think the question Is nothing sacred? is an interesting one. Lots of
these things we're talking about have been false for a very long time.
It's only that people are finally starting to notice them. Product
changes are often *not* what's driving new knowledge. In many cases,
the change that's taking place is the improvement in the quality of
our conclusions.

Is nothing sacred? I think it's perfectly legitimate to confront
people's (and companies') conjectures with scientific data.


Cary Millsap
Hotsos Enterprises, Ltd.
http://www.hotsos.com

Upcoming events:
- Hotsos Clinic, Dec 9-11 Honolulu
- 2003 Hotsos Symposium on OracleR System Performance, Feb 9-12 Dallas
- Jonathan Lewis' Optimising Oracle, Nov 19-21 Dallas


-Original Message-
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, November 12, 2002 10:19 AM
To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L

Jesse,

No, nothing in sacred any more.  Change is the theme of the day.
BTW: did
you experiment with caching these tables in the keep_pool??  I've had
some real
good luck with unindexed tables that are small (in the 1 to 10 block
size) that
get assigned to the keep pool and retained in memory forever.

Also, BTW: I'll disagree with Cary and Hotsos on the costs of a PIO
vs a
LIO.  In my experience it's not such a clear cut distinction.  Whenever
Oracle
needs a block of data that data must be in memory which means that a PIO
requires 2 LIO's to fulfill the request and on top of that there may be
other
memory management routines that get called if an empty data block in
memory must
be created.  All in all it's a very mixed bag that needs to be
considered case
by case.  I believe that was one of the reasons Oracle allows us to
configure
the cache three ways.  Static, seldomly changed tables in the keep pool.
Large
constantly changing tables in the discard pool.  Also to index or not to
index
are no longer such clear cut item, especially with CBO which loves to
ignore
indexes.

Dick Goulet

Reply Separator
Author: Jesse; Rich [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date:   11/11/2002 8:58 AM

So, there I am, on 8.1.7.2 (and .4) on HP/UX 11.0, with a process that
runs
20 minutes out of every hour of the day (despite my protests to it's
design).  After it starts having problems (go figure), it becomes a
priority
to speed it up.

Thanks to a 10046 trace, we see that the query taking the most elapsed
time
does FTSs on each of two very small tables (1 block and 4 blocks -- 8K
blocksize).  These tables are not indexed, as per the official Oracle
recommendation.  After reading the excellent Hotsos paper When to index
a
table (THANKS, CARY!), I added an index to reduce elapsed time on this
query by 50% (150 to 75 seconds in test), proving to me that the paper
is
valid.  And I've only read to page four!

OK, first I'm taught by Oracle to look at Buffer Cache Hit Ratios as a
measure of performance, then told (and thoroughly convinced) by experts
that
this is bunk.  Now, I found out

RE: SQL*Plus truncating lines