Re: Mathematics in Persian, feedback needed

[Sina Ahmadian]

Hi,

Just to add some info about the French system :


Among the common differences you see in primary
school mathematics are the long division notation. e.g. In English
it's written as shown in
. In french it's:

   14523 | 34
 92  |--
 243 | 427
   5 |



Yes, surprisingly the long division notation in the French is really 
"bizarre"!



I don't know the difference with Arabic either. But what I notice
relative to English is that the limit sign is stretching. And I
wonder if other common operators are the same. How about sine
and cosine? Are they always written 'sin' and 'cos'. Are there local
variations? (e.g. in French, 'tan' is written 'tg')


When I was studying at high school here in France, I had never seen "tg" in 
the books or on the board. As Roozbeh said, it seems to be the old form used 
in the French educational system which is obsolete now.


Sina


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RE: Jalaali?!

[Sina Ahmadian]

Hi Omid,


Happy to hear that you're still working on Persian issues in M$ products.
I also think "Persian Calendar" would be ok, but as you said, this may later cause some confusions between the calendar used in Iran and the Afghan version. So, maybe "Iranian Calendar" is the proper choice. But I still think there should be better choices...
Anyway, they should really avoid using terms such as Hejri Shamsi (an Arabic name for a Persian Calendar?!!) and even the right local form of it, Khorshidi, which are not easy to pronounce and make no sense in English.
Sinahttp://www.30na.com>From: "Omid K. Rad" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
>To: "'PersianComputing'" 
>Subject: Jalaali?!
>Date: Wed, 2 Feb 2005 00:01:12 +0330
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>Dear PersianComputers,
>
>
>
>I had made a feedback to Microsoft some weeks ago to revise the name of the Jalaali Calendar in their products, as we had discussed it in this forum before. Please read the problem statement and Microsoft's response here:
>
>
>
>http://lab.msdn.microsoft.com/ProductFeedback/viewfeedback.aspx?feedbackid=94d44f47-bab2-4724-a912-c2c8fa545d59
>
>
>
>We’ve triggered MS to investigate again for a proper name for our calendar, so your input is very important at the present. Whatever name they choose now it will remain forever. The time is short; Please comment, and DON’T draw a dispute in Microsoft’s pages.
>
>
>
>Thank you all,
>
>Omid K. Rad
>
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Re: Locale requirement of Persian in Iran, first public draft

[Sina Ahmadian]

I think the best solution is to use the 24 hour clock when it's possible. 
This should become a standard in all printed documents (digital or paper).

The 12 hour clock can exist as a second choise. Instead of AM/PM, we can use 
Baamdaad/Shaamgaah, which have Persian origines, or Sobh/Shab. But when you 
think more about these choises and other similar terms (Sobh/Asr, Rooz/Shab, 
Ghabl Az Zoh/Bad Az Zohr, ...) none of them are completely compatible with 
12 hour clock. Just imagine "10:23 Baamdaad" for the morning or "10:55 Asr" 
and "10:55 Baaz Az Zohr" for the night. They don't make any sens!

Maybe it's better to follow the Microsoft's choise: Ghabl Az Zohr/Baad Az 
Zohr (B.Z/GH.Z) or Pish Az Zohr/Pas Az Zohr, where the second group cannot 
be abbreviated (P.Z/P.Z !!)

Another similarity between Persian and French! In French also there is no 
equivalent to AM/PM. They use always the 24 hour clock in printed stuff and 
the following rule in conversation:

00 To 12: matin (sobh)
12 To 17-19(depends on the season): après-midi (baad az zohr)
17-19 To 00: soir (shab)
Sina
Original Message Follows
From: "Ali A. Khanban" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Roozbeh Pournader <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
CC: Persian Computing <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Locale requirement of Persian in Iran, first public draft
Date: Tue, 15 Jun 2004 13:49:55 +0100
Thanks. BTW, in locale, I noticed that there is no "am" and "pm" for time, 
and it is only 24 hour time in Iran. I remember two words "baamdaam" and 
"ba'd az zohr" were used by radio/tv presenters most of the time. Of course 
people always use "ba'd az zohr", but rarely "baamdaad".

I think deleting 12 hour clock is not fair. We could use the current entries 
in AM&PM part of the locale in the following link, that you sent me.

Best
-ali-
Roozbeh Pournader wrote:
I don't know how you got to the page, but it is about the the Arabic
*language* in Iran. The (almost) correct Persian page is at:
http://oss.software.ibm.com/cgi-bin/icu/lx/en_US/?_=fa_IR
(which is done partially by me.)
roozbeh
On Tue, 2004-06-15 at 05:01, Ali A. Khanban wrote:

Hi,
Have a look at:
http://oss.software.ibm.com/cgi-bin/icu/lx/en_US/?_=ar&d_=en_US&_r=IR&;
Maybe we need to submit the draft version to correct this. Anyway, as long 
as there is a note, it should be OK to refer to script as Arabic, though I 
still prefer something like "Perso-Arabic".

Best
-ali-
C Bobroff wrote:

On Mon, 14 Jun 2004, Ali A Khanban wrote:


Well, that has the same author(!), so it doesn't count.


Do a google search for "pashto perso-arabic" to see that many authors
think Pashto is written in the Perso-Arabic script.
Then do a google search for "pashto arabic script" and you'll see with
just a quick glance that most further explain that it is *modified* 
Arabic
script or called *Perso-Arabic.*

If you're writing in English, you'd better not say simply "Arabic 
script."

-Connie




--

||   Ali Asghar Khanban
|| ||Research Associate in Department of Computing
|||  Imperial College London, London SW7 2BZ, U.K.
||   Tel: +44 (020) 7594 8241 Fax: +1 (509) 694 0599
|||  [EMAIL PROTECTED]   http://www.doc.ic.ac.uk/~khanban

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Re: khaat e Farsi

[Sina Ahmadian]

If you use Arabic script, the word "Arabic" has the cultural notion of a 
nation. It is not a neutral name. While It doesn't add any thing new to the 
locale information, it will give this notion that our culture and language 
is the same. The wast majority of ordinary people in western world still 
think that we are Arabs, we have the same language and culture, Ave sina 
was an Arab and etc. Please consider a national identity for our language 
and culture and don't worry about other similar  languages.

Peyman
Here in Europe, many people think that Iran is an Arabic country. One of the 
reasons, and not the only one, is the name of the country, Iran, which is 
similar to Iraq, Liban and maybe some others when it's pronounced in western 
languages (for example in French and English).
About Avecina and almost all other persian scientists (Kharazmi, Kashi, ... 
who are called Al-Kharazmi, Al-Kashi, ...) they are known as Arabs, even 
when people don't forget to mention that they were born in Iran (Persia). As 
the scientific language of that time was Arabic, they wrote their research 
results in that language, but the nationality doesn't depend on the language 
that you speak. Also, we shouldn't forget that their mother tongue was 
Persian. What is strange is that this mistake is also done in academic 
areas, such as schools and universities, and not only by ordinary people.

Sorry if I was off-topic.
Sina
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Persian Text Algorithms

[Sina Ahmadian]

Hello,

I have some unicode texts in different languages (Persian, Arabic, ...).
How can I find the language of each text? Is there any algorithms or any 
other solution for determining the text language?

Sina Ahmadian

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[PersianComputing] Penglish-Persian Convertor

[Sina Ahmadian]

Hey, take a look at 
http://www.bitaweb.com/fa/BitaWeb_BitaWeb_BitaWeb/farsiNegar.php .
This is a Penglish-Persian convertor. I tested it right now. Except some 
small problems, it works fine. It converts about 90% of the text 
successfully.
What do you think about this project? Can it be useful to prevent or reduce 
using Penglish instead of the correct form of Persian texts?

Best regards,
Sina Ahmadian
http://www.30na.com
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