Re: [Phono-L] update that Triumph or not?
2 banner types, early sharp corners later rounded. I would not bother the banner case as they add value to the machine. From: lhera...@bu.edu To: phono-l@oldcrank.org Date: Sun, 13 Jan 2013 21:01:12 -0500 Subject: Re: [Phono-L] update that Triumph or not? It is a banner front machine but has the 2/4 gearing upgrade. It has also been upgraded to a top mount and diamond B reproducer so someone was only playing 4 min. celluloid on it. Your opinion concurs with a local Edison collector who pretty much said the same thing to me tonight. Ron -Original Message- From: phono-l-boun...@oldcrank.org [mailto:phono-l-boun...@oldcrank.org] On Behalf Of clockworkh...@aol.com Sent: Sunday, January 13, 2013 1:11 AM To: phono-l@oldcrank.org Subject: Re: [Phono-L] update that Triumph or not? What Triumph cabinet does it have? If it is a banner Triumph Model A then I would definitely NOT drill holes into one of these cabinets. The later raised panel with a thicker wood is better suited from a material strength viewpoint. What reproducer does it have? A Model O in a horizontal carriage would suggest a Cygnet horn would be a good addition so the 'new' holes might not detract from the machine. If the carriage is a 45º small carriage with a Model C reproducer then I would stick with a smaller straight horn. Is the machine equipped with a 2 and 4 minute mandrel shaft gearing? Has the cabinet been refinished? Many factors need to be considered. In making a decision to alter something that has remained the same for 100+ years, one must think if the modification would have been accurate to the machine and how it will change the monetary value. Triumphs late D and D2, E, F, and G should already have the factory drilled holes. A 2 minute Model C Triumph is a rare bird, I would leave it virginal. A Triumph Model B with added horizontal carriage and an O Reproducer has already been altered, drill away Gridley. A Triumph A banner would have me want to return it to its catalog configuration. I have taken out 2/4 minutes gears on some of my machines and made them like their original description from a contemporaneous catalog. Anything earlier like a Spring Motor and it would be sacrilege to drill the holes. Did I mention that I am an opinionated old fart? Best wishes to all on the list, Al Who thought swans used Cygnet horns to keep from bumping into each other on the pond... ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.org ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.org ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.org
Re: [Phono-L] update that Triumph or not?
just for a laugh i have a triumph d2 with a straight horn never set up for a cygnet just how edison did things zono In a message dated 1/13/2013 1:24:54 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, clockworkh...@aol.com writes: What Triumph cabinet does it have? If it is a banner Triumph Model A then I would definitely NOT drill holes into one of these cabinets. The later raised panel with a thicker wood is better suited from a material strength viewpoint. What reproducer does it have? A Model O in a horizontal carriage would suggest a Cygnet horn would be a good addition so the 'new' holes might not detract from the machine. If the carriage is a 45º small carriage with a Model C reproducer then I would stick with a smaller straight horn. Is the machine equipped with a 2 and 4 minute mandrel shaft gearing? Has the cabinet been refinished? Many factors need to be considered. In making a decision to alter something that has remained the same for 100+ years, one must think if the modification would have been accurate to the machine and how it will change the monetary value. Triumphs late D and D2, E, F, and G should already have the factory drilled holes. A 2 minute Model C Triumph is a rare bird, I would leave it virginal. A Triumph Model B with added horizontal carriage and an O Reproducer has already been altered, drill away Gridley. A Triumph A banner would have me want to return it to its catalog configuration. I have taken out 2/4 minutes gears on some of my machines and made them like their original description from a contemporaneous catalog. Anything earlier like a Spring Motor and it would be sacrilege to drill the holes. Did I mention that I am an opinionated old fart? Best wishes to all on the list, Al Who thought swans used Cygnet horns to keep from bumping into each other on the pond... ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.org ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.org
Re: [Phono-L] update that Triumph or not?
As ever, Al has put it better and more complete than anyone else could. -Original Message- From: clockworkh...@aol.com Sent: Sunday, January 13, 2013 12:10 AM To: phono-l@oldcrank.org Subject: Re: [Phono-L] update that Triumph or not? What Triumph cabinet does it have? If it is a banner Triumph Model A then I would definitely NOT drill holes into one of these cabinets. The later raised panel with a thicker wood is better suited from a material strength viewpoint. What reproducer does it have? A Model O in a horizontal carriage would suggest a Cygnet horn would be a good addition so the 'new' holes might not detract from the machine. If the carriage is a 45º small carriage with a Model C reproducer then I would stick with a smaller straight horn. Is the machine equipped with a 2 and 4 minute mandrel shaft gearing? Has the cabinet been refinished? Many factors need to be considered. In making a decision to alter something that has remained the same for 100+ years, one must think if the modification would have been accurate to the machine and how it will change the monetary value. Triumphs late D and D2, E, F, and G should already have the factory drilled holes. A 2 minute Model C Triumph is a rare bird, I would leave it virginal. A Triumph Model B with added horizontal carriage and an O Reproducer has already been altered, drill away Gridley. A Triumph A banner would have me want to return it to its catalog configuration. I have taken out 2/4 minutes gears on some of my machines and made them like their original description from a contemporaneous catalog. Anything earlier like a Spring Motor and it would be sacrilege to drill the holes. Did I mention that I am an opinionated old fart? Best wishes to all on the list, Al Who thought swans used Cygnet horns to keep from bumping into each other on the pond... ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.org ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.org
Re: [Phono-L] update that Triumph or not?
yes kudos to al sefl aka clockwork home and to george frow they both are a blessing to us collectors of edisons zono In a message dated 1/13/2013 1:24:22 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, glast...@comcast.net writes: As ever, Al has put it better and more complete than anyone else could. -Original Message- From: clockworkh...@aol.com Sent: Sunday, January 13, 2013 12:10 AM To: phono-l@oldcrank.org Subject: Re: [Phono-L] update that Triumph or not? What Triumph cabinet does it have? If it is a banner Triumph Model A then I would definitely NOT drill holes into one of these cabinets. The later raised panel with a thicker wood is better suited from a material strength viewpoint. What reproducer does it have? A Model O in a horizontal carriage would suggest a Cygnet horn would be a good addition so the 'new' holes might not detract from the machine. If the carriage is a 45º small carriage with a Model C reproducer then I would stick with a smaller straight horn. Is the machine equipped with a 2 and 4 minute mandrel shaft gearing? Has the cabinet been refinished? Many factors need to be considered. In making a decision to alter something that has remained the same for 100+ years, one must think if the modification would have been accurate to the machine and how it will change the monetary value. Triumphs late D and D2, E, F, and G should already have the factory drilled holes. A 2 minute Model C Triumph is a rare bird, I would leave it virginal. A Triumph Model B with added horizontal carriage and an O Reproducer has already been altered, drill away Gridley. A Triumph A banner would have me want to return it to its catalog configuration. I have taken out 2/4 minutes gears on some of my machines and made them like their original description from a contemporaneous catalog. Anything earlier like a Spring Motor and it would be sacrilege to drill the holes. Did I mention that I am an opinionated old fart? Best wishes to all on the list, Al Who thought swans used Cygnet horns to keep from bumping into each other on the pond... ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.org ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.org ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.org
Re: [Phono-L] update that Triumph or not?
Interesting idea. I'll pass that along. Ron L -Original Message- From: phono-l-boun...@oldcrank.org [mailto:phono-l-boun...@oldcrank.org] On Behalf Of Andrew Baron Sent: Sunday, January 13, 2013 12:00 AM To: Antique Phonograph List Cc: phonol...@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Phono-L] update that Triumph or not? The idea of drilling three big holes in something that's survived more than a 100 years in its original state is somewhat troubling, especially in a high-class, lower-production model like the Triumph. How about making a custom thin steel bracket that hangs over the back edge of the cabinet, similar to what you'd use to hang a Christmas wreath from your door, but wide enough to fasten the usual signet bracket to, with low-profile machine screw heads (or better yet, counter-sunk into the intermediate bracket/hangar and facing rearward; i.e., the nuts would be on the outer part of the signet bracket instead of inside the cabinet? It might require adding shims under the top hinge leaves to bump the motor board up enough to clear the thickness of the custom metal bracket (felt pads on the front corners to keep things level). The mass of the horn and support rods would ensure that the combination custom sheetmetal signet bracket assembly rests firmly against the outside rear panel of the cabinet. Lining the back of the intermediate bracket with green turntable felt (after securing the signet bracket to it and tightening the hardware of course) would protect the finish from the metal edges of the new bracket. Andrew Baron Santa Fe On Jan 12, 2013, at 5:18 PM, Ron L'Herault wrote: I've got a Triumph in for clean up and reproducer repair and the owner said that when he got it, he was given the original signet horn set up for the machine but it was never installed. Indeed, there are no holes in the back of the case. He was wondering if he should install it or not. So what would you do in a case like this, leave it as original, uninstalled, or complete the installation? Ron L ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.org ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.org ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.org
[Phono-L] update that Triumph or not?
I've got a Triumph in for clean up and reproducer repair and the owner said that when he got it, he was given the original signet horn set up for the machine but it was never installed. Indeed, there are no holes in the back of the case. He was wondering if he should install it or not. So what would you do in a case like this, leave it as original, uninstalled, or complete the installation? Ron L ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.org
Re: [Phono-L] update that Triumph or not?
The idea of drilling three big holes in something that's survived more than a 100 years in its original state is somewhat troubling, especially in a high-class, lower-production model like the Triumph. How about making a custom thin steel bracket that hangs over the back edge of the cabinet, similar to what you'd use to hang a Christmas wreath from your door, but wide enough to fasten the usual signet bracket to, with low-profile machine screw heads (or better yet, counter-sunk into the intermediate bracket/hangar and facing rearward; i.e., the nuts would be on the outer part of the signet bracket instead of inside the cabinet? It might require adding shims under the top hinge leaves to bump the motor board up enough to clear the thickness of the custom metal bracket (felt pads on the front corners to keep things level). The mass of the horn and support rods would ensure that the combination custom sheetmetal signet bracket assembly rests firmly against the outside rear panel of the cabinet. Lining the back of the intermediate bracket with green turntable felt (after securing the signet bracket to it and tightening the hardware of course) would protect the finish from the metal edges of the new bracket. Andrew Baron Santa Fe On Jan 12, 2013, at 5:18 PM, Ron L'Herault wrote: I've got a Triumph in for clean up and reproducer repair and the owner said that when he got it, he was given the original signet horn set up for the machine but it was never installed. Indeed, there are no holes in the back of the case. He was wondering if he should install it or not. So what would you do in a case like this, leave it as original, uninstalled, or complete the installation? Ron L ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.org ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.org
Re: [Phono-L] update that Triumph or not?
What Triumph cabinet does it have? If it is a banner Triumph Model A then I would definitely NOT drill holes into one of these cabinets. The later raised panel with a thicker wood is better suited from a material strength viewpoint. What reproducer does it have? A Model O in a horizontal carriage would suggest a Cygnet horn would be a good addition so the 'new' holes might not detract from the machine. If the carriage is a 45º small carriage with a Model C reproducer then I would stick with a smaller straight horn. Is the machine equipped with a 2 and 4 minute mandrel shaft gearing? Has the cabinet been refinished? Many factors need to be considered. In making a decision to alter something that has remained the same for 100+ years, one must think if the modification would have been accurate to the machine and how it will change the monetary value. Triumphs late D and D2, E, F, and G should already have the factory drilled holes. A 2 minute Model C Triumph is a rare bird, I would leave it virginal. A Triumph Model B with added horizontal carriage and an O Reproducer has already been altered, drill away Gridley. A Triumph A banner would have me want to return it to its catalog configuration. I have taken out 2/4 minutes gears on some of my machines and made them like their original description from a contemporaneous catalog. Anything earlier like a Spring Motor and it would be sacrilege to drill the holes. Did I mention that I am an opinionated old fart? Best wishes to all on the list, Al Who thought swans used Cygnet horns to keep from bumping into each other on the pond... ___ Phono-L mailing list http://phono-l.org
