Re: [Python-Dev] Can I revoke PEP 103 (info about git)?

2017-03-08 Thread Oleg Broytman 
On Wed, Mar 08, 2017 at 06:18:51PM -0500, Terry Reedy  wrote:
> On 3/8/2017 4:07 PM, Oleg Broytman wrote:
> >On Thu, Mar 09, 2017 at 07:53:04AM +1100, Steven D'Aprano 
> > wrote:
> >>On Wed, Mar 08, 2017 at 04:30:41PM +0100, Oleg Broytman wrote:
> >>>On Wed, Mar 08, 2017 at 09:50:06AM -0500, Barry Warsaw  
> >>>wrote:
> >>
> It's also okay to remove much of the content and just leave a placeholder.
> The historical record would of course always be available in the vcs.
> >>>
> >>>   Thanks! That's what I've planned to do in case we don't remove PEPs.
> >>
> >>Why remove the content?
> >>
> >>In fact, since its just an informational PEP, why withdraw it? Some
> >>people find it too generic and not enough about Python -- okay. So what?
> >>
> >>Is PEP 103 actively harmful?
> >
> >   Certainly not!
> 
> I recommend adding a note to the top that the info, which correct, is
> somewhat obsolescent (or whatever) with the new workflow.  We have PEPs
> which are not 'wrong' in that they have been replaced by later PEPs, but we
> do not delete them, either in whole or in part.

   I see. Thanks!

> -- 
> Terry Jan Reedy

Oleg.
-- 
 Oleg Broytmanhttp://phdru.name/p...@phdru.name
   Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN.
___
Python-Dev mailing list
Python-Dev@python.org
https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev
Unsubscribe: 
https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com

Re: [Python-Dev] Can I revoke PEP 103 (info about git)?

2017-03-08 Thread Terry Reedy 

On 3/8/2017 4:07 PM, Oleg Broytman wrote:

On Thu, Mar 09, 2017 at 07:53:04AM +1100, Steven D'Aprano  
wrote:

On Wed, Mar 08, 2017 at 04:30:41PM +0100, Oleg Broytman wrote:

On Wed, Mar 08, 2017 at 09:50:06AM -0500, Barry Warsaw  wrote:



It's also okay to remove much of the content and just leave a placeholder.
The historical record would of course always be available in the vcs.


   Thanks! That's what I've planned to do in case we don't remove PEPs.


Why remove the content?

In fact, since its just an informational PEP, why withdraw it? Some
people find it too generic and not enough about Python -- okay. So what?

Is PEP 103 actively harmful?


   Certainly not!


I recommend adding a note to the top that the info, which correct, is 
somewhat obsolescent (or whatever) with the new workflow.  We have PEPs 
which are not 'wrong' in that they have been replaced by later PEPs, but 
we do not delete them, either in whole or in part.


--
Terry Jan Reedy

___
Python-Dev mailing list
Python-Dev@python.org
https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev
Unsubscribe: 
https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 538: Coercing the legacy C locale to a UTF-8 based locale

2017-03-08 Thread Guido van Rossum 
On Wed, Mar 8, 2017 at 4:35 AM, Nick Coghlan  wrote:

>
> On 5 March 2017 at 17:50, Nick Coghlan  wrote:
>
>> Late last year I started working on a change to the CPython CLI (*not*
>> the shared library) to get it to coerce the legacy C locale to something
>> based on UTF-8 when a suitable locale is available.
>>
>> After a couple of rounds of iteration on linux-sig and python-ideas, I'm
>> now bringing it to python-dev as a concrete proposal for Python 3.7.
>>
>
> In terms of resolving this PEP, if Guido doesn't feel inclined to wade
> into the intricacies of legacy C locale handling, Barry has indicated he'd
> be happy to act as BDFL-Delegate :)
>

Hi Nick and Barry, I'd very much appreciate if you two could resolve this
without involving me. Godspeed!

-- 
--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
___
Python-Dev mailing list
Python-Dev@python.org
https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev
Unsubscribe: 
https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com

Re: [Python-Dev] Can I revoke PEP 103 (info about git)?

2017-03-08 Thread Oleg Broytman 
On Thu, Mar 09, 2017 at 07:53:04AM +1100, Steven D'Aprano  
wrote:
> On Wed, Mar 08, 2017 at 04:30:41PM +0100, Oleg Broytman wrote:
> > On Wed, Mar 08, 2017 at 09:50:06AM -0500, Barry Warsaw  
> > wrote:
> 
> > > It's also okay to remove much of the content and just leave a placeholder.
> > > The historical record would of course always be available in the vcs.
> > 
> >Thanks! That's what I've planned to do in case we don't remove PEPs.
> 
> Why remove the content? 
> 
> In fact, since its just an informational PEP, why withdraw it? Some 
> people find it too generic and not enough about Python -- okay. So what?
> 
> Is PEP 103 actively harmful?

   Certainly not!

> -- 
> Steve

Oleg.
-- 
 Oleg Broytmanhttp://phdru.name/p...@phdru.name
   Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN.
___
Python-Dev mailing list
Python-Dev@python.org
https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev
Unsubscribe: 
https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com

Re: [Python-Dev] Can I revoke PEP 103 (info about git)?

2017-03-08 Thread Steven D'Aprano 
On Wed, Mar 08, 2017 at 04:30:41PM +0100, Oleg Broytman wrote:
> On Wed, Mar 08, 2017 at 09:50:06AM -0500, Barry Warsaw  
> wrote:

> > It's also okay to remove much of the content and just leave a placeholder.
> > The historical record would of course always be available in the vcs.
> 
>Thanks! That's what I've planned to do in case we don't remove PEPs.

Why remove the content? 

In fact, since its just an informational PEP, why withdraw it? Some 
people find it too generic and not enough about Python -- okay. So what?

Is PEP 103 actively harmful?

-- 
Steve
___
Python-Dev mailing list
Python-Dev@python.org
https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev
Unsubscribe: 
https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com

Re: [Python-Dev] Python Design issue with print() function

2017-03-08 Thread Chris Barker 
This is a list for python interpreter development, not new ideas -- that
list is python-ideas.

However, sorry to be blunt, but this post shows great ignorance of Python
-- please study up more in the future before posting suggestions on any
list.

Specifics:

1) this has nothing to do with the print function -- it is simply printing
what you are asking it to print.

2) This does have to do with how slicing is done in Python, and that is
very well justified and is not going to change.

Don't be discouraged, though -- keep learning about Python, but while you
are, be sure to ask questions on python-tutor and the like before proposing
changes!

-CHB

On Sat, Jan 28, 2017 at 8:21 AM, ravi y via Python-Dev <
python-dev@python.org> wrote:

> Hi Python Developers,
>
> print() function has a slight design issue, when user gives start and end
> positions of character array.
> Issue:
> >>> str_ary="abcdef"
> >>> print(str_ary[1])
> b
> >>> print(str_ary[4])
> e
> >>> print(str_ary[1:4])
> bcd
> >>>
>
> In the above scenario, user is expecting that output of print function
> will be bcde (not bcd).
>
> Analysis:
> I kind of figured out what could be the issue.
> To get the string slice, "between" (or equivalent) was used.
> i.e.  str_ary array position >=1 and < 4
> Solution:
>User experience will be better if the code is updated to get last
> character.
>i.e str_ary array position >=1 and <= 4
>
> Note:
>  To keep the code as backward compatibility, you may come up with
> different name like printf()
>
>
> Thanks
> Ravi Yarlagadda
>
>
> ___
> Python-Dev mailing list
> Python-Dev@python.org
> https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev
> Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/
> chris.barker%40noaa.gov
>
>


-- 

Christopher Barker, Ph.D.
Oceanographer

Emergency Response Division
NOAA/NOS/OR(206) 526-6959   voice
7600 Sand Point Way NE   (206) 526-6329   fax
Seattle, WA  98115   (206) 526-6317   main reception

chris.bar...@noaa.gov
___
Python-Dev mailing list
Python-Dev@python.org
https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev
Unsubscribe: 
https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com

[Python-Dev] Python Design issue with print() function

2017-03-08 Thread ravi y via Python-Dev 
Hi Python Developers,
print() function has a slight design issue, when user gives start and end 
positions of character array.Issue: >>> str_ary="abcdef" >>> print(str_ary[1]) 
b >>> print(str_ary[4]) e >>> print(str_ary[1:4]) bcd >>> 
 In the above scenario, user is expecting that output of print function will be 
bcde (not bcd).
Analysis: I kind of figured out what could be the issue.  To get the string 
slice, "between" (or equivalent) was used. i.e.  str_ary array position >=1 and 
< 4 Solution:   User experience will be better if the code is updated to get 
last character.   i.e str_ary array position >=1 and <= 4
Note: To keep the code as backward compatibility, you may come up with 
different name like printf() 
ThanksRavi Yarlagadda   
___
Python-Dev mailing list
Python-Dev@python.org
https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev
Unsubscribe: 
https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com

Re: [Python-Dev] Can I revoke PEP 103 (info about git)?

2017-03-08 Thread Oleg Broytman 
On Wed, Mar 08, 2017 at 09:50:06AM -0500, Barry Warsaw  wrote:
> On Mar 08, 2017, at 10:38 PM, Nick Coghlan wrote:
> 
> >Withdrawing the PEP is just a matter of submitting a PR to change the state
> >to Withdrawn, so it doesn't actually break any links. It's helpful to add a
> >short "PEP Withdrawal" section to say why it's withdrawn though, and you'd
> >be able to link to the wiki.python.org page from there.
> 
> We don't have a great Status for obsolete informational PEPs, so Withdrawn is
> about as good as it gets.  I've heard little parrots ask whether the whole PEP
> can just be deleted, implying the number could be reused in the future.  I
> *really* don't want for that to ever be possible.
> 
> Maybe change the status to "This is an Ex-PEP" or "This PEP is pining for the
> fiords".
> 
> It's also okay to remove much of the content and just leave a placeholder.
> The historical record would of course always be available in the vcs.

   Thanks! That's what I've planned to do in case we don't remove PEPs.

> Cheers,
> -Barry

Oleg.
-- 
 Oleg Broytmanhttp://phdru.name/p...@phdru.name
   Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN.
___
Python-Dev mailing list
Python-Dev@python.org
https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev
Unsubscribe: 
https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com

Re: [Python-Dev] Can I revoke PEP 103 (info about git)?

2017-03-08 Thread Barry Warsaw 
On Mar 08, 2017, at 10:38 PM, Nick Coghlan wrote:

>Withdrawing the PEP is just a matter of submitting a PR to change the state
>to Withdrawn, so it doesn't actually break any links. It's helpful to add a
>short "PEP Withdrawal" section to say why it's withdrawn though, and you'd
>be able to link to the wiki.python.org page from there.

We don't have a great Status for obsolete informational PEPs, so Withdrawn is
about as good as it gets.  I've heard little parrots ask whether the whole PEP
can just be deleted, implying the number could be reused in the future.  I
*really* don't want for that to ever be possible.

Maybe change the status to "This is an Ex-PEP" or "This PEP is pining for the
fiords".

It's also okay to remove much of the content and just leave a placeholder.
The historical record would of course always be available in the vcs.

Cheers,
-Barry

___
Python-Dev mailing list
Python-Dev@python.org
https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev
Unsubscribe: 
https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com

Re: [Python-Dev] Can I revoke PEP 103 (info about git)?

2017-03-08 Thread Oleg Broytman 
On Wed, Mar 08, 2017 at 10:38:08PM +1000, Nick Coghlan  
wrote:
> On 8 March 2017 at 18:33, Oleg Broytman  wrote:
> 
> > Hello! When I was writing PEP 103 I wanted to help to start using git.
> > There were a few proponents and a few opponents: people expressed
> > concerns that the PEP is too generic and isn't really related to Python
> > development so I promised to revoke the PEP after the switch to git and
> > Github.
> >Now I think is the time. I hope revocation of the PEP wouldn't cause
> > any problem? I'm gonna publish it at wiki.p.o.
> 
> Withdrawing the PEP is just a matter of submitting a PR to change the state
> to Withdrawn, so it doesn't actually break any links. It's helpful to add a
> short "PEP Withdrawal" section to say why it's withdrawn though, and you'd
> be able to link to the wiki.python.org page from there.

   Thanks! So the plan for me is to get editor rights for wiki, publish
the text there and submit a PR.

> Cheers,
> Nick.
> 
> -- 
> Nick Coghlan   |   ncogh...@gmail.com   |   Brisbane, Australia

Oleg.
-- 
 Oleg Broytmanhttp://phdru.name/p...@phdru.name
   Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN.
___
Python-Dev mailing list
Python-Dev@python.org
https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev
Unsubscribe: 
https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com

Re: [Python-Dev] Can I revoke PEP 103 (info about git)?

2017-03-08 Thread Nick Coghlan 
On 8 March 2017 at 18:33, Oleg Broytman  wrote:

> Hello! When I was writing PEP 103 I wanted to help to start using git.
> There were a few proponents and a few opponents: people expressed
> concerns that the PEP is too generic and isn't really related to Python
> development so I promised to revoke the PEP after the switch to git and
> Github.
>Now I think is the time. I hope revocation of the PEP wouldn't cause
> any problem? I'm gonna publish it at wiki.p.o.
>

Withdrawing the PEP is just a matter of submitting a PR to change the state
to Withdrawn, so it doesn't actually break any links. It's helpful to add a
short "PEP Withdrawal" section to say why it's withdrawn though, and you'd
be able to link to the wiki.python.org page from there.

Cheers,
Nick.

-- 
Nick Coghlan   |   ncogh...@gmail.com   |   Brisbane, Australia
___
Python-Dev mailing list
Python-Dev@python.org
https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev
Unsubscribe: 
https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com

Re: [Python-Dev] PEP 538: Coercing the legacy C locale to a UTF-8 based locale

2017-03-08 Thread Nick Coghlan 
On 5 March 2017 at 17:50, Nick Coghlan  wrote:

> Hi folks,
>
> Late last year I started working on a change to the CPython CLI (*not* the
> shared library) to get it to coerce the legacy C locale to something based
> on UTF-8 when a suitable locale is available.
>
> After a couple of rounds of iteration on linux-sig and python-ideas, I'm
> now bringing it to python-dev as a concrete proposal for Python 3.7.
>

In terms of resolving this PEP, if Guido doesn't feel inclined to wade into
the intricacies of legacy C locale handling, Barry has indicated he'd be
happy to act as BDFL-Delegate :)

Cheers,
Nick.

-- 
Nick Coghlan   |   ncogh...@gmail.com   |   Brisbane, Australia
___
Python-Dev mailing list
Python-Dev@python.org
https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev
Unsubscribe: 
https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com

[Python-Dev] Can I revoke PEP 103 (info about git)?

2017-03-08 Thread Oleg Broytman 
Hello! When I was writing PEP 103 I wanted to help to start using git.
There were a few proponents and a few opponents: people expressed
concerns that the PEP is too generic and isn't really related to Python
development so I promised to revoke the PEP after the switch to git and
Github.
   Now I think is the time. I hope revocation of the PEP wouldn't cause
any problem? I'm gonna publish it at wiki.p.o.

Oleg.
-- 
 Oleg Broytmanhttp://phdru.name/p...@phdru.name
   Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN.
___
Python-Dev mailing list
Python-Dev@python.org
https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev
Unsubscribe: 
https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com

Re: [Python-Dev] 3.6.1 release status and plans

2017-03-08 Thread Nick Coghlan 
On 8 March 2017 at 11:59, Ned Deily  wrote:

> An update on the 3.6.1 release:  As you probably noticed, 3.6.1 release
> candidate 1 was made available (finally!) two days ago.  Thank you for your
> patience as we worked though the details of producing a release using our
> new GitHub-based development workflow.  As we've noted, it's really
> important for all segments of the community to try using 3.6.1rc1 to help
> make sure something didn't break along the way.  Please report any
> potential problems via the bugs.python.org tracker and mark them as
> "release blocker".
>
> Because rc1 was delayed a week, I've moved the planned release date for
> 3.6.1 final back a week as well, now 2017-03-20.  That gives two weeks of
> exposure for rc1.  The plan is to, if at all possible, not ship any
> additional changes in the final beyond what is already in rc1 unless we
> discover any release-blocking critical problems in rc1.  The 3.6 branch
> remains open for new cherry-pick PRs etc but you should expect that any PRs
> that are merged into the 3.6 branch since the v3.6.1rc1 tag will first be
> released in 3.6.2, expected before the end of June (about 3 months).
>

And if anyone notices some oddities with sys.path initialisation, we're
aware of them and are looking into it: http://bugs.python.org/issue29723
(it currently appears to be a case where a fix that worked as intended in
Windows is unexpectedly leaving the parent directory of the given directory
or archive on sys.path when running directories and zip archives on other
platforms).

Cheers,
Nick.

-- 
Nick Coghlan   |   ncogh...@gmail.com   |   Brisbane, Australia
___
Python-Dev mailing list
Python-Dev@python.org
https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev
Unsubscribe: 
https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com