date:20110108

Double that AMEN!  You were brought up right.  I can't get away with
that on a long ride-I'll just end up seeing the food again later.

On Fri, Jan 7, 2011 at 7:24 PM, Montclair BobbyB
montclairbob...@gmail.com wrote:
 AMEN, BROTHER, I'm with you... Because life is too short to not enjoy
 food!!!  (or drink sh**y beer, or drink bad coffee, or ride lousy
 bikes... yaddy yadda...)

 BB

 On Jan 7, 11:59 am, Kelly Sleeper tkslee...@gmail.com wrote:
 Thanks .. Double cheeseburger, fries and shake at 50 miles thanks.:
 Medium please

 Sent from my iPhone

 On Jan 6, 2011, at 11:38 PM, Rene Sterental orthie...@gmail.com wrote:



  Well, the discussion had just turned into what to eat during those long 
  rides, carbs being the traditional option and now, with Grant's web post 
  regarding Taube's book that triggered this thread, what would the high 
  protein/high fat alternative be and whether it would be viable and provide 
  the required energy to sustain a rider through one of these long rides.

  I can say that for me this is a very interesting thread as I am planning 
  to do those rides but not planning on eating the traditional carbs... :-)

  René

  On Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at 9:28 PM, Kelly Sleeper tkslee...@gmail.com wrote:
  Who doesn't plan long rides on Riv bikes?  Never heard that one.  I plan 
  on riding 12 to 15 centuries this year as usual.. I didn't read the book, 
  but I'm lost as to anyone suggesting we wouldn't ride long rides.

  Kelly
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Re: [RBW] Re: New News Post

Look up the biography of Alexandra David Neal, who practised tumo
the Tibetan art of self-generating enough heat to survive without warm
clothing in Himalayan winters.

The Inuit ate largely meat and fish; the Masai, traditionally, milk
and blood; the Japanese largely polished rice with a little fish and
vegetable, as do my mother's Filipino people, the southwestern pueblo
Indians corn and beans (and chile). I personally (Nepal, trek from
Pokhara to Ghorepani at about 10K feet; spring, 1968, age 13 --
nothing there in 1968!) have seen Sherpas carrying heavy loads climb
at altitude for days largely on tsampa, barley flour mixed with tea.
The French seem to eat richly but moderately; all are generally
healthy. My conclusion is that there are very many healthy diets.

On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 5:39 AM, David T.  wrote:

 Vilhjalmur Stefansson, the arctic explorer, pioneered and tested a
 high meat, high fish, low carb diet, based on what he learned from the
 Inuit. In 1930 he published a study in the Journal of the American
 Medical Association describing how he and a colleague lived on a diet
 of only meat for one year.

 http://www.jbc.org/content/87/3/651.full.pdf

 (I see the study was partly funded by the Institute of American Meat
 Packers.)

 He also had a way of traveling across country by foot in the coldest
 conditions: he would walk or run until he felt himself start to get
 overheated. Then he would lie down on the snow to rest, and sometimes
 even drift off to sleep. When his body cooled down enough he would
 naturally wake, and then get up for another stretch of activity. The
 key was not to allow himself to get overheated and sweaty, and that
 way he avoided hypothermia.

 Does this relate to Rivendell bicycles, or even the topic at hand? Not
 necessarily. Just thought I would throw it out there.






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Re: [RBW] Re: Fender mounted battery powered taillight suggestions?

But quite bright nonetheless! I have them on two bikes to complement
the PB Superflash blinkies.

On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 5:07 AM, Angus angusle...@sbcglobal.net wrote:
 I use a Spanninga too...not very bright compared to the Planet Bike
 Super Flash or the PDW Radbot 1000.

 Angus

 On Jan 7, 10:01 pm, RoadieRyan ryansub...@gmail.com wrote:
 After commuting home in the dark and rain this evening (Seattle) it
 occurred to me that, even with a nice Princeton-tech swerve n the seat
 stay and modest tail pack and back of helmet tail lights,  a nice
 bright rear fender mounted tail light would not be a bad idea.

 I like the look of the PDW Radbot 1000 but it doesn't specify a fender
 mount option.  Anybody have suggestions on a good battery powered
 fender mounted tail light I can slap on my (metal) fender?

 Thanks

 Ryan

 West Seattle

 PS  Thank goodness for wool on wet nights!  and lil' loafer rain
 covers.

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[RBW] Re: New News Post

2011-01-08 Thread Patrick in VT

On Jan 7, 9:04 pm, PATRICK MOORE bertin...@gmail.com wrote:
 I know this topic is grossly OT, but the idea that carbs, even refined
 carbs, are somehow bad for you is just egregiously absurd: tell it
 to the Chinese, Indians, Native Americans, Italians and other groups
 whose principal source of food is grains of some sort or another. The
 Japanese have very long average life, and it isn't because they are
 scarfing down bacon and cheese.

and don't forget disease.  it's pretty well researched and clear at
this point which foods help prevent, fight or even help reverse
disease, including cancers and heart disease, and which foods increase
the risk for getting seriously sick.  if ever there was a final
arbiter of which foods are healthy and which are not, it's disease.

in any event, nutrition and health is simply too important to allow
others (especially those who stand to profit) to be making the calls.
life is better when we take ownership of our decisions, particularly
those that relate to our health.  and we are all perfectly capable of
choosing health on our own.  food isn't complicated.  life is.  but
food isn't.

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Re: [RBW] Re: New News Post

Whereabouts in VT?

On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 10:16 AM, Patrick in VT swing4...@gmail.com wrote:
 On Jan 7, 9:04 pm, PATRICK MOORE bertin...@gmail.com wrote:
 I know this topic is grossly OT, but the idea that carbs, even refined
 carbs, are somehow bad for you is just egregiously absurd: tell it
 to the Chinese, Indians, Native Americans, Italians and other groups
 whose principal source of food is grains of some sort or another. The
 Japanese have very long average life, and it isn't because they are
 scarfing down bacon and cheese.

 and don't forget disease.  it's pretty well researched and clear at
 this point which foods help prevent, fight or even help reverse
 disease, including cancers and heart disease, and which foods increase
 the risk for getting seriously sick.  if ever there was a final
 arbiter of which foods are healthy and which are not, it's disease.

 in any event, nutrition and health is simply too important to allow
 others (especially those who stand to profit) to be making the calls.
 life is better when we take ownership of our decisions, particularly
 those that relate to our health.  and we are all perfectly capable of
 choosing health on our own.  food isn't complicated.  life is.  but
 food isn't.

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Re: [RBW] Re: New News Post

2011-01-08 Thread Bruce

We need to change the topic of this thread. 

What do you think, Helmets, yes or no?

From: Patrick in VT swing4...@gmail.com
To: RBW Owners Bunch rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com
Sent: Sat, January 8, 2011 9:16:46 AM
Subject: [RBW] Re: New News Post

On Jan 7, 9:04 pm, PATRICK MOORE bertin...@gmail.com wrote:
 I know this topic is grossly OT, but the idea that carbs, even refined
 carbs, are somehow bad for you is just egregiously absurd:...

and don't forget disease.  

in any event, nutrition and health is simply too important to allow
others (especially those who stand to profit) to be making the calls.

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Re: [RBW] Re: New News Post

2011-01-08 Thread zeidler . robert

No we don't...
Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry

-Original Message-
From: Bruce fullylug...@yahoo.com
Sender: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com
Date: Sat, 8 Jan 2011 07:33:27 
To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com
Reply-To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [RBW] Re: New News Post

We need to change the topic of this thread. 

What do you think, Helmets, yes or no?





From: Patrick in VT swing4...@gmail.com
To: RBW Owners Bunch rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com
Sent: Sat, January 8, 2011 9:16:46 AM
Subject: [RBW] Re: New News Post

On Jan 7, 9:04 pm, PATRICK MOORE bertin...@gmail.com wrote:
 I know this topic is grossly OT, but the idea that carbs, even refined
 carbs, are somehow bad for you is just egregiously absurd:...

and don't forget disease.  

in any event, nutrition and health is simply too important to allow
others (especially those who stand to profit) to be making the calls.


  

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[RBW] Re: Electra Ticino Bottle Cage

Thanks for posting! I love the look of the Nitto's but can't bring
myself to spend that kind of money on a cage. However, you mention in
your review that Electra specifies a limit of 21oz bottles... And that
makes me worry. I can see that with the construction of these cages
(both Nitto and Electra's version) the tension used to hold a bottle
is going to put stress on those brazed/welded spots at the top of the
cage. Those are the spots that would eventually see breakage.

Travis

On Jan 7, 8:29 pm, Eric Norris campyonly...@me.com wrote:
 Some thoughts on this alternative to Nitto's R cage and a link to detailed 
 photos are on my 
 blog:http://campyonlyguy.blogspot.com/2011/01/stuff-were-using-electra-tic...

 --Eric
 campyonly...@me.comwww.campyonly.comwww.wheelsnorth.org

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Re: [RBW] Re: Electra Ticino Bottle Cage

I had a number of Nitto's Butterfly cages which were broken by
large, ss bottles. I replaced them all (eventually) with King Iris
cages which are not quite as pretty but very much more sturdy.

On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 8:37 AM, Travis travisbreitenb...@gmail.com wrote:
 Thanks for posting! I love the look of the Nitto's but can't bring
 myself to spend that kind of money on a cage. However, you mention in
 your review that Electra specifies a limit of 21oz bottles... And that
 makes me worry. I can see that with the construction of these cages
 (both Nitto and Electra's version) the tension used to hold a bottle
 is going to put stress on those brazed/welded spots at the top of the
 cage. Those are the spots that would eventually see breakage.

 Travis

 On Jan 7, 8:29 pm, Eric Norris campyonly...@me.com wrote:
 Some thoughts on this alternative to Nitto's R cage and a link to detailed 
 photos are on my 
 blog:http://campyonlyguy.blogspot.com/2011/01/stuff-were-using-electra-tic...

 --Eric
 campyonly...@me.comwww.campyonly.comwww.wheelsnorth.org

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-- 
Patrick Moore
Albuquerque, NM
For professional resumes, contact
Patrick Moore, ACRW at resumespecialt...@gmail.com

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[RBW] Re: Fender mounted battery powered taillight suggestions?

Same issue here. I bought a Radbot 1000 hoping I could make it work
with a fender, but I haven't found an elegant solution so far. You
need access to a screw at the back of the light to change the
batteries - whereas on fender mounted models the screw is on the
front.

Patrick: when you say But quite bright nonetheless! which light are
you referring to? Are you saying the PDW fenderbot is decently bright?
Or the PDW Radbot 1000?

Thanks,
Travis

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[RBW] Re: Most interesting Riv Reader Articles

2011-01-08 Thread Beth H

I'm a fan of the early, early stuff that made me want to subscribe/
join.
--Living with a retired greyhound
--the reason our typewriters use the QWERTY system
--Why the Titanic sank (metal failure and fascinating discussion of
metallurgy in general)
--And, although I am a lousy poet and not terribly literate (I can't
sit still long enough to read a chapter in a novel most days -- too
much shpilkes!), I enjoy the poetry that sometimes creeps its way into
the RR.

Things I could live with a little less of: articles exhorting me to
let my bike rust and chip and/or how to add stuff to it (feather-
wrapped chainstays??!) to make it look more used.

I worry that the RR will eventually go away, or be reduced to an
erratic schedule of once every three years or less. It's one of the
things that really set Rivendell apart in the beginning and I fear
that it's loss will reduce Rivendell to Just Another Bike Company That
Sells Cool Bikes. The RR makes Rivendell so much more.

Beth

On Jan 7, 6:42 pm, colin p. cummings colinthehip...@gmail.com
wrote:
 To all who read them, what has been the most interesting article
 you've read in a Riv Reader?

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[RBW] Re: Most interesting Riv Reader Articles

2011-01-08 Thread Mitch Browne

Re: RR27

It was actually a used XO-2 he picked up for $150.

Comments from the author (Grant?) riding the fully loaded bike.

I rode it about 4 miles loaded up, as I escorted Brad to the
range country out of town, and let me tell you, that thing is
a handful even on smooth pavement. The front and back
parts of the bike move independently, and the flex is way
more than I’ve ever experienced, and I’ve ridden light-
framed road bikes off road with 30lbs of gear. I hate to say
it, but it is a testimony to steel’s fatigue resistance and
toughness, that such a humble bike can handle such heavy
loads on such lousy surfaces for such a long time.

On Jan 7, 7:29 pm, rob markwardt robmar...@hotmail.com wrote:
 One of my favorites (in # 27)  was about the twins who toured from
 Alaska to South America.  One of them stayed down there and the other
 rode back to the US on an XO-1, with Terrier riding atop luggage,
 stopping in at Walnut Creek for a chat and ride with Grant.  He got a
 new saddle and headed off to?...wonder where he is now?
    That same reader had a an interview with Charlie Cunningham, pics
 of Chuck Schmidt's awesome vintage Mercian and also (I believe)
 introduced the Quickbeam.  The peak of the Reader imho.

 Rob

 On Jan 7, 6:42 pm, colin p. cummings colinthehip...@gmail.com
 wrote:







  To all who read them, what has been the most interesting article
  you've read in a Riv Reader?

  I haven't read many, but I was very into an article about a
  typographer that originally appeared in the New Yorker...can't
  remember which Reader, or the chap's name, but it was intriguing and
  fun.  I love that sort of esoteric reporting alongside an article
  about wrapping twine.

  Colin Cummings
  Amarillo, TX

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Re: [RBW] Re: Fender mounted battery powered taillight suggestions?

I was referring to the Spanninga that someone else mentioned. It's not
as bright as the PB SF, but, seen from a couple of hundred yards away
at night, it's quite visible and IMO is a worthy part of a package
including a bright flasher and reflective bits.

On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 8:59 AM, Travis travisbreitenb...@gmail.com wrote:
 Same issue here. I bought a Radbot 1000 hoping I could make it work
 with a fender, but I haven't found an elegant solution so far. You
 need access to a screw at the back of the light to change the
 batteries - whereas on fender mounted models the screw is on the
 front.

 Patrick: when you say But quite bright nonetheless! which light are
 you referring to? Are you saying the PDW fenderbot is decently bright?
 Or the PDW Radbot 1000?

 Thanks,
 Travis

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For professional resumes, contact
Patrick Moore, ACRW at resumespecialt...@gmail.com

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[RBW] Re: Most interesting Riv Reader Articles

2011-01-08 Thread Mike

I loved the Andy Hampsten interview. It was relatively recent, RR 38
or 39 if I remember correctly. I also enjoyed the recent piece about
touring Alaska in the 70s, again the specific issue number escapes
me.

I've ordered the RRs on disc, it's a lot of fun looking through the
older issues.

--mike

On Jan 7, 6:42 pm, colin p. cummings colinthehip...@gmail.com
wrote:
 To all who read them, what has been the most interesting article
 you've read in a Riv Reader?

 I haven't read many, but I was very into an article about a
 typographer that originally appeared in the New Yorker...can't
 remember which Reader, or the chap's name, but it was intriguing and
 fun.  I love that sort of esoteric reporting alongside an article
 about wrapping twine.

 Colin Cummings
 Amarillo, TX

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Re: [RBW] Re: Electra Ticino Bottle Cage

2011-01-08 Thread Bruce Baker

I have a couple on my Sam Hillborne and love them. No problem so far and
they look pretty cool. This was my substitute for the Nitto's.
I'll post a pic later.
Bruce

On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 10:37 AM, Travis travisbreitenb...@gmail.com wrote:

Thanks for posting! I love the look of the Nitto's but can't bring
myself to spend that kind of money on a cage. However, you mention in
your review that Electra specifies a limit of 21oz bottles... And that
makes me worry. I can see that with the construction of these cages
(both Nitto and Electra's version) the tension used to hold a bottle
is going to put stress on those brazed/welded spots at the top of the
cage. Those are the spots that would eventually see breakage.

Travis

On Jan 7, 8:29 pm, Eric Norris campyonly...@me.com wrote:
Some thoughts on this alternative to Nitto's R cage and a link to
detailed photos are on my blog:
http://campyonlyguy.blogspot.com/2011/01/stuff-were-using-electra-tic...

--Eric
campyonly...@me.comwww.campyonly.comwww.wheelsnorth.org

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[RBW] Re: New News Post

2011-01-08 Thread Mike

Eat food. Not too much. Mostly plants.--Michael Pollan

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Re: [RBW] Re: New News Post

2011-01-08 Thread Kelly Sleeper

Yes and NO! If the group you are riding with prefers helmets be worn wear
them. If it's your ride and you dont' want to don't. Just be civil. ...
I love the helmet wars... but think I would be better served to wear my
helmet on the golf course than the bike.

On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 9:33 AM, Bruce fullylug...@yahoo.com wrote:

We need to change the topic of this thread.

What do you think, Helmets, yes or no?

--
*From:* Patrick in VT swing4...@gmail.com
*To:* RBW Owners Bunch rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com
*Sent:* Sat, January 8, 2011 9:16:46 AM
*Subject:* [RBW] Re: New News Post

On Jan 7, 9:04 pm, PATRICK MOORE bertin...@gmail.com wrote:
I know this topic is grossly OT, but the idea that carbs, even refined
carbs, are somehow bad for you is just egregiously absurd:...

and don't forget disease.

in any event, nutrition and health is simply too important to allow
others (especially those who stand to profit) to be making the calls.

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Re: [RBW] Re: Most interesting Riv Reader Articles

2011-01-08 Thread Kelly Sleeper

Thanks guys for costing me 40 bucks on CD's to get all the readers... now my
wife has to eat McDonalds for dinner instead of Outback.

Hope you are proud of yourselfs now.

Kelly

On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 10:16 AM, Mike mjawn...@gmail.com wrote:

I loved the Andy Hampsten interview. It was relatively recent, RR 38
or 39 if I remember correctly. I also enjoyed the recent piece about
touring Alaska in the 70s, again the specific issue number escapes
me.

I've ordered the RRs on disc, it's a lot of fun looking through the
older issues.

--mike

On Jan 7, 6:42 pm, colin p. cummings colinthehip...@gmail.com
wrote:
To all who read them, what has been the most interesting article
you've read in a Riv Reader?

I haven't read many, but I was very into an article about a
typographer that originally appeared in the New Yorker...can't
remember which Reader, or the chap's name, but it was intriguing and
fun. I love that sort of esoteric reporting alongside an article
about wrapping twine.

Colin Cummings
Amarillo, TX

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[RBW] Re: Nitto Front Racks

2011-01-08 Thread Earl Grey

Go with the Mini. It's a great rack, and mine has carried well over 30 lbs 
without a problem. In fact, the superiority of the Mini is a major reason to 
get a cantilever bike, IMO.

I have no experience with the two-strut, so take my comments with a grain of 
salt, but despite the double struts I doubt it can carry more weight than 
the mini, because its attachment to the fork crown is much less secure 
(bolted-on flat piece of flexible steel vs. brazed-on solid round steel 
rod). That said, the two strut will fit cantis acc. to rivbike: It mounts 
to any of our bikes, and most others. For the most secure attachment, you'd 
probably want to run a bolt through your forkcrown to attach the flat metal 
piece to...

Cheers,

Gernot

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[RBW] Re: Electra Ticino Bottle Cage

2011-01-08 Thread Michael_S

I had never heard of that weight restriction before on the Nitto
cages. I found mine on EBAY at reasonable prices. They are beautiful.
I only use those clear polypro bottles Riv sells and they are 18oz so
I'm ok.

~Mike~

On Jan 8, 8:21 am, Bruce Baker bkno...@gmail.com wrote:
I have a couple on my Sam Hillborne and love them. No problem so far and
they look pretty cool. This was my substitute for the Nitto's.
I'll post a pic later.
Bruce

On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 10:37 AM, Travis travisbreitenb...@gmail.com wrote:
Thanks for posting! I love the look of the Nitto's but can't bring
myself to spend that kind of money on a cage. However, you mention in
your review that Electra specifies a limit of 21oz bottles... And that
makes me worry. I can see that with the construction of these cages
(both Nitto and Electra's version) the tension used to hold a bottle
is going to put stress on those brazed/welded spots at the top of the
cage. Those are the spots that would eventually see breakage.

Travis

--Eric
campyonly...@me.comwww.campyonly.comwww.wheelsnorth.org

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[RBW] Re: What Makes the Rivendell

2011-01-08 Thread Michael_S

I agree... it's all of the above. The bikes fit right, permit larger
tires, seem very balanced riding.
The lug work and  attention to detail make the whole package perfect.

I'm not sure about that elf thing though. I thought it was artesians.

~Mike~

On Jan 7, 6:15 pm, PATRICK MOORE bertin...@gmail.com wrote:
 On Fri, Jan 7, 2011 at 1:06 PM, Kelly Sleeper tkslee...@gmail.com wrote:
  My question is what makes the Rivendell Bike Different.

 Incontrovertibly and incontestably nothing more important than **fit**
 and **handling** -- sez I whose 3 customs won't take more than 30s
 with fenders.

 --
 Patrick Moore
 Albuquerque, NM
 For professional resumes, contact
 Patrick Moore, ACRW at resumespecialt...@gmail.com

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[RBW] Re: Fender mounted battery powered taillight suggestions?

2011-01-08 Thread KP

I mounted the Radbot 1000 on my fender. First I popped off the clip
and sanded down the back of the light to more closely match the curve
of the fender. Then I used a longer screw to attach the fender to the
light back. The same screw attaches the reflector to the back.
I think the light is located in the best possible spot for the bike.
It's not perfect, but this isn't a show bike by any means.

I'm not doing a good job of describing it, so posted a few pictures
here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/39056...@n08/sets/72157625775993554/

Kevin Mulcahy
Chicago, IL
On Jan 8, 7:41 am, EricP ericpl...@aol.com wrote:
 There is a fender mounted PDW light.  It's smaller than the
 Spanninga.  Use it on my Fargo with plastic fenders.  Went with the
 Spanninga on my metal fendered bike.  The PDW fender mount does have a
 flashing mode.  Not as bright as the Radbot 1000.

 Neither is that bright of a light.  Mostly use it in conjunction with
 other lights.  Or as a backup.

 You could save money and buy an ankle reflector.  Cheaper.  But
 depends on drivers having lights on to work well.

 Eric Platt
 St. Paul, MN

 On Jan 8, 6:07 am, Angus angusle...@sbcglobal.net wrote:

  I use a Spanninga too...not very bright compared to the Planet Bike
  Super Flash or the PDW Radbot 1000.

  Angus

  On Jan 7, 10:01 pm, RoadieRyan ryansub...@gmail.com wrote:

   After commuting home in the dark and rain this evening (Seattle) it
   occurred to me that, even with a nice Princeton-tech swerve n the seat
   stay and modest tail pack and back of helmet tail lights,  a nice
   bright rear fender mounted tail light would not be a bad idea.

   I like the look of the PDW Radbot 1000 but it doesn't specify a fender
   mount option.  Anybody have suggestions on a good battery powered
   fender mounted tail light I can slap on my (metal) fender?

   Thanks

   Ryan

   West Seattle

   PS  Thank goodness for wool on wet nights!  and lil' loafer rain
   covers.- Hide quoted text -

  - Show quoted text -

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Re: [RBW] Re: Fender mounted battery powered taillight suggestions?

2011-01-08 Thread omnigrid

I've sent an email in the past to planetbike asking them to consider making
a fender-mount version of the superflash. perhaps if others did the same,
they'd respond.

On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 9:13 AM, PATRICK MOORE bertin...@gmail.com wrote:

But quite bright nonetheless! I have them on two bikes to complement
the PB Superflash blinkies.

On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 5:07 AM, Angus angusle...@sbcglobal.net wrote:
I use a Spanninga too...not very bright compared to the Planet Bike
Super Flash or the PDW Radbot 1000.

Angus

On Jan 7, 10:01 pm, RoadieRyan ryansub...@gmail.com wrote:
After commuting home in the dark and rain this evening (Seattle) it
occurred to me that, even with a nice Princeton-tech swerve n the seat
stay and modest tail pack and back of helmet tail lights, a nice
bright rear fender mounted tail light would not be a bad idea.

I like the look of the PDW Radbot 1000 but it doesn't specify a fender
mount option. Anybody have suggestions on a good battery powered
fender mounted tail light I can slap on my (metal) fender?

Thanks

Ryan

West Seattle

PS Thank goodness for wool on wet nights! and lil' loafer rain
covers.

--
Patrick Moore
Albuquerque, NM
For professional resumes, contact
Patrick Moore, ACRW at resumespecialt...@gmail.com

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RE: [RBW] Fender mounted battery powered taillight suggestions?

2011-01-08 Thread jim phillips

I use a pair of Cateye lights which mount on the metal stay. Very easy to 
mount. No concern with scratching the paint.

best,

JimP

 Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2011 20:01:43 -0800
 Subject: [RBW] Fender mounted battery powered taillight suggestions?
 From: ryansub...@gmail.com
 To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com

 After commuting home in the dark and rain this evening (Seattle) it
 occurred to me that, even with a nice Princeton-tech swerve n the seat
 stay and modest tail pack and back of helmet tail lights,  a nice
 bright rear fender mounted tail light would not be a bad idea.

 I like the look of the PDW Radbot 1000 but it doesn't specify a fender
 mount option.  Anybody have suggestions on a good battery powered
 fender mounted tail light I can slap on my (metal) fender?

 Thanks

 Ryan

 West Seattle

 PS  Thank goodness for wool on wet nights!  and lil' loafer rain
 covers.

 -- 
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[RBW] Re: Fender mounted battery powered taillight suggestions?

2011-01-08 Thread AmiSingh

Ryan,

See if you like the fenderbot :

http://www.ridepdw.com/goods/lights/fenderbot™

There's bound to be some awesome home brew solutions also.  I'm
looking forward to seeing what inginuity abounds the Riv family.

Ami

On Jan 7, 11:01 pm, RoadieRyan ryansub...@gmail.com wrote:
 After commuting home in the dark and rain this evening (Seattle) it
 occurred to me that, even with a nice Princeton-tech swerve n the seat
 stay and modest tail pack and back of helmet tail lights,  a nice
 bright rear fender mounted tail light would not be a bad idea.

 I like the look of the PDW Radbot 1000 but it doesn't specify a fender
 mount option.  Anybody have suggestions on a good battery powered
 fender mounted tail light I can slap on my (metal) fender?

 Thanks

 Ryan

 West Seattle

 PS  Thank goodness for wool on wet nights!  and lil' loafer rain
 covers.

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[RBW] Re: Fender mounted battery powered taillight suggestions?

2011-01-08 Thread Philip Williamson

I got Radbot 1000s for my wife and son, then I saw the Portland Design
Works' Fenderbot: http://www.flickr.com/photos/kaptainamerika/5218869330/
I need about 3 of them, or I need to figure out a fender mount for the
Radbot. The Radbot is extremely bright.

 Philip

 Philip Williamson
www.biketinker.com



On Jan 7, 8:01 pm, RoadieRyan ryansub...@gmail.com wrote:
 After commuting home in the dark and rain this evening (Seattle) it
 occurred to me that, even with a nice Princeton-tech swerve n the seat
 stay and modest tail pack and back of helmet tail lights,  a nice
 bright rear fender mounted tail light would not be a bad idea.

 I like the look of the PDW Radbot 1000 but it doesn't specify a fender
 mount option.  Anybody have suggestions on a good battery powered
 fender mounted tail light I can slap on my (metal) fender?

 Thanks

 Ryan

 West Seattle

 PS  Thank goodness for wool on wet nights!  and lil' loafer rain
 covers.

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Re: [RBW] Most interesting Riv Reader Articles

2011-01-08 Thread JimD

The Riv Readers have so many interesting articles that I can't choose.

From the perspective of a bicycler with bicycling priorities the
Readers on CD are some of the most interesting reading

I've encountered in some time. I'm fond of the span of Grant's
interests and the quality of his writing and observations.

http://www.rivbike.com/products/show/riv-reader-pdfs-on-cds/24-127

-JimD
in northern Calif where today it is cold and gray like Siberia.
(one get's a bit wimpy living here.)

On Jan 7, 2011, at 6:42 PM Jan 7, 2011, colin p. cummings wrote:

To all who read them, what has been the most interesting article
you've read in a Riv Reader?

Colin Cummings
Amarillo, TX

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Re: [RBW] What Makes the Rivendell

2011-01-08 Thread JimD


+1

and they are good looking too.

Oh, and the have real head badges.

-JimD

On Jan 7, 2011, at 6:15 PM  Jan 7, 2011, PATRICK MOORE wrote:

On Fri, Jan 7, 2011 at 1:06 PM, Kelly Sleeper tkslee...@gmail.com  
wrote:



My question is what makes the Rivendell Bike Different.



Incontrovertibly and incontestably nothing more important than **fit**
and **handling** -- sez I whose 3 customs won't take more than 30s
with fenders.

--
Patrick Moore
Albuquerque, NM
For professional resumes, contact
Patrick Moore, ACRW at resumespecialt...@gmail.com

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RE: [RBW] Re: What Makes the Rivendell

2011-01-08 Thread jim phillips


Rivendell bicycles are special for many reasons. Grant is Not a frame maker. He 
is a designer. Over many years of trial and error maybe even with a bit of luck 
or, better yet, magic, he came upon a design that really works and works 
wonderfully. Then, he searched to find the best frame makers to follow his 
design to the smallest nitpicking point. His frames are made for Rivendell Just 
as he designed them.

best,

JimP

 Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2011 13:45:53 -0800
 Subject: [RBW] Re: What Makes the Rivendell
 From: willh...@yahoo.com
 To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com
 
 The magician never shares his secrets
 
 its a mystery that should never be put into exact words or it will
 be diluted.
 
 I think in the industry they call it brand mystique
 
 it is what I love about Rivendell.
 
 On Jan 7, 12:06 pm, Kelly Sleeper tkslee...@gmail.com wrote:
  As a new owner and new to this style of riding.  This style of riding being
  larger tires, more upright position, more comfort oriented.  
 
  My question is what makes the Rivendell Bike Different.  
 
  I notice that even with Custom builds that Tire Clearance is less than.  
  Full tour bikes that will only run 700x35 with fenders. I have two.. a FUJI
  Tour and a Giant OCR Tour.
 
  This is my Giant  
  http://www.flickr.com/photos/tksleeper/5179941844/in/set-721576252104...
 
  It's my uninformed opinion that the lower bottom bracket appears to be
  unique or rare compared..  does this cotribute to the ride.
 
  I notice my Riv's feel quicker (even if they aren't) than my other bikes of
  similar weight.
 
  I seem to have a more comfortable ride which I attribute to the steal and
  fit etc.
 
  So even though I read that LHT's are great and we can use this or that I
  haven't found that to be true.  My Giant OCR has been a good friend on
  tours, but it doesn't have the same feel as my Bombadil.  (I do admit to
  liking and missing my disc brakes= only when stopping-minor detail)  
 
  Anyway right or wrong I've found myself looking at bikes and seeing that
  it's not just steel or a leather saddle or bags that is Riv'ish .. it's not
  some cult of practicality even.
  But as a package of geometry (I am dumber than box of rocks on that subject)
  size and style combined that make the rivendell bike.  
 
  If I got the same ride quality and handling and feel from an LHT or a Gunner
  at 500 bucks I'ld go there, but I don't .. this could be because I'm 6'5
  tall or it could be I'm delusional.
 
  What makes the Rivendell Different.. how does one explain that difference to
  those that just see a steel antique looking bke?
 
  Kelly
 
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RE: [RBW] Re: Saddle comparison - Brooks B17 vs. Berthoud Touring

2011-01-08 Thread jim phillips

My question is, put delicately, how many, if any. like the Berthoud because it
is French, and, how many dislike it because it is French. Anyone?

JimP

Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2011 10:10:11 -0800
Subject: [RBW] Re: Saddle comparison - Brooks B17 vs. Berthoud Touring
From: leec...@gmail.com
To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com

Joel and Clayton:

I noticed that the rails appear a bit narrower on the Berthoud Aspin
than on a B-17. Did you have to force the rails out a little to get it
to fit your seatpost clamp? What seatposts have you tried with the
Apsin?

Thanks,
Lee
San Francisco, CA

On Jan 7, 9:42 am, Clayton Scott clayton...@gmail.com wrote:
I have been using b.17s for while, but got frustrated when I burnt through
my last one in 7 months and went ahead and purchased a Berthoud touring
saddle.
I have only been using it for 2 months now but so far so good. It is a
little narrower than a b.17 but not in a bad way. Still has enough
room accommodate my sitbones. The shape seems perfect for me.
The craftsmanship is stunning compared to Brooks.
Compared to the now incredibly saggy brooks it does feel a lot firmer. I did
ride a 200k permanent within a few weeks of owning it and toward the end I
did have to ride out of the saddle occasionally to give my slightly
protesting sitbones some relief. It was not agonizing and only started
setting in during the last few miles but was noticeable and distracting
nevertheless. (Still significantly better than having the metal frame of the
b.17 dig into me though.). So far the Berthoud is perfect for up to a 100
miles and I expect it to get even more comfortable as the saddle and I get
more used to eachother.
I purchased mine from Rene Herse Bicycles who lets you try the saddle for 60
days and return it if you don't like it. I suggest you give it try.

Best,
Clayton Scott
SF, CA

On Fri, Jan 7, 2011 at 9:29 AM, JoelMatthews joelmatth...@mac.com wrote:
I had an Ideale when it was new and it wasn't as comfortable and didn't
work as well as a B.17. It was one of those with the integral wide
aluminum rails and the built-in micro-adjusting clamp.

My favorite Ideales are the 4 and 6 (the lightly sprung city
saddles). I think the aluminum frame Ideale used made for a more
comfortable spring base than the heavier Brooks.

Unfortunately, the leather is somewhat thin on them and they tend to
need frequent tightening. Wonder if Berthoud will ever try and copy
that model?

On Jan 7, 10:29 am, Steve Palincsar palin...@his.com wrote:
On Fri, 2011-01-07 at 08:12 -0800, JoelMatthews wrote:
Unless you have an Ideale that has been well maintained - or stored in
optimal conditions - it is not going to be as comfortable, work as
well, or last as long as a modern Brooks or Berthoud.

I had an Ideale when it was new and it wasn't as comfortable and didn't
work as well as a B.17. It was one of those with the integral wide
aluminum rails and the built-in micro-adjusting clamp.

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[RBW] Re: Tires.... what to buy

I've been really liking my Marathon Supreme 42-622s (measure about
37.5), but they're too big too fit inside of my fenders. Currently,
I'm using GB Cypres that measure almost 32, but I'm hoping to shoehorn
an in-between size tire in.

What do people think of Racers vs. Kojak's vs. Supremes?

The Racer and Kojak seem to fill about the same niche, except for a
wee bit of pattern. I'd probably try a Racer because there's a 40-622
(I imagine these measure about 35), where the 35-622 that come in both
the Racer and Kojak are probably about the same size as the Cypres,
only perhaps more durable. Maybe I should get Supremes in 37-622 and
be done with it, though.

Thoughts?



On Jan 7, 6:31 am, Montclair BobbyB montclairbob...@gmail.com wrote:
 For me when it comes to tires, it's like visiting my favorite
 restaurant and always ordering the same dish... So even though I
 always vow to try something different, at the last minute I always go
 with the sure thing... Schwalbe Big Apple 2.0s... I just ordered 2 new
 sets for project bikes...(I also have the 2.35s, which for toolin'
 around on/off road they're such a blast, but have settled in on the
 2.0s as my new faves)...

 But I will have to try out the Kojak 2.0s (maybe to go with my
 Kojak bike siren...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FsXaoppIfow)

 Peace,
 BB

 On Jan 6, 6:08 pm, Eric Norris campyonly...@me.com wrote:

  I *think* I ran kevlar bead tires at that time, but I'm fairly sure the 
  tires were all Tour Guard.

  --Eric N

  On Jan 6, 2011, at 1:34 PM, Peter Pesce petepe...@gmail.com wrote:

   Eric-

   In the pics, the folded tire on your rear rack is obviously kevlar
   bead - are the tires on the bike wire bead or kevlar? It seems from
   what I have found that all kevlar Paselas are TourGuard, but wire bead
   Paselas can be TG or non-TG. Just curious which you were riding.

   Thanks,

   Pete

   On Jan 6, 12:38 pm, Eric Norris campyonly...@me.com wrote:
   Scroll down a bit and you can see my Quickbeam (with Paselas) in some 
   photos taken at the check-in before the start of PBP:  
   http://www.fixedgeargallery.com/articles/p-b-p/0xa12a94c.htm

   --Eric N

   On Jan 6, 2011, at 9:28 AM, Peter Pesce petepe...@gmail.com wrote:

   I'm glad bictourist asked this question, because I was considering the
   exact same thing.

   Last thing I'd want on a century or brevet is to be fixing flats all
   time but reading about all these magical tires I thought I was
   riding real dogs with my Paselas, Hearing that Eric did PBP on them I
   feel much better!

   -Pete

   On Jan 6, 12:03 pm, Eric Norris campyonly...@me.com wrote:
   I'll also weigh in for the Paselas.  I've used them for many epic 
   rides, including PBP '07 (no flats in 765 miles).  I've seen the 
   700x32 size for sale as low as $8 (annual sale at the UC Davis Bike 
   Barn last year).  

   --Eric N

   On Jan 6, 2011, at 7:40 AM, bicitourist ejro...@gmail.com wrote:

   Hi everyone, The time has come to get some tires for my new ride.  
   I've been running a loaned pair of Schwable Marathon 700x32 @ 
   80-85psi from my commuter. I've been running these for a couple of 
   years now with no problems but I wanted something more supple. New 
   bike = New tires right? I know I'm giving up some puncture resistance 
   for comfort, but I'm sure there is a sweet spot out there!   I tried 
   some continental gatorskins 700x28 (but they were too skinny and made 
   my bike feel unstable maybe it was all those miles on the 32s?). I'm 
   looking for an all-round tire, but most of my miles are on pavement 
   (I'd say 80%). I'm also planning on my first 200K and 300K this year!

   From my research it looks like I've narrowed it down to:

   Jack Brown Blue's (I'm 6 ft 215lb so i don't think Greens will do)
   Pasela Wire bead
   GB Cypres

   Thanks in advance for the advice! --Eduardo
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[RBW] Re: New News Post

2011-01-08 Thread Philip Williamson

I have good friends who have lost a ton of weight switching to a Paleo
diet... or switching to a Vegan diet. Both of those groups of eaters
seem to get underweight, in my opinion.

I agree with Patrick (and Patrick) that the real culprit is over-
processed industrialized food. Any diet (with a small d) that makes
you examine your food and choose the least processed, highest quality,
is going to be better for you. There's more FOOD in it.

Stayed out of it as long as I could,
 Philip



On Jan 7, 6:04 pm, PATRICK MOORE bertin...@gmail.com wrote:
 I know this topic is grossly OT, but the idea that carbs, even refined
 carbs, are somehow bad for you is just egregiously absurd: tell it
 to the Chinese, Indians, Native Americans, Italians and other groups
 whose principal source of food is grains of some sort or another. The
 Japanese have very long average life, and it isn't because they are
 scarfing down bacon and cheese.

 Sit still, quiet, breathe deeply, think peaceful thoughts, cultivate
 one-ness with the cosmos -- and be patient, patient, patient: this fad
 too shall pass.

 Patrick happily and skinnily (at a svelte almost 56, 5'10 in bare
 feet, 170 lb) eating his home made French bread with olive oil, salt
 and pepper, who believes that a real culprit of dietary sin is
 processed foods and who eats very little of them because they are so
 g-d disgusting!

 On Fri, Jan 7, 2011 at 9:51 AM, Patrick in VT swing4...@gmail.com wrote:



  On Jan 6, 8:12 pm, Rene Sterental orthie...@gmail.com wrote:

  The short answer is that carbs create and trigger addiction responses, just
  like nicotine, alcohol and other drugs. When you are hooked, you crave them
  for all the reasons explained in the book (High insuline, lack of calories
  for normal function because most are stored in the fat tissue, etc.)

  you're starting with the premise of being an addict, or in the case of
  food, people who have most likely been chronically overweight,
  unhealthy and/or unfit.  carbs, or any other source of calories for
  that matter, do not pose a problem for people who have a healthy, long-
  standing relationship with food.  just like beer and wine don't pose a
  problem for one who is control of his or her drinking.

  I know other authors talk about how to use carbs when excercising, but I'd
  be willing to bet that if one takes the time to fully change eating
  paradigms . . ..

  It seems to me that those who espouse atkins, taubes, et al. are those
  who chronically struggle with weight, health and fitness.  they also
  tend to be focused on weight loss and not overall health, as evidenced
  by the diets they embrace.

  Most of the truly healthy, fit people i know eat/drink what ever they
  want - but it's mostly vegetables, whole grains, nuts,
  fruits . ..stuff without nutrition labels. carbs are certainly not
  forbidden - two of my friends are outstanding bakers and delicious
  bread and cake is always on the table when we eat together.  the
  handful of serious athletes (those who train, compete to win) I know
  are all vegetarian/vegan.  none of these folks follow a *diet.* I
  haven't seen any of them gain or lose significant weight for years.

  the other thing they have in common is that they cook *a lot*, which,
  for me, is absolutely essential to maintaining a healthy relationship
  with food.  In fact, I'd suggest buying a good cookbook, rather than a
  *diet* book, for anyone who is serious about repairing their
  relationship with food and living a healthier lifestyle.

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 For professional resumes, contact
 Patrick Moore, ACRW at resumespecialt...@gmail.com

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[RBW] Skewers?

2011-01-08 Thread Marty

I need a pair of skewers for my next build - using Phil/Riv hubs.
Looking for a nice clean design, and no plastic. Anyone have
experience with Pitlock?

Marty

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Re: [RBW] Re: Informal Tall Riders Group

2011-01-08 Thread Larry Schellhase

My wife is 6' and has a pbh of 90.5, I am 6'5 and my pbh is 97.5. Early in
2003 we both ordered Rivendell's. When Grant sent to design sheets to us he
included a note to me saying the bike he had designed for me was nearly
identical to a 68cm Rambouillet and if I wanted to switch my order my
deposit would be applied to the price of the Rambouillet. I now have the
Rambouillet (repainted by JB) a 68cm Atlantis and a Bike Friday made from
the Rambouillet dimensions. My wife has the Douglas Brooks blue Riv a Bike
Friday and a Bruce Gordon BLT.

I am truly  grateful to Grant and Rivendell for including tall frames in
their off the shelf inventory. It is truly rare to be able to buy a frame of
this size without getting it custom made. I believe the tall frames happened
at Rivendell because Bhima, the frame manager in the early part of this
century was very tall and Grant thought they should build frames that his
frame manager could ride.

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Re: [RBW] Re: What Makes the Rivendell - It's not about the bike

2011-01-08 Thread James Warren


The answer is not so much about any specific bike material decision.

The answer is their attention to detail.

Lots of companies care about details, but Rivendell cares about details that 
serve a wider range of cycling interests.

(Do I owe Lance Armstrong money now?)



On Jan 8, 2011, at 9:43 AM, Michael_S wrote:

 I agree... it's all of the above. The bikes fit right, permit larger
 tires, seem very balanced riding.
 The lug work and  attention to detail make the whole package perfect.
 
 I'm not sure about that elf thing though. I thought it was artesians.
 
 ~Mike~
 
 On Jan 7, 6:15 pm, PATRICK MOORE bertin...@gmail.com wrote:
 On Fri, Jan 7, 2011 at 1:06 PM, Kelly Sleeper tkslee...@gmail.com wrote:
 My question is what makes the Rivendell Bike Different.
 
 Incontrovertibly and incontestably nothing more important than **fit**
 and **handling** -- sez I whose 3 customs won't take more than 30s
 with fenders.
 
 --
 Patrick Moore
 Albuquerque, NM
 For professional resumes, contact
 Patrick Moore, ACRW at resumespecialt...@gmail.com
 
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[RBW] Re: Most interesting Riv Reader Articles

2011-01-08 Thread Philip Williamson

I liked that typographer article. I think the most memorable article
was the one where the author's brakes failed descending a mountain
pass. I get visual flashbacks of it sometimes.

 Philip

 Philip Williamson
www.biketinker.com

On Jan 7, 6:42 pm, colin p. cummings colinthehip...@gmail.com
wrote:
 To all who read them, what has been the most interesting article
 you've read in a Riv Reader?

 I haven't read many, but I was very into an article about a
 typographer that originally appeared in the New Yorker...can't
 remember which Reader, or the chap's name, but it was intriguing and
 fun.  I love that sort of esoteric reporting alongside an article
 about wrapping twine.

 Colin Cummings
 Amarillo, TX

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[RBW] New News Post - Stay on the edge aisles in the supermarket

2011-01-08 Thread James Warren



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Re: [RBW] What Makes the Rivendell

on 1/7/11 12:06 PM, Kelly Sleeper at tkslee...@gmail.com wrote:
(great questions which ended with...)
 What makes the Rivendell Different.. how does one explain that difference to
 those that just see a steel antique looking bke?

I think there have been a couple of handling or discussion of trail
threads where this has popped up before.  These are a couple points I've
probably made before...

Rivendells (and I include all of the designs, not simply custom models) have
a similar quality of ride. While a Roadeo is different from a Bombadil,
there's an underlying set of design tenets which seems pretty consistent.
For me, in my riding conditions, they are superlative. They are stable,
predictable, solid handling bikes that generally keep me out of trouble, and
then react appropriately when I'm silly enough to get my self into it.  If
they didn't handle well, nothing else would matter.

The handling and ride is a sum of a all parts. It isn't _JUST_ trail, head
angle, bb height, chainstay length, angles, and length.  It's all of those
things.  You cannot just change one aspect and have the same bike.  The
bicycles are a product of those variables, plus the things which Grant has
learned in the XX number of years of plotting out frames, testing them and
thinking pretty deeply about the results.

The bicycle designs have grown to be incredibly versatile. Ten years ago,
the longer reach brakes weren't availalble. The clearances which we now
enjoy were only possible with canti brakes.  Finding a 28mm 700C tire was
difficult, let alone a higher quality 30mm+ tire. The limiting factors have
been the components, and Grant has always been pushing the envelope in this
particular corner of the bicycle world. Add to that his commitment to high
quality bags and racks and you end up with a useful and continually variable
design.  As I've repeated too many times, both my Quickbeam and Hilsen have
been errand bikes, road bikes, mountain bikes, race bikes and brevet bikes
in the time I've had them. Over the past couple years, I've grown to feel
that if a bicycle can't be fendered or adapted, it really is not a bicycle
in the true sense.  In other words, when people ask what my road bike is,
I kind of stare at them blankly.

All of this could be done roughly, or quickly, or with a more industrial
design tenet, but the fact that Rivendell connects the tubes with lugs, has
small, undernoticed details and pays attention to decal fonts, paint colors,
and bicycle packaging (just to pick out a quick few) to the extent that they
do just locks them in for me. It distinguishes them as practitioners of a
craft.  It's important to me to support that.  The finish work is part of
the craft...part of the art of what they practice.

I suppose it's easy to equate the outside, finishing layer with the whole.
The first thing someone notices is the paint layer, the contrasting colors,
the lugs.  While that's part of the equation, the strength lies underneath.

- Jim

-- 
Jim Edgar
cyclofi...@earthlink.net

Cyclofiend Bicycle Photo Galleries - http://www.cyclofiend.com
Current Classics - Cross Bikes
Singlespeed - Working Bikes

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[RBW] Re: Fender mounted battery powered taillight suggestions?

Cool, KP! But I assume you need to remove the rear wheel to remove the
batteries?

I was thinking of mounting the clip on the back of the Radbot 1000
sideways and then somehow installing the QR mount on the fender.
Though, now that I'm looking at it, I'm not sure of I can remove and
reorient the clip without breaking it...

On Jan 8, 10:41 am, KP kpmulc...@gmail.com wrote:
 I mounted the Radbot 1000 on my fender. First I popped off the clip
 and sanded down the back of the light to more closely match the curve
 of the fender. Then I used a longer screw to attach the fender to the
 light back. The same screw attaches the reflector to the back.
 I think the light is located in the best possible spot for the bike.
 It's not perfect, but this isn't a show bike by any means.

 I'm not doing a good job of describing it, so posted a few pictures
 here:http://www.flickr.com/photos/39056...@n08/sets/72157625775993554/

 Kevin Mulcahy
 Chicago, IL

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[RBW] Re: Nitto Front Racks

2011-01-08 Thread MikeC

Not to hijack this thread, but how do the VO's in stainless steel
compare to the Nittos in cro-mo in design and quality? They seem
pretty similar in photos and VOs are half to two-thirds the price.

-Mike

On Jan 8, 12:09 pm, Earl Grey earlg...@gmail.com wrote:
 Go with the Mini. It's a great rack, and mine has carried well over 30 lbs
 without a problem. In fact, the superiority of the Mini is a major reason to
 get a cantilever bike, IMO.

 I have no experience with the two-strut, so take my comments with a grain of
 salt, but despite the double struts I doubt it can carry more weight than
 the mini, because its attachment to the fork crown is much less secure
 (bolted-on flat piece of flexible steel vs. brazed-on solid round steel
 rod). That said, the two strut will fit cantis acc. to rivbike: It mounts
 to any of our bikes, and most others. For the most secure attachment, you'd
 probably want to run a bolt through your forkcrown to attach the flat metal
 piece to...

 Cheers,

 Gernot

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[RBW] New Lauterwasser handlebars from Soma

Pretty cool:
http://somafab.blogspot.com/2010/12/lauterwasser-handlebars-launched.html

I've noticed these bars on vintage/antique bikes and have always
thought they looked great and might be highly functional for touring
and city use. Though, I wish they had published full specs. It's hard
to consider them for serious use without knowing about the reach, etc..

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[RBW] Re: Nitto Front Racks

2011-01-08 Thread Minh


I'll second this request. Do the vo racks line up with the rvindell
braze ons?

And is the main diff between the nitto mini front and the marks rack
the way the stays attach?


On Jan 8, 2:17 pm, MikeC mecinib...@sbcglobal.net wrote:
 Not to hijack this thread, but how do the VO's in stainless steel
 compare to the Nittos in cro-mo in design and quality? They seem
 pretty similar in photos and VOs are half to two-thirds the price.

 -Mike

 On Jan 8, 12:09 pm, Earl Grey earlg...@gmail.com wrote:



  Go with the Mini. It's a great rack, and mine has carried well over 30 lbs
  without a problem. In fact, the superiority of the Mini is a major reason to
  get a cantilever bike, IMO.

  I have no experience with the two-strut, so take my comments with a grain of
  salt, but despite the double struts I doubt it can carry more weight than
  the mini, because its attachment to the fork crown is much less secure
  (bolted-on flat piece of flexible steel vs. brazed-on solid round steel
  rod). That said, the two strut will fit cantis acc. to rivbike: It mounts
  to any of our bikes, and most others. For the most secure attachment, you'd
  probably want to run a bolt through your forkcrown to attach the flat metal
  piece to...

  Cheers,

  Gernot

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[RBW] Re: Saddle comparison - Brooks B17 vs. Berthoud Touring

2011-01-08 Thread kavalk

I had several Ideale 90A (?) saddles back in the 1980s.  Had
them mounted on a Merz custom tourer and a Santana tandem.
Sadly, my best buddy and neighbor did not care for the Ideale
and placed his Brooks on the stoker's seat post.

Loved the saddle, but the break-in to break-down period was
much too short.  That time frame was essentially from mile zero
to mile 5,000 at best.  I also never got into the habit of strictly
maintaining a leather saddle that was on a bicycle I rode on a
daily basis.  I always ran into rain.

Perhaps a topic on maintaining these great pieces of bicycle art
(in regular use) would be a timely subject.  I understand periodic
use of Proof Hide, but perhaps there are those of you who have
other suggestions in mind.



On Jan 7, 11:12 am, JoelMatthews joelmatth...@mac.com wrote:
 I could never get comfortable on a B-17 or any of the Fizik saddles so
 tried the Berthoud more out of desperation than anything.  Right out
 of the box I had an opportunity to do an ~500 mile trip.  No
 discomfort at all.

 As for appearance, I prefer Berthoud to the Brooks.  The Berthoud
 shape is less pronounced.  In my opinion, Brooks has a very strong
 silhouette that pulls the eye away from the lines of the bicycles.  No
 problem, obviously, if you like the Brooks shape.  I am not as
 enamored as some other riders .

 Some of the comments to the linked review mention Ideale saddles.  I
 collected Ideale over the years.  I have since sold most but still
 have two in the display case.  They are lovely pieces of history.
 Certainly an Ideale will match well with a correct restoration.
 Unless you have an Ideale that has been well maintained - or stored in
 optimal conditions - it is not going to be as comfortable, work as
 well, or last as long as a modern Brooks or Berthoud.

 On Jan 6, 11:40 pm, Rene Sterental orthie...@gmail.com wrote: Can anyone 
 provide how the Berthoud Touring Saddles would compare to a B17
  saddle? I own B17 saddles but have never ridden a Berthoud one.

  Thanks,

  René

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[RBW] Re: Saddle comparison - Brooks B17 vs. Berthoud Touring

2011-01-08 Thread Lee

Hey Rene. I just got mine in. Here's a brief visual comparison of the
saddle vis-a-vis a B-17 Champion Special:

http://tinyurl.com/23eyb8o

I've been slowly accumulating parts to upgrade my distance bike. The
Aspin will replace a Selle An-Atomica, which will go to my saddle-less
camping/utility bike. I had been switching my B-17S between my
commuter (the Quickbeam) and the utility bike.

Best,
Lee

On Jan 7, 3:47 pm, Rene Sterental orthie...@gmail.com wrote:
 Thanks for all the responses. I'm ordering one tonight to try it. I
 like the B17 except for its nose up position to prevent sliding
 forward. Always thought it should be flatter.

 Seems like the Berthoud Touring might make me completely happy.

 René

 Sent from my iPhone 4

 On Jan 7, 2011, at 1:54 PM, Seth Vidal skvi...@gmail.com wrote:

  On Fri, Jan 7, 2011 at 2:50 PM, Kelly Sleeper tkslee...@gmail.com wrote:

  Only reason I wouldn't try a 200 dollar saddle is if I can't return it.   
  It
  looks to me to be a very well made comfortable saddle that has a benefit if
  you buy thier saddle bags too.

  I would also out of desperation try it if I didn't have comfortable saddles
  now.

  wallbike.com

  6month unconditional return guarantee.

  -sv

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Re: [RBW] Re: Informal Tall Riders Group

...and may I please forward the 1st suggestion for a new 65cm+ model
range?  The Tall-One?  Maybe with a foamy beer on the headbadge?

RBW could have a separate range of bikes under Redwood, sort of like
the Toyota/Lexus thing.

Can you tell it snowed here las night?

On Fri, Jan 7, 2011 at 3:14 PM, David Klatte flopmeis...@gmail.com wrote:
 I think it is brilliant. Those people who can shop at the mall for
 clothing have no idea the weird issues the very tall face. Rivendel is
 such a tall friendly company that I think there are probably a
 freakishly disproportionate number of us here.

 Has anyone tall tried the bike poncho? I'm worried my knees will get
 wet.

 David (6'7, 100 PBH, 71 Hilsen)

 On Jan 7, 10:55 am, zeidler.rob...@gmail.com wrote:
 Nothing apart from taking over the world as we know it.

 OK, OK. This should be discussion about any and everything that involves the 
 riding experience for those who require a bicycle larger than 64cm.
 Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry



 -Original Message-
 From: Dave Craig dcr...@prescott.edu

 Sender: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com
 Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2011 07:44:34
 To: RBW Owners Bunchrbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com
 Reply-To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com
 Subject: [RBW] Re: Informal Tall Riders Group

 Robert:

 Perhaps you could be more specific. Do you have questions or
 observations? What are you hoping that us longshanks will share?
 What's the Riv-related content?

 DC
 (6'2;37-inch PBH;ape arms;size 14 feet; 65cm Hilsen;60cm Bombadil;
 64cm Quickbeam)

 On Jan 7, 6:24 am, robert zeidler zeidler.rob...@gmail.com wrote:
  OK, Have at it!!!  Who's first?

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Re: [RBW] Re: Nitto Front Racks

on 1/8/11 11:25 AM, Minh at mgiangs...@gmail.com wrote:

 And is the main diff between the nitto mini front and the marks rack
 the way the stays attach?

I have both.  The platforms are identical. Somewhere in my flickr stream are
photos of each one.

- Jim

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it.
Mahatma Gandhi


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Re: [RBW] Re: Nitto Front Racks

on 1/8/11 11:17 AM, MikeC at mecinib...@sbcglobal.net wrote:

 Not to hijack this thread, but how do the VO's in stainless steel
 compare to the Nittos in cro-mo in design and quality? They seem
 pretty similar in photos and VOs are half to two-thirds the price.

I would pretty much trust my life to anything Nitto makes. I've had a few
conversations with GP about the amount of testing and attention which goes
into the Nitto racks (and other items).  The rigor of their process is truly
impressive.  I think that's what you pay for with Nitto. And, if you compare
Nitto prices, you'll find that RBW is pretty much the go-to place for
dollar value.

- Jim

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Maybe a bike, once discarded, pines away year after year for the first hand
that steered it, and as it grows old it dreams, in its bike way, of the
young roads.

-- Robert McCammon, Boy's Life

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Re: [RBW] Re: Informal Tall Riders Group

on 1/8/11 11:27 AM, robert zeidler at zeidler.rob...@gmail.com wrote:

 ...and may I please forward the 1st suggestion for a new 65cm+ model
 range?  The Tall-One?  Maybe with a foamy beer on the headbadge?
 
 RBW could have a separate range of bikes under Redwood, sort of like
 the Toyota/Lexus thing.

Actually, I do think it is important to speak up (or I guess, since all's
y'all are so tall, that you would be speaking down to us 6-footers...).

Grant wrote specifically that the SimpLeone would be in a narrower range of
sizes unless he received a commitment on them (...was it 10?...) for
larger/smaller riders.

I'm certainly _not_ trying to leverage anyone into buying something that
they can't afford, but it would probably be helpful to let John at
Rivbike.com know that you are in that size range.

I've worked as a retail buyer, and estimating sizing ranges to stock is
crazy-making stuff. Just moving clothing out of the system is a tricky
prospect - I can imagine the pressure of stocking $1,100+ bike frames in
slower moving sizes

- Jim

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Re: [RBW] Re: New News Post

on 1/8/11 10:28 AM, Philip Williamson at philip.william...@gmail.com wrote:
 Stayed out of it as long as I could,

Word.

admin hat

Yep.  General Diet threads are OT.  OT threads within the confines of this
group are, well... OT.

Of course, GP keeps mucking up the waters by posting about it and bringing
up the Primal and Taube approaches.  And since you probably don't know me
well enough to know that I'm chuckling as I type that, here's the
emoticon... ;^)  In other words, there's more of a spectrum sometimes than a
hard edge.

I think it's good to ask basic questions, consider them thoroughly and
consider the assumptions you retain and adhere to. I'd guess that most of us
have found our way to Rivendell bicycles and this group because we
questioned the assumptions of the Bike Industry - that racing was the core
design tenet, that we'd get used to the discomfort we felt on a bike, that
when it rained we got sluiced or rode the trainer inside...

In other words, I think it's in our (and I mean this group's) wiring to dig
down on these topics.

It's also winter, which means that for many of us, a few more months will
pass until we can feel the real breeze upon our cheeks and the hiss of tires
upon the road.  That means it's a real possibility to get a bit wrapped up
in the conversation as an end to itself. It let's us live vicariously, enjoy
the intensity of feeling which goes with an invigorating ride.

There's always a point in every thread where diminishing returns begin to
occur.  There's a point in some threads where it's more of a two way chat
than a general topic of discussion. Historically, we as a group have been
excellent at knowing when to disengage, take it to a private back channel or
simply agree to disagree.

We are not the iBob group, and as I've said before in various State of The
List Reports, our strength and vitality as a group stems from the
specificity of our topic - Rivendell Bicycle Works. It's ulimately up to
each of us to maintain that balance.

This probably ought to just morph into a SOTL Report...

/admin hat


- Jim

Previous SOTLR's - 
http://www.cyclofiend.com/rbw/sotlr

-- 
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cyclofi...@earthlink.net

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[RBW] Re: Skewers?

2011-01-08 Thread Bill M.

The VO skewers look like they might be decent.  Classic design,
anyway, not an internal cam.

On Jan 8, 10:32 am, Marty mgie...@mac.com wrote:
 I need a pair of skewers for my next build - using Phil/Riv hubs.
 Looking for a nice clean design, and no plastic. Anyone have
 experience with Pitlock?

 Marty

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Re: [RBW] Saddle comparison - Brooks B17 vs. Berthoud Touring

on 1/6/11 9:40 PM, Rene Sterental at orthie...@gmail.com wrote:

Can anyone provide how the Berthoud Touring Saddles would compare to a B17
saddle? I own B17 saddles but have never ridden a Berthoud one.

I have found that for me, the B17 is a bit too wide.  I ordered a Brooks
Swift through Rivendell a while back and really have grown to like it quite
a bit.  The reason I bring it up is because others have mentioned that the
Berthoud saddle is a bit thicker.  The Swift was definitely a thicker cut
leather than the B17's I've owned.

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[RBW] Re: Fender mounted battery powered taillight suggestions?

2011-01-08 Thread AmiSingh

I run two of the Soma Bullets and really like them.

http://store.somafab.com/sosiburesafl.html

I use them in conjunction with a planet bike super flash - three
lights are better than one :)

On Jan 8, 2:12 pm, Travis travisbreitenb...@gmail.com wrote:
 Cool, KP! But I assume you need to remove the rear wheel to remove the
 batteries?

 I was thinking of mounting the clip on the back of the Radbot 1000
 sideways and then somehow installing the QR mount on the fender.
 Though, now that I'm looking at it, I'm not sure of I can remove and
 reorient the clip without breaking it...

 On Jan 8, 10:41 am, KP kpmulc...@gmail.com wrote:



  I mounted the Radbot 1000 on my fender. First I popped off the clip
  and sanded down the back of the light to more closely match the curve
  of the fender. Then I used a longer screw to attach the fender to the
  light back. The same screw attaches the reflector to the back.
  I think the light is located in the best possible spot for the bike.
  It's not perfect, but this isn't a show bike by any means.

  I'm not doing a good job of describing it, so posted a few pictures
  here:http://www.flickr.com/photos/39056...@n08/sets/72157625775993554/

  Kevin Mulcahy
  Chicago, IL

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[RBW] Re: Informal Tall Riders Group



On Jan 8, 10:22 am, Larry Schellhase schellh...@gmail.com wrote:
...
 I am truly  grateful to Grant and Rivendell for including tall frames in
 their off the shelf inventory. It is truly rare to be able to buy a frame of
 this size without getting it custom made. I believe the tall frames happened
 at Rivendell because Bhima, the frame manager in the early part of this
 century was very tall and Grant thought they should build frames that his
 frame manager could ride.

Yeah, and the large sizes are slowly contracting back to conventional
standards as time progresses - but they're still the best selection in
the business (VO told me they had no plans to make a larger frame at
least this year ). When I mentioned Bhima's name to Jay several
months ago, he said sorry, I don't know who that is. I had to turn
it into a joke with well, everything I know about Rivendell is ten
years old.

Bhima may have been the early booster of really large tires, too. I
remember talking with him, and I can't document it, but I seem to
remember Grant writing about how Bhima just swears by those Big
Apples on his Atlantis. Did Bhima also get the first double top tube
bike? Probably not, I'd bet a custom was first, but his was the first
paratube Riv I remember seeing a photo of, anyway.

One of the most unfortunate aspects of so much of Rivendell's ad copy,
product descriptions and musings being on their website instead of in
print is how ephemeral it all is. Every now and then I go to the site
to try to re-remember something that I have a foggy memory of, and see
it's modified or gone. The S24O info, for instance, is much more
expansive in readers than what is now on the site. Much of the advice
was tied in with products - and once the products are no longer for
sale everything disappears. The cyclofiend site is the single best
online source for obsolete Riv copy that I know, and I hope that it
continues. Heck, I looked up the old Bike Pro online catalog recently,
and it's still a great resource even though it's probably been out of
business for over 10 years.

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[RBW] Re: Most interesting Riv Reader Articles

2011-01-08 Thread Jim Thill - Hiawatha Cyclery

+1 on the descent without brakes article. If I recall, it was a reprint from 
a 1970s issue of Bicycling?

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[RBW] Re: Skewers?

I own both Pitlock and VO skewers. There is no comparison of course. I
don't know why, but the VO skewers have sort of a knurled surface on
the outside, so it looks like they could be opened with a good set of
pliers. Also, keys for those hex-pin bolts can be had at most hardware
stores. I'd say the VO skewer provides just a tad more security than
an allen bolt skewer. I use mine on a wheel which I wouldn't really
mind replacing because it's nearing the end of it's useful life
anyway.

The Pitlock design is really much further advanced than any other
locking skewers out there. I see two ways to defeat it, but they
require quite a bit of ingenuity. I live in NYC and use them on a
decent wheelset. I have enough faith in them that I lock only my frame
which is tremendously freeing. I carry one of the Pit keys on a large
key ring with my keys and this gives me just enough torque to adjust
them if needed. Also, I use them on a bike with horizontal drop-outs
even though you're not supposed to. It's been holding up fine. Of
course, this bike has a freewheel - I would not try this with a SS/
fixed set-up.

Travis

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Re: [RBW] What Makes the Rivendell

2011-01-08 Thread JimD

Well said Jim.
I wish I could find the thing I read from Douglas Brooks where he
talks about 'resolved' and 'resourcefull' bikes.

A Hampsten Tournesol Rando bike is an example of a resolved bike.
Everything is optimized for the function of long distance/unsupported
riding.

A Rivendell (pick any one) is a premier example of a 'resourceful' bike.
Grant designs great riding bikes that are flexibly configurable. They
may be aimed at different
primary riding domains (Roadeo vs Bombadil) but can be setup across a
wide range within the

design target domain.

Underlying this approach to the hardware is a sensibility for
bicycling and bicyclers that is wide

ranging - everything but racing.

For me this sensibility has enriched the experience of bicycling
beyond the bounds of my perspective during
my first 20 years of riding. I was riding '10 speed racing bikes' and
should go fast, train, be like Eddy.
As I 'matured' I found the challenge of going fast and faster was
getting hard and harder.

I had to succumb to the dreaded triple to climb the hills around here.

Once I realized I wasn't racing. I started thinking about other
approaches.
Having discovered Rivendell I'm riding more and having more fun than
ever before.

-JimD

On Jan 8, 2011, at 11:09 AM Jan 8, 2011, CycloFiend wrote:

on 1/7/11 12:06 PM, Kelly Sleeper at tkslee...@gmail.com wrote:
(great questions which ended with...)
What makes the Rivendell Different.. how does one explain that
difference to

those that just see a steel antique looking bke?

I think there have been a couple of handling or discussion of trail
threads where this has popped up before. These are a couple points
I've

probably made before...

Rivendells (and I include all of the designs, not simply custom
models) have
a similar quality of ride. While a Roadeo is different from a
Bombadil,
there's an underlying set of design tenets which seems pretty
consistent.
For me, in my riding conditions, they are superlative. They are
stable,
predictable, solid handling bikes that generally keep me out of
trouble, and
then react appropriately when I'm silly enough to get my self into
it. If

they didn't handle well, nothing else would matter.

The handling and ride is a sum of a all parts. It isn't _JUST_
trail, head
angle, bb height, chainstay length, angles, and length. It's all of
those
things. You cannot just change one aspect and have the same bike.
The
bicycles are a product of those variables, plus the things which
Grant has
learned in the XX number of years of plotting out frames, testing
them and

thinking pretty deeply about the results.

The bicycle designs have grown to be incredibly versatile. Ten years
ago,
the longer reach brakes weren't availalble. The clearances which we
now
enjoy were only possible with canti brakes. Finding a 28mm 700C
tire was
difficult, let alone a higher quality 30mm+ tire. The limiting
factors have
been the components, and Grant has always been pushing the envelope
in this
particular corner of the bicycle world. Add to that his commitment
to high
quality bags and racks and you end up with a useful and continually
variable
design. As I've repeated too many times, both my Quickbeam and
Hilsen have
been errand bikes, road bikes, mountain bikes, race bikes and brevet
bikes
in the time I've had them. Over the past couple years, I've grown to
feel
that if a bicycle can't be fendered or adapted, it really is not a
bicycle
in the true sense. In other words, when people ask what my road
bike is,

I kind of stare at them blankly.

All of this could be done roughly, or quickly, or with a more
industrial
design tenet, but the fact that Rivendell connects the tubes with
lugs, has
small, undernoticed details and pays attention to decal fonts, paint
colors,
and bicycle packaging (just to pick out a quick few) to the extent
that they
do just locks them in for me. It distinguishes them as practitioners
of a
craft. It's important to me to support that. The finish work is
part of

the craft...part of the art of what they practice.

I suppose it's easy to equate the outside, finishing layer with the
whole.
The first thing someone notices is the paint layer, the contrasting
colors,
the lugs. While that's part of the equation, the strength lies
underneath.

- Jim

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Re: [RBW] Re: Most interesting Riv Reader Articles

2011-01-08 Thread Bill Gibson

Good topic idea!
My first thought was the article about the guy who lived off wild figs and
living wine, while following the road on the bike, until the season was
over.

On Fri, Jan 7, 2011 at 8:29 PM, rob markwardt robmar...@hotmail.com wrote:

One of my favorites (in # 27) was about the twins who toured from
Alaska to South America. One of them stayed down there and the other
rode back to the US on an XO-1, with Terrier riding atop luggage,
stopping in at Walnut Creek for a chat and ride with Grant. He got a
new saddle and headed off to?...wonder where he is now?
That same reader had a an interview with Charlie Cunningham, pics
of Chuck Schmidt's awesome vintage Mercian and also (I believe)
introduced the Quickbeam. The peak of the Reader imho.

Rob

On Jan 7, 6:42 pm, colin p. cummings colinthehip...@gmail.com
wrote:
To all who read them, what has been the most interesting article
you've read in a Riv Reader?

Colin Cummings
Amarillo, TX

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Re: [RBW] What Makes the Rivendell

I agree with it all, what a great bike to make into what you want.
The one thing I find quite amazing-this is an observation, not a
critique-is, especially on Cyclofiend, the amazing amounts of stuff
that people hang on their bikes.  It's like farkle city!

On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 3:54 PM, JimD rasterd...@comcast.net wrote:
 Well said Jim.
 I wish I could find the thing I read from Douglas Brooks where he talks
 about 'resolved' and 'resourcefull' bikes.
 A Hampsten Tournesol Rando bike is an example of a resolved bike.
 Everything is optimized for the function of long distance/unsupported
 riding.
 A Rivendell (pick any one) is a premier example of a 'resourceful' bike.
 Grant designs great riding bikes that are flexibly configurable. They may be
 aimed at different
 primary riding domains (Roadeo vs Bombadil) but can be setup across a wide
 range within the
 design target domain.
 Underlying this approach to the hardware is a sensibility for bicycling and
 bicyclers that is wide
 ranging - everything but racing.
 For me this sensibility has enriched the experience of bicycling beyond the
 bounds of my perspective during
 my first 20 years of riding.  I was riding '10 speed racing bikes' and
 should go fast, train, be like Eddy.
 As I 'matured' I found the challenge of going fast and faster was getting
 hard and harder.
 I had to succumb to the dreaded triple to climb the hills around here.
 Once I realized I wasn't racing. I started thinking about other approaches.
 Having discovered Rivendell I'm riding more and having more fun than ever
 before.
 -JimD


 On Jan 8, 2011, at 11:09 AM  Jan 8, 2011, CycloFiend wrote:

 on 1/7/11 12:06 PM, Kelly Sleeper at tkslee...@gmail.com wrote:
 (great questions which ended with...)

 What makes the Rivendell Different.. how does one explain that difference to

 those that just see a steel antique looking bke?

 I think there have been a couple of handling or discussion of trail
 threads where this has popped up before.  These are a couple points I've
 probably made before...

 Rivendells (and I include all of the designs, not simply custom models) have
 a similar quality of ride. While a Roadeo is different from a Bombadil,
 there's an underlying set of design tenets which seems pretty consistent.
 For me, in my riding conditions, they are superlative. They are stable,
 predictable, solid handling bikes that generally keep me out of trouble, and
 then react appropriately when I'm silly enough to get my self into it.  If
 they didn't handle well, nothing else would matter.

 The handling and ride is a sum of a all parts. It isn't _JUST_ trail, head
 angle, bb height, chainstay length, angles, and length.  It's all of those
 things.  You cannot just change one aspect and have the same bike.  The
 bicycles are a product of those variables, plus the things which Grant has
 learned in the XX number of years of plotting out frames, testing them and
 thinking pretty deeply about the results.

 The bicycle designs have grown to be incredibly versatile. Ten years ago,
 the longer reach brakes weren't availalble. The clearances which we now
 enjoy were only possible with canti brakes.  Finding a 28mm 700C tire was
 difficult, let alone a higher quality 30mm+ tire. The limiting factors have
 been the components, and Grant has always been pushing the envelope in this
 particular corner of the bicycle world. Add to that his commitment to high
 quality bags and racks and you end up with a useful and continually variable
 design.  As I've repeated too many times, both my Quickbeam and Hilsen have
 been errand bikes, road bikes, mountain bikes, race bikes and brevet bikes
 in the time I've had them. Over the past couple years, I've grown to feel
 that if a bicycle can't be fendered or adapted, it really is not a bicycle
 in the true sense.  In other words, when people ask what my road bike is,
 I kind of stare at them blankly.

 All of this could be done roughly, or quickly, or with a more industrial
 design tenet, but the fact that Rivendell connects the tubes with lugs, has
 small, undernoticed details and pays attention to decal fonts, paint colors,
 and bicycle packaging (just to pick out a quick few) to the extent that they
 do just locks them in for me. It distinguishes them as practitioners of a
 craft.  It's important to me to support that.  The finish work is part of
 the craft...part of the art of what they practice.

 I suppose it's easy to equate the outside, finishing layer with the whole.
 The first thing someone notices is the paint layer, the contrasting colors,
 the lugs.  While that's part of the equation, the strength lies underneath.

 - Jim

 --
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 Cyclofiend Bicycle Photo Galleries - http://www.cyclofiend.com
 Current Classics - Cross Bikes
 Singlespeed - Working Bikes

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[RBW] Re: Skewers?

Okay, this is heresy, but I have a hard time seeing a quick release
skewer as having any value except to racers with numb fingers at the
top of a mountain. If I lose 30 seconds every time I flat, I'll live
with that. The allen wrench I keep in my tool kit is a simpler and
lighter way to tighten a skewer than a cam, and I don't need one for
every wheel I own. For security, the allen wrench is better, and any
of the locking skewers is better yet. Lastly, quick releases have a
long handle that legend says could grab objects and cause a wreck.

I've liked the Kore/Onguard locking skewers for some time, and I don't
even know what brand the allen key skewers are. I hope these are all
still in production. PJW sells Pitlocks, which look like a system
similar to Kore/Onguard.



On Jan 8, 12:15 pm, Bill M. bmenn...@comcast.net wrote:
 The VO skewers look like they might be decent.  Classic design,
 anyway, not an internal cam.

 On Jan 8, 10:32 am, Marty mgie...@mac.com wrote:

  I need a pair of skewers for my next build - using Phil/Riv hubs.
  Looking for a nice clean design, and no plastic. Anyone have
  experience with Pitlock?

  Marty

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Re: [RBW] Re: Nitto Front Racks

2011-01-08 Thread omnigrid

I was not impressed with a VO rack I installed on a customer's bicycle. The
welds were ugly, everything was out of alignment, the finish was not
anywhere near that of a Nitto, and the piece that attaches to the fork crown
was flimsy and sure to fail eventually. I'm sure it would perform just fine
for a little while, but the build quality was just not there.

You get what you pay for. Buy once, cry once.

On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 1:25 PM, Minh mgiangs...@gmail.com wrote:

I'll second this request. Do the vo racks line up with the rvindell
braze ons?

And is the main diff between the nitto mini front and the marks rack
the way the stays attach?

On Jan 8, 2:17 pm, MikeC mecinib...@sbcglobal.net wrote:
Not to hijack this thread, but how do the VO's in stainless steel
compare to the Nittos in cro-mo in design and quality? They seem
pretty similar in photos and VOs are half to two-thirds the price.

-Mike

On Jan 8, 12:09 pm, Earl Grey earlg...@gmail.com wrote:

Go with the Mini. It's a great rack, and mine has carried well over 30
lbs
without a problem. In fact, the superiority of the Mini is a major
reason to
get a cantilever bike, IMO.

I have no experience with the two-strut, so take my comments with a
grain of
salt, but despite the double struts I doubt it can carry more weight
than
the mini, because its attachment to the fork crown is much less secure
(bolted-on flat piece of flexible steel vs. brazed-on solid round steel
rod). That said, the two strut will fit cantis acc. to rivbike: It
mounts
to any of our bikes, and most others. For the most secure attachment,
you'd
probably want to run a bolt through your forkcrown to attach the flat
metal
piece to...

Cheers,

Gernot

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[RBW] Re: Most interesting Riv Reader Articles

2011-01-08 Thread George Schick

There have been many, many great articles over the years about various
facets of bicycle riding - from truly ergonomic positioning to saddle,
bar, and pedal choices and the advantages of each - that I enjoyed.
And, of course, the technical how-to stuff was always welcomed.  But
my favorite would have to be a tie between the one about Lon Haldeman
 RAAM and the one about Freddy Hoffman.


On Jan 7, 8:42 pm, colin p. cummings colinthehip...@gmail.com
wrote:
 To all who read them, what has been the most interesting article
 you've read in a Riv Reader?

 I haven't read many, but I was very into an article about a
 typographer that originally appeared in the New Yorker...can't
 remember which Reader, or the chap's name, but it was intriguing and
 fun.  I love that sort of esoteric reporting alongside an article
 about wrapping twine.

 Colin Cummings
 Amarillo, TX

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Re: [RBW] Re: New News Post

2011-01-08 Thread Bill Gibson

I think the version of low-carb diet that is Paleo is Rivendell related
during this season when so many cyclists have to deal with ride deprivation.
I think the group here can handle the reality that there is no disputing
individual differences, including real medical needs, but have an open mind,
curiosity, romantic yearning for adventure, much love for life lived uphill
and into the wind, under blazing sun and stars, and a distrust of mass
marketed fads, including diets. A good ride makes me hungry. Velocio taught
me early on to eat before I'm hungry, drink before I'm thirsty, which is
advice that I have never forgotten! Well, no, I bonk sometimes.

On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 1:09 PM, CycloFiend cyclofi...@earthlink.net wrote:

on 1/8/11 10:28 AM, Philip Williamson at philip.william...@gmail.comwrote:
Stayed out of it as long as I could,

Word.

admin hat

Yep. General Diet threads are OT. OT threads within the confines of
this
group are, well... OT.

Of course, GP keeps mucking up the waters by posting about it and bringing
up the Primal and Taube approaches. And since you probably don't know me
well enough to know that I'm chuckling as I type that, here's the
emoticon... ;^) In other words, there's more of a spectrum sometimes than
a
hard edge.

I think it's good to ask basic questions, consider them thoroughly and
consider the assumptions you retain and adhere to. I'd guess that most of
us
have found our way to Rivendell bicycles and this group because we
questioned the assumptions of the Bike Industry - that racing was the core
design tenet, that we'd get used to the discomfort we felt on a bike,
that
when it rained we got sluiced or rode the trainer inside...

In other words, I think it's in our (and I mean this group's) wiring to dig
down on these topics.

It's also winter, which means that for many of us, a few more months will
pass until we can feel the real breeze upon our cheeks and the hiss of
tires
upon the road. That means it's a real possibility to get a bit wrapped up
in the conversation as an end to itself. It let's us live vicariously,
enjoy
the intensity of feeling which goes with an invigorating ride.

There's always a point in every thread where diminishing returns begin to
occur. There's a point in some threads where it's more of a two way chat
than a general topic of discussion. Historically, we as a group have been
excellent at knowing when to disengage, take it to a private back channel
or
simply agree to disagree.

We are not the iBob group, and as I've said before in various State of The
List Reports, our strength and vitality as a group stems from the
specificity of our topic - Rivendell Bicycle Works. It's ulimately up to
each of us to maintain that balance.

This probably ought to just morph into a SOTL Report...

/admin hat

- Jim

Previous SOTLR's -
http://www.cyclofiend.com/rbw/sotlr

--
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cyclofi...@earthlink.net

--
Bill Gibson
Tempe, Arizona, USA

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Re: [RBW] Re: New News Post

2011-01-08 Thread Bill Gibson

Sorry admin hat, I missed your advice to cease and desist: I often write a
little in between other tasks and then hit send. That's email for you.

On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 2:13 PM, Bill Gibson bill.bgib...@gmail.com wrote:

On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 1:09 PM, CycloFiend cyclofi...@earthlink.netwrote:

on 1/8/11 10:28 AM, Philip Williamson at philip.william...@gmail.comwrote:
Stayed out of it as long as I could,

Word.

admin hat

Yep. General Diet threads are OT. OT threads within the confines of
this
group are, well... OT.

In other words, I think it's in our (and I mean this group's) wiring to
dig
down on these topics.

We are not the iBob group, and as I've said before in various State of
The
List Reports, our strength and vitality as a group stems from the
specificity of our topic - Rivendell Bicycle Works. It's ulimately up to
each of us to maintain that balance.

This probably ought to just morph into a SOTL Report...

/admin hat

- Jim

Previous SOTLR's -
http://www.cyclofiend.com/rbw/sotlr

--
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cyclofi...@earthlink.net

--
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Tempe, Arizona, USA

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[RBW] Re: Informal Tall Riders Group

2011-01-08 Thread Rambouilleting Utahn


I'm only 6' but I think my 94cm PBH qualifies me as 'tall'

64cm Rambouillet

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[RBW] Re: Skewers?

2011-01-08 Thread JoelMatthews

I use Pitlocks on my bike with hollow axle hubs.  They are good
looking, well made and fairly easy to remove, provided you remember to
bring your coded pit socket.

Not sure if PJW sells them, but Urban Bike Tech in Canada sells nice
caps for the pit side so you can have a really clean look.

On Jan 8, 12:32 pm, Marty mgie...@mac.com wrote:
 I need a pair of skewers for my next build - using Phil/Riv hubs.
 Looking for a nice clean design, and no plastic. Anyone have
 experience with Pitlock?

 Marty

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[RBW] Re: What Makes the Rivendell

2011-01-08 Thread Jim Cloud

Here's way you were reading from Douglas Brooks on Resolved vs
Resourceful bikes:
http://search.bikelist.org/?SearchString=resolvedmsgfrom=d...@mail.rochester.eduSortBy=MsgDate[d]

Courtesy of the bikelist.org archives...

Jim Cloud
Tucson, AZ

On Jan 8, 1:54 pm, JimD rasterd...@comcast.net wrote:
Well said Jim.
I wish I could find the thing I read from Douglas Brooks where he
talks about 'resolved' and 'resourcefull' bikes.

A Hampsten Tournesol Rando bike is an example of a resolved bike.
Everything is optimized for the function of long distance/unsupported
riding.

Underlying this approach to the hardware is a sensibility for
bicycling and bicyclers that is wide
ranging - everything but racing.

Once I realized I wasn't racing. I started thinking about other
approaches.
Having discovered Rivendell I'm riding more and having more fun than
ever before.

-JimD

On Jan 8, 2011, at 11:09 AM Jan 8, 2011, CycloFiend wrote:

on 1/7/11 12:06 PM, Kelly Sleeper at tkslee...@gmail.com wrote:
(great questions which ended with...)
What makes the Rivendell Different.. how does one explain that
difference to
those that just see a steel antique looking bke?

I think there have been a couple of handling or discussion of trail
threads where this has popped up before. These are a couple points
I've
probably made before...

- Jim

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cyclofi...@earthlink.net

Cyclofiend Bicycle Photo Galleries -http://www.cyclofiend.com
Current Classics - Cross Bikes

[RBW] Re: Nitto Front Racks

2011-01-08 Thread Montclair BobbyB

I have the Nitto Mini (which I love)... It looks awesome, has
beautiful welds and finish, and it's STRONG... Nicest front rack I've
ever owned.  I think this is THE rack to get if it fits your setup,
and you're planning to stick with the same bike.  If you plan to
switch it to different bikes (or potentially use it as a rear rack),
then I think Mark's Rack may offer a little more versatility.  (I just
ordered one for this reason).

BB

On Jan 8, 4:04 pm, omnigrid omnig...@gmail.com wrote:
 I was not impressed with a VO rack I installed on a customer's bicycle. The
 welds were ugly, everything was out of alignment, the finish was not
 anywhere near that of a Nitto, and the piece that attaches to the fork crown
 was flimsy and sure to fail eventually. I'm sure it would perform just fine
 for a little while, but the build quality was just not there.

 You get what you pay for. Buy once, cry once.



 On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 1:25 PM, Minh mgiangs...@gmail.com wrote:

  I'll second this request. Do the vo racks line up with the rvindell
  braze ons?

  And is the main diff between the nitto mini front and the marks rack
  the way the stays attach?

  On Jan 8, 2:17 pm, MikeC mecinib...@sbcglobal.net wrote:
   Not to hijack this thread, but how do the VO's in stainless steel
   compare to the Nittos in cro-mo in design and quality? They seem
   pretty similar in photos and VOs are half to two-thirds the price.

   -Mike

   On Jan 8, 12:09 pm, Earl Grey earlg...@gmail.com wrote:

Go with the Mini. It's a great rack, and mine has carried well over 30
  lbs
without a problem. In fact, the superiority of the Mini is a major
  reason to
get a cantilever bike, IMO.

I have no experience with the two-strut, so take my comments with a
  grain of
salt, but despite the double struts I doubt it can carry more weight
  than
the mini, because its attachment to the fork crown is much less secure
(bolted-on flat piece of flexible steel vs. brazed-on solid round steel
rod). That said, the two strut will fit cantis acc. to rivbike: It
  mounts
to any of our bikes, and most others. For the most secure attachment,
  you'd
probably want to run a bolt through your forkcrown to attach the flat
  metal
piece to...

Cheers,

Gernot

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[RBW] Today's Video

2011-01-08 Thread Eric Norris

Still playing around with iMovie and my new camera ...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F6-MIPBosEg

Ride was steel/leather/wool-equipped (including a canvas Baggins bag).

--Eric
campyonly...@me.com
www.campyonly.com
www.wheelsnorth.org

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Re: [RBW] Re: New News Post

Jim -- thanks for your work in maintaining this list, and for your
flexibility. No more from *me* on food -- for a while.

Patrick Moore, who just grunted and groaned his heavy '73 Gr Record
Motobecane grocery bike up a 3 mile climb, back down again, and up
another 1 mile climb, in a single, 67 fixed gear and is hungrily
waiting for chicken mole' 
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mole_(sauce)) made by his brother Peter,
visiting from LA.

OK, no more after *that*.

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[RBW] Re: Saddle comparison - Brooks B17 vs. Berthoud Touring

2011-01-08 Thread Mojo

Rene,

B17s work very well for me. I first bought one from early Rivendell
back in 1995 for my Robin Hood 3speed
http://www.flickr.com/photos/79695...@n00/3993215438/in/set-72157607471577085/
After a few years, I realized it was the most comfortable saddle I had
ridden, and bought another for my road bike, then all other bikes
except the mtn bike. B17s are perfectly comfortable out of the box.
But the fast wear and quickly changing/sagging leather has made me
concerned.

I bought a cork Touring Berthoud last fall. Beautiful finish and thick
thick leather convinced me to purchase from Rene Herse cycles in
Boulder. I have several shortish rides on it so far, and it does not
have B17 comfort for me. I think the not-quite-as-wide back is not a
problem. I think perhaps it is the very flat profile of the Berthoud
that may feel different to me compared to the distinct fore-aft dip in
the B17. But I have high hopes. A few sweaty hot rides may help to
modify the saddle to me. Its hard to get sweaty on the bike at this
time of year with 2 inches of snow on the ground.

I want to like the Berthoud. But at this point we are still assessing
each other to see if it will be a match.

On Jan 6, 10:40 pm, Rene Sterental orthie...@gmail.com wrote:
 Can anyone provide how the Berthoud Touring Saddles would compare to a B17
 saddle? I own B17 saddles but have never ridden a Berthoud one.

 Thanks,

 René

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[RBW] Re: Skewers?

2011-01-08 Thread Mojo

Shimano skewers are nearly impossible to beat mechanically. Any
internal cam wins over external. http://www.sheldonbrown.com/skewers.html

On Jan 8, 11:32 am, Marty mgie...@mac.com wrote:
 I need a pair of skewers for my next build - using Phil/Riv hubs.
 Looking for a nice clean design, and no plastic. Anyone have
 experience with Pitlock?

 Marty

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[RBW] Re: Saddle comparison - Brooks B17 vs. Berthoud Touring

2011-01-08 Thread JoelMatthews

 My question is, put delicately, how many, if any. like the Berthoud because 
 it is French, and, how many dislike it because it is French. Anyone?

 JimP

Jim:

Berthoud is definitely a company very much in the French tradition -
small, family run, not necessarily concerned about being the biggest
or fastest to market.  at least in my opinion anyway, they make nice
stuff.

The Berthoud saddle does not look all that much like Ideale the
classic French saddle I and some other posters mention.  It is a
unique design whether that means it is uniquely French, I could not
say.


On Jan 7, 12:24 pm, jim phillips thefamil...@hotmail.com wrote:
 My question is, put delicately, how many, if any. like the Berthoud because 
 it is French, and, how many dislike it because it is French. Anyone?

 JimP



  Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2011 10:10:11 -0800
  Subject: [RBW] Re: Saddle comparison - Brooks B17 vs. Berthoud Touring
  From: leec...@gmail.com
  To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com

  Joel and Clayton:

  I noticed that the rails appear a bit narrower on the Berthoud Aspin
  than on a B-17. Did you have to force the rails out a little to get it
  to fit your seatpost clamp? What seatposts have you tried with the
  Apsin?

  Thanks,
  Lee
  San Francisco, CA

  On Jan 7, 9:42 am, Clayton Scott clayton...@gmail.com wrote:
   I have been using b.17s for while, but got frustrated when I burnt through
   my last one in 7 months and went ahead and purchased a Berthoud touring
   saddle.
   I have only been using it for 2 months now but so far so good. It is a
   little narrower than a b.17 but not in a bad way. Still has enough
   room accommodate my sitbones. The shape seems perfect for me.
   The craftsmanship is stunning compared to Brooks.
   Compared to the now incredibly saggy brooks it does feel a lot firmer. I 
   did
   ride a 200k permanent within a few weeks of owning it and toward the end I
   did have to ride out of the saddle occasionally to give my slightly
   protesting sitbones some relief. It was not agonizing and only started
   setting in during the last few miles but was noticeable and distracting
   nevertheless. (Still significantly better than having the metal frame of 
   the
   b.17 dig into me though.). So far the Berthoud is perfect for up to a 100
   miles and I expect it to get even more comfortable as the saddle and I get
   more used to eachother.
   I purchased mine from Rene Herse Bicycles who lets you try the saddle for 
   60
   days and return it if you don't like it. I suggest you give it try.

   Best,
   Clayton Scott
   SF, CA

   On Fri, Jan 7, 2011 at 9:29 AM, JoelMatthews joelmatth...@mac.com wrote:
 I had an Ideale when it was new and it wasn't as comfortable and 
 didn't
 work as well as a B.17.  It was one of those with the integral wide
 aluminum rails and the built-in micro-adjusting clamp.

My favorite Ideales are the 4 and 6 (the lightly sprung city
saddles).  I think the aluminum frame Ideale used made for a more
comfortable spring base than the heavier Brooks.

Unfortunately, the leather is somewhat thin on them and they tend to
need frequent tightening.  Wonder if Berthoud will ever try and copy
that model?

On Jan 7, 10:29 am, Steve Palincsar palin...@his.com wrote:
 On Fri, 2011-01-07 at 08:12 -0800, JoelMatthews wrote:
  Unless you have an Ideale that has been well maintained - or stored 
  in
  optimal conditions - it is not going to be as comfortable, work as
  well, or last as long as a modern Brooks or Berthoud.

 I had an Ideale when it was new and it wasn't as comfortable and 
 didn't
 work as well as a B.17.  It was one of those with the integral wide
 aluminum rails and the built-in micro-adjusting clamp.

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[RBW] Re: Skewers?

2011-01-08 Thread EricP

A cover might get me to use Pitlock again.  Have two sets.  Ran them
on both my Hillborne and my LHT.  On the latter, which is my winter
bike, the Pitlock started to seize.  Had a devil of a time removing
the wheel one time.  There was no obvious rust in the system.

That pretty much scared me off of Pitlocks.   Although if you live in
more temperate climates (or are better at maintenance) they are a nice
choice. (Also don't like only two keys.  Prefer three.  One to carry,
one for the shop, one in house as spare.)

Have also used the Zefal QR (that Riv used to sell).  Those had a
different problem.  If I cranked the cam down tight, the pin wouldn't
always dislodge.  Scared me nigh on half to death one time trying to
fix a flat.  That was also in winter.  Could easily have been a
binding issue between two different materials.

Eric Platt
St. Paul, MN

On Jan 8, 4:07 pm, JoelMatthews joelmatth...@mac.com wrote:
 I use Pitlocks on my bike with hollow axle hubs.  They are good
 looking, well made and fairly easy to remove, provided you remember to
 bring your coded pit socket.

 Not sure if PJW sells them, but Urban Bike Tech in Canada sells nice
 caps for the pit side so you can have a really clean look.

 On Jan 8, 12:32 pm, Marty mgie...@mac.com wrote:



  I need a pair of skewers for my next build - using Phil/Riv hubs.
  Looking for a nice clean design, and no plastic. Anyone have
  experience with Pitlock?

  Marty- Hide quoted text -

 - Show quoted text -

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Re: [RBW] Re: Skewers?

2011-01-08 Thread Dan Abelson

On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 6:05 PM, EricP ericpl...@aol.com wrote:


 Have also used the Zefal QR (that Riv used to sell).  Those had a
 different problem.  If I cranked the cam down tight, the pin wouldn't
 always dislodge.  Scared me nigh on half to death one time trying to
 fix a flat.  That was also in winter.  Could easily have been a
 binding issue between two different materials.

 Eric Platt
 St. Paul, MN



I stopped using the Zefal for the same reason.  I had a time where it
was difficult to open when changing a flat in the winter.

Dan Abelson
St. Paul, MN

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[RBW] Re: Saddle comparison - Brooks B17 vs. Berthoud Touring

2011-01-08 Thread EricP

Have not used the Berthoud but my fears about it are two-fold.  Would
the frame handle my weight (220 to 230)?  At least metal is known to
be able to handle that girth and not fail.

Also, how would it handle a Minnesota winter?  Althought am not sure
it would be the saddle that would end up on my winter bike. (Which is
currently a choice between a Terry and a VO.)

Am starting to feel my B-17 saddles are slowly dying.  Although having
to put up with my heft for the past few years would probably make any
material fail.

Eric Platt
St. Paul, MN

On Jan 8, 5:46 pm, JoelMatthews joelmatth...@mac.com wrote:
  My question is, put delicately, how many, if any. like the Berthoud because 
  it is French, and, how many dislike it because it is French. Anyone?

  JimP

 Jim:

 Berthoud is definitely a company very much in the French tradition -
 small, family run, not necessarily concerned about being the biggest
 or fastest to market.  at least in my opinion anyway, they make nice
 stuff.

 The Berthoud saddle does not look all that much like Ideale the
 classic French saddle I and some other posters mention.  It is a
 unique design whether that means it is uniquely French, I could not
 say.

 On Jan 7, 12:24 pm, jim phillips thefamil...@hotmail.com wrote:



  My question is, put delicately, how many, if any. like the Berthoud because 
  it is French, and, how many dislike it because it is French. Anyone?

  JimP

   Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2011 10:10:11 -0800
   Subject: [RBW] Re: Saddle comparison - Brooks B17 vs. Berthoud Touring
   From: leec...@gmail.com
   To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com

   Joel and Clayton:

   I noticed that the rails appear a bit narrower on the Berthoud Aspin
   than on a B-17. Did you have to force the rails out a little to get it
   to fit your seatpost clamp? What seatposts have you tried with the
   Apsin?

   Thanks,
   Lee
   San Francisco, CA

   On Jan 7, 9:42 am, Clayton Scott clayton...@gmail.com wrote:
I have been using b.17s for while, but got frustrated when I burnt 
through
my last one in 7 months and went ahead and purchased a Berthoud touring
saddle.
I have only been using it for 2 months now but so far so good. It is a
little narrower than a b.17 but not in a bad way. Still has enough
room accommodate my sitbones. The shape seems perfect for me.
The craftsmanship is stunning compared to Brooks.
Compared to the now incredibly saggy brooks it does feel a lot firmer. 
I did
ride a 200k permanent within a few weeks of owning it and toward the 
end I
did have to ride out of the saddle occasionally to give my slightly
protesting sitbones some relief. It was not agonizing and only started
setting in during the last few miles but was noticeable and distracting
nevertheless. (Still significantly better than having the metal frame 
of the
b.17 dig into me though.). So far the Berthoud is perfect for up to a 
100
miles and I expect it to get even more comfortable as the saddle and I 
get
more used to eachother.
I purchased mine from Rene Herse Bicycles who lets you try the saddle 
for 60
days and return it if you don't like it. I suggest you give it try.

Best,
Clayton Scott
SF, CA

On Fri, Jan 7, 2011 at 9:29 AM, JoelMatthews joelmatth...@mac.com 
wrote:
  I had an Ideale when it was new and it wasn't as comfortable and 
  didn't
  work as well as a B.17.  It was one of those with the integral wide
  aluminum rails and the built-in micro-adjusting clamp.

 My favorite Ideales are the 4 and 6 (the lightly sprung city
 saddles).  I think the aluminum frame Ideale used made for a more
 comfortable spring base than the heavier Brooks.

 Unfortunately, the leather is somewhat thin on them and they tend to
 need frequent tightening.  Wonder if Berthoud will ever try and copy
 that model?

 On Jan 7, 10:29 am, Steve Palincsar palin...@his.com wrote:
  On Fri, 2011-01-07 at 08:12 -0800, JoelMatthews wrote:
   Unless you have an Ideale that has been well maintained - or 
   stored in
   optimal conditions - it is not going to be as comfortable, work as
   well, or last as long as a modern Brooks or Berthoud.

  I had an Ideale when it was new and it wasn't as comfortable and 
  didn't
  work as well as a B.17.  It was one of those with the integral wide
  aluminum rails and the built-in micro-adjusting clamp.

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[RBW] Re: Skewers?

2011-01-08 Thread Peter Pesce

I use VO skewers on my commuter. Truth is, you are only relying on the
skewer to thwart opportunistic thiefs.
If you have a $1500 wheelset that a pro wants, he'll get it. Pitlock
or not. It probably just as easy for them to take the whole bike.
I have QR skewers in my Sam because I often put it in or on vehicles,
and often have my wheels off when I'm messing with bike parts for fun.
They are handy for that.

On Jan 8, 3:52 pm, Travis travisbreitenb...@gmail.com wrote:
 I own both Pitlock and VO skewers. There is no comparison of course. I
 don't know why, but the VO skewers have sort of a knurled surface on
 the outside, so it looks like they could be opened with a good set of
 pliers. Also, keys for those hex-pin bolts can be had at most hardware
 stores. I'd say the VO skewer provides just a tad more security than
 an allen bolt skewer. I use mine on a wheel which I wouldn't really
 mind replacing because it's nearing the end of it's useful life
 anyway.

 The Pitlock design is really much further advanced than any other
 locking skewers out there. I see two ways to defeat it, but they
 require quite a bit of ingenuity. I live in NYC and use them on a
 decent wheelset. I have enough faith in them that I lock only my frame
 which is tremendously freeing. I carry one of the Pit keys on a large
 key ring with my keys and this gives me just enough torque to adjust
 them if needed. Also, I use them on a bike with horizontal drop-outs
 even though you're not supposed to. It's been holding up fine. Of
 course, this bike has a freewheel - I would not try this with a SS/
 fixed set-up.

 Travis

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Re: [RBW] Re: Saddle comparison - Brooks B17 vs. Berthoud Touring

2011-01-08 Thread Rene Sterental

Yes it would... :-)

Sent from my iPhone 4

On Jan 7, 2011, at 4:10 PM, Montclair BobbyB montclairbob...@gmail.com wrote:

 Rene:

 If the Berthoud works out, COULD this mean you may have a veritable
 arsenal of B17s available for sale???  (tee hee hee)

 Bobby I've already bought a B17 from Rene Birmingham

 On Jan 7, 6:47 pm, Rene Sterental orthie...@gmail.com wrote:
 Thanks for all the responses. I'm ordering one tonight to try it. I
 like the B17 except for its nose up position to prevent sliding
 forward. Always thought it should be flatter.

 Seems like the Berthoud Touring might make me completely happy.

 René

 Sent from my iPhone 4

 On Jan 7, 2011, at 1:54 PM, Seth Vidal skvi...@gmail.com wrote:



 On Fri, Jan 7, 2011 at 2:50 PM, Kelly Sleeper tkslee...@gmail.com wrote:

 Only reason I wouldn't try a 200 dollar saddle is if I can't return it.   
 It
 looks to me to be a very well made comfortable saddle that has a benefit if
 you buy thier saddle bags too.

 I would also out of desperation try it if I didn't have comfortable saddles
 now.

 wallbike.com

 6month unconditional return guarantee.

 -sv

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[RBW] Re: Saddle comparison - Brooks B17 vs. Berthoud Touring

2011-01-08 Thread msrw

I'm also one of the apparent minority who tried a Berthoud, and found
it uncomfortable, even on reasonably short rides--25 miles.  The
material and build quality is amazing and I was disappointed that the
comfort didn't match all the other exceptional qualities of this
saddle.

I have B-17's in various versions on all my bikes--Champion Flyer on
the commuter with upright bars, Ti versions on my brevet bike and
tandem.  I've only had one B-17 fail due to assymetrical stretching,
and it was replaced by Brooks under warranty.

My weight is about 180 lbs.

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Re: [RBW] Re: Saddle comparison - Brooks B17 vs. Berthoud Touring

2011-01-08 Thread omnigrid

regarding b17 vs. berthoud touring...

are the rails longer on the berthoud...or just as short as on the b17?

On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 5:46 PM, JoelMatthews joelmatth...@mac.com wrote:

My question is, put delicately, how many, if any. like the Berthoud
because it is French, and, how many dislike it because it is French. Anyone?

JimP

Jim:

Berthoud is definitely a company very much in the French tradition -
small, family run, not necessarily concerned about being the biggest
or fastest to market. at least in my opinion anyway, they make nice
stuff.

The Berthoud saddle does not look all that much like Ideale the
classic French saddle I and some other posters mention. It is a
unique design whether that means it is uniquely French, I could not
say.

On Jan 7, 12:24 pm, jim phillips thefamil...@hotmail.com wrote:
My question is, put delicately, how many, if any. like the Berthoud
because it is French, and, how many dislike it because it is French. Anyone?

JimP

Date: Fri, 7 Jan 2011 10:10:11 -0800
Subject: [RBW] Re: Saddle comparison - Brooks B17 vs. Berthoud Touring
From: leec...@gmail.com
To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com

Joel and Clayton:

Thanks,
Lee
San Francisco, CA

On Jan 7, 9:42 am, Clayton Scott clayton...@gmail.com wrote:
I have been using b.17s for while, but got frustrated when I burnt
through
my last one in 7 months and went ahead and purchased a Berthoud
touring
saddle.
I have only been using it for 2 months now but so far so good. It is
a
little narrower than a b.17 but not in a bad way. Still has enough
room accommodate my sitbones. The shape seems perfect for me.
The craftsmanship is stunning compared to Brooks.
Compared to the now incredibly saggy brooks it does feel a lot
firmer. I did
ride a 200k permanent within a few weeks of owning it and toward the
end I
did have to ride out of the saddle occasionally to give my slightly
protesting sitbones some relief. It was not agonizing and only
started
setting in during the last few miles but was noticeable and
distracting
nevertheless. (Still significantly better than having the metal frame
of the
b.17 dig into me though.). So far the Berthoud is perfect for up to a
100
miles and I expect it to get even more comfortable as the saddle and
I get
more used to eachother.
I purchased mine from Rene Herse Bicycles who lets you try the saddle
for 60
days and return it if you don't like it. I suggest you give it try.

Best,
Clayton Scott
SF, CA

On Fri, Jan 7, 2011 at 9:29 AM, JoelMatthews joelmatth...@mac.com
wrote:
I had an Ideale when it was new and it wasn't as comfortable and
didn't
work as well as a B.17. It was one of those with the integral
wide
aluminum rails and the built-in micro-adjusting clamp.

My favorite Ideales are the 4 and 6 (the lightly sprung city
saddles). I think the aluminum frame Ideale used made for a more
comfortable spring base than the heavier Brooks.

Unfortunately, the leather is somewhat thin on them and they tend
to
need frequent tightening. Wonder if Berthoud will ever try and
copy
that model?

On Jan 7, 10:29 am, Steve Palincsar palin...@his.com wrote:
On Fri, 2011-01-07 at 08:12 -0800, JoelMatthews wrote:
Unless you have an Ideale that has been well maintained - or
stored in
optimal conditions - it is not going to be as comfortable, work
as
well, or last as long as a modern Brooks or Berthoud.

I had an Ideale when it was new and it wasn't as comfortable and
didn't
work as well as a B.17. It was one of those with the integral
wide
aluminum rails and the built-in micro-adjusting clamp.

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[RBW] Re: Nitto Front Racks

I've been eyeballing low rider front racks.

For the first couple of years Rivendell sold the Nitto Campee with the
bolt on low riders, and had a simple low rider only with hoop in
development (Reader 15, page 13) but at some point decided to eschew
the low and go high. I wonder what made them see the high rider
religion?

I have a Carradice Limpet, the rackless, velcro and hop-mount bags,
but unfortunately I've just never come to love it. When I find a good
deal or trade on a rack, I want to switch out the Limpet. I'm sure
with global economies and such $220 is the fair price for a Nitto
Campee, but that's not in the budget right now. VO says they have
something in development but can't discuss it's design or timing.

On Jan 8, 1:04 pm, omnigrid omnig...@gmail.com wrote:
I was not impressed with a VO rack I installed on a customer's bicycle. The
welds were ugly, everything was out of alignment, the finish was not
anywhere near that of a Nitto, and the piece that attaches to the fork crown
was flimsy and sure to fail eventually. I'm sure it would perform just fine
for a little while, but the build quality was just not there.

You get what you pay for. Buy once, cry once.

On Sat, Jan 8, 2011 at 1:25 PM, Minh mgiangs...@gmail.com wrote:

I'll second this request. Do the vo racks line up with the rvindell
braze ons?

And is the main diff between the nitto mini front and the marks rack
the way the stays attach?

-Mike

On Jan 8, 12:09 pm, Earl Grey earlg...@gmail.com wrote:

Go with the Mini. It's a great rack, and mine has carried well over 30
lbs
without a problem. In fact, the superiority of the Mini is a major
reason to
get a cantilever bike, IMO.

Cheers,

Gernot

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[RBW] Re: Most interesting Riv Reader Articles