RE: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM
-Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Nate Duehr I'm curious to see if: 1. You're seeing the majority of failures in PA's. 2. If you're seeing other failures of some sort. (That would be odd to me, at least from our experiences with them here.) Well, I've had the PA fail about three times in the 12 years I've been maintaining it. The last time I rebuilt it all from scratch and added a couple of fans. Most recently the pots on the repeater audio board failed and had to be replaced. After that I've been having trouble getting it to key reliably via the remote keyer. The main thing is that they are for a commercial/government agency with the lack of replacement parts available, its time to update. We also have coverage issues because over the years our area has grown so it's just a natural thing to put in new stuff. Curiosity kills the cat... and what we REALLY want to know, is just where DO you Safari, Safari_Tim? :-) :-) :-) LOL.. My first travel trailer model was a Safari.. Anyway, I'd say that the Magic 8-Ball says that most folks seem to be having pretty good luck with Moto, M/ACom, and Kenwood these days. It says, Ask Again whenever I ask it about EF Johnson, Icom, Yaesu/Vertex, right now. (Oh lord, I can hear the keyboards typing up the flames now. Time to go don my Nomex underwear.) I've been asked to help spec out the new equipment and I've been stuck in a radio time warp for the last 12 years maintaining these Master II's. So I'm just looking for some direct experience with the new stuff as far as reliability and serviceability as well. It's been an interesting discussion! -Tim
Re: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM
we have been replacing our Micor repeaters with Kenwood TKR-840 with better operation. John - Original Message - From: Tim S To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2007 1:30 AM Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM Wow, did that get a response! What I was wondering about was failure rate and serviceability. We're replacing Master II's that have been in operation about 30 years. They have been pretty reliable until recently. I'd hate to replace them with something new and have nothing but problems. -Tim -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Nate Duehr Sent: Monday, April 30, 2007 12:41 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM On 4/30/07, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Who is making the best repeater these days? Motorola or MA/Com formaly GE? That would be a question best suited for your favorite religious leader, probably. ;-) First, define: best... If all you want is anecdotes, I can personally say that I've seen the current generation Motorola and M/ACom products both in operation 24/7 in various public safety and Amateur radio applications in the local area, and they both appear to work fine. But that's probably not what you wanted. Nate WY0X
Re: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM
We used to tell people that Motorola watts were bigger than anyone else's watts. Funny thing was that a lot of folks believed us! Mike KA4MKG Gary Schafer wrote: That reminds me of a time (many years ago) when I worked for Motorola. One of the Motorola salesman was telling some of the other Motorola salesmen about a system he had sold some radios into and how there were some coverage problems. Upon discovering that there were a few GE handheld radios in the system several of the salesmen said “well that’s the problem” , “There is no way those GE radios are going to work as well a Motorola radio”. Funny part of it was that most of the salesmen really believed that. Talk about a religious leader.. J 73 Gary K4FMX From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Nate Duehr Sent: Monday, April 30, 2007 3:41 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM On 4/30/07, [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Who is making the best repeater these days? Motorola or MA/Com formaly GE? That would be a question best suited for your favorite religious leader, probably. ;-) First, define: best... If all you want is anecdotes, I can personally say that I've seen the current generation Motorola and M/ACom products both in operation 24/7 in various public safety and Amateur radio applications in the local area, and they both appear to work fine. But that's probably not what you wanted. Nate WY0X Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM
Nate Duehr wrote: There's a number of decent options out there along those lines. People have been discussing Cresend with reasonably favorable comments, lately here -- for one example. I've seen a few analog public safety systems that are Kenwood's driving Crescend and/or Vocom (they bought Vocom out) PA's. FWIW-the current vintage of MastrIII's uses Crescend PA's as well. -- Jim Barbour WD8CHL
RE: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM
Yes they do. I just replaced 3 800 Mhz PA's yesterday with the new Crescend PA. They are lighter for sure. The label on one I remember looking at was marked as 8.1 Amps for 100W out. When I was at M/A-Com last year for an EDACS class, one of the instructors was talking about the new PA's and commented that they operate them at 10 watts with no problems. Try that with one of the older Mastr III or Mastr II PA's. Jamey Wright Systems Analyst/EDACS Administrator Morgan County EMCD 911 Decatur, AL 256-552-0911 -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Repeater- [EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jim B. Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2007 8:01 AM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM Nate Duehr wrote: There's a number of decent options out there along those lines. People have been discussing Cresend with reasonably favorable comments, lately here -- for one example. I've seen a few analog public safety systems that are Kenwood's driving Crescend and/or Vocom (they bought Vocom out) PA's. FWIW-the current vintage of MastrIII's uses Crescend PA's as well. -- Jim Barbour WD8CHL Yahoo! Groups Links
RE: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM
Here's my 2¢ worth... I'm running a 150W Crescend PA behind my Kenwood TKR-820 repeater - absolutely NO complaints!! Mark - N9WYS -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com On Behalf Of Jim B. Sent: Tuesday, May 01, 2007 8:01 AM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM Nate Duehr wrote: There's a number of decent options out there along those lines. People have been discussing Cresend with reasonably favorable comments, lately here -- for one example. I've seen a few analog public safety systems that are Kenwood's driving Crescend and/or Vocom (they bought Vocom out) PA's. FWIW-the current vintage of MastrIII's uses Crescend PA's as well. -- Jim Barbour WD8CHL Yahoo! Groups Links -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.467 / Virus Database: 269.6.2/781 - Release Date: 4/30/2007 9:14 AM
Re: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM
Paul Finch wrote: I just completed a crossband repeater for a balloon launch built out of Johnson's old HT line of radios. Weighs 10 ounces without batteries, the controller adds about 2 I think. Paul WB5IDM 587/589's? I remember them! I remember one customer that had a fleet of 579's (VHF), probably a couple hundred. They were a wholesale nursery, and we caught them several times using the radios as a hammer to pound stakes in the ground. Biggest issue was the little cap that went from the PC board up to the antenna connector, and the connector itself coming loose. We wound up soldering the nut to the thread on a lot of them. -- Jim Barbour WD8CHL Yahoo! Groups Links * To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ * Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional * To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/join (Yahoo! ID required) * To change settings via email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] * Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM
Tim S wrote: I've been asked to help spec out the new equipment and I've been stuck in a radio time warp for the last 12 years maintaining these Master II's. So I'm just looking for some direct experience with the new stuff as far as reliability and serviceability as well. It's been an interesting discussion! -Tim I think you're in theright ball park then. You can't go too far wrong with Quantars, MIII's, or TKR-8400's. And remember, the Feds are supposed to narrowband this year, and everyone else on VHF/UHF (Part 90) will in 2013. Another good incentive to buy new, since you'll have to soon anyway. -- Jim Barbour WD8CHL
Re: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM
I think I have had one Crescend 100 Watt 800 Mhz PA fail (1/2 power) in 4 years - ouyt of 70 some odd - dang good stuff in EDACS - Jamey if you ever want to trade notes gimme a holler, Steve
[Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM
Who is making the best repeater these days? Motorola or MA/Com formaly GE? -- -Tim
RE: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM
Tim, Now THAT'S a loaded question. hehehehe Be prepared - now you'll get responses from Motorola fans, GE/Ericsson/MA-Com/Tyco fans, Kenwood, et al. So now it becomes a question of: new vs. old equipment; what purpose of usage (commercial vs. ham); etc. Ad Nauseum Mark - N9WYS _ From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Who is making the best repeater these days? Motorola or MA/Com formaly GE? -- -Tim
Re: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM
N9WYS wrote: Tim, Now THAT'S a loaded question. hehehehe Be prepared - now you'll get responses from Motorola fans, GE/Ericsson/MA-Com/Tyco fans, Kenwood, et al. So now it becomes a question of: new vs. old equipment; what purpose of usage (commercial vs. ham); etc. Ad Nauseum Mark - N9WYS Who is making the best repeater these days? Motorola or MA/Com formaly GE? Indeed-a VERY loaded question. I happen to like all three of of the ones mentioned, if you stay in the same class when you compare (unlike car companies ;c). Compare an MTR2000 to a TKR-750/850 (M/A-Com doesn't have a low end repeater.) Compare the MastrIII to a Quantar or a TKR-7400/8400 for a high end repeater. They're all pretty good. -- Jim Barbour WD8CHL
Re: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM
At 11:24 AM 04/30/07, you wrote: Who is making the best repeater these days? Motorola or MA/Com formaly GE? -- -Tim That's a flamewar baiting question ! on the same level with politics, religion and sex... You'll find proponents of every brand out there... from Aerotron to the little M (Midland) to Yaesu. And then you will have the totally unexpected answer fly past you... Locally, we have one guy who feels that if it doesn't glow in the dark it's not a real repeater. He's still running GE Progress line on 220 and 440... and it's funny, he goes to the radio site for maintenance trips maybe 1/4 as often as the guys that run Mastr IIs or Micors. And the repeaters don't key up from grunge and intermod as often. When asked, he comments that maybe its because the 3rd order intercept point of a RF stage that has 150v on the plate is higher than one that has 10v on the collector and he loves to pull the chain of the newbies that have never seen a tube other than the face of a CRT with answers like you need to adjust the grid bias, then dip the plate when asked questions about why his systems work so well. Mike WA6ILQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM
I'll take Motorola And EF Johnson Repeaters anytime over the Others . Just my Two cents ... lol 73 Steve. EF Johnson Tech Motorola Tech . ** See what's free at http://www.aol.com.
RE: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM
That reminds me of a time (many years ago) when I worked for Motorola. One of the Motorola salesman was telling some of the other Motorola salesmen about a system he had sold some radios into and how there were some coverage problems. Upon discovering that there were a few GE handheld radios in the system several of the salesmen said well that's the problem , There is no way those GE radios are going to work as well a Motorola radio. Funny part of it was that most of the salesmen really believed that. Talk about a religious leader.. :-) 73 Gary K4FMX _ From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Nate Duehr Sent: Monday, April 30, 2007 3:41 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM On 4/30/07, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Who is making the best repeater these days? Motorola or MA/Com formaly GE? That would be a question best suited for your favorite religious leader, probably. ;-) First, define: best... If all you want is anecdotes, I can personally say that I've seen the current generation Motorola and M/ACom products both in operation 24/7 in various public safety and Amateur radio applications in the local area, and they both appear to work fine. But that's probably not what you wanted. Nate WY0X
RE: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM
Steve and all, FWIW - We [Will County (IL) EMA] have four EF Johnson base/repeater units installed in a trailer designed for interoperability here in Illinois, and we've had nothing but problems with them. First the VHF went south (and were eventually replaced - by Johnson - with mobiles for our application) and now the UHF has gone likewise. There are 9 such trailers throughout Illinois (coined ITECS for Illinois Transportable Emergency Communications System) developed and paid for by the Joint Terrorism Task Force (JTTF) and all are experiencing the same problems. Supposedly a factory rep form Johnson wasn't even able to resolve the issues. YMMV. Mark - N9WYS Asst Chief - Operations, Will County (IL) EMA / Field Services Division _ From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] I'll take Motorola And EF Johnson Repeaters anytime over the Others . Just my Two cents ... lol 73 Steve. EF Johnson Tech Motorola Tech
Re: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM
Mike, yours is a very good comment, Moto / MA/COM. Probably the best approach would be to compare specifications, and take a good look at each product for serviceablilty. Don't forget EF Johnson - I have 10 or 15 of their VX series, and 5 or 6 M3, and a handful of Kenwood TKR820's and such that I use in my own LTR trunking systems. By large and far, modern equipment has been very trouble free. In my real life I maintain 78 MA/COM M3, 800 Mhz Edacs repeaters, 4 Sites, 19 channels per site, simulcast, with a couple of NPSPAC channels for interoperability. I do know how the Maytag man feels. Best luck on your selection of repeater. More importantlocation, enviroment, antenna, transmission line, grounding, shelter, accessability, and such. Steve NU5D
Re: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM
Mark, I am sure sorry to hear about the EFJ's going south. That has not been my experience. I have had a couple of VCO's get noisy and one or two power supplies fail, but this is over a 10 year period. I do hope the manufacturer can get this resolved quickly. Steve NU5D
RE: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM
Hello, Johnson is not what Johnson used to be... Paul _ From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of N9WYS Sent: Monday, April 30, 2007 4:42 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM Steve and all, FWIW - We [Will County (IL) EMA] have four EF Johnson base/repeater units installed in a trailer designed for “interoperability” here in Illinois, and we’ve had nothing but problems with them… First the VHF went south (and were eventually replaced - by Johnson - with mobiles for our application) and now the UHF has gone likewise. There are 9 such trailers throughout Illinois (coined “ITECS” for Illinois Transportable Emergency Communications System) developed and paid for by the Joint Terrorism Task Force (JTTF) and all are experiencing the same problems. Supposedly a factory rep form Johnson wasn’t even able to resolve the issues… YMMV. Mark – N9WYS Asst Chief – Operations, Will County (IL) EMA / Field Services Division _ From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] I'll take Motorola And EF Johnson Repeaters anytime over the Others . Just my Two cents ... lol 73 Steve. EF Johnson Tech Motorola Tech Try the new PrairieNet toolbar its free: http://prairienet.mycitytoolbar.com No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.467 / Virus Database: 269.6.2/780 - Release Date: 4/29/2007 6:30 AM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.467 / Virus Database: 269.6.2/780 - Release Date: 4/29/2007 6:30 AM
RE: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM
At 03:06 PM 04/30/07, you wrote: Hello, Johnson is not what Johnson used to be... Paul And that statement is just the tip of the iceberg... Talk to any long-term Johnson dealer.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM
I have used, programmed, setup, and interfaced both the Motorola and MA/COM equipment. I like both equally. The Motorola Quantar is very nice, and everything is self contained. Not big on the MTR2000 station but they are fine as well. The MA/COM MASTR III repeaters are great also. Only drawback is they are not made for 800/900MHz. Other than that, its really who you want to deal with. Andy - Ahhh...imagining that irresistible new car smell? Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM
Hello Andy, are you meaning the M3 is not made for 800 Mhz., or not dual band (800/900)? The ones I maintain are 800 Mhz. Steve On 4/30/07, Andrew G. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I have used, programmed, setup, and interfaced both the Motorola and MA/COM equipment. I like both equally. The Motorola Quantar is very nice, and everything is self contained. Not big on the MTR2000 station but they are fine as well. The MA/COM MASTR III repeaters are great also. Only drawback is they are not made for 800/900MHz. Other than that, its really who you want to deal with. Andy -- -- Ham Radio Spoken Here.NU5D Nickel Under Five Dollars
Re: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM
Understood - On 4/30/07, Andrew G. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My bad on that one Steve. Meant to only throw it in as 900. We had a need for a high split 900 station 934-950 and could not get a M3. Still fighting Motorola for a Quantar to use there. Due to the frequency pair we have, it overlaps the two models they make between TX freq RX Freq, but thats another story for another thread. Andy Ham Radio Spoken Here.NU5D Nickel Under Five Dollars
RE: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM
I worked in a Johnson shop from 1973 to 1983, learned radio there. Learned which Johnson were good and which ones were not. Love the old Fleetcom II 559 and 530 radios. All three of my repeaters on my tower are Fleetcom II's, have not touched any of them in years. The PPL 6060 radios make great little portable repeaters. I just completed a crossband repeater for a balloon launch built out of Johnson's old HT line of radios. Weighs 10 ounces without batteries, the controller adds about 2 I think. Paul WB5IDM _ From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mike Morris WA6ILQ Sent: Monday, April 30, 2007 5:29 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] New repeater Motorola or MA/COM At 03:06 PM 04/30/07, you wrote: Hello, Johnson is not what Johnson used to be... Paul And that statement is just the tip of the iceberg... Talk to any long-term Johnson dealer. Try the new PrairieNet toolbar its free: http://prairienet.mycitytoolbar.com No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.467 / Virus Database: 269.6.2/780 - Release Date: 4/29/2007 6:30 AM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.467 / Virus Database: 269.6.2/780 - Release Date: 4/29/2007 6:30 AM
