Re: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage
Peter Dakota Summerhawk wrote: > Some of the “paper repeaters” that are not working and listed on the > repeater directory need to be taken down and reassigned as they are just > tying up space and if they are not used other than for special event > then they need to go the way of the dodo. > > Peter Summerhawk-N0WRE Volunteer your time to your local coordination body to go clean 'em up. They don't remove themselves. Nate WY0X Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/ <*> Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional <*> To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Repeater-Builder/join (Yahoo! ID required) <*> To change settings via email: mailto:repeater-builder-dig...@yahoogroups.com mailto:repeater-builder-fullfeatu...@yahoogroups.com <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: repeater-builder-unsubscr...@yahoogroups.com <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage - what are you going to do about it?
Paul Plack wrote: > Nate, > > If you leave the repeater on all day, but block calls from anyone but a > few friends, what has changed? Someone throwing out his callsign will > still find the room empty. Well, they could always hit and hold the "EMR" (probably originally meant to be "Emergency" mode, but the lawyers at Icom made sure it never says that ANYWHERE in the manuals, that I've found yet...) button and FORCE all the sand-baggers to listen. (Of course, if this feature gets over-used, people will just turn off their radios... but it even forces listening rigs to go to half volume if they're currently set below that threshold.) ;-) Annoying little feature if used inappropriately, eh? Nate WY0X
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage - what are you going to do about it?
Nate, If you leave the repeater on all day, but block calls from anyone but a few friends, what has changed? Someone throwing out his callsign will still find the room empty. The APRS reference was to newer rigs which can work with local repeater directories distributed by APRS, and display options on their front panels. Manual frequency-hopping only lets you follow nets as you drive if you know the next node to tune, its PL tone, etc. On your other suggestion, if there was a RB net on IRLP, I'd be very motivated to be there! 73, Paul, AE4KR - Original Message - From: Nate Duehr To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2008 6:13 PM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage - what are you going to do about it? One way to accomodate both is fancy CTCSS schemes, or in the case of D-STAR, the coded squelch features. If you want to hear, you do... if you don't you don't, but you leave the rig on for calls... APRS is the "continuous net", it's always there on 144.39 in most metropolitan areas -- what do you mean? It's not really designed for a round-table, really. Recent Activity a.. 15New Members Visit Your Group Yahoo! Groups Going Green Zone Resources for a greener planet. Resources for a greener you. Sell Online Start selling with our award-winning e-commerce tools. Yahoo! Groups Stay healthy and discover other people who can help. .
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage - what are you going to do about it?
Sounds like I need to count my lucky stars that I'm in a community of active hams! 73 es Merry Xmas, Mike WM4B From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of John J. Riddell Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2008 6:33 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage - what are you going to do about it? Benjamin, The sparse activity seems to be everywhere.One suggestion is to add IRLP to your repeater. When there is no local activity there always seems to be someone listening on the various reflectors all over the world and you can chat with them. Some time back, I was driving to pick up my wife from work at 7 PM here in Ontario, and I came across a fellow Ham in Japan who was also driving but it was 7 AM in the morning there. IRLP activity would certainly be of interest to anyone listening to our Ham repeaters on a scanner and it may just be the "spark" to get them interested in becoming a Ham. The inventor of IRLP is a Canadian Ham and is a member of this list, VE7LTD 73 John VE3AMZ (A Ham for 50 years) Waterloo, Ontario - Original Message - From: "Benjamin L. Naber" mailto:benjamin%40kb9lfz.com> > To: mailto:Repeater-Builder%40yahoogroups.com> > Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2008 5:47 PM Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage - what are you going to do about it? > So after reading a few messages, I began to think, what is each person > who gets these messages now going to do about it? > > I guess you have a few options. > > Sit on your butt in front of the idiot box like 90% of all Americans and > not do anything but complain. > -Or- > Do something about like going attending club meetings and begin public > service events. The ARRL has a lot of getting involved with amateur > radio. I read it about five years ago and to this day I still do what I > can which my military time consuming job allows - I still go on the air, > even if it's on the rid home.. > > Read my article in June/July 2004 QST. > > Unless you have a positive thing you are going do, then never mind this > post and do not reply. > > ~Benjamin, KB9LFZ > > > > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > <><>
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage
Some of the "paper repeaters" that are not working and listed on the repeater directory need to be taken down and reassigned as they are just tying up space and if they are not used other than for special event then they need to go the way of the dodo. Peter Summerhawk-N0WRE -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of larryjspamme...@teleport.com Sent: Tuesday, December 16, 2008 2:48 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage Yet there is no end to requests for repeater pairs, especially on 2-Meters. And now, future D-STAR repeater owners seem to have their eye on existing analog repeater pairs, and are making battle plans to get their requests moved up ahead of people already on the waiting list in the local coordination councils - even displacing existing repeaters. Some are already ordering the equipment, sure that they will be moved to the front of the waiting list. At least that seems to be the talk around here in the NW -Original Message- From: Kris Kirby Sent: Dec 16, 2008 1:01 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage On Tue, 16 Dec 2008, Tony L. wrote: > We're continuing to experience a significant drop off in usage of ham > repeaters (all bands) in the Northern NJ area. > > It is not uncommon to find a repeater that has been dormant for > months. > > What's it like in your part of the country? In central Alabama, entirely too quiet. Two meters is normally only used during "drive time", and despite eight 440 machines that cover the city, none are irregularly or regularly used. Seems like we're in the doldrums of ham radio. -- Kris Kirby, KE4AHR mailto:kris%40catonic.us> us> But remember, with no superpowers comes no responsibility. --rly
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage - what are you going to do about it?
Benjamin L. Naber wrote: > For those of you who are really doing all they can, this message is not > for you. It's for those that say they are so busy. So busy with what? > Really, ask yourself, what makes you sooo busy that you cannot get on > the air at home or in the car? Even for five damn minutes? Benjamin -- I think a lot of us do as you do, and get on the air at each opportunity. But if I get on the air on every FM repeater I like to talk to people on (who are scattered across many), link up IRLP to popular places and say hello to other friends, get on the D-STAR system and do the same, fire up 2m SSB and see who's around in THAT group (they rarely get on repeaters, that gang), and also play a little on HF... That's hours a day. Realistically, I get on ONE of those things about once a day... call it five to six times a week. And look for a good conversation or friends to talk to. That means one person can only cover a very small amount of the time a repeater has available to it, each day... so to speak. Every repeater has 86400 seconds a day available to it to provide communications. I can maybe eat up a MAXIMUM on a really long QSO of two hours of KEY DOWN on my part... 7200 of those. It would take 12 people to keep the repeater on-air 24/7 at that rate, every single day. And if I were keying down for that long, I'd be considered a "repeater hog", I'm sure... but that's because the users all show up at generally the same times each day. See below for more on that. If we take out the overnight hours, you need 6 hams actively transmitting that much (which is too much) to have 12 hours of activity. You also need someone around to receive them and reply... and they could be the same people, but that's unlikely. So you probably need about 12 ACTIVE people on every repeater to make it a "busy" system. 12 hams, who talk a lot, every single day. I think the reality is... once you point out that most areas have at least 20 repeaters of some sort, with some kind of coverage in metro areas -- there's so many repeaters, we'll never adequately use the spectrum. Scanning helps. I pop over to other people's repeaters all the time. Luckily there's little in the way of "taboo" in doing this around here. If it's 2AM and I'm driving home and I hear ANY repeater pair (yes, I have ALL of them programmed into one rig) active, I'll either at least listen to the QSO or join in. How many people are bold enough to do that on unknown repeaters? I see it the same as "tuning around on HF"... if you're on-air, I'll talk to you that late at night.) Net's and set "activity times" are almost the only way to find the people interested in what you're interested in. And a lot of people turn off their rigs or go to other repeaters if the topic isn't something THEY are interested in. Interesting math for the number of seconds a repeater has "to give" every day, isn't it, when you break it down to real operators? It's amazing we ever find groups to associate with and stick with them on specific repeaters other than the fact that the real activity tends to "bunch up" around drive time. Most repeaters sit stone silent during the overnight hours, of course. So where is Repeater-Builder going to build an "always on" on-air presence? Does anyone even want to? Will we go crazy with end-user questions about repeaters? (Might be fun, might not...) Anyone willing to "park" somewhere? Nate WY0X
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage - what are you going to do about it?
Paul Plack wrote: > This is an interesting debate. Anyone who builds a repeater finds > satisfaction when it attracts a community of users - "A warm heatsink is > a happy heatsink." But many users seem to favor repeaters with little > traffic, allowing unobtrusive monitoring for their friends. One way to accomodate both is fancy CTCSS schemes, or in the case of D-STAR, the coded squelch features. If you want to hear, you do... if you don't you don't, but you leave the rig on for calls -- which seems to be the important distinction in today's day and age where we have so many "noisemakers" that a lot of people only turn on the rig to make that one call, and then turn it back off. > Low usage is a time bomb in an age of growing demand for bandwidth. IRLP > could be one answer, but the reflectors seem to attract lots of chatter > which isn't very interesting to hear. I've turned the rig off many times > when I heard hams swapping S-meter reports. Hahahah... yes, dumb conversations and GOOD conversations both go with the territory of busy linked systems. Can't avoid it. We recently had some "controversy" here about that, and asked the groups wanting "quiet" and "noise" to split up... different repeaters for the different personality types. Me personally, I'll listen to anything -- if I *really* don't want to listen I know where the OFF button is. But my wife can attest (and maybe this is due to my multi-tasking ways with radios in airplane cockpits for a long time), I can have the commercial broadcast radio on, a ham repeater, a phone call going, and still able to be "interrupt driven" if something more important signals for my attention. (My wife on the other hand, can not... and no matter how hard you shake her, jump up and down, scream or otherwise... if she's on the phone, you can't stop her and update her with updated information for the person who she's talking to. She simply can't do it. You'll end up telling her, "I TRIED TO GET YOUR ATTENTION" and she'll have to call the person back. She wouldn't make a very good 911 dispatcher! GRIN...) > IRLP could be really neat for special interest nets. I've often thought > it would be great to have something equivalent to the old ECARS 40m net > for mobiles. I'd welcome the company when driving long distances at night. Yes, all the linked systems are great for that type of thing but rarely is it done. There are Nets about talking, but few nets about specific technical topics or ham activities on the Reflectors. I always thought the Houston AMSAT Net would be an excellent one to find on both IRLP and EchoLink... if you had enough volunteers around to knock the nodes offline who can't get their keying/ID's right. > I suppose APRS will have to become more fully developed before we'll be > able to easily find nets while transient. APRS is the "continuous net", it's always there on 144.39 in most metropolitan areas -- what do you mean? It's not really designed for a round-table, really. > Perhaps this will be the real "killer app" for D*. A mobile net that > utilizes automated frequency-hopping to work like satellite broadcast > radio on long drives would be awesome. Frequency hopping is easy to do manually, but it doesn't require D-STAR for that... just enough repeaters on the same network/reflector/conference along your route, or capable of being linked as you go. We have truck drivers here in Colorado that link the various IRLP machines together or to a Reflector as they drive around the state late at night... it works fine. That's not a "Net" per se, but there's no reason they couldn't expand it to the "Late Night Truck Drivers Conference", easily... if they wanted to. I've often wondered how to move THIS conversation -- REPEATER Builders/Geeks... to a known meeting place on-air. Wouldn't this discussion be more interesting in person with voices? :-) Nate WY0X
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage - what are you going to do about it?
I think it's time to kiss our little useless things we do on that side and say hello to radio again. After all, what are you *really* accomplishing? For those of you who are really doing all they can, this message is not for you. It's for those that say they are so busy. So busy with what? Really, ask yourself, what makes you sooo busy that you cannot get on the air at home or in the car? Even for five damn minutes? On this military installation, no antennas on the house allowed and handheld in the hole I live in don't make for good TX/RX range. But you bet that every time I get in the car, even at 5:45AM, I put out my callsign. Everytime. If you have an extenuating; roger, got it. But for the rest of you? Get on the air you just give your stuff to someone who will. No reply needed, just roll your sleeves up, get on the air, and do something to get others to follow suit. ~Benjamin, KB9LFZ On Wed, 2008-12-17 at 16:46 -0700, Paul Plack wrote: > This is an interesting debate. Anyone who builds a repeater finds > satisfaction when it attracts a community of users - "A warm heatsink > is a happy heatsink." But many users seem to favor repeaters with > little traffic, allowing unobtrusive monitoring for their friends. > > Low usage is a time bomb in an age of growing demand for bandwidth. > IRLP could be one answer, but the reflectors seem to attract lots of > chatter which isn't very interesting to hear. I've turned the rig off > many times when I heard hams swapping S-meter reports. > > IRLP could be really neat for special interest nets. I've often > thought it would be great to have something equivalent to the old > ECARS 40m net for mobiles. I'd welcome the company when driving long > distances at night. > > I suppose APRS will have to become more fully developed before we'll > be able to easily find nets while transient. > > Perhaps this will be the real "killer app" for D*. A mobile net that > utilizes automated frequency-hopping to work like satellite broadcast > radio on long drives would be awesome. > > 73, > Paul, AE4KR > > > - Original Message - > From: John J. Riddell > To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com > Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2008 4:32 PM > Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage - > what are you going to do about it? > > > Benjamin, > The sparse activity seems to be everywhere.One suggestion > is to > add IRLP to your repeater. When there is no local activity > there always > seems to be someone listening on the various reflectors all > over the world > and you can chat with them. > > Some time back, I was driving to pick up my wife from work at > 7 PM > here in Ontario, and I came across a fellow Ham in Japan who > was also > driving > but it was 7 AM in the morning there. > > IRLP activity would certainly be of interest to anyone > listening to our > Ham repeaters on a scanner and it may just be the "spark" to > get them > interested > in becoming a Ham. > > The inventor of IRLP is a Canadian Ham and is a member of this > list, VE7LTD > > 73 John VE3AMZ (A Ham for 50 years) > Waterloo, Ontario > > - Original Message - > From: "Benjamin L. Naber" > To: > Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2008 5:47 PM > Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage - > what are you > going to do about it? > > > So after reading a few messages, I began to think, what is > each person > > who gets these messages now going to do about it? > > > > I guess you have a few options. > > > > Sit on your butt in front of the idiot box like 90% of all > Americans and > > not do anything but complain. > > -Or- > > Do something about like going attending club meetings and > begin public > > service events. The ARRL has a lot of getting involved with > amateur > > radio. I read it about five years ago and to this day I > still do what I > > can which my military time consuming job allows - I still go > on the air, > > even if it's on the rid home.. > > > > Read my article in June/July 2004 QST. > > > > Unless you have a positive thing you are going do, then > never mind this > > post and do not reply. > > > > ~Benjamin, KB9LFZ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage - what are you going to do about it?
This is an interesting debate. Anyone who builds a repeater finds satisfaction when it attracts a community of users - "A warm heatsink is a happy heatsink." But many users seem to favor repeaters with little traffic, allowing unobtrusive monitoring for their friends. Low usage is a time bomb in an age of growing demand for bandwidth. IRLP could be one answer, but the reflectors seem to attract lots of chatter which isn't very interesting to hear. I've turned the rig off many times when I heard hams swapping S-meter reports. IRLP could be really neat for special interest nets. I've often thought it would be great to have something equivalent to the old ECARS 40m net for mobiles. I'd welcome the company when driving long distances at night. I suppose APRS will have to become more fully developed before we'll be able to easily find nets while transient. Perhaps this will be the real "killer app" for D*. A mobile net that utilizes automated frequency-hopping to work like satellite broadcast radio on long drives would be awesome. 73, Paul, AE4KR - Original Message - From: John J. Riddell To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2008 4:32 PM Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage - what are you going to do about it? Benjamin, The sparse activity seems to be everywhere.One suggestion is to add IRLP to your repeater. When there is no local activity there always seems to be someone listening on the various reflectors all over the world and you can chat with them. Some time back, I was driving to pick up my wife from work at 7 PM here in Ontario, and I came across a fellow Ham in Japan who was also driving but it was 7 AM in the morning there. IRLP activity would certainly be of interest to anyone listening to our Ham repeaters on a scanner and it may just be the "spark" to get them interested in becoming a Ham. The inventor of IRLP is a Canadian Ham and is a member of this list, VE7LTD 73 John VE3AMZ (A Ham for 50 years) Waterloo, Ontario - Original Message - From: "Benjamin L. Naber" To: Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2008 5:47 PM Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage - what are you going to do about it? > So after reading a few messages, I began to think, what is each person > who gets these messages now going to do about it? > > I guess you have a few options. > > Sit on your butt in front of the idiot box like 90% of all Americans and > not do anything but complain. > -Or- > Do something about like going attending club meetings and begin public > service events. The ARRL has a lot of getting involved with amateur > radio. I read it about five years ago and to this day I still do what I > can which my military time consuming job allows - I still go on the air, > even if it's on the rid home.. > > Read my article in June/July 2004 QST. > > Unless you have a positive thing you are going do, then never mind this > post and do not reply. > > ~Benjamin, KB9LFZ > > > > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > >
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage - what are you going to do about it?
Benjamin, The sparse activity seems to be everywhere.One suggestion is to add IRLP to your repeater. When there is no local activity there always seems to be someone listening on the various reflectors all over the world and you can chat with them. Some time back, I was driving to pick up my wife from work at 7 PM here in Ontario, and I came across a fellow Ham in Japan who was also driving but it was 7 AM in the morning there. IRLP activity would certainly be of interest to anyone listening to our Ham repeaters on a scanner and it may just be the "spark" to get them interested in becoming a Ham. The inventor of IRLP is a Canadian Ham and is a member of this list, VE7LTD 73 John VE3AMZ (A Ham for 50 years) Waterloo, Ontario - Original Message - From: "Benjamin L. Naber" To: Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2008 5:47 PM Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage - what are you going to do about it? > So after reading a few messages, I began to think, what is each person > who gets these messages now going to do about it? > > I guess you have a few options. > > Sit on your butt in front of the idiot box like 90% of all Americans and > not do anything but complain. > -Or- > Do something about like going attending club meetings and begin public > service events. The ARRL has a lot of getting involved with amateur > radio. I read it about five years ago and to this day I still do what I > can which my military time consuming job allows - I still go on the air, > even if it's on the rid home.. > > Read my article in June/July 2004 QST. > > Unless you have a positive thing you are going do, then never mind this > post and do not reply. > > ~Benjamin, KB9LFZ > > > > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > >
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage
On Tue, 16 Dec 2008 19:21:13 -0700, you wrote: >The cell phone companies get something like $20/month to numbers well >over $120/month out of you to provide all that infrastructure. Some >large linking systems get $10/month out of all members... that's >probably the highest I've heard of. My little club asks for $25/year, >and we're $5 higher than the "competition" in this area. Some of the repeater systems out here in CA want up to $150/year for a membership, but I don't hear too much traffic on those. The system I use has a voluntary contribution, but I prefer "sweat equity" to money.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage
This probably sounds strange to you, but it is really cool and kind of a turn on that you are a Repeater-Builder. I think you just accidentally started a new joke/meme on the list that will NEVER end, John! I wonder if I can teach my mailer to start all replies with... "X said the following, which is really cool and kind of a turn-on..." Nate WY0X On Dec 16, 2008, at 6:30 PM, JOHN MACKEY wrote: > Sorry > , that was part of a joke meant to go to a friend and not on this > list!! > > -- Original Message -- > Received: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 04:58:37 PM PST > From: "JOHN MACKEY" > To: > Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage > >> This probably sounds strange to you, but it is really cool and kind >> of a >> turn on that you are Irish! >> >> -- Original Message -- >> Received: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 04:22:56 PM PST >> From: "Mike Besemer \(WM4B\)" >> To: >> Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage >> >>> 3 of the 7 coordinated 2-meter repeaters in my area are quite >>> active. 6 > are >>> actually on-the-air. One of the active repeaters is currently >>> getting a >>> facelift which should increase its activity even more. >>> >>> >>> >>> One of the machines I maintain currently runs Echolink and is >>> linked with > a >>> WX-200 weather station to provide real-time weather information. >>> We also >>> run an APRS WX Station from the same site. The repeater is used >>> weekly > for >>> the clubs VHF net and also to provide communications for the >>> Christmas >>> Parade and our Santa Patrol. We are also beginning to get a group >>> that > is >>> interested in storm spotting, so expect we'll have a good >>> spotters net >> next >>> year. This machine will soon be linked to our other machine, >>> about 25 >> miles >>> away, providing us with some wider-area coverage and allowing our >>> ARES >>> organizations from several counties to team up. I'd also like to >>> have a >>> 2-meter remote base for the WX Spotters so they can link to >>> cooperating >> (but >>> not member) systems in the outlying areas to help fill in some >>> holes. >>> >>> >>> >>> Generally, there is somebody listening 24-7. Obviously drive-time >>> is the >>> busiest, but there is activity all day from about 0600 - 2300 or so. > I've >>> been using my computer to record repeater traffic for the past >>> several >>> weeks, and I have good evidence to show that we have good activity >>> for > the >>> majority of the day. >>> >>> >>> >>> We do have several advantages. We're close to I-75 and we run no PL > tone, >>> so it's easy for passers-by to access us. We also are host to >>> Robins Air >>> Force Base, the single largest employer in the State of Georgia, >>> so even >>> through we're a small town, we get a lot of visitors and newcomers. >>> >>> >>> >>> Yes. there are some inactive systems here, but everybody >>> cooperates and > if >>> we have an outage of one of the main systems, the backups fill in >>> the > gaps. >>> >>> >>> >>> 73, >>> >>> >>> >>> Mike >>> >>> WM4B >>> >>> >>> >>> From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com >>> [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tony L. >>> Sent: Tuesday, December 16, 2008 2:45 PM >>> To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com >>> Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage >>> >>> >>> >>> We're continuing to experience a significant drop off in usage of >>> ham >>> repeaters (all bands) in the Northern NJ area. >>> >>> It is not uncommon to find a repeater that has been dormant for >>> months. >>> >>> What's it like in your part of the country? >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> > > > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > -- Nate Duehr n...@natetech.com
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage
On Dec 16, 2008, at 3:53 PM, Jacob Suter wrote: > I personally don't see much future in amateur radio in its current > path. I > personally don't think d-star is going to magically adjust the > path. What > we need is something that's socially acceptable in 2008. Squawkbox > HTs > don't cut it. You need trunking, smart roaming, full duplex with echo > canceling, and a proper control system that includes not having to > verbally > repeat your callsign like a kid with Tourettes syndrome. That's called a cell phone. :-) As far as repeating your callsign, when the other guy asks, ask him if he's going to send a QSL card? If not, only you need to know it... get on with the conversation. Stop ID'ing at the end of every over, and have fun. LOL! All of the things you're wanting are possible, but at GREAT expense. How much are you willing to put into your local club? Hell any technical problem is "fixable" with enough money. The Fed even got the stock market to make another dead-cat bounce today by dropping interest rates so low you can't see them anymore with a microscope. (GRIN) (The cell phone companies get something like $20/month to numbers well over $120/month out of you to provide all that infrastructure. Some large linking systems get $10/month out of all members... that's probably the highest I've heard of. My little club asks for $25/year, and we're $5 higher than the "competition" in this area.) As far as the D-STAR thing goes, have you tried it? It's pretty damn cool... once you've figured out how to operate. There isn't a single other digital 2-way radio system in the world with as much reach Internationally. Analog... yeah more repeaters capable of being linked, but less control on the quality of the link and as you say -- who wants to do old analog stuff anyway? :-) We have to maintain the infrastructure for a while, but if hams want to move forward, we have to start acting like it by buying new gear... if D-STAR's what it is today, so be it. Maybe some folks will figure out Amateur P25 linking tomorrow. Maybe something new will come along after that. But if we show no appetite for anything but $150 cheap VHF HT's -- that's what we'll get. (And are getting.) -- Nate Duehr, WY0X n...@natetech.com
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage
Sorry, that was part of a joke meant to go to a friend and not on this list!! -- Original Message -- Received: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 04:58:37 PM PST From: "JOHN MACKEY" To: Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage > This probably sounds strange to you, but it is really cool and kind of a > turn on that you are Irish! > > -- Original Message -- > Received: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 04:22:56 PM PST > From: "Mike Besemer \(WM4B\)" > To: > Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage > > > 3 of the 7 coordinated 2-meter repeaters in my area are quite active. 6 are > > actually on-the-air. One of the active repeaters is currently getting a > > facelift which should increase its activity even more. > > > > > > > > One of the machines I maintain currently runs Echolink and is linked with a > > WX-200 weather station to provide real-time weather information. We also > > run an APRS WX Station from the same site. The repeater is used weekly for > > the clubs VHF net and also to provide communications for the Christmas > > Parade and our Santa Patrol. We are also beginning to get a group that is > > interested in storm spotting, so expect we'll have a good spotters net > next > > year. This machine will soon be linked to our other machine, about 25 > miles > > away, providing us with some wider-area coverage and allowing our ARES > > organizations from several counties to team up. I'd also like to have a > > 2-meter remote base for the WX Spotters so they can link to cooperating > (but > > not member) systems in the outlying areas to help fill in some holes. > > > > > > > > Generally, there is somebody listening 24-7. Obviously drive-time is the > > busiest, but there is activity all day from about 0600 - 2300 or so. I've > > been using my computer to record repeater traffic for the past several > > weeks, and I have good evidence to show that we have good activity for the > > majority of the day. > > > > > > > > We do have several advantages. We're close to I-75 and we run no PL tone, > > so it's easy for passers-by to access us. We also are host to Robins Air > > Force Base, the single largest employer in the State of Georgia, so even > > through we're a small town, we get a lot of visitors and newcomers. > > > > > > > > Yes. there are some inactive systems here, but everybody cooperates and if > > we have an outage of one of the main systems, the backups fill in the gaps. > > > > > > > > 73, > > > > > > > > Mike > > > > WM4B > > > > > > > > From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com > > [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tony L. > > Sent: Tuesday, December 16, 2008 2:45 PM > > To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com > > Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage > > > > > > > > We're continuing to experience a significant drop off in usage of ham > > repeaters (all bands) in the Northern NJ area. > > > > It is not uncommon to find a repeater that has been dormant for months. > > > > What's it like in your part of the country? > > > > > > > > > > > >
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage
This probably sounds strange to you, but it is really cool and kind of a turn on that you are Irish! -- Original Message -- Received: Tue, 16 Dec 2008 04:22:56 PM PST From: "Mike Besemer \(WM4B\)" To: Subject: RE: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage > 3 of the 7 coordinated 2-meter repeaters in my area are quite active. 6 are > actually on-the-air. One of the active repeaters is currently getting a > facelift which should increase its activity even more. > > > > One of the machines I maintain currently runs Echolink and is linked with a > WX-200 weather station to provide real-time weather information. We also > run an APRS WX Station from the same site. The repeater is used weekly for > the clubs VHF net and also to provide communications for the Christmas > Parade and our Santa Patrol. We are also beginning to get a group that is > interested in storm spotting, so expect we'll have a good spotters net next > year. This machine will soon be linked to our other machine, about 25 miles > away, providing us with some wider-area coverage and allowing our ARES > organizations from several counties to team up. I'd also like to have a > 2-meter remote base for the WX Spotters so they can link to cooperating (but > not member) systems in the outlying areas to help fill in some holes. > > > > Generally, there is somebody listening 24-7. Obviously drive-time is the > busiest, but there is activity all day from about 0600 - 2300 or so. I've > been using my computer to record repeater traffic for the past several > weeks, and I have good evidence to show that we have good activity for the > majority of the day. > > > > We do have several advantages. We're close to I-75 and we run no PL tone, > so it's easy for passers-by to access us. We also are host to Robins Air > Force Base, the single largest employer in the State of Georgia, so even > through we're a small town, we get a lot of visitors and newcomers. > > > > Yes. there are some inactive systems here, but everybody cooperates and if > we have an outage of one of the main systems, the backups fill in the gaps. > > > > 73, > > > > Mike > > WM4B > > > > From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com > [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tony L. > Sent: Tuesday, December 16, 2008 2:45 PM > To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com > Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage > > > > We're continuing to experience a significant drop off in usage of ham > repeaters (all bands) in the Northern NJ area. > > It is not uncommon to find a repeater that has been dormant for months. > > What's it like in your part of the country? > > > >
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage
3 of the 7 coordinated 2-meter repeaters in my area are quite active. 6 are actually on-the-air. One of the active repeaters is currently getting a facelift which should increase its activity even more. One of the machines I maintain currently runs Echolink and is linked with a WX-200 weather station to provide real-time weather information. We also run an APRS WX Station from the same site. The repeater is used weekly for the clubs VHF net and also to provide communications for the Christmas Parade and our Santa Patrol. We are also beginning to get a group that is interested in storm spotting, so expect we'll have a good spotters net next year. This machine will soon be linked to our other machine, about 25 miles away, providing us with some wider-area coverage and allowing our ARES organizations from several counties to team up. I'd also like to have a 2-meter remote base for the WX Spotters so they can link to cooperating (but not member) systems in the outlying areas to help fill in some holes. Generally, there is somebody listening 24-7. Obviously drive-time is the busiest, but there is activity all day from about 0600 - 2300 or so. I've been using my computer to record repeater traffic for the past several weeks, and I have good evidence to show that we have good activity for the majority of the day. We do have several advantages. We're close to I-75 and we run no PL tone, so it's easy for passers-by to access us. We also are host to Robins Air Force Base, the single largest employer in the State of Georgia, so even through we're a small town, we get a lot of visitors and newcomers. Yes. there are some inactive systems here, but everybody cooperates and if we have an outage of one of the main systems, the backups fill in the gaps. 73, Mike WM4B From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Tony L. Sent: Tuesday, December 16, 2008 2:45 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage We're continuing to experience a significant drop off in usage of ham repeaters (all bands) in the Northern NJ area. It is not uncommon to find a repeater that has been dormant for months. What's it like in your part of the country? <><>
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage
In Western New York State I'd say activity dropped off back in the 80's but then stayed at that level. Chuck WB2EDV - Original Message - From: "Tony L." To: Sent: Tuesday, December 16, 2008 2:44 PM Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage > We're continuing to experience a significant drop off in usage of ham > repeaters (all bands) in the Northern NJ area. > > It is not uncommon to find a repeater that has been dormant for months. > > What's it like in your part of the country? >
RE: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage
Here in East Texas (near Crockett to be exact) I have to use APRS to see if my 2m antenna/rig still works. I'm RX only (no license) so I can't see if the area's listed repeaters actually still work. My old Kenwood TR7400A doesn't have PL anyways :) One of these days I'll get around to taking the test. It's depressing when the only local ham radio group in the county's weekly net only has 4 check-ins. I personally don't see much future in amateur radio in its current path. I personally don't think d-star is going to magically adjust the path. What we need is something that's socially acceptable in 2008. Squawkbox HTs don't cut it. You need trunking, smart roaming, full duplex with echo canceling, and a proper control system that includes not having to verbally repeat your callsign like a kid with Tourettes syndrome. Basically, what I'm suggesting here is an (inter)national trunking system, similar to a cellular system with a local conference method, and using (logically) the internet (or at least IP) as its backbone. No more dinking around with echolink, no more begging to use an autopatch, no coordination problems since this would logically include AFS and TPC. Imagine *just* the public safety/emergency uses? No more "sorry bill, didn't mean to key up on top of you" issues. Look at your cell phone. It's cute, it's stupid, but it sure is damned useful and easy to use. Also, they're attractive enough to draw almost 50% of the world population. Why haven't hams taken the *next* step in this direction? IDEN without the IDUH? Come on, who's with me? [ducking shots from cellcos and cellco vendors] JS > -Original Message- > From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto:Repeater- > buil...@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Kris Kirby > Sent: Tuesday, December 16, 2008 3:01 PM > To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com > Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage > > On Tue, 16 Dec 2008, Tony L. wrote: > > We're continuing to experience a significant drop off in usage of ham > > repeaters (all bands) in the Northern NJ area. > > > > It is not uncommon to find a repeater that has been dormant for > > months. > > > > What's it like in your part of the country? > > In central Alabama, entirely too quiet. Two meters is normally only used > during "drive time", and despite eight 440 machines that cover the city, > none are irregularly or regularly used. Seems like we're in the doldrums > of ham radio. > > -- > Kris Kirby, KE4AHR > But remember, with no superpowers comes no responsibility. > --rly > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > >
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage
larryjspamme...@teleport.com wrote: > Yet there is no end to requests for repeater pairs, especially on > 2-Meters. And now, future D-STAR repeater owners seem to have their eye > on existing analog repeater pairs, and are making battle plans to get > their requests moved up ahead of people already on the waiting list in > the local coordination councils - even displacing existing repeaters. > Some are already ordering the equipment, sure that they will be moved to > the front of the waiting list. At least that seems to be the talk around > here in the NW So you told us all about coordination activity, but not on-air activity, which was his question, Larry. :-) Are people USING all of those repeaters up there? Who cares what they're coordinating (or have had coordinated for 20 years)? (I heard from a good friend who was in the Seattle area that he was commonly able to use some large repeater system -- where he and his wife chatted on it regularly for as long as they wanted, because no one else was around or seemed to reply to his requests for anyone to jump in, after leaving breaks, etc. Sounds dead.) Around here, we have some "anchor" systems that have regular Nets and users on them, and some that have no Nets and are the hang-outs of the "non-organization" type hams. Activity does seem to be down a bit this summer, even during drive-time, but late evening at least a couple of our club's machines keep talking. We've always been known as the "ragchew" club, so that probably helps our overall activity levels at all times. I actively tell people to FEEL FREE to stay on the repeater, when they say they can work each other SSB or FM simplex... even though I'm a VHF SSB nut too. Linked systems are more active than non-linked in general -- doesn't seem to matter the linking technology in use... RF, IRLP, EchoLink, a combination. Hams are more "scattered" throughout our large Metro area than ever, and easy coverage and access for HT's looks like it'll be the challenge for the next few years. But as we linked many of the VHF systems, the "standalone" UHF systems gained in popularity as a "more private" (I guess?) place for regular chats between friends. So we kinda have stuck a balance, whether on purpose or by accident, I don't know. Maybe it's time to start playing with voters and simulcast, even though the repeaters here often have a line of sight of 70 miles... the issue is wimpy HT signals, not the coverage area for anyone with a reasonable antenna/signal, nowadays. Newer users want repeaters with coverage that makes the repeater as "convenient" to use as a cell phone, basically. They don't realize they're making the comparison in their heads, but they are. They don't want to buy mobile rigs, nor mount them in modern vehicles. They want a pico-watt HT in a pocket that works "everywhere". Next, they want it to cover a bejillion miles with linked repeaters... that ALSO have great receivers and or multiple receivers... so they have plenty of people to talk to. That's all strategic "stuff" for us all to think about as we plan your repeater projects for 2009... Also when "times are hard", just like the banking industry -- hams might think about merging some of the clubs/organizations in an area, taking down "duplicated effort" repeaters, and using the spare parts to accomplish the above voting/simulcast goals. Interesting, wouldn't it be? Nate WY0X
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Amateur Radio Repeater Usage
On Tue, 16 Dec 2008, Tony L. wrote: > We're continuing to experience a significant drop off in usage of ham > repeaters (all bands) in the Northern NJ area. > > It is not uncommon to find a repeater that has been dormant for > months. > > What's it like in your part of the country? In central Alabama, entirely too quiet. Two meters is normally only used during "drive time", and despite eight 440 machines that cover the city, none are irregularly or regularly used. Seems like we're in the doldrums of ham radio. -- Kris Kirby, KE4AHR But remember, with no superpowers comes no responsibility. --rly
