Re: Advice requested: tape system
At 10:43 -0400 9/18/00, Church Initiative WebMaster wrote: Also, in Graham's chart, the VXA V-17 media (33 gig native) is listed at $67. Anyone know where I can find it at this price? The best that I've found so far is ~72.50 http://www.egghead.com/category/inv/00074283/03276001.htm broken link. Can't find VXA tape anywhere on their site. -- -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Ben Liberman -- -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ For urgent issues, please contact Dantz technical support directly at [EMAIL PROTECTED] or 925.253.3050.
RE: Advice requested: tape system
Call my account rep, Skip Heeman at CDW and tell him I sent you and he'll sell you the VXA tapes for $67. Ask for CDW part# 204732. Here's his contact info: Skip Heeman [EMAIL PROTECTED] (877) 780-7017 -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Ben Liberman Sent: Tuesday, September 26, 2000 10:17 AM To: retro-talk Subject: Re: Advice requested: tape system At 10:43 -0400 9/18/00, Church Initiative WebMaster wrote: Also, in Graham's chart, the VXA V-17 media (33 gig native) is listed at $67. Anyone know where I can find it at this price? The best that I've found so far is ~72.50 http://www.egghead.com/category/inv/00074283/03276001.htm broken link. Can't find VXA tape anywhere on their site. -- -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Ben Liberman -- -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ For urgent issues, please contact Dantz technical support directly at [EMAIL PROTECTED] or 925.253.3050. -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ For urgent issues, please contact Dantz technical support directly at [EMAIL PROTECTED] or 925.253.3050.
Advice requested: tape system
Hi I've been using Retrospect very successfully for some while now, backing up our small Mac LAN to recordable CDs. However our company has grown some over time and the use of CD-R is no longer a real option as it takes too long to do a full backup of the 30GB or so of data on the LAN. I am therefore looking for an economical, reliable tape based solution that can handle the job. There seem to be many different ysstems available on the market, but rather than wade through a pile of manufacturer misinformation I thought I would come straight to the horse's mouth, so to speak. What works? Any help or pointers that fellow list-users might be able to offer will be gratefully received. Regards Graham Graham Mitchell Total Coverage Limited the co-operative design consultancy T: 023 8067 8330 F: 023 8067 8340 E: [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.totalcoverage.co.uk -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Advice requested: tape system
However our company has grown some over time and the use of CD-R is no longer a real option as it takes too long to do a full backup of the 30GB or so of data on the LAN. I like VXA. Tapes hold 33 MB before compression, although I haven't hit that level on my home network -- probably due to slow 6100s and Quadras not able to send data fast enough. Cost for the drive ranges from $600 to $1200+, depending on the deal you manage to find. Tapes are $80 each. At work, we use AIT, which has a native capacity of 25 GB and averages about 35 GB compressed. AIT seems to work better backing up older, slower Macs on the network. I've never run *under* the tapes rated capacity, as I did with my first VXA tape at home. Cost of drives is much higher ($2000+). Tapes are about $80, also. I have no experience with DLT. Dan Knight, IS manager/webmaster [EMAIL PROTECTED] Baker Book House Company http://www.bakerbooks.com 6030 East Fulton 616-676-9185 x146 Ada, Michigan 49301 fax 616-676-9573 Macs for productivity, Unix for stability, Windows for solitaire -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Advice requested: tape system
At 8:58 AM +0100 9/18/00, Graham, Total Coverage Limited wrote: Hi I've been using Retrospect very successfully for some while now, backing up our small Mac LAN to recordable CDs. However our company has grown some over time and the use of CD-R is no longer a real option as it takes too long to do a full backup of the 30GB or so of data on the LAN. I am therefore looking for an economical, reliable tape based solution that can handle the job. There seem to be many different ysstems available on the market, but rather than wade through a pile of manufacturer misinformation I thought I would come straight to the horse's mouth, so to speak. What works? Any help or pointers that fellow list-users might be able to offer will be gratefully received. This is from a previous post on the list, from the beginning of August. I hope this helps, and I hope Larry (and the list) doesn't mind my reposting... At 1:36 AM -0700 8/3/00, Larry Acosta Wong wrote: I've added the two OnStream drives (ADR50 and SC30) in the internal SCSI configurations (wide connector if available). I've listed the pricing I can get to keep the comparison prices consistent. Steve Rothman, the Eliant 820 is an Exabyte drive utilizing an 8mm helical scan tape. The VXA-1 media $/GB price is also actually a bit higher than you calculated Media $/GB --- Exabyte M2: 60GB, 12MB/s, $3777 ($80 media) 1.33 Sony AIT-2: 50GB, 6MB/s, $3289 ($94 media) 1.88 DLT 8000 : 40GB, 6MB/s, $3915 ($64 media) 1.60 Sony AIT-1: 35GB, 3MB/s, $1913 ($88 media) 2.51 VXA-1 : 33GB, 3MB/s, $939 ($67 media) 2.03 ADR50 : 25GB, 2MB/s, $697 ($46 media) 1.84 DDS-4 : 20GB, 3MB/s, $1072 ($33 media) 1.65 Mammoth : 20GB, 3MB/s, $2126 ($56 media) 2.80 DLT 4000 : 20GB, 1.5MB/s, $1352 ($64 media) 3.20 SC30 : 15GB, 2MB/S, $438 ($41 media) 2.73 Mammoth-LT: 14GB, 2MB/s, $1193 ($35 media) 2.50 DDS-3 : 12GB, 1MB/s, $777 ($16 media) 1.33 Eliant 820: 7GB, 1MB/s, $1160 ( $8 media) 1.14 DDS-2 : 4GB, .51MB/s, $606 ( $7 media) 1.75 -Native capacity listed, compressed capacity is typically 50% more -Sustained transfer rate listed -Cost is based on internal model with wide SCSI connector (if available) -VXA-1 tape drive is even cheaper through Ecrix July promo ($539) -Media listed is highest capacity format in single packs Here's how I personally chose which tape drive to go with: The way I figure, in order, the most important factors regarding the tape backup system are: 1. Reliability 2. Performance 3. Ease 4. Cost Some of these items will be in different order for other people but I think that reliability is always the most important factor in a backup. (To stress my point, substitute the word "parachute" for "backup." I'm sure you'll always choose the most reliable parachute over any other.) Reliability: The key feature with a backup is the ability to restore data and no tape system is 100% problem-free. But, only Ecrix makes these ridiculous durability claims and actually backs it up with extreme torture tests (boiling freezing tapes). This is what really got my attention on the VXA drives. Performance: You need to backup your users in the shortest amount of time possible. If it takes you more than one night to create a full backup, some users will go more than a day between backups thus reducing your backup system's effectiveness. Plus, the less you inconvenience your users, the less likely they'll keep "snoozing" Retrospect when it starts a backup. But with a fast tape drive you'll need a fast network and fast clients. Watch for the bottleneck. Ease: higher capacity tapes reduce the amount of tape swapping that needs to happen during a backup or restore. If it takes 5 tapes to perform a full backup, then it'll take 5 nights before the full backup is done and the first incremental backup can take place meaning that some people will go 5 days between their full and incremental backups. Ideally, a full backup will fit on a single tape or you'll have an autoloader. Cost: lower = good but when computing the cost per GB, you must factor in the cost of the tape drive as well. $7 media sounds really appealing but weigh in drive cost, performance and storage capacity. Below, I've computed actual cost per GB for my test scenario of 100GB total to backup, 3 storage sets. Tran#Tapes Total True Model (GB) RatePrice Media Req'd Price $/GB --- VXA-1 333MB/s$539 $6712 $1,343 $3.39 DDS-3 121MB/s$777 $1627 $1,209 $3.73 DDS-24 .51MB/s$606 $775 $1,131 $3.77 SC30152MB/s$438 $4121 $1,299 $4.12 ADR50 252MB/s$697 $4612 $1,249 $4.16 VXA-1
Re: Advice requested: tape system
At 8:58 AM +0100 9/18/00, Graham, Total Coverage Limited wrote: For this comparison, I've included the VXA-1 at the promotional price since it's been extended through Aug and is available to everyone. The VXA promotion has been extended through Sept. http://www.vxa.com/eval/index.cfm?a=834p=aff Also, in Graham's chart, the VXA V-17 media (33 gig native) is listed at $67. Anyone know where I can find it at this price? The best that I've found so far is ~72.50 -- -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Ben Liberman -- -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Advice requested: tape system
Graham Mitchell said: I am therefore looking for an economical, reliable tape based solution that can handle the job. I've read discussions about using IDE drives. You can get 40 GB drives for around $200. At that price, you can get five drives, use one to write your backups to and then swap it out replacing it with the next hard drive. I imagine that on Windoze you could even arrange for them to be hot swap-able. I imagine it would be pretty fast, too. EZ -- Eric Zylstra [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Advice requested: tape system
Also, in Graham's chart, the VXA V-17 media (33 gig native) is listed at $67. Anyone know where I can find it at this price? The best that I've found so far is ~72.50 http://www.egghead.com/category/inv/00074283/03276001.htm Stiles Watson Director of Information Services The Church Initiative, Inc. www.churchinitiative.org www.divorcecare.org www.griefshare.org -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
RE: Advice requested: tape system
The VXA promotion has indeed been extended through September, but is not available to our friends in the U.K.: limited to US and Canada only, since it's a direct-sales promotion through the web store, and we don't (yet!) sell in Europe. We're working on it. Egghead offers a great price right now on V17 tapes, and I haven't checked but some of the other e-tailers may be matching them. Thanks for recommending our drive!!! Geoff Rainville Ecrix Corp. -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Ben Liberman Sent: Monday, September 18, 2000 7:58 AM To: retro-talk Subject: Re: Advice requested: tape system At 8:58 AM +0100 9/18/00, Graham, Total Coverage Limited wrote: For this comparison, I've included the VXA-1 at the promotional price since it's been extended through Aug and is available to everyone. The VXA promotion has been extended through Sept. http://www.vxa.com/eval/index.cfm?a=834p=aff Also, in Graham's chart, the VXA V-17 media (33 gig native) is listed at $67. Anyone know where I can find it at this price? The best that I've found so far is ~72.50 -- -- [EMAIL PROTECTED] Ben Liberman -- -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Advice requested: tape system
I like VXA. Tapes hold 33 MB before compression, I'd be changing tapes every 3 seconds!!:) typo. Should be GB. -- -- To subscribe:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Archives:http://list.working-dogs.com/lists/retro-talk/ Problems?: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
