Re: [silk] India's dangerous capitalism
On Wed, May 16, 2012 at 8:55 PM, Srini RamaKrishnan che...@gmail.com wrote: I would recommend reading this along with this 40 minute interview with Sainath http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q5xNyomuf6Y http://dawn.com/2012/03/18/capitalism-a-ghost-story-2/ Capitalism: A Ghost Story Arundhati Roy | 18th March, 2012 Is it a house or a home? A temple to the new India, or a warehouse for its ghosts? Ever since Antilla arrived on Altamount Road in Mumbai, exuding mystery and quiet menace, things have not been the same. “Here we are,” the friend who took me there said “Pay your respects to our new Ruler.” why just india, shes talking about the whole planet. but its meandering verbiage i found it hard to read beyond paragraph 10. she should commit suicide right now.
Re: [silk] India's dangerous capitalism
On Thu, May 17, 2012 at 3:04 PM, ashok _ listmans...@gmail.com wrote: meandering verbiage i found it hard to read beyond paragraph 10. she should commit suicide right now. I actually started reading it then got lost. Does she always write like this? Venkat
Re: [silk] In London
On Wed, May 16, 2012 at 5:18 PM, Dinesh Venkateswaran dinesh.mad...@gmail.com wrote: Not in town on friday. How about thursday or late evening saturday? I leave London late evening Saturday. But can change plans if enough people turn up for a Saturday meeting. C
Re: [silk] In London
I can do Saturday, if that's what the majority prefers. From: Chandrachoodan Gopalakrishnan chandrachoo...@gmail.com To: silklist@lists.hserus.net Sent: Thursday, May 17, 2012 2:06 PM Subject: Re: [silk] In London On Wed, May 16, 2012 at 5:18 PM, Dinesh Venkateswaran dinesh.mad...@gmail.com wrote: Not in town on friday. How about thursday or late evening saturday? I leave London late evening Saturday. But can change plans if enough people turn up for a Saturday meeting. C
Re: [silk] India's dangerous capitalism
I actually started reading it then got lost. Does she always write like this? Yes, she does. Her writing defies parody because really, who could possibly out-do her own stock of entitled, delusional, condescending, endlessly recycled, logic-defying, inane rhetoric? The State is evil! Check. Sinister Global capitalist forces (of Indian origin)! Check. Vast Right-Wing Media conspiracy! Check. A few things in the article are worth giggling over - she now describes herself as part of the Indian middle class. The same middle class that in the world of Arundhati Roy as recently as last year were 'incredibly hostile, abusive, and dangerous' to her. Apparently, the pernicious, reality-challenged middle class in India were a privileged lot who had 'seceded to outer space' and were disconnected to everything but 'their own andolan, their own Jessica Lal, their own media, their own controversies'. In other words, people who choose to rally around anything other than Arundhati's chosen andolans, media and controversies are detached from reality. The worst part? She is such a terrible, disingenuous pseudo-intellectual that it makes me cringe when she espouses a cause that I care about. (It happens frequently). I'd rather not have my issues advocated for so ineptly. cheers Divya
Re: [silk] India's dangerous capitalism
Amen to that post that, Divya. Sent from BlackBerry® on Airtel -Original Message- From: Divya Sampath divyasamp...@yahoo.com Sender: silklist-bounces+nikhil.mehra773=gmail@lists.hserus.net Date: Thu, 17 May 2012 12:01:28 To: silklist@lists.hserus.netsilklist@lists.hserus.net Reply-To: silklist@lists.hserus.net Subject: Re: [silk] India's dangerous capitalism I actually started reading it then got lost. Does she always write like this? Yes, she does. Her writing defies parody because really, who could possibly out-do her own stock of entitled, delusional, condescending, endlessly recycled, logic-defying, inane rhetoric? The State is evil! Check. Sinister Global capitalist forces (of Indian origin)! Check. Vast Right-Wing Media conspiracy! Check. A few things in the article are worth giggling over - she now describes herself as part of the Indian middle class. The same middle class that in the world of Arundhati Roy as recently as last year were 'incredibly hostile, abusive, and dangerous' to her. Apparently, the pernicious, reality-challenged middle class in India were a privileged lot who had 'seceded to outer space' and were disconnected to everything but 'their own andolan, their own Jessica Lal, their own media, their own controversies'. In other words, people who choose to rally around anything other than Arundhati's chosen andolans, media and controversies are detached from reality. The worst part? She is such a terrible, disingenuous pseudo-intellectual that it makes me cringe when she espouses a cause that I care about. (It happens frequently). I'd rather not have my issues advocated for so ineptly. cheers Divya
Re: [silk] India's dangerous capitalism
Sent from my iPad On May 18, 2012, at 12:34 AM, Nikhil Mehra nikhil.mehra...@gmail.com wrote: Amen to that post that, Divya. Sent from BlackBerry® on Airtel From: Divya Sampath divyasamp...@yahoo.com Sender: silklist-bounces+nikhil.mehra773=gmail@lists.hserus.net Date: Thu, 17 May 2012 12:01:28 -0700 (PDT) To: silklist@lists.hserus.netsilklist@lists.hserus.net ReplyTo: silklist@lists.hserus.net Subject: Re: [silk] India's dangerous capitalism I actually started reading it then got lost. Does she always write like this? Yes, she does. Her writing defies parody because really, who could possibly out-do her own stock of entitled, delusional, condescending, endlessly recycled, logic-defying, inane rhetoric? The State is evil! Check. Sinister Global capitalist forces (of Indian origin)! Check. Vast Right-Wing Media conspiracy! Check. A few things in the article are worth giggling over - she now describes herself as part of the Indian middle class. The same middle class that in the world of Arundhati Roy as recently as last year were 'incredibly hostile, abusive, and dangerous' to her. Apparently, the pernicious, reality-challenged middle class in India were a privileged lot who had 'seceded to outer space' and were disconnected to everything but 'their own andolan, their own Jessica Lal, their own media, their own controversies'. In other words, people who choose to rally around anything other than Arundhati's chosen andolans, media and controversies are detached from reality. The worst part? She is such a terrible, disingenuous pseudo-intellectual that it makes me cringe when she espouses a cause that I care about. (It happens frequently). I'd rather not have my issues advocated for so ineptly. cheers Divya She's a double-barreled menace. She hijacks issues, and permanently skews them with her high-decibel manifestos, and she also manages to attract right wing troglodytes in massive numbers, forcing people to defend her right to free speech rather than presenting the merits of the original issues involved.
Re: [silk] India's dangerous capitalism
I just now managed to read the whole thing -- apart from not making much sense it makes some incomprehensible assertions like this one: A similar coup was carried out in the anti-apartheid struggle in South Africa. In 1978 the Rockefeller Foundation organized a Study Commission on US Policy toward Southern Africa. The report warned of the growing influence of the Soviet Union on the ANC and said that US strategic and corporate interests (i.e., access to South Africa’s minerals) would be best served if there were genuine sharing of political power by all races. The Foundations began to support the ANC. The ANC soon turned on the more radical organizations like Steve Biko’s Black Consciousness movement and more or less eliminated it. When Nelson Mandela took over as South Africa’s first Black President, he was canonized as a living saint, not just because he is a freedom fighter who spent twenty-seven years in prison, but also because he deferred completely to the Washington Consensus. That is such a ridiculous argument given that steve biko spent most of his time under house arrest and in prison (like the ANC leaders ) and died in police custody ! Apparently people are incapable of making any choices that may benefit them and will always make the wrong ones (be they an indian farmer ...or someone living under apartheid ) . On Thu, May 17, 2012 at 12:34 PM, ashok _ listmans...@gmail.com wrote: On Wed, May 16, 2012 at 8:55 PM, Srini RamaKrishnan che...@gmail.com wrote: I would recommend reading this along with this 40 minute interview with Sainath http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q5xNyomuf6Y http://dawn.com/2012/03/18/capitalism-a-ghost-story-2/ Capitalism: A Ghost Story Arundhati Roy | 18th March, 2012 Is it a house or a home? A temple to the new India, or a warehouse for its ghosts? Ever since Antilla arrived on Altamount Road in Mumbai, exuding mystery and quiet menace, things have not been the same. “Here we are,” the friend who took me there said “Pay your respects to our new Ruler.” why just india, shes talking about the whole planet. but its meandering verbiage i found it hard to read beyond paragraph 10. she should commit suicide right now.
Re: [silk] India's dangerous capitalism
On Wednesday 16 May 2012 at 11:25 PM, Srini RamaKrishnan wrote: I would recommend reading this along with this 40 minute interview with Sainath http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q5xNyomuf6Y http://dawn.com/2012/03/18/capitalism-a-ghost-story-2/ Capitalism: A Ghost Story Arundhati Roy | 18th March, 2012 Is it a house or a home? A temple to the new India, or a warehouse for its ghosts? Ever since Antilla arrived on Altamount Road in Mumbai, exuding mystery and quiet menace, things have not been the same. “Here we are,” the friend who took me there said “Pay your respects to our new Ruler.” Couldn't get through this. But I did go through Aakar Patel's response to it: http://www.outlookindia.com/article.aspx?280609 Venky.
Re: [silk] India's dangerous capitalism
Probably the best sort of response is one that deconstructs her arguments and makes them look foolish You know, the way sokal etc debunked science studies What can be used to debunk baudrillard and derrida can be quite effectively used here --Original Message-- From: Venky Sender: silklist-bounces+suresh=hserus@lists.hserus.net To: silklist@lists.hserus.net ReplyTo: silklist@lists.hserus.net Subject: Re: [silk] India's dangerous capitalism Sent: May 18, 2012 02:50 On Wednesday 16 May 2012 at 11:25 PM, Srini RamaKrishnan wrote: I would recommend reading this along with this 40 minute interview with Sainath http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q5xNyomuf6Y http://dawn.com/2012/03/18/capitalism-a-ghost-story-2/ Capitalism: A Ghost Story Arundhati Roy | 18th March, 2012 Is it a house or a home? A temple to the new India, or a warehouse for its ghosts? Ever since Antilla arrived on Altamount Road in Mumbai, exuding mystery and quiet menace, things have not been the same. “Here we are,” the friend who took me there said “Pay your respects to our new Ruler.” Couldn't get through this. But I did go through Aakar Patel's response to it: http://www.outlookindia.com/article.aspx?280609 Venky. -- srs (blackberry)
Re: [silk] India's dangerous capitalism
http://www.firstpost.com/living/reading-arundhati-roy-the-high-price-of-toxic-rage-251377.html What to me seemed like a sensible response to Roy's essay. Sruthi
Re: [silk] India's dangerous capitalism
Saw that one, fantastic article. -Original Message- From: silklist-bounces+suresh=hserus@lists.hserus.net [mailto:silklist- bounces+suresh=hserus@lists.hserus.net] On Behalf Of Sruthi Krishnan Sent: 18 May 2012 10:30 To: silklist@lists.hserus.net Subject: Re: [silk] India's dangerous capitalism http://www.firstpost.com/living/reading-arundhati-roy-the-high-price-of- toxic-rage-251377.html What to me seemed like a sensible response to Roy's essay. Sruthi
Re: [silk] India's dangerous capitalism
On 18/05/12 18-May-2012;10:32 AM, Suresh Ramasubramanian wrote: Saw that one, fantastic article. http://www.firstpost.com/living/reading-arundhati-roy-the-high-price-of- toxic-rage-251377.html What to me seemed like a sensible response to Roy's essay. Sruthi I'm not sure I agree, with either Suresh or Sruthi. The sense I got from the article is on the lines of so what if most of her arguments are wrong? Some of them are right, and they are important. [1] To paraphrase Charles Babbage, I am not able rightly to apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a conclusion. Where is the data? The evidence? That the arguments are *important*, to start with, and then that they are *right*? Argument by assertion is not convincing to me, either from Arundhati Roy, or from Lakshmi Chaudhry [2]. [1] Insert even a stopped clock is right twice a day analogy here. [2] Who may well be right. I'm making an argument based on principle here. -- ((Udhay Shankar N)) ((udhay @ pobox.com)) ((www.digeratus.com))
Re: [silk] India's dangerous capitalism
On May 17, 2012 11:28 PM, ashok _ listmans...@gmail.com wrote: The report warned of the growing influence of the Soviet Union on the ANC and said that US strategic and corporate interests (i.e., access to South Africa’s minerals) would be best served if there were genuine sharing of political power by all races. The Foundations began to support the ANC. The ANC soon turned on the more radical organizations like Steve Biko’s Black Consciousness movement and more or less eliminated it. When Nelson Mandela took over as South Africa’s first Black President, he was canonized as a living saint... because he deferred completely to the Washington Consensus. That is such a ridiculous argument given that steve biko spent most of his time under house arrest It's a ridiculous argument to anyone who knows the first thing about the ANCYL, the ANC, Steve Biko, Chris Hani, Nelson Mandela, or the history of South Africa. It comes across as the ravings of someone who has read one or two easy reader summaries written by lunatic fringe conspiracy theorists. -- Charles
