Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware

2017-03-09 Thread Johnny Billquist 

On 2017-03-09 19:00, Paul Koning wrote:



On Mar 9, 2017, at 12:27 PM, Timothe Litt  wrote:

..
With respect to an earlier question about CI emulation:  The best approach may 
be to emulate it as multicast ethernet.  Setup a couple of groups for each star 
coupler.  Each coupler supports up to 32 nodes.  For VMS, half o them hosts, 
half storage.  CI is a 50Mb/s (might be 70, but I remember 50 from the initial 
doc) CSMA/CD bus.


70 Mb/s is the number I always saw.


Me too.


 The cabling is redundant (A & B cables), so assign one MC group to each per 
star.  (Yes, there are DECnet drivers for on multiple OSs.  I think it was 
considered a multipoint medium with addresses related to (CI) node numbers rather 
than an ethernet (broadcast) - but it's been a while.)


I don't think DECnet ever supported CI.  It certainly doesn't show up in the 
DECnet architecture specs anywhere.


It did support it. But if I remember right, it was kindof not really 
supported. The drivers existed, and was provided to customers, but I 
think VMS manuals mentioned it as some unsupported lines. I remember 
having tested it a little, and did get it to work.


Under Ultrix I also managed to get TCP/IP running over CI.

Johnny

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Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware

2017-03-09 Thread Paul Koning 

> On Mar 9, 2017, at 1:23 PM, Timothe Litt  wrote:
> 
> I don't have time to dig up the details.  But TOPS-10/20 definitely supported 
> the CI. 

Interesting.  That sounds like a product-specific item rather than part of the 
standard architecture.

paul


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Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware

2017-03-09 Thread Paul Koning 

> On Mar 9, 2017, at 12:27 PM, Timothe Litt  wrote:
> 
> ..
> With respect to an earlier question about CI emulation:  The best approach 
> may be to emulate it as multicast ethernet.  Setup a couple of groups for 
> each star coupler.  Each coupler supports up to 32 nodes.  For VMS, half o 
> them hosts, half storage.  CI is a 50Mb/s (might be 70, but I remember 50 
> from the initial doc) CSMA/CD bus.

70 Mb/s is the number I always saw.

>  The cabling is redundant (A & B cables), so assign one MC group to each per 
> star.  (Yes, there are DECnet drivers for on multiple OSs.  I think it was 
> considered a multipoint medium with addresses related to (CI) node numbers 
> rather than an ethernet (broadcast) - but it's been a while.)

I don't think DECnet ever supported CI.  It certainly doesn't show up in the 
DECnet architecture specs anywhere.

paul

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Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware

2017-03-09 Thread Timothe Litt 
The CI interface is the KLIPA.  Its a KL10-only device that sits in an
RH20 channel slot.  It uses a port architecture similar to the CI780,
with queues and 36-bit pointers in physical memory.  It's supported in 7.04.

With respect to an earlier question about CI emulation:  The best
approach may be to emulate it as multicast ethernet.  Setup a couple of
groups for each star coupler.  Each coupler supports up to 32 nodes. 
For VMS, half o them hosts, half storage.  CI is a 50Mb/s (might be 70,
but I remember 50 from the initial doc) CSMA/CD bus.  The cabling is
redundant (A & B cables), so assign one MC group to each per star. 
(Yes, there are DECnet drivers for on multiple OSs.  I think it was
considered a multipoint medium with addresses related to (CI) node
numbers rather than an ethernet (broadcast) - but it's been a while.)


Have fun.

On 09-Mar-17 11:58, Tim Stark wrote:
> Folks,
>
> Hmm.   I checked TOPS-10 7.04 monitor source codes and found two files about 
> SCS/SCA packet info but did not find any files about CI interface. 
> I think TOPS-10 can communicate through DECnet.
>
> I think that transport layers are SCS/SCA layers. 
>
> There is commercial emulator (Charon-VAX) emulates CI hardware and HSJ50 
> controllers.  They are much faster than actual CI hardware.
>
> So that we can implement them on SIMH and other emulators possibly.
>
> Tim
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Simh [mailto:simh-boun...@trailing-edge.com] On Behalf Of Rich Alderson
> Sent: Tuesday, March 7, 2017 2:37 PM
> To: simh@trailing-edge.com
> Subject: Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware
>
>> Unless I remember totally wrong, only the HSC50 could do 576 byte sectors.
>> It was dropped in a pretty early version of CRONIC, before support for 
>> any other HSC controller existed.
> Correct.  Only the HSC50 ever supported 576-byte sectors, and only on RA81 
> and smaller drives.  (We really wanted RA82s on our 4-system CI cluster at 
> Stanford LOTS, but were informed that it would never ever happen.)
>
> Rich 
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Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware

2017-03-08 Thread Bailey, Scott 
>Yes. Although there are some slight differences between ethernet and CI,
>but from a practical point of view, for cluster networking, ethernet
>works just as well.

"Practical" has very little to do with my interest in this subject, LOL, but I 
have
a definite fondness for the old "classic" VAXcluster with a star coupler and 
an
HSC (or two - dual-ported disks, anyone?) for storage.

For no good reason, I fret over my inability to map the same "shared disk" 
image
to multiple emulated VAXen and have at it. Yeah, I could just MSCP-serve it 
from
one node to another, but the kewlness of having a virtual HSC50 own all my 
disks
and running a completely symmetrical shared-storage cluster cannot be 
overlooked.

Daydreaming,

Scott Bailey
scott.bai...@hpe.com


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Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware

2017-03-07 Thread Johnny Billquist 

On 2017-03-07 02:42, Phil Budne wrote:

I know I'm being a spoil-sport, and I don't deny it would be fun to
create a "star coupler" network server, but.

Wouldn't it be possible (if less fun) to have the simulator interpret
the contents of the CI packets (which might just contain MSCP)?


I actually agree. I'm not sure I see the point here. We're talking MSCP, 
which have already been done. CI is just a different transport layer for 
the MSCP packets.



Isn't clustering over Ethernet available under VMS, delivering the
same end-user experience?  Modern (Gbit) Ethernet is faster than CI ever was.


Yes. Although there are some slight differences between ethernet and CI, 
but from a practical point of view, for cluster networking, ethernet 
works just as well.


Johnny

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Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware

2017-03-07 Thread Johnny Billquist 

On 2017-03-07 02:21, Tim Stark wrote:

Hmm, interesting.  K.scsi is not mentioned in my HSC50/70 docs.  Does anyone 
have any docs contains K.scsi tech info?


I don't. I have no technical information on any of the modules. But I do 
know that your HSC90 documentation have a bit of information about the 
upgrade to be able to use SCSI. But it's mostly about how to install the 
stuff.


Johnny



Thanks again,
Tim

-Original Message-
From: Simh [mailto:simh-boun...@trailing-edge.com] On Behalf Of Johnny Billquist
Sent: Monday, March 6, 2017 6:47 PM
To: simh@trailing-edge.com
Subject: Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware

On 2017-03-06 15:03, Timothe Litt wrote:

There were also HSC40 & hsc60.


Right. Pretty similar to all the others. The differences (as far as I can 
remember) were mostly on the number of SDI/STI ports available, and the amount 
of cache in the machine.


The differences in the hsc family members were the processor, cache,
load device, number of channels, and maximum number of ports.  Some
models were field-upgradable.  Also, later models supported
(reluctantly) the K.scsi module, which allowed the HSC to serve SCSI
disks and tapes.  (SCSI was carefully analyzed & found to have
reliability/data integrity issues; DEC's answer was DSSI.  Rather like
Beta & VHS - "good enough, but cheaper" won.)


Right. However, to use the K.scsi, you actually needed to upgrade. The
HSC90 with the capability to use K.scsi was the HSC95. I don't think the
HSC70 could at all. The 40 and 60 could, I think, but I wonder if they then 
were renamed 45 and 65. I think I still have some documentation somewhere, but 
it would take some digging to find this.


At some point, support for 18-bit disks (576 byte sectors) was dropped.
The HSC50 definitely had it; the HSC90 did not.  I'm unsure about the HSC70.


Unless I remember totally wrong, only the HSC50 could do 576 byte sectors. It 
was dropped in a pretty early version of CRONIC, before support for any other 
HSC controller existed.

Johnny


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Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware

2017-03-07 Thread Johnny Billquist 

On 2017-03-07 02:18, Tim Stark wrote:

Ok, I now got it. I downloaded and reviewed scanned docs that Tim Litt pointed 
to.  Yes, HSC70 is upgradable to HSC90.

I will start with HSC70/90 emulation development then HSC50 and others...


Not sure what you are trying to accomplish here. It might be worth 
pointing out that all CI controllers worked the same way, from a system 
point of view. So, there shouldn't be any differences between a HSC50 
and a HSC90, apart from the number of disks you might have attached, how 
fast it was, and the actual name it reported.

And a HSJ or HSZ is the same thing.


Also I learned that CI became DSSI (SCSI version of CI) later.  They provides 
SHAC tech docs for VAX 4000 series (KA660 to KA690) and others.


Well, DSSI is not "SCSI version of CI". DSSI is pretty much just CI 
reimplemented, with each disk being a node, meaning that each disk is 
like a HSC.



Does anyone have HSJ tech docs for DSSI and SCS/SCA packet docs?


The HSJ talks CI. So, it looks the same from other CI nodes as a HSC. 
Same with HSZ. They are all disk controllers sitting on CI. It's just a 
question of what the actual disks are attached to the HS with.
With HSC, it's SDI. With HSJ my brain says SCSI, and HSZ is DSSI. (But I 
could be remembering things wrong, but I believe we have about eight 
HSJ40 at Update, along with a VAX 8650 and a VAX 7000-720, both with CI 
as well.)


But there are oddball exceptions, like the SCSI adaptor for some HSC 
controllers.


And, if you ignore the transport layer, controllers like the UDA-50, 
KDA-50 and KDB-50 also work the same.


Johnny



Thanks again,
Tim

-Original Message-
From: Simh [mailto:simh-boun...@trailing-edge.com] On Behalf Of Johnny Billquist
Sent: Monday, March 6, 2017 6:43 PM
To: simh@trailing-edge.com
Subject: Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware

On 2017-03-06 14:39, Tim Stark wrote:

I reviewed HSC50/70 tech docs.  Yeah.  They are PDP-11 machines.  HSC50 uses 
TU58 and is F11 processor.  HSC70 uses floppy drive and is J11 processor.

They uses SDI and STI devices through two Qbus registers with MSCP/TMSCP 
packets.

I am interested to get copies of floppy and tape images for loading software.

I have not find HSC90 tech docs yet.


The HSC90 is pretty similar to the HSC70. I would have to go and check more 
documentation, but I think the HSC70 was upgradeable to a HSC90.
I think the HSC90 had much more cache memory, but they both certainly use the 
J11, and the same modules for SDI and STI, along with the CI.

The HSC90 can have more ports though. But there is not a whole lot of 
difference.

Johnny


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Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware

2017-03-07 Thread khandy21yo 
Nows your chance to make it happen! 


Sent from my Galaxy Tab® A
 Original message From: Rich Alderson 
<s...@alderson.users.panix.com> Date: 3/7/17  12:37 PM  (GMT-07:00) To: 
simh@trailing-edge.com Subject: Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware 
> From: Johnny Billquist <b...@softjar.se>
> Date: Tue, 7 Mar 2017 00:47:08 +0100

> On 2017-03-06 15:03, Timothe Litt wrote:

>> At some point, support for 18-bit disks (576 byte sectors) was dropped.  The
>> HSC50 definitely had it; the HSC90 did not.  I'm unsure about the HSC70.

> Unless I remember totally wrong, only the HSC50 could do 576 byte sectors.
> It was dropped in a pretty early version of CRONIC, before support for any
> other HSC controller existed.

Correct.  Only the HSC50 ever supported 576-byte sectors, and only on RA81 and
smaller drives.  (We really wanted RA82s on our 4-system CI cluster at Stanford
LOTS, but were informed that it would never ever happen.)

    Rich
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Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware

2017-03-06 Thread Tim Stark 
Yeah.  I know that but I like to emulate HSC and HSJ servers for SIMH and other 
emulators via TCP links. 

It uses SCS or SCA packets that embeds MSCP/TMSCP packets. 

Tim

-Original Message-
From: Simh [mailto:simh-boun...@trailing-edge.com] On Behalf Of Phil Budne
Sent: Monday, March 6, 2017 8:43 PM
To: simh@trailing-edge.com
Subject: Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware

I know I'm being a spoil-sport, and I don't deny it would be fun to create a 
"star coupler" network server, but.

Wouldn't it be possible (if less fun) to have the simulator interpret the 
contents of the CI packets (which might just contain MSCP)?

Isn't clustering over Ethernet available under VMS, delivering the same 
end-user experience?  Modern (Gbit) Ethernet is faster than CI ever was.
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Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware

2017-03-06 Thread Tim Stark 
Hmm, interesting.  K.scsi is not mentioned in my HSC50/70 docs.  Does anyone 
have any docs contains K.scsi tech info?

Thanks again,
Tim

-Original Message-
From: Simh [mailto:simh-boun...@trailing-edge.com] On Behalf Of Johnny Billquist
Sent: Monday, March 6, 2017 6:47 PM
To: simh@trailing-edge.com
Subject: Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware

On 2017-03-06 15:03, Timothe Litt wrote:
> There were also HSC40 & hsc60.

Right. Pretty similar to all the others. The differences (as far as I can 
remember) were mostly on the number of SDI/STI ports available, and the amount 
of cache in the machine.

> The differences in the hsc family members were the processor, cache, 
> load device, number of channels, and maximum number of ports.  Some 
> models were field-upgradable.  Also, later models supported
> (reluctantly) the K.scsi module, which allowed the HSC to serve SCSI 
> disks and tapes.  (SCSI was carefully analyzed & found to have 
> reliability/data integrity issues; DEC's answer was DSSI.  Rather like 
> Beta & VHS - "good enough, but cheaper" won.)

Right. However, to use the K.scsi, you actually needed to upgrade. The
HSC90 with the capability to use K.scsi was the HSC95. I don't think the
HSC70 could at all. The 40 and 60 could, I think, but I wonder if they then 
were renamed 45 and 65. I think I still have some documentation somewhere, but 
it would take some digging to find this.

> At some point, support for 18-bit disks (576 byte sectors) was dropped.
> The HSC50 definitely had it; the HSC90 did not.  I'm unsure about the HSC70.

Unless I remember totally wrong, only the HSC50 could do 576 byte sectors. It 
was dropped in a pretty early version of CRONIC, before support for any other 
HSC controller existed.

Johnny


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Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware

2017-03-06 Thread Tim Stark 
Ok, I now got it. I downloaded and reviewed scanned docs that Tim Litt pointed 
to.  Yes, HSC70 is upgradable to HSC90. 

I will start with HSC70/90 emulation development then HSC50 and others...

Also I learned that CI became DSSI (SCSI version of CI) later.  They provides 
SHAC tech docs for VAX 4000 series (KA660 to KA690) and others.

Does anyone have HSJ tech docs for DSSI and SCS/SCA packet docs?

Thanks again,
Tim

-Original Message-
From: Simh [mailto:simh-boun...@trailing-edge.com] On Behalf Of Johnny Billquist
Sent: Monday, March 6, 2017 6:43 PM
To: simh@trailing-edge.com
Subject: Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware

On 2017-03-06 14:39, Tim Stark wrote:
> I reviewed HSC50/70 tech docs.  Yeah.  They are PDP-11 machines.  HSC50 uses 
> TU58 and is F11 processor.  HSC70 uses floppy drive and is J11 processor.
>
> They uses SDI and STI devices through two Qbus registers with MSCP/TMSCP 
> packets.
>
> I am interested to get copies of floppy and tape images for loading software.
>
> I have not find HSC90 tech docs yet.

The HSC90 is pretty similar to the HSC70. I would have to go and check more 
documentation, but I think the HSC70 was upgradeable to a HSC90.
I think the HSC90 had much more cache memory, but they both certainly use the 
J11, and the same modules for SDI and STI, along with the CI.

The HSC90 can have more ports though. But there is not a whole lot of 
difference.

Johnny


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Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware

2017-03-06 Thread Johnny Billquist 

On 2017-03-06 15:03, Timothe Litt wrote:

There were also HSC40 & hsc60.


Right. Pretty similar to all the others. The differences (as far as I 
can remember) were mostly on the number of SDI/STI ports available, and 
the amount of cache in the machine.



The differences in the hsc family members were the processor, cache,
load device, number of channels, and maximum number of ports.  Some
models were field-upgradable.  Also, later models supported
(reluctantly) the K.scsi module, which allowed the HSC to serve SCSI
disks and tapes.  (SCSI was carefully analyzed & found to have
reliability/data integrity issues; DEC's answer was DSSI.  Rather like
Beta & VHS - "good enough, but cheaper" won.)


Right. However, to use the K.scsi, you actually needed to upgrade. The 
HSC90 with the capability to use K.scsi was the HSC95. I don't think the 
HSC70 could at all. The 40 and 60 could, I think, but I wonder if they 
then were renamed 45 and 65. I think I still have some documentation 
somewhere, but it would take some digging to find this.



At some point, support for 18-bit disks (576 byte sectors) was dropped.
The HSC50 definitely had it; the HSC90 did not.  I'm unsure about the HSC70.


Unless I remember totally wrong, only the HSC50 could do 576 byte 
sectors. It was dropped in a pretty early version of CRONIC, before 
support for any other HSC controller existed.


Johnny



There's a fair bit of configuration information in
http://decdoc.itsx.net/dec94mds/hscmnin2.pdf


On 06-Mar-17 08:39, Tim Stark wrote:

I reviewed HSC50/70 tech docs.  Yeah.  They are PDP-11 machines.  HSC50 uses 
TU58 and is F11 processor.  HSC70 uses floppy drive and is J11 processor.

They uses SDI and STI devices through two Qbus registers with MSCP/TMSCP 
packets.

I am interested to get copies of floppy and tape images for loading software.

I have not find HSC90 tech docs yet.

Thanks,
Tim

-Original Message-
From: Simh [mailto:simh-boun...@trailing-edge.com] On Behalf Of Anders Magnusson
Sent: Monday, March 6, 2017 7:33 AM
To: Johnny Billquist <b...@softjar.se>; simh@trailing-edge.com
Subject: Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware

Den 2017-03-06 kl. 11:27, skrev Johnny Billquist:

On 2017-03-06 09:51, Anders Magnusson wrote:

Den 2017-03-05 kl. 14:06, skrev Tim Stark:

Folks,



I discovered CI750 tech docs when I searched for some CPU processors
for VAX emulation. I downloaded and reviewed it.  CI emulation can
be implemented for emulator to link to other VAX/Alpha emulators as
VMScluster. Does anyone find CI780 emulation for VAX-11/780 and VAX
86x0 yet?  Also I found HSC 50/70 tech docs but do not have software
at this time.


Hm, there is a small chance that I may have the HSC50 Cronic floppies
somewhere, is that what you are thinking about?

Heh. If it's for the HSC50, it will be DECtape II.
We might still have a set around at Update, but it's been years since
I saw them, and we don't have any HSC50 anymore. We still have a HSC90
though, with the floppy.

Oh, of course!  Hm, it must be for a 70 (or 90) then.  Sorry :-)

-- R
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Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware

2017-03-06 Thread Johnny Billquist 

On 2017-03-06 14:39, Tim Stark wrote:

I reviewed HSC50/70 tech docs.  Yeah.  They are PDP-11 machines.  HSC50 uses 
TU58 and is F11 processor.  HSC70 uses floppy drive and is J11 processor.

They uses SDI and STI devices through two Qbus registers with MSCP/TMSCP 
packets.

I am interested to get copies of floppy and tape images for loading software.

I have not find HSC90 tech docs yet.


The HSC90 is pretty similar to the HSC70. I would have to go and check 
more documentation, but I think the HSC70 was upgradeable to a HSC90.
I think the HSC90 had much more cache memory, but they both certainly 
use the J11, and the same modules for SDI and STI, along with the CI.


The HSC90 can have more ports though. But there is not a whole lot of 
difference.


Johnny



Thanks,
Tim

-Original Message-
From: Simh [mailto:simh-boun...@trailing-edge.com] On Behalf Of Anders Magnusson
Sent: Monday, March 6, 2017 7:33 AM
To: Johnny Billquist <b...@softjar.se>; simh@trailing-edge.com
Subject: Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware

Den 2017-03-06 kl. 11:27, skrev Johnny Billquist:

On 2017-03-06 09:51, Anders Magnusson wrote:

Den 2017-03-05 kl. 14:06, skrev Tim Stark:


Folks,



I discovered CI750 tech docs when I searched for some CPU processors
for VAX emulation. I downloaded and reviewed it.  CI emulation can
be implemented for emulator to link to other VAX/Alpha emulators as
VMScluster. Does anyone find CI780 emulation for VAX-11/780 and VAX
86x0 yet?  Also I found HSC 50/70 tech docs but do not have software
at this time.


Hm, there is a small chance that I may have the HSC50 Cronic floppies
somewhere, is that what you are thinking about?


Heh. If it's for the HSC50, it will be DECtape II.
We might still have a set around at Update, but it's been years since
I saw them, and we don't have any HSC50 anymore. We still have a HSC90
though, with the floppy.

Oh, of course!  Hm, it must be for a 70 (or 90) then.  Sorry :-)

-- R
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Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware

2017-03-06 Thread Timothe Litt 
There were also HSC40 & hsc60. 

The differences in the hsc family members were the processor, cache,
load device, number of channels, and maximum number of ports.  Some
models were field-upgradable.  Also, later models supported
(reluctantly) the K.scsi module, which allowed the HSC to serve SCSI
disks and tapes.  (SCSI was carefully analyzed & found to have
reliability/data integrity issues; DEC's answer was DSSI.  Rather like
Beta & VHS - "good enough, but cheaper" won.)

At some point, support for 18-bit disks (576 byte sectors) was dropped. 
The HSC50 definitely had it; the HSC90 did not.  I'm unsure about the HSC70.

There's a fair bit of configuration information in
http://decdoc.itsx.net/dec94mds/hscmnin2.pdf


On 06-Mar-17 08:39, Tim Stark wrote:
> I reviewed HSC50/70 tech docs.  Yeah.  They are PDP-11 machines.  HSC50 uses 
> TU58 and is F11 processor.  HSC70 uses floppy drive and is J11 processor.
>
> They uses SDI and STI devices through two Qbus registers with MSCP/TMSCP 
> packets.
>
> I am interested to get copies of floppy and tape images for loading software.
>
> I have not find HSC90 tech docs yet. 
>
> Thanks,
> Tim
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Simh [mailto:simh-boun...@trailing-edge.com] On Behalf Of Anders 
> Magnusson
> Sent: Monday, March 6, 2017 7:33 AM
> To: Johnny Billquist <b...@softjar.se>; simh@trailing-edge.com
> Subject: Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware
>
> Den 2017-03-06 kl. 11:27, skrev Johnny Billquist:
>> On 2017-03-06 09:51, Anders Magnusson wrote:
>>> Den 2017-03-05 kl. 14:06, skrev Tim Stark:
>>>> Folks,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I discovered CI750 tech docs when I searched for some CPU processors 
>>>> for VAX emulation. I downloaded and reviewed it.  CI emulation can 
>>>> be implemented for emulator to link to other VAX/Alpha emulators as 
>>>> VMScluster. Does anyone find CI780 emulation for VAX-11/780 and VAX
>>>> 86x0 yet?  Also I found HSC 50/70 tech docs but do not have software 
>>>> at this time.
>>>>
>>> Hm, there is a small chance that I may have the HSC50 Cronic floppies 
>>> somewhere, is that what you are thinking about?
>> Heh. If it's for the HSC50, it will be DECtape II.
>> We might still have a set around at Update, but it's been years since 
>> I saw them, and we don't have any HSC50 anymore. We still have a HSC90 
>> though, with the floppy.
> Oh, of course!  Hm, it must be for a 70 (or 90) then.  Sorry :-)
>
> -- R
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Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware

2017-03-06 Thread Tim Stark 
I reviewed HSC50/70 tech docs.  Yeah.  They are PDP-11 machines.  HSC50 uses 
TU58 and is F11 processor.  HSC70 uses floppy drive and is J11 processor.

They uses SDI and STI devices through two Qbus registers with MSCP/TMSCP 
packets.

I am interested to get copies of floppy and tape images for loading software.

I have not find HSC90 tech docs yet. 

Thanks,
Tim

-Original Message-
From: Simh [mailto:simh-boun...@trailing-edge.com] On Behalf Of Anders Magnusson
Sent: Monday, March 6, 2017 7:33 AM
To: Johnny Billquist <b...@softjar.se>; simh@trailing-edge.com
Subject: Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware

Den 2017-03-06 kl. 11:27, skrev Johnny Billquist:
> On 2017-03-06 09:51, Anders Magnusson wrote:
>> Den 2017-03-05 kl. 14:06, skrev Tim Stark:
>>>
>>> Folks,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I discovered CI750 tech docs when I searched for some CPU processors 
>>> for VAX emulation. I downloaded and reviewed it.  CI emulation can 
>>> be implemented for emulator to link to other VAX/Alpha emulators as 
>>> VMScluster. Does anyone find CI780 emulation for VAX-11/780 and VAX
>>> 86x0 yet?  Also I found HSC 50/70 tech docs but do not have software 
>>> at this time.
>>>
>> Hm, there is a small chance that I may have the HSC50 Cronic floppies 
>> somewhere, is that what you are thinking about?
>
> Heh. If it's for the HSC50, it will be DECtape II.
> We might still have a set around at Update, but it's been years since 
> I saw them, and we don't have any HSC50 anymore. We still have a HSC90 
> though, with the floppy.
Oh, of course!  Hm, it must be for a 70 (or 90) then.  Sorry :-)

-- R
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Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware

2017-03-06 Thread Anders Magnusson 

Den 2017-03-06 kl. 11:27, skrev Johnny Billquist:

On 2017-03-06 09:51, Anders Magnusson wrote:

Den 2017-03-05 kl. 14:06, skrev Tim Stark:


Folks,



I discovered CI750 tech docs when I searched for some CPU processors
for VAX emulation. I downloaded and reviewed it.  CI emulation can be
implemented for emulator to link to other VAX/Alpha emulators as
VMScluster. Does anyone find CI780 emulation for VAX-11/780 and VAX
86x0 yet?  Also I found HSC 50/70 tech docs but do not have software
at this time.


Hm, there is a small chance that I may have the HSC50 Cronic floppies
somewhere, is that what you are thinking about?


Heh. If it's for the HSC50, it will be DECtape II.
We might still have a set around at Update, but it's been years since 
I saw them, and we don't have any HSC50 anymore. We still have a HSC90 
though, with the floppy.

Oh, of course!  Hm, it must be for a 70 (or 90) then.  Sorry :-)

-- R
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Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware

2017-03-06 Thread Johnny Billquist 

On 2017-03-06 09:51, Anders Magnusson wrote:

Den 2017-03-05 kl. 14:06, skrev Tim Stark:


Folks,



I discovered CI750 tech docs when I searched for some CPU processors
for VAX emulation. I downloaded and reviewed it.  CI emulation can be
implemented for emulator to link to other VAX/Alpha emulators as
VMScluster. Does anyone find CI780 emulation for VAX-11/780 and VAX
86x0 yet?  Also I found HSC 50/70 tech docs but do not have software
at this time.


Hm, there is a small chance that I may have the HSC50 Cronic floppies
somewhere, is that what you are thinking about?


Heh. If it's for the HSC50, it will be DECtape II.
We might still have a set around at Update, but it's been years since I 
saw them, and we don't have any HSC50 anymore. We still have a HSC90 
though, with the floppy.


Johnny

--
Johnny Billquist  || "I'm on a bus
  ||  on a psychedelic trip
email: b...@softjar.se ||  Reading murder books
pdp is alive! ||  tryin' to stay hip" - B. Idol
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Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware

2017-03-06 Thread Anders Magnusson 

Den 2017-03-05 kl. 14:06, skrev Tim Stark:


Folks,

I discovered CI750 tech docs when I searched for some CPU processors 
for VAX emulation. I downloaded and reviewed it.  CI emulation can be 
implemented for emulator to link to other VAX/Alpha emulators as 
VMScluster. Does anyone find CI780 emulation for VAX-11/780 and VAX 
86x0 yet?  Also I found HSC 50/70 tech docs but do not have software 
at this time.


Hm, there is a small chance that I may have the HSC50 Cronic floppies 
somewhere, is that what you are thinking about?


-- Ragge
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Re: [Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware

2017-03-06 Thread Mark Pizzolato 
On Sunday, March 5, 2017 at 5:07 AM, Tim Stark wrote:
> I discovered CI750 tech docs when I searched for some CPU processors 
> for VAX emulation. I downloaded and reviewed it.  CI emulation can 
> be implemented for emulator to link to other VAX/Alpha emulators 
> as VMScluster. Does anyone find CI780 emulation for VAX-11/780 
> and VAX 86x0 yet?  Also I found HSC 50/70 tech docs but do not 
> have software at this time. 

Matt Burke (the author of the additional VAX simulators beyond the 
VAX780 and the VAX3900), had mentioned something about some
work he'd done with CI stuff.  I presume that none of that was 
ever completed enough since he'd never passed any of that across.

> Since SIMH's VAX firmware (KA6x0) were modified for emulation, 
> I am looking for unmodified KA6x0 ROM images.  

The original KA655 ROM is in the github repo as VAX/ka655_orig.bin

- Mark


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[Simh] CI750 tech docs and VAX firmware

2017-03-05 Thread Tim Stark 
Folks,

 

I discovered CI750 tech docs when I searched for some CPU processors for VAX
emulation. I downloaded and reviewed it.  CI emulation can be implemented
for emulator to link to other VAX/Alpha emulators as VMScluster. Does anyone
find CI780 emulation for VAX-11/780 and VAX 86x0 yet?  Also I found HSC
50/70 tech docs but do not have software at this time. 

 

Since SIMH's VAX firmware (KA6x0) were modified for emulation, I am looking
for unmodified KA6x0 ROM images.  Also I am still looking for KA680/KA690
firmware to support full 512MB memory and DSSI interface. I have KA680 tech
docs that provides complete DSSI info (SHAC).  Does anyone have any info
about HSJ array storage?  Initially I will use SIMH's KA655X for full 512MB
memory on my new MSE emulator.  I am working on command handler for console
prompt.

 

Thanks!

Tim

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