Re: Persistent objects ids
Yes, it's not Softimage related problem, it just happened that I have to do
it (again) in Soft and thought I've forgotten about some obvious
method/shortcut.
ObjectIDs will change between sessions and in some other cases, hence I
can't use them, I'll have a look at GUIDs out of curiosity. I am very
likely going to do what I've always done (ie. managing some sort of unique
IDs myself) - this discussion got me thinking though - as Raffaele said,
there is so many scenarios and variations in regards to creation time and
management/update time of unique IDs that I think it's better to leave it
to user to implement it.
Thanks again everyone, great ideas and info.
On 5 June 2013 01:39, Raffaele Fragapane raffsxsil...@googlemail.comwrote:
I tend to agree with Matt, and to be really honest granting UID
persistency in a large software is frequently done on the side,
specifically with that intention, and either user controlled, or if left to
heuristics either very conservative or very changing (IE: at what point do
you decide to lock an ID? On creaiton? On Topo change? What happens if you
swap the primitive like you can do with Curves?).
Your best bet is emulating the above yourself by tagging objects at the
stages you want to ID them, and changing it if and when you need it. It's
actually not hard to do in terms of difficulty, but it can result in a
large and pervasive toolset before it's reliable enough, which is probably
why Michal outlined he'd rather avoid it.
It's what we do in a couple places actually to support name agnostic
operations in our pipe (plenty renaming happening since, in example, the
same rig can be imported several times for different characters).
I'm afraid there's little alternative to controlling this yourself, and to
be honest this is a rather generig CS problem more so than it's a Softimage
specific one.
The Identity of an item is a very ambiguous and volatile concept that
every user and pipeline will have a different idea of the extent of.
What Soft might want to do is offer an open parameter with a creation ID,
that way there's always something fairly static couple with the object, and
leave it to the user to modify it if they require more frequent mutation
than the first time the primitive comes into existence. This will need to
be wrapped around by every command offering creation of sorts. Gets,
Extracts, Duplicates and so on.
Log the request if you feel it's important.
On Wed, Jun 5, 2013 at 9:49 AM, Ciaran Moloney
moloney.cia...@gmail.comwrote:
Yeah, I figured as much.
Not that I doubt Matt's observations, but it would be nice to have some
official word on the reliability of this method - unique ID's are a request
that come up all the time.
In the mean time I'll proceed with caution, since it's the simplest
general purpose solution.
Ciaran
On Wed, Jun 5, 2013 at 12:35 AM, Raffaele Fragapane
raffsxsil...@googlemail.com wrote:
I doubt it's an issue with GUID at an algorithmic level, if two
identical GUID could be produced by the same person on the same project,
and therefore the conflict noticed, the windows world would be in very deep
S*** :)
Identical GUIDs on one platform should be centuries apart.
It's more likely a case of generation/re-use on Soft's side, either
intentional for non-obvious reasons or a bug.
On Wed, Jun 5, 2013 at 9:00 AM, Ciaran Moloney moloney.cia...@gmail.com
wrote:
So, if the GUID isn't unique, that's a pretty lousy algorithm
Luckily, I haven't observed that so far.
Ciaran
On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 11:57 PM, Matt Lind ml...@carbinestudios.comwrote:
Object GUID is persistent, but not granular enough. I’ve run into
cases where multiple items get the same GUID. Same goes for CLSID.**
**
** **
Matt
** **
** **
** **
** **
** **
*From:* softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto:
softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] *On Behalf Of *Ciaran Moloney
*Sent:* Tuesday, June 04, 2013 3:55 PM
*To:* softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
*Subject:* Re: Persistent objects ids
** **
Yes, you're right...I can reproduce a change of ID when deleting an
object and re-opening a scene. However, I would not dismiss the object
GUID, which appears to persists between sessions despite the change in the
object ID value. In the below snippet the sphere object changed ID but not
GUID.
** **
# Name: cylinder
# ID: 114
# GUID: {090F2A9A-D1FC-4112-ACC5-9345BEB48954}
#
# Name: disc
# ID: 92
# GUID: {D03EF191-3962-4540-929D-F5438CE59D79}
#
# Name: torus1
# ID: 68
# GUID: {1AC14CC7-1175-4E30-9CDD-BC0C0C1DE6EA}
#
# Name: sphere
# ID: 80
# GUID: {CC63558A-D5A3-4F55-8621-6D428FE2743A}
#
** **
# Delete cylinder, save and re-open scene
** **
# Name: disc
# ID: 92
# GUID: {D03EF191-3962-4540-929D-F5438CE59D79}
#
# Name
Persistent objects ids
Hi, Is there any obvious way I am missing which would allow me to identify objects in the scene, but not by name? Something like ObjectID, but persistent between scene saves and loads. I can generate UUID or something similar using ObjectAdded event and store custom property but I'd rather avoid it. I want to be able to track objects regardless if they were renamed or not. -- -- Michal http://uk.linkedin.com/in/mdoniec
Re: Persistent objects ids
Create an annotation and write a ID into that - we used that in our asset system, worked fine for us. S. On 2013/06/04 12:49 PM, Michal Doniec wrote: Hi, Is there any obvious way I am missing which would allow me to identify objects in the scene, but not by name? Something like ObjectID, but persistent between scene saves and loads. I can generate UUID or something similar using ObjectAdded event and store custom property but I'd rather avoid it. I want to be able to track objects regardless if they were renamed or not. -- -- Michal http://uk.linkedin.com/in/mdoniec
Re: Persistent objects ids
That's what I've been doing (I use properties instead of annotation but the principle is the same), maybe there is no need to change after all :) On 4 June 2013 12:52, Sandy Sutherland sandy.mailli...@gmail.com wrote: Create an annotation and write a ID into that - we used that in our asset system, worked fine for us. S. On 2013/06/04 12:49 PM, Michal Doniec wrote: Hi, Is there any obvious way I am missing which would allow me to identify objects in the scene, but not by name? Something like ObjectID, but persistent between scene saves and loads. I can generate UUID or something similar using ObjectAdded event and store custom property but I'd rather avoid it. I want to be able to track objects regardless if they were renamed or not. -- -- Michal http://uk.linkedin.com/in/**mdoniec http://uk.linkedin.com/in/mdoniec -- -- Michal http://uk.linkedin.com/in/mdoniec
Re: Persistent objects ids
At work I use a topology hash which I base off a string composed of either boundingbox and component counts, or if there's collisions from similar objects, the whole position array in local space. I use SHA1 for the hashing as it's a teensy bit faster to compute than MD5, but both of those have known to have had collision flaws, so ideally one should use something fancier. As long as the topo stays the same, it makes it super easy to track renamed meshes or whatever. On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 7:57 AM, Michal Doniec doni...@gmail.com wrote: That's what I've been doing (I use properties instead of annotation but the principle is the same), maybe there is no need to change after all :) On 4 June 2013 12:52, Sandy Sutherland sandy.mailli...@gmail.com wrote: Create an annotation and write a ID into that - we used that in our asset system, worked fine for us. S. On 2013/06/04 12:49 PM, Michal Doniec wrote: Hi, Is there any obvious way I am missing which would allow me to identify objects in the scene, but not by name? Something like ObjectID, but persistent between scene saves and loads. I can generate UUID or something similar using ObjectAdded event and store custom property but I'd rather avoid it. I want to be able to track objects regardless if they were renamed or not. -- -- Michal http://uk.linkedin.com/in/**mdoniec http://uk.linkedin.com/in/mdoniec -- -- Michal http://uk.linkedin.com/in/mdoniec
Re: Persistent objects ids
Interesting idea Alan - thanks for this. Can't apply it to this particular thing I am doing now (topo, or anything can change), but I'll save it for the future. On 4 June 2013 15:25, Alan Fregtman alan.fregt...@gmail.com wrote: At work I use a topology hash which I base off a string composed of either boundingbox and component counts, or if there's collisions from similar objects, the whole position array in local space. I use SHA1 for the hashing as it's a teensy bit faster to compute than MD5, but both of those have known to have had collision flaws, so ideally one should use something fancier. As long as the topo stays the same, it makes it super easy to track renamed meshes or whatever. On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 7:57 AM, Michal Doniec doni...@gmail.com wrote: That's what I've been doing (I use properties instead of annotation but the principle is the same), maybe there is no need to change after all :) On 4 June 2013 12:52, Sandy Sutherland sandy.mailli...@gmail.com wrote: Create an annotation and write a ID into that - we used that in our asset system, worked fine for us. S. On 2013/06/04 12:49 PM, Michal Doniec wrote: Hi, Is there any obvious way I am missing which would allow me to identify objects in the scene, but not by name? Something like ObjectID, but persistent between scene saves and loads. I can generate UUID or something similar using ObjectAdded event and store custom property but I'd rather avoid it. I want to be able to track objects regardless if they were renamed or not. -- -- Michal http://uk.linkedin.com/in/**mdoniec http://uk.linkedin.com/in/mdoniec -- -- Michal http://uk.linkedin.com/in/mdoniec -- -- Michal http://uk.linkedin.com/in/mdoniec
Re: Persistent objects ids
No, i haven't, but this is what I was looking for, thanks a lot! On 4 June 2013 16:52, Ciaran Moloney moloney.cia...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, did you try XSIUtils.DataRepository.GetIdentifier() passing the siObjectGUID argument? I've used this to keep track of ICE nodes without relying on name strings. It's persistent between sessions and is preserved when models are exported. Works like a charm. The only problem is that it's possibly a bit tricky to get a pointer back to the object, since you need to know what you're looking for. I use Application.FindObjects() to get a collection of objects of this class, then check for the ObjectGUID I'm looking for. Ciaran On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 12:49 PM, Michal Doniec doni...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, Is there any obvious way I am missing which would allow me to identify objects in the scene, but not by name? Something like ObjectID, but persistent between scene saves and loads. I can generate UUID or something similar using ObjectAdded event and store custom property but I'd rather avoid it. I want to be able to track objects regardless if they were renamed or not. -- -- Michal http://uk.linkedin.com/in/mdoniec -- -- Michal http://uk.linkedin.com/in/mdoniec
Re: Persistent objects ids
How about with refmodels? I know ObjectID sometimes changes with refmodels. Does this ObjectGUID suffer the same fate? On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 11:52 AM, Ciaran Moloney moloney.cia...@gmail.comwrote: Hi, did you try XSIUtils.DataRepository.GetIdentifier() passing the siObjectGUID argument? I've used this to keep track of ICE nodes without relying on name strings. It's persistent between sessions and is preserved when models are exported. Works like a charm. The only problem is that it's possibly a bit tricky to get a pointer back to the object, since you need to know what you're looking for. I use Application.FindObjects() to get a collection of objects of this class, then check for the ObjectGUID I'm looking for. Ciaran On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 12:49 PM, Michal Doniec doni...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, Is there any obvious way I am missing which would allow me to identify objects in the scene, but not by name? Something like ObjectID, but persistent between scene saves and loads. I can generate UUID or something similar using ObjectAdded event and store custom property but I'd rather avoid it. I want to be able to track objects regardless if they were renamed or not. -- -- Michal http://uk.linkedin.com/in/mdoniec
RE: Persistent objects ids
This is not safe between sessions as IDs are dynamically generated and assigned in the order objects were created in the scene. If an older object is deleted and the scene reopened, everything after it will have a new ID. Matt From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Ciaran Moloney Sent: Tuesday, June 04, 2013 8:52 AM To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com Subject: Re: Persistent objects ids Hi, did you try XSIUtils.DataRepository.GetIdentifier() passing the siObjectGUID argument? I've used this to keep track of ICE nodes without relying on name strings. It's persistent between sessions and is preserved when models are exported. Works like a charm. The only problem is that it's possibly a bit tricky to get a pointer back to the object, since you need to know what you're looking for. I use Application.FindObjects() to get a collection of objects of this class, then check for the ObjectGUID I'm looking for. Ciaran On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 12:49 PM, Michal Doniec doni...@gmail.commailto:doni...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, Is there any obvious way I am missing which would allow me to identify objects in the scene, but not by name? Something like ObjectID, but persistent between scene saves and loads. I can generate UUID or something similar using ObjectAdded event and store custom property but I'd rather avoid it. I want to be able to track objects regardless if they were renamed or not. -- -- Michal http://uk.linkedin.com/in/mdoniec
Re: Persistent objects ids
Looks like it'll keep the same GUID as when exported as long as it's unique in the scene. If you have two references of a refmodel in a scene, the contents of the second model will get new GUIDs. On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 5:41 PM, Alan Fregtman alan.fregt...@gmail.comwrote: How about with refmodels? I know ObjectID sometimes changes with refmodels. Does this ObjectGUID suffer the same fate? On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 11:52 AM, Ciaran Moloney moloney.cia...@gmail.comwrote: Hi, did you try XSIUtils.DataRepository.GetIdentifier() passing the siObjectGUID argument? I've used this to keep track of ICE nodes without relying on name strings. It's persistent between sessions and is preserved when models are exported. Works like a charm. The only problem is that it's possibly a bit tricky to get a pointer back to the object, since you need to know what you're looking for. I use Application.FindObjects() to get a collection of objects of this class, then check for the ObjectGUID I'm looking for. Ciaran On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 12:49 PM, Michal Doniec doni...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, Is there any obvious way I am missing which would allow me to identify objects in the scene, but not by name? Something like ObjectID, but persistent between scene saves and loads. I can generate UUID or something similar using ObjectAdded event and store custom property but I'd rather avoid it. I want to be able to track objects regardless if they were renamed or not. -- -- Michal http://uk.linkedin.com/in/mdoniec
Re: Persistent objects ids
Yes, you're right...I can reproduce a change of ID when deleting an object
and re-opening a scene. However, I would not dismiss the object GUID, which
appears to persists between sessions despite the change in the object ID
value. In the below snippet the sphere object changed ID but not GUID.
# Name: cylinder
# ID: 114
# GUID: {090F2A9A-D1FC-4112-ACC5-9345BEB48954}
#
# Name: disc
# ID: 92
# GUID: {D03EF191-3962-4540-929D-F5438CE59D79}
#
# Name: torus1
# ID: 68
# GUID: {1AC14CC7-1175-4E30-9CDD-BC0C0C1DE6EA}
#
# Name: sphere
# ID: 80
# GUID: {CC63558A-D5A3-4F55-8621-6D428FE2743A}
#
# Delete cylinder, save and re-open scene
# Name: disc
# ID: 92
# GUID: {D03EF191-3962-4540-929D-F5438CE59D79}
#
# Name: torus1
# ID: 69
# GUID: {1AC14CC7-1175-4E30-9CDD-BC0C0C1DE6EA}
#
# Name: sphere
# ID: 99
# GUID: {CC63558A-D5A3-4F55-8621-6D428FE2743A}
#
#
On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 6:38 PM, Matt Lind ml...@carbinestudios.com wrote:
This is not safe between sessions as IDs are dynamically generated and
assigned in the order objects were created in the scene. If an older
object is deleted and the scene reopened, everything after it will have a
new ID.
** **
Matt
** **
** **
** **
*From:* softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto:
softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] *On Behalf Of *Ciaran Moloney
*Sent:* Tuesday, June 04, 2013 8:52 AM
*To:* softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
*Subject:* Re: Persistent objects ids
** **
Hi,
did you try XSIUtils.DataRepository.GetIdentifier() passing the
siObjectGUID argument?
I've used this to keep track of ICE nodes without relying on name strings.
It's persistent between sessions and is preserved when models are exported.
Works like a charm.
The only problem is that it's possibly a bit tricky to get a pointer back
to the object, since you need to know what you're looking for. I use
Application.FindObjects()
to get a collection of objects of this class, then check for the ObjectGUID
I'm looking for.
** **
Ciaran
** **
** **
On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 12:49 PM, Michal Doniec doni...@gmail.com wrote:*
***
Hi,
** **
Is there any obvious way I am missing which would allow me to identify
objects in the scene, but not by name?
Something like ObjectID, but persistent between scene saves and loads. I
can generate UUID or something similar using ObjectAdded event and store
custom property but I'd rather avoid it.
** **
I want to be able to track objects regardless if they were renamed or not.
** **
--
--
Michal
http://uk.linkedin.com/in/mdoniec
** **
RE: Persistent objects ids
Object GUID is persistent, but not granular enough. I've run into cases where
multiple items get the same GUID. Same goes for CLSID.
Matt
From: softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] On Behalf Of Ciaran Moloney
Sent: Tuesday, June 04, 2013 3:55 PM
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Persistent objects ids
Yes, you're right...I can reproduce a change of ID when deleting an object and
re-opening a scene. However, I would not dismiss the object GUID, which appears
to persists between sessions despite the change in the object ID value. In the
below snippet the sphere object changed ID but not GUID.
# Name: cylinder
# ID: 114
# GUID: {090F2A9A-D1FC-4112-ACC5-9345BEB48954}
#
# Name: disc
# ID: 92
# GUID: {D03EF191-3962-4540-929D-F5438CE59D79}
#
# Name: torus1
# ID: 68
# GUID: {1AC14CC7-1175-4E30-9CDD-BC0C0C1DE6EA}
#
# Name: sphere
# ID: 80
# GUID: {CC63558A-D5A3-4F55-8621-6D428FE2743A}
#
# Delete cylinder, save and re-open scene
# Name: disc
# ID: 92
# GUID: {D03EF191-3962-4540-929D-F5438CE59D79}
#
# Name: torus1
# ID: 69
# GUID: {1AC14CC7-1175-4E30-9CDD-BC0C0C1DE6EA}
#
# Name: sphere
# ID: 99
# GUID: {CC63558A-D5A3-4F55-8621-6D428FE2743A}
#
#
On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 6:38 PM, Matt Lind
ml...@carbinestudios.commailto:ml...@carbinestudios.com wrote:
This is not safe between sessions as IDs are dynamically generated and assigned
in the order objects were created in the scene. If an older object is deleted
and the scene reopened, everything after it will have a new ID.
Matt
From:
softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.commailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com
[mailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.commailto:softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com]
On Behalf Of Ciaran Moloney
Sent: Tuesday, June 04, 2013 8:52 AM
To: softimage@listproc.autodesk.commailto:softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
Subject: Re: Persistent objects ids
Hi,
did you try XSIUtils.DataRepository.GetIdentifier() passing the siObjectGUID
argument?
I've used this to keep track of ICE nodes without relying on name strings. It's
persistent between sessions and is preserved when models are exported.
Works like a charm.
The only problem is that it's possibly a bit tricky to get a pointer back to
the object, since you need to know what you're looking for. I use
Application.FindObjects() to get a collection of objects of this class, then
check for the ObjectGUID I'm looking for.
Ciaran
On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 12:49 PM, Michal Doniec
doni...@gmail.commailto:doni...@gmail.com wrote:
Hi,
Is there any obvious way I am missing which would allow me to identify objects
in the scene, but not by name?
Something like ObjectID, but persistent between scene saves and loads. I can
generate UUID or something similar using ObjectAdded event and store custom
property but I'd rather avoid it.
I want to be able to track objects regardless if they were renamed or not.
--
--
Michal
http://uk.linkedin.com/in/mdoniec
Re: Persistent objects ids
So, if the GUID isn't unique, that's a pretty lousy algorithm
Luckily, I haven't observed that so far.
Ciaran
On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 11:57 PM, Matt Lind ml...@carbinestudios.com wrote:
Object GUID is persistent, but not granular enough. I’ve run into cases
where multiple items get the same GUID. Same goes for CLSID.
** **
Matt
** **
** **
** **
** **
** **
*From:* softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto:
softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] *On Behalf Of *Ciaran Moloney
*Sent:* Tuesday, June 04, 2013 3:55 PM
*To:* softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
*Subject:* Re: Persistent objects ids
** **
Yes, you're right...I can reproduce a change of ID when deleting an object
and re-opening a scene. However, I would not dismiss the object GUID, which
appears to persists between sessions despite the change in the object ID
value. In the below snippet the sphere object changed ID but not GUID.
** **
# Name: cylinder
# ID: 114
# GUID: {090F2A9A-D1FC-4112-ACC5-9345BEB48954}
#
# Name: disc
# ID: 92
# GUID: {D03EF191-3962-4540-929D-F5438CE59D79}
#
# Name: torus1
# ID: 68
# GUID: {1AC14CC7-1175-4E30-9CDD-BC0C0C1DE6EA}
#
# Name: sphere
# ID: 80
# GUID: {CC63558A-D5A3-4F55-8621-6D428FE2743A}
#
** **
# Delete cylinder, save and re-open scene
** **
# Name: disc
# ID: 92
# GUID: {D03EF191-3962-4540-929D-F5438CE59D79}
#
# Name: torus1
# ID: 69
# GUID: {1AC14CC7-1175-4E30-9CDD-BC0C0C1DE6EA}
#
# Name: sphere
# ID: 99
# GUID: {CC63558A-D5A3-4F55-8621-6D428FE2743A}
#
#
** **
** **
On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 6:38 PM, Matt Lind ml...@carbinestudios.com
wrote:
This is not safe between sessions as IDs are dynamically generated and
assigned in the order objects were created in the scene. If an older
object is deleted and the scene reopened, everything after it will have a
new ID.
Matt
*From:* softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto:
softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] *On Behalf Of *Ciaran Moloney
*Sent:* Tuesday, June 04, 2013 8:52 AM
*To:* softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
*Subject:* Re: Persistent objects ids
Hi,
did you try XSIUtils.DataRepository.GetIdentifier() passing the
siObjectGUID argument?
I've used this to keep track of ICE nodes without relying on name strings.
It's persistent between sessions and is preserved when models are exported.
Works like a charm.
The only problem is that it's possibly a bit tricky to get a pointer back
to the object, since you need to know what you're looking for. I use
Application.FindObjects()
to get a collection of objects of this class, then check for the ObjectGUID
I'm looking for.
Ciaran
On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 12:49 PM, Michal Doniec doni...@gmail.com wrote:*
***
Hi,
Is there any obvious way I am missing which would allow me to identify
objects in the scene, but not by name?
Something like ObjectID, but persistent between scene saves and loads. I
can generate UUID or something similar using ObjectAdded event and store
custom property but I'd rather avoid it.
I want to be able to track objects regardless if they were renamed or not.
--
--
Michal
http://uk.linkedin.com/in/mdoniec
** **
Re: Persistent objects ids
I doubt it's an issue with GUID at an algorithmic level, if two identical
GUID could be produced by the same person on the same project, and
therefore the conflict noticed, the windows world would be in very deep
S*** :)
Identical GUIDs on one platform should be centuries apart.
It's more likely a case of generation/re-use on Soft's side, either
intentional for non-obvious reasons or a bug.
On Wed, Jun 5, 2013 at 9:00 AM, Ciaran Moloney moloney.cia...@gmail.comwrote:
So, if the GUID isn't unique, that's a pretty lousy algorithm
Luckily, I haven't observed that so far.
Ciaran
On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 11:57 PM, Matt Lind ml...@carbinestudios.comwrote:
Object GUID is persistent, but not granular enough. I’ve run into cases
where multiple items get the same GUID. Same goes for CLSID.
** **
Matt
** **
** **
** **
** **
** **
*From:* softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto:
softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] *On Behalf Of *Ciaran Moloney
*Sent:* Tuesday, June 04, 2013 3:55 PM
*To:* softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
*Subject:* Re: Persistent objects ids
** **
Yes, you're right...I can reproduce a change of ID when deleting an
object and re-opening a scene. However, I would not dismiss the object
GUID, which appears to persists between sessions despite the change in the
object ID value. In the below snippet the sphere object changed ID but not
GUID.
** **
# Name: cylinder
# ID: 114
# GUID: {090F2A9A-D1FC-4112-ACC5-9345BEB48954}
#
# Name: disc
# ID: 92
# GUID: {D03EF191-3962-4540-929D-F5438CE59D79}
#
# Name: torus1
# ID: 68
# GUID: {1AC14CC7-1175-4E30-9CDD-BC0C0C1DE6EA}
#
# Name: sphere
# ID: 80
# GUID: {CC63558A-D5A3-4F55-8621-6D428FE2743A}
#
** **
# Delete cylinder, save and re-open scene
** **
# Name: disc
# ID: 92
# GUID: {D03EF191-3962-4540-929D-F5438CE59D79}
#
# Name: torus1
# ID: 69
# GUID: {1AC14CC7-1175-4E30-9CDD-BC0C0C1DE6EA}
#
# Name: sphere
# ID: 99
# GUID: {CC63558A-D5A3-4F55-8621-6D428FE2743A}
#
#
** **
** **
On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 6:38 PM, Matt Lind ml...@carbinestudios.com
wrote:
This is not safe between sessions as IDs are dynamically generated and
assigned in the order objects were created in the scene. If an older
object is deleted and the scene reopened, everything after it will have a
new ID.
Matt
*From:* softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto:
softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] *On Behalf Of *Ciaran Moloney
*Sent:* Tuesday, June 04, 2013 8:52 AM
*To:* softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
*Subject:* Re: Persistent objects ids
Hi,
did you try XSIUtils.DataRepository.GetIdentifier() passing the
siObjectGUID argument?
I've used this to keep track of ICE nodes without relying on name
strings. It's persistent between sessions and is preserved when models are
exported.
Works like a charm.
The only problem is that it's possibly a bit tricky to get a pointer back
to the object, since you need to know what you're looking for. I use
Application.FindObjects()
to get a collection of objects of this class, then check for the ObjectGUID
I'm looking for.
Ciaran
On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 12:49 PM, Michal Doniec doni...@gmail.com wrote:
Hi,
Is there any obvious way I am missing which would allow me to identify
objects in the scene, but not by name?
Something like ObjectID, but persistent between scene saves and loads. I
can generate UUID or something similar using ObjectAdded event and store
custom property but I'd rather avoid it.
I want to be able to track objects regardless if they were renamed or not.
--
--
Michal
http://uk.linkedin.com/in/mdoniec
** **
--
Our users will know fear and cower before our software! Ship it! Ship it
and let them flee like the dogs they are!
Re: Persistent objects ids
Yeah, I figured as much.
Not that I doubt Matt's observations, but it would be nice to have some
official word on the reliability of this method - unique ID's are a request
that come up all the time.
In the mean time I'll proceed with caution, since it's the simplest general
purpose solution.
Ciaran
On Wed, Jun 5, 2013 at 12:35 AM, Raffaele Fragapane
raffsxsil...@googlemail.com wrote:
I doubt it's an issue with GUID at an algorithmic level, if two identical
GUID could be produced by the same person on the same project, and
therefore the conflict noticed, the windows world would be in very deep
S*** :)
Identical GUIDs on one platform should be centuries apart.
It's more likely a case of generation/re-use on Soft's side, either
intentional for non-obvious reasons or a bug.
On Wed, Jun 5, 2013 at 9:00 AM, Ciaran Moloney
moloney.cia...@gmail.comwrote:
So, if the GUID isn't unique, that's a pretty lousy algorithm
Luckily, I haven't observed that so far.
Ciaran
On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 11:57 PM, Matt Lind ml...@carbinestudios.comwrote:
Object GUID is persistent, but not granular enough. I’ve run into cases
where multiple items get the same GUID. Same goes for CLSID.
** **
Matt
** **
** **
** **
** **
** **
*From:* softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto:
softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] *On Behalf Of *Ciaran Moloney
*Sent:* Tuesday, June 04, 2013 3:55 PM
*To:* softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
*Subject:* Re: Persistent objects ids
** **
Yes, you're right...I can reproduce a change of ID when deleting an
object and re-opening a scene. However, I would not dismiss the object
GUID, which appears to persists between sessions despite the change in the
object ID value. In the below snippet the sphere object changed ID but not
GUID.
** **
# Name: cylinder
# ID: 114
# GUID: {090F2A9A-D1FC-4112-ACC5-9345BEB48954}
#
# Name: disc
# ID: 92
# GUID: {D03EF191-3962-4540-929D-F5438CE59D79}
#
# Name: torus1
# ID: 68
# GUID: {1AC14CC7-1175-4E30-9CDD-BC0C0C1DE6EA}
#
# Name: sphere
# ID: 80
# GUID: {CC63558A-D5A3-4F55-8621-6D428FE2743A}
#
** **
# Delete cylinder, save and re-open scene
** **
# Name: disc
# ID: 92
# GUID: {D03EF191-3962-4540-929D-F5438CE59D79}
#
# Name: torus1
# ID: 69
# GUID: {1AC14CC7-1175-4E30-9CDD-BC0C0C1DE6EA}
#
# Name: sphere
# ID: 99
# GUID: {CC63558A-D5A3-4F55-8621-6D428FE2743A}
#
#
** **
** **
On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 6:38 PM, Matt Lind ml...@carbinestudios.com
wrote:
This is not safe between sessions as IDs are dynamically generated and
assigned in the order objects were created in the scene. If an older
object is deleted and the scene reopened, everything after it will have a
new ID.
Matt
*From:* softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto:
softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] *On Behalf Of *Ciaran Moloney
*Sent:* Tuesday, June 04, 2013 8:52 AM
*To:* softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
*Subject:* Re: Persistent objects ids
Hi,
did you try XSIUtils.DataRepository.GetIdentifier() passing the
siObjectGUID argument?
I've used this to keep track of ICE nodes without relying on name
strings. It's persistent between sessions and is preserved when models are
exported.
Works like a charm.
The only problem is that it's possibly a bit tricky to get a pointer
back to the object, since you need to know what you're looking for. I use
Application.FindObjects()
to get a collection of objects of this class, then check for the ObjectGUID
I'm looking for.
Ciaran
On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 12:49 PM, Michal Doniec doni...@gmail.com
wrote:
Hi,
Is there any obvious way I am missing which would allow me to identify
objects in the scene, but not by name?
Something like ObjectID, but persistent between scene saves and loads. I
can generate UUID or something similar using ObjectAdded event and store
custom property but I'd rather avoid it.
I want to be able to track objects regardless if they were renamed or
not.
--
--
Michal
http://uk.linkedin.com/in/mdoniec
** **
--
Our users will know fear and cower before our software! Ship it! Ship it
and let them flee like the dogs they are!
Re: Persistent objects ids
I tend to agree with Matt, and to be really honest granting UID persistency
in a large software is frequently done on the side, specifically with that
intention, and either user controlled, or if left to heuristics either very
conservative or very changing (IE: at what point do you decide to lock an
ID? On creaiton? On Topo change? What happens if you swap the primitive
like you can do with Curves?).
Your best bet is emulating the above yourself by tagging objects at the
stages you want to ID them, and changing it if and when you need it. It's
actually not hard to do in terms of difficulty, but it can result in a
large and pervasive toolset before it's reliable enough, which is probably
why Michal outlined he'd rather avoid it.
It's what we do in a couple places actually to support name agnostic
operations in our pipe (plenty renaming happening since, in example, the
same rig can be imported several times for different characters).
I'm afraid there's little alternative to controlling this yourself, and to
be honest this is a rather generig CS problem more so than it's a Softimage
specific one.
The Identity of an item is a very ambiguous and volatile concept that every
user and pipeline will have a different idea of the extent of.
What Soft might want to do is offer an open parameter with a creation ID,
that way there's always something fairly static couple with the object, and
leave it to the user to modify it if they require more frequent mutation
than the first time the primitive comes into existence. This will need to
be wrapped around by every command offering creation of sorts. Gets,
Extracts, Duplicates and so on.
Log the request if you feel it's important.
On Wed, Jun 5, 2013 at 9:49 AM, Ciaran Moloney moloney.cia...@gmail.comwrote:
Yeah, I figured as much.
Not that I doubt Matt's observations, but it would be nice to have some
official word on the reliability of this method - unique ID's are a request
that come up all the time.
In the mean time I'll proceed with caution, since it's the simplest
general purpose solution.
Ciaran
On Wed, Jun 5, 2013 at 12:35 AM, Raffaele Fragapane
raffsxsil...@googlemail.com wrote:
I doubt it's an issue with GUID at an algorithmic level, if two identical
GUID could be produced by the same person on the same project, and
therefore the conflict noticed, the windows world would be in very deep
S*** :)
Identical GUIDs on one platform should be centuries apart.
It's more likely a case of generation/re-use on Soft's side, either
intentional for non-obvious reasons or a bug.
On Wed, Jun 5, 2013 at 9:00 AM, Ciaran Moloney
moloney.cia...@gmail.comwrote:
So, if the GUID isn't unique, that's a pretty lousy algorithm
Luckily, I haven't observed that so far.
Ciaran
On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 11:57 PM, Matt Lind ml...@carbinestudios.comwrote:
Object GUID is persistent, but not granular enough. I’ve run into
cases where multiple items get the same GUID. Same goes for CLSID.***
*
** **
Matt
** **
** **
** **
** **
** **
*From:* softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto:
softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] *On Behalf Of *Ciaran Moloney
*Sent:* Tuesday, June 04, 2013 3:55 PM
*To:* softimage@listproc.autodesk.com
*Subject:* Re: Persistent objects ids
** **
Yes, you're right...I can reproduce a change of ID when deleting an
object and re-opening a scene. However, I would not dismiss the object
GUID, which appears to persists between sessions despite the change in the
object ID value. In the below snippet the sphere object changed ID but not
GUID.
** **
# Name: cylinder
# ID: 114
# GUID: {090F2A9A-D1FC-4112-ACC5-9345BEB48954}
#
# Name: disc
# ID: 92
# GUID: {D03EF191-3962-4540-929D-F5438CE59D79}
#
# Name: torus1
# ID: 68
# GUID: {1AC14CC7-1175-4E30-9CDD-BC0C0C1DE6EA}
#
# Name: sphere
# ID: 80
# GUID: {CC63558A-D5A3-4F55-8621-6D428FE2743A}
#
** **
# Delete cylinder, save and re-open scene
** **
# Name: disc
# ID: 92
# GUID: {D03EF191-3962-4540-929D-F5438CE59D79}
#
# Name: torus1
# ID: 69
# GUID: {1AC14CC7-1175-4E30-9CDD-BC0C0C1DE6EA}
#
# Name: sphere
# ID: 99
# GUID: {CC63558A-D5A3-4F55-8621-6D428FE2743A}
#
#
** **
** **
On Tue, Jun 4, 2013 at 6:38 PM, Matt Lind ml...@carbinestudios.com
wrote:
This is not safe between sessions as IDs are dynamically generated and
assigned in the order objects were created in the scene. If an older
object is deleted and the scene reopened, everything after it will have a
new ID.
Matt
*From:* softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com [mailto:
softimage-boun...@listproc.autodesk.com] *On Behalf Of *Ciaran Moloney
*Sent:* Tuesday, June 04, 2013 8:52 AM
*To:* softimage
