RE: CPVC leak
Are you allowed to fill CPVC pipe-work with compressed air? Check it out. -Original Message- From: Jim Davidson [mailto:jdavid...@davidsonassociates.net] Sent: 14 November 2012 21:09 To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: CPVC leak Be very careful about introduction of a foreign substance into a CPVC pipe system, need to check if the odorant is compatible with CPVC piping. You do not want to introduce a substance that could cause environmental stress cracking. If you do, you have just brought the system. Regards Jim DAVIDSON ASSOCIATES Fire Protection Engineering P. O. Box 4010 Code ConsultantsGreenville, DE 19807-0010 Medical Gas Systems Engineering (302) 994-9500 Fax (302) 234-1781 -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Matt Grise Sent: Wednesday, November 14, 2012 2:16 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: CPVC leak Did the owner who drained it note anything about the leak? Is there any evidence of water/glycerin staining? Matt Grisé PE*, LEED AP, NICET II Sales Engineer Alliance Fire Protection 130 w 9th Ave. North Kansas City, MO 64116 *Licensed in KS MO 913.888.0647 ph 913.888.0618 f 913.927.0222 cell www. AFPsprink.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Steve Johnson Sent: Wednesday, November 14, 2012 1:09 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: CPVC leak Need some input: Working on an existing CPVC system which original owner drained glycerin out of the system because of a leak. We have tried to find the leak with 40 psi of air pressure, still unable to find a leak. Has anyone introduced a smell into the system with the air pressure to find such a leak. If so, what could we use for the smell? Steve Johnson Office:801.295.1189 Fax: 801.295.1193 Cell: 801.301.3950 www.chpfire.com http://www.google.com/search?q=chaparral+fire+protection+ie=utf-8oe=u tf-8aq=trls=org.mozilla:en-US:officialclient=firefox-a http://www.facebook.com/pages/Chaparral-Fire-Protection/110753688988876 -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/private/sprinklerforum/attachments/20121114/1383ddee/attachment.html -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image001.png Type: image/png Size: 14568 bytes Desc: image001.png URL: http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/private/sprinklerforum/attachments/20121114/1383ddee/attachment.png -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image002.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 959 bytes Desc: image002.jpg URL: http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/private/sprinklerforum/attachments/20121114/1383ddee/attachment.jpg -- next part -- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: image003.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 937 bytes Desc: image003.jpg URL: http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/private/sprinklerforum/attachments/20121114/1383ddee/attachment-0001.jpg ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum
Re: flow per sprinkler
Flow and pressure are related, as you stated below. Most of the time you will start with a known flow which is based on your density and sprinkler area. However, there are portions of code and/or manufacturer's requirements that start off with a required pressure. Duane - Original Message - From: Jeff Garrison [mailto:jeffgarrison1...@gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, November 14, 2012 03:02 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: flow per sprinkler Flow depends upon pressure, your calculated numbers are corrrect... On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 2:40 PM, Rubén Miranda Idrovo seus...@hotmail.comwrote: Hi evreybody: I¨m new in the sprinklers world so I have a question every sprinkler (ESFR, CMDA, CMSA) have a fixed flow value (GPM) no matter the pressure??? or the flow is up to the pressure value??? for example an ESFR k 16.8 according to the k formula k=Q/ P^(1/2) with 64 PSI flow will be 134.4 GPM with 50 PSI flow will be 118.7 GPM Is this right??? -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/private/sprinklerforum/attachments/20121114/d1c5ed0c/attachment.html ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/private/sprinklerforum/attachments/20121114/da227ed4/attachment.html ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum
AFSA Storage Webinar
A little AFSA cheerleading today. Yesterday the AFSA sponsored a webinar on storage applications. James Golinveaux from Tyco was the presenter. Two hours in length and worth every penny of my membership dues. First seminar where I had outstanding evaluation marks in every category and actually meant it. He had tables and flow charts and detailed comparisons of NFPA 13 and FM storage rules, along with videos. He covered the new EC applications, the 6-head designs, cautions in making sure your open racks don't turn into solid shelving because of slip ups in flue space allocation, etc. Just like George Church says, membership is a great idea. I'm in. Bill Brooks ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum
Re: AFSA Storage Webinar
Ditto. It also answered the question for a concurrent thread Sent from my iPhone On Nov 15, 2012, at 9:10 AM, Bill Brooks bill.bro...@brooksfpe.com wrote: A little AFSA cheerleading today. Yesterday the AFSA sponsored a webinar on storage applications. James Golinveaux from Tyco was the presenter. Two hours in length and worth every penny of my membership dues. First seminar where I had outstanding evaluation marks in every category and actually meant it. He had tables and flow charts and detailed comparisons of NFPA 13 and FM storage rules, along with videos. He covered the new EC applications, the 6-head designs, cautions in making sure your open racks don't turn into solid shelving because of slip ups in flue space allocation, etc. Just like George Church says, membership is a great idea. I'm in. Bill Brooks ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum
Re: AFSA Storage Webinar
Give me an A! Give me an F! Give me an S! Give me an A! What's THAT SPELL? AFSA! What's THAT SPELL? AFSA! What's THAT SPELL? AFSA! American Fire Sprinkler Association! YAY AFSA. A better valure for your dollar than cable and ESPN. On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 6:58 AM, Todd - FPDC t...@fpdc.com wrote: Ditto. It also answered the question for a concurrent thread Sent from my iPhone On Nov 15, 2012, at 9:10 AM, Bill Brooks bill.bro...@brooksfpe.com wrote: A little AFSA cheerleading today. Yesterday the AFSA sponsored a webinar on storage applications. James Golinveaux from Tyco was the presenter. Two hours in length and worth every penny of my membership dues. First seminar where I had outstanding evaluation marks in every category and actually meant it. He had tables and flow charts and detailed comparisons of NFPA 13 and FM storage rules, along with videos. He covered the new EC applications, the 6-head designs, cautions in making sure your open racks don't turn into solid shelving because of slip ups in flue space allocation, etc. Just like George Church says, membership is a great idea. I'm in. Bill Brooks ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum -- Ron Greenman Instructor Fire Protection Engineering Technology Bates Technical College 1101 So. Yakima Ave. Tacoma, WA 98405 rgreen...@bates.ctc.edu http://www.bates.ctc.edu/fireprotection/ 253.680.7346 253.576.9700 (cell) Member: ASEE, SFPE, ASCET, NFPA, AFSA, NFSA, AFAA, NIBS, WSAFM, WFC, WFSC They are happy men whose natures sort with their vocations. -Francis Bacon, essayist, philosopher, and statesman (1561-1626) -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/private/sprinklerforum/attachments/20121115/99d464cf/attachment.html ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum
Re: AFSA Storage Webinar
I was fortunate enough to see the same presentation last week at the ASCET meeting in King of Prussia and even though the AFSA one was a repeat for me, I still found info that I missed and I also got the slides too! Richard -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/private/sprinklerforum/attachments/20121115/5c1c8ffa/attachment.html ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum
Re: AFSA Storage Webinar
Seeing the videos again was also a kicker. I had everyone in the office around for the exposed expanded plastics fire. Benjamin Young On Thu, Nov 15, 2012 at 11:25 AM, Richard Lindner rklindner.w...@gmail.comwrote: I was fortunate enough to see the same presentation last week at the ASCET meeting in King of Prussia and even though the AFSA one was a repeat for me, I still found info that I missed and I also got the slides too! Richard -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/private/sprinklerforum/attachments/20121115/5c1c8ffa/attachment.html ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/private/sprinklerforum/attachments/20121115/a2914051/attachment.html ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum
Re: AFSA Storage Webinar
The sprinkler fish cheer? At 11:21 AM 11/15/2012, you wrote: Give me an A! Give me an F! Give me an S! Give me an A! What's THAT SPELL? AFSA! What's THAT SPELL? AFSA! What's THAT SPELL? AFSA! American Fire Sprinkler Association! YAY Todd G. Williams, PE Fire Protection Design/Consulting Stonington, CT 860.535.2080 www.fpdc.com ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum
Standpipe Calc
Existing hospital with 5 standpipes. New addition will have two SP's with standalone pump and underground supply. The new addition SP is not connected to the existing SP system. The addition is only 30k sqft but the entire hospital is over 80K sqft. Can the new addition be calc'd for 500 250 or must it be 500 + 500? Ron Fletcher Aero Phoenix ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum
Re: Standpipe Calc
Why aren't they connected? - Original Message - From: rfletc...@aerofire.com [mailto:rfletc...@aerofire.com] Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2012 05:07 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Standpipe Calc Existing hospital with 5 standpipes. New addition will have two SP's with standalone pump and underground supply. The new addition SP is not connected to the existing SP system. The addition is only 30k sqft but the entire hospital is over 80K sqft. Can the new addition be calc'd for 500 250 or must it be 500 + 500? Ron Fletcher Aero Phoenix ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum
RE: New Jersey
Hi Bruce, Had the pleasure of working with electricians from Seattle doing electrical service assessments the other night. Although we had all been working since 7am they and the rest of the crew, new jersey, illinois, florida, mississipi, massachusetts, ohio and alabama stayed on until 10:30pm restoring service to hundreds of residents in the borough of little silver. John -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Bruce Verhei Sent: Saturday, November 10, 2012 3:52 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: New Jersey John Power crews and their vehicles have come from as far as Seattle City Light and California via the 62nd Air Wing and their handy C-17's. Bv Sent from my Motorola ATRIX™ 4G on ATT -Original message- From: John Drucker jdruc...@redbanknj.org To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Sent: Sat, Nov 10, 2012 08:07:59 GMT+00:00 Subject: Re: New Jersey Power is back on in most of the state. People are being let back into coastal areas including the barrier islands but finding their homes severly damaged or destroyed. Tens of thousands displaced. Fema reps working to assist w aid and grants. Warm weather is forecast for this weekend which will give everyone a break. Red cross and Salvation army are on the ground, financial donations to these is appreciated. More utility crews being brought in from southern states as well as state police from as far as mississipi. Damage assessments may run as high as 50 billion. Lots of rebuilding work and contractors needed. State DCA has hired inspectors to assist local jurisdictions. Fuel is still a problem with odd/even rationing in effect. Unfortunately problems have occurred , fuel hoarding, storing large quantitys in vehicles and homes, generators being hooked directly to pumps in violation of NEC. With power restored tripped dry systems are being drained and restored in advance of c old weather. Thanks to all who helped out ! John Drucker - Mobile Email - Original Message - From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Sent: Fri Nov 02 11:14:08 2012 Subject: RE: New Jersey Thanks John, Cold weather is forecast this weekend and 1.5 million homes are without power. The situation is dire, if anyone has family or friends in the northeast please reach out and contact them, help in any way you can. People are running out of fuel, only 35% of the gas stations are open and lines miles long for cars and hundreds of feet long for generators. Anyone you can help is important. John Drucker New Jersey -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of 321 Sent: Thursday, November 01, 2012 6:21 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: New Jersey John, We here in South Florida know all too well what you are experiencing. Our hearts and prayers are with you all. Know that it will get better and that the Calvary is coming. John W. Farabee, Vice President Bass United Fire and Security 561-707-5150 From: John Drucker jdruc...@redbanknj.org To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Sent: Thu, November 1, 2012 4:08:40 AM Subject: New Jersey Thursday widespread power still out . Major roads cleared of debris and trees. Fuel is precious commodity, lines for gas were two miles long on garden state parkway. Food was starting to be a problem but some stores reopened on generators brought in or partial power restored. Our beautiful coastline and historic locations are mere memories. Sadly people have died as a result. Gov and Pres toured yesterday, send money. Flooding has destroyed or damaged buildings and electrical equipment. On the tech side lots of tripped dry valves and unpowered fire pumps. All in all were lucky. John Drucker - Mobile Email - Original Message - From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Sent: Wed Oct 31 15:47:20 2012 Subject: Re: Sodium Silicate Several reasons Sodium silicate is a white powder that is readily soluble in water, producing an alkaline http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alkaline solution. It is one of a number of related compounds which include sodium orthosilicatehttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Orthosilicate, Na4SiO4, sodium pyrosilicatehttp://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Pyrosilicateaction=e ditredlink=1, Na6Si2O7, and others. All are glassy http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glassy, colourless and dissolve in water. Sodium silicate is stable in neutral http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PH and alkaline http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alkaline solutionshttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solution. In acidic
RE: Standpipe Calc
If not separate fire areas, it looks like 500+500 (instead of +250). But then what about the existing building; Wouldn't you have to prove 500+500 for that arrangement now also? -Original Message- From: rfletc...@aerofire.com [mailto:rfletc...@aerofire.com] Sent: Thursday, November 15, 2012 4:07 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Standpipe Calc Existing hospital with 5 standpipes. New addition will have two SP's with standalone pump and underground supply. The new addition SP is not connected to the existing SP system. The addition is only 30k sqft but the entire hospital is over 80K sqft. Can the new addition be calc'd for 500 250 or must it be 500 + 500? Ron Fletcher Aero Phoenix ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum
RE: New Jersey
/sprinklerforum -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/private/sprinklerforum/attachment s/20121101/cb9c15f4/attachment.html ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum CONFIDENTIAL AND PROPRIETARY: This email message is intended only for the use of the individual or entity to which it is addressed and may contain information that is privileged and confidential, nor is it, unless specifically stated, intended to be relied upon by any person or persons other than the individual or entity named above and no warranties or representations are made or intended to persons or entities not named above. If the reader is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by telephone, return this message to the address above and delete all copies. Thank you. -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/private/sprinklerforum/attachments/20121110/9437b836/attachment.html ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/private/sprinklerforum/attachments/20121110/0f323859/attachment.html ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/private/sprinklerforum/attachments/20121115/ef969dc6/attachment.html ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum
RE: New Jersey
: http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/private/sprinklerforum/attachment s/20121101/088e2c26/attachment.html ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/private/sprinklerforum/attachment s/20121101/cb9c15f4/attachment.html ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum CONFIDENTIAL AND PROPRIETARY: This email message is intended only for the use of the individual or entity to which it is addressed and may contain information that is privileged and confidential, nor is it, unless specifically stated, intended to be relied upon by any person or persons other than the individual or entity named above and no warranties or representations are made or intended to persons or entities not named above. If the reader is not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please notify us immediately by telephone, return this message to the address above and delete all copies. Thank you. -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/private/sprinklerforum/attachments/20121110/9437b836/attachment.html ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/private/sprinklerforum/attachments/20121110/0f323859/attachment.html ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/private/sprinklerforum/attachments/20121115/ef969dc6/attachment.html ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/private/sprinklerforum/attachments/20121115/0b66d1e9/attachment.html ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum
ISO
Are there any forum members here ISO certified? TD ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum
water storage tank: 300,000 gallon size: failure
Does anyone know and care to share, whether the ~ 300,000 gallon tank that failed about the 7th of April in Lake Placid, NY in 2011 was a welded, or a bolted tank? I am doing no litigation work, nor I am being paid by any party relative to this incident. http://www.wtsp.com/news/topstories/article/185855/250/Massive-water-tank-bursts-kills-two-following-tsunami-like-wave Scot Deal Excelsior Fire Engineering -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/private/sprinklerforum/attachments/20121116/c414834e/attachment.html ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list Sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum
