date:20060720

Charles,
   The impeller in the clearwater pump is metal. Plastic impellers will 
eventually fail in pumps used to agitate the reaction.
 My experience w. the clearwater pump is that it will handle up to 90L 
(~ 24 gal) batches. Above that, even after three hours reaction time, I have 
gotten incomplete reactions.
 Congratulations on your success scaling up.

 Tom
- Original Message - 
From: Charles List [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Wednesday, July 19, 2006 7:43 PM
Subject: [Biofuel] Pump choice


 Hi All

 Thanks to all who have advised me this last few months, I am now a
 biofueller! 105l batches, good product. Unfortunately, after 10 good
 batches, my pump has started spraying out of the back of the impeller
 housing. So I took it apart and the impeller has broken up and the
 housing has been eaten through at the back, around the mechanical
 seal. It was 30 years old or so, free and a plastic spa pump, so I'm
 not too distressed, but I obviously don't want it happening again.

 I notice that the clearwater pump used by JtF is made of cast iron,
 so should my next pump be made of metal? Also, is the impeller in the
 clearwater pump  plastic? As I know you can get some with stainless
 steel blades, I wonder my impeller break-up was due to age or chemicals.

 Thanks

 Charles List
 -- 
 --
 This email was sent using Telecom SchoolZone.
www.schoolzone.net.nz

 This email has been scanned for viruses by Telecom SchoolZone,
 but is not guaranteed to be virus-free.
 --

 ___
 Biofuel mailing list
 Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

 Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
 http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

 Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 
 messages):
 http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/


 



___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] breakthrough - store CH4 at 500psi instead of 3600

2006-07-20 Thread bob allen


I did a little hyway driving last weekend in my (really my wife's) 
Prius:  at 65 mph we got 54 mpg, 60 about 56 mpg and at 50 mph an 
honest 61+ mpg.  Essentially flat and windless conditions.

Zeke Yewdall wrote:
 Yeah, I know about the getting passed like you are standing still.  My 
 truck will do 65 to 70mph on the highway, which isn't bad for a 4 
 cylinder diesel engine -- probably rated at less horsepower than the 
 stock ford ranger engine in roughly the same size truck.   It was funny 
 driving it down through montana and wyoming to colorado -- in wyoming 
 and montana it was fine in the right lane, and the left lane wasn't that 
 much faster except for a few outlying speedsters.  But as soon as I 
 crossed the Colorado border, even the right lane was annoyed at me, and 
 the left lane was probably 15 to 20mph faster than me.
 
 On 7/19/06, *robert and benita rabello* [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
 Zeke Yewdall wrote:
 
   Isn't that interesting that the North American driver is willing to
   sacrifice the world and condemn billions of people to a slow painful
   death, rather than accept a 10% decrease in how fast they can go in
   their car  Although I suppose they don't think of it that way.
 
 
 We just drove for 24 hours going to Los Angeles and back.  It's hard
 to drive slow for that long on the open highway.  I put the cruise
 control on the Camry at 110 km / hour and averaged 6.2 liters / 100 km
 for the trip.  (That's a little over 40 mpg for you who are metrically
 challenged.)  Air conditioning and hills REALLY drain fuel economy, as
 does going fast.  My best fuel mileage occured on flat roads at 90 km /
 hour, where the car would easily do 5.5 liters / 100 km.  The only time
 we accomplished that kind of economy happened between San Jose and Paso
 Robles, which is a relatively flat section of highway.
 
 But we were often getting passed like we were standing still!
 
 Your remark is cogent.  I don't think people here actually make the
 connection between their driving habits and the impact these have on
 the
 earth.  We saw a fair number of hybrids on the trip--they're becoming
 more common now--and most of the people who were driving them tried to
 drive in a more sane manner than the rest of the folk on the freeway.
 In Los Angeles, however, the hybrids get to use the HOV lanes, and if
 you're not driving at least 120 km / hour, other motorists become rather
 annoyed!
 
 I put the blower on my truck in part because I eventually intend to
 run it on some kind of gaseous fuel, but the best thing I can do with
 that machine is simply NOT drive it at all.  Working from home really
 helps . . .
 
 robert luis rabello
 The Edge of Justice
 Adventure for Your Mind
 http://www.newadventure.ca
 
 Ranger Supercharger Project Page
 http://www.members.shaw.ca/rabello/
 http://www.members.shaw.ca/rabello/
 
 
 ___
 Biofuel mailing list
 Biofuel@sustainablelists.org mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org
 
 Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
 http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
 
 Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000
 messages):
 http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
 
 
 
 
 
 ___
 Biofuel mailing list
 Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org
 
 Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
 http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
 
 Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
 http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
 


-- 
--
Bob Allen,http://ozarker.org/bob
--
-
The modern conservative is engaged in one of Man's oldest exercises
in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral
justification for selfishness  JKG
 


___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

[Biofuel] Smacking the hornet's nest

I can't say I am always a fan of the Israeli government right or wrong, 
and let's be honest, they've made some mistakes (but then look at the US 
gov't), but they are
in an impossible spot.  Do they need some nudging to do they right 
thing? Yes, but we all do.

Let's stop and think, Why are they where they are?  - Because NO 
Western country would take then. Roosevelt turned away of boatload of 
Jewish refugees.  They really didn't have a lot of options.  In Poland, 
TWO YEARS after WWII ended, there was a massacre of Jews.  I can 
understand why one might gamble on a boat trip to (then) British 
Palestine rather than go home to Europe.

Personally, I think the whole idea was ill-conceived, and US should have 
settled the refugees in the largely unocupied American West.  Heck, a 
state even.

Besides, I think if you wait long enough, Fritz, you'll see the same 
behavior here anyway.  We're already denying blacks the right to vote in 
some states, and it's pretty much illegal to be black in a white area 
after dark already. 

 Step one is to confiscate the land owned by
African-Americans, [or Native Americans] evict them from it and use the land
to build massive new subdivisions. Only white
Protestant Christians may live in these subdivisions. - Check, doing 
that here.

I notice you're in Canada - do you live in a house?  Where did the land 
come from?  A friendly Algonkin 
http://www.accessgenealogy.com/native/tribes/algonquian/algonhist1.htm  
give it to you?  I notice the Canadia Government has been
having a little trouble with its First Nation denizens - a few Mohawk 
lawsuits  here and there. 

Don't judge, so that you won't be judged.

http://bible.cc/matthew/7-2.htmFor with whatever judgment you judge, 
you will be judged; and with whatever measure you measure, it will be 
measured to you.

^3 http://bible.cc/matthew/7-3.htm Why do you see the speck that is in 
your brother's eye, but don't consider the beam that is in your own eye?

Or, let he who is free from sin cast the first stone.

-Mike


Fritz Friesinger wrote:

 Bob,
 i bett you havent wread the report of www.btselem.org 
 http://www.btselem.org
 you would not talk such rhubbish!
 Fritz

 - Original Message -
 *From:* Bob Molloy mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 *To:* Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 *Sent:* Wednesday, July 19, 2006 6:52 PM
 *Subject:* Re: [Biofuel] Check Your Beliefs

 Yo Fritz,
 Yeah, right on Fritz. And just to prove it your ethnic forebears
 killed off six million of these bloody Jews only to have the rest
 of us dumb westerners stop them just before they'd finished the
 job. Now it's up to the poor Palestinians with only suicide
 bombers and Katushya rockets to carry on where the rest of us left
 off. We need to force the Israelis to open these roads, tear down
 their walls and move back onto their own territory so that the
 bombers in civilian clothing have a fighting chance to get closer
 to Israeli settlements.  At least let's have a level playing field
 here. After it's all over and the Palestinians have finally
 established their Muslim state we can allow a few Israeli refugees
 into western countries just as long as they toe the line and run
 the garbage collection systems for us.
 Good one, Fritz,
 Bob. 

 - Original Message -
 *From:* Fritz Friesinger mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 *To:* Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 *Sent:* Thursday, July 20, 2006 1:33 AM
 *Subject:* [Biofuel] Check Your Beliefs

 Forewardet by Fritz
  
 
 --

 Check Your Beliefs

 By Charley Reese

 03/17/06 -- -- Let's play a fantasy game to check on
 our belief in human rights. Let's suppose that in a
 mythical state, a governor announced a campaign to
 punish African-Americans for alleged violence.

 Step one is to confiscate the land owned by
 African-Americans, evict them from it and use the land
 to build massive new subdivisions. Only white
 Protestant Christians may live in these subdivisions.

 Step two is to connect these all-white Protestant
 Christian settlements to each other by a highway on
 which African-Americans are forbidden to drive. To
 facilitate control, the automobile tags for
 African-Americans will be a different color from the
 tags issued to white motorists. Checkpoints would be
 set up all around the state capitol to search and
 harass African-Americans trying to enter.

 Would you support such a plan? Would you hail that
 mythical governor as a man of peace? Would you go to
 your church congregation and ask the members to send
 money to

Re: [Biofuel] Check Your Beliefs

Up until the 2nd WW there were as many if not more anti-semitic acts in 
the US than Europe.

Zeke Yewdall wrote:

 Actually, it seems to me that the US and Europe created Israel because 
 we felt bad about the holocaust, but not enough to actually want to 
 stop their anti-semitism so they found a place where the Jew's 
 could have a homeland, without inconveniencing any Europeans.  It 
 makes us feel better about the holocaust to say that we support 
 Israel, but I think it's rather condemning of us westerners that we 
 still fight antisemitism at home, rather unsucessfully at times, and 
 only support Jews when there are no westerners to be inconvenienced by 
 them, in Israel. If we really wanted to atone for the holocaust, is 
 shipping the Jews off to a far off land where we don't have to deal 
 with them the best way to show this?  It seems to me that this is 
 almost as insulting to the Jews as it is to the Palistinians, though 
 obviously billions of dollars of military support goes some way 
 towards placating the insult. 

 On 7/19/06, *Bob Molloy* [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Yo Fritz,
 Yeah, right on Fritz. And just to prove it your ethnic forebears
 killed off six million of these bloody Jews only to have the rest
 of us dumb westerners stop them just before they'd finished the
 job. Now it's up to the poor Palestinians with only suicide
 bombers and Katushya rockets to carry on where the rest of us left
 off. We need to force the Israelis to open these roads, tear down
 their walls and move back onto their own territory so that the
 bombers in civilian clothing have a fighting chance to get closer
 to Israeli settlements.  At least let's have a level playing field
 here. After it's all over and the Palestinians have finally
 established their Muslim state we can allow a few Israeli refugees
 into western countries just as long as they toe the line and run
 the garbage collection systems for us.
 Good one, Fritz,
 Bob. 
 - Original Message -
 *From:* Fritz Friesinger mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 *To:* Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 *Sent:* Thursday, July 20, 2006 1:33 AM
 *Subject:* [Biofuel] Check Your Beliefs

 Forewardet by Fritz
  
 --

 Check Your Beliefs

 By Charley Reese

 03/17/06 -- -- Let's play a fantasy game to check on
 our belief in human rights. Let's suppose that in a
 mythical state, a governor announced a campaign to
 punish African-Americans for alleged violence.

 Step one is to confiscate the land owned by
 African-Americans, evict them from it and use the land
 to build massive new subdivisions. Only white
 Protestant Christians may live in these subdivisions.

 Step two is to connect these all-white Protestant
 Christian settlements to each other by a highway on
 which African-Americans are forbidden to drive. To
 facilitate control, the automobile tags for
 African-Americans will be a different color from the
 tags issued to white motorists. Checkpoints would be
 set up all around the state capitol to search and
 harass African-Americans trying to enter.

 Would you support such a plan? Would you hail that
 mythical governor as a man of peace? Would you go to
 your church congregation and ask the members to send
 money to the occupants of these white settlements?
 Would you lobby the federal government to subsidize
 this new apartheid state in our midst?

 I don't think so. I think most Americans would
 consider such acts an abomination, un-American and a
 mockery of everything both Christianity and the United
 States stand for.

 Well, if you would condemn such acts here directed
 against African-Americans, why won't you condemn
 identical acts committed against the Palestinians by
 the state of Israel?

 Those settlements you hear about are built on
 Palestinian land, and they are for Jews only. New
 roads that Palestinians are forbidden to use connect
 them. The entire West Bank is riddled with Israeli
 checkpoints, where innocent Palestinians are daily
 humiliated and harassed. A trip to a nearby village
 can mean waiting in line at checkpoints for hours.
 Palestinians have died in these lines.

 After all of these humiliations, abuses, the houses
 destroyed, the children killed, the olive trees
 uprooted, how do you think Palestinians feel about
 Americans who support the Israelis no matter what they
 do to the Palestinians? Don't take my word about these
 abuses. Check out the Israeli human-rights
 organization at www.btselem.org/English
 http://www.btselem.org/English.

 If you cannot condemn the flagrant abuses of

Re: [Biofuel] Cause of New Plymouth biodiesel explosion released

I was 19 or so. I got too close to a fuel tank (2-3) feet with a
cutting wheel on a Ingersol air rotary. I was cutting off the exhaust
system. He smacked me in the back of the head with his rather large
hand, put his cigar-chomping face into mine and explained the facts of
gas, fumes, flames and explosions. He then offered to slap me into
next week if I had any problems with it. Needless to say, the lesson took.

Bill Ellis wrote:

Hey Mike,

Ditto on the water filled gas tank, course back then it seems folks
had just a smidge more in the common sense department. In addition if
my boss had caught me even close to a gas tank with a torch I would
have been in the unemployment line.

*/Mike Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED]/* wrote:

I feel sorry for the guy and his family but using a torch around
methanol?
Back in my wrenching days my boss made sure we knew an empty gas tank
was more danergous than a full one, and god forbid you did any
welding the gas tank had to be filled with water first.

Appal Energy wrote:

A bad day at Black Rock...

http://www.ktvb.com/news/localnews/stories/ktvbn-jul1406-explosion_cause.113ae8b1.html

Cause of New Plymouth biodiesel explosion released

02:30 PM MDT on Friday, July 14, 2006

KTVB.COM

PAYETTE -- Investigators say they now know what caused an
explosion at a
New Plymouth biodiesel plant last week that killed a Meridian man.

One man died at a fire and explosion at a New Plymouth biodiesel
plant
last Friday.

The Payette County Sheriff's Office released its findings today
into the
explosion and subsequent fire at the plant that left 25-year-old
Blaise
Black dead.

The cause of the fire was determined to be an explosion of a 25,000
gallon steel holding tank that Blaise was working on. The tank
contain
about 30 to 40 gallons of glycerin and methanol liquid mix. Both
products are flammable and give off flammable vapors.

Investigators say at the time of the explosion Blaise was working
on the
top of the tank attempting to install a two-inch steel pipe with a
90-degree elbow on the end to function as a vent on the top of
the tank.
During the installation of the vent tube a steel two-inch cap was
removed from the side of the tank where the vent was to be
installed.
This allowed the vapors to escape from the tank. When Blaise lit his
cutting torch it ignited the vapors, which triggered the fire and
explosion.

The Payette County coroner says Blaise it appears Blaise died
from blunt
force trauma as a result of the explosion.

The explosion would have thrown him violently upward against the
ceiling
and a large beam that was above him. As a result of the
explosion, the
ceiling and beam came down and trapped him on the top of the
tank. The
force of the impact would have killed him immediately.

___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives
(50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000
messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

/Wildbill/
/Sutton.VT /

Groups are talking. We´re listening. Check out the handy changes to
Yahoo! Groups.
http://pa.yahoo.com/*http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=41144/*http://groups.yahoo.com/local/newemail.html

___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Re: [Biofuel] Pump choice

We're using a clearwater with good results - but be careful to leave a 
little oil in it for priming purposes and when you plumb it
use tape - any air leaks really impair its ability...

Charles List wrote:

Hi All

Thanks to all who have advised me this last few months, I am now a  
biofueller! 105l batches, good product. Unfortunately, after 10 good  
batches, my pump has started spraying out of the back of the impeller  
housing. So I took it apart and the impeller has broken up and the  
housing has been eaten through at the back, around the mechanical  
seal. It was 30 years old or so, free and a plastic spa pump, so I'm  
not too distressed, but I obviously don't want it happening again.

I notice that the clearwater pump used by JtF is made of cast iron,  
so should my next pump be made of metal? Also, is the impeller in the  
clearwater pump  plastic? As I know you can get some with stainless  
steel blades, I wonder my impeller break-up was due to age or chemicals.

Thanks

Charles List
  



___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Check Your Beliefs

Bob;

Your comments are surely offensive and ill considered. Move back onto 
their own territory? Pray tell where is that? Parachuting displaced Jews 
into the area we call Israel was the first mistake made by the US and 
Brittain IMHO and  we have been living with the fallout ever since. 
Although all of the one sidedness and unfair support for the Jews is 
well expressed in the post and rightly so, your comments about garbage 
collection mark you as an anti-semite and I believe you should 
appologize for that comment. Don't get me wrong I am no supporter of any 
particular people or unfair advantage in any regard in fact I hate all 
that, but you can't come on a public list and make such statements.  It 
is like condemning americans with a broad brush stroke because you hate 
the actions of their government. Fair? Justified? Right? I think not.

Joe

Bob Molloy wrote:

 Yo Fritz,
 Yeah, right on Fritz. And just to prove it your ethnic forebears killed 
 off six million of these bloody Jews only to have the rest of 
 us dumb westerners stop them just before they'd finished the job. Now 
 it's up to the poor Palestinians with only suicide bombers and Katushya 
 rockets to carry on where the rest of us left off. We need to force the 
 Israelis to open these roads, tear down their walls and move back onto 
 their own territory so that the bombers in civilian clothing have a 
 fighting chance to get closer to Israeli settlements.  At least let's 
 have a level playing field here. After it's all over and the 
 Palestinians have finally established their Muslim state we can allow a 
 few Israeli refugees into western countries just as long as they toe the 
 line and run the garbage collection systems for us.
 Good one, Fritz,
 Bob. 
 
 - Original Message -
 *From:* Fritz Friesinger mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 *To:* Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 *Sent:* Thursday, July 20, 2006 1:33 AM
 *Subject:* [Biofuel] Check Your Beliefs
 
 Forewardet by Fritz
  
 --
 
 Check Your Beliefs
 
 By Charley Reese
 
 03/17/06 -- -- Let's play a fantasy game to check on
 our belief in human rights. Let's suppose that in a
 mythical state, a governor announced a campaign to
 punish African-Americans for alleged violence.
 
 Step one is to confiscate the land owned by
 African-Americans, evict them from it and use the land
 to build massive new subdivisions. Only white
 Protestant Christians may live in these subdivisions.
 
 Step two is to connect these all-white Protestant
 Christian settlements to each other by a highway on
 which African-Americans are forbidden to drive. To
 facilitate control, the automobile tags for
 African-Americans will be a different color from the
 tags issued to white motorists. Checkpoints would be
 set up all around the state capitol to search and
 harass African-Americans trying to enter.
 
 Would you support such a plan? Would you hail that
 mythical governor as a man of peace? Would you go to
 your church congregation and ask the members to send
 money to the occupants of these white settlements?
 Would you lobby the federal government to subsidize
 this new apartheid state in our midst?
 
 I don't think so. I think most Americans would
 consider such acts an abomination, un-American and a
 mockery of everything both Christianity and the United
 States stand for.
 
 Well, if you would condemn such acts here directed
 against African-Americans, why won't you condemn
 identical acts committed against the Palestinians by
 the state of Israel?
 
 Those settlements you hear about are built on
 Palestinian land, and they are for Jews only. New
 roads that Palestinians are forbidden to use connect
 them. The entire West Bank is riddled with Israeli
 checkpoints, where innocent Palestinians are daily
 humiliated and harassed. A trip to a nearby village
 can mean waiting in line at checkpoints for hours.
 Palestinians have died in these lines.
 
 After all of these humiliations, abuses, the houses
 destroyed, the children killed, the olive trees
 uprooted, how do you think Palestinians feel about
 Americans who support the Israelis no matter what they
 do to the Palestinians? Don't take my word about these
 abuses. Check out the Israeli human-rights
 organization at www.btselem.org/English
 http://www.btselem.org/English.
 
 If you cannot condemn the flagrant abuses of
 Palestinians by the Israeli government, then you are
 undoubtedly a bigot, the worst kind of racist pig who
 believes that Palestinians are some kind of subspecies
 of the human race. If you do condemn in your heart
 these terrible abuses, but are afraid to speak out
 about

Re: [Biofuel] Check Your Beliefs

Joe,

I think Bob was being sarcastic - read his post again.

Joe Street wrote:

Bob;

Your comments are surely offensive and ill considered. Move back onto 
their own territory? Pray tell where is that? Parachuting displaced Jews 
into the area we call Israel was the first mistake made by the US and 
Brittain IMHO and  we have been living with the fallout ever since. 
Although all of the one sidedness and unfair support for the Jews is 
well expressed in the post and rightly so, your comments about garbage 
collection mark you as an anti-semite and I believe you should 
appologize for that comment. Don't get me wrong I am no supporter of any 
particular people or unfair advantage in any regard in fact I hate all 
that, but you can't come on a public list and make such statements.  It 
is like condemning americans with a broad brush stroke because you hate 
the actions of their government. Fair? Justified? Right? I think not.

Joe

Bob Molloy wrote:

  

Yo Fritz,
Yeah, right on Fritz. And just to prove it your ethnic forebears killed 
off six million of these bloody Jews only to have the rest of 
us dumb westerners stop them just before they'd finished the job. Now 
it's up to the poor Palestinians with only suicide bombers and Katushya 
rockets to carry on where the rest of us left off. We need to force the 
Israelis to open these roads, tear down their walls and move back onto 
their own territory so that the bombers in civilian clothing have a 
fighting chance to get closer to Israeli settlements.  At least let's 
have a level playing field here. After it's all over and the 
Palestinians have finally established their Muslim state we can allow a 
few Israeli refugees into western countries just as long as they toe the 
line and run the garbage collection systems for us.
Good one, Fritz,
Bob. 

- Original Message -
*From:* Fritz Friesinger mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
*To:* Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
*Sent:* Thursday, July 20, 2006 1:33 AM
*Subject:* [Biofuel] Check Your Beliefs

Forewardet by Fritz
 
--

Check Your Beliefs

By Charley Reese

03/17/06 -- -- Let's play a fantasy game to check on
our belief in human rights. Let's suppose that in a
mythical state, a governor announced a campaign to
punish African-Americans for alleged violence.

Step one is to confiscate the land owned by
African-Americans, evict them from it and use the land
to build massive new subdivisions. Only white
Protestant Christians may live in these subdivisions.

Step two is to connect these all-white Protestant
Christian settlements to each other by a highway on
which African-Americans are forbidden to drive. To
facilitate control, the automobile tags for
African-Americans will be a different color from the
tags issued to white motorists. Checkpoints would be
set up all around the state capitol to search and
harass African-Americans trying to enter.

Would you support such a plan? Would you hail that
mythical governor as a man of peace? Would you go to
your church congregation and ask the members to send
money to the occupants of these white settlements?
Would you lobby the federal government to subsidize
this new apartheid state in our midst?

I don't think so. I think most Americans would
consider such acts an abomination, un-American and a
mockery of everything both Christianity and the United
States stand for.

Well, if you would condemn such acts here directed
against African-Americans, why won't you condemn
identical acts committed against the Palestinians by
the state of Israel?

Those settlements you hear about are built on
Palestinian land, and they are for Jews only. New
roads that Palestinians are forbidden to use connect
them. The entire West Bank is riddled with Israeli
checkpoints, where innocent Palestinians are daily
humiliated and harassed. A trip to a nearby village
can mean waiting in line at checkpoints for hours.
Palestinians have died in these lines.

After all of these humiliations, abuses, the houses
destroyed, the children killed, the olive trees
uprooted, how do you think Palestinians feel about
Americans who support the Israelis no matter what they
do to the Palestinians? Don't take my word about these
abuses. Check out the Israeli human-rights
organization at www.btselem.org/English
http://www.btselem.org/English.

If you cannot condemn the flagrant abuses of
Palestinians by the Israeli government, then you are
undoubtedly a bigot, the worst kind of racist pig who
believes that Palestinians are some kind of subspecies
of the human race. If you do condemn in your heart
these terrible abuses, but are afraid to speak out
about them, then

Re: [Biofuel] Smacking the hornet's nest

2006-07-20 Thread Fritz Friesinger

Mike,
what you are saying is,Palestine was British then?
so how it became British?and thas this make the whole thing less hard for the
Palestinians?
What happened a hundred years ago should not
happening anymore today!
We came a long way to realize the wrongs of the
past but instaed of garding that those attrocytis cant be repeatet we are
turning a blind eye and excuse things with old rethoric.Your analysis sucks but
then you are US Citicen and what can we expect from such!
To my very own situation,i live in Quebec Canada on
a piece of Land (a former open pit Graphit mine) nobody wantet so i got it
fairly cheep.But then i am cleaning up the mess a US Mining companie had left
and this for seven years now!
i have put trouts in my lakes and had spent a lot
of money for topsoil and plant trees and garden!And once i be finished (probably
never) people will come and ask if the could live on my land and i will refuse
the request if the show me the same attitude as you
Fritz

- Original Message -
From:
Mike Weaver

To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org

Sent: Thursday, July 20, 2006 9:18
AM
Subject: [Biofuel] Smacking the hornet's
nest
I can't say I am always a fan of the Israeli government right
or wrong, and let's be honest, they've made some mistakes (but then look
at the US gov't), but they arein an impossible spot. Do they
need some nudging to do they right thing? Yes, but we all do.Let's
stop and think, "Why are they where they are? - Because NO Western
country would take then. Roosevelt turned away of boatload of Jewish
refugees. They really didn't have a lot of options. In Poland,
TWO YEARS after WWII ended, there was a massacre of Jews. I can
understand why one might gamble on a boat trip to (then) British
Palestine rather than go "home" to Europe.Personally, I think the
whole idea was ill-conceived, and US should have settled the refugees in
the largely unocupied American West. Heck, a state
even.Besides, I think if you wait long enough, Fritz, you'll see the
same behavior here anyway. We're already denying blacks the right to
vote in some states, and it's pretty much illegal to be black in a white
area after dark already. Step one is to confiscate
the land owned byAfrican-Americans, [or Native Americans] evict them from
it and use the landto build massive new subdivisions. Only
whiteProtestant Christians may live in these subdivisions. - Check, doing
that here.I notice you're in Canada - do you live in a
house? Where did the land come from? A friendly Algonkin
http://www.accessgenealogy.com/native/tribes/algonquian/algonhist1.htm
give it to you? I notice the Canadia Government has beenhaving a
little trouble with its First Nation denizens - a few Mohawk
lawsuits here and there. "Don't judge, so that you won't be
judged.http://bible.cc/matthew/7-2.htmFor
with whatever judgment you judge, you will be judged; and with whatever
measure you measure, it will be measured to you.^3 http://bible.cc/matthew/7-3.htm
Why do you see the speck that is in your brother's eye, but don't consider
the beam that is in your own eye?Or, let he who is free from sin cast
the first stone.-MikeFritz Friesinger wrote:
Bob, i bett you havent wread the report of www.btselem.org http://www.btselem.org you would
not talk such rhubbish! Fritz
- Original Message - *From:* Bob
Molloy mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
*To:* Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
*Sent:* Wednesday, July 19, 2006 6:52 PM
*Subject:* Re: [Biofuel] Check Your
Beliefs Yo
Fritz, Yeah, right on Fritz. And just to prove
it your ethnic forebears killed off six
million of these bloody Jews only to have the
rest of us dumb westerners stop them just
before they'd finished the job. Now it's up to
the poor Palestinians with only suicide
bombers and Katushya rockets to carry on where the rest of us
left off. We need to force the Israelis to
open these roads, tear down their walls and
move back onto their own territory so that the
bombers in civilian clothing have a fighting chance to get
closer to Israeli settlements. At least
let's have a level playing field here. After
it's all over and the Palestinians have
finally established their Muslim state we can
allow a few Israeli refugees into western
countries just as long as they toe the line and
run the garbage collection systems for
us. Good one,
Fritz, Bob.
-
Original Message -
*From:* Fritz Friesinger mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
*To:* Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
*Sent:* Thursday, July 20, 2006 1:33
AM *Subject:*
[Biofuel] Check Your
Beliefs
Forewardet by
Fritz

--
Check Your
Beliefs By
Charley Reese
03/17/06 --

Re: [Biofuel] Pump choice

Sorry, I was being cheeky, they'll work until the methoxide eats them - 
of course - I was using an old Dodge pump so YMMV.

Jason Katie wrote:

 well, i can get them for just about free at the boneyard, so i 
 can test and see when or if they blow out, ill let you know what 
 happens when i get the chance to experiment.
 Jason
 ICQ#:  154998177
 MSN:  [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

 - Original Message -
 *From:* Zeke Yewdall mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 *To:* biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 mailto:biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 *Sent:* Wednesday, July 19, 2006 9:14 PM
 *Subject:* Re: [Biofuel] Pump choice

 Uhh, how can the answer to both questions be yes.  If it
 dissolves, it won't work, right?

 I'd think it shouldn't have a problem with methanol, since that's
 in windshield washer fluid anyway, but methoxide is a different
 monster.  Plus, these pumps are pretty chinzy -- I think they'd
 burn out after not too long of continuous operation even with the
 nicest fluid.  In a 20 year lifetime of a car, it would only run
 about 60 hours (assumptions: 200,000 miles, 10% of miles require
 using windshield washers, when using it it is used 3 times per
 mile, for three 1 second shots each time)

 On 7/19/06, *Mike Weaver* [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


 Yes.
 Yes.

 Jason Katie wrote:

 i have a pump question on a side note. will a window washer
 fluid pump from
 a car work in my little test reactor, or will it dissolve as
 well?
 
 Jason
 ICQ#:  154998177
 MSN:  [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 - Original Message -
 From: Charles List  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 Sent: Wednesday, July 19, 2006 6:43 PM
 Subject: [Biofuel] Pump choice
 
 
 
 
 Hi All
 
 Thanks to all who have advised me this last few months, I am
 now a
 biofueller! 105l batches, good product. Unfortunately, after
 10 good
 batches, my pump has started spraying out of the back of the
 impeller
 housing. So I took it apart and the impeller has broken up
 and the
 housing has been eaten through at the back, around the
 mechanical
 seal. It was 30 years old or so, free and a plastic spa
 pump, so I'm
 not too distressed, but I obviously don't want it happening
 again.
 
 I notice that the clearwater pump used by JtF is made of
 cast iron,
 so should my next pump be made of metal? Also, is the
 impeller in the
 clearwater pump  plastic? As I know you can get some with
 stainless
 steel blades, I wonder my impeller break-up was due to age
 or chemicals.
 
 Thanks
 
 Charles List
 --
 --
 This email was sent using Telecom SchoolZone.
www.schoolzone.net.nz
 http://www.schoolzone.net.nz
 
 This email has been scanned for viruses by Telecom SchoolZone,
 but is not guaranteed to be virus-free.
 --
 
 ___
 Biofuel mailing list
 Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 
 
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org
 
 Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
 http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
 http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
 
 Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives
 (50,000
 messages):
 http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
 http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
 
 
 --
 No virus found in this incoming message.
 Checked by AVG Free Edition.
 Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.10.1/391 - Release
 Date: 7/18/2006
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 


 ___
 Biofuel mailing list
 Biofuel@sustainablelists.org mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

 Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
 http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

 Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives
 (50,000 messages):

Re: [Biofuel] Pump choice

Hey Tom;

My guess on this is it is not so much the pump but the size of the 
plumbing.  I noticed that one particular pump with the same size motor 
and impeller was offered with 1 or 3/4 inlet and the throughput was 
almost the same as a smaller pump with standard 3/4 inlet unless you 
ordered it with the 1
I then took a look at a whoile bunch of pump curves and what you find is 
that you won't get beyond about 10-15 GPM with any size motor or pump 
unless you go larger than 3/4 on the pump inlet. The 90 litre wall I 
think is related to the 3/4 tank connections on the hot water tanks we 
all like using not the pump per se but it amounts to the same difference 
in the end.

I believe it is a waste of time and money buying a larger tank than 
about 100 litres since as most people find out you can't get a good 
reaction on about more than 90 litres of oil anyways.

Joe



Thomas Kelly wrote:

 Charles,
The impeller in the clearwater pump is metal. Plastic impellers will 
 eventually fail in pumps used to agitate the reaction.
  My experience w. the clearwater pump is that it will handle up to 90L 
 (~ 24 gal) batches. Above that, even after three hours reaction time, I have 
 gotten incomplete reactions.
  Congratulations on your success scaling up.
 
  Tom
 - Original Message - 
 From: Charles List [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 Sent: Wednesday, July 19, 2006 7:43 PM
 Subject: [Biofuel] Pump choice
 
 
 
Hi All

Thanks to all who have advised me this last few months, I am now a
biofueller! 105l batches, good product. Unfortunately, after 10 good
batches, my pump has started spraying out of the back of the impeller
housing. So I took it apart and the impeller has broken up and the
housing has been eaten through at the back, around the mechanical
seal. It was 30 years old or so, free and a plastic spa pump, so I'm
not too distressed, but I obviously don't want it happening again.

I notice that the clearwater pump used by JtF is made of cast iron,
so should my next pump be made of metal? Also, is the impeller in the
clearwater pump  plastic? As I know you can get some with stainless
steel blades, I wonder my impeller break-up was due to age or chemicals.

Thanks

Charles List
-- 
--
This email was sent using Telecom SchoolZone.
   www.schoolzone.net.nz

This email has been scanned for viruses by Telecom SchoolZone,
but is not guaranteed to be virus-free.
--

___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 
messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/



 
 
 
 
 ___
 Biofuel mailing list
 Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org
 
 Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
 http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
 
 Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
 http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
 
 


___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Check Your Beliefs

Not to mention the unecessary use of two atomic bombs on the Japanese. 
Americans are the only ones ever to massacre human beings with nuclear 
weapons and yet they deem themselves to be the ones worthy of having 
them.huh?

Joe

Hakan Falk wrote:

 Bob,
 
 I forgot about your ethnic forebears massacres of 
 the native American population. In numbers it is also comparable.
 
 Bob,
 
 I have a lot to do and have been silent for a 
 while, but this I have to comment.
 
 It was clearly under the belt and very 
 insensitive and outright dumb, especially form an 
 American. US do have their own racism and the 
 internment of Americans with Japanese decent 
 during WWII is nothing to be proud of, not to 
 talk about the racism and prosecution of black 
 people, this still in more recent times. Your 
 comments says more about you than about Fritz.
 
 It was very few Germans who knew about what was 
 going on, most knew about internment, but very 
 few about the final solution and even fewer that 
 was involved in it. In fact it was very few that 
 ever read Mein Kampf  and had reasons to 
 suspect anything like the final solution. They 
 knew about the interment as the Americans knew 
 about their own internment of Japanese Americans 
 also. The final solution was set in practise by a 
 few and when the German population were more occupied by the war.
 
 You are also talking about taking personal 
 responsibility for forefathers and then you are 
 personal responsible for the Japanese internment 
 and prosecution of black people also.
 
 Hakan
 
 
 At 05:09 20/07/2006, you wrote:
 
Hello Bob

I think you should check your beliefs.

http://www.fair.org/index.php?page=2921
'Because This Is the Middle East'

http://snipurl.com/pg9x
Re: [biofuel] Re: Oil and Israel
3 Jun 2004

Keith



Yo Fritz,
Yeah, right on Fritz. And just to prove it your ethnic forebears
killed off six million of these bloody Jews only to have the rest of
us dumb westerners stop them just before they'd finished the job.
Now it's up to the poor Palestinians with only suicide bombers and
Katushya rockets to carry on where the rest of us left off. We need
to force the Israelis to open these roads, tear down their walls and
move back onto their own territory so that the bombers in civilian
clothing have a fighting chance to get closer to Israeli
settlements.  At least let's have a level playing field here. After
it's all over and the Palestinians have finally established their
Muslim state we can allow a few Israeli refugees into western
countries just as long as they toe the line and run the garbage
collection systems for us.
Good one, Fritz,
Bob.

- Original Message -
From: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Fritz Friesinger
To: mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgBiofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Thursday, July 20, 2006 1:33 AM
Subject: [Biofuel] Check Your Beliefs

Forewardet by Fritz

--

Check Your Beliefs

By Charley Reese

03/17/06 -- -- Let's play a fantasy game to check on
our belief in human rights. Let's suppose that in a
mythical state, a governor announced a campaign to
punish African-Americans for alleged violence.

Step one is to confiscate the land owned by
African-Americans, evict them from it and use the land
to build massive new subdivisions. Only white
Protestant Christians may live in these subdivisions.

Step two is to connect these all-white Protestant
Christian settlements to each other by a highway on
which African-Americans are forbidden to drive. To
facilitate control, the automobile tags for
African-Americans will be a different color from the
tags issued to white motorists. Checkpoints would be
set up all around the state capitol to search and
harass African-Americans trying to enter.

Would you support such a plan? Would you hail that
mythical governor as a man of peace? Would you go to
your church congregation and ask the members to send
money to the occupants of these white settlements?
Would you lobby the federal government to subsidize
this new apartheid state in our midst?

I don't think so. I think most Americans would
consider such acts an abomination, un-American and a
mockery of everything both Christianity and the United
States stand for.

Well, if you would condemn such acts here directed
against African-Americans, why won't you condemn
identical acts committed against the Palestinians by
the state of Israel?

Those settlements you hear about are built on
Palestinian land, and they are for Jews only. New
roads that Palestinians are forbidden to use connect
them. The entire West Bank is riddled with Israeli
checkpoints, where innocent Palestinians are daily
humiliated and harassed. A trip to a nearby village
can mean waiting in line at checkpoints for hours.
Palestinians have died in these lines.

After all of these humiliations, abuses, the houses
destroyed, the children killed, the olive trees
uprooted, how do you think Palestinians

Re: [Biofuel] Check Your Beliefs

Uh.oh :$
Maybe you're right. Sorry Bob. I love sarcasm but I guess I missed it. 
Need a coffeelol

Joe

Mike Weaver wrote:

 Joe,
 
 I think Bob was being sarcastic - read his post again.
 
 Joe Street wrote:
 
 
Bob;

Your comments are surely offensive and ill considered. Move back onto 
their own territory? Pray tell where is that? Parachuting displaced Jews 
into the area we call Israel was the first mistake made by the US and 
Brittain IMHO and  we have been living with the fallout ever since. 
Although all of the one sidedness and unfair support for the Jews is 
well expressed in the post and rightly so, your comments about garbage 
collection mark you as an anti-semite and I believe you should 
appologize for that comment. Don't get me wrong I am no supporter of any 
particular people or unfair advantage in any regard in fact I hate all 
that, but you can't come on a public list and make such statements.  It 
is like condemning americans with a broad brush stroke because you hate 
the actions of their government. Fair? Justified? Right? I think not.

Joe

Bob Molloy wrote:

 


Yo Fritz,
Yeah, right on Fritz. And just to prove it your ethnic forebears killed 
off six million of these bloody Jews only to have the rest of 
us dumb westerners stop them just before they'd finished the job. Now 
it's up to the poor Palestinians with only suicide bombers and Katushya 
rockets to carry on where the rest of us left off. We need to force the 
Israelis to open these roads, tear down their walls and move back onto 
their own territory so that the bombers in civilian clothing have a 
fighting chance to get closer to Israeli settlements.  At least let's 
have a level playing field here. After it's all over and the 
Palestinians have finally established their Muslim state we can allow a 
few Israeli refugees into western countries just as long as they toe the 
line and run the garbage collection systems for us.
Good one, Fritz,
Bob. 

   - Original Message -
   *From:* Fritz Friesinger mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
   *To:* Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
   mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
   *Sent:* Thursday, July 20, 2006 1:33 AM
   *Subject:* [Biofuel] Check Your Beliefs

   Forewardet by Fritz

   --

   Check Your Beliefs

   By Charley Reese

   03/17/06 -- -- Let's play a fantasy game to check on
   our belief in human rights. Let's suppose that in a
   mythical state, a governor announced a campaign to
   punish African-Americans for alleged violence.

   Step one is to confiscate the land owned by
   African-Americans, evict them from it and use the land
   to build massive new subdivisions. Only white
   Protestant Christians may live in these subdivisions.

   Step two is to connect these all-white Protestant
   Christian settlements to each other by a highway on
   which African-Americans are forbidden to drive. To
   facilitate control, the automobile tags for
   African-Americans will be a different color from the
   tags issued to white motorists. Checkpoints would be
   set up all around the state capitol to search and
   harass African-Americans trying to enter.

   Would you support such a plan? Would you hail that
   mythical governor as a man of peace? Would you go to
   your church congregation and ask the members to send
   money to the occupants of these white settlements?
   Would you lobby the federal government to subsidize
   this new apartheid state in our midst?

   I don't think so. I think most Americans would
   consider such acts an abomination, un-American and a
   mockery of everything both Christianity and the United
   States stand for.

   Well, if you would condemn such acts here directed
   against African-Americans, why won't you condemn
   identical acts committed against the Palestinians by
   the state of Israel?

   Those settlements you hear about are built on
   Palestinian land, and they are for Jews only. New
   roads that Palestinians are forbidden to use connect
   them. The entire West Bank is riddled with Israeli
   checkpoints, where innocent Palestinians are daily
   humiliated and harassed. A trip to a nearby village
   can mean waiting in line at checkpoints for hours.
   Palestinians have died in these lines.

   After all of these humiliations, abuses, the houses
   destroyed, the children killed, the olive trees
   uprooted, how do you think Palestinians feel about
   Americans who support the Israelis no matter what they
   do to the Palestinians? Don't take my word about these
   abuses. Check out the Israeli human-rights
   organization at www.btselem.org/English
   http://www.btselem.org/English.

   If you cannot condemn the flagrant abuses of
   Palestinians by the Israeli government, then you are
   undoubtedly a bigot, the worst kind of racist pig who
   believes that Palestinians are some kind of subspecies
   of the human race. If you do condemn in your

Re: [Biofuel] breakthrough - store CH4 at 500psi instead of 3600

2006-07-20 Thread bob allen

acetylene gas is actually dissolved in acetone, so you dont have a gas
but rather a solution. the packing material is simply to keep the
liquid from sloshing around.

lres1 wrote:
I was also under the impression that Acetylene for decades has been kept
at reasonable pressures in the cylinders due to the carbon or Kapok
filling. I was also to understand that at above 15 psi Acetylene was
unstable and thus the need to use a filler to react with the gas.

Can some one put me to rights on this. If the above is so then such
cylinders have been around for as above decades and thus the carbon,
active carbon and Kapok are very old technology.

Active carbon filters are also used in some water treatment systems that
have been around for many years. can some one out there confirm this also.

Doug

- Original Message -
*From:* John Beale mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
*To:* biofuel@sustainablelists.org
mailto:biofuel@sustainablelists.org
*Sent:* Thursday, July 20, 2006 6:20 AM
*Subject:* Re: [Biofuel] breakthrough - store CH4 at 500psi instead
of 3600

You can get it made out of all kinds of things: wood, coal,
coconutshells, etc etc.
...and if you look on the University of Missouri website, you
findthis abstract: *Synthesis and analysisof activated carbon
briquettes as an adsorbent for natural gas *byDemetrius Taylor
/Presented at the 2005 SummerUndergraduate Research and Creative
Achievements Forum
/*ABSTRACT
*Activated carbon has been usedfor many years for its adsorptive
properties. These adsorptiveproperties are a result of its high
surface area to density ratio. Itachieves this through its
activation process. During activation anetwork of pores forms
throughout the carbon matrix. These pores givethe carbon a very
large surface area for outside molecules to adsorbto. By maximizing
the distribution of different pore widths one cantailor the carbon
to adsorb molecules of differing sizes and duringvarious conditions.
Our goal is to develop a natural gas (95% methane)fuel tank that
uses corncob produced activated carbon as an adsorptivemedium. To do
this we need to maximize the distribution of porediameters that are
between 1~2 nanometers (10~20 Angstroms). We arecurrently studying
different activation methods and their effect onthe carbon’s
adsorptive properties. We have obtained volumetricnitrogen and
methane isotherms, gravimetric methane analysis data,both scanning
and tunneling electron micrographs, and small-anglex-ray analysis
data obtained from Argonne National Labs. From thisdata we have
begun producing activated carbon briquettes that willform the “core”
of our tank. We hope to expand the use of thesebriquettes to not
only automotive fuel tanks but to natural gastrapping and storage as
well.

(http://undergradresearch.missouri.edu/events/conferences/abstracts/abstract-detail.php?abstractid=533
)

And notice that the opening words are activated carbon. So
Kirk,here's your affirmation.

...Also noteworthy is that there's this other abstract on
theUniversity of Missouri website: *Fuel system design foran
Adsorbed Natural Gas Vehicle *byAntonio Howard /Presented at the
2005 SummerUndergraduate Research and Creative Achievements Forum
/*ABSTRACT
*With energy and environmentalconcerns mounting as the global energy
demand increases, alternativefuels are drawing more and more
attention. Natural gas is one suchalternative fuel. However, the
major shortcoming of natural gas isthat it must be highly compressed
in order to store at a comparableenergy density to liquid fuels. For
this reason, The Alliance forCollaborative Research in Alternative
Fuel Technology (ALL-CRAFT) aimsto develop low-pressure,
high-capacity storage technologies fornatural gas (methane). Midwest
Research Institute (MRI), an ALL-CRAFTpartner, is assigned the task
of developing a fuel tank and fueldelivery system for a natural
gas-powered vehicle modified to storethe natural gas using adsorbed
natural gas (ANG) technology. Thedesign work done thus far has dealt
with the logistics of modifyingthe vehicle’s fuel delivery system to
accommodate the use of the ANGtank in addition to the pre-existing
compressed natural gas (CNG)tank. The fuel system of a 2005 Honda
Civic GX will be modified byinstalling an ANG fuel tank to serve as
an auxiliary tank to theexisting higher pressure CNG tank.
Additional capabilities will beadded while maintaining all of its
original functions. One suchcapability is running either from its
CNG or the ANG tank, withemphasis on maximizing mileage from ANG
tank use. Moreover, the CNGtank will be equipped to simultaneously
fuel the engine and refill theANG tank upon

Re: [Biofuel] Pump choice


your mileage may vary
Joe Street wrote:

YMMV  ??  (Yes My Mother..???)

I'm so out of the loop

Mike Weaver wrote:

  

Sorry, I was being cheeky, they'll work until the methoxide eats them - 
of course - I was using an old Dodge pump so YMMV.

Jason Katie wrote:




well, i can get them for just about free at the boneyard, so i 
can test and see when or if they blow out, ill let you know what 
happens when i get the chance to experiment.
Jason
ICQ#:  154998177
MSN:  [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

   - Original Message -
   *From:* Zeke Yewdall mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
   *To:* biofuel@sustainablelists.org
   mailto:biofuel@sustainablelists.org
   *Sent:* Wednesday, July 19, 2006 9:14 PM
   *Subject:* Re: [Biofuel] Pump choice

   Uhh, how can the answer to both questions be yes.  If it
   dissolves, it won't work, right?

   I'd think it shouldn't have a problem with methanol, since that's
   in windshield washer fluid anyway, but methoxide is a different
   monster.  Plus, these pumps are pretty chinzy -- I think they'd
   burn out after not too long of continuous operation even with the
   nicest fluid.  In a 20 year lifetime of a car, it would only run
   about 60 hours (assumptions: 200,000 miles, 10% of miles require
   using windshield washers, when using it it is used 3 times per
   mile, for three 1 second shots each time)

   On 7/19/06, *Mike Weaver* [EMAIL PROTECTED]
   mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


   Yes.
   Yes.

   Jason Katie wrote:

   i have a pump question on a side note. will a window washer
   fluid pump from
   a car work in my little test reactor, or will it dissolve as
   well?
   
   Jason
   ICQ#:  154998177
   MSN:  [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
   - Original Message -
   From: Charles List  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
   mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
   To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
   mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
   Sent: Wednesday, July 19, 2006 6:43 PM
   Subject: [Biofuel] Pump choice
   
   
   
   
   Hi All
   
   Thanks to all who have advised me this last few months, I am
   now a
   biofueller! 105l batches, good product. Unfortunately, after
   10 good
   batches, my pump has started spraying out of the back of the
   impeller
   housing. So I took it apart and the impeller has broken up
   and the
   housing has been eaten through at the back, around the
   mechanical
   seal. It was 30 years old or so, free and a plastic spa
   pump, so I'm
   not too distressed, but I obviously don't want it happening
   again.
   
   I notice that the clearwater pump used by JtF is made of
   cast iron,
   so should my next pump be made of metal? Also, is the
   impeller in the
   clearwater pump  plastic? As I know you can get some with
   stainless
   steel blades, I wonder my impeller break-up was due to age
   or chemicals.
   
   Thanks
   
   Charles List
   --
   --
   This email was sent using Telecom SchoolZone.
  www.schoolzone.net.nz
   http://www.schoolzone.net.nz
   
   This email has been scanned for viruses by Telecom SchoolZone,
   but is not guaranteed to be virus-free.
   --
   
   ___
   Biofuel mailing list
   Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
   mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
   
   
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org
   
   Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
   http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
   http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
   
   Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives
   (50,000
   messages):
   http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
   http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
   
   
   --
   No virus found in this incoming message.
   Checked by AVG Free Edition.
   Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.10.1/391 - Release
   Date: 7/18/2006
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   


   ___
   Biofuel mailing list
   Biofuel@sustainablelists.org mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
   
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

   Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
   http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

   Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives
   (50,000 messages):
   http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
   http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Pump choice

YMMV  ??  (Yes My Mother..???)

I'm so out of the loop

Mike Weaver wrote:

 Sorry, I was being cheeky, they'll work until the methoxide eats them - 
 of course - I was using an old Dodge pump so YMMV.
 
 Jason Katie wrote:
 
 
well, i can get them for just about free at the boneyard, so i 
can test and see when or if they blow out, ill let you know what 
happens when i get the chance to experiment.
Jason
ICQ#:  154998177
MSN:  [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

- Original Message -
*From:* Zeke Yewdall mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
*To:* biofuel@sustainablelists.org
mailto:biofuel@sustainablelists.org
*Sent:* Wednesday, July 19, 2006 9:14 PM
*Subject:* Re: [Biofuel] Pump choice

Uhh, how can the answer to both questions be yes.  If it
dissolves, it won't work, right?

I'd think it shouldn't have a problem with methanol, since that's
in windshield washer fluid anyway, but methoxide is a different
monster.  Plus, these pumps are pretty chinzy -- I think they'd
burn out after not too long of continuous operation even with the
nicest fluid.  In a 20 year lifetime of a car, it would only run
about 60 hours (assumptions: 200,000 miles, 10% of miles require
using windshield washers, when using it it is used 3 times per
mile, for three 1 second shots each time)

On 7/19/06, *Mike Weaver* [EMAIL PROTECTED]
mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


Yes.
Yes.

Jason Katie wrote:

i have a pump question on a side note. will a window washer
fluid pump from
a car work in my little test reactor, or will it dissolve as
well?

Jason
ICQ#:  154998177
MSN:  [EMAIL PROTECTED] mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
- Original Message -
From: Charles List  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Wednesday, July 19, 2006 6:43 PM
Subject: [Biofuel] Pump choice




Hi All

Thanks to all who have advised me this last few months, I am
now a
biofueller! 105l batches, good product. Unfortunately, after
10 good
batches, my pump has started spraying out of the back of the
impeller
housing. So I took it apart and the impeller has broken up
and the
housing has been eaten through at the back, around the
mechanical
seal. It was 30 years old or so, free and a plastic spa
pump, so I'm
not too distressed, but I obviously don't want it happening
again.

I notice that the clearwater pump used by JtF is made of
cast iron,
so should my next pump be made of metal? Also, is the
impeller in the
clearwater pump  plastic? As I know you can get some with
stainless
steel blades, I wonder my impeller break-up was due to age
or chemicals.

Thanks

Charles List
--
--
This email was sent using Telecom SchoolZone.
   www.schoolzone.net.nz
http://www.schoolzone.net.nz

This email has been scanned for viruses by Telecom SchoolZone,
but is not guaranteed to be virus-free.
--

___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org


 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives
(50,000
messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/


--
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.10.1/391 - Release
Date: 7/18/2006










___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org

 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives
(50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Pump choice


Charles,
 As Mikw Weaver pointed out, 1 Clearwater pumps are not self-priming. 
Another way to avoid priming each time is to:
 Position the pump so that it is level with the bottom of the WVO source 
and the bottom of the reactor. This allows it to prime by gravity. I pump 
WVO from a plastic barrel that is on a small platform  ~ 16 inches high. My 
pump and reactor are on platforms the same height. I used JB Weld to attach 
a plastic nipple about 2 inches from the bottom of the WVO barrel   
line to the pump.

 Air leaks do impair the pump's ability. I'd recommend threaded barbs w. 
hose clamps for any hoses  ... (rather than using pipe nipples to hoses). 
Also check on a regular basis to make sure clamps are tight.
 While teflon tape works great for water lines, it is not recommended 
for fuel/solvents lines. The fittings will eventually leak and the tape 
turns to goo. I was advised to use a slow dry, soft set, pipe thread sealant 
when plumbing fittings in my reactor. After 8 months, no leaks. The fittings 
are also very easy to disassemble for processor maintenance.
 Best of luck,
 Tom
- Original Message - 
From: Mike Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Thursday, July 20, 2006 9:44 AM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Pump choice


 We're using a clearwater with good results - but be careful to leave a
 little oil in it for priming purposes and when you plumb it
 use tape - any air leaks really impair its ability...

 Charles List wrote:

Hi All

Thanks to all who have advised me this last few months, I am now a
biofueller! 105l batches, good product. Unfortunately, after 10 good
batches, my pump has started spraying out of the back of the impeller
housing. So I took it apart and the impeller has broken up and the
housing has been eaten through at the back, around the mechanical
seal. It was 30 years old or so, free and a plastic spa pump, so I'm
not too distressed, but I obviously don't want it happening again.

I notice that the clearwater pump used by JtF is made of cast iron,
so should my next pump be made of metal? Also, is the impeller in the
clearwater pump  plastic? As I know you can get some with stainless
steel blades, I wonder my impeller break-up was due to age or chemicals.

Thanks

Charles List




 ___
 Biofuel mailing list
 Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

 Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
 http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

 Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 
 messages):
 http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/


 



___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] breakthrough - store CH4 at 500psi instead of 3600

2006-07-20 Thread John Beale

Water and air filters. Many respirators for working in environments  
with fumes, etc, have activated carbon in them. And, yes, they have  
been around for decades, Doug.

-John



On Jul 20, 2006, at 9:09 AM, bob allen wrote:


 I did a little hyway driving last weekend in my (really my wife's)
 Prius:  at 65 mph we got 54 mpg, 60 about 56 mpg and at 50 mph an
 honest 61+ mpg.  Essentially flat and windless conditions.

 Zeke Yewdall wrote:
 Yeah, I know about the getting passed like you are standing still.  My
 truck will do 65 to 70mph on the highway, which isn't bad for a 4
 cylinder diesel engine -- probably rated at less horsepower than the
 stock ford ranger engine in roughly the same size truck.   It was  
 funny
 driving it down through montana and wyoming to colorado -- in wyoming
 and montana it was fine in the right lane, and the left lane wasn't  
 that
 much faster except for a few outlying speedsters.  But as soon as I
 crossed the Colorado border, even the right lane was annoyed at me,  
 and
 the left lane was probably 15 to 20mph faster than me.

 On 7/19/06, *robert and benita rabello* [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Zeke Yewdall wrote:

 Isn't that interesting that the North American driver is willing to
 sacrifice the world and condemn billions of people to a slow painful
 death, rather than accept a 10% decrease in how fast they can go in
 their car  Although I suppose they don't think of it that way.


 We just drove for 24 hours going to Los Angeles and back.   
 It's hard
 to drive slow for that long on the open highway.  I put the cruise
 control on the Camry at 110 km / hour and averaged 6.2 liters /  
 100 km
 for the trip.  (That's a little over 40 mpg for you who are  
 metrically
 challenged.)  Air conditioning and hills REALLY drain fuel  
 economy, as
 does going fast.  My best fuel mileage occured on flat roads at  
 90 km /
 hour, where the car would easily do 5.5 liters / 100 km.  The  
 only time
 we accomplished that kind of economy happened between San Jose  
 and Paso
 Robles, which is a relatively flat section of highway.

 But we were often getting passed like we were standing still!

 Your remark is cogent.  I don't think people here actually  
 make the
 connection between their driving habits and the impact these have  
 on
 the
 earth.  We saw a fair number of hybrids on the trip--they're  
 becoming
 more common now--and most of the people who were driving them  
 tried to
 drive in a more sane manner than the rest of the folk on the  
 freeway.
 In Los Angeles, however, the hybrids get to use the HOV lanes,  
 and if
 you're not driving at least 120 km / hour, other motorists become  
 rather
 annoyed!

 I put the blower on my truck in part because I eventually  
 intend to
 run it on some kind of gaseous fuel, but the best thing I can do  
 with
 that machine is simply NOT drive it at all.  Working from home  
 really
 helps . . .

 robert luis rabello
 The Edge of Justice
 Adventure for Your Mind
 http://www.newadventure.ca

 Ranger Supercharger Project Page
 http://www.members.shaw.ca/rabello/
 http://www.members.shaw.ca/rabello/


 ___
 Biofuel mailing list
 Biofuel@sustainablelists.org mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
  
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/ 
 biofuel_sustainablelists.org

 Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
 http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

 Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000
 messages):
 http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/



 -- 
 --

 ___
 Biofuel mailing list
 Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/ 
 biofuel_sustainablelists.org

 Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
 http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

 Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000  
 messages):
 http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/



 -- 
 --
 Bob Allen,http://ozarker.org/bob
 --
 -
 The modern conservative is engaged in one of Man's oldest exercises
 in moral philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral
 justification for selfishness  JKG
 


 ___
 Biofuel mailing list
 Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/ 
 biofuel_sustainablelists.org

 Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
 http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

 Search

[Biofuel] WVO

2006-07-20 Thread WM LUKE MATHISEN

The waste veg oil (wvo)I collect has three different layers after it 
settles.  A clear (translucent) layer on top and a brown non-translucent 
layer - that doesn't want to filter - in the middle and then black solids on 
the bottom.  My question is the middle brown layer.  It seems - and I havent 
run enough batches to be sure - that the middle layer has water in it.  Is 
it worth the energy - propane - to process it when you have to boil off the 
water?


:-)
Luke

_
Dont just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! 
http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/



___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Pump choice

Joe,
 I'll sure you're right. I am using 3/4 fittings. Going to 1 fittings 
and lines would allow one to break the 90L barrier.
  Tom
- Original Message - 
From: Joe Street [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Thursday, July 20, 2006 10:28 AM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Pump choice

 Hey Tom;

 My guess on this is it is not so much the pump but the size of the
 plumbing.  I noticed that one particular pump with the same size motor
 and impeller was offered with 1 or 3/4 inlet and the throughput was
 almost the same as a smaller pump with standard 3/4 inlet unless you
 ordered it with the 1
 I then took a look at a whoile bunch of pump curves and what you find is
 that you won't get beyond about 10-15 GPM with any size motor or pump
 unless you go larger than 3/4 on the pump inlet. The 90 litre wall I
 think is related to the 3/4 tank connections on the hot water tanks we
 all like using not the pump per se but it amounts to the same difference
 in the end.

 I believe it is a waste of time and money buying a larger tank than
 about 100 litres since as most people find out you can't get a good
 reaction on about more than 90 litres of oil anyways.

 Joe

 Thomas Kelly wrote:

 Charles,
The impeller in the clearwater pump is metal. Plastic impellers 
 will
 eventually fail in pumps used to agitate the reaction.
  My experience w. the clearwater pump is that it will handle up to 
 90L
 (~ 24 gal) batches. Above that, even after three hours reaction time, I 
 have
 gotten incomplete reactions.
  Congratulations on your success scaling up.

  Tom
 - Original Message - 
 From: Charles List [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 Sent: Wednesday, July 19, 2006 7:43 PM
 Subject: [Biofuel] Pump choice

Hi All

Thanks to all who have advised me this last few months, I am now a
biofueller! 105l batches, good product. Unfortunately, after 10 good
batches, my pump has started spraying out of the back of the impeller
housing. So I took it apart and the impeller has broken up and the
housing has been eaten through at the back, around the mechanical
seal. It was 30 years old or so, free and a plastic spa pump, so I'm
not too distressed, but I obviously don't want it happening again.

I notice that the clearwater pump used by JtF is made of cast iron,
so should my next pump be made of metal? Also, is the impeller in the
clearwater pump  plastic? As I know you can get some with stainless
steel blades, I wonder my impeller break-up was due to age or chemicals.

Thanks

Charles List
-- 
--
This email was sent using Telecom SchoolZone.
   www.schoolzone.net.nz

This email has been scanned for viruses by Telecom SchoolZone,
but is not guaranteed to be virus-free.
--

___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000
messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

 ___
 Biofuel mailing list
 Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

 Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
 http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

 Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 
 messages):
 http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

 ___
 Biofuel mailing list
 Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

 Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
 http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

 Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 
 messages):
 http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] WVO

2006-07-20 Thread doug swanson

I've found that if I leave it in the settling tank longer, it will 
settle out even more. Smaller water droplets seem to take longer to sink 
and separate, (or conglomerate with other droplets) when encased in 
their oil surroundings. I'd use solar if I wanted to heat and retrieve 
the oil from it, but the last time I cleaned out the settling tank, I 
blended that layer with my compost pile, its temperature went up to 140 
F, and stayed there for a week. Happy bacteria! (I did mix saw dust and 
grass clippings with it to help absorb it, and make it easier to move 
around into the pile.)

Just heating that layer, not necessarily to water's boiling point will 
facilitate the separation though.

doug swanson



WM LUKE MATHISEN wrote:

 The waste veg oil (wvo)I collect has three different layers after it 
 settles. A clear (translucent) layer on top and a brown 
 non-translucent layer - that doesn't want to filter - in the middle 
 and then black solids on the bottom. My question is the middle brown 
 layer. It seems - and I havent run enough batches to be sure - that 
 the middle layer has water in it. Is it worth the energy - propane - 
 to process it when you have to boil off the water?

 :-)
 Luke

 _
 Don’t just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! 
 http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/




___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

  


-- 
Contentment comes not from having more, but from wanting less.

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *

This email is constructed entirely with OpenSource Software.
No Microsoft databits have been incorporated herein.
All existing databits have been constructed from recycled databits. 


___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Cause of New Plymouth biodiesel explosion released

2006-07-20 Thread Appal Energy

It's sad to be making any comment on such a matter. Here you had a 
family that was on the edge of not only doing something great but 
putting themselves in an enormously better finanacial window to boot. 
Then the bottom falls out.

I don't wish to insinuate anything about the owner/operators. But I can 
see and have seen where the backyard brewer mindset is being applied to 
commercial environements and is begging for accidents to happen. No 
containment. Open-face motors. Open reactors. Wood-fired boilers in 
close proximity to methanol or methanol fumes.

It's one thing to spill a gallon here or lose a motor there or foul up 
in a small way somewhere else when you're working with a five or perhaps 
a 55 gallon pale. It's altogether another when you're handling thousands 
of gallons at a time.

This is now two plants at least that have been lost to methanol related 
fire/explosions. I don't doubt that there will be more and perhaps 
already have been.

At this scale making biodiesel requires as much concentration as walking 
a tightrope across the Royal Gorge with no balance bar.

I have no doubt that a lot of people are going to fail to make that 
connection.

Todd Swearingen


Mike Weaver wrote:

I feel sorry for the guy and his family but using a torch around methanol?
Back in my wrenching days my boss made sure we knew an empty gas tank 
was more danergous than a full one, and god forbid you did any
welding the gas tank had to be filled with water first.


Appal Energy wrote:

  

A bad day at Black Rock...

http://www.ktvb.com/news/localnews/stories/ktvbn-jul1406-explosion_cause.113ae8b1.html


   Cause of New Plymouth biodiesel explosion released


 02:30 PM MDT on Friday, July 14, 2006

KTVB.COM

PAYETTE -- Investigators say they now know what caused an explosion at a 
New Plymouth biodiesel plant last week that killed a Meridian man.

One man died at a fire and explosion at a New Plymouth biodiesel plant 
last Friday.

The Payette County Sheriff's Office released its findings today into the 
explosion and subsequent fire at the plant that left 25-year-old Blaise 
Black dead.

The cause of the fire was determined to be an explosion of a 25,000 
gallon steel holding tank that Blaise was working on. The tank contain 
about 30 to 40 gallons of glycerin and methanol liquid mix. Both 
products are flammable and give off flammable vapors.

Investigators say at the time of the explosion Blaise was working on the 
top of the tank attempting to install a two-inch steel pipe with a 
90-degree elbow on the end to function as a vent on the top of the tank. 
During the installation of the vent tube a steel two-inch cap was 
removed from the side of the tank where the vent was to be installed. 
This allowed the vapors to escape from the tank. When Blaise lit his 
cutting torch it ignited the vapors, which triggered the fire and 
explosion.

The Payette County coroner says Blaise it appears Blaise died from blunt 
force trauma as a result of the explosion.

The explosion would have thrown him violently upward against the ceiling 
and a large beam that was above him. As a result of the explosion, the 
ceiling and beam came down and trapped him on the top of the tank. The 
force of the impact would have killed him immediately.


___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

 





___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/




  


___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Pump choice

Tom,

what is the name of the 

slow dry, soft set, pipe thread sealant

you use?  We are still getting small leaks...


Thomas Kelly wrote:

Charles,
 As Mikw Weaver pointed out, 1 Clearwater pumps are not self-priming. 
Another way to avoid priming each time is to:
 Position the pump so that it is level with the bottom of the WVO source 
and the bottom of the reactor. This allows it to prime by gravity. I pump 
WVO from a plastic barrel that is on a small platform  ~ 16 inches high. My 
pump and reactor are on platforms the same height. I used JB Weld to attach 
a plastic nipple about 2 inches from the bottom of the WVO barrel   
line to the pump.

 Air leaks do impair the pump's ability. I'd recommend threaded barbs w. 
hose clamps for any hoses  ... (rather than using pipe nipples to hoses). 
Also check on a regular basis to make sure clamps are tight.
 While teflon tape works great for water lines, it is not recommended 
for fuel/solvents lines. The fittings will eventually leak and the tape 
turns to goo. I was advised to use a slow dry, soft set, pipe thread sealant 
when plumbing fittings in my reactor. After 8 months, no leaks. The fittings 
are also very easy to disassemble for processor maintenance.
 Best of luck,
 Tom
- Original Message - 
From: Mike Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Thursday, July 20, 2006 9:44 AM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Pump choice


  

We're using a clearwater with good results - but be careful to leave a
little oil in it for priming purposes and when you plumb it
use tape - any air leaks really impair its ability...

Charles List wrote:



Hi All

Thanks to all who have advised me this last few months, I am now a
biofueller! 105l batches, good product. Unfortunately, after 10 good
batches, my pump has started spraying out of the back of the impeller
housing. So I took it apart and the impeller has broken up and the
housing has been eaten through at the back, around the mechanical
seal. It was 30 years old or so, free and a plastic spa pump, so I'm
not too distressed, but I obviously don't want it happening again.

I notice that the clearwater pump used by JtF is made of cast iron,
so should my next pump be made of metal? Also, is the impeller in the
clearwater pump  plastic? As I know you can get some with stainless
steel blades, I wonder my impeller break-up was due to age or chemicals.

Thanks

Charles List


  

___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 
messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/








___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

  



___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

[Biofuel] Your Beliefs

2006-07-20 Thread Fritz Friesinger




Not to mention 
the unecessary use of two atomic bombs on the Japanese. Americans are the 
only ones ever to massacre human beings with nuclear weapons and yet they 
deem themselves to be the ones worthy of having 
them.huh?Joe
Hey Joe,
you speak my mind thanks
Fritz
___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Your Beliefs

2006-07-20 Thread John Beale

Not to defend the US government's actions, but if you had the opportunity to be the only one holding the nuclear weapons, wouldn't you want to be?
-John



On Jul 20, 2006, at 12:50 PM, Fritz Friesinger wrote:

Not to mention the unecessary use of two atomic bombs on the Japanese. 
Americans are the only ones ever to massacre human beings with nuclear 
weapons and yet they deem themselves to be the ones worthy of having 
them.huh?

Joe
Hey Joe,
you speak my mind thanks
Fritz
___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Pump choice

Any advice on 40 gallon batches and a clearwater pump?  We haven't used 
this latest reactor yet - will it have enought power to
mix 40 gallons?

-Mike

Joe Street wrote:

Hey Tom;

My guess on this is it is not so much the pump but the size of the 
plumbing.  I noticed that one particular pump with the same size motor 
and impeller was offered with 1 or 3/4 inlet and the throughput was 
almost the same as a smaller pump with standard 3/4 inlet unless you 
ordered it with the 1
I then took a look at a whoile bunch of pump curves and what you find is 
that you won't get beyond about 10-15 GPM with any size motor or pump 
unless you go larger than 3/4 on the pump inlet. The 90 litre wall I 
think is related to the 3/4 tank connections on the hot water tanks we 
all like using not the pump per se but it amounts to the same difference 
in the end.

I believe it is a waste of time and money buying a larger tank than 
about 100 litres since as most people find out you can't get a good 
reaction on about more than 90 litres of oil anyways.

Joe



Thomas Kelly wrote:

  

Charles,
   The impeller in the clearwater pump is metal. Plastic impellers will 
eventually fail in pumps used to agitate the reaction.
 My experience w. the clearwater pump is that it will handle up to 90L 
(~ 24 gal) batches. Above that, even after three hours reaction time, I have 
gotten incomplete reactions.
 Congratulations on your success scaling up.

 Tom
- Original Message - 
From: Charles List [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Wednesday, July 19, 2006 7:43 PM
Subject: [Biofuel] Pump choice





Hi All

Thanks to all who have advised me this last few months, I am now a
biofueller! 105l batches, good product. Unfortunately, after 10 good
batches, my pump has started spraying out of the back of the impeller
housing. So I took it apart and the impeller has broken up and the
housing has been eaten through at the back, around the mechanical
seal. It was 30 years old or so, free and a plastic spa pump, so I'm
not too distressed, but I obviously don't want it happening again.

I notice that the clearwater pump used by JtF is made of cast iron,
so should my next pump be made of metal? Also, is the impeller in the
clearwater pump  plastic? As I know you can get some with stainless
steel blades, I wonder my impeller break-up was due to age or chemicals.

Thanks

Charles List
-- 
--
   This email was sent using Telecom SchoolZone.
  www.schoolzone.net.nz

This email has been scanned for viruses by Telecom SchoolZone,
but is not guaranteed to be virus-free.
--

___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 
messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/



  



___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/






___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

  



___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Cause of New Plymouth biodiesel explosion released

It wasn't my intent to be insensitive.  This was a case of operator 
error - a young man didn't realize the danger of methanol fumes
and lost his life. 

Appal Energy wrote:

It's sad to be making any comment on such a matter. Here you had a 
family that was on the edge of not only doing something great but 
putting themselves in an enormously better finanacial window to boot. 
Then the bottom falls out.

I don't wish to insinuate anything about the owner/operators. But I can 
see and have seen where the backyard brewer mindset is being applied to 
commercial environements and is begging for accidents to happen. No 
containment. Open-face motors. Open reactors. Wood-fired boilers in 
close proximity to methanol or methanol fumes.

It's one thing to spill a gallon here or lose a motor there or foul up 
in a small way somewhere else when you're working with a five or perhaps 
a 55 gallon pale. It's altogether another when you're handling thousands 
of gallons at a time.

This is now two plants at least that have been lost to methanol related 
fire/explosions. I don't doubt that there will be more and perhaps 
already have been.

At this scale making biodiesel requires as much concentration as walking 
a tightrope across the Royal Gorge with no balance bar.

I have no doubt that a lot of people are going to fail to make that 
connection.

Todd Swearingen


Mike Weaver wrote:

  

I feel sorry for the guy and his family but using a torch around methanol?
Back in my wrenching days my boss made sure we knew an empty gas tank 
was more danergous than a full one, and god forbid you did any
welding the gas tank had to be filled with water first.


Appal Energy wrote:

 



A bad day at Black Rock...

http://www.ktvb.com/news/localnews/stories/ktvbn-jul1406-explosion_cause.113ae8b1.html


  Cause of New Plymouth biodiesel explosion released


02:30 PM MDT on Friday, July 14, 2006

KTVB.COM

PAYETTE -- Investigators say they now know what caused an explosion at a 
New Plymouth biodiesel plant last week that killed a Meridian man.

One man died at a fire and explosion at a New Plymouth biodiesel plant 
last Friday.

The Payette County Sheriff's Office released its findings today into the 
explosion and subsequent fire at the plant that left 25-year-old Blaise 
Black dead.

The cause of the fire was determined to be an explosion of a 25,000 
gallon steel holding tank that Blaise was working on. The tank contain 
about 30 to 40 gallons of glycerin and methanol liquid mix. Both 
products are flammable and give off flammable vapors.

Investigators say at the time of the explosion Blaise was working on the 
top of the tank attempting to install a two-inch steel pipe with a 
90-degree elbow on the end to function as a vent on the top of the tank. 
During the installation of the vent tube a steel two-inch cap was 
removed from the side of the tank where the vent was to be installed. 
This allowed the vapors to escape from the tank. When Blaise lit his 
cutting torch it ignited the vapors, which triggered the fire and 
explosion.

The Payette County coroner says Blaise it appears Blaise died from blunt 
force trauma as a result of the explosion.

The explosion would have thrown him violently upward against the ceiling 
and a large beam that was above him. As a result of the explosion, the 
ceiling and beam came down and trapped him on the top of the tank. The 
force of the impact would have killed him immediately.


___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/



   

  

___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/




 




___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

  



___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):

Re: [Biofuel] Smacking the hornet's nest

Fritz,

1.  No, I said it was then called British Palestine.
2.  It was then ruled by the British as part of the British Empire.  
But, than does not make it British.  The people living there were 
primarily Muslim Arabs, a few Christians and, surprisingly, some Jewish 
people.
3.  I am not saying things are not hard for Palestinians under the 
Israeli government, not to mention the PA is likely the most corrupt 
government in the world.
4.  I am also not saying I approve of everything the Israeli Gov't does.
5.  I also never said I approve of the way Israel is handling the 
current situation.
6.  My being an American does not impair my thinking; ad hominem attacks 
usually indicate that you are out of intellectual ammo.
7. My point with the land is that most of us in North America are 
arguably living on land that was home to Native Americans.  I'm fairly 
sure my huse is on land once occupied by the Algonkian nation.  If you 
are in Quebec, you are probably living on Abenaki land.
8. I offer no defense of US mining companies.  Most of what they do is 
indefensible.
9.  I am saying I think blowing each other to bits won't solve anything.

Nowhere in my post do I say I defend what is going on in Palestine and 
Israel.  I did say I think it was a mistake to drop all the Jewish 
refugees into that area.
But, no one else wanted them.  I personally think the US should have 
taken them in. 

I am not quite sure what you mean by your last sentance.

-Mike

Fritz Friesinger wrote:

 Mike,
 what you are saying is,Palestine was British then? so how it became 
 British?and thas this make the whole thing less hard for the Palestinians?
 What happened a hundred years ago should not happening anymore today!
 We came a long way to realize the wrongs of the past but instaed of 
 garding that those attrocytis cant be repeatet we are turning a blind 
 eye and excuse things with old rethoric.Your analysis sucks but then 
 you are US Citicen and what can we expect from such!
 To my very own situation,i live in Quebec Canada on a piece of Land (a 
 former open pit Graphit mine) nobody wantet so i got it fairly 
 cheep.But then i am cleaning up the mess a US Mining companie had left 
 and this for seven years now!
 i have put trouts in my lakes and had spent a lot of money for topsoil 
 and plant trees and garden!And once i be finished (probably never) 
 people will come and ask if the could live on my land and i will 
 refuse the request if the show me the same attitude as you
 Fritz

 - Original Message -
 *From:* Mike Weaver mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 *To:* biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 mailto:biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 *Sent:* Thursday, July 20, 2006 9:18 AM
 *Subject:* [Biofuel] Smacking the hornet's nest

 I can't say I am always a fan of the Israeli government right or
 wrong,
 and let's be honest, they've made some mistakes (but then look at
 the US
 gov't), but they are
 in an impossible spot.  Do they need some nudging to do they right
 thing? Yes, but we all do.

 Let's stop and think, Why are they where they are?  - Because NO
 Western country would take then. Roosevelt turned away of boatload of
 Jewish refugees.  They really didn't have a lot of options.  In
 Poland,
 TWO YEARS after WWII ended, there was a massacre of Jews.  I can
 understand why one might gamble on a boat trip to (then) British
 Palestine rather than go home to Europe.

 Personally, I think the whole idea was ill-conceived, and US
 should have
 settled the refugees in the largely unocupied American West.  Heck, a
 state even.

 Besides, I think if you wait long enough, Fritz, you'll see the same
 behavior here anyway.  We're already denying blacks the right to
 vote in
 some states, and it's pretty much illegal to be black in a white area
 after dark already.

  Step one is to confiscate the land owned by
 African-Americans, [or Native Americans] evict them from it and
 use the land
 to build massive new subdivisions. Only white
 Protestant Christians may live in these subdivisions. - Check, doing
 that here.

 I notice you're in Canada - do you live in a house?  Where did the
 land
 come from?  A friendly Algonkin
 http://www.accessgenealogy.com/native/tribes/algonquian/algonhist1.htm 

 give it to you?  I notice the Canadia Government has been
 having a little trouble with its First Nation denizens - a few Mohawk
 lawsuits  here and there.

 Don't judge, so that you won't be judged.

 http://bible.cc/matthew/7-2.htmFor
 http://bible.cc/matthew/7-2.htm%3EFor with whatever judgment you
 judge,
 you will be judged; and with whatever measure you measure, it will be
 measured to you.

 ^3 http://bible.cc/matthew/7-3.htm Why do you see the speck that
 is in
 your brother's eye, but don't consider the beam that is in your
 own eye?

Re: [Biofuel] Smacking the hornet's nest

2006-07-20 Thread Fritz Friesinger




Mike,
your point,that it was british Palestine and so 
make things sound,it was not real Palestine!
Than,if you say,the Israeli Gvnmt.hade made some 
mistakes it souns like: everyone is entitled to some Mistakes and 
so
But you are so far of reality as if you would say 
Hitler made some Mistakes and this is making my final point in my last 
Mail!
After all it is your Gvnmt. who supplies the Arms 
to Israel and therefor you are as guilty as my Parents have been in the 
Holocaust
Simon Wiesenthal said :you have to make a stand 
!What an emty Phrase considering the murder going on in Palestine,an occupation 
lasting now 40 Years
To you point 6. I doo think that you beeing an US 
American impairs your thinking
and the lack of my intellectual capacity is more my 
lack of good english
get the picture?
Fritz

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Mike Weaver 
  
  To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org 
  
  Sent: Thursday, July 20, 2006 1:19 
  PM
  Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Smacking the 
  hornet's nest
  Fritz,1. No, I said it was then called British 
  Palestine.2. It was then ruled by the British as part of the British 
  Empire. But, than does not make it British. The people living 
  there were primarily Muslim Arabs, a few Christians and, surprisingly, 
  some Jewish people.3. I am not saying things are not hard for 
  Palestinians under the Israeli government, not to mention the PA is likely 
  the most corrupt government in the world.4. I am also not saying 
  I approve of everything the Israeli Gov't does.5. I also never said 
  I approve of the way Israel is handling the current situation.6. 
  My being an American does not impair my thinking; ad hominem attacks 
  usually indicate that you are out of intellectual ammo.7. My point 
  with the land is that most of us in North America are arguably living on 
  land that was home to Native Americans. I'm fairly sure my huse is 
  on land once occupied by the Algonkian nation. If you are in Quebec, 
  you are probably living on Abenaki land.8. I offer no defense of US mining 
  companies. Most of what they do is indefensible.9. I am 
  saying I think blowing each other to bits won't solve anything.Nowhere 
  in my post do I say I defend what is going on in Palestine and 
  Israel. I did say I think it was a mistake to drop all the Jewish 
  refugees into that area.But, no one else wanted them. I 
  personally think the US should have taken them in. I am not quite 
  sure what you mean by your last sentance.-MikeFritz Friesinger 
  wrote: Mike, what you are saying is,Palestine was British 
  then? so how it became  British?and thas this make the whole thing 
  less hard for the Palestinians? What happened a hundred years ago 
  should not happening anymore today! We came a long way to realize the 
  wrongs of the past but instaed of  garding that those attrocytis cant 
  be repeatet we are turning a blind  eye and excuse things with old 
  rethoric.Your analysis sucks but then  you are US Citicen and what can 
  we expect from such! To my very own situation,i live in Quebec Canada 
  on a piece of Land (a  former open pit Graphit mine) nobody wantet so 
  i got it fairly  cheep.But then i am cleaning up the mess a US Mining 
  companie had left  and this for seven years now! i have put 
  trouts in my lakes and had spent a lot of money for topsoil  and plant 
  trees and garden!And once i be finished (probably never)  people will 
  come and ask if the could live on my land and i will  refuse the 
  request if the show me the same attitude as you 
  Fritz - Original Message 
  - *From:* Mike Weaver mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  *To:* biofuel@sustainablelists.org 
  mailto:biofuel@sustainablelists.org 
  *Sent:* Thursday, July 20, 2006 9:18 AM 
  *Subject:* [Biofuel] Smacking the hornet's 
  nest I can't say I am always a fan of 
  the Israeli government right or 
  wrong, and let's be honest, they've made some 
  mistakes (but then look at the 
  US gov't), but they 
  are in an impossible spot. Do they need 
  some nudging to do they right thing? Yes, but 
  we all do. Let's stop and think, "Why 
  are they where they are? - Because NO 
  Western country would take then. Roosevelt turned away of boatload 
  of Jewish refugees. They really didn't 
  have a lot of options. In 
  Poland, TWO YEARS after WWII ended, there was 
  a massacre of Jews. I can understand why 
  one might gamble on a boat trip to (then) 
  British Palestine rather than go "home" to 
  Europe. Personally, I think the whole 
  idea was ill-conceived, and US should 
  have settled the refugees in the largely 
  unocupied American West. Heck, a state 
  even. Besides, I think if you wait 
  long enough, Fritz, you'll see the same 
  behavior here anyway. We're already denying blacks the right 
  to vote in 
  some states, and it's pretty much illegal to be black in a white 
  area after dark 
  already. Step one is to 
  confiscate the land owned by 
  African-Americans, [or

Re: [Biofuel] Your Beliefs

2006-07-20 Thread Hakan Falk


John,

I do not know, probably not, if I knew the consequences. Many of the 
scientists that were drafted to do the development, on both sides, 
were also against it. In war time the people have few choices. Maybe 
even some politician would be against the development, but they could 
not grasp was the result would be. However, it was better that the 
Americans was first, Nazi Germany under Hitler was not far behind, 
delayed a little bit by the destruction of the heavy water production 
plant in Norway. It is clear that US understood what was going on and 
had to be first, otherwise Europe might have been Germany now and US 
a radioactive desert. It is no doubt that Germany was far ahead on 
the rocket missile development and  it was the same people that later 
help US to be the leading nation in space and missile technology. 
They were moved to US and fast tracked to be US citizens.

Hakan


At 19:01 20/07/2006, you wrote:
Not to defend the US government's actions, but if you had the 
opportunity to be the only one holding the nuclear weapons, wouldn't 
you want to be?
-John



On Jul 20, 2006, at 12:50 PM, Fritz Friesinger wrote:

Not to mention the unecessary use of two atomic bombs on the Japanese.
Americans are the only ones ever to massacre human beings with nuclear
weapons and yet they deem themselves to be the ones worthy of having
them.huh?

Joe
Hey Joe,
you speak my mind thanks
Fritz
___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org
 


Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlhttp://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
 


Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 
messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
 

br
div___/div
divBiofuel mailing list/div
divBiofuel@sustainablelists.org/div
diva 
href=http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org;
 
EUDORA=AUTOURLhttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org/a/div
br
divBiofuel at Journey to Forever:/div
diva href=http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html; 
EUDORA=AUTOURLhttp://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html/a/div
br
divSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives 
(50,000 messages):/div
diva 
href=http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/; 
EUDORA=AUTOURLhttp://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org//a/div
/blockquote/x-html



___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Pump choice

Hi Mike;

I can only speak from my own experience and I haven't used that 
combination but I have read a fer anecdotes. Sorry but I think you 
should not get too excited about 40 gallons.  You may find that you can 
only fill that tank to the 25 gallon point with that size plumbing and 
pump.  You would not be the first one to discover this!  There is no 
fine print telling you this by the people selling kits with a 40 gallon 
tank and clear pump.  But then again if you don't do quality tests you 
would never know.

Joe

Mike Weaver wrote:

 Any advice on 40 gallon batches and a clearwater pump?  We haven't used 
 this latest reactor yet - will it have enought power to
 mix 40 gallons?
 
 -Mike
 
 Joe Street wrote:
 
 
Hey Tom;

My guess on this is it is not so much the pump but the size of the 
plumbing.  I noticed that one particular pump with the same size motor 
and impeller was offered with 1 or 3/4 inlet and the throughput was 
almost the same as a smaller pump with standard 3/4 inlet unless you 
ordered it with the 1
I then took a look at a whoile bunch of pump curves and what you find is 
that you won't get beyond about 10-15 GPM with any size motor or pump 
unless you go larger than 3/4 on the pump inlet. The 90 litre wall I 
think is related to the 3/4 tank connections on the hot water tanks we 
all like using not the pump per se but it amounts to the same difference 
in the end.

I believe it is a waste of time and money buying a larger tank than 
about 100 litres since as most people find out you can't get a good 
reaction on about more than 90 litres of oil anyways.

Joe



Thomas Kelly wrote:

 


Charles,
  The impeller in the clearwater pump is metal. Plastic impellers will 
eventually fail in pumps used to agitate the reaction.
My experience w. the clearwater pump is that it will handle up to 90L 
(~ 24 gal) batches. Above that, even after three hours reaction time, I have 
gotten incomplete reactions.
Congratulations on your success scaling up.

Tom
- Original Message - 
From: Charles List [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Wednesday, July 19, 2006 7:43 PM
Subject: [Biofuel] Pump choice



   


Hi All

Thanks to all who have advised me this last few months, I am now a
biofueller! 105l batches, good product. Unfortunately, after 10 good
batches, my pump has started spraying out of the back of the impeller
housing. So I took it apart and the impeller has broken up and the
housing has been eaten through at the back, around the mechanical
seal. It was 30 years old or so, free and a plastic spa pump, so I'm
not too distressed, but I obviously don't want it happening again.

I notice that the clearwater pump used by JtF is made of cast iron,
so should my next pump be made of metal? Also, is the impeller in the
clearwater pump  plastic? As I know you can get some with stainless
steel blades, I wonder my impeller break-up was due to age or chemicals.

Thanks

Charles List
-- 
--
  This email was sent using Telecom SchoolZone.
 www.schoolzone.net.nz

This email has been scanned for viruses by Telecom SchoolZone,
but is not guaranteed to be virus-free.
--

___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 
messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/



 



___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/


   



___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

 

 
 
 
 ___
 Biofuel mailing list
 Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org
 
 Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
 http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
 
 Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
 http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
 
 


___
Biofuel mailing list

Re: [Biofuel] Your Beliefs

John;

Of course.but that would make me a bit of a fascist wouldn't you say?

Joe

John Beale wrote:

 Not to defend the US government's actions, but if you had the 
 opportunity to be the only one holding the nuclear weapons, wouldn't you 
 want to be?
 -John
 
 
 
 On Jul 20, 2006, at 12:50 PM, Fritz Friesinger wrote:
 
 Not to mention the unecessary use of two atomic bombs on the Japanese.
 Americans are the only ones ever to massacre human beings with nuclear
 weapons and yet they deem themselves to be the ones worthy of having
 them.huh?
 
 Joe
 Hey Joe,
 you speak my mind thanks
 Fritz
 ___
 Biofuel mailing list
 Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org
 
 
 Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
 http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
 
 Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000
 messages):
 http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
 
 
 
 
 ___
 Biofuel mailing list
 Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org
 
 Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
 http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html
 
 Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
 http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
 


___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] Smacking the hornet's nest

No.  I find your logic hard to follow.
I also did not say being called British Palestine made it British.  At 
that time it was ruled by Britain. 
I never mentioned Hitler nor the Nazis.
Yes, I said the government of Israel has made mistakes and will most 
certainly continue to do so, as will the US. 
I just don't understand your 3rd sentance.  I am not talking about Hitler.
 After all it is your Gvnmt. who supplies the Arms to Israel and 
therefor you are as guilty as my Parents have been in the Holocaust
Canada sell $900,000,000 worth of arms annually.
Canada sell arms to Israel also: ** Canada exported military goods 
valued at $100,000 or more to seven countries hosting armed conflicts in 
2002: Algeria , Colombia  India , Israel , Nigeria, the Philippines , 
and Sri Lanka . The value of arms exports to these countries totaled 
$8-million. -Wikipedia
So, as your government is selling arms to Israel that makes you as 
guilty as the rest of us?  By your logic you've got blood on your hands.
Also, I have to say, what's the difference between saying my thinking is 
impaired because I'm a citizen of the US, and saying that my thinking is 
impaired because I'm a citizen of Zambia?  That sounds like a bigoted 
statement to me. 

Fritz Friesinger wrote:

 Mike,
 your point,that it was british Palestine and so make things sound,it 
 was not real Palestine!
 Than,if you say,the Israeli Gvnmt.hade made some mistakes it souns 
 like: everyone is entitled to some Mistakes and so
 But you are so far of reality as if you would say Hitler made some 
 Mistakes and this is making my final point in my last Mail!
 After all it is your Gvnmt. who supplies the Arms to Israel and 
 therefor you are as guilty as my Parents have been in the Holocaust
 Simon Wiesenthal said :you have to make a stand !What an emty Phrase 
 considering the murder going on in Palestine,an occupation lasting now 
 40 Years
 To you point 6. I doo think that you beeing an US American impairs 
 your thinking
 and the lack of my intellectual capacity is more my lack of good english
 get the picture?
 Fritz

 - Original Message -
 *From:* Mike Weaver mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 *To:* biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 mailto:biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 *Sent:* Thursday, July 20, 2006 1:19 PM
 *Subject:* Re: [Biofuel] Smacking the hornet's nest

 Fritz,

 1.  No, I said it was then called British Palestine.
 2.  It was then ruled by the British as part of the British Empire. 
 But, than does not make it British.  The people living there were
 primarily Muslim Arabs, a few Christians and, surprisingly, some
 Jewish
 people.
 3.  I am not saying things are not hard for Palestinians under the
 Israeli government, not to mention the PA is likely the most corrupt
 government in the world.
 4.  I am also not saying I approve of everything the Israeli Gov't
 does.
 5.  I also never said I approve of the way Israel is handling the
 current situation.
 6.  My being an American does not impair my thinking; ad hominem
 attacks
 usually indicate that you are out of intellectual ammo.
 7. My point with the land is that most of us in North America are
 arguably living on land that was home to Native Americans.  I'm
 fairly
 sure my huse is on land once occupied by the Algonkian nation.  If
 you
 are in Quebec, you are probably living on Abenaki land.
 8. I offer no defense of US mining companies.  Most of what they
 do is
 indefensible.
 9.  I am saying I think blowing each other to bits won't solve
 anything.

 Nowhere in my post do I say I defend what is going on in Palestine
 and
 Israel.  I did say I think it was a mistake to drop all the Jewish
 refugees into that area.
 But, no one else wanted them.  I personally think the US should have
 taken them in.

 I am not quite sure what you mean by your last sentance.

 -Mike

 Fritz Friesinger wrote:

  Mike,
  what you are saying is,Palestine was British then? so how it became
  British?and thas this make the whole thing less hard for the
 Palestinians?
  What happened a hundred years ago should not happening anymore
 today!
  We came a long way to realize the wrongs of the past but instaed of
  garding that those attrocytis cant be repeatet we are turning a
 blind
  eye and excuse things with old rethoric.Your analysis sucks but
 then
  you are US Citicen and what can we expect from such!
  To my very own situation,i live in Quebec Canada on a piece of
 Land (a
  former open pit Graphit mine) nobody wantet so i got it fairly
  cheep.But then i am cleaning up the mess a US Mining companie
 had left
  and this for seven years now!
  i have put trouts in my lakes and had spent a lot of money for
 topsoil
  and plant trees and garden!And once i be finished

Re: [Biofuel] Pump choice

Mike,
 The label says Rectorseal. I think that's the company that makes it.
 There's a   5  inside a red circle. It says Slow Dry on the left of the 
5 and Soft Set on the right. Pipe Thread Sealant  is written under the 5.
 I bought a 4 oz can at Lowe's.
 Any brush-on pipe dope might work, but this doesn't harden and was 
recommended for fittings in fuel lines.
 Tom
- Original Message - 
From: Mike Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Thursday, July 20, 2006 12:31 PM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Pump choice


 Tom,

 what is the name of the 

 slow dry, soft set, pipe thread sealant

 you use?  We are still getting small leaks...


 Thomas Kelly wrote:

Charles,
 As Mikw Weaver pointed out, 1 Clearwater pumps are not self-priming.
Another way to avoid priming each time is to:
 Position the pump so that it is level with the bottom of the WVO 
 source
and the bottom of the reactor. This allows it to prime by gravity. I pump
WVO from a plastic barrel that is on a small platform  ~ 16 inches high. 
My
pump and reactor are on platforms the same height. I used JB Weld to 
attach
a plastic nipple about 2 inches from the bottom of the WVO barrel  
line to the pump.

 Air leaks do impair the pump's ability. I'd recommend threaded barbs 
 w.
hose clamps for any hoses  ... (rather than using pipe nipples to hoses).
Also check on a regular basis to make sure clamps are tight.
 While teflon tape works great for water lines, it is not recommended
for fuel/solvents lines. The fittings will eventually leak and the tape
turns to goo. I was advised to use a slow dry, soft set, pipe thread 
sealant
when plumbing fittings in my reactor. After 8 months, no leaks. The 
fittings
are also very easy to disassemble for processor maintenance.
 Best of luck,
 Tom
- Original Message - 
From: Mike Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org
Sent: Thursday, July 20, 2006 9:44 AM
Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Pump choice




We're using a clearwater with good results - but be careful to leave a
little oil in it for priming purposes and when you plumb it
use tape - any air leaks really impair its ability...

Charles List wrote:



Hi All

Thanks to all who have advised me this last few months, I am now a
biofueller! 105l batches, good product. Unfortunately, after 10 good
batches, my pump has started spraying out of the back of the impeller
housing. So I took it apart and the impeller has broken up and the
housing has been eaten through at the back, around the mechanical
seal. It was 30 years old or so, free and a plastic spa pump, so I'm
not too distressed, but I obviously don't want it happening again.

I notice that the clearwater pump used by JtF is made of cast iron,
so should my next pump be made of metal? Also, is the impeller in the
clearwater pump  plastic? As I know you can get some with stainless
steel blades, I wonder my impeller break-up was due to age or chemicals.

Thanks

Charles List




___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000
messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/








___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 
messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/





 ___
 Biofuel mailing list
 Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
 http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

 Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
 http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

 Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 
 messages):
 http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/


 



___
Biofuel mailing list
Biofuel@sustainablelists.org
http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org

Biofuel at Journey to Forever:
http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html

Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):
http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/

Re: [Biofuel] WVO