Re: [Talk-GB] UK/GB OpenStreetMap survey results
As this has dropped off the active thread list a bit. I'd broadly agree with this, though I'm more corporate sponsors than members. My feeling on responding with a greater emphasis on community rather than techy stuff was that those OSM discussions I've been to (mapping parties in Gravesend, Maidstone) is that OSM meetups tend towards the techy. For those of us who don't speak Java or Ruby or whatever, this is quite an obstacle. And offputting (which is why I haven't gone to the London meetups though I work in London, the reports seem even more techy. Which isn't to say that a render that makes sense for the UK shouldn't be done, its more that the focus of a UK OSM group should be: 1) growing and retaining mappers. 2) getting the UK up to some level of completion (multiplying the post-hoc system for other datasets.) 3) encouraging repeat ground surveys to check changes. Paulbiv On Friday 07 Aug 2015 11:18:50 Brian Prangle wrote: Seeing as the survey put technical stuff like a new render low on the priority list ( it got one of the lowest strongly agree scores) lets refocus on the community stuff that the survey indicated should be more of a priority. A new UK render should be a separate task and discussion in my opinion. Here's my tuppence worth on 100 days 100 members 10 Corporate members (if we decide that's what we want) 1 Flagship sponsor 1 Engagement Initiative launched with 1 new instance underway Website and social media in placeNy Online shop with merchandise (e.g hiviz vests) 5 contacts identified in major organisations discussions underway with OSM data user organisations Committee/Board 2 meetings 1 online policy vote Sponsor pack in place Media Pack in Place 1 Press release 1 indepth piece of media coverage Regards Brian On 1 August 2015 at 12:53, Rob Nickerson rob.j.nicker...@gmail.com wrote: Hi all, Thank you for taking the time to fill out the A UK OpenStreetMap group? survey. In the 3 weeks since the survey first opened we received a total of 101 responses. This is a great response rate and indicates that many people are interested in the prospect of such a group. So what do the results show? Please follow the link below for a break down of the results and some suggestions as to next steps for this group. https://docs.google.com/document/d/1A8rKyKUW0X01n-JEMLwEUT4ktX-7WrxNP03YTk Zs6lU/edit# I look forward to hearing your views on this. If possible please send replies to talk-gb@openstreetmap.org so that other members can view your comments (emails sent to this address are publicly visible). Best wishes, Rob ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] UK/GB OpenStreetMap survey results
This looks to be quite a good list of objectives. I would suggest adding discussions with the existing local groups. How might they fit in should a national group be formed? What might a national group be able to provide in the way of support to local groups. I would hope that any national body would have some “weight” compared to individuals and the existing local groups in terms of engaging with “major organisations” , potential Corporate support and sponsors. I’m not sure I see the point of a national body if it isn’t able to facilitate this. I say “facilitate” because OSM seems to be very much about local and individual initiatives and I think it is important that this doesn’t change significantly if such a group is formed. When it comes to an “engagement initiative” this could in theory be the launch of a new UK rendering of OSM data but as suggested it is probably unrealistic, if an inclusive new rendering is to be developed, in the time scale. Personally the idea of a vector based system appeals as it seems you could render a “specialist” map with very little server resources. If my understanding is correct you would only need to “serve” the script to render the vector data which would come from a central server, so I’m hoping a £35/pa LAMP account might be all that you would need. Another possibility for an engagement imitative might be some sort of “state of the UK map” event. I doubt SOTM will be returning to the UK any time soon and it would seem appropriate for a national body to look at supporting this type of event. I guess developing some sort of “policy”/constitution under which it will operate will be a reasonable priority. Hopefully this can be based on another (national) organisation rather than starting from scratch. Regards Dudley Date: Fri, 7 Aug 2015 11:18:50 +0100 From: bpran...@gmail.com To: rob.j.nicker...@gmail.com CC: talk-gb@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [Talk-GB] UK/GB OpenStreetMap survey results Seeing as the survey put technical stuff like a new render low on the priority list ( it got one of the lowest strongly agree scores) lets refocus on the community stuff that the survey indicated should be more of a priority. A new UK render should be a separate task and discussion in my opinion. Here's my tuppence worth on 100 days 100 members 10 Corporate members (if we decide that's what we want) 1 Flagship sponsor 1 Engagement Initiative launched with 1 new instance underway Website and social media in place Online shop with merchandise (e.g hiviz vests) 5 contacts identified in major organisations discussions underway with OSM data user organisations Committee/Board 2 meetings 1 online policy vote Sponsor pack in place Media Pack in Place 1 Press release 1 indepth piece of media coverage Regards Brian On 1 August 2015 at 12:53, Rob Nickerson rob.j.nicker...@gmail.com wrote: Hi all, Thank you for taking the time to fill out the A UK OpenStreetMap group? survey. In the 3 weeks since the survey first opened we received a total of 101 responses. This is a great response rate and indicates that many people are interested in the prospect of such a group. So what do the results show? Please follow the link below for a break down of the results and some suggestions as to next steps for this group. https://docs.google.com/document/d/1A8rKyKUW0X01n-JEMLwEUT4ktX-7WrxNP03YTkZs6lU/edit# I look forward to hearing your views on this. If possible please send replies to talk-gb@openstreetmap.org so that other members can view your comments (emails sent to this address are publicly visible). Best wishes, Rob ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] UK/GB OpenStreetMap survey results
On 6 August 2015 at 22:07, Antje map...@minoa.li wrote: Forking the map style with stronger British road colours and then getting that forked road style onto the main site once the default style goes “international”. I think a UK-specific style should be a priority for a UK OSM group as well, and I'm a bit surprised it didn't get more support in the survey. I don't remember exactly how the question was written, but I wonder if some of those answering weren't aware of the direction of the current osm-carto development, with plans well underway to colour motorways pinky-red and trunk and primary roads different shades of orange... As well as ensuring a more natural road colouring in a UK style, I think It would also be really good if we could highlight Public Rights of Way with their own specific styles. Other things I'd like to see supported would be more UK-centric tools, perhaps a UK-only XAPI instance, and maybe something we could use to compare open data sets of certain types of object (schools, hospitals, post offices, etc, and maybe also commercial retail chains if they could be persuaded) with OSM data in order to help detect both missing and out of date objects on the map. Robert. -- Robert Whittaker ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] UK/GB OpenStreetMap survey results
On 10/08/15 19:39, Robert Whittaker (OSM lists) wrote: I think a UK-specific style should be a priority for a UK OSM group as well, and I'm a bit surprised it didn't get more support in the survey. I don't think it was very clear just what the problem was. I've got the database sync running on my new machine, but have hit something of a brick wall with the mapnik stuff. I think the process is supposed to produce an osm.xml file to control the rendering, but nothing I do seems to work, and having what seems like partial sets of material for different style sheets is not helping. Can anybody point me to a crib sheet that fills in the gaps in the openstreetmap-carto setup notes. Obviously where I would like to get to is a setup where I can identify which icon sets and colour elements go with what ... -- Lester Caine - G8HFL - Contact - http://lsces.co.uk/wiki/?page=contact L.S.Caine Electronic Services - http://lsces.co.uk EnquirySolve - http://enquirysolve.com/ Model Engineers Digital Workshop - http://medw.co.uk Rainbow Digital Media - http://rainbowdigitalmedia.co.uk ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] UK/GB OpenStreetMap survey results
On 8/6/2015 2:07 PM, Antje wrote: Forking the map style with stronger British road colours and then getting that forked road style onto the main site once the default style goes “international”. After all, we didn’t call it “open” for nothing! I'd approach this with caution, for two reasons The first is that developing a new render style is one of the items more disagreed with. Providing server space would be necessary for others to host the tile layer so others can view it without installing it themselves, and this was also a disagreed item. On the other hand, this is a fairly well defined technical task, while items like raise awareness and encourage more mappers are fairly fuzzy and harder to define clear actions for. The second is technical. Richard F has already suggested using a different stack[1]. Even if using the same stack, openstreetmap-carto has nearly a decade of legacy code and cartography, not all good. It is also one of the largest and most complex stylesheets, with active development. Unless the only changes are simply redefining some colours, you will be unable to keep your fork up with osm-carto, and you will certainly want the bugfixes we do, even if you don't want the new features. When starting a style, you also need to make sure you have the cartographers to maintain it. I know the UK OSM community has good cartographers, but I also know most of them are very busy with their own styles. It can be a lot of work, and it tends to be draining with the attacks you get. I don't mean to sound discouraging. I'd love to see a style designed for the UK, particularly a vector one. I just know first-hand that a fairly complete style is a good chunk of work, be it vector or raster. [1]: https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-gb/2015-July/017629.html ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] UK/GB OpenStreetMap survey results
On 07/08/2015 10:02, Paul Norman wrote: On 8/6/2015 2:07 PM, Antje wrote: Forking the map style with stronger British road colours and then getting that forked road style onto the main site once the default style goes “international”. After all, we didn’t call it “open” for nothing! I'd approach this with caution, for two reasons The first is that developing a new render style is one of the items more disagreed with. Providing server space would be necessary for others to host the tile layer so others can view it without installing it themselves, and this was also a disagreed item. On the other hand, this is a fairly well defined technical task, while items like raise awareness and encourage more mappers are fairly fuzzy and harder to define clear actions for. Just an (anec)data point here. One of OSM's strongest selling points among the ordinary (non-map-geek) web community in the UK at the moment is the fact that, unlike Google, it uses the correct colours for roads. Google's own change to the orange-and-grey colour scheme generated huge opposition from many UK-based users. So the current OSM colour scheme is itself doing a very good job of raising awareness of OSM. If there are plans to move OSM to an international colour scheme globally as well, then that advantage will be lost unless there is an easy option to use a UK-style overlay. So yes, I do think that a UK colour scheme should be a very high priority. Mark -- http://www.markgoodge.uk ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] UK/GB OpenStreetMap survey results
On 07/08/15 10:28, Mark Goodge wrote: Just an (anec)data point here. One of OSM's strongest selling points among the ordinary (non-map-geek) web community in the UK at the moment is the fact that, unlike Google, it uses the correct colours for roads. Google's own change to the orange-and-grey colour scheme generated huge opposition from many UK-based users. So the current OSM colour scheme is itself doing a very good job of raising awareness of OSM. If there are plans to move OSM to an international colour scheme globally as well, then that advantage will be lost unless there is an easy option to use a UK-style overlay. So yes, I do think that a UK colour scheme should be a very high priority. I'd second that, and PERSONALLY all I'm looking for at this stage is keeping the existing style sheet for UK use. I've got a nice new machine ready to at least have a go at keeping my own copy live. Adding a new rendering stack is secondary and does not need to be implemented to achieve the first goal. -- Lester Caine - G8HFL - Contact - http://lsces.co.uk/wiki/?page=contact L.S.Caine Electronic Services - http://lsces.co.uk EnquirySolve - http://enquirysolve.com/ Model Engineers Digital Workshop - http://medw.co.uk Rainbow Digital Media - http://rainbowdigitalmedia.co.uk ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] UK/GB OpenStreetMap survey results
On 07/08/2015 10:02, Paul Norman wrote: On 8/6/2015 2:07 PM, Antje wrote: Forking the map style with stronger British road colours and then getting that forked road style onto the main site once the default style goes “international”. After all, we didn’t call it “open” for nothing! I'd approach this with caution, for two reasons The first is that developing a new render style is one of the items more disagreed with. Wouldn't it be a case of just keeping the old. Europe/RoW would be the ones changing to orange motorways. Dave F, --- This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software. http://www.avast.com ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] UK/GB OpenStreetMap survey results
Seeing as the survey put technical stuff like a new render low on the priority list ( it got one of the lowest strongly agree scores) lets refocus on the community stuff that the survey indicated should be more of a priority. A new UK render should be a separate task and discussion in my opinion. Here's my tuppence worth on 100 days 100 members 10 Corporate members (if we decide that's what we want) 1 Flagship sponsor 1 Engagement Initiative launched with 1 new instance underway Website and social media in place Online shop with merchandise (e.g hiviz vests) 5 contacts identified in major organisations discussions underway with OSM data user organisations Committee/Board 2 meetings 1 online policy vote Sponsor pack in place Media Pack in Place 1 Press release 1 indepth piece of media coverage Regards Brian On 1 August 2015 at 12:53, Rob Nickerson rob.j.nicker...@gmail.com wrote: Hi all, Thank you for taking the time to fill out the A UK OpenStreetMap group? survey. In the 3 weeks since the survey first opened we received a total of 101 responses. This is a great response rate and indicates that many people are interested in the prospect of such a group. So what do the results show? Please follow the link below for a break down of the results and some suggestions as to next steps for this group. https://docs.google.com/document/d/1A8rKyKUW0X01n-JEMLwEUT4ktX-7WrxNP03YTkZs6lU/edit# I look forward to hearing your views on this. If possible please send replies to talk-gb@openstreetmap.org so that other members can view your comments (emails sent to this address are publicly visible). Best wishes, Rob ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] UK/GB OpenStreetMap survey results
Hi all, It's been a few days since I posted the results of the UK OpenStreetMap group survey. If you've had any thoughts on what the first 100 days of this organisation would look like then I'd love to hear them. For example, what initiatives should we focus on first? How can we tackle those things that people voted agree/strongly agree to? Best wishes, Rob p.s. I'll be in London this weekend at the OSM mobile app dev event. I'll try to tweet and blog about this on mappa-mercia.org . If you have any app ideas you want me to share then let me know soon :-) On 1 August 2015 at 12:53, Rob Nickerson rob.j.nicker...@gmail.com wrote: Hi all, Thank you for taking the time to fill out the A UK OpenStreetMap group? survey. In the 3 weeks since the survey first opened we received a total of 101 responses. This is a great response rate and indicates that many people are interested in the prospect of such a group. So what do the results show? Please follow the link below for a break down of the results and some suggestions as to next steps for this group. https://docs.google.com/document/d/1A8rKyKUW0X01n-JEMLwEUT4ktX-7WrxNP03YTkZs6lU/edit# I look forward to hearing your views on this. If possible please send replies to talk-gb@openstreetmap.org so that other members can view your comments (emails sent to this address are publicly visible). Best wishes, Rob ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
Re: [Talk-GB] UK/GB OpenStreetMap survey results
Forking the map style with stronger British road colours and then getting that forked road style onto the main site once the default style goes “international”. After all, we didn’t call it “open” for nothing! Amaroussi On 6 Aug 2015, at 21:00, Rob Nickerson rob.j.nicker...@gmail.com wrote: Hi all, It's been a few days since I posted the results of the UK OpenStreetMap group survey. If you've had any thoughts on what the first 100 days of this organisation would look like then I'd love to hear them. For example, what initiatives should we focus on first? How can we tackle those things that people voted agree/strongly agree to? Best wishes, Rob p.s. I'll be in London this weekend at the OSM mobile app dev event. I'll try to tweet and blog about this on mappa-mercia.org http://mappa-mercia.org/ . If you have any app ideas you want me to share then let me know soon :-) On 1 August 2015 at 12:53, Rob Nickerson rob.j.nicker...@gmail.com mailto:rob.j.nicker...@gmail.com wrote: Hi all, Thank you for taking the time to fill out the A UK OpenStreetMap group? survey. In the 3 weeks since the survey first opened we received a total of 101 responses. This is a great response rate and indicates that many people are interested in the prospect of such a group. So what do the results show? Please follow the link below for a break down of the results and some suggestions as to next steps for this group. https://docs.google.com/document/d/1A8rKyKUW0X01n-JEMLwEUT4ktX-7WrxNP03YTkZs6lU/edit# https://docs.google.com/document/d/1A8rKyKUW0X01n-JEMLwEUT4ktX-7WrxNP03YTkZs6lU/edit# I look forward to hearing your views on this. If possible please send replies to talk-gb@openstreetmap.org mailto:talk-gb@openstreetmap.org so that other members can view your comments (emails sent to this address are publicly visible). Best wishes, Rob ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
[Talk-GB] UK/GB OpenStreetMap survey results
Hi all, Thank you for taking the time to fill out the A UK OpenStreetMap group? survey. In the 3 weeks since the survey first opened we received a total of 101 responses. This is a great response rate and indicates that many people are interested in the prospect of such a group. So what do the results show? Please follow the link below for a break down of the results and some suggestions as to next steps for this group. https://docs.google.com/document/d/1A8rKyKUW0X01n-JEMLwEUT4ktX-7WrxNP03YTkZs6lU/edit# I look forward to hearing your views on this. If possible please send replies to talk-gb@openstreetmap.org so that other members can view your comments (emails sent to this address are publicly visible). Best wishes, Rob ___ Talk-GB mailing list Talk-GB@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb
