Re: [Talk-transit] Proposed Feature - 2nd RFC - Public Transport
Am 12.01.2011 07:50, schrieb André Joost: Am 11.01.11 17:01, schrieb Michał Borsuk: You do get that information when you are at the spot. It is written on the timetable. If you are able to see, yes. But disabled (that is everyone who has to use public transport because he/she is not able to drive a car) not. A lot of the disabled are perfectly able to drive cars (which have been adjusted for that purpose). My father was severely disabled after an accident, and he did so. And on the time-table you wont find a hint *where* the right platform is. It is clearly printed at each bus stop, at least in Europe. In North America phone number is provided. A public transport router with audio output would do, if it has the data. We could work towards this aim. The visually impaired are a very small minority, and clearly OSM has different, more basic issues to deal with. We should focus on the mainstream first, to get OSM out of the beta version it is now. Greetings, -- Best regards, mit freundlichen Grüssen, meilleurs sentiments, Pozdrowienia, Michał Borsuk ___ Talk-transit mailing list Talk-transit@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-transit
Re: [Talk-transit] Proposed Feature - 2nd RFC - Public Transport
Am Tue, 11 Jan 2011 20:21:41 +0100 schrieb Michał Borsuk michal.bor...@gmail.com: On 11 January 2011 18:59, Dominik Mahrer (Teddy) te...@teddy.ch wrote: I began searching for alternatives and found Oxomoa, unified stoparea, stop place and others. All are created because the current schema is not able to represent all eventualities. It doesn't have to. It is an S-function, reaching 100% costs much more than reaching 99%. I pretty much came the same way Dominik did. I am also a public transport fanatic. And I like to map small details and it makes me joy to when a bus route crossing a roundabout uses one half of the roundabout in one direction and the other half in the other direction. Till now I had the impression that openstreetmap follows the philosophy Everybody maps as detailed as he likes. And for enthusiasts it is not only a question of efficency and costs but also of joy, and isn't it because of enthusiasts that openstreetmap exist? If not and if this detailed public transport mapping is not preferred in osm please tell me, then I will find my joy somewhere else. I am open to change my proposal. I am also open to approve a completely different schema. Michał, please feel free to tell me what to change to improve the proposal. To say this proposal has a bad learning curve may be correct, but it does not help further. In another topic. I am looking forward to that! Albin (Almich) ___ Talk-transit mailing list Talk-transit@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-transit
Re: [Talk-transit] Proposed Feature - 2nd RFC - Public Transport
1) We need to see a proposal that is explicitly scalable. No more than one page to describe how to map a basic bus or tram line in a way that is consistent with existing usage (ie if you look around you will see lots of examples to reinforce your understanding). 2) There is no clear case for a new public_transport key. If existing usage of existing tags works ok for basic situations, that should be enough. 3) It doesn't matter whether people use one relation per direction or two. Both are readily parsable. However, forward/backward must refer to the direction of the way, not the direction of the route, otherwise you are cutting across other uses of those roles. ___ Talk-transit mailing list Talk-transit@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-transit
Re: [Talk-transit] Proposed Feature - 2nd RFC - Public Transport
Am 12.01.2011 11:10, schrieb Albin Michlmayr: Am Tue, 11 Jan 2011 20:21:41 +0100 schrieb Michał Borsukmichal.bor...@gmail.com: On 11 January 2011 18:59, Dominik Mahrer (Teddy)te...@teddy.ch wrote: I began searching for alternatives and found Oxomoa, unified stoparea, stop place and others. All are created because the current schema is not able to represent all eventualities. It doesn't have to. It is an S-function, reaching 100% costs much more than reaching 99%. I pretty much came the same way Dominik did. I am also a public transport fanatic. So am I. And I like to map small details and it makes me joy to when a bus route crossing a roundabout uses one half of the roundabout in one direction and the other half in the other direction. Till now I had the impression that openstreetmap follows the philosophy Everybody maps as detailed as he likes. And for enthusiasts it is not only a question of efficency and costs but also of joy, and isn't it because of enthusiasts that openstreetmap exist? It's a Pareto-principle distribution: 80% of edits are done by 20% of contributors. Still, this does not mean that we can't have more contributors. And new guys are not going to map half a roundabout, at least not immediately. Personally I've done the same as you did, until I realized that my area (2500km²) will never get done if I am to be so slow. Thereafter I imported *all* the bus stops, added more lines, and miraculously more contributors appeared! So people were encouraged to join when they saw another person do something in their area. So the learning curve was important after all: they all copied from me, instead of discovering (like I did) how it should be done. And that's my main point: we need more of those small time contributors. If not and if this detailed public transport mapping is not preferred in osm please tell me, then I will find my joy somewhere else. This is a proposal, nobody is telling you to go. Or even to change your ways. Enjoy it as you did. I am just appealing to your common sense: the standard is not only for us, but for the community. The community is often *very* different than us. Most of them will never reach our levels of proficiency, but if they map a line or two, it's very good! And, I don't know where you people get the idea that I am any different than you. I've ridden public transport in many countries, both on the right and on the left side of the street, and on two continents. I map not only German lines, but also French, and local international (yes, we do have those!). Presently I don't have a car, but I have an almost free monthly ticket to my large public transport area. I've been to more places in that PT area (VerkehrsVerbund) than any local inhabitant in his whole life. What I clearly oppose is turning OSM PT mapping into our playground. I am an idealist, ready to defend the principle that OSM is a public service, not only our personal fun. I am not aiming to take the fun from us. All I want is to have an open door for new people. More on this should actually follow in the other thread I started, about principles to follow. Michał, please feel free to tell me what to change to improve the proposal. To say this proposal has a bad learning curve may be correct, but it does not help further. In another topic. I am looking forward to that! I've posted it yesterday. Can't cite the title, because I don't see my own posts. You're very welcome to argue with the five principles I posted there, and my comparison of the proposal in the light of the principles. Greetings, -- Best regards, mit freundlichen Grüssen, meilleurs sentiments, Pozdrowienia, Michał Borsuk ___ Talk-transit mailing list Talk-transit@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-transit
Re: [Talk-transit] Proposed Feature - 2nd RFC - Public Transport
Am 12.01.2011 11:16, schrieb Richard Mann: 1) We need to see a proposal that is explicitly scalable. No more than one page to describe how to map a basic bus or tram line in a way that is consistent with existing usage (ie if you look around you will see lots of examples to reinforce your understanding). 2) There is no clear case for a new public_transport key. If existing usage of existing tags works ok for basic situations, that should be enough. That seems to be a sensible proposal, but do we put it into the standard? If so, then the one-relation version should be accompanied by a comment on roles. 3) It doesn't matter whether people use one relation per direction or two. Both are readily parsable. However, forward/backward must refer to the direction of the way, not the direction of the route, otherwise you are cutting across other uses of those roles. So, who's volunteering to prepare yet another wiki page that would explain the situation? And, personal request hereby. If you provide examples how to map (also how not to map would be good), please do not only provide your own examples. -- Best regards, mit freundlichen Grüssen, meilleurs sentiments, Pozdrowienia, Michał Borsuk ___ Talk-transit mailing list Talk-transit@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-transit
Re: [Talk-transit] Proposed Feature - 2nd RFC - Public Transport
On 12.01.2011 09:52, Michał Borsuk wrote: Am 12.01.2011 07:50, schrieb André Joost: Am 11.01.11 17:01, schrieb Michał Borsuk: You do get that information when you are at the spot. It is written on the timetable. If you are able to see, yes. But disabled (that is everyone who has to use public transport because he/she is not able to drive a car) not. The visually impaired are a very small minority, and clearly OSM has different, more basic issues to deal with. We should focus on the mainstream first, to get OSM out of the beta version it is now. It is not our primary aim to serve some kind of mainstream. It is to collect any geographical data that could be useful to somebody. And yes, somebody includes blind people, too. cheers ant ___ Talk-transit mailing list Talk-transit@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-transit
Re: [Talk-transit] Proposed Feature - 2nd RFC - Public Transport
Richard wrote: put unified_stoparea as an elaboration rather than an alternative; I hope it doesn't spark an edit war). It might. Unified_stoparea is flawed in that it isn't backwards compatible as it contradicts the documentation for highway=bus_stop (node beside way) to use it for the stopping position (rather than the platform). This is why the proposals that use public_transport tags are immediately better. Adding bus stop nodes is one of the simple things new mappers can do; more advanced users can add them to the appropriate relations later. Ed ___ Talk-transit mailing list Talk-transit@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-transit
Re: [Talk-transit] Proposed Feature - 2nd RFC - Public Transport
Am 12.01.2011 12:59, schrieb ant: Hi Michał, Certainly it doesn't make sense to talk about bus stops when the road network isn't even finished yet. Totally agree. The point is, we are in the process of establishing a kind-of-standard about public transport network. There has been lots of struggle about this topic, and therefore it's quite an important process. Since I am working on a project that deals with navigation for the blind and visually impaired, I know how important these mapping standards (if you can call anything in OSM a standard at all) are. If we continue to stick to the old scheme, or any extremely simplistic scheme, we are simply missing the basis for future development in the area of blind people's navigation (and probably many other areas as well). Yes, we are - at the cost of (sorry to repeat the mantra) efficiency, compatibility with the existing software and easier learning curve. From our point of view (or mine, depends how you see it), the quality of the final product is a mathematical product of quite a few parameters (including the mantra above), NOT the quality of the data alone. I'm not saying everybody should do it now and everywhere. But the proposed public transport scheme is a solid basis to work with and one that is scalable enough to meet requirements we might not yet be thinking about. I've already provided my criticism to the proposed schema, so not to repeat myself, on another topic: I have been sort of thinking along the same lines as you are here (assistance to the users of public transport). I came to the conclusion that the easiest thing would be to take the bus stop code and combine it with the link to the local timetable online. For example, to cover entire area of Germany one would need to import stop codes as the stop_id tag, and then have a list of online timetables combined with geographical location those timetables cover. As some people (myself included) have already imported stop_id's, the last step - the mapping of public transport authorities to the geographical area, and providing a link to the online timetable is relatively banal. An overlay would then take the stop_id, combine it with the URL, and here opens your timetable website. I am writing this, because I have heard of NAPTAN, and I am sure a similar plan could be applied in the UK. My point is not to reinvent the wheel, no matter how much one likes programming. cheers also, ant michal -- Best regards, mit freundlichen Grüssen, meilleurs sentiments, Pozdrowienia, Michał Borsuk ___ Talk-transit mailing list Talk-transit@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-transit
Re: [Talk-transit] Proposed Feature - 2nd RFC - Public Transport
On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 12:21 PM, Ed Loach e...@loach.me.uk wrote: Unified_stoparea is flawed in that it isn't backwards compatible as it contradicts the documentation for highway=bus_stop (node beside way) to use it for the stopping position (rather than the platform). This is why the proposals that use public_transport tags are immediately better. You have to make sense of all the main existing schemas already (since they are unlikely to disappear). The main requirement is understanding what they are and how to tell them apart, not to try to standardise them (and especially not to standardise by multiplying the number of tags several-fold). Richard ___ Talk-transit mailing list Talk-transit@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-transit
Re: [Talk-transit] Proposed Feature - 2nd RFC - Public Transport
Le 12/01/2011 11:10, Albin Michlmayr a écrit : I pretty much came the same way Dominik did. I am also a public transport fanatic. And I like to map small details and it makes me joy to when a bus route crossing a roundabout uses one half of the roundabout in one direction and the other half in the other direction. I like precision too. But on that point I think it's a mistake to cut roundabouts for routing. Included in a route, a roundabout has an entry point, a outgoing point and a oneway circulation. So it is very easy to comput the part of the roundabout used by the route without cuting it. A roundabout is to be considered as a cross, just a big cross. I have stopped cutting them when someone explained this easy comput. I think roundabouts would be cut only when part of them are bridges. -- FrViPofm ___ Talk-transit mailing list Talk-transit@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-transit
Re: [Talk-transit] Proposed Feature - 2nd RFC - Public Transport
On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 2:50 PM, ant antof...@gmail.com wrote: Ok, nobody is forced into a complicated tagging scheme. Anybody who is uncomfortable with relations, advanced editors or whatever should just put a node to each bus stop. That's fine. Another mapper will come and turn it into a stop area and update the route relations. But if applications can cope with only having an unordered relation and bus stop pole nodes (or indeed just tram_stop centroids), then why clutter the map with lots more tags and info that the applications can perfectly well derive for themselves 99.9% of the time? You should only supply the extra info for the 0.1% of the time when it can't readily be derived. Richard ___ Talk-transit mailing list Talk-transit@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-transit
Re: [Talk-transit] Proposed Feature - 2nd RFC - Public Transport
Am 12.01.2011 15:50, schrieb ant: Hi, Ok, nobody is forced into a complicated tagging scheme. Anybody who is uncomfortable with relations, advanced editors or whatever should just put a node to each bus stop. That's fine. And that's what we're about to standarize. Another mapper will come and turn it into a stop area and update the route relations. Exactly. But this entire process needs a website, hence this discussion here. [...] People will develop standalone OSM routing applications for public transport and won't accept any dependency on external websites... No, they won't. It's too complicated, and too expensive to maintain. I can bet on it (sadly). Those who claim otherwise have not seen the real data, or they think that a bus starts from a terminus, ends at another terminus, and does it N times a day. It's not at all that easy. (Some people may want to simply copy Google Transit data, but again, Google Transit at present covers very small area.) Greetngs, -- Best regards, mit freundlichen Grüssen, meilleurs sentiments, Pozdrowienia, Michał Borsuk ___ Talk-transit mailing list Talk-transit@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-transit
Re: [Talk-transit] Proposed Feature - 2nd RFC - Public Transport
On 12.01.2011 16:00, Richard Mann wrote: On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 2:50 PM, antantof...@gmail.com wrote: Ok, nobody is forced into a complicated tagging scheme. Anybody who is uncomfortable with relations, advanced editors or whatever should just put a node to each bus stop. That's fine. Another mapper will come and turn it into a stop area and update the route relations. But if applications can cope with only having an unordered relation and bus stop pole nodes (or indeed just tram_stop centroids), then why clutter the map with lots more tags and info that the applications can perfectly well derive for themselves 99.9% of the time? You should only supply the extra info for the 0.1% of the time when it can't readily be derived. I don't know what applications you have in mind, but if they can do more than draw some lines on a map, this sounds like black magic to me. Consider an application that takes a start and an end address, maybe other options such as night lines only, and that shall calculate the shortest PT connection including number of stops etc. How would you accomplish that with the old tagging scheme? cheers ant ___ Talk-transit mailing list Talk-transit@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-transit
Re: [Talk-transit] Proposed Feature - 2nd RFC - Public Transport
Am 12.01.2011 16:30, schrieb ant: Consider an application that takes a start and an end address, maybe other options such as night lines only, and that shall calculate the shortest PT connection including number of stops etc. How would you accomplish that with the old tagging scheme? By introducing an abstract interface layer with your own objects, that is your own internal standard, into which all the messy present standards would be translated. This is easy. Then you play with *your* objects, your program is not directly dependent on the OSM PT standards. Any changes to the standards will require only a few lines of code to the abstract interface layer. BTW Data consistency is not as important as it used to be 15 years ago. We primarily have to make sure that no contradicting standards exists. Of course, this conversation still does make sense, because we want to have a clear standard for beginners, and for our own ease of use (and fun). Greetings, -- Best regards, mit freundlichen Grüssen, meilleurs sentiments, Pozdrowienia, Michał Borsuk ___ Talk-transit mailing list Talk-transit@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-transit
Re: [Talk-transit] Proposed Feature - 2nd RFC - Public Transport
On 12.01.2011 16:40, Michał Borsuk wrote: Am 12.01.2011 16:30, schrieb ant: Consider an application that takes a start and an end address, maybe other options such as night lines only, and that shall calculate the shortest PT connection including number of stops etc. How would you accomplish that with the old tagging scheme? By introducing an abstract interface layer with your own objects, that is your own internal standard, into which all the messy present standards would be translated. This is easy. Then you play with *your* objects, your program is not directly dependent on the OSM PT standards. Any changes to the standards will require only a few lines of code to the abstract interface layer. There are some minimum requirements that the data should meet in order to make it easy. In particular, it should resemble the network structure of a PT network, i.e. bus and tram stops acting as nodes that connect bus and tram lines with each other. A node in this context means a place where i can change from one bus (tram) line to another without having to walk more than a few metres. In the proposed scheme a stop area is exactly this. So the point of stop area relations is to prepare the data to be interpreted as a network and thus to make routing... easy. cheers ant ___ Talk-transit mailing list Talk-transit@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-transit
Re: [Talk-transit] Proposed Feature - 2nd RFC - Public Transport
On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 4:07 PM, ant antof...@gmail.com wrote: So the point of stop area relations is to prepare the data to be interpreted as a network and thus to make routing... easy. Stop areas are about linking the stop (notionally on the footway) to the road. Or they are about linking platforms with the same name. You can do that as you go along. The stopping_position and stop_area relation are just clutter. If you know the latlons of two stop areas, you can work out how to get between them by running your pedestrian routing algorithm. Marking footways between stops (other than the ones you can assume are adjacent to any roads not marked with footway=no) is more useful than linking the stop areas into a group and implying there is free access between any stop area within it. Basically you use relations to link objects which have a geographical relationship - not just a geographical proximity. There's sense in adding group objects if data relates to the group (eg to a station and not to it's individual platforms), but I'd find a convenient node or area to hold the info, not put it on an unnecessary relation. And if the information is relatively simple (eg a name), I'd settle for putting it on all the nodes, rather than create an artificial single object to hold it. Richard ___ Talk-transit mailing list Talk-transit@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-transit
Re: [Talk-transit] Talk-transit Digest, Vol 23, Issue 3
Hi, I'm watching this discussion from beginning, and I want to give you some point to your consideration. OSM is map solution - I don't want to define what kind of solution (despite the content is developed by community). But OSM is a perfect base-platform for every geo-location based internet application. Not only trip planning but more. I agree with Michal: the ultimate goal of OSM is the mapping solution, but it mean also the data. But everyone of us have to separate this definition: to cartography data and thematic-related data, like transit. That's why we have Geoserver, OpenLayer, PostGIS and more. So, let's leave the OSM as a map, and don't mix the data. Use layer instead of copile everything in to Mapnik. For me, the problem lays in data management related issues like, data repository, lawfulness of data, data ownership etc. This issue arising specially for transit topics. Regards, Filip BTW, It's my first post on this group. I wanted to say Hello to community - currently from Dublin :) On 4 November 2010 20:43, talk-transit-requ...@openstreetmap.org wrote: Send Talk-transit mailing list submissions to talk-transit@openstreetmap.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-transit or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to talk-transit-requ...@openstreetmap.org You can reach the person managing the list at talk-transit-ow...@openstreetmap.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than Re: Contents of Talk-transit digest... Today's Topics: 1. Re: public transport time tables (Micha? Borsuk) 2. Re: Talk-transit Digest, Vol 23, Issue 2 (Wojciech Kulesza) -- Message: 1 Date: Thu, 4 Nov 2010 21:37:43 +0100 From: Micha? Borsuk michal.bor...@gmail.com To: Public transport/transit/shared taxi related topics talk-transit@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [Talk-transit] public transport time tables Message-ID: aanlktik+ape+-v_cvx8=gml-mgj+joy37vv99bsnu...@mail.gmail.comgml-mgj%2bjoy37vv99bsnu...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 On 4 November 2010 21:25, Sander Deryckere sander...@gmail.com wrote: Sorry, I didn't want to attack you. You didn't attack me, I must have an aggression problem if you took it this way ;) Sorry if it sounded that way. I know it's not easy to make a map, but I see a map making as an other project, next to OSM. OK, then you simply should see that other project as next to OSM, the map-making project. It's all about the name and about who makes what. To be absolutely clear: I am not a street mapper, I map/maintain routes and stops on the existing map. So I'm on your side, but OSM is OSM, not a route-building application. That would be IMHO creeping featurism. The project seems already complicated to manage, let it stay slim. It's good that OSM has its own map, so mappers kan see their changes, but it's not OSM's core business. Is it not? OSM is more than data for maps, it also has to provide data for routing software, like maxspeeds, forbidden turns ... I think a timetable would be part of that. So there can be efficient routing software for public transport. I see it as an efficient lower layer for any the routing application out there. But again, is there a need for a new one? These are just my thoughts, I don't want to offend someone, I admire all people working on projects like this for free, be it map making, programming, mapping ... Neither do we want to offend, but just in case you were new: my advice take a look around. I've been here for a year, and I still consider myself somewhat of a newbie. The very early realization that I made was that OSM is not a wikipedia of maps, it's a *way more complicated* project than has existed (personal opinion disclaimer). I do share your optimisms about the possible uses, what is brewing here is something incredible. If somebody told me few years ago I'd be roaming the forests in my surroundings with my telephone, and be able to return home from any given point, I'd not be able to imagine how that'd work. But it does. regards, also, Sander -- Best regards, mit freundlichen Gr?ssen, meilleurs sentiments, Pozdrowienia, Micha? Borsuk -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-transit/attachments/20101104/29a0917c/attachment-0001.html -- Message: 2 Date: Thu, 4 Nov 2010 21:42:58 +0100 From: Wojciech Kulesza wkule...@gmail.com To: talk-transit@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [Talk-transit] Talk-transit Digest, Vol 23, Issue 2 Message-ID: aanlktimrhhcdyhsrw9=vu2pyxaugt1dlw5ykcypy9...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain;
Re: [Talk-transit] [Tagging] Proposed Feature - 2nd RFC - Public Transport
2011/1/11 Dominik Mahrer (Teddy) te...@teddy.ch: Please visit again http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features/Public_Transport thank you for the work on this. I have just 2 small comment on this: A station is an area dedicated to and particularly designed for passenger access to Public Transport, considerably bigger than a pair of bus stops or tram stops. I think that particularly designed is not an essential requirement. Whether a station is a station or not depends only on the function: if it works as a station it is a station. 2) I think the examples should have a bus=yes attached cheers, Martin ___ Talk-transit mailing list Talk-transit@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-transit
[Talk-transit] Additional administrators needed please
I have very belatedly noticed a load of posts to talk-transit needing moderation. I have been through them all discarding the dross and releasing the valid ones. Many apologies for people who's posts got held up. Can we have some offers of additional administrators for this list as I am the only one at present. The only duty is to review 'first posts' and to allow posts by real people and to deny spam. Can we have two volunteers please? Regards, Peter ___ Talk-transit mailing list Talk-transit@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-transit
Re: [Talk-transit] Proposed Feature - 2nd RFC - Public Transport
On 01/12/2011 05:07 PM, ant wrote: A node in this context means a place where i can change from one bus (tram) line to another without having to walk more than a few metres.In the proposed scheme a stop area is exactly this. Sorry, but this is absolutely pointless. First of all, modern routing software can calculate a route finding the nodes from stops' coordinates (Hafas and Google Transit). It will consider two stops to be a node if a distance between them is lower than a certain constant. So those can be created dynamically, humans are not necessary. For speed, popular pairs of stops are stored in a static table. Secondly, if you insist on stop area, then you create a weak point for the routing program, because it would rely on human input creating those areas. One area missing, and the entire routing algorithm goes to hell, because the program would send you through another stop area. Such errors would be very visible, and the users would be disappointed. Who wants to be taken for a ride all over the town because of one missing stop area? I mean no offence, but please understand that this is the 21st century. Your suggestions are indeed correct, but are applicable to software standards that were there 10 or 15 years ago. Much more can be done now. Point: Leave it to the algorithm instead of asking humans to do it. So the point of stop area relations is to prepare the data to be interpreted as a network and thus to make routing... easy. Programs such as Hafas are some years of age, and already they do it easier than you propose. They do it the way I described above: finding connections by distance between stops, and calculating the price to walk. A connection with a shorter walk is of course preferred, as is a connection without transfers. Greetings, LMB ___ Talk-transit mailing list Talk-transit@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-transit
Re: [Talk-transit] Proposed Feature - 2nd RFC - Public Transport
On 01/12/2011 06:34 PM, ant wrote: On 12.01.2011 17:27, Richard Mann wrote: I think there is some misunderstanding. I'm talking about the use of relations to group stop positions and platforms together that are considered a stop or station where one can change vehicles. Again, why enter it by hand (expensive!), when OSM already contains all the necessary data (stop coordinates, obstacles between them)? We do not need stop areas, at least not for that purpose. The transferability between stops can be calculated by a very simple script checking the distance (foot route) and obstacles between the two stops. The distance is then added to the cost of the route. (Cost: each transfer is a cost, travel time is a cost, walk as well, etc. The connection with the smallest cost is presented to the user). Greetings, LMB ___ Talk-transit mailing list Talk-transit@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-transit
Re: [talk-ph] Slum Mapping Party (was Re: OSM related research in slum areas (BASECO and Sitio Pajo))
GK-Telus Village here: http://tools.geofabrik.de/mc/?mt0=mapnikmt1=googlehybridlon=121.0327lat=14.67399zoom=18 On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 11:16 AM, maning sambale emmanuel.samb...@gmail.com wrote: The slum mapping with Philip Paar will be on Saturday Jan 15, 2011. 2nd GK site Telus Village in Masagana, Tandang Sora (still looking in the map) from 9am until 5pm. Send me a private mail with your cell number if you are interested to join. On Sun, Jan 2, 2011 at 11:25 PM, maning sambale emmanuel.samb...@gmail.com wrote: The author of the article posted below is requesting for a mapping party for one of their project area on January 15, 2011. He should be posting the specific area in a few days, it will probably be a slum/GK site. Anyone interested? I'll create a wikipage once I get more details. On Fri, Nov 19, 2010 at 7:35 PM, maning sambale emmanuel.samb...@gmail.com wrote: “Grassroots GIS: Digital outdoor designing where the streets have no name” ( Rekittke Paar, 2010, URL: https://files.me.com/paar/8t58bd ) We can contribute a lot by helping community organization create their own map for slum upgrading projects. -- cheers, maning -- Freedom is still the most radical idea of all -N.Branden wiki: http://esambale.wikispaces.com/ blog: http://epsg4253.wordpress.com/ -- -- cheers, maning -- Freedom is still the most radical idea of all -N.Branden wiki: http://esambale.wikispaces.com/ blog: http://epsg4253.wordpress.com/ -- -- cheers, maning -- Freedom is still the most radical idea of all -N.Branden wiki: http://esambale.wikispaces.com/ blog: http://epsg4253.wordpress.com/ -- -- cheers, maning -- Freedom is still the most radical idea of all -N.Branden wiki: http://esambale.wikispaces.com/ blog: http://epsg4253.wordpress.com/ -- ___ talk-ph mailing list talk-ph@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ph
Re: [talk-ph] Be careful in tracing from Bing Maps
I checked the existing coverage of gps traces within bing areas. Aside from Jolo and Sanga-sanga all of them have GPS tracks we can calibrate the imagery. See josm shots here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/esambale/sets/72157625812711648/with/5350890259/ A few observations while eye-balling the images: - Cavite, Laguna, Batangas area have extensive traces, I think it is sufficient for calibration/adjustment - same goes for Iloilo and Cebu - Puerto princesa has good coverage on some grid like streets, however, I'm not sure if these are multiple traces. Is there a Palawan mapper here? - very few traces in Tacloban but there is a grid-like trace in Tanauan (center of the image) - Cagayan de Oro has very few traces. I added my personal trace (using 2 separate GPS units) along the trunk road. So far, it lined up pretty well. - Puerto galera's major roads are traced, however, the roads are too curvy. Unless it is a multiple trace I don't think we should calibrate the image. - For all other areas, the traces are very few. @ Rally, is there a way to share the offset bookmark in JOSM? I suspect this is just a config line within the .preferences file of JOSM. It would be good if we can share the bookmark to other josmers. On Thu, Jan 6, 2011 at 3:19 PM, Jim Morgan j...@datalude.com wrote: Rally de Leon wrote, On Thursday, 06 January, 2011 03:08 PM: JOSM Version 3767 (on Windows) looks like this: No need for extra plug-in (it's built-in): Indeed. Got it now. They must have sneaked that in in the last week or two! Good stuff. Jim -- datalude: information security e: j...@datalude.com Philippines: +63 2 403 1311 / mob: +63 917 849 3939 Hong Kong: +852 6840 6693 w: http://www.datalude.com/ ___ talk-ph mailing list talk-ph@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ph -- cheers, maning -- Freedom is still the most radical idea of all -N.Branden wiki: http://esambale.wikispaces.com/ blog: http://epsg4253.wordpress.com/ -- ___ talk-ph mailing list talk-ph@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ph
Re: [OSM-talk] highway=unsurfaced
A cursory glance suggests Britain appears to have more highway=unsurfaced than other places, and even then there aren't that many. I will happily fix 200 of them _properly_ (i.e. with what the track actually is, not the cop-out of highway=road) if someone creates a rendering to highlight where they are. It originated here: I certainly remember using it circa 2006 and continued using it through 2007, for both: * residential roads with an uneven, gravelly surface; * tracks. The former I would now tag as highway=residential; surface=unpaved and the latter, highway=track. I try to change them if I'm editing in an area with one I created, if I remember to do so. Nick ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] surface=unpaved
If someone feels like reviewing the stylesheet and providing a patch, I'd go for dashed casings rather than solid casings where surface is specified and it's not one of a small set (paved, asphalt, concrete, paving_stones). I've used a similar scheme on my local map (for distinguishing the quality of tracks and paths rather than roads) and it's fairly intuitive. (For OS afficionados, I haven't yet had anyone ask me whether it means unfenced...) Richard On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 12:02 AM, M∡rtin Koppenhoefer dieterdre...@gmail.com wrote: 2011/1/11 Pieren pier...@gmail.com: On Tue, Jan 11, 2011 at 6:04 PM, M∡rtin Koppenhoefer dieterdre...@gmail.com wrote: will be unpaved: there is cobblestone, surface=asphalt, Excuse the stupidity of my question, but what is the difference between 'paved' and 'asphalt' ? it's different concepts: paved doesn't tell you much about the material, it could be concrete, paving stones, cobblestone (well, in OSM not I'd say), asphalt, while asphalt is a material mixture from pebbles and bitumen. cheers, Martin ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [OSM Fork] paths and roads and approval, oh my
On 12 January 2011 14:36, Anthony o...@inbox.org wrote: By the way, this is a great example of why no approval process required for tags is a weakness, and not a strength (see Ultimate list of approved keys, http://permalink.gmane.org/gmane.comp.gis.openstreetmap.tagging/6203) No, the lack of a policy to mass retag is the weakness. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [OSM Fork] paths and roads and approval, oh my
JohnSmitty wrote: No, the lack of a policy to mass retag is the weakness. No. You cannot retag once the meaning of a tag has been lost in multiple different interpretations. bye Nop -- View this message in context: http://gis.638310.n2.nabble.com/paths-and-roads-and-approval-oh-my-tp5913440p5914117.html Sent from the General Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
[OSM-talk] [Request] Mapper for interviews (Thu, ~15 Uhr), detection, recoding and solving OSM address problems
Dear OSM Community, for a Design Thinking Workshop in Rumania to “improve the quantity and quality of address solving software in open maps” we are looking for 4-8 spontaneous and interested mappers that are happy to share there thoughts and experiences around the topic of address collection and problem solving with us. The workshop is done in co-operation with skobbler.com. The interviews will be conducted by the web development team that has developed e.g. MapDust Co. *When?* 2.30 - 3.30 pm (Berlin time), Thursday January 13th *How long? *~20 minutes *Where? How?* via Skype When you are interested and have time, please just drop me a line till about 2 pm (with your Skype name). Thanks a lot in advance! Best regards, alex (in the name of the team) ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] highway=unsurfaced
2011/1/12 Anthony o...@inbox.org: On Tue, Jan 11, 2011 at 8:59 PM, David Murn da...@incanberra.com.au wrote You seem to keep getting mixed up between the UK understanding of the word 'road' and the OSM context of the meaning of highway=road. As you can read (quoted) in my original email, highway=road means unknown classification. +1 As I said, highway=road is not defined as unknown classification, it is defined as a road of unknown classification. IMHO that's just a bad definition, because if you don't know the way, how could you know that it is a road (see also the aussie example of cycleway vs. unpaved road)? And which should be the classification of an unknown path? Btw., Wikipedia (yes, it's not the bible) states that road can be almost everything: A road is a thoroughfare, route, or way between two places, which typically has been improved to allow travel by some conveyance, [1] and A thoroughfare may refer to a public road, highway, path or trail or a route on water from one place to another for use by a variety of general traffic. On land a thoroughfare may refer to anything from a simple trail through to limited access highway with grade separated junctions; [2] And the differing notions of the meaning of road don't seem to be restricted to the UK. +1, here I agree. In Germany it is similar. What exactly does highway mean in spoken language? Does highway=path make any sense? Tags are not the same as their verbal meaning. The wiki is confusing, though. It puts highway=residential, highway=track, highway=service, and highway=pedestrian under the subcategory of roads, but it puts highway=cycleway, highway=footway, and highway=bridleway under the subcategory of paths. Which I thought was distinguishing between motor vehicle traffic allowed and motor vehicle traffic not allowed. IMHO that's perfectly OK, (note that I don't confirm road= highway=road) But then highway=pedestrian would be an exception. It is a pedestrianized road = a road Well, according to my understanding of the wiki, a cycleway (like a bridleway and a footway) is a path and not a road. If we want to keep that distinction, maybe there should be a highway=unknown tag, for cases where we don't know if it's a path or a road. I think that is not necessary. I am in favor of changing what the wiki states about highway=road The fact is, whether we like it or not, people will mass-change tags. Lets at least try to encourage them to not break things too badly when they do so. I disagree. me too. I we really find that many people are mass-changing tags, and the actions are disputed, we will probably take technical means to avoid it. cheers, Martin [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Road [2] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thoroughfare ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] highway=unsurfaced
On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 11:18 AM, M∡rtin Koppenhoefer dieterdre...@gmail.com wrote: 2011/1/12 Anthony o...@inbox.org: As I said, highway=road is not defined as unknown classification, it is defined as a road of unknown classification. IMHO that's just a bad definition, because if you don't know the way, how could you know that it is a road (see also the aussie example of cycleway vs. unpaved road)? I agree it's a bad definition (I think my last post explained that in detail), but you certainly could see a road, but not know what class of road it is. And which should be the classification of an unknown path? highway=path What exactly does highway mean in spoken language? Does highway=path make any sense? Tags are not the same as their verbal meaning. No, not necessarily, which is why I asked what the OSM definition of highway=road is. And I'm not quite sure what your answer is. Are you saying it's a generic path where people travel, such that all highway=* ways (except for the dumb ones like highway=proposed) are roads? If so, I think that's fine, but the wiki fairly clearly contradicts that, referring to a subdivision between roads and paths. And highway=unknown or even highway=highway would be less confusing. (And yes, highway itself is a dumb choice of mnemonic, but that one is far too ingrained to be fixed.) The wiki is confusing, though. It puts highway=residential, highway=track, highway=service, and highway=pedestrian under the subcategory of roads, but it puts highway=cycleway, highway=footway, and highway=bridleway under the subcategory of paths. Which I thought was distinguishing between motor vehicle traffic allowed and motor vehicle traffic not allowed. IMHO that's perfectly OK, (note that I don't confirm road= highway=road) The wiki clearly says that highway=road is a tag for a road, though. And even besides that, it's not perfectly okay, because it's confusing as hell. The wiki presents highway=* broken down into two categories, roads and paths. It presents highway=road as a generic road, and highway=path as a generic path, and then other various highway=* values as being more specific roads or paths. Which would make perfect sense, except for the fact that a bunch of people are now saying that this isn't actually how we're supposed to be tagging things. But then highway=pedestrian would be an exception. It is a pedestrianized road = a road And a cycleway can be a road where bicycles are allowed but motor vehicles aren't. So why isn't cycleway under roads as well? I've asked this before, and I don't think you've answered it (though others have). What is a road? If it's just a paved path where people travel, then a cycleway is a road. If it is an official (i.e. marked as a separate parcel, or given a name for addressing purposes) path where people travel, then a track isn't a road. If you want to separate highway=* into roads and paths, then what is the distinction? If not, then the subcategories shouldn't be in the wiki. Well, according to my understanding of the wiki, a cycleway (like a bridleway and a footway) is a path and not a road. If we want to keep that distinction, maybe there should be a highway=unknown tag, for cases where we don't know if it's a path or a road. I think that is not necessary. I am in favor of changing what the wiki states about highway=road Me too, although I can't really figure out what it is supposed to say. I suspect a path where motor vehicles travel is the about closest to the de facto definition, as I suspect that most roads where motor vehicles are allowed to travel are not tagged with motor_vehicle=yes/permissive (and, in fact, I have in the past tagged roads with highway=road and thought that motor_vehicle=yes/permissive was implied). ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [OSM Fork] paths and roads and approval, oh my
On Wed, 12 Jan 2011 03:10:38 -0800 (PST) NopMap ekkeh...@gmx.de wrote: JohnSmitty wrote: No, the lack of a policy to mass retag is the weakness. No. You cannot retag once the meaning of a tag has been lost in multiple different interpretations. bye Nop Even that would constitute part of a policy ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] highway=unsurfaced
On 01/12/2011 11:39 AM, Anthony wrote: Which I suppose is one of my main questions. If a way is tagged with highway=road, and nothing else, should a router route motor vehicle traffic down it? I would think the answer is yes, which means that paths which are not meant for motor vehicle traffic shouldn't be tagged with highway=road. Well, nothing should end up tagged as highway=road, it’s an interim tag only. It means exactly “we don’t know what this is, except it looks like a road from the aerial photos”: It could be private or pedestrian-only, there could be a gate or one-way spike strips, or bollards (rising or otherwise), or any number of other things which make it unsuitable for routing. So at best it could be routed with strong “use at your own risk” warnings. But in general it’s probably best if routers do not send people down them. —Alex Mauer “hawke” ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] highway=unsurfaced
Am 12.01.2011 20:36, schrieb Alex Mauer: So at best it could be routed with strong “use at your own risk” warnings. But in general it’s probably best if routers do not send people down them. It would be great to have an OSM-Navi giving the user the choice: - fastest - shortest - most helpful: knowing the risk of being misleaded you as the user know that that's possible; but I'll ask you for missing data at some points (e.g. to re-classify a street tagged as highway=road). You agree to stop at these places at a save area to answer the questions (could be: oneway, oneway opposite, optional maxspeed, maxweight, ..) regards Peter P.S.: I know, not everything can be generated as a clear to answer question; some answers could go to a note only; but I as a mapper sometimes ask people I know of for their street details after drawing them from aerials. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] highway=unsurfaced
On Wed, Jan 12, 2011 at 2:36 PM, Alex Mauer ha...@hawkesnest.net wrote: On 01/12/2011 11:39 AM, Anthony wrote: Which I suppose is one of my main questions. If a way is tagged with highway=road, and nothing else, should a router route motor vehicle traffic down it? I would think the answer is yes, which means that paths which are not meant for motor vehicle traffic shouldn't be tagged with highway=road. Well, nothing should end up tagged as highway=road, it’s an interim tag only. It means exactly “we don’t know what this is, except it looks like a road from the aerial photos”: It could be private or pedestrian-only, there could be a gate or one-way spike strips, or bollards (rising or otherwise), or any number of other things which make it unsuitable for routing. Ah. I see. I thought it was for roads of unknown classification. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk-nl] install party bij Gert
Martijn, maar ook anderen... Mijn server is blijven staan op het niveau van de server party, en ik heb de automatische updates aan de gang gekregen. Is er al een bijgewerkt serve handboek inmiddels... Ik zou de server graag afmaken tot aan het niveau dat ie zelf tiles kan serveren in mijn lokale netwerk en later een versie op het web. Regards, Ing. Gert Gremmen . -Oorspronkelijk bericht- Van: talk-nl-boun...@openstreetmap.org [mailto:talk-nl-boun...@openstreetmap.org] Namens Martijn van Exel Verzonden: Monday, December 20, 2010 12:27 AM Aan: OpenStreetMap NL discussion list Onderwerp: Re: [OSM-talk-nl] install party bij Gert Gert, Bedankt voor je gulle gastvrijheid, ik vond het een erg gezellige middag. Ik kijk uit naar een volgende editie. Misschien wel bij Geodan in Amsterdam (makkelijk bereikbaar per O.V.). Lijkt me leuk! Martijn van Exel +++ m...@rtijn.org laziness - impatience - hubris http://schaaltreinen.nl | http://martijnvanexel.nl | http://oegeo.wordpress.com/ twitter / skype: mvexel flickr: rhodes On Dec 19, 2010, at 8:22 PM, ce-test, qualified testing bv - Gert Gremmen wrote: Gerts serverhackfeest: (de erwtenzoephack-a-thon) Hoewel de opkomst door de intensieve sneeuw en glibberpartijen over ongezouten wegen wat tegenviel (6 man) , hebben we toch een goed resultaat geboekt: wat random feiten: -enkele fouten uit Martijns handleiding gehaald -het lijkt erop dat we ook een server op windows aan de praat kunnen krijgen (steven: handleiding) -met Centos 5 zijn er flinke problemen - 1 lange middag is niet lang genoeg, de benelux inlezen in osm2pgsql duurt meer dan 2 uur - De benelux omvat zo'n 47 miljoen nodes en 6.4 miljoen ways - Andorra (Martijn !) kan binnen 1 minuut ingelezen worden, er zijn daar autowegen die bij de grens ophouden en in een zandweg verder gaan - Er zijn nog wat structurele problemen met de auto-update - Er was voldoende erwtensoep en het weer was er klaar voor - Als je de steker van het keyboard er niet goed insteekt heb je problemen met screen wake-up - Als je na 2 uur wachten ^C toets eindigt het inlees proces zonder waarschuwing - Ik heb flink wat bijgeleerd Ik wil in januari nogmaals als gastheer functioneren voor een vervolg. Dan gaan we met name in op het tunen van de configuratie files for osm2pgsql (wat willen we op de kaart) en die van Mapnik (hoe willen we het op de kaart) Gert Gremmen -Oorspronkelijk bericht- Van: talk-nl-boun...@openstreetmap.org [mailto:talk-nl-boun...@openstreetmap.org] Namens Peter Peterse Verzonden: zondag 19 december 2010 13:56 Aan: OpenStreetMap NL discussion list Onderwerp: Re: [OSM-talk-nl] install party bij Gert Jammer. Volgende keer beter. Groeten van ons allen. On 19-12-2010 13:46, Stefan de Konink wrote: Op 19-12-10 13:35, Peter Peterse schreef: waar ben je? We zitten hier al op je te wachten. Zie mailtje gisteravond if Veolia... daar stopte het vanmorgen al. Maar ik zit gezellig op ons warme IRC kanaal. Stefan ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl
Re: [OSM-talk-nl] install party bij Gert
Ik heb er nog geen tijd voor gehad. Ik wil het nog in januari doen :) Heeft iemand anders er nog aan gewerkt? Martijn On 1/12/2011 11:58 AM, ce-test, qualified testing bv - Gert Gremmen wrote: Martijn, maar ook anderen... Mijn server is blijven staan op het niveau van de server party, en ik heb de automatische updates aan de gang gekregen. Is er al een bijgewerkt serve handboek inmiddels... Ik zou de server graag afmaken tot aan het niveau dat ie zelf tiles kan serveren in mijn lokale netwerk en later een versie op het web. Regards, Ing. Gert Gremmen . -Oorspronkelijk bericht- Van: talk-nl-boun...@openstreetmap.org [mailto:talk-nl-boun...@openstreetmap.org] Namens Martijn van Exel Verzonden: Monday, December 20, 2010 12:27 AM Aan: OpenStreetMap NL discussion list Onderwerp: Re: [OSM-talk-nl] install party bij Gert Gert, Bedankt voor je gulle gastvrijheid, ik vond het een erg gezellige middag. Ik kijk uit naar een volgende editie. Misschien wel bij Geodan in Amsterdam (makkelijk bereikbaar per O.V.). Lijkt me leuk! Martijn van Exel +++ m...@rtijn.org laziness - impatience - hubris http://schaaltreinen.nl | http://martijnvanexel.nl | http://oegeo.wordpress.com/ twitter / skype: mvexel flickr: rhodes On Dec 19, 2010, at 8:22 PM, ce-test, qualified testing bv - Gert Gremmen wrote: Gerts serverhackfeest: (de erwtenzoephack-a-thon) Hoewel de opkomst door de intensieve sneeuw en glibberpartijen over ongezouten wegen wat tegenviel (6 man) , hebben we toch een goed resultaat geboekt: wat random feiten: -enkele fouten uit Martijns handleiding gehaald -het lijkt erop dat we ook een server op windows aan de praat kunnen krijgen (steven: handleiding) -met Centos 5 zijn er flinke problemen - 1 lange middag is niet lang genoeg, de benelux inlezen in osm2pgsql duurt meer dan 2 uur - De benelux omvat zo'n 47 miljoen nodes en 6.4 miljoen ways - Andorra (Martijn !) kan binnen 1 minuut ingelezen worden, er zijn daar autowegen die bij de grens ophouden en in een zandweg verder gaan - Er zijn nog wat structurele problemen met de auto-update - Er was voldoende erwtensoep en het weer was er klaar voor - Als je de steker van het keyboard er niet goed insteekt heb je problemen met screen wake-up - Als je na 2 uur wachten ^C toets eindigt het inlees proces zonder waarschuwing - Ik heb flink wat bijgeleerd Ik wil in januari nogmaals als gastheer functioneren voor een vervolg. Dan gaan we met name in op het tunen van de configuratie files for osm2pgsql (wat willen we op de kaart) en die van Mapnik (hoe willen we het op de kaart) Gert Gremmen -Oorspronkelijk bericht- Van: talk-nl-boun...@openstreetmap.org [mailto:talk-nl-boun...@openstreetmap.org] Namens Peter Peterse Verzonden: zondag 19 december 2010 13:56 Aan: OpenStreetMap NL discussion list Onderwerp: Re: [OSM-talk-nl] install party bij Gert Jammer. Volgende keer beter. Groeten van ons allen. On 19-12-2010 13:46, Stefan de Konink wrote: Op 19-12-10 13:35, Peter Peterse schreef: waar ben je? We zitten hier al op je te wachten. Zie mailtje gisteravond if Veolia... daar stopte het vanmorgen al. Maar ik zit gezellig op ons warme IRC kanaal. Stefan ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl -- Martijn van Exel Senior Researcher / Software Engineer - Geodan SR President Kennedylaan 1 1079 MB Amsterdam (NL) - Tel: +31 (0)20 - 5711 318 Fax: +31 (0)20 - 5711 333 - E-mail: mart...@geodan.nl Website: www.geodan.nl KvK-nummer: 33 247475 Disclaimer: www.geodan.nl/disclaimer - ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl
Re: [OSM-talk-nl] install party bij Gert
Ik ben in principe nog steeds bezig met OSMbuntu, maar ik ben nu bezig met het bouwen van mijn nieuwe server. Voor zij die het nog niet gezien ehbben, OSMbuntu wordt een distributie gebaseerd op Ubuntu Server, die meteen alle OSM software al bevat. En een extract van een gebied naar keuze, inclusief updates. Op 12 januari 2011 12:15 heeft Martijn van Exel mart...@geodan.nl het volgende geschreven: Ik heb er nog geen tijd voor gehad. Ik wil het nog in januari doen :) Heeft iemand anders er nog aan gewerkt? Martijn On 1/12/2011 11:58 AM, ce-test, qualified testing bv - Gert Gremmen wrote: Martijn, maar ook anderen... Mijn server is blijven staan op het niveau van de server party, en ik heb de automatische updates aan de gang gekregen. Is er al een bijgewerkt serve handboek inmiddels... Ik zou de server graag afmaken tot aan het niveau dat ie zelf tiles kan serveren in mijn lokale netwerk en later een versie op het web. Regards, Ing. Gert Gremmen . -Oorspronkelijk bericht- Van: talk-nl-boun...@openstreetmap.org [mailto:talk-nl-boun...@openstreetmap.org] Namens Martijn van Exel Verzonden: Monday, December 20, 2010 12:27 AM Aan: OpenStreetMap NL discussion list Onderwerp: Re: [OSM-talk-nl] install party bij Gert Gert, Bedankt voor je gulle gastvrijheid, ik vond het een erg gezellige middag. Ik kijk uit naar een volgende editie. Misschien wel bij Geodan in Amsterdam (makkelijk bereikbaar per O.V.). Lijkt me leuk! Martijn van Exel +++ m...@rtijn.org laziness - impatience - hubris http://schaaltreinen.nl | http://martijnvanexel.nl | http://oegeo.wordpress.com/ twitter / skype: mvexel flickr: rhodes On Dec 19, 2010, at 8:22 PM, ce-test, qualified testing bv - Gert Gremmen wrote: Gerts serverhackfeest: (de erwtenzoephack-a-thon) Hoewel de opkomst door de intensieve sneeuw en glibberpartijen over ongezouten wegen wat tegenviel (6 man) , hebben we toch een goed resultaat geboekt: wat random feiten: -enkele fouten uit Martijns handleiding gehaald -het lijkt erop dat we ook een server op windows aan de praat kunnen krijgen (steven: handleiding) -met Centos 5 zijn er flinke problemen - 1 lange middag is niet lang genoeg, de benelux inlezen in osm2pgsql duurt meer dan 2 uur - De benelux omvat zo'n 47 miljoen nodes en 6.4 miljoen ways - Andorra (Martijn !) kan binnen 1 minuut ingelezen worden, er zijn daar autowegen die bij de grens ophouden en in een zandweg verder gaan - Er zijn nog wat structurele problemen met de auto-update - Er was voldoende erwtensoep en het weer was er klaar voor - Als je de steker van het keyboard er niet goed insteekt heb je problemen met screen wake-up - Als je na 2 uur wachten ^C toets eindigt het inlees proces zonder waarschuwing - Ik heb flink wat bijgeleerd Ik wil in januari nogmaals als gastheer functioneren voor een vervolg. Dan gaan we met name in op het tunen van de configuratie files for osm2pgsql (wat willen we op de kaart) en die van Mapnik (hoe willen we het op de kaart) Gert Gremmen -Oorspronkelijk bericht- Van: talk-nl-boun...@openstreetmap.org [mailto:talk-nl-boun...@openstreetmap.org] Namens Peter Peterse Verzonden: zondag 19 december 2010 13:56 Aan: OpenStreetMap NL discussion list Onderwerp: Re: [OSM-talk-nl] install party bij Gert Jammer. Volgende keer beter. Groeten van ons allen. On 19-12-2010 13:46, Stefan de Konink wrote: Op 19-12-10 13:35, Peter Peterse schreef: waar ben je? We zitten hier al op je te wachten. Zie mailtje gisteravond if Veolia... daar stopte het vanmorgen al. Maar ik zit gezellig op ons warme IRC kanaal. Stefan ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl -- Martijn van Exel Senior Researcher / Software Engineer - Geodan SR President Kennedylaan 1 1079 MB Amsterdam (NL) - Tel: +31 (0)20 - 5711 318 Fax: +31 (0)20 - 5711 333 - E-mail: mart...@geodan.nl Website: www.geodan.nl KvK-nummer: 33 247475 Disclaimer: www.geodan.nl/disclaimer - ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org
Re: [OSM-talk-nl] install party bij Gert
Jij had toch iets van een script ?? Kan je daar iets uit copypasten, zodat ik van het weekend weer wat verder kan komen ev met behulp van je IRC adviezen ? Gert -Oorspronkelijk bericht- Van: Peter [mailto:pe...@haas-en-berg.nl] Verzonden: woensdag 12 januari 2011 16:44 Aan: OpenStreetMap NL discussion list Onderwerp: Re: [OSM-talk-nl] install party bij Gert Ik ben in principe nog steeds bezig met OSMbuntu, maar ik ben nu bezig met het bouwen van mijn nieuwe server. Voor zij die het nog niet gezien ehbben, OSMbuntu wordt een distributie gebaseerd op Ubuntu Server, die meteen alle OSM software al bevat. En een extract van een gebied naar keuze, inclusief updates. Op 12 januari 2011 12:15 heeft Martijn van Exel mart...@geodan.nl het volgende geschreven: Ik heb er nog geen tijd voor gehad. Ik wil het nog in januari doen :) Heeft iemand anders er nog aan gewerkt? Martijn On 1/12/2011 11:58 AM, ce-test, qualified testing bv - Gert Gremmen wrote: Martijn, maar ook anderen... Mijn server is blijven staan op het niveau van de server party, en ik heb de automatische updates aan de gang gekregen. Is er al een bijgewerkt serve handboek inmiddels... Ik zou de server graag afmaken tot aan het niveau dat ie zelf tiles kan serveren in mijn lokale netwerk en later een versie op het web. Regards, Ing. Gert Gremmen . -Oorspronkelijk bericht- Van: talk-nl-boun...@openstreetmap.org [mailto:talk-nl-boun...@openstreetmap.org] Namens Martijn van Exel Verzonden: Monday, December 20, 2010 12:27 AM Aan: OpenStreetMap NL discussion list Onderwerp: Re: [OSM-talk-nl] install party bij Gert Gert, Bedankt voor je gulle gastvrijheid, ik vond het een erg gezellige middag. Ik kijk uit naar een volgende editie. Misschien wel bij Geodan in Amsterdam (makkelijk bereikbaar per O.V.). Lijkt me leuk! Martijn van Exel +++ m...@rtijn.org laziness - impatience - hubris http://schaaltreinen.nl | http://martijnvanexel.nl | http://oegeo.wordpress.com/ twitter / skype: mvexel flickr: rhodes On Dec 19, 2010, at 8:22 PM, ce-test, qualified testing bv - Gert Gremmen wrote: Gerts serverhackfeest: (de erwtenzoephack-a-thon) Hoewel de opkomst door de intensieve sneeuw en glibberpartijen over ongezouten wegen wat tegenviel (6 man) , hebben we toch een goed resultaat geboekt: wat random feiten: -enkele fouten uit Martijns handleiding gehaald -het lijkt erop dat we ook een server op windows aan de praat kunnen krijgen (steven: handleiding) -met Centos 5 zijn er flinke problemen - 1 lange middag is niet lang genoeg, de benelux inlezen in osm2pgsql duurt meer dan 2 uur - De benelux omvat zo'n 47 miljoen nodes en 6.4 miljoen ways - Andorra (Martijn !) kan binnen 1 minuut ingelezen worden, er zijn daar autowegen die bij de grens ophouden en in een zandweg verder gaan - Er zijn nog wat structurele problemen met de auto-update - Er was voldoende erwtensoep en het weer was er klaar voor - Als je de steker van het keyboard er niet goed insteekt heb je problemen met screen wake-up - Als je na 2 uur wachten ^C toets eindigt het inlees proces zonder waarschuwing - Ik heb flink wat bijgeleerd Ik wil in januari nogmaals als gastheer functioneren voor een vervolg. Dan gaan we met name in op het tunen van de configuratie files for osm2pgsql (wat willen we op de kaart) en die van Mapnik (hoe willen we het op de kaart) Gert Gremmen -Oorspronkelijk bericht- Van: talk-nl-boun...@openstreetmap.org [mailto:talk-nl-boun...@openstreetmap.org] Namens Peter Peterse Verzonden: zondag 19 december 2010 13:56 Aan: OpenStreetMap NL discussion list Onderwerp: Re: [OSM-talk-nl] install party bij Gert Jammer. Volgende keer beter. Groeten van ons allen. On 19-12-2010 13:46, Stefan de Konink wrote: Op 19-12-10 13:35, Peter Peterse schreef: waar ben je? We zitten hier al op je te wachten. Zie mailtje gisteravond if Veolia... daar stopte het vanmorgen al. Maar ik zit gezellig op ons warme IRC kanaal. Stefan ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl ___ Talk-nl mailing list Talk-nl@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-nl -- Martijn van Exel Senior Researcher / Software Engineer - Geodan SR President Kennedylaan 1 1079 MB Amsterdam (NL) - Tel: +31 (0)20 - 5711 318 Fax: +31 (0)20 - 5711 333 - E-mail: mart...@geodan.nl Website: www.geodan.nl
Re: [talk-au] Massive flooding
On 12 January 2011 16:18, Ben Last ben.l...@nearmap.com wrote: Cloudbase was at 1600' last time James looked at it, which is a bit too low; I just spoke to him and whilst we can fly at 1000' if we want (for a 1cm survey), the buildings in Brisbane are a bit higher than in Perth :) Only in the city itself, then again that's where the Brisbane River is flooding... ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] [Tagging] tagging world heritage (UNESCO) and other protected areas/features
On 12 January 2011 10:05, M∡rtin Koppenhoefer dieterdre...@gmail.com wrote: 2011/1/11 John Smith deltafoxtrot...@gmail.com: Martin, for your information there was a bit of work done on this sort of thing in the past for Aussie parks covered by this, based on data from http://data.australia.gov.au I think. which scheme did you apply? I didn't, it was someone else doing it... ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Question about source of low-resolution NearMap images
On 12 January 2011 17:01, Mark Pulley mrpul...@lizzy.com.au wrote: I'm working out whether I am able to accept the new OSM terms. I haven't used the detailed NearMap aerial photos, but what I have used is a low-quality image at zoom 13 and 14. I used these images for the Kiewa River in northern Victoria (this was before the detailed imagery for northern Victoria was put in, and most of the river is still outside the high-resolution images), and for an airstrip on Flinders Island. Are these low-resolution images public domain (in which case I can accept the new OSM terms), or are they copyrighted (in which case I will need to replace this data with Yahoo or Bing data prior to accepting)? (Bing imagery is much better, so the river will probably need to be retraced anyway.) Nearmap aside, there is plenty of other sources that are also cc-by or cc-by-sa like the data from the ABS or the data from data.australia.gov.au etc. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Fwd: [Tagging] tagging world heritage (UNESCO) and other protected areas/features
On 12/01/2011, at 2:48 AM, John Smith wrote: Martin, for your information there was a bit of work done on this sort of thing in the past for Aussie parks covered by this, based on data from http://data.australia.gov.au I think. I uploaded the dataset I think you're referring to, after discussing tagging on talk-au. From: M∡rtin Koppenhoefer dieterdre...@gmail.com 3. The most universal feature is IMHO this: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:boundary%3Dprotected_area allowing for cultural, natural and other protection types. A problem might arise if a feature is at the same time protected for different reasons. That sort of what I used, though it's changed a bit since then. There's also problem of marking it boundary=protected_area and boundary=national_park at the same time. Some examples: http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/way/46152942 (Fraser Island) http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/relation/361693 (Gondwana Rainforests) At the time I don't think I knew about protect_id, but I used that later on National Parks. -- James ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [Talk-br] Uso do StreetView para mapear POIs
http://help.openstreetmap.org/questions/710/can-i-use-google-streetview-to-help-create-maps -- ?? ? Salaam Aleikum Guilherme Guerra de Almeidaguerri...@comum.org xmpp: guerri...@jabber-br.org http://comum.org http://guerrinha.comum.org On 12/22/2010 03:30 PM, Fabian Alejandro wrote: thread parecido el talk-es: http://www.mail-archive.com/talk-es@openstreetmap.org/msg02711.html Saludos! 2010/12/22 Djavan Fagundes dja...@comum.org mailto:dja...@comum.org Pessoal, Em conversa com o Samuel Vale, começamos a discutir sobre o uso das imagens captadas pelas câmeras do Google das ruas que se encontram no StreetView para pegar localização e nome de POIs. Se nos basearmos que as ruas são públicas e que as fotos nada mais são que capturas destas, isso não pode ser caracterizado cópia. Samuel alertou para o caso do Google inserir Easter Eggs, mas até hoje eu nunca vi, ao menos aqui em BH. O que pensam sobre? -- Djavan Fagundes E-mail | xmpp: dja...@comum.org mailto:dja...@comum.org http://djavan.comum.org/blog/ http://butequeiro.comum.org/ http://comum.org ___ Talk-br mailing list Talk-br@openstreetmap.org mailto:Talk-br@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-br ___ Talk-br mailing list Talk-br@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-br ___ Talk-br mailing list Talk-br@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-br
Re: [Talk-br] Wiki
Melhor ainda, se você sabe que é barro, coloca a tag de qualidade da pavimentação (não lembro o nome agora) Em 12/01/2011, às 18:55, Flavio Bello Fialho be...@cnpuv.embrapa.br escreveu: A orientação no Pt-br:Map_Features está muito ruim. A descrição no segundo link faz mais sentido, mas se limita a alguns valores para o tag highway. Sugiro que melhoremos a descrição no Pt-br:Map_Features usando o conteúdo de Pt-br:Guia_de_Mapeamento_do_Territ%C3%B3rio_Brasileiro. Ao contrário do sugerido, uma rota terciária não significa barro. Há muitas rodovias estaduais e federais que não são pavimentadas e em muitos casos são o único acesso a uma cidade. Em 30-12-2010 23:16, Alexandre Parente Lima escreveu: Ola, Temos na wiki duas orientações para mapear rodovias. Acredito que a primeira é a mais lógica e pratica, principalmente quando se pretende usar os dados no GPS. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Pt-br:Map_Features A segunda, é essa que pode levar seu gps a traçar uma rota por 200 km de barro, quando ele indica uma pista terciária. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Pt-br:Guia_de_Mapeamento_do_Territ%C3%B3rio_Brasileiro Sugestão, apaga esse segundo link, a primeira orientação é muito boa e ilustrada. Alexandre P. Lima http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Pt-br:Map_Features -- Doutor em Ciências Ocultas, Filosofia Dramática, / Pediatria Charlatânica / , / Biologia Dogmática / e Astrologia Eletrônica. ___ Talk-br mailing list Talk-br@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-br ___ Talk-br mailing list Talk-br@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-br ___ Talk-br mailing list Talk-br@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-br
Re: [Talk-br] Wiki
Atualmente eu sigo o Map_Feature, acho que o resultado é melhor e por enquanto mais conveniente para quem usa os dados no gps. A tag citada pelo diogo é surface=*, acredito que usei pouca vezes :P Alexandre Parente Lima Em 12 de janeiro de 2011 19:10, Diogo Nunes dio...@diogow.com escreveu: Melhor ainda, se você sabe que é barro, coloca a tag de qualidade da pavimentação (não lembro o nome agora) Em 12/01/2011, às 18:55, Flavio Bello Fialho be...@cnpuv.embrapa.br escreveu: A orientação no Pt-br:Map_Features está muito ruim. A descrição no segundo link faz mais sentido, mas se limita a alguns valores para o tag highway. Sugiro que melhoremos a descrição no Pt-br:Map_Features usando o conteúdo de Pt-br:Guia_de_Mapeamento_do_Territ%C3%B3rio_Brasileiro. Ao contrário do sugerido, uma rota terciária não significa barro. Há muitas rodovias estaduais e federais que não são pavimentadas e em muitos casos são o único acesso a uma cidade. Em 30-12-2010 23:16, Alexandre Parente Lima escreveu: Ola, Temos na wiki duas orientações para mapear rodovias. Acredito que a primeira é a mais lógica e pratica, principalmente quando se pretende usar os dados no GPS. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Pt-br:Map_Features A segunda, é essa que pode levar seu gps a traçar uma rota por 200 km de barro, quando ele indica uma pista terciária. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Pt-br:Guia_de_Mapeamento_do_Territ%C3%B3rio_Brasileiro Sugestão, apaga esse segundo link, a primeira orientação é muito boa e ilustrada. Alexandre P. Lima http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Pt-br:Map_Features -- Doutor em Ciências Ocultas, Filosofia Dramática, / Pediatria Charlatânica / , / Biologia Dogmática / e Astrologia Eletrônica. ___ Talk-br mailing list Talk-br@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-br ___ Talk-br mailing list Talk-br@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-br ___ Talk-br mailing list Talk-br@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-br -- Doutor em Ciências Ocultas, Filosofia Dramática, *Pediatria Charlatânica*, *Biologia Dogmática* e Astrologia Eletrônica. ___ Talk-br mailing list Talk-br@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-br
Re: [Talk-br] Wiki
Acredito também que não devemos criar um guia jaboticaba. Para quem nasceu depois de 1990 e nunca ouviu essa expressão: *Teoria da jabuticaba é tudo aquilo que só existe no Brasil, como essa saborosa fruta selvagem da respeitada família das mirtáceas (myrciaria jaboticaba). Isso significa, para ser rápido, pertencer a uma família de “explicações sociais” única e exclusiva neste planeta Terra, situação inédita no plano universal, que consiste em propor, defender e sustentar, contra qualquer outra evidência lógica em sentido contrário, soluções, propostas, medidas práticas, iniciativas teóricas ou mesmo teses (em alguns casos, até antíteses) que só existem no Brasil e que só aqui funcionam, como se o mundo tivesse mesmo de se curvar ante nossas soluções inovadoras para velhos problemas humanos e antigos dilemas sociais.* *http://www.espacoacademico.com.br/054/54almeida.htm* Em 12 de janeiro de 2011 22:34, Alexandre Parente Lima alexandre.pare...@gmail.com escreveu: Atualmente eu sigo o Map_Feature, acho que o resultado é melhor e por enquanto mais conveniente para quem usa os dados no gps. A tag citada pelo diogo é surface=*, acredito que usei pouca vezes :P Alexandre Parente Lima Em 12 de janeiro de 2011 19:10, Diogo Nunes dio...@diogow.com escreveu: Melhor ainda, se você sabe que é barro, coloca a tag de qualidade da pavimentação (não lembro o nome agora) Em 12/01/2011, às 18:55, Flavio Bello Fialho be...@cnpuv.embrapa.br escreveu: A orientação no Pt-br:Map_Features está muito ruim. A descrição no segundo link faz mais sentido, mas se limita a alguns valores para o tag highway. Sugiro que melhoremos a descrição no Pt-br:Map_Features usando o conteúdo de Pt-br:Guia_de_Mapeamento_do_Territ%C3%B3rio_Brasileiro. Ao contrário do sugerido, uma rota terciária não significa barro. Há muitas rodovias estaduais e federais que não são pavimentadas e em muitos casos são o único acesso a uma cidade. Em 30-12-2010 23:16, Alexandre Parente Lima escreveu: Ola, Temos na wiki duas orientações para mapear rodovias. Acredito que a primeira é a mais lógica e pratica, principalmente quando se pretende usar os dados no GPS. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Pt-br:Map_Features A segunda, é essa que pode levar seu gps a traçar uma rota por 200 km de barro, quando ele indica uma pista terciária. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Pt-br:Guia_de_Mapeamento_do_Territ%C3%B3rio_Brasileiro Sugestão, apaga esse segundo link, a primeira orientação é muito boa e ilustrada. Alexandre P. Lima http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Pt-br:Map_Features -- Doutor em Ciências Ocultas, Filosofia Dramática, / Pediatria Charlatânica / , / Biologia Dogmática / e Astrologia Eletrônica. ___ Talk-br mailing list Talk-br@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-br ___ Talk-br mailing list Talk-br@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-br ___ Talk-br mailing list Talk-br@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-br -- Doutor em Ciências Ocultas, Filosofia Dramática, *Pediatria Charlatânica* , *Biologia Dogmática* e Astrologia Eletrônica. -- Doutor em Ciências Ocultas, Filosofia Dramática, *Pediatria Charlatânica*, *Biologia Dogmática* e Astrologia Eletrônica. ___ Talk-br mailing list Talk-br@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-br
Re: [Talk-de] Frage zu ti...@home Windows
Am 11.01.2011 23:37, schrieb Stephan Knauss: On 11.01.2011 19:52, Carsten Moeller wrote: War jetzt lange nicht mehr am Ball aber schau mal hier: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/DE:windowscli...@home warum machst du das alles von Hand? Warum nicht einfach einen Doppelklick auf den Installer? Der installiert alle notwendigen Tools und Erweiterungen, ggf. auch noch Java und rendert mit Batik. Moin, schau mal auf das Datum, von wann die Doku ist. Damals war alles noch ein wenig wackelig. Außerdem hat diese Vorgehensweise auch Vorteile. Z.b. wenn man nicht alles doppelt installieren will, weil u.U. die Pfade verbogen werden u.ä. Ansonsten: Für die Java-Spezies: Java kann auf einer Windows-2Gig-Maschine maximal -Xmx1408m. seltenst. Woran es genau liegt kann ich dir nicht erklären, die Grenze liegt meist niedriger. 1350 hat meist funktioniert. Machmal können die Systeme auch weniger. Es gibt einen dokumentierten Fall bei dem die Comodo Firewall dafür gesorgt hatte dass die Grenze niedriger war. Stephan Denke, das liegt dann aber nicht an Java, sondern daran, dass hier der o.g. Prozess bereits vorher das RAM geklaut hat. Java auf 32Bit-Maschinen unter Windows kann 1408. Tausendmal ausprobiert. Höher geht aber witzigerweise nicht. Auch wenn die Kiste mehr als 2 Gig hat. Das ist dann ein pures Windows-Problem. Linux kommt bei einigen Derivaten auf 2Gig. Gruß, Carsten. ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Tirex im Hintergrund rendern lassen
Frederik Ramm frederik at remote.org writes: Hallo, On 01/11/2011 10:24 AM, Karsten wrote: hat jemand eine Ahnung, wie ich im Hintergrund veraltete Kacheln neu rendern kann und nicht erst, wenn sie im Browser neu angefordert werden. Ich habe mapnik/Tirex installiert Schau Dir mal utils/tirex-create-stats-and-update-tiles.sh an, das kann das. Bye Frederik Ich habe eine bessere Alternative gefunden. tirex-batch map=osm bbox=5,46,16,56 --filter older\(978328800\) z=12-16 Damit rendert er alle Kacheln neu, die älter als 1.1.2001 sind. ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Exzessive Einzelrequests an die API
Am 12.01.2011 01:31, schrieb Frederik Ramm: irgendein - pardon - Idiot bitte immer sachlich bleiben. ;-) sendet seit Tagen taeglich ueber 100.000 einzelne /api/0.6/node/123-Requests an die OSM-API. Die Person kommt aus Deutschland, aus dem Arcor/Vodafone-DSL-Dialin-Netz. Die IPs werden immer gesperrt, das haelt dann, bis sie sich das naechste Mal einwaehlt. Kann man nicht eine Authorisierung für API-get requests einführen? Wie lange sind die IPs jeweils gesperrt? Da man damit ja auch Unschuldige trifft, sobald der Täter eine neue IP zieht. Helfen täte noch ein besserer XAPI Service Chris ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] GPX Track in Karte einblenden und schneiden
On 2011-01-11 23:11, Tirkon wrote: Gibt es eine Möglichkeit, einen GPX Track in eine Karte (z.B. OSM oder Google) einzublenden und dann Punkte (z.B. durch Aufziehen eines Rechteckes) geografisch bezogen rauszulöschen oder den Track zu teilen? Ein paar Programme sind im Wiki gelistet: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/DE:Editing_GPX_Tracks Ich verwende meistens Prune dafür: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/DE:Prune Tschau, Andreas ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] OpenRouteService mit direkter Adresseingabe
Hallo, On 11.01.2011 23:38, Heinz-Jürgen Oertel wrote: Hallo, Gibt es eine Möglichkeit Start und Ziel direkt beim Aufruf anzugeben? Etwa http://openrouteservice.org/such?start=meinort?ziel=deinort vielleicht hilft dir die Nur-Text-Version weiter: http://koenigstuhl.geog.uni-heidelberg.de/accessible_routing/ Start und Ziel können hier auch als GET-Parameter übergeben werden, z.B. http://koenigstuhl.geog.uni-heidelberg.de/accessible_routing/?start=aend=b Grüße ant ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Exzessive Einzelrequests an die API
Hi Frederick, habt ihr die Möglichkeit die HTTP-Header mit zu loggen? Evtl. lässt sich daraus schon erste Schlüsse ziehen... Außerdem ist ein nmap über die zu sperrende IP-Adresse manchmal hilfreich. Desweiteren könnte man die IP mal bei einem Geolocationdienst auswerten lassen... MfG Andreas -- Diese Nachricht wurde maschinell erstellt und ist daher ohne Unterschrift gültig. signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Post offices near Lünen
Am 11.01.2011 16:05, schrieb Chris66: mit post office near Lünen kriege ich ein Ergebnis; post offices geht offensichtlich tatsächlich nicht. Ticket erstellt. http://trac.openstreetmap.org/ticket/3451 In der Wortliste (die jeder ergänzen darf!) http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Nominatim/Special_Phrases/EN ist die Pluralform eigentlich drin, also wohl ein Nominatim Bug. Wortliste DE: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Nominatim/Special_Phrases/DE Chris ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] AIO selber bauen?
Am Donnerstag 23 Dezember 2010, um 07:30:03 schrieb Christian Knorr: weiß jemand ob 3 nebeneinander installierten Maps auf dem Oregon länderübergreifend routingfähig sind? Ja, das tut es. Habe DE, NL und BE separat drauf und gerade von D nach NL navigiert, das geht. [1] http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/DE:All_in_one_Garmin_Map Chris.. ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Exzessive Einzelrequests an die API
hi, eventuell wäre eine liste des interessensgebietes doch auch hilfreich. grast der z.b. eine bbox nach allen daten ab um die xapi zu umgehen oder macht er das weltweit wie ein bot, liesst er POIs ? macht er dann auf die gleiche art updates? da müsste er sich ja authentifizieren. ich vermute ersteres: umgehung der inzwischen überlasteten xapi. diskussionen darüber gibt es ja massenweise im forum. gruss walter - 33,33% aller Statistiken beruhen auf kleinen Datenmengen. -- View this message in context: http://gis.638310.n2.nabble.com/Exzessive-Einzelrequests-an-die-API-tp5913036p5914381.html Sent from the Germany mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Tirex im Hintergrund rendern lassen
Hallo, On 01/12/2011 12:41 PM, Karsten wrote: Schau Dir mal utils/tirex-create-stats-and-update-tiles.sh an, das kann das. Ich habe eine bessere Alternative gefunden. tirex-batch map=osm bbox=5,46,16,56 --filter older\(978328800\) z=12-16 Damit rendert er alle Kacheln neu, die älter als 1.1.2001 sind. Kommt immer drauf an, was Du willst. Die von mir genannte Loesung waere geeignet, um sie einfach alle paar Stunden aufzurufen mit dem Befehl, die aeltesten 1000 Tiles neu zu rechnen oder so. Das muss man ein bisschen kalibrieren, aber auf diese Weise kann man dafuer sorgen, dass der Server immer eine gewisse Grundlast hat (nach dem Motto: Wenn ich grad nix zu tun hab, rechne ich halt mal irgendwas altes neu aus). Je nachdem, was fuer einen dicken Server man hat und wie viele Tiles drauf, pendelt sich das dann irgendwann bei einem kein Tile ist aelter als X Tage-Zustand ein. Gibts auch ein Munin-Bild dazu. Das ist ein relativ primitiver Ansatz, weil er nicht beruecksichtigt, wo sich wirklich was an den Daten aendert (das ist aufwendiger zu ermitteln). Aber zugleich ist er etwas feiner als Dein Vorschlag, der sich mehr fuer eine Einmal-Aktion eignet. Bye Frederik ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Exzessive Einzelrequests an die API
Hallo, On 01/12/2011 01:20 PM, Andreas Neumann wrote: habt ihr die Möglichkeit die HTTP-Header mit zu loggen? Evtl. lässt sich daraus schon erste Schlüsse ziehen... Außerdem ist ein nmap über die zu sperrende IP-Adresse manchmal hilfreich. Desweiteren könnte man die IP mal bei einem Geolocationdienst auswerten lassen... Die IPs zeigen alle nach Eschborn, aber das sagt nichts, der kann irgendwo sitzen. Genauere Analyse der Requests muesste man als naechstes machen, ja. Authentifizierung fuer Leserquests (wie woanders im Thread vorgeschlagen) waere die letzte Moeglichkeit. Oder natuerlich ein schnelleres, automatisches Rate Limiting, das aber evtl. auch gute Anwendungsfaelle traefe. Jemand anders fragte nach der Dauer der Sperrung - im Grunde erstmal unbegrenzt, muss dann halt von Hand wieder aufgeraeumt werden. Bye Frederik ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] AIO selber bauen?
Mit der Einführung von AIO-Tiles-Manager wird es in Zukunft möglich sein beliebige Teile von Europa auf seinem Gerät zu benutzen. Routing funktioniert zwischen den Kacheln. Außerdem kann man uninteressante Gebiete von Europa von seinem Gerät verbannen, sodass auch User ältere Geräte mit 4GB-Problemen nun trotzdem große Teile von Europa benutzen können. Netter Nebeneffekt. Lokale Updaten ohne erneut 4 GB runterladen zu müssen, bzw Update einzelner Layer wird möglich sein. Die spart euch Zeit beim runterladen. Lg Dirk PS : Es gibt entsprechende Veröffentlichungen zur Benutzung und Funktion von AIOTM im OSMBLOg sobald das Tool fertig ist. ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Exzessive Einzelrequests an die API
Chris66 wrote: Wie lange sind die IPs jeweils gesperrt? Da man damit ja auch Unschuldige trifft, sobald der Täter eine neue IP zieht. Ich denke, dass es sehr unwahrscheinlich ist, dass in der Zeit die IP aus dem Arcor-Pool jemandem zugeordnet wird, der dann eine solche Abfrage starten will. Wie viel % der Arcor-Internetnutzer sind OSM-Nutzer? Und wie viel Prozent der OSM-Nutzer fragen diese API jeden Tag auf diese Weise ab? Ich denke, dass die Fehlerquote hier gering ist. Ich finde es einfach unverschämt, wenn man solch eine API wissentlich überstrapaziert und weiß, dass OSM selber (finanziell und servermäßig) nicht auf den stärksten Beinen steht. Das ist einfach - im herkömmlichen Sinne - asoziales Verhalten. Ich hoffe, der Benutzer wird es einsehen und die Dumps nehmen. Gruß, Philip -- View this message in context: http://gis.638310.n2.nabble.com/Exzessive-Einzelrequests-an-die-API-tp5913036p5914616.html Sent from the Germany mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Tirex im Hintergrund rendern lassen
Frederik Ramm frederik at remote.org writes: Hallo, On 01/12/2011 12:41 PM, Karsten wrote: Schau Dir mal utils/tirex-create-stats-and-update-tiles.sh an, das kann das. Ich habe eine bessere Alternative gefunden. tirex-batch map=osm bbox=5,46,16,56 --filter older\(978328800\) z=12-16 Damit rendert er alle Kacheln neu, die älter als 1.1.2001 sind. Kommt immer drauf an, was Du willst. Die von mir genannte Loesung waere geeignet, um sie einfach alle paar Stunden aufzurufen mit dem Befehl, die aeltesten 1000 Tiles neu zu rechnen oder so. Das muss man ein bisschen kalibrieren, aber auf diese Weise kann man dafuer sorgen, dass der Server immer eine gewisse Grundlast hat (nach dem Motto: Wenn ich grad nix zu tun hab, rechne ich halt mal irgendwas altes neu aus). Je nachdem, was fuer einen dicken Server man hat und wie viele Tiles drauf, pendelt sich das dann irgendwann bei einem kein Tile ist aelter als X Tage-Zustand ein. Gibts auch ein Munin-Bild dazu. Das ist ein relativ primitiver Ansatz, weil er nicht beruecksichtigt, wo sich wirklich was an den Daten aendert (das ist aufwendiger zu ermitteln). Aber zugleich ist er etwas feiner als Dein Vorschlag, der sich mehr fuer eine Einmal-Aktion eignet. Bye Frederik Naja, ich weiß ja, welche Daten sich geändert haben, weil ich ja die diffs in Postgres mittels load-next einspiele und das wiederum setzt das Dateidatum aller betroffenen Metas auf den 1.1.2000. Somit kann ich mit meinem Ansatz immer dafür sorgen, dass ich einen aktuelle Karte habe. Rechner ist übrigens ein i7 920 mit 8G RAM bei Hetzner. Karsten ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Tirex im Hintergrund rendern lassen
Hallo, On 01/12/2011 03:33 PM, Karsten wrote: Naja, ich weiß ja, welche Daten sich geändert haben, weil ich ja die diffs in Postgres mittels load-next einspiele Ah, ok, das Detail war mir unklar. Das ist natuerlich eine gute Methode, um Aenderungen schnell mitzukriegen. Dann hast Du im Zweifel nach einer Daten-Aktualisierung in Minutenschnelle das neue Tile. Allerdings ignoriert diese Loesung Aenderungen an Relationen, d.h. es wird immer ein paar Tiles geben, die eigentlich aktualisiert werden muessten, die Dir aber durch die Lappen gehen. Es bietet sich daher an, von Zeit zu Zeit doch mal so einen jetzt lass ich mal alle Tiles neu rendern, die aelter als X sind-Job zu starten. Bye Frederik ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
[Talk-de] Mapper für Interviews (Do, ~15 U hr) gesucht, Erfassung und Lösung von Adressp roblemen
Liebe OSM Community, für einen Design-Thinking Workshop in Rumänien zur “Weiterentwicklung eines Tools zur Erhöhung der Adressenqualität und -quantität in OSM” suchen wir spontan für morgen Mittag 4-8 interessierte Mapper die sich über Skype zum Thema Adresserfassung interviewen lassen. Ziel des Workshops ist Tools wie z.B. MapDust so weiter zu entwickeln, dass einfach und gut Adressprobleme erfasst und gelöst werden können. Dazu brauchen wir eure Gedanken, Ideen und Erfahrungen. Die Interviews werden vom skobbler-MapDust-Team direkt durchgeführt. Zeitraum 14.30 - 15.30 Uhr (Berlin time), Donnerstag 13. Januar Dauer etwa 20 Minuten (in Englisch) Wenn ihr Lust und Zeit habt, dann meldet euch bitte einfach bis 14 Uhr via Mail (bitte mit eurem Skype-Namen). Schon jetzt einmal einen herzlichen Dank. Lieben Gruß, alex (für das Team) ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] GEOFABRIK pbf Downloads nicht aktuell?
Moin, Frederik Ramm schrieb am 11.01.2011 20:25: Es scheint ein Problem mit dem GWDG-Mirror zu geben, der hat sich letzte Nacht keine neuen Daten geholt. Der Geofabrik-Server schickt Dich aber trotzdem dahin (im blinden Vertrauen darauf, dass dort die aktuellen Daten sind). Da wollte ich es dann heute noch mal mit den neusten Daten versuchen, aber so richtig gesund sieht ft5.gwdg.de nicht aus. Er antwortet zwar auf ein ping, und Index von ftp://ftp5.gwdg.de/; bekomme ich im Feuerfuchs auch zu sehen, aber irgendwelche Daten scheint er z.Z. nicht rauszuruecken. Da steht in der Statusleiste nur Warten auf ftp5.gwdg.de ... und sonst tut sich nichts. Gruss Torsten ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] GEOFABRIK pbf Downloads nicht aktuell?
Hallo Heute früh hab ich europe.osm.bz2 von dort geladen. Ging ohne Probleme. Versuch ihn eftl. mal über http://... anzusprechen. So mach ich das immer. Viele Grüße, Henning Am 12.01.2011 16:33, schrieb Torsten Leistikow: Moin, Frederik Ramm schrieb am 11.01.2011 20:25: Es scheint ein Problem mit dem GWDG-Mirror zu geben, der hat sich letzte Nacht keine neuen Daten geholt. Der Geofabrik-Server schickt Dich aber trotzdem dahin (im blinden Vertrauen darauf, dass dort die aktuellen Daten sind). Da wollte ich es dann heute noch mal mit den neusten Daten versuchen, aber so richtig gesund sieht ft5.gwdg.de nicht aus. Er antwortet zwar auf ein ping, und Index von ftp://ftp5.gwdg.de/; bekomme ich im Feuerfuchs auch zu sehen, aber irgendwelche Daten scheint er z.Z. nicht rauszuruecken. Da steht in der Statusleiste nur Warten auf ftp5.gwdg.de ... und sonst tut sich nichts. Gruss Torsten ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Exzessive Einzelrequests an die API
Philip Gillißen schrieb: Chris66 wrote: Wie lange sind die IPs jeweils gesperrt? Da man damit ja auch Unschuldige trifft, sobald der Täter eine neue IP zieht. Ich denke, dass es sehr unwahrscheinlich ist, dass in der Zeit die IP aus dem Arcor-Pool jemandem zugeordnet wird, der dann eine solche Abfrage starten will. Wie viel % der Arcor-Internetnutzer sind OSM-Nutzer? Und wie viel Prozent der OSM-Nutzer fragen diese API jeden Tag auf diese Weise ab? Ich denke, dass die Fehlerquote hier gering ist. Wenn die IP von OSM aus gesperrt wird, wie Frederik sagt, gehe ich davon aus, dass man damit bei OSM gar nix mehr darf. Insofern sind geblockte, aber mittlerweile von Anderen genutzte IPs durchaus ein Problem. malenki ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Post offices near Lünen
mit post office near Lünen kriege ich ein Ergebnis; post offices geht offensichtlich tatsächlich nicht. Ticket erstellt. http://trac.openstreetmap.org/ticket/3451 In der Wortliste (die jeder ergänzen darf!) http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Nominatim/Special_Phrases/EN ist die Pluralform eigentlich drin, also wohl ein Nominatim Bug. Wortliste DE: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Nominatim/Special_Phrases/DE Sorry for the English. The new word lists have not yet gone live. This problem was one of the reasons for creating the new wiki pages because previously we were missing plurals and variations. The version using the new wiki word lists will go live next week. In the mean time I have manually added 'post offices' to resolve this. Google translate for what it is worth: Die neue Wort-Listen sind noch nicht aktiv. Dieses problem wurde auch einer der gründe für die schaffung der neuen wiki-seiten, weil wir vorher fehlende pluralformen und variationen. Die version mit dem neuen wiki-wort-listen werden live gehen nächste Woche. In der zwischenzeit habe ich manuell hinzugefügt post offices, um dieses problem zu. -- Brian ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] GEOFABRIK pbf Downloads nicht aktuell?
Torsten Leistikow schrieb am 12.01.2011 16:33: Da wollte ich es dann heute noch mal mit den neusten Daten versuchen, aber so richtig gesund sieht ft5.gwdg.de nicht aus. Er antwortet zwar auf ein ping, und Index von ftp://ftp5.gwdg.de/; bekomme ich im Feuerfuchs auch zu sehen, aber irgendwelche Daten scheint er z.Z. nicht rauszuruecken. Da steht in der Statusleiste nur Warten auf ftp5.gwdg.de ... und sonst tut sich nichts. Jetzt scheint ftp5.gwdg.de wieder zu laufen. Gruss Torsten ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Per Straßenname den Stadtteil herausf inden
Hallo! Am 10.01.11 schrieb ben: Ich hab gesehen, dass z.B. hier in Leipzig die Stadtteile nur mit einem Punkt gekennzeichnet sind. Würden dort Relationen oder sowas Sinn machen? Relationen wären sinnvoll, wenn Du die Grenzen kennst. Die Situation in Leipzig schildert http://www.leipzig-lexikon.de/KOMMGLIE/KOMMGLIE.HTM Es gibt 63 Ortsteile, die in 10 Stadtbezirke zusammengefasst sind. Die Ortsteile orientieren sich grob an den Gemarkungen, sind aber leider nicht identisch. Von der Stadt gibt es ein Straßenverzeichnis, in dem steht, in welchem Ortsteil welche Straßen liegen. Vielleicht kannst/darfst Du das für Deine Daten nutzen. Damit sollte sich auch grob bestimmen lassen, zwischen welchen Straßen die Grenzen verlaufen. http://osm-static.anders-hamburg.de/Deutschland/Sachsen/Direktionsbezirk_Leipzig/Leipzig_Stadt/index.html http://www.leipzig.de/de/buerger/service/info/gebiet/index.aspx Gruß, Fabian.___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Post offices near Lünen
Am 12.01.2011 17:01, schrieb Brian Quinion: The new word lists have not yet gone live. This problem was one of the reasons for creating the new wiki pages because previously we were missing plurals and variations. The version using the new wiki word lists will go live next week. In the mean time I have manually added 'post offices' to resolve this. Thanks Brian, another minor thing: When searching Bank nah Lüdinghausen I get (money)banks and benches (Sitzbanken / amenity=bench) in the result list, because in german bank has this two meanings. This is somewhat confusing. Would it be possible to have another (optional) column in the word list which will be used for the result list? So instead of * Bank Volksbank Lüdinghausen * Bank Südwiese Lüdinghausen it should return * Bank Volksbank Lüdinghausen * Sitzbank Südwiese Lüdinghausen Christian ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Post offices near Lünen
When searching Bank nah Lüdinghausen I get (money)banks and benches (Sitzbanken / amenity=bench) in the result list, because in german bank has this two meanings. About an hour ago I deleted the 'bank' = 'amenity=bench' mapping to remove some general problems it was causing. I agree this needs resolving but I will come back to it at some point in the future. -- Brian ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Mapper für Interviews (Do, ~15 Uhr ) gesucht, Erfassung und Lösung von Adressprobl emen
Hallo Alex, Kurz weil vom iPhone geschickt, würde aber gerne mitmachen. Skype: dermotm Dermot On Wednesday, 12 January 2011, Alexander Steinhart / DThinking dthinking.a...@nder.info wrote: Liebe OSM Community, für einen Design-Thinking Workshop in Rumänien zur “Weiterentwicklung eines Tools zur Erhöhung der Adressenqualität und -quantität in OSM” suchen wir spontan für morgen Mittag 4-8 interessierte Mapper die sich über Skype zum Thema Adresserfassung interviewen lassen. Ziel des Workshops ist Tools wie z.B. MapDust so weiter zu entwickeln, dass einfach und gut Adressprobleme erfasst und gelöst werden können. Dazu brauchen wir eure Gedanken, Ideen und Erfahrungen. Die Interviews werden vom skobbler-MapDust-Team direkt durchgeführt. Zeitraum 14.30 - 15.30 Uhr (Berlin time), Donnerstag 13. Januar Dauer etwa 20 Minuten (in Englisch) Wenn ihr Lust und Zeit habt, dann meldet euch bitte einfach bis 14 Uhr via Mail (bitte mit eurem Skype-Namen). Schon jetzt einmal einen herzlichen Dank. Lieben Gruß, alex (für das Team) ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de -- -- Igaühel on siin oma laul ja ma oma ei leiagi üles ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] OpenRouteService mit direkter Adresseingabe
2011/1/12 fx99 f...@vollbio.de: mit http://www.gpsvisualizer.com/geocoder/ kann man ADressen in Koordinatenumwandeln. AFAIK ist das, da Google und Yahoo verwandt werden, lizenzmäßig nur frei wie in Bier. Gruß Martin ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Mapper für Interviews gesucht (Do, ~15 Uhr), Erfassung und Lösung von Adressp roblemen
Cool, merci, Dermot! Wir haben nun 4 Leute, hätten aber gerne noch 2 um ein gutes Bild zu bekommen. Wer hat noch Lust/Zeit? lg PS: Es gibt als Dank für alle die teilnehmen einen 15 Euro Amazon Gutschein! 2011/1/12 Dermot McNally derm...@gmail.com Hallo Alex, Kurz weil vom iPhone geschickt, würde aber gerne mitmachen. Skype: dermotm Dermot On Wednesday, 12 January 2011, Alexander Steinhart / DThinking dthinking.a...@nder.info wrote: Liebe OSM Community, für einen Design-Thinking Workshop in Rumänien zur “Weiterentwicklung eines Tools zur Erhöhung der Adressenqualität und -quantität in OSM” suchen wir spontan für morgen Mittag 4-8 interessierte Mapper die sich über Skype zum Thema Adresserfassung interviewen lassen. Ziel des Workshops ist Tools wie z.B. MapDust so weiter zu entwickeln, dass einfach und gut Adressprobleme erfasst und gelöst werden können. Dazu brauchen wir eure Gedanken, Ideen und Erfahrungen. Die Interviews werden vom skobbler-MapDust-Team direkt durchgeführt. Zeitraum 14.30 - 15.30 Uhr (Berlin time), Donnerstag 13. Januar Dauer etwa 20 Minuten (in Englisch) Wenn ihr Lust und Zeit habt, dann meldet euch bitte einfach bis 14 Uhr via Mail (bitte mit eurem Skype-Namen). Schon jetzt einmal einen herzlichen Dank. Lieben Gruß, alex (für das Team) ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de -- -- Igaühel on siin oma laul ja ma oma ei leiagi üles ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de -- alexander steinhart carmel street 85 belfast BT7 1QF mail post.a...@nder.info phone +49 (0) 30 224 148 44 - active landline +44 (0) 786 965 18 14 - active mobile +49 (0) 178 198 46 50 - partly active skype alex.anywhere - active post.a...@nder.info ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Exzessive Einzelrequests an die API
Die IPs zeigen alle nach Eschborn, aber das sagt nichts, der kann Es gibt auch Geolocationdienste, die nicht alle Arcor-Dialup-IPs in die Alfred-Herrhausen-Allee verorten. BTW: Ich sitze dort in Sichtweite, aber ich bin's nicht ;-) Jemand anders fragte nach der Dauer der Sperrung - im Grunde erstmal unbegrenzt, muss dann halt von Hand wieder aufgeraeumt werden. Wenn Ihr den eh manuell sperrt, dann sorgt doch dafür, dass er Daten erhält, die a) eindeutig fehlerhaft sind und b) egal in welcher Anwendung, bis zum Anwender sichtbar ein Lass das, sonst kommen wir Dich besuchen. Fuer Rueckfragen Mail:... in seiner Anwendung zu sehen bekommen. -jha- ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Post offices near Lünen
it should return * Bank Volksbank Lüdinghausen * Sitzbank Südwiese Lüdinghausen It should ask did you mean 'Bankfiliale' or 'Sitzbank'?. Perhaps with respective links on the guggestions. -jha- ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] AIO selber bauen?
Am 12.01.2011 14:55, schrieb fla...@googlemail.com: PS : Es gibt entsprechende Veröffentlichungen zur Benutzung und Funktion von AIOTM im OSMBLOg sobald das Tool fertig ist. Development! Development! Development! ;) Die Grundfunktionen gehen schon mal ein bisschen. Versuche noch einige Kruditäten auszumerzen. Außerdem muss der Serverprozess komplett umgebastelt werden. Ich versuche den alten Prozess so lange es geht durchzubringen, aber mit Ausfällen der AiO ist natürlich zu rechnen... Grüße Christoph signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] Per Straßenname den Stadtteil herausfind en
Hallo Fabian, na das ist doch schonmal was! Vielen Dank dafür! Nun ist die Frage wie man die Daten wirklich sinnvoll verwursten kann (darf). Bei dem ersten Link könnte man das per Hand machen, da jede Begrenzung beschrieben wird. Leider is das Bild zu klein. Bei den anderen Links müsste man sehen. (PDF parsen? urghs!) Dann ist die Frage ob die Daten in OSM Sinn machen und gemappt werden können? Man müsste dann ja irgendwie berechnen können wann eine Straße in einer Relation liegt. Oder man erstellt nur Polygone wie es das auch von Leipzig gibt (Leipzig.poly). Dann müsste man nur noch berechnen ob die Straße/Adresse in dem Polygon liegt. (Formel?) Vielen Dank nochmal an Alle, ben 2011/1/12 Fabian Schmidt fschm...@informatik.uni-leipzig.de Hallo! Am 10.01.11 schrieb ben: Ich hab gesehen, dass z.B. hier in Leipzig die Stadtteile nur mit einem Punkt gekennzeichnet sind. Würden dort Relationen oder sowas Sinn machen? Relationen wären sinnvoll, wenn Du die Grenzen kennst. Die Situation in Leipzig schildert http://www.leipzig-lexikon.de/KOMMGLIE/KOMMGLIE.HTM Es gibt 63 Ortsteile, die in 10 Stadtbezirke zusammengefasst sind. Die Ortsteile orientieren sich grob an den Gemarkungen, sind aber leider nicht identisch. Von der Stadt gibt es ein Straßenverzeichnis, in dem steht, in welchem Ortsteil welche Straßen liegen. Vielleicht kannst/darfst Du das für Deine Daten nutzen. Damit sollte sich auch grob bestimmen lassen, zwischen welchen Straßen die Grenzen verlaufen. http://osm-static.anders-hamburg.de/Deutschland/Sachsen/Direktionsbezirk_Leipzig/Leipzig_Stadt/index.html http://www.leipzig.de/de/buerger/service/info/gebiet/index.aspx Gruß, Fabian. ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-de] unpräzise Beschreibung von access im Wiki
Am 10.01.2011 16:08, schrieb Georg Feddern: Das agricultural=* kommt zwar vom Traktor-Symbol, bezieht sich aber ganz allgemein auf entsprechend langsame Fahrzeuge, wie auch in der Beschreibung angegeben (und siehe meine Beispiele). Ich geh davon aus, dass die Beschreibung (wie so oft) schlicht nicht der wirklichen Verwendung entspricht. Ich kann mir nämlich sonst die 12k-mal Verwendung von agricultural=yes (also fast mit Sicherheit landwirtschaftlicher Verkehr gemeint und nicht explizite Erlaubnis für langsame Fahrzeuge) vs. 2k-mal no und anderes Zugemüse nicht erklären. Da agricultural=* praktisch nur in DE und CH vorkommt, also irgendwelche exotische Verkehrsregeln auch keine Rolle spielen, denke ich, wäre es sinnvoll aus Symmetriegründen agricultural=* tatsächlich für landwirtschaftlicher Verkehr zu reservieren (nicht unbedingt zu brauchen) und für langsame Fahrzeuge was anderes zu verwenden (slow_vehicles z.B. :-)). Simon ___ Talk-de mailing list Talk-de@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-de
Re: [Talk-it] Percorrendo sentieri
Ho anche notato che le piste ciclabili sono disegnate diversamente in alcuni punti della città: In alcune è segnato semplicemente highway=cycleway In altre è scritto così: highway=path bicycle=designated foot=designated Il Garmin mi fa andare con la macchina nelle seconde mentre invece non mi permette - giustamente - di entrare con l'auto nelle prime. Come mai questa discrepanza? ___ Talk-it mailing list Talk-it@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it
Re: [Talk-it] Percorrendo sentieri
2011/1/12 Stefano Droghetti stefano.droghe...@gmail.com: Ho anche notato che le piste ciclabili sono disegnate diversamente in alcuni punti della città: In alcune è segnato semplicemente highway=cycleway In altre è scritto così: highway=path bicycle=designated foot=designated Il Garmin mi fa andare con la macchina nelle seconde mentre invece non mi permette - giustamente - di entrare con l'auto nelle prime. Ah che incubo highway=path! 1. il Garmin non dovrebbe farti andare in macchina su highway=path, letteralmente è un sentiero 2. quando fu inventato il tag highway=path non si capiva bene a che servisse, ci sono tante correnti di pensiero, qui in Italia abbiamo deciso di usarlo per i sentieri veri e propri (non da tacchi a spillo) e per le ciclabili con cartello blu sarebbe più chiaro mapparle come: highway=cycleway bicycle=official foot=official Se conosci la pista ciclabile in questione ed è appunto una ciclabile ufficiale (cartello blu) ti suggerisco di fare questa modifica (ne guadagnano tutte le mappa, dalla OpenCycleMap alla mappa di NOP alle mappe per Garmin) Ciao, Federico ___ Talk-it mailing list Talk-it@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it
Re: [Talk-it] Percorrendo sentieri
Il giorno mer, 12/01/2011 alle 15.52 +0100, Federico Cozzi ha scritto: Ah che incubo highway=path! 1. il Garmin non dovrebbe farti andare in macchina su highway=path, letteralmente è un sentiero 2. quando fu inventato il tag highway=path non si capiva bene a che servisse, ci sono tante correnti di pensiero, qui in Italia abbiamo deciso di usarlo per i sentieri veri e propri (non da tacchi a spillo) e per le ciclabili con cartello blu sarebbe più chiaro mapparle come: highway=cycleway bicycle=official foot=official Se conosci la pista ciclabile in questione ed è appunto una ciclabile ufficiale (cartello blu) ti suggerisco di fare questa modifica (ne guadagnano tutte le mappa, dalla OpenCycleMap alla mappa di NOP alle mappe per Garmin) Grazie moltissime per le info. Sto cambiando or ora i dati, anche perché, sì, le ciclabili hanno il segnale d'obbligo per bici e pedoni. È un lavoraccio perché un po' TUTTE le strade di Ferrara sono affiancate da piste ciclabili... Oltretutto, ci sono anche alcuni controviali che hanno l'obbligo per le bici ma non hanno il divieto per le auto. :-O E che di fianco hanno il marciapiede... Come li taggo? Un'ultima domanda: vedo che in molte piste ciclabili hanno aggiunto il tag segregated = no. Cosa vuol dire? ___ Talk-it mailing list Talk-it@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it
Re: [Talk-it] Percorrendo sentieri
Ciao.
Il fatto che il Garmin ti faccia andare su un path dipende da come è fatta la
traduzione dei tag OSM in tag Garmin.
Se provi a costruirti la mappa con CreateIMG
(http://mce66.altervista.org/software.html#Open_Maps_for_Garmin_navigators) non
solo il Garmin non ti manderà più sui path, ma potrai anche personalizzarti
tulla la mappatura OSM-Garmin (file style).
Per esempio, ecco come tratto i path (righe processate dall'alto in basso) in
CreateIMG con stype Drivemap (default):
..
highway=path bicycle=designated{set highway=cycleway }
highway=path horse=designated {set highway=bridleway }
highway=path foot=designated{set highway=footway }
..
highway=path{add motorcar = no} [0x16 road_class=0 road_speed=0
resolution 22]
highway=footway {add motorcar = no} [0x16 road_class=0 road_speed=0
resolution 24]
highway=cycleway{add motorcar = no} [0x16 road_class=0 road_speed=1
resolution 24]
highway=bridleway {add motorcar = no} [0x0a road_class=0 road_speed=0
resolution 22]
.
Come vedi, dopo una eventuale ridefinizione della way OSM nel caso ci sia un
più
specifico designted=*, quando la way viene mappata verso una way Garmin c'è
sempre la {add motorcar = no} che impedisce di ruotare le auto sulla via.
N.B: Per come è fatto il Garmin, se il path è comunque l'unico modo di arrivare
alla destinazione, il Garmin se ne infischierà del motorcar=no. Se quindi metti
come destinazione un punto sul sentiero, Garmin ti ci porterà in macchina.
Ciao, Marco.
Da: Federico Cozzi f.co...@gmail.com
A: openstreetmap list - italiano talk-it@openstreetmap.org
Inviato: Mer 12 gennaio 2011, 15:52:51
Oggetto: Re: [Talk-it] Percorrendo sentieri
2011/1/12 Stefano Droghetti stefano.droghe...@gmail.com:
Ho anche notato che le piste ciclabili sono disegnate diversamente in
alcuni punti della città:
In alcune è segnato semplicemente
highway=cycleway
In altre è scritto così:
highway=path
bicycle=designated
foot=designated
Il Garmin mi fa andare con la macchina nelle seconde mentre invece non
mi permette - giustamente - di entrare con l'auto nelle prime.
Ah che incubo highway=path!
1. il Garmin non dovrebbe farti andare in macchina su highway=path,
letteralmente è un sentiero
2. quando fu inventato il tag highway=path non si capiva bene a che
servisse, ci sono tante correnti di pensiero, qui in Italia abbiamo
deciso di usarlo per i sentieri veri e propri (non da tacchi a
spillo) e per le ciclabili con cartello blu sarebbe più chiaro
mapparle come:
highway=cycleway
bicycle=official
foot=official
Se conosci la pista ciclabile in questione ed è appunto una ciclabile
ufficiale (cartello blu) ti suggerisco di fare questa modifica (ne
guadagnano tutte le mappa, dalla OpenCycleMap alla mappa di NOP alle
mappe per Garmin)
Ciao,
Federico
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Re: [Talk-it] Percorrendo sentieri
Il giorno mer, 12/01/2011 alle 15.51 +, Marco Certelli ha scritto: Ciao. Il fatto che il Garmin ti faccia andare su un path dipende da come è fatta la traduzione dei tag OSM in tag Garmin. Se provi a costruirti la mappa con CreateIMG (http://mce66.altervista.org/software.html#Open_Maps_for_Garmin_navigators) non solo il Garmin non ti manderà più sui path, ma potrai anche personalizzarti tulla la mappatura OSM-Garmin (file style). Sono un felice utilizzatore di Linux, e non ho tra famiglia e amici alcuna licenza di Windows ^_^ Comunque posso provare a vedere se gira con wine o se c'è un equivalente per Linux. In genere uso mkgmap con queste opzioni: java -ea -jar ./mkgmap.jar --net --route --latin1 --gmapsupp ~/mappa.osm ~/mappa2.osm (dove mappa e mappa2 sono le varie mappe salvate con JOSM) In effetti non saprei come fare la traduzione dei tag. Bisogna che ci studi su un attimo. Intanto vi ringrazio moltissimo dell'assistenza... ___ Talk-it mailing list Talk-it@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it
Re: [Talk-it] Percorrendo sentieri
2011/1/12 Stefano Droghetti stefano.droghe...@gmail.com: Oltretutto, ci sono anche alcuni controviali che hanno l'obbligo per le bici ma non hanno il divieto per le auto. :-O Questi controviali non sembrano essere piste ciclabili ma vie regolari, quindi li mapperei come highway=unclassified, oppure highway=residential, oppure highway=service. Il fatto che ci possano andare sopra le bici è catturato da bicycle=yes (o eventualmente bicycle=designated, ma di sicuro non bicycle=official perché scommetto che mancherà il cartello blu) Per il fatto che ci sia un obbligo di usarli per le bici, purtroppo non c'è il tag diretto su OSM (è meglio così); lo stratagemma è di mettere bicycle=no sui percorsi in cui non si può andare in bici (perché c'è l'obbligo di usare un altro percorso) Un'ultima domanda: vedo che in molte piste ciclabili hanno aggiunto il tag segregated = no. Cosa vuol dire? Come suggerivo sopra: highway=cycleway foot=official cycleway=official può essere un percorso ciclopedonale separato (cioè in cui pedoni e bici devono percorrere corsie separate) - segregated=yes oppure non separato - segregated=no In teoria il cartello blu è diverso (in un caso c'è la barra di separazione tra i due simboli, nell'altro no) ma è mia esperienza che non ci si può fidare molto del cartello messo dal comune, a volte è sbagliato ed è più affidabile la segnaletica orizzontale in questo caso Ciao, Federico ___ Talk-it mailing list Talk-it@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it
Re: [Talk-it] Percorrendo sentieri
Il 12 gennaio 2011 08:25, Stefano Droghetti stefano.droghe...@gmail.com ha scritto: Ultimamente in molte strade il mio Garmin mi dice Percorrendo Sentieri invece della giusta strada. La mappa è quella italiana scaricata da gfoss. Zona Ferrara. Ad esempio Viale IV Novembre. Accade sempre in concomitanza di controviali e piste ciclabili. Quando scarico il tracciato che ho fatto con l'auto e lo carico in JOSM, si vede che in effetti è sempre piuttosto spostato, non necessariamente verso la stessa zona (a volte è troppo a nord, altre volte troppo a sud, ma in generale a destra del senso di marcia che si sta percorrendo). In generale, la mappa appare piuttosto sfasata rispetto alla posizione del satellite. Con la mappa proprietaria (le rarissime volte che la uso) invece tutto ok. Che voi sappiate c'è un modo per ovviare a questo problema? certo, devo aggiustare la mappa :-) Nei prossimi giorni ci lavoro su... -- ciao Luca www.lucadelu.org ___ Talk-it mailing list Talk-it@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it
[Talk-it] problemi PCN con Merkaartor
Ciao, penso che qn. di vuoi usa Merkaartor, forse mi potete aiutare. Un utente tedesco mi ha scritto che non funziona il PCN da lui. Il suo messaggio (malamente tradotto al volo): ho letto questo http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/WikiProject_Italy/PCN e fatto in Merkaartor: wiki Inserire il WMS PCN in Merkaartor wiki wiki [...] wiki wiki Per le mappe del 2008, sostituire semplicemente 06 con 08 in Main wiki path. wiki Versione 0.15.3 wiki wiki Name: Portale Cartografico Nazionale 2006 wiki Server URL: wiki http://wms.pcn.minambiente.it/cgi-bin/mapserv.exe?map=/ms_ogc/service/ortofoto_colore_06.map; wiki Layers: (selezionarli tutti) wiki Projection: EPSG:4326 wiki Styles: (lasciare vuoto) wiki Image format: image/jpeg wiki wiki Per le mappe del 2008, sostituire semplicemente 06 con 08 in Server wiki URL. ma non vedo nessun sfondo PCN Nel Log trovo questo: ImageMapLayer::drawFull: getting: /cgi-bin/mapserv.exe?map=/ms_ogc/service/ortofoto_colore_06.map SERVICE=WMSVERSION=1.1.1REQUEST=GetMapTRANSPARENT=TRUELAYERS=ortofoto_colore,ortofoto_colore_06,ortofoto_colore_06_32,ortofoto_colore_06_33,watermark,watermarkSRS=EPSG:4326 STYLES=FORMAT=image/jpegWIDTH=357HEIGHT=423BBOX=12.094245,42.621390,12.118811,42.650497 Bg image ratio 1 Bg image scale 1 QSize(357, 573) : QSize(357, 423) Downloader::go: /api/0.6/map?bbox=12.094245,42.625198,12.118811,42.646689 Downloader::on_responseHeaderReceived: 200 OK Reindexing... ImageMapLayer::drawFull: getting: /cgi-bin/mapserv.exe?map=/ms_ogc/service/ortofoto_colore_06.map SERVICE=WMSVERSION=1.1.1REQUEST=GetMapTRANSPARENT=TRUELAYERS=ortofoto_colore,ortofoto_colore_06,ortofoto_colore_06_32,ortofoto_colore_06_33,watermark,watermarkSRS=EPSG:4326 STYLES=FORMAT=image/jpegWIDTH=357HEIGHT=423BBOX=12.094279,42.621415,12.118845,42.650523 requesting: wms.pcn.minambiente.it/cgi-bin/mapserv.exe?map=/ms_ogc/service/ortofoto_colore_06.map SERVICE=WMSVERSION=1.1.1REQUEST=GetMapTRANSPARENT=TRUELAYERS=ortofoto_colore,ortofoto_colore_06,ortofoto_colore_06_32,ortofoto_colore_06_33,watermark,watermarkSRS=EPSG:4326 STYLES=FORMAT=image/jpegWIDTH=357HEIGHT=423BBOX=12.094279,42.621415,12.118845,42.650523 getting: http://wms.pcn.minambiente.it/cgi-bin/mapserv.exe?map=/ms_ogc/service/ortofoto_colore_06.map; SERVICE=WMSVERSION=1.1.1REQUEST=GetMapTRANSPARENT=TRUELAYERS=ortofoto_colore,ortofoto_colore_06,ortofoto_colore_06_32,ortofoto_colore_06_33,watermark,watermarkSRS=EPSG:4326 STYLES=FORMAT=image/jpegWIDTH=357HEIGHT=423BBOX=12.094279,42.621415,12.118845,42.650523 Bg image ratio 1 Bg image scale 1 QSize(357, 423) : QSize(357, 423) NETWORK_PIXMAP_ERROR: ?xml version='1.0' encoding=ISO-8859-1 standalone=no ? !DOCTYPE ServiceExceptionReport SYSTEM http://schemas.opengis.net/wms/1.1.1/exception_1_1_1.dtd; ServiceExceptionReport version=1.1.1 ServiceException code=InvalidSRS msWMSLoadGetMapParams(): WMS server error. Invalid SRS given : SRS must be valid for all requested layers. /ServiceException /ServiceExceptionReport Che cos'è il NETWORK_PIXMAP_ERROR? C'entra qualcosa? lo potete aiutare vuoi? grazie, Martin ___ Talk-it mailing list Talk-it@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it
Re: [Talk-it] problemi PCN con Merkaartor
intendevo voi ;-) ___ Talk-it mailing list Talk-it@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it
Re: [Talk-it] Percorrendo sentieri
Sono curioso di sapere se funziona in wine. Se poi sei un esperto di linux, potresti tradurlo in uno script bash. Se ti serve aiuto, chiedi pure. Comunque queste sono le opzioni che uso io: java -enableassertions -Xmx1000m -jar ..\bin\splitter.jar --mapid=66%FID%001 --max-nodes=100 ..\OSM-Data\%osmfile% java -enableassertions -Xmx1000m -jar ..\bin\mkgmap.jar --code-page=1252 --country-name=%country% --latin1 --family-id=%FID% --mapname=66%FID%001 --overview-mapname=66%FID%000 --tdbfile --series-name=OSM-%country% --family-name=OpenStreetMap: %country% --road-name-pois --add-pois-to-areas --no-poi-address --ignore-maxspeeds --remove-short-arcs --preserve-element-order --style-file=..\bin\resources\styles\ --style=%style% --description=%country% --route --net --gmapsupp -c template.args Il primo comando (splitter.jar) serve a dividere file OSM grandi oltre 1 milione di nodi (l'Italia si divide in 30 pezzi circa) Il secondo (mkgmap.jar) compila la mappa. In windows le variabili sono richiamate con %xxx%. Come vedi io uso uno style personale (switches --style-file=..\bin\resources\styles\ --style=%style%) che in CreateIMG trovi appunto sotto bin/resources/styles/*. Il mio di default è Drivemap (che è poi il mio vero valore aggiunto...) Ciao, Marco. Da: Stefano Droghetti stefano.droghe...@gmail.com A: openstreetmap list - italiano talk-it@openstreetmap.org Inviato: Mer 12 gennaio 2011, 17:15:59 Oggetto: Re: [Talk-it] Percorrendo sentieri Il giorno mer, 12/01/2011 alle 15.51 +, Marco Certelli ha scritto: Ciao. Il fatto che il Garmin ti faccia andare su un path dipende da come è fatta la traduzione dei tag OSM in tag Garmin. Se provi a costruirti la mappa con CreateIMG (http://mce66.altervista.org/software.html#Open_Maps_for_Garmin_navigators) non solo il Garmin non ti manderà più sui path, ma potrai anche personalizzarti tulla la mappatura OSM-Garmin (file style). Sono un felice utilizzatore di Linux, e non ho tra famiglia e amici alcuna licenza di Windows ^_^ Comunque posso provare a vedere se gira con wine o se c'è un equivalente per Linux. In genere uso mkgmap con queste opzioni: java -ea -jar ./mkgmap.jar --net --route --latin1 --gmapsupp ~/mappa.osm ~/mappa2.osm (dove mappa e mappa2 sono le varie mappe salvate con JOSM) In effetti non saprei come fare la traduzione dei tag. Bisogna che ci studi su un attimo. Intanto vi ringrazio moltissimo dell'assistenza... ___ Talk-it mailing list Talk-it@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it ___ Talk-it mailing list Talk-it@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it
Re: [Talk-it] Percorrendo sentieri
Il 12 gennaio 2011 17:15, Stefano Droghetti stefano.droghe...@gmail.com ha scritto: Sono un felice utilizzatore di Linux, e non ho tra famiglia e amici alcuna licenza di Windows ^_^ Comunque posso provare a vedere se gira con wine o se c'è un equivalente per Linux. In genere uso mkgmap con queste opzioni: java -ea -jar ./mkgmap.jar --net --route --latin1 --gmapsupp ~/mappa.osm ~/mappa2.osm qui [0] puoi vedere come vengono create le mappe di gfoss (ovviamente sotto linux) [0] http://www.lucadelu.org/software_libero/script/italimg/ -- ciao Luca www.lucadelu.org ___ Talk-it mailing list Talk-it@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it
Re: [Talk-it] Percorrendo sentieri
Ciao Luca, potresti pubblicare anche lo style (a meno che già non sia disponibile da qualche parte). Ciao, Marco. Da: Luca Delucchi lucadel...@gmail.com A: openstreetmap list - italiano talk-it@openstreetmap.org Inviato: Mer 12 gennaio 2011, 17:55:41 Oggetto: Re: [Talk-it] Percorrendo sentieri Il 12 gennaio 2011 17:15, Stefano Droghetti stefano.droghe...@gmail.com ha scritto: Sono un felice utilizzatore di Linux, e non ho tra famiglia e amici alcuna licenza di Windows ^_^ Comunque posso provare a vedere se gira con wine o se c'è un equivalente per Linux. In genere uso mkgmap con queste opzioni: java -ea -jar ./mkgmap.jar --net --route --latin1 --gmapsupp ~/mappa.osm ~/mappa2.osm qui [0] puoi vedere come vengono create le mappe di gfoss (ovviamente sotto linux) [0] http://www.lucadelu.org/software_libero/script/italimg/ -- ciao Luca www.lucadelu.org ___ Talk-it mailing list Talk-it@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it ___ Talk-it mailing list Talk-it@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it
Re: [Talk-it] Percorrendo sentieri
Il giorno mer, 12/01/2011 alle 17.48 +0100, Luca Delucchi ha scritto: certo, devo aggiustare la mappa :-) Nei prossimi giorni ci lavoro su... Aaaah ok ^_^ ecco perché :D Comunque, grazie ai suggerimenti degli utenti, ho fatto delle prove, e il metodo di mettere: highway=cycleway foot=official cycleway=official per le ciclabili funziona benissimo. Il Garmin non pensa più di essere sulla pista ciclabile. In sostanza, era quel highway=path che mandava fuori tutto. Mi chiedo, non si può tagliare la testa al toro e mettere un qualche tag che dica dove le auto NON possono andare? Ho già messo a posto qualcosa, e ho spostato un po' via Volano che era completamente fuori dal vero tracciato. Ho aggiunto anche molti nomi alle vie del centro storico. Prima o poi devo decidermi ad aggiungere tutto il quartiere a destra dopo la rotonda di via Bologna-via Wagner. Infine: ho notato che scaricando la mappa da http://garmin.na1400.info/routable.php o convertendola con mkgmap il Garmin vede le rotonde, mentre con la mappa scaricata da gfoss il garmin le vede come normali strade e quindi è piuttosto buffo quando invece che dire immettersi nella rotonda e uscire alla seconda uscita dice girare a sinistra in strade e girare a destra in strade e a sinistra in strade via Tal dei Tali :-O ___ Talk-it mailing list Talk-it@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it
Re: [Talk-it] Percorrendo sentieri
2011/1/12 Stefano Droghetti stefano.droghe...@gmail.com: Mi chiedo, non si può tagliare la testa al toro e mettere un qualche tag che dica dove le auto NON possono andare? Magari fosse tutto così semplice... 1. puoi sempre mettere, su ciascuna strada dove le auto non sono ammesse, il tag motorcar=no. Ma secondo me non è quello che vuoi... 2. tu vorresti che di default si sapesse che su highway=path non si può andare in auto. Mi sembra che una volta i default fossero documentati sul wiki nelle pagine dei tag highway, ma recentemente non li ho più visti, il che ci lascia a... 3. i fogli di stile usati da mkgmap (o i default di altro motori di routing). Qui si può intervenire per ri-definire i default. Ad esempio il foglio di stile di Marco è fatto molto bene e appunto forza motorcar=no sui path. Ciao, Federico ___ Talk-it mailing list Talk-it@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it
Re: [Talk-it] Percorrendo sentieri
Ah che incubo highway=path! highway=cycleway bicycle=official foot=official ma perchè usando la preimpostazione di JOSM con il cartello blu mi risulta invece highway=path bicycle=designaded foot=designaded ??? morsi ___ Talk-it mailing list Talk-it@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it
Re: [Talk-it] Percorrendo sentieri
Il giorno mer, 12/01/2011 alle 18.15 +0100, Stefano Droghetti ha scritto: Comunque, grazie ai suggerimenti degli utenti, ho fatto delle prove, e il metodo di mettere: highway=cycleway foot=official cycleway=official per le ciclabili funziona benissimo. Il Garmin non pensa più di essere sulla pista ciclabile. In sostanza, era quel highway=path che mandava fuori tutto. No, falso allarme: non funziona bene lo stesso. All'inizio vedeva bene la strada perché l'avevo un po' spostata (le dimensioni non erano giuste) e quindi sembrava funzionare, ma appena mi avvicino a un highway=cycleway mi rimette l'auto su percorrendo sentieri. A questo punto occorre decisamente ridefinire i fogli di stile per rendere automatico il motorcar=no su tutte le piste ciclabili e i sentieri, perché adesso veramente la mappa è inutilizzabile, crede sempre che io stia andando sulle ciclabili. Ringrazio Federico Cozzi per il chiarimento. Io comincio a mettere motorcar=no su tutte le ciclabili di Ferrara, intanto. ___ Talk-it mailing list Talk-it@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it
Re: [Talk-it] Percorrendo sentieri
Il -10/01/-28163 20:59, Federico Cozzi ha scritto: 2011/1/12 Stefano Droghetti stefano.droghe...@gmail.com: Ho anche notato che le piste ciclabili sono disegnate diversamente in alcuni punti della città: In alcune è segnato semplicemente highway=cleway In altre è scritto così: highway=th bicycleÞsignated footÞsignated Il Garmin mi fa andare con la macchina nelle seconde mentre invece non mi permette - giustamente - di entrare con l'auto nelle prime. Ah che incubo highway=th! 1. il Garmin non dovrebbe farti andare in macchina su highway=th, letteralmente è un sentiero 2. quando fu inventato il tag highway=th non si capiva bene a che servisse, ci sono tante correnti di pensiero, qui in Italia abbiamo deciso di usarlo per i sentieri veri e propri (non da tacchi a spillo) e per le ciclabili con cartello blu sarebbe più chiaro mapparle come: highway=cleway bicycle=ficial foot=ficial Se conosci la pista ciclabile in questione ed è appunto una ciclabile ufficiale (cartello blu) ti suggerisco di fare questa modifica (ne guadagnano tutte le mappa, dalla OpenCycleMap alla mappa di NOP alle mappe per Garmin) Ciao, Federico Siete sicuri che sia giusto cambiare i tag della ciclabile per non far sbagliare il Garmin? Su JOSM il preset per le ciclabili miste (bici + pedoni) è quello con highway=path e bicycle=designated foot=designated segregated=yes/no ___ Talk-it mailing list Talk-it@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it
Re: [Talk-it] Percorrendo sentieri
2011/1/12 Fabri erfab...@gmail.com: Siete sicuri che sia giusto cambiare i tag della ciclabile per non far sbagliare il Garmin? Su JOSM il preset per le ciclabili miste (bici + pedoni) è quello con highway=path e bicycle=designated foot=designated segregated=yes/no Premesso che, come dicevo, highway=path è un incubo, nel senso che ognuno lo intende a modo suo: a. bicycle=official è più giusto di bicycle=designated: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:access%3Dofficial Difference to designated: Official is stronger than designated. [...] Offical is only for ways marked with a legal traffic sign. Pertanto se c'è il cartello blu è official, non designated b. highway=cycleway vs highway=path un paio d'anni fa c'è stato un sondaggio sulla mailing list italiana (qualcuno lo ritrova?) in cui si decise che highway=path era limitato ai sentieri (quelli extra-urbani che si percorrono con scarpe adeguate, per intenderci) Ovviamente il wiki stesso si contraddice, ad es. qui: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/IT:Tag:highway%3Dpath è concorde con JOSM. Io difendo il mio schema, che è comunque conforme ad ALCUNE pagine del wiki ed è meglio supportato da alcune mappe (OpenCycleMap, OpenMtbMap, Hiking map di NOP). Anche l'altro è conforme ad ALCUNE pagine del wiki, però è supportato peggio dai render Ciao, Federico ___ Talk-it mailing list Talk-it@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it
Re: [Talk-it] Percorrendo sentieri
Non mi sembra il modo giusto di operare. Se non dobbiamo mappare per il render, figuriamoci se dobbiamo mappare per la mappa garmin fatta in un modo invece che in un altro. Secondo me la mappa OSM non va toccata (soprattutto se è solo per mettere un tag implicito). E' chi produce la mappa Garmin che si deve adeguare se vuole non mandare le auto sulle ciclabili. Ciao, Marco. Da: Stefano Droghetti stefano.droghe...@gmail.com A: openstreetmap list - italiano talk-it@openstreetmap.org Inviato: Mer 12 gennaio 2011, 18:36:51 Oggetto: Re: [Talk-it] Percorrendo sentieri Il giorno mer, 12/01/2011 alle 18.15 +0100, Stefano Droghetti ha scritto: ... Io comincio a mettere motorcar=no su tutte le ciclabili di Ferrara, intanto. ... ___ Talk-it mailing list Talk-it@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it ___ Talk-it mailing list Talk-it@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it
Re: [Talk-it] Percorrendo sentieri
Il giorno mer, 12/01/2011 alle 17.48 +, Marco Certelli ha scritto: Non mi sembra il modo giusto di operare. Se non dobbiamo mappare per il render, figuriamoci se dobbiamo mappare per la mappa garmin fatta in un modo invece che in un altro. Secondo me la mappa OSM non va toccata (soprattutto se è solo per mettere un tag implicito). E' chi produce la mappa Garmin che si deve adeguare se vuole non mandare le auto sulle ciclabili. È vero, però intanto bisogna dire ai vari siti di fare la conversione in un certo modo. È un peccato che altrimenti tutti si debbano convertire le mappe in proprio. A proposito: non esistono GPS che leggano direttamente le OpenStreetMap? Comunque io adesso non sto cambiando i tag, sto solo aggiungendo motorcar=no alle zone in cui è vietato per le auto, il che mi sembra anche plausibile. O no? ___ Talk-it mailing list Talk-it@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it
Re: [Talk-it] Percorrendo sentieri
2011/1/12 Marco Certelli marco_certe...@yahoo.it: Non mi sembra il modo giusto di operare. Se non dobbiamo mappare per il render, figuriamoci se dobbiamo mappare per la mappa garmin fatta in un modo invece che in un altro. No, aspetta. C'è il solito fraintendimento di base su non mappare per il render. Siamo tutti d'accordo che non dobbiamo introdurre dei tag errati in modo da sfruttare dei bug di render / fogli di stile (cioè combinare due errori opposti in modo da annullarli e ottenere il risultato corretto) Ma io mappo per il render proprio perché inserisco le informazioni corrette nel database, che poi verranno sfruttate dal render / dalle mappe Garmin / ecc. Ti faccio un esempio. A. scopro che le mappe Garmin mandano le auto sulle ciclabili, e che questa cosa può essere evitata aggiungendo horse=no (!!!) B. scopro che le mappe Garmin mandano le auto sulle ciclabili, e che questa cosa può essere evitata aggiungendo motorcar=no Il caso A. è mappare per il rendering. Sto introducendo dei dati errati per ottenere il comportamento corretto. Sbagliatissimo. Il caso B. è mappare per il rendering, ma in un altro modo: sto introducendo dei dati corretti per ottenere il comportamento corretto. Non ci vedo niente di male. Secondo me la mappa OSM non va toccata (soprattutto se è solo per mettere un tag implicito). E' chi produce la mappa Garmin che si deve adeguare se vuole non mandare le auto sulle ciclabili. Su OSM purtroppo non c'è un chiaro concetto di tag implicito. Inoltre non si può dipendere da chi produce la mappa Garmin di introdurre delle informazioni aggiuntive non presenti sulla mappa: al 90% dei casi azzecca, nel 10% dei casi sbaglia. E' molto più sicuro se queste informazioni sono presenti nella base dati. Ad es. un trunk_link di default è a senso unico o doppio senso? Forse sul wiki c'è la risposta. Ma è stata editata un sacco di volte. Mi sembra molto più sicuro mettere oneway=yes (oppure no) su ogni singolo trunk_link che mappo Ciao, Federico ___ Talk-it mailing list Talk-it@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it
Re: [Talk-it] Percorrendo sentieri
Il 12 gennaio 2011 18:55, Stefano Droghetti ha scritto: Comunque io adesso non sto cambiando i tag, sto solo aggiungendo motorcar=no alle zone in cui è vietato per le auto, il che mi sembra anche plausibile. O no? no, seguendo questo ragionamento se scopri che il router ti manda in macchina su una scalinata cosa fai, correggi il router o aggiungi motorcar=no a higway=step? come base io metterei motorcar=no solo se c'è il cartello esplicito http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Italian_traffic_signs_-_divieto_di_transito_a_tutti_gli_autoveicoli.svg e motorcar=yes se c'è http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Italian_traffic_signs_-_strada_riservata_ai_veicoli_a_motore.svg e niente negli altri casi elenco di segnali, ci sono anche quelli delle ciclabili, segregate e no: http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Segnaletica_verticale_italiana:_segnali_di_prescrizione -- Daniele Forsi ___ Talk-it mailing list Talk-it@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-it
