Re: [talk-au] Talk-au Digest, Vol 76, Issue 21
Hi james, Marking out a track is a reasonable approach. On 29 Oct 2013 05:02, talk-au-requ...@openstreetmap.org wrote: Send Talk-au mailing list submissions to talk-au@openstreetmap.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to talk-au-requ...@openstreetmap.org You can reach the person managing the list at talk-au-ow...@openstreetmap.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than Re: Contents of Talk-au digest... Today's Topics: 1. Tagging beach driving info (James Livingston) 2. Bus shelter artwork (Andrew Elwell) 3. Loading JOSM (Arthur Geeson) 4. Re: Bus shelter artwork (Sam Wilson) -- Message: 1 Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2013 09:30:39 +1000 From: James Livingston li...@sunsetutopia.com To: OpenStreetMap talk-au@openstreetmap.org Subject: [talk-au] Tagging beach driving info Message-ID: cabm-lo6nbysxwmyr4tzkh1zx5mjmojhzomcpzlxherjcxtt...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Hi, Recently I was 4wding with some people and collected some info to add to OSM. I think that the access tracks to the beach and realted campsites should be tagged with: highway=track surface=sand maxspeed=NN tracktype=grade7 4wd_only=yes access=permit How should I tag the maxspeed and permit information on the beach itself? Should I be using highway=track, even though there is no track as such, just the beach sand? I've tagged it like that at http://osm.org/go/ueH4JoA~ for the moment (ignore the track-water alignment for now), but is there a better way of tagging information about driving on the beach? -- James Doc Livingston -- Message: 2 Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2013 09:50:53 +0800 From: Andrew Elwell andrew.elw...@gmail.com To: OpenStreetMap talk-au@openstreetmap.org Subject: [talk-au] Bus shelter artwork Message-ID: caanx9yf5b9_gwnqrpyt5qemphcsynwjfsx139acksovd1xp...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Hi folks, I'm about to embark on a pet project to photograph and tag all the decorated bus stops around city of Melville (http://www.melvillecity.com.au/community/art/bus-shelter-painting ) and perhaps freo and others I spot on my travels I'd obviously check the position, route ID (for transperth) and the GTFS info was correct, but I'd like to display them on a photo-map somehow. What's the simplest way to do this - some sort of leaflet based site? I plan to stick pics on flickr (CC-BY-SA most likely) so I only need thumbnails on the mapping site. Does this sound reasonable? other suggestions? Anyone else already doing this? (have spoken to Melville and they're sending me what details they have for the artists so I can include proper credits) Andrew -- Message: 3 Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2013 14:08:15 +1100 From: Arthur Geeson ag200...@gmail.com To: OSM Australia mailing list talk-au@openstreetmap.org Subject: [talk-au] Loading JOSM Message-ID: 526f269f.5040...@gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Thank you to the replies I got for my problems with JOSM/Java. Yesterday I removed everything java from my machine and reloaded java with sudo apt-get install but it totally refused to start and didn't seem to be even loaded correctly. I tried updates etc. all to no avail. Today I located http://roger.steneteg.org/535/how-to-install-oracle-java-on-ubuntudebian/; and followed it through and this resulted in jre1.7.0_45 working correctly. So I now have JOSM up and running. Thanks again for the help. Arthur (geesona) -- Message: 4 Date: Tue, 29 Oct 2013 11:13:05 +0800 From: Sam Wilson s...@samwilson.id.au To: talk-au@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [talk-au] Bus shelter artwork Message-ID: 350a6638e5051e4855b3c1856add9bb2.squir...@webmail.samwilson.id.au Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1 You could upload the photos to Wikimedia Commons, then use the various tools (like https://toolserver.org/~para/GeoCommons/ for example) to view the photos. This would pull the location info from Commons and not OSM though. If you geocode the images before upload, and then upload with Commonist, the correct coord template is inserted. For example, I'm starting to upload a bunch of old photos of Fremantle (starting the workflow in DigiKam for geocoding): https://maps.google.com/maps?q=http:%2F%2Ftools.wikimedia.de%2F~para%2FGeoCommons%2FGeoCommons-simple.kmlll=-32.065028,115.7536spn=0.002964,0.006539t=mz=18 (Not that I usually use Google maps for much!) - Sam. On Tue, October 29, 2013 9:50 am, Andrew Elwell wrote: Hi folks, I'm about to embark on a
Re: [talk-au] vicmap data licensing
Hi Nyall, Starting simple is a great suggestion. Importing the massive vicmap dataset will be a huge project. To keep track of it all, would starting a wiki page and outline requirements, methods and progress be useful in coordinate this effort? In regards to existing data, such as LGAs, non existent what so ever is simple, just import the vicmap data. What if there is some data, but very little amount of it? Options are to: 1. Delete existing and import new. 2. Determine duplicates and work around them. Which of the above option is best practice? Li. On Mon, Oct 14, 2013 at 8:21 AM, Nyall Dawson nyall.daw...@gmail.comwrote: Maybe a good approach would be to start with the easy things first. It should be quite straightforward to import the boundary information like postcodes and LGA borders. Unless I'm mistaken, these boundaries are basically non-existent in Victoria OSM at the moment. Property boundaries would be another good candidate like this - there should be very little existing information we'd need to worry about. Nyall On 11 October 2013 07:37, Li m...@lixia.co wrote: Does anyone have experience on importing data? In particular avoiding duplicates? Li. On 10 Oct 2013, at 5:16 pm, Ben Kelley ben.kel...@gmail.com wrote: Hi. I guess the thing to consider is how you would handle a second import if someone had edited the data in OSM in between. I think this kind of conflict would be very difficult to resolve. You could either plan to do a 1-off import, or maybe include a tag on the imported data matching a unique identifier for the same feature in the vicmap data. The US Tiger import did something like this. - Ben Kelley. On 10 Oct 2013 17:12, Li Xia m...@lixia.co wrote: Hi everyone, I'm meeting Vicmap and data.gov staff tomorrow to get their blessing on importing vicmap data into OSM. Once the licensing is squared away, we can move onto discussing techniques of importing the data. Snapshot data in shp format is available from data.vic.gov.au. Alternatively a vicmap provides a live feed to weekly data diffs directly. Any advice on how to import this data is much appreciated. Li ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] vicmap data licensing
Option 1 seems to me like the better way to go. JOSM can also read and display shp files, conversion may not be necessary. Key is to make the vicmap data easy to access. Currently they are available from data.vic.gov.au in SHP and WMS. I'll write up some instructions on how to access this data on the wiki page. Li. On Mon, Oct 14, 2013 at 9:43 AM, Ian Sergeant inas66+...@gmail.com wrote: I see there are two ways we can approach this. One is to make the data available in OSM form. People can use information to trace/import to complete the map as they go about their daily mapping. Secondly, we can have a complete plan as to how we import bits that we know come from good sources and should complement/replace existing OSM data. If we import LGA and postcodes, we immediately need to consider things like what happens when these align with coastlines, or with each other, or with suburb boundaries? Probably other things too. Worst case is, as has been done on some occasions in the past, is for the import to be done and to leave hundreds of thousands of fixmes scattered around the country. Ian. On 14 October 2013 08:21, Nyall Dawson nyall.daw...@gmail.com wrote: Maybe a good approach would be to start with the easy things first. It should be quite straightforward to import the boundary information like postcodes and LGA borders. Unless I'm mistaken, these boundaries are basically non-existent in Victoria OSM at the moment. Property boundaries would be another good candidate like this - there should be very little existing information we'd need to worry about. Nyall On 11 October 2013 07:37, Li m...@lixia.co wrote: Does anyone have experience on importing data? In particular avoiding duplicates? Li. On 10 Oct 2013, at 5:16 pm, Ben Kelley ben.kel...@gmail.com wrote: Hi. I guess the thing to consider is how you would handle a second import if someone had edited the data in OSM in between. I think this kind of conflict would be very difficult to resolve. You could either plan to do a 1-off import, or maybe include a tag on the imported data matching a unique identifier for the same feature in the vicmap data. The US Tiger import did something like this. - Ben Kelley. On 10 Oct 2013 17:12, Li Xia m...@lixia.co wrote: Hi everyone, I'm meeting Vicmap and data.gov staff tomorrow to get their blessing on importing vicmap data into OSM. Once the licensing is squared away, we can move onto discussing techniques of importing the data. Snapshot data in shp format is available from data.vic.gov.au. Alternatively a vicmap provides a live feed to weekly data diffs directly. Any advice on how to import this data is much appreciated. Li ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Talk-au Digest, Vol 76, Issue 8
Gday Ross, Great workflow suggestion mate. To clarify, when you say compare, you mean manually in JOSM right? Li. On Sun, Oct 13, 2013 at 5:27 PM, talk-au-requ...@openstreetmap.org wrote: Send Talk-au mailing list submissions to talk-au@openstreetmap.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to talk-au-requ...@openstreetmap.org You can reach the person managing the list at talk-au-ow...@openstreetmap.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than Re: Contents of Talk-au digest... Today's Topics: 1. Re: vicmap data licensing (Ross Scanlon) 2. Re: South Australia Suburb Boundries (Daniel O'Connor) -- Message: 1 Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2013 08:57:13 +1000 From: Ross Scanlon i...@4x4falcon.com To: talk-au@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [talk-au] vicmap data licensing Message-ID: 525730c9.5070...@4x4falcon.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Cut the data into small chunks (0.25 x 0.25 deg). Load each chunk it into josm. Download the relevant area to a separate layer. Compare with what is already there. Expect to spend a least 2 hours with each chunk depending on what data your adding. Cheers Ross On 11/10/13 06:37, Li wrote: Does anyone have experience on importing data? In particular avoiding duplicates? Li. On 10 Oct 2013, at 5:16 pm, Ben Kelley ben.kel...@gmail.com mailto:ben.kel...@gmail.com wrote: Hi. I guess the thing to consider is how you would handle a second import if someone had edited the data in OSM in between. I think this kind of conflict would be very difficult to resolve. You could either plan to do a 1-off import, or maybe include a tag on the imported data matching a unique identifier for the same feature in the vicmap data. The US Tiger import did something like this. - Ben Kelley. On 10 Oct 2013 17:12, Li Xia m...@lixia.co mailto:m...@lixia.co wrote: Hi everyone, I'm meeting Vicmap and data.gov http://data.gov staff tomorrow to get their blessing on importing vicmap data into OSM. Once the licensing is squared away, we can move onto discussing techniques of importing the data. Snapshot data in shp format is available from data.vic.gov.au http://data.vic.gov.au. Alternatively a vicmap provides a live feed to weekly data diffs directly. Any advice on how to import this data is much appreciated. Li ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org mailto:Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au -- Message: 2 Date: Sat, 12 Oct 2013 02:41:02 +1030 From: Daniel O'Connor daniel.ocon...@gmail.com To: Andrew Harvey andrew.harv...@gmail.com Cc: OSM Australian Talk List talk-au@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [talk-au] South Australia Suburb Boundries Message-ID: CAJsZyFCxk2C1s2YE8x9xwegQBe_p= guvq9k_npgjarefup3...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Did the bits to produce .osm files (again on github); suitable to open up and view in JOSM. I spot checked two areas near me that I know well, and the accuracy is pretty high. http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/way/241675341 http://www.openstreetmap.org/browse/way/241667279 I guess this discussion probably does want to head over to the imports list shortly. Any volunteers to help write up a fairly complete plan? I really don't fancy doing ~3000 suburb boundaries one by one in JOSM and checking them all myself; on top of doing all of the writeups/status updates/etc. Also, I have overseas travel in the coming weeks; so am likely to vanish half way through the conversation unless there's at least one other mapper with ownership. http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Import/Plan_Outline On Sun, Oct 6, 2013 at 7:01 PM, Daniel O'Connor daniel.ocon...@gmail.com wrote: I did look through a few of the existing tools; but most fell into the too hard basket. In the end, manually doing it via QGIS and exporting into the right projection was fairly easy. I've pushed to github what I've done; which is produce geojson kml serializations of it - I had assumed geojson.io would let me export easily to OSM, but unfortunately that's not the case. Example: https://github.com/CloCkWeRX/data.sa.gov.au-suburb-boundaries/blob/master/suburbs/suburbs_0.geojson Repo: https://github.com/CloCkWeRX/data.sa.gov.au-suburb-boundaries/ Anyway, I'm more or less going
Re: [talk-au] Talk-au Digest, Vol 76, Issue 5
Hi Nick, Yes, vicmap data does contain road geometry, names plus many more attributes. Vicmap also produces are raster version from this dataset so that work is already done. I will enquiry about getting access to this. However manually tracing and editing is a LOT of work. Does anyone know of a process where a mass import can be done without manually tracing imagery? The dataset is very comprehensive. Here's a quick summary of it's features: Release under Creative commons 3.0 license, dataset can be obtained in various formats from http://www.data.vic.gov.au/ The has heaps of datasets. I've downloaded most relevant datasets in shp format and combined the datasets into logical structure, download links below. If anyone is interest in other features such as forestry reserves, national parks etc, have a look and pull the data down from data.vic. Transport shp data https://www.dropbox.com/sh/fuba69goag6c5pb/FYRs68wqDo documentationhttps://www.dropbox.com/s/p44ld1ov1i291ra/Vicmap-Transport-Prod-Desc-V3_4.pdf Hydro - shp data https://www.dropbox.com/sh/qrnmzveiu4ayxsn/bXyu5QI4Vr - documentationhttps://www.dropbox.com/s/dwsw36xs905dw1d/Vicmap-Hydro-Prod-Desc-v5.4.pdf Administrative - shp datahttps://www.dropbox.com/sh/efa8ags193e8d7b/_SxEilmoOA Li. On Fri, Oct 11, 2013 at 11:00 PM, talk-au-requ...@openstreetmap.org wrote: Send Talk-au mailing list submissions to talk-au@openstreetmap.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to talk-au-requ...@openstreetmap.org You can reach the person managing the list at talk-au-ow...@openstreetmap.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than Re: Contents of Talk-au digest... Today's Topics: 1. Re: vicmap data licensing (Li) 2. Re: vicmap data licensing (Nick Hocking) -- Message: 1 Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2013 07:37:31 +1100 From: Li m...@lixia.co To: Ben Kelley ben.kel...@gmail.com Cc: OSM Australian Talk List talk-au@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [talk-au] vicmap data licensing Message-ID: 91641499-6fb4-426c-8313-c0d82c305...@lixia.co Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Does anyone have experience on importing data? In particular avoiding duplicates? Li. On 10 Oct 2013, at 5:16 pm, Ben Kelley ben.kel...@gmail.com wrote: Hi. I guess the thing to consider is how you would handle a second import if someone had edited the data in OSM in between. I think this kind of conflict would be very difficult to resolve. You could either plan to do a 1-off import, or maybe include a tag on the imported data matching a unique identifier for the same feature in the vicmap data. The US Tiger import did something like this. - Ben Kelley. On 10 Oct 2013 17:12, Li Xia m...@lixia.co wrote: Hi everyone, I'm meeting Vicmap and data.gov staff tomorrow to get their blessing on importing vicmap data into OSM. Once the licensing is squared away, we can move onto discussing techniques of importing the data. Snapshot data in shp format is available from data.vic.gov.au. Alternatively a vicmap provides a live feed to weekly data diffs directly. Any advice on how to import this data is much appreciated. Li ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-au/attachments/20131011/98778e6c/attachment-0001.html -- Message: 2 Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2013 12:18:17 +1100 From: Nick Hocking nick.hock...@gmail.com To: talk-au@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [talk-au] vicmap data licensing Message-ID: caded0cxpnfdoza4jsnvn0xczcgaun0hnn5x2nk-siuxlfdv...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Hi Li Does the vicmap[ data include road geometry and road names. If so then a really usefull thing to do would be to create an imagery layer from this data that could be used in JOSM. This is what is done in the USA with each year's TIGER data. Then we could use the Bing imagery the vicmap layer and existing data to fill in all the unnamed streets/roads and include any new ones or ones that have not yet been surveyed or traced. It would only be a matter of months and all of Victoria's roads would be completely up to date. Curerently, I'm spending hours each day using the TIGER data and Bing imagery in helping to fix up the horrible original TIGER data but would love to be helping in fixing up Australia. Nick Hocking Canberra -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk
Re: [talk-au] Talk-au Digest, Vol 76, Issue 5
We need to get the vicmap data in a form that will have maximum - can you be more specific? Do you have any experience in merging datasets in josm? Li. On Sat, Oct 12, 2013 at 9:18 AM, Ian Sergeant inas66+...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, Whatever process we undertake will have large manual elements to integrate the datasets and keep them updated. Even if that is simply merging the datasets in josm. We need to get the vicmap data in a form that will have maximum utility to OSM mappers. Ian. On 12 October 2013 09:09, Li Xia m...@lixia.co wrote: Hi Nick, Yes, vicmap data does contain road geometry, names plus many more attributes. Vicmap also produces are raster version from this dataset so that work is already done. I will enquiry about getting access to this. However manually tracing and editing is a LOT of work. Does anyone know of a process where a mass import can be done without manually tracing imagery? The dataset is very comprehensive. Here's a quick summary of it's features: Release under Creative commons 3.0 license, dataset can be obtained in various formats from http://www.data.vic.gov.au/ The has heaps of datasets. I've downloaded most relevant datasets in shp format and combined the datasets into logical structure, download links below. If anyone is interest in other features such as forestry reserves, national parks etc, have a look and pull the data down from data.vic. Transport shp data documentation Hydro - shp data - documentation Administrative - shp data Li. On Fri, Oct 11, 2013 at 11:00 PM, talk-au-requ...@openstreetmap.org wrote: Send Talk-au mailing list submissions to talk-au@openstreetmap.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to talk-au-requ...@openstreetmap.org You can reach the person managing the list at talk-au-ow...@openstreetmap.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than Re: Contents of Talk-au digest... Today's Topics: 1. Re: vicmap data licensing (Li) 2. Re: vicmap data licensing (Nick Hocking) -- Message: 1 Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2013 07:37:31 +1100 From: Li m...@lixia.co To: Ben Kelley ben.kel...@gmail.com Cc: OSM Australian Talk List talk-au@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [talk-au] vicmap data licensing Message-ID: 91641499-6fb4-426c-8313-c0d82c305...@lixia.co Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Does anyone have experience on importing data? In particular avoiding duplicates? Li. On 10 Oct 2013, at 5:16 pm, Ben Kelley ben.kel...@gmail.com wrote: Hi. I guess the thing to consider is how you would handle a second import if someone had edited the data in OSM in between. I think this kind of conflict would be very difficult to resolve. You could either plan to do a 1-off import, or maybe include a tag on the imported data matching a unique identifier for the same feature in the vicmap data. The US Tiger import did something like this. - Ben Kelley. On 10 Oct 2013 17:12, Li Xia m...@lixia.co wrote: Hi everyone, I'm meeting Vicmap and data.gov staff tomorrow to get their blessing on importing vicmap data into OSM. Once the licensing is squared away, we can move onto discussing techniques of importing the data. Snapshot data in shp format is available from data.vic.gov.au. Alternatively a vicmap provides a live feed to weekly data diffs directly. Any advice on how to import this data is much appreciated. Li ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-au/attachments/20131011/98778e6c/attachment-0001.html -- Message: 2 Date: Fri, 11 Oct 2013 12:18:17 +1100 From: Nick Hocking nick.hock...@gmail.com To: talk-au@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [talk-au] vicmap data licensing Message-ID: caded0cxpnfdoza4jsnvn0xczcgaun0hnn5x2nk-siuxlfdv...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Hi Li Does the vicmap[ data include road geometry and road names. If so then a really usefull thing to do would be to create an imagery layer from this data that could be used in JOSM. This is what is done in the USA with each year's TIGER data. Then we could use the Bing imagery the vicmap layer and existing data to fill in all the unnamed streets/roads and include any new ones or ones that have not yet been surveyed or traced. It would only be a matter
[talk-au] obtaining permission to import vicmap datasets
Quick update... I met with data.vic and vicmap yesterday for permission to import vicmap data into OSM. data.vic has requested that we include attribution in the wiki pagehttp://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Contributors#Australian_government_public_information_datasets, and then they will request official approval from the policy office. I have added attribution to Vicmap transport, hydro, admin and LITE datasets on the wiki contributors pagehttp://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Contributors#Australian_government_public_information_datasets so the process can move forward. They have indicated that this process will take around 2 weeks. These attributions are required for formal approval, DO NOT REMOVE THEM! As of this moment, we have been given the green light to start importing the vicmap data. Approval is simply a formality. Li. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
[talk-au] vicmap data licensing
Hi everyone, I'm meeting Vicmap and data.gov staff tomorrow to get their blessing on importing vicmap data into OSM. Once the licensing is squared away, we can move onto discussing techniques of importing the data. Snapshot data in shp format is available from data.vic.gov.au. Alternatively a vicmap provides a live feed to weekly data diffs directly. Any advice on how to import this data is much appreciated. Li ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
[talk-au] vicmap has given the thumbs up for import
Gday, I had a meeting with Vicmap staff today in regards to importing Vicmap data into OSM under the CC license. They are very excited about the community showing interest in their data and are have clarified that importing it is fine. I also asked about obtaining a letter of authority so they referred me onto Simon at data.vic.gov.au. It turns out someone from the OSM community is already liaising with his colleague Judy. Rather than doubling up the effort and causing confusion, I'm trying to find out who this OSM contributor is so that we can establish communication and get this done. If you are or aware of this individual, let me know ASAP. Thanks. Li. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] vicmap has given the thumbs up for import
Hi Nyall, Jodee Cook is the correct person, we are on the same page. How is the progress? Li. On Thu, Oct 10, 2013 at 2:30 PM, Nyall Dawson nyall.daw...@gmail.comwrote: On 10 October 2013 14:07, Li Xia m...@lixia.co wrote: Gday, I had a meeting with Vicmap staff today in regards to importing Vicmap data into OSM under the CC license. They are very excited about the community showing interest in their data and are have clarified that importing it is fine. Great news! Thanks for following this up. I also asked about obtaining a letter of authority so they referred me onto Simon at data.vic.gov.au. It turns out someone from the OSM community is already liaising with his colleague Judy. Rather than doubling up the effort and causing confusion, I'm trying to find out who this OSM contributor is so that we can establish communication and get this done. That may likely be me - although I've been in communication with Elizabeth Thomas and Jodee Cook, not Judy? Cheers, Nyall ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Vicmap licensing
Gday everyone, I've been talking to DSE about importing vicmap data into OSM under the CC license. Got this reply today... The Creative Commons licence requires you to Attribute the work/data as being Vicmap Data. We would like to sit down with you at some stage in early October and discuss the inclusion of Vicmap into OSM.? I'm not a legal buff, but if someone is, would you like to join me for this meeting? Li. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Vicmap licensing
Sounds straight forward. thanks for the help. On Tue, Sep 17, 2013 at 2:14 AM, Daniel O'Connor daniel.ocon...@gmail.comwrote: Also: clarify explicitly that attribution in the wiki is acceptable to them. On 17/09/2013 6:43 PM, Daniel O'Connor daniel.ocon...@gmail.com wrote: I would send them the odbl licence and position it as 'is this ok with your open government stance? ' neatly avoids cc by confusion, gives them an attitude to address, and likely ends up with 'let it be free' On 17/09/2013 4:53 PM, Li Xia lisxia1...@gmail.com wrote: Gday everyone, I've been talking to DSE about importing vicmap data into OSM under the CC license. Got this reply today... The Creative Commons licence requires you to Attribute the work/data as being Vicmap Data. We would like to sit down with you at some stage in early October and discuss the inclusion of Vicmap into OSM.? I'm not a legal buff, but if someone is, would you like to join me for this meeting? Li. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Talk-au Digest, Vol 74, Issue 7
Is marking source:GeoScience Australia considered attribution? Li. On Mon, Aug 19, 2013 at 10:00 PM, talk-au-requ...@openstreetmap.org wrote: Send Talk-au mailing list submissions to talk-au@openstreetmap.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to talk-au-requ...@openstreetmap.org You can reach the person managing the list at talk-au-ow...@openstreetmap.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than Re: Contents of Talk-au digest... Today's Topics: 1. Incorporating public information into OSM - Legal situation (Brett Russell) -- Message: 1 Date: Mon, 19 Aug 2013 19:49:43 +1030 From: Brett Russell brussell...@live.com.au To: OSM Australia mailing list talk-au@openstreetmap.org Subject: [talk-au] Incorporating public information into OSM - Legal situation Message-ID: snt149-w80b55e70cf0cc334abdef7af...@phx.gbl Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Hi I have been working on OSM maps for bushwalking and this has generated a fair bit of interest. A few people have taken up mapping and one person approached me on lifting rivers and streams data from the 1:250,000 publicly available data. My response was no as it is likely copyrighted and OSM requires no restriction be placed on the data. Not to be defeated he wrote to A/g Manager, Information Product Management Policy Unit Information Management Corporate Services | GEOSCIENCE AUSTRALIA and received this reply. Thank you for your email enquiry in regards to copyright and Creative Commons. The material available as a free download under a Creative Commons Attribution 3.0 Australia licence is still under copyright. We are releasing many of our products under the CC-BY licence which means that you may share (copy, distribute and transmit the work), remix and make adaption or even make commercial use of the work. The only condition for using the product under this licence is that you must attribute Geoscience Australia. http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/3.0/au/deed.en If you have any further questions or would like me to send you the attribution statement we require please let me know. Regards Given that this data (rough as it might be) might be available what is the OSM community thoughts on an Australia wide approach? Basically has anyone been down this road. I would imagine the challenge would be to identify what data is available under what license. Anyway your thoughts please. Cheers Brett -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-au/attachments/20130819/a7e06533/attachment-0001.html -- ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au End of Talk-au Digest, Vol 74, Issue 7 ** ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Vicmap data released on data.gov.au
Sweet, very exciting and willing to lend a hand in the import process. Also have a few contacts in Vicmap, and will email Nyall Dawson directly. What tools are available for importing data (and removing duplicates) Li. On Mon, Jul 8, 2013 at 10:00 PM, talk-au-requ...@openstreetmap.org wrote: Send Talk-au mailing list submissions to talk-au@openstreetmap.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to talk-au-requ...@openstreetmap.org You can reach the person managing the list at talk-au-ow...@openstreetmap.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than Re: Contents of Talk-au digest... Today's Topics: 1. Vicmap data released on data.gov.au (Nyall Dawson) 2. Re: Vicmap data released on data.gov.au (Ian Sergeant) 3. Re: Vicmap data released on data.gov.au (Paul Norman) 4. Re: Vicmap data released on data.gov.au (Nyall Dawson) -- Message: 1 Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2013 09:27:15 +1000 From: Nyall Dawson nyall.daw...@gmail.com To: talk-au@openstreetmap.org Subject: [talk-au] Vicmap data released on data.gov.au Message-ID: CAB28AsgZPt3Dw4WAuwRSYA_Jm=x+3v428= v7mifeedxbger...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Hi all, I'm not sure if this has been raised yet, but in the last week the entire VicMap dataset was released on data.vic.gov.au under a CC-Attribution 3.0 license. This includes the entire address [1], roads [2], parcel boundaries [3], and administration boundaries [4] for Victoria. I gather by http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Attribution/data.gov.au_explicit_permission that we're OK to use data from data.gov.au for OSM. Does anyone know if this is still the case, and if so, how we could go about getting this data into osm? I'm willing to do any hard work required, but don't want to duplicate effort and first want to see if there's already any ongoing discussion about this data release. Regards, Nyall Dawson 1. http://www.data.vic.gov.au/raw_data/address-vicmap-address/748 2. http://www.data.vic.gov.au/raw_data/road-network-vicmap-transport/4877 3. http://www.data.vic.gov.au/raw_data/parcel-view-vicmap-property/2038 4. http://www.data.vic.gov.au/raw_data/locality-boundaries-property-polygon-vicmap-admin/2043 http://www.data.vic.gov.au/raw_data/local-government-area-boundaries-property-polygon-vicmap-admin/2039 -- Message: 2 Date: Mon, 8 Jul 2013 10:09:54 +1000 From: Ian Sergeant inas66+...@gmail.com To: Nyall Dawson nyall.daw...@gmail.com Cc: OSM - Talk-au talk-au@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [talk-au] Vicmap data released on data.gov.au Message-ID: calda4yjby0bzvngqvkr3j91lzonefgu8p0x7fewr7exrtuh...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 We should send an email to the data owner to seek permission under our contributor terms. I don't think there is any relationship between data.vic.gov.au and data.gov.au, so I don't see how any permission we have is relevant to this. Ian. On 8 July 2013 09:27, Nyall Dawson nyall.daw...@gmail.com wrote: Hi all, I'm not sure if this has been raised yet, but in the last week the entire VicMap dataset was released on data.vic.gov.au under a CC-Attribution 3.0 license. This includes the entire address [1], roads [2], parcel boundaries [3], and administration boundaries [4] for Victoria. I gather by http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Attribution/data.gov.au_explicit_permission that we're OK to use data from data.gov.au for OSM. Does anyone know if this is still the case, and if so, how we could go about getting this data into osm? I'm willing to do any hard work required, but don't want to duplicate effort and first want to see if there's already any ongoing discussion about this data release. Regards, Nyall Dawson 1. http://www.data.vic.gov.au/raw_data/address-vicmap-address/748 2. http://www.data.vic.gov.au/raw_data/road-network-vicmap-transport/4877 3. http://www.data.vic.gov.au/raw_data/parcel-view-vicmap-property/2038 4. http://www.data.vic.gov.au/raw_data/locality-boundaries-property-polygon-vicmap-admin/2043 http://www.data.vic.gov.au/raw_data/local-government-area-boundaries-property-polygon-vicmap-admin/2039 ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-au/attachments/20130708/b953cea8/attachment-0001.html -- Message: 3 Date: Sun, 07 Jul 2013 17:28:03 -0700 From: Paul Norman penor...@mac.com To:
Re: [talk-au] Talk-au Digest, Vol 72, Issue 9
Hi Brett, I'm Li, founder and developer of Mud Map 2. You bring up great points. We have a small development team, the app was released 6 weeks ago and it's just the start. Heaps of feature upgrades are planned. Upload your tracks as a GPX trace to OSM from the app is one of them. Are you able to send me the link to that track? I'll have a look at it's compatibility with Garmin basecampe. Mountain peaks are available as a POI, you can turn them on by going to Options MapKey POIs. We don't include all OSM attributes in the offline vector data yet, but plan to include more features. Which attributes are you keen to see included? As for battery life, did you have the phone's screen on the entire 2 hours? Screens kill battery life. Mud Map 2 has background tracking, so you can put your device to sleep and it will keep recording your location. We've logged 6-7 hours using an iPhone 4S. I do pay attention to this mailing list, however you are always welcome to contact us with any feedback on supp...@mud-maps.com for topics directly related to our products. Li. On Sun, Jun 16, 2013 at 10:00 PM, talk-au-requ...@openstreetmap.org wrote: Send Talk-au mailing list submissions to talk-au@openstreetmap.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to talk-au-requ...@openstreetmap.org You can reach the person managing the list at talk-au-ow...@openstreetmap.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than Re: Contents of Talk-au digest... Today's Topics: 1. MudMap 2 report back (Brett Russell) -- Message: 1 Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2013 16:56:39 +1030 From: Brett Russell brussell...@live.com.au To: OSM Australia mailing list talk-au@openstreetmap.org Subject: [talk-au] MudMap 2 report back Message-ID: snt130-w29966cfaee6aff95016e0aaf...@phx.gbl Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Hi I have been playing with MudMap 2 and frankly the important feature for a OSM mapper, the ability to upload GPX files, is terrible. MudMap are mad keen that you use their server. First the send, sends the GPX file to their server with a default public setting. Then you have to go to their server to send it, say to yourself, which then after typing in an email address it send you an email that again requires you to again visit their server to download a GPX format that is downloaded as a GPX.XLM format so not recognised by Garmin's Bsecamp!! In all the most idiotic process that could be dreamed up. Net result is I have not even the ability to comment on the tracking ability of my plot except to say that it almost flattened my iPhone 4S in two and bit hours. The critical for bushwalkers features such as lakes and mountains do not appear. Sure the application is still in development so I can forgive this but the terrible ability to extract a GPX file suggests a form of thinking that I can not abide, that being forcing users to their site. Are we to see fees being charged for this service down the track? Not recommended. Cheers Brett Russell PO Box 94 LAUNCESTON Tas 7250 -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-au/attachments/20130616/9367f055/attachment-0001.html -- ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au End of Talk-au Digest, Vol 72, Issue 9 ** ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Talk-au Digest, Vol 71, Issue 25
Provided that licensing is all good, how can the data be imported into OSM? What can be done to ensure there's minimal duplicates? Li. On 26/05/2013, at 10:00 PM, talk-au-requ...@openstreetmap.org wrote: Send Talk-au mailing list submissions to talk-au@openstreetmap.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to talk-au-requ...@openstreetmap.org You can reach the person managing the list at talk-au-ow...@openstreetmap.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than Re: Contents of Talk-au digest... Today's Topics: 1. Re: data.sa.gov.au (Alex Sims) -- Message: 1 Date: Sat, 25 May 2013 21:35:55 +0930 From: Alex Sims a...@softgrow.com To: talk-au@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [talk-au] data.sa.gov.au Message-ID: 51a0a923.8090...@softgrow.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; Format=flowed I'm just writing an email now to seek a similar agreement for sa.data.gov.au as for data.gov.au Alex On 25/05/2013 5:23 PM, Paul Norman wrote: The only issue with CC BY is that some data owners believe that attribution reasonable to the medium is more than the ODbL guarantees which allows notices in a location ... where users would be likely to look for it such as a wiki page linked from /copyright or in the case of produced works, a notice ... reasonably calculated to make [anyone] aware that Content was obtained from the Database (The Database in that quote would be what was provided under CC BY). Some cities releasing data as CC BY insisted that only mention on any page where the map was viewed was reasonable, which is clearly unreasonable when there can be dozens of sources on one page, or even hundreds. *From:*Ian Sergeant [mailto:inas66+...@gmail.com] *Sent:* Saturday, May 25, 2013 12:09 AM *To:* Daniel O'Connor *Cc:* talk-au@openstreetmap.org *Subject:* Re: [talk-au] data.sa.gov.au Hi Daniel, The first step should be to find out if they are willing to have their data relicenced under our licence? CC-BY data is nice, and means that the data owner is likely only seeking attribution (which we do provide) but my understanding is that it is still insufficient for us to use without further permission from the data owner. Pointers to our attribution page have worked in the past in gaining such permission. Ian. On 24 May 2013 18:58, Daniel O'Connor daniel.ocon...@gmail.com mailto:daniel.ocon...@gmail.com wrote: The SA govt has joined many of the other state/local governments in publishing open data. The current implementation is powered by CKAN, and though I haven't seen it yet, appears to be leveraging openstreetmap / cloudmade in some fashion. Anyway, the majority of the data sets are CC-A licensed, and in either CSV or Shapefile format: Some initial things that might be worth importing/using as a reference/looking into: http://www.data.sa.gov.au/dataset/major-and-minor-roads http://www.data.sa.gov.au/dataset/library-locations http://www.data.sa.gov.au/dataset/parks-and-reserves http://www.data.sa.gov.au/dataset/sa-playgrounds http://www.data.sa.gov.au/dataset/stormwater-nodes http://www.data.sa.gov.au/dataset/surface-water-catchments http://www.data.sa.gov.au/dataset/suburb-boundaries and of course: http://www.data.sa.gov.au/dataset/centrelink-office-locations Not sure how much overlap with data.gov.au http://data.gov.au data sets (assume some). Anyone want to have a look around and 1) Call out the things you think are missing 2) Call out the things you'd want to have imported or manually transcribed into open street map ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org mailto:Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-au/attachments/20130525/139116b6/attachment-0001.html -- ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au End of Talk-au Digest, Vol 71, Issue 25 *** ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Talk-au Digest, Vol 71, Issue 26
Ian, Interested to know how and what tools you use to extract data for this type of analysis. Li. On 27/05/2013, at 10:00 PM, talk-au-requ...@openstreetmap.org wrote: Send Talk-au mailing list submissions to talk-au@openstreetmap.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to talk-au-requ...@openstreetmap.org You can reach the person managing the list at talk-au-ow...@openstreetmap.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than Re: Contents of Talk-au digest... Today's Topics: 1. Re: Australia licence change redaction recovery.. (Steve Bennett) 2. Re: Australia licence change redaction recovery.. (Ben Johnson) 3. Re: Australia licence change redaction recovery.. (Brett Russell) 4. Re: Talk-au Digest, Vol 71, Issue 25 (Li Xia) -- Message: 1 Date: Sun, 26 May 2013 22:26:34 +1000 From: Steve Bennett stevag...@gmail.com To: Ian Sergeant inas66+...@gmail.com Cc: OSM - Talk-au Talk-au@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [talk-au] Australia licence change redaction recovery.. Message-ID: CA+z=q=vxqgp7z9-3bdewsolcdchdclevn6ethwngpu--zdz...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 On Sat, May 25, 2013 at 9:08 PM, Ian Sergeant inas66+...@gmail.com wrote: So, my summary would be that we've probably comprehensively remapped he motorways and trunk roads across the country. We've got significantly more tracks, paths and residential/unclassified roads than we had before. There would seem to be artifacts of extensive aerial remapping, with the lower percentage overall of named roads, and what I'm thinking could be a consequent tendency to underrate what passes for a secondary road in Australia. I'd also attribute greater mapping outside of urban areas to the more extensive bing imagery coverage, and possibly the focus of the redaction process on urban areas. Thanks very much for doing this - I've been quite curious about where we're up to. I had guessed we were about on par - so this is good news. I've been doing a fair bit of aerial mapping lately - not sure whether remapping or not. I tend to be pretty conservative with road classifications on a first pass. Later, I might look at the area and upgrade a couple of the roads. Steve -- Message: 2 Date: Mon, 27 May 2013 11:05:39 +1000 From: Ben Johnson tangarar...@gmail.com To: Ian Sergeant inas66+...@gmail.com Cc: OSM - Talk-au Talk-au@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [talk-au] Australia licence change redaction recovery.. Message-ID: 16f9fd5a-a1bf-47f2-ab39-c5be9cd34...@gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Ian, Thanks very much for doing this exercise. I agree with all the sentiments already expressed - it's so encouraging to see we bounced back so fast, and so strong, and that all our efforts have made a difference. Everyone in the project should feel very proud of what we achieved. BJ On 25/05/2013, at 9:08 PM, Ian Sergeant inas66+...@gmail.com wrote: I crunched some numbers comparing AU planet extracts from today and prior to the redaction commencing. Although they were for my personal edification, I thought I'd share them. We have about 70,000 km of additional mapped unclassified and residential road now than we did before the redaction process - that is an increase in distance of about 27%. In terms of distance of named roads in this category, we're about where we were before the redaction in absolute terms. Trunk and motorways there is no significant variation. The number of kilometres of mapped road and named roads in this category is roughly unchanged. In primary, secondary, and tertiary, we've had an increase in mapped distance of 35,000km, or around 20%. Although we've seen a significant decrease in the number of secondary roads, and marked increase in the mapped km of tertiary roads. Our post-redaction remappers have a tendency towards tertiary roads, it would seem. Our length of named roads in this category is up in actual kilometres, but down on a relative basis. In paths, tracks, footways and cycleways and service roads our mapped distance is also up, We've seen huge increases in mapped tracks - closing on double what we had before. So, my summary would be that we've probably comprehensively remapped he motorways and trunk roads across the country. We've got significantly more tracks, paths and residential/unclassified roads than we had before. There would seem to be artifacts of extensive aerial remapping, with the lower percentage overall of named roads, and what I'm thinking could be a consequent tendency to underrate what passes for a secondary road
Re: [talk-au] Major 4WD tracks
Significant was what I meant. Using route relation makes sense. — Li On Fri, May 10, 2013 at 4:48 PM, Steve Bennett stevag...@gmail.com wrote: On Fri, May 10, 2013 at 1:47 PM, Li Xia lisxia1...@gmail.com wrote: Major 4wd tracks such as Birdsville track Old telegraph track Wonagatta rd Etc Hi Li, Still not clear on what you mean by major. Do you mean important, significant, famous...or do you mean big,well-maintained etc? If the former, I'd think a route relation (as I described earlier), but you'd need an authoritative source for what the route is. PS Don't forget to reply-all. Steve___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Gates and access
Hi Ian, thanks for the info. My company is running a program to encourage 4wd and outdoor enthusiasts to contribute to OSM data. Access to track and trails is very important for outdoor activities so we just want to make sure our recommendations are in line with OSM. Looks like it's all good though, thanks for your help. Li. On Thu, May 9, 2013 at 3:42 PM, Ian Sergeant inas66+...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, It is documented on the wiki here: https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:seasonal If you want to, you could add it to Map Features. It may just stay there, as a tag in reasonably widespread use. Or, someone might remove it, and say you haven't gone through the correct Proposal Process, so that the eight or nine people who occasionally vote on such things have missed their opportunity to express their opinion (over the several hundred who appear to have used it). https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposed_features Is there a particular reason why you'd want to see it there? If you find the tag has utility, then use it. Ian. On 9 May 2013 15:29, Li Xia lisxia1...@gmail.com wrote: Cool, but it's not listed in the main map features page? http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Map_Features What's the process to get it listed there? Li. On Tue, May 7, 2013 at 4:50 PM, Ian Sergeant inas66+...@gmail.comwrote: Hi, The seasonal tag exists, and is reasonably well used. http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/seasonal#map However, I also agree with Andrew's note, that if you have detailed information on access, then the opening_hours syntax and conditional restrictions is quite expressive. Ian. On 7 May 2013 14:01, Li Xia lisxia1...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Mappers, Gates in many regional, state reserves or national parks have seasonal access. There's no official tag for this in the OSM wiki, right now options are access=yes or no If someone knows of the accepted way seasonal access should be tagged, that would great, Alternative, i'm proposing the access=seasonal tag. Li. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Gates and access
Cool, but it's not listed in the main map features page? http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Map_Features What's the process to get it listed there? Li. On Tue, May 7, 2013 at 4:50 PM, Ian Sergeant inas66+...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, The seasonal tag exists, and is reasonable well used. http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/seasonal#map However, I also agree with Andrew's note, that if you have detailed information on access, then the opening_hours syntax and conditional restrictions is quite expressive. Ian. On 7 May 2013 14:01, Li Xia lisxia1...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Mappers, Gates in many regional, state reserves or national parks have seasonal access. There's no official tag for this in the OSM wiki, right now options are access=yes or no If someone knows of the accepted way seasonal access should be tagged, that would great, Alternative, i'm proposing the access=seasonal tag. Li. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
[talk-au] Major 4WD tracks
Hi Mappers, Is there a tag that's officially recognised that can be used to highlight major 4WD tracks. Similar tags for hiking, cycling existing under route:xx Li. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
[talk-au] Offline OSM vector map engine for iOS
Gday mappers, I'm Li from Mud Map. We've just launched Mud Map 2, an iOS app that includes a OSM based vector map engine that works completely offline. It's been developed with a focus on outdoor recreational use, for example 4WDing, touring, hiking etc. Being vector, map data is fairly compact in size so the app has the whole of Australia. If you are interested in trying out Mud Map 2, I have a few promo codes here to give out. Li. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
[talk-au] Gates and access
Hi Mappers, Gates in many regional, state reserves or national parks have seasonal access. There's no official tag for this in the OSM wiki, right now options are access=yes or no If someone knows of the accepted way seasonal access should be tagged, that would great, Alternative, i'm proposing the access=seasonal tag. Li. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Talk-au Digest, Vol 66, Issue 16
Hey Russell, At the node where the way changes traversibility, split the way into 2. Then tag each way with the appropriate tag. Li. On 16/12/2012, at 11:00 PM, talk-au-requ...@openstreetmap.org wrote: Send Talk-au mailing list submissions to talk-au@openstreetmap.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to talk-au-requ...@openstreetmap.org You can reach the person managing the list at talk-au-ow...@openstreetmap.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than Re: Contents of Talk-au digest... Today's Topics: 1. Re: Tagging dirt and 4x4 roads - new approach (Russell Edwards) 2. Re: Tagging dirt and 4x4 roads - new approach (David Bannon) -- Message: 1 Date: Sun, 16 Dec 2012 17:50:05 +1100 From: Russell Edwards russ...@edwds.net To: talk-au@openstreetmap.org talk-au@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [talk-au] Tagging dirt and 4x4 roads - new approach Message-ID: 50cd6f1d.9030...@edwds.net Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Could I ask a newbie question on this topic? I want to update some roads that are 4wd-only in certain sections. Any new approach aside, what is the best way to do this -- a) what tag do I use, and b) how do I handle the changing traversibility - separate ways linked as a route, or... ? Thanks in advance Russell -- Message: 2 Date: Sun, 16 Dec 2012 21:12:09 +1100 From: David Bannon dban...@internode.on.net To: Russell Edwards russ...@edwds.net Cc: talk-au@openstreetmap.org talk-au@openstreetmap.org Subject: Re: [talk-au] Tagging dirt and 4x4 roads - new approach Message-ID: 1355652729.8562.26.camel@Davo-LT Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Hi Russell, maybe you have followed the conversation ? If so, you will see that I think we do need a new approach but are unlikely to get it 'approved' ? Oh well, won't be the first fight I have lost ! So, the fall back is really as now doc'ed on the Australian Tagging Guidelines. Use 4wd_only if its a 4x4 road, officially the only option is 'yes' but I recommend people also use 'recommended' in cases where its marginal. And 'extreme' for the really wild cases. Note that your efforts will not appear distinctively on (eg) the main slippery map on the OSM website. I have opened a ticket with the map maintainers but no answer yet. Hmm... All roads should have highway=[track, unclassified, tertiary, etc] and source=survey and surface=unpaved. I'd also consider using tracktype= but note that it will only be rendered differently if highway=track. And, to make it worse, the roughest (ie the most fun) track is officially grade5. As defined, that might be OK in England, pretty silly in Oz. If you use grade6, grade7 and grade8 the OSM maps will show the track as a grade3, thats potentially dangerous but really the correct thing to do. Sigh . The best way to handle changing conditions down the length of a road (IMHO) is to break the road up into ways that have similar characteristics and join them using merged nodes. That is, don't merge the ways into one way. It does not make sense to have sections that cannot be accessed externally if you see what I mean ? Any discrete section should be labeled with the worse case bit. Hope this helps. And I hope you had a great time collecting that data ! David On Sun, 2012-12-16 at 17:50 +1100, Russell Edwards wrote: Could I ask a newbie question on this topic? I want to update some roads that are 4wd-only in certain sections. Any new approach aside, what is the best way to do this -- a) what tag do I use, and b) how do I handle the changing traversibility - separate ways linked as a route, or... ? Thanks in advance Russell ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au -- ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au End of Talk-au Digest, Vol 66, Issue 16 *** ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] 4WD only tags
Hi David, Here is an example of why the grading combined with 4WD_only tags may not work in conjunction in rendering. let's say all 4WD tracks are rendered using dotted lines (very common on raster maps and widely adopted). What happens when it already 4wd_only=yes but it's also tagged as grade 6? Which tag should take priority? Isn't 4wd_only=yes and 4WD recommended some what contradicting? Li. On 07/11/2012, at 8:20 PM, David Bannon wrote: Hello Li what happens when a track is tagged with 4wd_only=yes and grade=6? Technically I'd see no issue having both those key combos present. In practice not good in that one must be wrong but that won't upset OSM. In the mainstream maps, the way should be rendered according to grade6. The renderers already recognise tracktype so its relatively easy to extend to grades 6, 7 and 8. The renderers don't observe 4wd_only and sadly probably won't. But other applications will still be free to note one or the other of course. How they cope if they actually observe both and note the conflict I guess is up to the app it self. David On Tue, 2012-11-06 at 23:32 +1100, Li Xia wrote: Hi David, Just scanned your personal page quickly while i had spare time so sorry up front if i missed anything. A quick comment on the proposed grading. According to your proposal of tagging grades 6-8, what happens when a track is tagged with 4wd_only=yes and grade=6? Li. On 06/11/2012, at 2:23 PM, David Bannon wrote: OK Li, you ask and you shall receive ! Here http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Davo#Draft_4x4_road_proposal is my very early draft. You and everyone else is welcome to get stuck into it, I am not thin skinned ! The OSM proposal page says to to be verbose, no one need tell me to be verbose ! So if its too long, please indicate what needs removing. And obviously, error and omissions I am quite unhappy that it really ends up undercutting the 4wd_only tag, they can coexist but I wonder if they will if this is successful. Its a shame really, I like 4wd_only and have used it but as I developed my arguments it became clear to me that we need a finer grain and its probably easier to add levels to tracktype than it is to 4wd_only. And it will be easier to get these levels rendered if we go for tracktype. David David On Mon, 2012-11-05 at 17:28 +1100, Li Xia wrote: No probs david, and you'll be getting plenty of input from me, watch out ;-) A draft would be great. Let me know when it's ready to review. Li. On 05/11/2012, at 9:10 AM, David Bannon wrote: Thanks Li, I have not put that proposal up yet, waiting on a response to a related matter. Soon. And when I do, I'll not be wanting just your vote, it will be your input I will really need ! Maybe I should put a draft up on my personal page while we wait ? David - Original Message - From: Li Xia lisxia1...@gmail.com To: David Bannon dban...@internode.on.net Cc: OSM Australian Talk List talk-au@openstreetmap.org Sent: Sun, 4 Nov 2012 20:37:52 +1100 Subject: Re: 4WD only tags Hi David, although my opinion is that most render's try to simplify the the stylesheet so the map for ease of comprehension and would not make use of these additional attributes, I see your point and agree that it's useful data to have. Since my company focuses on 4WD maps and navigation, we will certainly take full advantage of this. BTW, do you have the link to the proposal page? Will go and cast a vote. Li. On 04/11/2012, at 2:41 PM, David Bannon wrote: Li, I beg to differ. While I agree that grading of a 4x4 track is subjective, so is much of the other data in the OSM database. Must be that way. The real issue is how important the data is. As I have mentioned, I am concerned that maps are being rendered that ignore this data. Routing engines are potentially sending people down roads that they, and their vehicles are ill suited to. Bad things will definitely happen. The routing people are saying but these tags don't even show on the OSM maps, why should we worry ?. And as to subjective, while there will always be borderline cases, I don't think it would be too hard to divide tracks up into - * 4x4 recommended - you will might be OK in a conventional car or (better still) an SUV but you have been warned. * 4x4 required - you really need a stock 4x4, a real one with (eg) low ratio. * 4x4 extreme - this is for the death or glory boys
Re: [talk-au] 4WD only tags
Hi David, Just scanned your personal page quickly while i had spare time so sorry up front if i missed anything. A quick comment on the proposed grading. According to your proposal of tagging grades 6-8, what happens when a track is tagged with 4wd_only=yes and grade=6? Li. On 06/11/2012, at 2:23 PM, David Bannon wrote: OK Li, you ask and you shall receive ! Here http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/User:Davo#Draft_4x4_road_proposal is my very early draft. You and everyone else is welcome to get stuck into it, I am not thin skinned ! The OSM proposal page says to to be verbose, no one need tell me to be verbose ! So if its too long, please indicate what needs removing. And obviously, error and omissions I am quite unhappy that it really ends up undercutting the 4wd_only tag, they can coexist but I wonder if they will if this is successful. Its a shame really, I like 4wd_only and have used it but as I developed my arguments it became clear to me that we need a finer grain and its probably easier to add levels to tracktype than it is to 4wd_only. And it will be easier to get these levels rendered if we go for tracktype. David David On Mon, 2012-11-05 at 17:28 +1100, Li Xia wrote: No probs david, and you'll be getting plenty of input from me, watch out ;-) A draft would be great. Let me know when it's ready to review. Li. On 05/11/2012, at 9:10 AM, David Bannon wrote: Thanks Li, I have not put that proposal up yet, waiting on a response to a related matter. Soon. And when I do, I'll not be wanting just your vote, it will be your input I will really need ! Maybe I should put a draft up on my personal page while we wait ? David - Original Message - From: Li Xia lisxia1...@gmail.com To: David Bannon dban...@internode.on.net Cc: OSM Australian Talk List talk-au@openstreetmap.org Sent: Sun, 4 Nov 2012 20:37:52 +1100 Subject: Re: 4WD only tags Hi David, although my opinion is that most render's try to simplify the the stylesheet so the map for ease of comprehension and would not make use of these additional attributes, I see your point and agree that it's useful data to have. Since my company focuses on 4WD maps and navigation, we will certainly take full advantage of this. BTW, do you have the link to the proposal page? Will go and cast a vote. Li. On 04/11/2012, at 2:41 PM, David Bannon wrote: Li, I beg to differ. While I agree that grading of a 4x4 track is subjective, so is much of the other data in the OSM database. Must be that way. The real issue is how important the data is. As I have mentioned, I am concerned that maps are being rendered that ignore this data. Routing engines are potentially sending people down roads that they, and their vehicles are ill suited to. Bad things will definitely happen. The routing people are saying but these tags don't even show on the OSM maps, why should we worry ?. And as to subjective, while there will always be borderline cases, I don't think it would be too hard to divide tracks up into - * 4x4 recommended - you will might be OK in a conventional car or (better still) an SUV but you have been warned. * 4x4 required - you really need a stock 4x4, a real one with (eg) low ratio. * 4x4 extreme - this is for the death or glory boys, they need experience and modified vehicles. This is a recent addition ! I am pretty sure that if you and I spent a couple of weeks having some driving fun, we'd agree on the vast majority of the tracks we graded. David - Original Message - From: Li Xia lisxia1...@gmail.com To: David Bannon dban...@internode.on.net Cc: OSM Australian Talk List talk-au@openstreetmap.org Sent: Sun, 4 Nov 2012 13:08:22 +1100 Subject: 4WD only tags Hi David, just my 2 cents on 4WD_only tags. By adding a 4x4 recommended tag will add to the complexity because it's kind of subjective as to which roads/tracks are traversable in a 2WD vehicle
Re: [talk-au] 4WD only tags
Hi David, although my opinion is that most render's try to simplify the the stylesheet so the map for ease of comprehension and would not make use of these additional attributes, I see your point and agree that it's useful data to have. Since my company focuses on 4WD maps and navigation, we will certainly take full advantage of this. BTW, do you have the link to the proposal page? Will go and cast a vote. Li. On 04/11/2012, at 2:41 PM, David Bannon wrote: Li, I beg to differ. While I agree that grading of a 4x4 track is subjective, so is much of the other data in the OSM database. Must be that way. The real issue is how important the data is. As I have mentioned, I am concerned that maps are being rendered that ignore this data. Routing engines are potentially sending people down roads that they, and their vehicles are ill suited to. Bad things will definitely happen. The routing people are saying but these tags don't even show on the OSM maps, why should we worry ?. And as to subjective, while there will always be borderline cases, I don't think it would be too hard to divide tracks up into - * 4x4 recommended - you will might be OK in a conventional car or (better still) an SUV but you have been warned. * 4x4 required - you really need a stock 4x4, a real one with (eg) low ratio. * 4x4 extreme - this is for the death or glory boys, they need experience and modified vehicles. This is a recent addition ! I am pretty sure that if you and I spent a couple of weeks having some driving fun, we'd agree on the vast majority of the tracks we graded. David - Original Message - From: Li Xia lisxia1...@gmail.com To: David Bannon dban...@internode.on.net Cc: OSM Australian Talk List talk-au@openstreetmap.org Sent: Sun, 4 Nov 2012 13:08:22 +1100 Subject: 4WD only tags Hi David, just my 2 cents on 4WD_only tags. By adding a 4x4 recommended tag will add to the complexity because it's kind of subjective as to which roads/tracks are traversable in a 2WD vehicle, therefor adding another option for this key will further complicate the issue. Li. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] 4WD only tags
No probs david, and you'll be getting plenty of input from me, watch out ;-) A draft would be great. Let me know when it's ready to review. Li. On 05/11/2012, at 9:10 AM, David Bannon wrote: Thanks Li, I have not put that proposal up yet, waiting on a response to a related matter. Soon. And when I do, I'll not be wanting just your vote, it will be your input I will really need ! Maybe I should put a draft up on my personal page while we wait ? David - Original Message - From: Li Xia lisxia1...@gmail.com To: David Bannon dban...@internode.on.net Cc: OSM Australian Talk List talk-au@openstreetmap.org Sent: Sun, 4 Nov 2012 20:37:52 +1100 Subject: Re: 4WD only tags Hi David, although my opinion is that most render's try to simplify the the stylesheet so the map for ease of comprehension and would not make use of these additional attributes, I see your point and agree that it's useful data to have. Since my company focuses on 4WD maps and navigation, we will certainly take full advantage of this. BTW, do you have the link to the proposal page? Will go and cast a vote. Li. On 04/11/2012, at 2:41 PM, David Bannon wrote: Li, I beg to differ. While I agree that grading of a 4x4 track is subjective, so is much of the other data in the OSM database. Must be that way. The real issue is how important the data is. As I have mentioned, I am concerned that maps are being rendered that ignore this data. Routing engines are potentially sending people down roads that they, and their vehicles are ill suited to. Bad things will definitely happen. The routing people are saying but these tags don't even show on the OSM maps, why should we worry ?. And as to subjective, while there will always be borderline cases, I don't think it would be too hard to divide tracks up into - * 4x4 recommended - you will might be OK in a conventional car or (better still) an SUV but you have been warned. * 4x4 required - you really need a stock 4x4, a real one with (eg) low ratio. * 4x4 extreme - this is for the death or glory boys, they need experience and modified vehicles. This is a recent addition ! I am pretty sure that if you and I spent a couple of weeks having some driving fun, we'd agree on the vast majority of the tracks we graded. David - Original Message - From: Li Xia lisxia1...@gmail.com To: David Bannon dban...@internode.on.net Cc: OSM Australian Talk List talk-au@openstreetmap.org Sent: Sun, 4 Nov 2012 13:08:22 +1100 Subject: 4WD only tags Hi David, just my 2 cents on 4WD_only tags. By adding a 4x4 recommended tag will add to the complexity because it's kind of subjective as to which roads/tracks are traversable in a 2WD vehicle, therefor adding another option for this key will further complicate the issue. Li. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
[talk-au] 4WD only tags
Hi David, just my 2 cents on 4WD_only tags. By adding a 4x4 recommended tag will add to the complexity because it's kind of subjective as to which roads/tracks are traversable in a 2WD vehicle, therefor adding another option for this key will further complicate the issue. Li. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Optimising map rendering for recreational use
Hey Ben and others, Yep, spot on, rendering hints but only related to zoom levels. I realise that it's matter of opinion what roads to be rendered at what levels etc and why rendering hints are not considered factual data and not preferred. Changing the road classification is an option but are likely to cause side effects. For example, tagging what is a territory road as a primary so that it will be rendered earlier on in the zoom level has the potential of polluting the data, making it less useful for other purposes such as routing etc. Another positive of the rendering hints approach is that the tags themselves are completely optional so it's up to the rendering engine to take advantage of them. If ignored, it's like they Also these tags are only really needed in more regional / outback areas, such as the Great central rd, Tanami track, French line etc so it's lightweight and won't add much size to the database. I plan to start a new project for mapping off road and regional areas of Australia and these rendering hints will certainly make a huge difference in rendering. There are already quiet a few of interested in this project and was planning to start a new project page on the Aus Wiki to coordinate this effort. We were hoping to include the rendering tags among the guild line and hope you guys agree. Li On 01/11/2012, at 3:31 PM, Ben Kelley wrote: Hi. I think tagging for the renderer is a bad idea. Essentially you are talking more about render hints, but I think that becomes a matter of preference pretty fast. Especially when OSM data can be rendered in a number of ways. I think it is worth considering what about a road makes you want to render it as a different type of road. - Ben Kelley. On Nov 1, 2012 3:01 PM, Li Xia lisxia1...@gmail.com wrote: Hey everyone, have an idea about map rendering and want to get your thoughts. One of the challenges is in rendering a useful map for recreational use is displaying roads, tracks, trails and to some degree water lines at appropriate zoom levels in more remote regions where the density is lower compared with urban regions. In my opinion, most map service online services or offline vector engine experience the same issue. Here are some illustrations of the issue, by comparing Google / OSM / Raster map of the same region: Google OSM Raster map As you can clearly see, at that zoom level, there's no deal on either OSM or Google maps, where as the raster map is useful. yes you can zoom in on Google or OSM, but with a smaller viewing port, orientation is more difficult and you loose that overview which is try handy for trip planning. By using a tag specific for rendering purposes, this issue can be overcome. Rendering engines can take advantage of these tags to optimise rendering of various regions. The tags are fairly self explanatory. By tagging a road with render_as:trunk, this feature can be rendered at the same zoom level as a trench road. Each class of road will have it's own tag so if a highway:territory should be rendered at the same zoom level as a primary, then tag render_as:tertiary. What do you guys think? Cheers Li. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Optimising map rendering for recreational use
Hi John, Why would it be limited to just 1 purpose? Any rendering engine can take advantage of these hints? Li. On 01/11/2012, at 5:11 PM, John Smith wrote: On 1 November 2012 15:01, Li Xia lisxia1...@gmail.com wrote: What do you guys think? what you are really after is a custom rendering that suits your purpose, it's not the easiest of things to do, but it's not rocket science either there is a number of people on this list that would be able to help you ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Optimising map rendering for recreational use
Thanks for the suggestions, I couldn't agree more for static rendering. However this approach has some massive draw backs in terms of performance. Any suggestions in this region? Li. On 01/11/2012, at 5:13 PM, Daniel O'Connor wrote: What do you guys think? It's non trivial to do it this way, but: Define a relationship between zoom level and number of ways/nodes within the bounding box Sort the ways in a weighted fashion - roads first, land boundaries second, etc Zoom level max, with 10 nodes to render: well, that should likely render everything Zoom level max - 1 with 1 billion nodes to render - roads only To actually set up the balance between zoom and what to render would be hard, but I think that's a better approach than render hints. Alternatively, after implementing it, you could add a 'render weighting/interest' attribute to a lot of ways, which would be like a render hint but also suitable for other purposes - ie: routing or search. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Optimising map rendering for recreational use
Importance is of most interest. In regional areas where density is much lower, rendering lower class roads earlier on in the zoom level would improve the usability of the map much more. Li. On 01/11/2012, at 5:32 PM, Ben Kelley wrote: You can change how mapnik renders by defining different styles for different zooms. Essentially with render hints you are saying that you would like this way to look like a different type of way. If this does not map to some verifiable attribute of the way then it becomes your preference. Presumably there is something about the road that leads you to want it to look differently. Why not tag the physical (and verifyable) thing that is different, and change your style definition when you render it? Is it the surface? The importance? The width? The destination? - Ben. On Nov 1, 2012 5:13 PM, Daniel O'Connor daniel.ocon...@gmail.com wrote: What do you guys think? It's non trivial to do it this way, but: Define a relationship between zoom level and number of ways/nodes within the bounding box Sort the ways in a weighted fashion - roads first, land boundaries second, etc Zoom level max, with 10 nodes to render: well, that should likely render everything Zoom level max - 1 with 1 billion nodes to render - roads only To actually set up the balance between zoom and what to render would be hard, but I think that's a better approach than render hints. Alternatively, after implementing it, you could add a 'render weighting/interest' attribute to a lot of ways, which would be like a render hint but also suitable for other purposes - ie: routing or search. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
[talk-au] Rendering hint suggestions
Hey Stephen, Appreciate the suggestions, I also thought about doing something similar to the idea of utilising density. The issue is one of performance, and sorting data no the fly is an expensive operation. Right now, data is sorted at compile time and stored in tiles based on the number of nodes, therefor each tile has very similar node count. Li. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
[talk-au] Offline iOS rendering engine
Hey guys, Since we are on the topic of rendering, I should explain my background. I'm the Founder of Mud Map and we develop iOS app for outdoor recreational navigation, 4wd, hiking etcs. We've been working on a offline rendering engine for a while now and it works well with OSM data. Would you guys be interested in having a look and possibly because a beta tester? Your feedback would be much appreciated. Li. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Optimising map rendering for recreational use
Hi John, Why would it be limited to just 1 purpose? Any rendering engine can take advantage of these hints? On 01/11/2012, at 5:11 PM, John Smith wrote: On 1 November 2012 15:01, Li Xia lisxia1...@gmail.com wrote: What do you guys think? what you are really after is a custom rendering that suits your purpose, it's not the easiest of things to do, but it's not rocket science either there is a number of people on this list that would be able to help you ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Optimising map rendering for recreational use
Thanks for the suggestions, I couldn't agree more for static rendering. However this approach has some massive draw backs in terms of performance. Another idea was using routes to define the importance, what do you guys think about this approach? Li. On 01/11/2012, at 5:13 PM, Daniel O'Connor wrote: What do you guys think? It's non trivial to do it this way, but: Define a relationship between zoom level and number of ways/nodes within the bounding box Sort the ways in a weighted fashion - roads first, land boundaries second, etc Zoom level max, with 10 nodes to render: well, that should likely render everything Zoom level max - 1 with 1 billion nodes to render - roads only To actually set up the balance between zoom and what to render would be hard, but I think that's a better approach than render hints. Alternatively, after implementing it, you could add a 'render weighting/interest' attribute to a lot of ways, which would be like a render hint but also suitable for other purposes - ie: routing or search. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Optimising map rendering for recreational use
Importance is of most interest. In regional areas where density is much lower, rendering lower class roads earlier on in the zoom level would improve the usability of the map much more. Li. On 01/11/2012, at 5:32 PM, Ben Kelley wrote: You can change how mapnik renders by defining different styles for different zooms. Essentially with render hints you are saying that you would like this way to look like a different type of way. If this does not map to some verifiable attribute of the way then it becomes your preference. Presumably there is something about the road that leads you to want it to look differently. Why not tag the physical (and verifyable) thing that is different, and change your style definition when you render it? Is it the surface? The importance? The width? The destination? - Ben. On Nov 1, 2012 5:13 PM, Daniel O'Connor daniel.ocon...@gmail.com wrote: What do you guys think? It's non trivial to do it this way, but: Define a relationship between zoom level and number of ways/nodes within the bounding box Sort the ways in a weighted fashion - roads first, land boundaries second, etc Zoom level max, with 10 nodes to render: well, that should likely render everything Zoom level max - 1 with 1 billion nodes to render - roads only To actually set up the balance between zoom and what to render would be hard, but I think that's a better approach than render hints. Alternatively, after implementing it, you could add a 'render weighting/interest' attribute to a lot of ways, which would be like a render hint but also suitable for other purposes - ie: routing or search. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
Re: [talk-au] Rendering hint suggestions
Other than skobbler, which is more for turn by turn, i've never seen anything that can render a regional map to the standard we are chasing. Nodes are already been reduced dynamically by marking each node at compile time with a level of importance. Issue isn't reducing nodes, it's more related to at which zoom level each road class is been rendered. Issues lies in the difference in density. A config that works well for metro areas doesn't work in regional areas. Li. On 01/11/2012, at 7:46 PM, John Smith wrote: On 1 November 2012 19:32, Li Xia lisxia1...@gmail.com wrote: The issue is one of performance, and sorting data no the fly is an expensive operation. there is already apps that do off line rendering, they pre-process data, and usually drop the number of nodes to 1/10th etc ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
[talk-au] Optimising map rendering for recreational use
Hey everyone, have an idea about map rendering and want to get your thoughts. One of the challenges is in rendering a useful map for recreational use is displaying roads, tracks, trails and to some degree water lines at appropriate zoom levels in more remote regions where the density is lower compared with urban regions. In my opinion, most map service online services or offline vector engine experience the same issue. Here are some illustrations of the issue, by comparing Google / OSM / Raster map of the same region: Google OSM Raster map As you can clearly see, at that zoom level, there's no deal on either OSM or Google maps, where as the raster map is useful. yes you can zoom in on Google or OSM, but with a smaller viewing port, orientation is more difficult and you loose that overview which is try handy for trip planning. By using a tag specific for rendering purposes, this issue can be overcome. Rendering engines can take advantage of these tags to optimise rendering of various regions. The tags are fairly self explanatory. By tagging a road with render_as:trunk, this feature can be rendered at the same zoom level as a trench road. Each class of road will have it's own tag so if a highway:territory should be rendered at the same zoom level as a primary, then tag render_as:tertiary. What do you guys think? Cheers Li. ___ Talk-au mailing list Talk-au@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-au
