Re: [OSM-talk] [OSM-newbies] avoid repeating the name tag twice
Hi,
I think that is OK. It is at least how I am mapping in similar cases.
regards
Nick Black wrote:
Hi Guys,
Was there an agreed answer to this issue.
I want to tag an address in Kyiv using both the English and Ukrainian
street names.
Sounds like I can do:
addr:street:en:Tereschenkivska Street
and
addr:street:ua:Терещнкіівська
Is this best practice?
On Mon, Mar 16, 2009 at 3:01 PM, Ben Laenen benlae...@gmail.com
mailto:benlae...@gmail.com wrote:
On Sunday 15 March 2009, Tal wrote:
name:local_lang=fr - nl is indeed an interesting idea, that I
haven't thought of.
However, I ask myself if it's flexible enough.
It seems that for just a little more coding you get the much more
flexible {name:fr} - {name:nl} (with special escape combinations
\\, \{, \} ).
I think that mappers from Brussels and also other parts of the word
with strings comprised from two languages should add there insights.
Do they care about this problem? Are they willing to use such a
solution?
Only if it's actually rendering both names, and only if it applies to an
area that automatically adds the local_lang=fr;nl tag to all objects
inside its boundaries (it's just a bad idea to tag every object with
what it's local language is, you can override with a tag on the object
itself if it's different).
I wouldn't do local_lang=fr - nl as the separator can always vary for
the same object (you could have a dash, or a newline or just a space, a
slash or a bullet or whatever), depending on what the person making the
maps likes most.
But given the complexity of handling boundaries to add tags to the
objects I think we'll be doing name=Dutch name - French
name, name:nl=Dutch name, name:fr=French name in Brussels for a
long time to come.
Greetings
Ben
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Re: [OSM-talk] Rough Tracks
Hi, I used grade5 or grade4 in this case, depending how bad the whole is. The surface has been inserted far later and seems me redundant and less usable for routing with weighting. regards Pierre-André kaerast wrote: Claudius wrote: Down-grade them to grade4 or grade5. It's not your job to fix the router's routing in the data. The wiki suggests that the track grades are for surface type rather than usability. Yet there does also exist surface=* so I'm not sure. The grades sound like they should be based on how usable or how clear the track is. If setting them to grade5 is going to make people and software think they aren't very usable then that seems to be the solution, even though it seems a bit kludgy to me. ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [OSM-newbies] avoid repeating the name tag twice
Hi
1) This proposal will not help the Brussels map, where a similar need exists.
In Brussels they want the default map to show street names in France and
Dutch.
see
http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=50.77218lon=4.38126zoom=15layers=B000FTTT
for
a road with these tags:
name=Avenue de la Sapinière - Denneboslaan --- could be
{name:fr} - {name:nl}
name:fr=Avenue de la Sapinière
name:nl=Denneboslaan
A possibility would be to tag the language like: name:local_lang=fr - nl
where the separator is the one that has to be used for the
representation. (iso-codes are known, the rest is spearator)
2) Sometime an object (node/way/relation) contains more then one
translatable tag.
For example, a house address is a node with
addr:housenumber=12Alef- translatable
addr:street=Herzel - translatable
addr:city=Tel-Aviv - translatable
addr:country=IL
addr:full=- translatable
building=yes
name=Azrieli Shopping Mall - translatable
Do we want to add a single a tag for each translatable tag:
addr:housenumber:lang=de
addr:street:lang=de
addr:citylang=de
addr:full:lang=de
name:lang=de
or do we want a single tag to indicate the text labels for the entire
node/way/relation?
Aaargh
Ok I think the local language(s) is (are) the same for all description
of a node/way/relation. Then I think we should introduce a new tag, like
local_lang=xx and then tag name:xx=Germany addr:city:en=Tel-Aviv and
so on...
what do you think about it??
best regards
paj
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Re: [OSM-talk] [OSM-newbies] avoid repeating the name tag twice
Hi, sorry, I have been of for some days.. What Pierre-André has suggested though, seems to be different to name in that rather than having name:local contain the name, what he's actually suggesting is that the value of name:local refers to the local language, perhaps better named as name:local_lang, so that for Germany there would be, for example, the following tags... place=country name:de=Deutschland name:en=Germany name:fr=Allemagne name:ja=ドイツ name:th=ประเทศเยอรมนี name:zh=德国 name:local=de Many things actually have names in more than one language on the map... Country names, city names, and in some parts of the world, virtually every named object have multiple language names... Thanks, you explain it better than me. I agree with you proposition name:local_lang would be better suited. How could we push this proposition further? This is strictly spoken not a new tag. Simply add a remark on the wiki-page or start a submission process? regards paj ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Multilingual map
Hi, great stuff... With my first go a couple of weeks back for 8 languages I did do fallback to at least 'name' using views as suggested on the wiki, setting this up for 40 languages however was somewhat less trivial and I felt that there would be a benefit to being able to display languages with no fallback... I think, here would a feature like name:local_lang=de, name:de=Deutschland be very useful. This would also help in order to have a map done in a chosen language, without blanks in the country (countries) where this language is the default value. paj ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] Multilingual map
With my first go a couple of weeks back for 8 languages I did do fallback to at least 'name' using views as suggested on the wiki, setting this up for 40 languages however was somewhat less trivial and I felt that there would be a benefit to being able to display languages with no fallback... I think, here would a feature like name:local_lang=de, name:de=Deutschland be very useful. This would also help in order to have a map done in a chosen language, without blanks in the country (countries) where this language is the default value. paj But does it really make sense to tag every object inside a country with the same name:local_lang tag? Talk about data duplication... It depends... in Switzerland, you will have at least the following 4 elements that will appear: name:local_lang=de name:local_lang=fr name:local_lang=it name:local_lang=roh (using ISO 639-3) Romansh is the 4th national language, (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romansh_language for more) Some administrative entites are of one language (like Genevae using French) other are using two or more languages within their boundaries. I even know a town where Quarters at the West part are named in French, and those of the East part are in German and so used locally. (despite having on both side a name in both languages)... regards ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] [OSM-newbies] avoid repeating the name tag twice
[...] Hi, In Israel we try to tag all names with name,name:he,name:en, and we put the same value in name and name:he. For example: name=1234 name:he=1234 name:en=abcd Is there a feature recognized by the renderer software packages that allows me to write something like this: name=$(name:he) name:he=1234 name:en=abcd [] Hebrew is my native language, and as far as I'm concerned the whole world can and should be mapped exclusively using the Hebrew alphabet ;) (und auch natuerlich ein bisschen Deutsch, die auch eine schoene sprache ist) As I see it, using the name tag is simply asking for trouble, and one need to seek a coherent and complete solution, which the name:lang system offer. I would, however, like to set a default language to the renderer using name=$(name:he) or something equivalent, for the default international map on the osm site. I am not aware of such a feature for the current tools. I fear a problem could be that $(name:he) is also a valid name somewhere else in the world (with an other font than Latin...) A possibility would be to never use name=, but only name:XX= and have a tag name:local=XX in order to indicate which is the local one. For rendering, a default rule could be that if there is only one name:XX=xxx without name:local=... then it will use the name:XX whatever XX is. I cross-posted to talk, if someone has other idea / better proposition. regards paj ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] OSM license change: A license to kill? - How to make a nightmare come true!
SteveC wrote: On 4 Mar 2009, at 23:42, Nop wrote: Hi! SteveC schrieb: To me this is similar to ignorance of the law is no defence. The data, people and facts are out there and it's not our job to serve them up to you in the specific best way you want. We will help all we can when you ask though. Thank your for bringing it down to this simple point. np Actually, it *IS* your job. That simple. You want a change. You want their consent. Your job. Well if you think about it you would want it too, right. Oh you're the guy who doesn't want to help.. I forgot. Sorry, I did not really cared about it. Could have been PD from the begin. Was a surprised by the announcement. Read the license and mails. Would probably have said yes. But I do not like the way this went on. The fact that those who want to change it just say you do not want to help. That's my free time, that's your's. If you think the change is important for the OSM, the better. If you want to do it, your right. But take the burden on you, inform people, ask opinions, and be aware that there are some that disagree, and some indifferent. I do not say you do not help because you do come here helping me mapping my remote place. Your sentences are only rude. F#@@# now I CARE. If I have to choose now, I will say NO. Not due to the license, just due to sarcastic, overstated comments. first last time I loose time on this subject until it is handled on a factual basis. regards ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
Re: [OSM-talk] amenity=vending_machine AND amenity=post_box: what about?
vegard a écrit : On Mon, Sep 08, 2008 at 06:40:59AM -0700, Karl Newman wrote: So personally I think duplicate keys would be the easiest and best way to tag such double-uses. Norbert Just make two different nodes, each located closest to the amenity concerned. There's nothing that makes it non-routable. It's just a Well - apart from the fact that it actually makes it difficult to render In many cases, the supermarket *is* the post-office, I agree fully with it. Here for example, at railways stations (let say middle class) you can buy train tickets (hopefully), but also book your travel or get some foreign money. At the same desk, deserved by the same person. I really have here 3 amenities as one point. The easy answer of some people map the world as it is... is here just too short. The fact that neither API 0.5 nor API 0.6 (will) support it is a good point for not using it. But not to forget to think about it ? Then in short, what is the process for API specifications inputs? :-) by the way: I just had a look at http://dev.openstreetmap.org/~kleptog/osm-0.5.dtd !ELEMENT node (tag*) !ATTLIST node id [...cut...] !ELEMENT tag EMPTY !ATTLIST tag k CDATA #REQUIRED !ATTLIST tag v CDATA #REQUIRED and from the current dtd definition, I could not see anything saying that it is forbidden to use twice the key amenity for a node or a way. Or did I missed something? best regards Pierre-André ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
