Re[2]: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-26 Thread NetVicious
viernes, 25 feb 2005 at 04:06, it seems you wrote:

> 2. samewise, each user should be able to configure TB! as if this user
> were to be the single TB! user. This means that configuration data, be
> it in the Registry or in an initialisation file, should also be stored
> under the current user area (either HK_CurrentUser, or under 'My
> Documents', for example). This means, for example, that one user can
> use BayesIt! while another user, on the same box, can use Bayes
> Filter.

I'm  with  you.  But  Ritlabs  it's  saying  they don't want to use de
Document&Settings folder.

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Re[3]: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-26 Thread NetVicious
jueves, 24 feb 2005 at 23:20, it seems you wrote:

> If you will notice that The Bat! will loose simplicity to install it, just 
> let me know!

Windows  programs prepared to run in multi-user environment should not
need  to  write in other folders different than Document&Settings/User
because  a  simple user could not have the needed rights to write into
Program Files folder.

Another  tip:  Why  you  not  allow  to  save into the backup file TB!
creates the registry keys it uses now?

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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-25 Thread Prezes
Hello,
Thursday, February 24, 2005, 10:05:13 PM, you wrote:

MM> I think that the path to the working directory should be the
MM> only value kept in the Registry. What do you think about it?

Or:

1. If exists The Bat!\MAIL directory (old way, preferable for users
which use TB from multiple machines) use this folder as working
folder.

2. If not exists search for working folder in registry.

Or you can swap 1 and 2 :-)

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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread hggdh

Hello NetVicious,

Thursday, February 24, 2005, 14:31:21, you wrote:

N> jueves, 24 feb 2005 at 20:28, it seems you wrote:

>> Currently, The Bat! keeps its files in two directories:
>> 1. The read-only program files in the "Program Files" folder
>> 2. The files that it modifies in the "MAIL Directory"

>> We don't like to make one additional directory besides the "MAIL
>> directory", we don't like to have three different directories.
N> Well  in  this  case, TB! should create or mark the ini files with the
N> Windows  username  it's  using the program. If you don't separate this
N> the different users of the program will have the same configurations

>> But if there is rationale for this third directory, please let us know.

N> The   old   ini   files  where  deprecated  with  the registry because
N> with  the old ini files each program had one only configuration. Later
N> in Win2000 M$ added the Documents&Settings folder.

N> I only said one think. Now with the registry each user could have it's
N> config. If TB! uses ini files if TB! don't marks or uses different ini
N> files  for  each user all the users of the computer will have the same
N> configuration, and if one user changes something the others users will
N> get also the same changes.

N> BsPlayer  (www.bsplayer.org)  uses xml files marked with the username.
N> Example:  BSPlayer.User1.xml  and BSPlayer.User2.xml. You could create
N> folders on mail folder or where you like for the user ini files.


Some things here:

0. the old .ini files were deprecated because every application put
them under the Windows system directory -- which, even at the
beginning (and I am talking about Windows 1.x here) was an atrociously
bad idea.

1. even if this is getting not to be common anymore, you can have many
users sharing a single Windows system. User-specific settings should
*by default* be saved under the current user system folder; the user
can be given an option to move it elsewhere. The reason here is a
simple one -- privacy.

2. samewise, each user should be able to configure TB! as if this user
were to be the single TB! user. This means that configuration data, be
it in the Registry or in an initialisation file, should also be stored
under the current user area (either HK_CurrentUser, or under 'My
Documents', for example). This means, for example, that one user can
use BayesIt! while another user, on the same box, can use Bayes
Filter.

3. Except for system settings, using the Registry just makes life a
lot more miserable for those of us that jump systems, or have to
rebuild them -- for whatever reason. On the other hand, for corporate
users that roam on a Domain, not having the settings under the
HK_CurrentUser will, of course, be a major pain.

4. And, on the other hand (that's the third hand for those of you that
did not count them) this is probably not a significant issue given
that the roaming user will still need to access the mail base
(probably on an altogether different computer that the one in use to
execute TB!).

So... right now, it is difficult to decide which way. I myself would
go off the Registry, no questions asked -- I simply hate the beast,
and the current abuse of what started as a good idea. My personal vote
is for XML-based initialisation files.

-- 

 ..hggdh..

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Re[7]: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Dennis Hays
Hello Goncalo,

Thursday, February 24, 2005, 7:11:31 PM, you wrote:


> In reply to  :

DH>> or store the short list of possible resolutions in an array and
DH>> update the variable (saved screen size) based on startup values.

> I like mine better! :) Kidding.
> I  guess  the  'short  list' can be quite different from video card to
> video card.

There is a set of resolution parameters that can be considered a set
of defaults:

800x600
1024x768
1280x1024
1600x1200

Quite a few video card manufacturers use these, but that's not to say
that there isn't some other sizes that could be set by the user. But
for talking points, consider the above to be 'built in' where by TB!
can test for resultion and apply the last known (saved) or use the
next resolution down. What's the worst? The user will get a window
occupying less than a whole screen--much like mine is now (I'm running
2560x1200 on a Matrox Dual Head).

Maybe yours is better :)

Dennis


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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Marcus Ohlström

On Thursday, February 24, 2005, 22:05, Maxim Masiutin wrote:

> I think that the path to the working directory should be the only
> value kept in the Registry. What do you think about it?

As long as you separate system locale settings from general settings (ie
windows sizes, server names etc from folder structure, editor
configuration etc) I for one does not care if you store the settings in
the registry or in files.

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Re[3]: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Goncalo Farias

In reply to  :


MM> Hello Krzysztof,

MM> Thursday, February 24, 2005, 00:10:21, you wrote:

>>>With  TB  right  now  it's very simple, just
>>>import  a previously-prepared .reg file.

MM> If  you will notice that The Bat! will loose simplicity to install
MM> it, just let me know!


Why  don't  you  make it users' choice? INI or Registry, the user will
name it! :)

Or  you could work with both and copy the registry settings to the INI
file.  Also,  you  could work with timestamps and use the most updated
(INI or REG). The import/export would work at start/close.

Probably you'll figure something much better...


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Re[6]: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Goncalo Farias

In reply to  :


DH> Quoting Maxim Masiutin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

>> That's a good idea! At least if the new resolution is less
>> than the old, we can ignore the saved coordinates.
>>

DH> or store the short list of possible resolutions in an array and
DH> update the variable (saved screen size) based on startup values.

I like mine better! :) Kidding.
I  guess  the  'short  list' can be quite different from video card to
video card.


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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Peter Palmreuther
Hello Martin,

On Thursday, February 24, 2005 at 11:59:01 PM Martin [MS] wrote:

>>> Why do you delete the registry tree first before importing the saved
>>> data? In my understanding everything is replaced if you import a whole
>>> tree. 
>> If you had deleted a key in the source it would not be deleted in
>> destination. As one seldom deletes registry keys in TB!-tree it
>> shouldn't make a different for this purpose, so Prezes simply applied
>> the "more general solution" to this "problem" :-)

MS> Are you sure about that?

Quite sure ...
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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Martin Sebald
Hi Peter!

>> Why do you delete the registry tree first before importing the saved
>> data? In my understanding everything is replaced if you import a whole
>> tree. 
> If you had deleted a key in the source it would not be deleted in
> destination. As one seldom deletes registry keys in TB!-tree it
> shouldn't make a different for this purpose, so Prezes simply applied
> the "more general solution" to this "problem" :-)

Are you sure about that? I'll have to check that. But sorry about this,
it's kinda offtopic here... ;-)

Regards,
Martin

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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Martin Sebald
Hello all,

I also would prefer having config files located somewhere in the data
directories of TB. As I already wrote here in the thread I often move TB
from one computer to another computer. Copying just one directory is much
easier than always exporting/importing registry trees.

By the way: My MAIL directory is located in the TB program directory. I use
TB since 1.6x and I think the default back there was the program direcory.
And to be honest, I like I that way. I really hate the "Documents and
Settings" directories. In my opinion user data has nothing to do on the
system disk or partition. I store everything I can on other drives to avoid
data loss. Being a M$ beta tester makes it necessary installing the OS new
all the time. I always go mad when I have to save stuff like Favorites and
registry settings plus stuff from "Documents and Settings".

Regards,
Martin

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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Peter Palmreuther
Hello Martin,

On Thursday, February 24, 2005 at 11:42:57 PM Martin [MS] wrote:

>> Yes, I also support this! I use The Bat! in 2 computers in my home and
>> if I do any change on one computer I must do it in second (export
>> registry branch, then delete registry branch in second computer, then
>> import exported branch). Please allow to not use registry at all :-)

MS> Why do you delete the registry tree first before importing the saved data?
MS> In my understanding everything is replaced if you import a whole tree.

If you had deleted a key in the source it would not be deleted in
destination. As one seldom deletes registry keys in TB!-tree it
shouldn't make a different for this purpose, so Prezes simply applied
the "more general solution" to this "problem" :-)
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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Martin Sebald
Hi Maxim!

> If you store screen coordinates in an INI file and move it to a
> computer with a display of different resolution, you will see a big mess!

Well, I do not have severe problems with different resolutions. I'm using
TB both on my client (1152x864) and on my laptop (1024x768) and moving the
installation all the time by copying the whole directory plus exporting /
importing the registry.

Works real good. No problems.

I have minor problems using TB via XP Remote Deskop. When the resolution is
reduced by Remote Desktop the folder listing on the left does sometimes
(only sometimes) not end at the bottom of the screen.

Regards,
Martin

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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Martin Sebald
Hi Prezes!

> Yes, I also support this! I use The Bat! in 2 computers in my home and
> if I do any change on one computer I must do it in second (export
> registry branch, then delete registry branch in second computer, then
> import exported branch). Please allow to not use registry at all :-)

Why do you delete the registry tree first before importing the saved data?
In my understanding everything is replaced if you import a whole tree. Or
am I wrong? Well, I also do have two installation and do it the same way
like you, exept deleting the registry tree on the target machine before
importing. Works fine for 2 years now.

Regards,
Martin

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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Krzysztof Trybowski
Hello Maxim,
On Thursday, February 24, 2005 you wrote:


> Hello Krzysztof,

> Thursday, February 24, 2005, 00:10:21, you wrote:

>>>With  TB  right  now  it's very simple, just
>>>import  a previously-prepared .reg file.
> If you will notice that The Bat! will loose simplicity to install it, just 
> let me know!

Okay  Max,  I'll  say  it  like this: you probably know how Windows 2k
domains  work, and how settings are propagated between computers there
(I  think  so,  judging  from  the  effort  you made to prepare an MSI
version  of installer, which is useful with active directory). So just
have  it  in  mind that many people -- being your target! -- are using
it.  You're  all  capable  developers,  I  hope  you  can make it in a
sensible way, like you've many times proved you can. Just don't forget
about these types of configurations. ;)

When the new version reaches a relatively stable beta-stage, I'll test
some  more,  since  now  it's  quite  an  abstractive speaking without
working on a real case :).

Regards,

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Re[2]: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Maxim Masiutin
Hello Krzysztof,

Thursday, February 24, 2005, 00:10:21, you wrote:

>>With  TB  right  now  it's very simple, just
>>import  a previously-prepared .reg file.
If you will notice that The Bat! will loose simplicity to install it, just let 
me know!

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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Krzysztof Trybowski
Hello Marek,
On Thursday, February 24, 2005 you wrote:

> Max, why is needed to use more places for storing configuration data,
> why is a problem to use INI files only? Look to Opera, I love it for
> this, whole configuration is stored in INI's.

This  is  more  or  less  the  source of serious pain to install it on
multiuser  environments.  With  TB  right  now  it's very simple, just
import  a previously-prepared .reg file. With Opera, you not only have
to prepare the configuration, but also copy it to various places, name
the  config  file in a specified manner and then wait longer while all
the  .ini  files  are  transferred  from  the  networked  profile. FYI
transferring  many  smaller  files takes much much more time, than one
bigger  file.  I  can  see  that  while  "recent  documents", cookies,
favorites  and "temporary internet files" grow on my profiles! This is
a  terrible solution! They should all be stored in registry or in big,
database-like  files.  Using all sorts of files for all sorts of small
parts  of  configuration  is  an  approach  that makes everything more
complicated and slower.

Gosh, how life would be simpler, if Opera just stored it's settings in
registry!  It  could  even  work on some of the configs I've seen. But
is't  not worth (in an economical POW) to work will all sorts of inis,
cfgs,  txts, xmls and other config files that all the authors in their
ingenuity  tend  to develop instead of just using a built in, fast and
working system of storing configuration.

Regards,

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Re: Re[4]: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Dennis Hays
Quoting Maxim Masiutin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

> Hello Goncalo,
>
> Thursday, February 24, 2005, 23:29:34, you wrote:
---snipped---
>...determine the percentage
> >>delta  (changes between resolutions) and reduce the screen
>> coordinates
>>just that much. What do you think?
>
> That's a good idea! At least if the new resolution is less
> than the old, we can ignore the saved coordinates.
>

or store the short list of possible resolutions in an array and
update the variable (saved screen size) based on startup values.

Dennis

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Re[4]: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread NetVicious
jueves, 24 feb 2005 at 22:29, it seems you wrote:

> You  could  store  the  resolution  for the stored screen coordinates,
> check,  at  start, the current resolution and determine the percentage
> delta  (changes between resolutions) and reduce the screen coordinates
> just that much. What do you think?

Sounds good!

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Re[4]: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Maxim Masiutin
Hello Goncalo,

Thursday, February 24, 2005, 23:29:34, you wrote:

>>You  could  store  the  resolution  for the stored screen coordinates,
>>check,  at  start, the current resolution and determine the percentage
>>delta  (changes between resolutions) and reduce the screen coordinates
>>just that much. What do you think?

That's a good idea! At least if the new resolution is less than the old, we can 
ignore the saved coordinates.

-- 
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Maxim Masiutinmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]



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Re[3]: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Goncalo Farias

In reply to  :


MM> Hello Marek,

MM> Thursday, February 24, 2005, 19:06:16, you wrote:

>>>Look to Opera, I love it for
>>>this, whole configuration is stored in INI's.

MM> If you store screen coordinates in an INI file and move it to
MM> a computer with a display of different resolution, you will see a
MM> big mess!

Just  the  same  if  you  change  the screen resolution in the machine
you're running TB!. How do you handle that today?

You  could  store  the  resolution  for the stored screen coordinates,
check,  at  start, the current resolution and determine the percentage
delta  (changes between resolutions) and reduce the screen coordinates
just that much. What do you think?

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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Roelof Otten
Hallo Maxim,

On Thu, 24 Feb 2005 23:05:13 +0200GMT (24-2-2005, 22:05 +0100, where I
live), you wrote:

>>>When you place the config file in the mail directory they'll have TB
>>>asking where to find the message base on every start.
MM> I think that the path to the working directory should be the
MM> only value kept in the Registry. What do you think about it?

I'd prefer a file in the program directory, but I'm not sure whether
that directory has write access for users with restricted rights.

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Re[2]: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Maxim Masiutin
Hello Roelof,

Thursday, February 24, 2005, 22:21:28, you wrote:

>>When you place the config file in the mail directory they'll have TB
>>asking where to find the message base on every start.

When The Bat! stores file names in some of the .INI configuration files, like 
tbplugin.ini, it uses the following 'macros' to make the paths flexible:

%WDIR% - the "MAIL" directory
%PROGRAMDIR% - the directory to where thebat.exe has been installed

It will support two more macros in the new version:

%APPDATA% - CurreUser's application data folder
%EXEDRIVE% - the drive on which thebat.exe resides


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Re[2]: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Maxim Masiutin
Hello Roelof,

Thursday, February 24, 2005, 22:21:28, you wrote:

>>When you place the config file in the mail directory they'll have TB
>>asking where to find the message base on every start.
I think that the path to the working directory should be the only value kept in 
the Registry. What do you think about it?

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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Alexander S. Kunz
Hello Roelof Otten & everyone else,

on 24-Feb-2005 at 21:21 you (Roelof Otten) wrote:

MM>> Currently, The Bat! keeps its files in two directories:
MM>> 1. The read-only program files in the "Program Files" folder

> That would be the logical place to store it. TB can always find its
> program directory, so it wouldn't be too hard to find the config file.

In that case it requires the username tagged to the config file name, or
inside the config, as NetVicious suggested.

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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Alexander S. Kunz
Hello NetVicious & everyone else,

on 24-Feb-2005 at 21:31 you (NetVicious) wrote:

> Well  in  this  case, TB! should create or mark the ini files with the
> Windows  username  it's  using the program. If you don't separate this
> the different users of the program will have the same configurations

But the MAIL directory defaults to "Documents & Settings/"
(/Application Data) ... there's the username. :-)

...anyone who tweaks the default setting will know what he/she does, I'd
say.

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Re[3]: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread NetVicious
jueves, 24 feb 2005 at 20:28, it seems you wrote:

> Currently, The Bat! keeps its files in two directories:
> 1. The read-only program files in the "Program Files" folder
> 2. The files that it modifies in the "MAIL Directory"

> We don't like to make one additional directory besides the "MAIL
> directory", we don't like to have three different directories.
Well  in  this  case, TB! should create or mark the ini files with the
Windows  username  it's  using the program. If you don't separate this
the different users of the program will have the same configurations

> But if there is rationale for this third directory, please let us know.

The   old   ini   files  where  deprecated  with  the registry because
with  the old ini files each program had one only configuration. Later
in Win2000 M$ added the Documents&Settings folder.

I only said one think. Now with the registry each user could have it's
config. If TB! uses ini files if TB! don't marks or uses different ini
files  for  each user all the users of the computer will have the same
configuration, and if one user changes something the others users will
get also the same changes.

BsPlayer  (www.bsplayer.org)  uses xml files marked with the username.
Example:  BSPlayer.User1.xml  and BSPlayer.User2.xml. You could create
folders on mail folder or where you like for the user ini files.

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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Roelof Otten
Hallo Maxim,

On Thu, 24 Feb 2005 21:28:27 +0200GMT (24-2-2005, 20:28 +0100, where I
live), you wrote:

>>>I suppose the file will be placed in Documents & Settings/User folder.
>>>Because  now  the  registry HKEY_CURRENT_USER makes the possibility to
>>>have different configurations for different users.
MM> We will store the files in the "MAIL Directory", which is
MM> currently by default in the Documents & Settings/User folder.

What about those unfortunate fools who (like me) don't have the mail
directory in the documents & settings/user folder, because they want
to share the mail between different profiles/users or because they
don't have such a directory (Win98 stuff etc) or because they'd like
to have their mail on removable media or a network drive.
When you place the config file in the mail directory they'll have TB
asking where to find the message base on every start.

MM> Currently, The Bat! keeps its files in two directories:
MM> 1. The read-only program files in the "Program Files" folder

That would be the logical place to store it. TB can always find its
program directory, so it wouldn't be too hard to find the config file.

-- 
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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Thomas Martin
Hello Max,

on Thursday, 24. February 2005, at 21:28:27 [GMT +0200] you wrote
regarding "Config: Registry -> File":

> We don't like to make one additional directory besides the "MAIL
> directory", we don't like to have three different directories.

good choice.

> But if there is rationale for this third directory, please let us know.

don't think so, that there is a reason.

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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Tony Brookes
Hello Maxim,

Thursday, February 24, 2005, 4:20:52 PM, you wrote:

> What kind of configuration data should we keep in registry and what should we 
> put into a file?

As others have already indicated, there is software out there that does not 
store any data in the registry. Virtual Access (mail and news client) does 
exactly this and copes with multiple accounts etc.

I am not technically literate when it comes to programming but don't really see 
the need to store configuration data in the registry, especially in a program 
like The Bat! where the users in this forum like to 'transport' their 
installations. Using ini files would make life considerably easier in that 
respect.

It would also make beta testing easier using ini files as you could run 
co-existing betas, just by running the exe for the beta which would load up 
configuration data from its own directory.

Just my thoughts ;-)

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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Prezes
Hello,
Thursday, February 24, 2005, 8:28:27 PM, you wrote:

MM> We don't like to make one additional directory besides the
MM> "MAIL directory", we don't like to have three different
MM> directories.

Yes, agreed!

MM> But if there is rationale for this third directory, please let us know.

No, this will be a nonsense :-)

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Re[2]: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Maxim Masiutin
Hello Netvicious,

Thursday, February 24, 2005, 21:14:10, you wrote:

>>I suppose the file will be placed in Documents & Settings/User folder.
>>Because  now  the  registry HKEY_CURRENT_USER makes the possibility to
>>have different configurations for different users.
We will store the files in the "MAIL Directory", which is currently by default 
in the Documents & Settings/User folder.

Currently, The Bat! keeps its files in two directories:
1. The read-only program files in the "Program Files" folder
2. The files that it modifies in the "MAIL Directory"

We don't like to make one additional directory besides the "MAIL directory", we 
don't like to have three different directories.

But if there is rationale for this third directory, please let us know.

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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Prezes
Hello,
Thursday, February 24, 2005, 8:01:09 PM, you wrote:

TB>  I'll agree with that. I like the idea of being able to run totally from a
TB>  USB stick or SD card like PocoPE.

So, maybe you will create new preferences tab with two columns:
registry and INI file. And user will be able to move items between
these two columns, so user will decide where store all things :-) This
will be the best way, but at least allow user to store all
informations in INI file :-)

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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Jernej Simoncic
On Thursday, February 24, 2005, 18:36:16, Maxim Masiutin wrote:

> If you store screen coordinates in an INI file and move it to a
> computer with a display of different resolution, you will see a big mess!

Always do a sanity check on all settings, whether they're stored in an INI
file, registry or some other custom format. If the coordinates point outside
of the screen, ignore them, and use default (or adjust them to current
screen).

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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Marcus Ohlström

On Thursday, February 24, 2005, 19:10, Alexander S. Kunz wrote:

>> There is a few annoyances though, one of them being that I every time
>> have to change my SMTP server. I do not use the same server when
>> travelling as I do at home, but the SMTP server setting seem to be
>> stored somewhere in the files I copy.

> You could solve that with xrayapp I think.

Yes, but that was not my point, my point was SMTP server should be
regarded as a system locale setting.

Thanks anyway.

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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread NetVicious
jueves, 24 feb 2005 at 17:20, it seems you wrote:

> What  kind of configuration data should we keep in registry and what
> should we put into a file?

I suppose the file will be placed in Documents & Settings/User folder.
Because  now  the  registry HKEY_CURRENT_USER makes the possibility to
have different configurations for different users.

In  this  case  I  think  all  should  be  placed  in files, excepting
window/position/column  sizes  because  it  should be a problem if the
resolution changes.

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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Tony Boom
Hello Prezes,

  A reminder of what Prezes on TBBETA typed on:
  24 February 2005 at 19:14:57 GMT +0100

P> Please allow to not use registry at al

 I'll agree with that. I like the idea of being able to run totally from a
 USB stick or SD card like PocoPE.


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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Prezes
Hello,
Thursday, February 24, 2005, 6:06:16 PM, you wrote:

MM> Max, why is needed to use more places for storing configuration data,
MM> why is a problem to use INI files only? Look to Opera, I love it for
MM> this, whole configuration is stored in INI's. Or Pocomail, AFAIK it
MM> stores everything in files too.

Yes, I also support this! I use The Bat! in 2 computers in my home and
if I do any change on one computer I must do it in second (export
registry branch, then delete registry branch in second computer, then
import exported branch). Please allow to not use registry at all :-)

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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Alexander S. Kunz
Hello Marcus Ohlström & everyone else,

on 24-Feb-2005 at 18:03 you (Marcus Ohlström) wrote:

> There is a few annoyances though, one of them being that I every time
> have to change my SMTP server. I do not use the same server when
> travelling as I do at home, but the SMTP server setting seem to be
> stored somewhere in the files I copy.

You could solve that with xrayapp I think.

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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Marck D Pearlstone
Dear Maxim,

@24-Feb-2005, 19:36 +0200 (24-Feb 17:36 UK time) Maxim Masiutin [MM]
in mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED] said to Marek:

>>>Look to Opera, I love it for
>>>this, whole configuration is stored in INI's.

MM> If you store screen coordinates in an INI file and move it to
MM> a computer with a display of different resolution, you will see a
MM> big mess!

Agreed!

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Re[2]: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Maxim Masiutin
Hello Marek,

Thursday, February 24, 2005, 19:06:16, you wrote:

>>Look to Opera, I love it for
>>this, whole configuration is stored in INI's.
If you store screen coordinates in an INI file and move it to a computer with a 
display of different resolution, you will see a big mess!

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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Mike
On Thursday, February 24, 2005, 11:53:07 AM, Cees wrote:

C> I  feel  that  ALL  userpreferences  without  exception,  including
C> folders  created  by the user, should be put into an ini-file. That
C> would really save me a lot of work in the future.

I  have  to  agree  with  this.   I'd  much  rather  have  the
information  stored  in  an  .INI  file  than  the registry.  It makes
backing up and restoring a much simpler process.

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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Marek Mikus
Hello all,
Thursday, February 24, 2005, Maxim Masiutin wrote:

>   Currently, The Bat! keeps the following configuration data in the registry:

> -   Window sizes, position, column widths
> -   Directory names last used to save an attachment, import messages, etc.
> -   Currently selected items, i.e. folder, message, etc.
> -   Miscellaneous editor settings like AutoIndent, AutoWrap,
> “Show ReplyTo”,  editor font, editor colours for selected text,
> quoted text, etc, 
> -   Various global preferences like “Inform about birthdays”,
> “Use menu navigator”, RAS settings like username and password, font
> of folders tree, etc.

> There is an imperative to store configuration data in a disk file
> rather than in the registry. However, there is no rationale to keep
> window sizes, position and column widths in files, it seems to me
> that Registry is the best place for this information. 

> What kind of configuration data should we keep in registry and what
> should we put into a file?

Max, why is needed to use more places for storing configuration data,
why is a problem to use INI files only? Look to Opera, I love it for
this, whole configuration is stored in INI's. Or Pocomail, AFAIK it
stores everything in files too.

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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Marcus Ohlström

On Thursday, February 24, 2005, 18:03, Marcus Ohlström wrote:

> The only files I make sure are *not* copied are:

> \MAIL\Account.~flb
> \MAIL\Account.flb
> \MAIL\\Account.~flb
> \MAIL\\Account.flb
> \MAIL\except.log
> \MAIL\\Account.log

> The latter two are excluded by obvious reasons. The former four I don't
> remember why I exclude, but maybe it gives you some hints of which
> settings I don't want synchronized between my computers?

Oh, forgot to mention. Excluding these files also makes folder settings
made on one computer not replicated to the other. For example, I would
like purge settings replicated, they are not.

Again, I don't remember why I excluded the files mentioned, but I do
remember I had good reasons.

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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Thomas Fernandez
Hello Maxim,

On Thu, 24 Feb 2005 18:20:52 +0200 GMT (24/02/2005, 23:20 +0700 GMT),
Maxim Masiutin wrote:

MM> What kind of configuration data should we keep in registry
MM> and what should we put into a file?

For portability, I always prefer .ini of .cfg files.

I even prefer them to be ASCII files, so I can tweak them to my liking
manually, if I am so inclined.

I don't know whether that causes problems for shareware though, as it
would probably make pirating easier. You (the developers) have to pay
for your bowl of rice a day, too. So I think it's a business decision
rather than a technical one. CMIIW.

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Re[3]: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Maxim Masiutin
Hello Cees,

Thursday, February 24, 2005, 18:53:07, you wrote:

>>including folders created
>> by the user, should be put into an ini-file.
The user's folders aren't in the Registry.

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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Marcus Ohlström

On Thursday, February 24, 2005, 17:26, Marck D Pearlstone wrote:

MM>> What kind of configuration data should we keep in registry and what
MM>> should we put into a file?

> Here's how I see it ...

> Data pertinent only to the local system - window size / position data
> and disk folder usage are certainly right for registry storage. But
> data that pertains to a user's preferences should be more portable.
> Current selection data and switch settings are very much user
> dependant rather than environment based.

I agree, but would like to add connection settings and servers to the
list of data related to the local system.

When going away, I usually copy my whole TB! directory to my laptop. I
have intentionally set up my systems quite similar to ensure this is
possible (same folder structure etc) and I must say this already works
quite nice.

There is a few annoyances though, one of them being that I every time
have to change my SMTP server. I do not use the same server when
travelling as I do at home, but the SMTP server setting seem to be
stored somewhere in the files I copy.

The only files I make sure are *not* copied are:

\MAIL\Account.~flb
\MAIL\Account.flb
\MAIL\\Account.~flb
\MAIL\\Account.flb
\MAIL\except.log
\MAIL\\Account.log

The latter two are excluded by obvious reasons. The former four I don't
remember why I exclude, but maybe it gives you some hints of which
settings I don't want synchronized between my computers?

Hope this helps.

-- 
Regards,
Marcus Ohlström

Using The Bat! v3.0.1.33 on Windows 2000 5.0 Build 2195 Service Pack 4
PGP Public Key at http://www.canit.se/~marcus/pgp.asc






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Re[2]: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Cees
Het was op donderdag 24 februari 2005 om 17:26 uur dat jij iets schreef over 
'Config: Registry -> File' :

Hallo Marck,
  
MM>> What kind of configuration data should we keep in registry
MM>> and what should we put into a file?

MDP> Here's how I see it ...

MDP> Data pertinent only to the local system - window size / position data
MDP> and disk folder usage are certainly right for registry storage. But
MDP> data that pertains to a user's preferences should be more portable.
MDP> Current selection data and switch settings are very much user
MDP> dependant rather than environment based.

 I feel that ALL userpreferences without exception, including folders created
 by the user, should be put into an ini-file. That would really save me a lot
 of work in the future.

-- 
regards,
 Cees

A pessimist is never disappointed.
__
The Bat! 3.0.9.1 Deep Alpha [A12F0392] running on Windows XP 5.1 build 2600 
Service Pack 2

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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Leif Gregory
Hello Maxim,

Thursday, February 24, 2005, 9:20:52 AM, you wrote:
M> What kind of configuration data should we keep in registry and what
M> should we put into a file?

Wow.. good question. I know you're selling voyager as a mobile
product, but I'd really like to be able to take my TB installation
with me on any format (CD, DVD, pendrive, removable hard drive etc),
so what should be in an .ini file are the pieces necessary for me to
be able to run TB directly from one of those mediums if I want to
(i.e. packet writing to the CD or whatnot).

It'd also be helpful where I might want to install the latest beta
alongside my other version (I know you can do that now with a switch
to use a specific registry key). One problem I ran into here was when
I wanted to move my TB installation from a laptop on a domain to a
laptop not on a domain I really, really had to work to get it up and
running. I used to love the fact that I could just copy the files over
and the registry key and it would just work once I ran the registry
import on the key. Now with the profile stuff it makes it a bit more
difficult.

If I just had an .ini file I could just copy the TB directory and be
totally done with it. The registry is fine for single point
installations, but if you want to take your software with you, then
it's a real bummer.

Thanks.


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Re: Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Marck D Pearlstone
Dear Maxim,

@24-Feb-2005, 18:20 +0200 (24-Feb 16:20 UK time) Maxim Masiutin [MM]
in mid:[EMAIL PROTECTED] said:

MM>   Currently, The Bat! keeps the following configuration data in the 
registry:

MM> -   Window sizes, position, column widths
MM> -   Directory names last used to save an attachment, import messages, 
etc.
MM> -   Currently selected items, i.e. folder, message, etc.
... 

MM> What kind of configuration data should we keep in registry
MM> and what should we put into a file?

Here's how I see it ...

Data pertinent only to the local system - window size / position data
and disk folder usage are certainly right for registry storage. But
data that pertains to a user's preferences should be more portable.
Current selection data and switch settings are very much user
dependant rather than environment based.

-- 
Cheers --  //.arck D Pearlstone -- List moderator and fellow end user
TB! v3.0.2.10 on Windows XP 5.1.2600 Service Pack 2
'

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Config: Registry -> File

2005-02-24 Thread Maxim Masiutin
Hello Tbbeta,

  Currently, The Bat! keeps the following configuration data in the registry:

-   Window sizes, position, column widths
-   Directory names last used to save an attachment, import messages, etc.
-   Currently selected items, i.e. folder, message, etc.
-   Miscellaneous editor settings like AutoIndent, AutoWrap, “Show 
ReplyTo”,  editor font, editor colours for selected text, quoted text, etc, 
-   Various global preferences like “Inform about birthdays”, “Use menu 
navigator”, RAS settings like username and password, font of folders tree, etc.

There is an imperative to store configuration data in a disk file rather than 
in the registry. However, there is no rationale to keep window sizes, position 
and column widths in files, it seems to me that Registry is the best place for 
this information. 

What kind of configuration data should we keep in registry and what should we 
put into a file?

-- 
Best regards,
Maxim Masiutin  mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

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