Re: [Texascavers] [SWR CAVERS] Special Presentation at Carlsbad Caverns today!

[Linda Starr]

Perhaps Zoe will make a presentation at the SWR Winter Tech in Las Cruces
Dec.7.
Linda Starr

On Fri, Jun 7, 2019 at 12:03 PM George Veni  wrote:

> Dear Friends,
>
> I apologize for this last-minute notice. If you are in the Carlsbad area
> this afternoon, please consider a visit to Carlsbad Caverns National Park
> at 4 p.m. for a free public lecture by Zoë Havlena.
>
> Have you ever thought about the green stuff growing near lights in show
> caves? Folks call it "algae" but the proper name is "lampenflora." It is
> unsightly, damages caves, and has been a problem in need of a solution for
> over a hundred years. The National Park Service funded NCKRI to study the
> situation, and we have been working with professors and students at New
> Mexico Tech to come up with answers. Zoë's work covers the first of two
> phases of the study. Attached is flyer with details. Feel free to share
> this announcement and to come hear Zoë this afternoon and see what she has
> found.
>
> George
>
> 
> George  Veni, PhD
> Executive Director, National Cave and Karst Research Institute (NCKRI)
> and
> President, International Union of Speleology (UIS)
>
> NCKRI address (primary)
> 400-1 Cascades Avenue
> Carlsbad, New Mexico 88220 USA
> Office: +575-887-5517
> Mobile: +210-863-6919
> Fax: +575-887-5523
> gv...@nckri.org
> www.nckri.org
>
> UIS address
> Titov trg 2
> Postojna, 6230 Slovenia
> www.uis-speleo.org
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "Southwestern Cavers of the National Speleological Society" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
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> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/swrcavers.
> To view this discussion on the web visit
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/swrcavers/BYAPR06MB41655C76184795D886CE6617A0100%40BYAPR06MB4165.namprd06.prod.outlook.com
> .
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[Texascavers] Potholing video of the week

[David]

Here is a short helmet-cam video.   Oscar Doyle wins this week's grand
prize.  Get a good view of how to stuff your rope in a pack.   Is that how
you do it ?That would be hard with 11 mm stiff rope.

Turn the annoying music down.

https://youtu.be/b8cXGdsoR0I


P.S.   I am disappointed nobody is hyping up the NSS Convention.  I am
super-bummed that I can not go.


I need to move out of my fancy apartment and into an even more expensive
one closer into The Center of H*ll, in order to further enslave myself to
my job.

On a weird note, my # 2 customer was arrested about 3 months ago, and I
only found because I ended up working on his  case.   His company fired him
and replaced him, and in doing so, erroneously chose to go with a far less
experienced service ( than mine ) that the new guy was cronies with.  I
just found out yesterday, so I would be getting drunk if I drank, but I
don't, so instead I am just beating my head at the wall and yelling at The
Great Spirit.  They will eventually come to their senses, but that might
take months of lost income.  When they beg me back, I would tell them my
fee has gone up, if I could afford to do so.  It is not skill, that my main
competion lacks, but they lack the insanity one needs to succeed in my
job.  In this case, the uninformed customer thought they could save money,
not understanding the consequences.  You try working in a field where 99%
of your customers are m*r*ns.
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[Texascavers] A recent video

[David]

https://youtu.be/6_Nteb1fBO4

Disclaimer:   I have not had a chance to watch this yet
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Re: [Texascavers] Caving vehicles

[Jocelyn Hooper]

Pete’ old red truck has gone to Houston with a fellow Sprouse told him
about who rebuilds old power wagons.  We are still stuck with Stone’s truck
that slid upside down along a hwy in Mexico all those years ago.  He lost
the title, and neither Pete nor I have been able to get him to get
another.  Would love someone to haul it off! 若

On Sat, Jun 8, 2019 at 11:40 AM PRESTON FORSYTHE 
wrote:

> Considering who owned that vehicle and what she accomplished using, I
> assume, that vehicle, the Chevy Tomato should go in a Caver Vehicle Museum
> in NM, TX or Huntsville. I mean in NM the humidity is so low the museum
> would not even have to be under roof.
>
> However, Nico is correct I am sure about the maintenance history of such
> vehicle. Having rebuilt an old caving vehicle decades ago, I have no desire
> to do another one. For one, the safety features on newer vehicles are worth
> it, and reliability counts as well. Cost? Fairly new vehicles to me are
> worth it because I no longer have unlimited time or necessarily want to
> make unlimited time, yet, to get there, with multiple tire problems,
> overheating, wheels flying off, drive shafts slinging off down the
> interstate or country dirt caving roads,  carb. clogging up from dirty fuel
> tanks, and more. Does anyone really get off road these days. Are there
> still caves to be found?
>
> I would be happy to see the Old School Bus in a museum. I would pay for
> having Strickland's old '68 Red Dodge Power Wagon pulled out of the weeds
> and hauled to Huntsville. There is space behind the hdqtrs in Huntsville
> for several vehicles. Terry R. do you still have an old vehicle or two to
> donate to the cause? We could park them in Huntsville, with Geary's
> permission,  and put a couple of drip pans underneath, maybe a half dozen
> drip pans. Are any of Frank's old Toyotas still stuck back in the weeds? I
> know Blake has one two.
>
> By the way George can do whatever he wants in my book. That TX convention
> was tops and those things are not easy to put on. Volunteer and help at TN.
>
> Nico, we will never get tired of your Giant Caves of Northern Mexico.
>
>
> Preston Forsythe, Browder, KY
>
> On Saturday, June 8, 2019, 11:04:43 AM CDT, Nico Escamilla <
> pitboun...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Vw saveiro as well as the Chevrolet tornado are gutless, Ive driven both,
> they're good for running errands and have decent fuel economy but thats it,
> neither could ever be considered a caving vehicle unless your idea of
> caving involves paved roads to the entrance like Palmito or Grutas de
> Garcia. They're nothing but a small carr disguised as a pickup, in the case
> of the Chevy its the Aveo platform with a pickup bed and the VW I believe
> its the Polo/vento turned into a pick'em up truck or I could be wrong and
> it could be the Gol platform... in any case, they both have tiny engines
> aimed at fuel economy and thats it, the Chevy is geared lower which helps
> with you put 500 kilos worth cattle feed or such in the bed, the tradeoff
> is higher rpms at highway speeds.. Ground clearance is nothing to write
> home about either.. I could go on and on, but that'd be as pointless as
> most of Locklear's posts on this listserve since neither of them vehicles
> is offered in the states cause they're little death boxes without airbags
> or any such safety features.
>
> Nico
>
>
> Nico
>
>
> 
>  Libre
> de virus. www.avast.com
> 
> <#m_-676499463997262_DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>
>
> El vie., 7 de jun. de 2019 7:37 PM, David 
> escribió:
>
> I saw the Volkwagen in the link below on the highway in Houston today, or
> something very similar to it.
>
>
>
> http://an-review.weebly.com/uploads/7/8/3/9/78391004/new-saveiro-2018-2_orig.jpg
>
> I think it had Mexican plates.
>
> Somebody should get one for Walt.
>
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Re: [Texascavers] [SWR CAVERS] Special Presentation at Carlsbad Caverns today!

[George Veni]

I don’t see the point to this repeated criticism. I started my announcement 
with an apology for sending it at the last minute because it was clear that it 
would be too late for many people. I sent it because it may not be too late for 
some and I thought it would be good to include them. If my circumstances 
allowed me to send the announcement earlier, I obviously would have.

If anyone has further complaints about my sharing information over lists 
designed to share information, please do so privately.

George

From: Jerry 
Sent: Saturday, June 8, 2019 06:01
To: George Veni ; swrcav...@googlegroups.com; 
Texascavers@texascavers.com
Subject: Re: [SWR CAVERS] Special Presentation at Carlsbad Caverns today!

Well George,

If it was important, why did you give us 4 hours notice before the meeting ?  
Even If I lived in Carlsbad, I probably wouldn't have noticed your email until 
it was either too late or had prior engagements.

If you wanted to be inclusive, send meeting notices earlier.  As it was, it 
appears as a last moment "oops" or worse, just covering yourself for planning 
in reverse.

I believe the Region would like to hear of Zoe's results if she is around 
during the upcoming Winter Tech. I promise we won't give her 4 hours notice.

Jerry Atkinson.


-Original Message-
From: George Veni mailto:gv...@nckri.org>>
To: New Mexico Cavers 
mailto:swrcav...@googlegroups.com>>; Texas Cavers 
mailto:Texascavers@texascavers.com>>
Sent: Fri, Jun 7, 2019 10:00 pm
Subject: RE: [SWR CAVERS] Special Presentation at Carlsbad Caverns today!
Why bother to post? I thought the reasons were obvious but since asked:

* I don't have the e-mail address of everyone who might be interested in 
attending.

* There are a notable number of people on the New Mexico and Texas e-lists 
within relatively easy travel range of Carlsbad who could make it with the 
short 4-hour advance notice I gave.

* Many cavers outside of the immediate Carlsbad area travel regularly to 
Carlsbad, especially on Fridays, and they night be in the area and would miss 
announcements sent only to locals.

* I believe it is important to be inclusive, not exclusive, in getting people 
news that might interest them.

* I see no harm in sharing announcements, even if at the last minute, in case 
some might benefit from them.

In the end, the lecture went well and the room was packed. I don't know if any 
people attended due to my announcement, but I noticed several who might have.

George

-Original Message-
From: jerryat...@aol.com 
mailto:jerryat...@aol.com>>
Sent: Friday, June 7, 2019 15:51
To: George Veni mailto:gv...@nckri.org>>
Cc: New Mexico Cavers 
mailto:swrcav...@googlegroups.com>>; Texas Cavers 
mailto:Texascavers@texascavers.com>>
Subject: Re: [SWR CAVERS] Special Presentation at Carlsbad Caverns today!

Jeez, George. Why did you even bother to post?  Hopefully, we’ll get to hear 
more at the SWR Winter Tech.

Jerry Atkinson.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jun 7, 2019, at 12:03 PM, George Veni 
> mailto:gv...@nckri.org>> wrote:
>
> Dear Friends,
>
> I apologize for this last-minute notice. If you are in the Carlsbad area this 
> afternoon, please consider a visit to Carlsbad Caverns National Park at 4 
> p.m. for a free public lecture by Zoë Havlena.
>
> Have you ever thought about the green stuff growing near lights in show 
> caves? Folks call it "algae" but the proper name is "lampenflora." It is 
> unsightly, damages caves, and has been a problem in need of a solution for 
> over a hundred years. The National Park Service funded NCKRI to study the 
> situation, and we have been working with professors and students at New 
> Mexico Tech to come up with answers. Zoë's work covers the first of two 
> phases of the study. Attached is flyer with details. Feel free to share this 
> announcement and to come hear Zoë this afternoon and see what she has found.
>
> George
>
> 
> George  Veni, PhD
> Executive Director, National Cave and Karst Research Institute (NCKRI)
> and President, International Union of Speleology (UIS)
>
> NCKRI address (primary)
> 400-1 Cascades Avenue
> Carlsbad, New Mexico 88220 USA
> Office: +575-887-5517
> Mobile: +210-863-6919
> Fax: +575-887-5523
> gv...@nckri.org>
> www.nckri.org
>
> UIS address
> Titov trg 2
> Postojna, 6230 Slovenia
> www.uis-speleo.org
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "Southwestern Cavers of the National Speleological Society" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
> email to 
> swrcavers+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> To post to this group, send email to 
> swrcav...@googlegroups.com.
> Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/swrcavers.
> To 

Re: [Texascavers] [SWR CAVERS] Special Presentation at Carlsbad Caverns today!

[Ken Harrington]

George,
You did good and several local people were able to attend because of your 
notice.
I applaud your efforts to get the word out even if it was at the last minute.
Ken

Sent from my iPad

On Jun 8, 2019, at 9:20 AM, George Veni 
mailto:gv...@nckri.org>> wrote:

I don’t see the point to this repeated criticism. I started my announcement 
with an apology for sending it at the last minute because it was clear that it 
would be too late for many people. I sent it because it may not be too late for 
some and I thought it would be good to include them. If my circumstances 
allowed me to send the announcement earlier, I obviously would have.

If anyone has further complaints about my sharing information over lists 
designed to share information, please do so privately.

George

From: Jerry mailto:jerryat...@aol.com>>
Sent: Saturday, June 8, 2019 06:01
To: George Veni mailto:gv...@nckri.org>>; 
swrcav...@googlegroups.com; 
Texascavers@texascavers.com
Subject: Re: [SWR CAVERS] Special Presentation at Carlsbad Caverns today!

Well George,

If it was important, why did you give us 4 hours notice before the meeting ?  
Even If I lived in Carlsbad, I probably wouldn't have noticed your email until 
it was either too late or had prior engagements.

If you wanted to be inclusive, send meeting notices earlier.  As it was, it 
appears as a last moment "oops" or worse, just covering yourself for planning 
in reverse.

I believe the Region would like to hear of Zoe's results if she is around 
during the upcoming Winter Tech. I promise we won't give her 4 hours notice.

Jerry Atkinson.


-Original Message-
From: George Veni mailto:gv...@nckri.org>>
To: New Mexico Cavers 
mailto:swrcav...@googlegroups.com>>; Texas Cavers 
mailto:Texascavers@texascavers.com>>
Sent: Fri, Jun 7, 2019 10:00 pm
Subject: RE: [SWR CAVERS] Special Presentation at Carlsbad Caverns today!
Why bother to post? I thought the reasons were obvious but since asked:

* I don't have the e-mail address of everyone who might be interested in 
attending.

* There are a notable number of people on the New Mexico and Texas e-lists 
within relatively easy travel range of Carlsbad who could make it with the 
short 4-hour advance notice I gave.

* Many cavers outside of the immediate Carlsbad area travel regularly to 
Carlsbad, especially on Fridays, and they night be in the area and would miss 
announcements sent only to locals.

* I believe it is important to be inclusive, not exclusive, in getting people 
news that might interest them.

* I see no harm in sharing announcements, even if at the last minute, in case 
some might benefit from them.

In the end, the lecture went well and the room was packed. I don't know if any 
people attended due to my announcement, but I noticed several who might have.

George

-Original Message-
From: jerryat...@aol.com 
mailto:jerryat...@aol.com>>
Sent: Friday, June 7, 2019 15:51
To: George Veni mailto:gv...@nckri.org>>
Cc: New Mexico Cavers 
mailto:swrcav...@googlegroups.com>>; Texas Cavers 
mailto:Texascavers@texascavers.com>>
Subject: Re: [SWR CAVERS] Special Presentation at Carlsbad Caverns today!

Jeez, George. Why did you even bother to post?  Hopefully, we’ll get to hear 
more at the SWR Winter Tech.

Jerry Atkinson.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jun 7, 2019, at 12:03 PM, George Veni 
> mailto:gv...@nckri.org>> wrote:
>
> Dear Friends,
>
> I apologize for this last-minute notice. If you are in the Carlsbad area this 
> afternoon, please consider a visit to Carlsbad Caverns National Park at 4 
> p.m. for a free public lecture by Zoë Havlena.
>
> Have you ever thought about the green stuff growing near lights in show 
> caves? Folks call it "algae" but the proper name is "lampenflora." It is 
> unsightly, damages caves, and has been a problem in need of a solution for 
> over a hundred years. The National Park Service funded NCKRI to study the 
> situation, and we have been working with professors and students at New 
> Mexico Tech to come up with answers. Zoë's work covers the first of two 
> phases of the study. Attached is flyer with details. Feel free to share this 
> announcement and to come hear Zoë this afternoon and see what she has found.
>
> George
>
> 
> George  Veni, PhD
> Executive Director, National Cave and Karst Research Institute (NCKRI)
> and President, International Union of Speleology (UIS)
>
> NCKRI address (primary)
> 400-1 Cascades Avenue
> Carlsbad, New Mexico 88220 USA
> Office: +575-887-5517
> Mobile: +210-863-6919
> Fax: +575-887-5523
> gv...@nckri.org>
> www.nckri.org
>
> UIS address
> Titov trg 2
> Postojna, 6230 Slovenia
> www.uis-speleo.org
>
> --
> You received this message because you are 

Re: [Texascavers] Caving vehicles

[PRESTON FORSYTHE]

 Considering who owned that vehicle and what she accomplished using, I assume, 
that vehicle, the Chevy Tomato should go in a Caver Vehicle Museum in NM, TX or 
Huntsville. I mean in NM the humidity is so low the museum would not even have 
to be under roof.
However, Nico is correct I am sure about the maintenance history of such 
vehicle. Having rebuilt an old caving vehicle decades ago, I have no desire to 
do another one. For one, the safety features on newer vehicles are worth it, 
and reliability counts as well. Cost? Fairly new vehicles to me are worth it 
because I no longer have unlimited time or necessarily want to make unlimited 
time, yet, to get there, with multiple tire problems, overheating, wheels 
flying off, drive shafts slinging off down the interstate or country dirt 
caving roads,  carb. clogging up from dirty fuel tanks, and more. Does anyone 
really get off road these days. Are there still caves to be found?
I would be happy to see the Old School Bus in a museum. I would pay for having 
Strickland's old '68 Red Dodge Power Wagon pulled out of the weeds and hauled 
to Huntsville. There is space behind the hdqtrs in Huntsville for several 
vehicles. Terry R. do you still have an old vehicle or two to donate to the 
cause? We could park them in Huntsville, with Geary's permission,  and put a 
couple of drip pans underneath, maybe a half dozen drip pans. Are any of 
Frank's old Toyotas still stuck back in the weeds? I know Blake has one two.
By the way George can do whatever he wants in my book. That TX convention was 
tops and those things are not easy to put on. Volunteer and help at TN.
Nico, we will never get tired of your Giant Caves of Northern Mexico.

Preston Forsythe, Browder, KY

On Saturday, June 8, 2019, 11:04:43 AM CDT, Nico Escamilla 
 wrote:  
 
 Vw saveiro as well as the Chevrolet tornado are gutless, Ive driven both, 
they're good for running errands and have decent fuel economy but thats it, 
neither could ever be considered a caving vehicle unless your idea of caving 
involves paved roads to the entrance like Palmito or Grutas de Garcia. They're 
nothing but a small carr disguised as a pickup, in the case of the Chevy its 
the Aveo platform with a pickup bed and the VW I believe its the Polo/vento 
turned into a pick'em up truck or I could be wrong and it could be the Gol 
platform... in any case, they both have tiny engines aimed at fuel economy and 
thats it, the Chevy is geared lower which helps with you put 500 kilos worth 
cattle feed or such in the bed, the tradeoff is higher rpms at highway speeds.. 
Ground clearance is nothing to write home about either.. I could go on and on, 
but that'd be as pointless as most of Locklear's posts on this listserve since 
neither of them vehicles is offered in the states cause they're little death 
boxes without airbags or any such safety features.
Nico

Nico
 
|  | Libre de virus. www.avast.com  |


El vie., 7 de jun. de 2019 7:37 PM, David  escribió:

I saw the Volkwagen in the link below on the highway in Houston today, or 
something very similar to it.

http://an-review.weebly.com/uploads/7/8/3/9/78391004/new-saveiro-2018-2_orig.jpg

I think it had Mexican plates.
Somebody should get one for Walt.
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Re: [Texascavers] [SWR CAVERS] Special Presentation at Carlsbad Caverns today!

[speodesmus]

George is good guy folks. I appreciate George!

On Jun 8, 2019, at 10:48 AM, Ken Harrington  wrote:

George,
You did good and several local people were able to attend because of your 
notice.
I applaud your efforts to get the word out even if it was at the last minute.
Ken

Sent from my iPad

On Jun 8, 2019, at 9:20 AM, George Veni  wrote:

> I don’t see the point to this repeated criticism. I started my announcement 
> with an apology for sending it at the last minute because it was clear that 
> it would be too late for many people. I sent it because it may not be too 
> late for some and I thought it would be good to include them. If my 
> circumstances allowed me to send the announcement earlier, I obviously would 
> have.
>  
> If anyone has further complaints about my sharing information over lists 
> designed to share information, please do so privately.
>  
> George
>  
> From: Jerry  
> Sent: Saturday, June 8, 2019 06:01
> To: George Veni ; swrcav...@googlegroups.com; 
> Texascavers@texascavers.com
> Subject: Re: [SWR CAVERS] Special Presentation at Carlsbad Caverns today!
>  
> Well George,
>  
> If it was important, why did you give us 4 hours notice before the meeting ?  
> Even If I lived in Carlsbad, I probably wouldn't have noticed your email 
> until it was either too late or had prior engagements.
>  
> If you wanted to be inclusive, send meeting notices earlier.  As it was, it 
> appears as a last moment "oops" or worse, just covering yourself for planning 
> in reverse.
>  
> I believe the Region would like to hear of Zoe's results if she is around 
> during the upcoming Winter Tech. I promise we won't give her 4 hours notice.
>  
> Jerry Atkinson.
>  
>  
> -Original Message-
> From: George Veni 
> To: New Mexico Cavers ; Texas Cavers 
> 
> Sent: Fri, Jun 7, 2019 10:00 pm
> Subject: RE: [SWR CAVERS] Special Presentation at Carlsbad Caverns today!
> 
> Why bother to post? I thought the reasons were obvious but since asked:
> 
> * I don't have the e-mail address of everyone who might be interested in 
> attending.
> 
> * There are a notable number of people on the New Mexico and Texas e-lists 
> within relatively easy travel range of Carlsbad who could make it with the 
> short 4-hour advance notice I gave.
> 
> * Many cavers outside of the immediate Carlsbad area travel regularly to 
> Carlsbad, especially on Fridays, and they night be in the area and would miss 
> announcements sent only to locals.
> 
> * I believe it is important to be inclusive, not exclusive, in getting people 
> news that might interest them.
> 
> * I see no harm in sharing announcements, even if at the last minute, in case 
> some might benefit from them.
> 
> In the end, the lecture went well and the room was packed. I don't know if 
> any people attended due to my announcement, but I noticed several who might 
> have.
> 
> George
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: jerryat...@aol.com  
> Sent: Friday, June 7, 2019 15:51
> To: George Veni 
> Cc: New Mexico Cavers ; Texas Cavers 
> 
> Subject: Re: [SWR CAVERS] Special Presentation at Carlsbad Caverns today!
> 
> Jeez, George. Why did you even bother to post?  Hopefully, we’ll get to hear 
> more at the SWR Winter Tech. 
> 
> Jerry Atkinson. 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> > On Jun 7, 2019, at 12:03 PM, George Veni  wrote:
> > 
> > Dear Friends,
> > 
> > I apologize for this last-minute notice. If you are in the Carlsbad area 
> > this afternoon, please consider a visit to Carlsbad Caverns National Park 
> > at 4 p.m. for a free public lecture by Zoë Havlena.
> > 
> > Have you ever thought about the green stuff growing near lights in show 
> > caves? Folks call it "algae" but the proper name is "lampenflora." It is 
> > unsightly, damages caves, and has been a problem in need of a solution for 
> > over a hundred years. The National Park Service funded NCKRI to study the 
> > situation, and we have been working with professors and students at New 
> > Mexico Tech to come up with answers. Zoë's work covers the first of two 
> > phases of the study. Attached is flyer with details. Feel free to share 
> > this announcement and to come hear Zoë this afternoon and see what she has 
> > found.
> > 
> > George
> > 
> > 
> > George  Veni, PhD
> > Executive Director, National Cave and Karst Research Institute (NCKRI) 
> > and President, International Union of Speleology (UIS)
> > 
> > NCKRI address (primary)
> > 400-1 Cascades Avenue
> > Carlsbad, New Mexico 88220 USA
> > Office: +575-887-5517
> > Mobile: +210-863-6919
> > Fax: +575-887-5523
> > gv...@nckri.org
> > www.nckri.org
> > 
> > UIS address
> > Titov trg 2
> > Postojna, 6230 Slovenia
> > www.uis-speleo.org
> > 
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> > "Southwestern Cavers of the National Speleological Society" group.
> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop 

Re: [Texascavers] [SWR CAVERS] Special Presentation at Carlsbad Caverns today!

[Michael Harris]

A 4 hour trip from San Antonio would have been toughOK, maybe
impossible but if I would have happened to be near Carlsbad I sure would
have appreciated the heads up. Thanks for keeping us in the loop George.

Mike Harris

On Sat, Jun 8, 2019, 10:20 AM George Veni  wrote:

> I don’t see the point to this repeated criticism. I started my
> announcement with an apology for sending it at the last minute because it
> was clear that it would be too late for many people. I sent it because it
> may not be too late for some and I thought it would be good to include
> them. If my circumstances allowed me to send the announcement earlier, I
> obviously would have.
>
>
>
> If anyone has further complaints about my sharing information over lists
> designed to share information, please do so privately.
>
>
>
> George
>
>
>
> *From:* Jerry 
> *Sent:* Saturday, June 8, 2019 06:01
> *To:* George Veni ; swrcav...@googlegroups.com;
> Texascavers@texascavers.com
> *Subject:* Re: [SWR CAVERS] Special Presentation at Carlsbad Caverns
> today!
>
>
>
> Well George,
>
>
>
> If it was important, why did you give us 4 hours notice before the meeting
> ?  Even If I lived in Carlsbad, I probably wouldn't have noticed your email
> until it was either too late or had prior engagements.
>
>
>
> If you wanted to be inclusive, send meeting notices earlier.  As it was,
> it appears as a last moment "oops" or worse, just covering yourself for
> planning in reverse.
>
>
>
> I believe the Region would like to hear of Zoe's results if she is around
> during the upcoming Winter Tech. I promise we won't give her 4 hours
> notice.
>
>
>
> Jerry Atkinson.
>
>
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: George Veni 
> To: New Mexico Cavers ; Texas Cavers <
> Texascavers@texascavers.com>
> Sent: Fri, Jun 7, 2019 10:00 pm
> Subject: RE: [SWR CAVERS] Special Presentation at Carlsbad Caverns today!
>
> Why bother to post? I thought the reasons were obvious but since asked:
>
> * I don't have the e-mail address of everyone who might be interested in
> attending.
>
> * There are a notable number of people on the New Mexico and Texas e-lists
> within relatively easy travel range of Carlsbad who could make it with the
> short 4-hour advance notice I gave.
>
> * Many cavers outside of the immediate Carlsbad area travel regularly to
> Carlsbad, especially on Fridays, and they night be in the area and would
> miss announcements sent only to locals.
>
> * I believe it is important to be inclusive, not exclusive, in getting
> people news that might interest them.
>
> * I see no harm in sharing announcements, even if at the last minute, in
> case some might benefit from them.
>
> In the end, the lecture went well and the room was packed. I don't know if
> any people attended due to my announcement, but I noticed several who might
> have.
>
> George
>
> -Original Message-
> From: jerryat...@aol.com 
> Sent: Friday, June 7, 2019 15:51
> To: George Veni 
> Cc: New Mexico Cavers ; Texas Cavers <
> Texascavers@texascavers.com>
> Subject: Re: [SWR CAVERS] Special Presentation at Carlsbad Caverns today!
>
> Jeez, George. Why did you even bother to post?  Hopefully, we’ll get to
> hear more at the SWR Winter Tech.
>
> Jerry Atkinson.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> > On Jun 7, 2019, at 12:03 PM, George Veni  wrote:
> >
> > Dear Friends,
> >
> > I apologize for this last-minute notice. If you are in the Carlsbad area
> this afternoon, please consider a visit to Carlsbad Caverns National Park
> at 4 p.m. for a free public lecture by Zoë Havlena.
> >
> > Have you ever thought about the green stuff growing near lights in show
> caves? Folks call it "algae" but the proper name is "lampenflora." It is
> unsightly, damages caves, and has been a problem in need of a solution for
> over a hundred years. The National Park Service funded NCKRI to study the
> situation, and we have been working with professors and students at New
> Mexico Tech to come up with answers. Zoë's work covers the first of two
> phases of the study. Attached is flyer with details. Feel free to share
> this announcement and to come hear Zoë this afternoon and see what she has
> found.
> >
> > George
> >
> > 
> > George  Veni, PhD
> > Executive Director, National Cave and Karst Research Institute (NCKRI)
> > and President, International Union of Speleology (UIS)
> >
> > NCKRI address (primary)
> > 400-1 Cascades Avenue
> > Carlsbad, New Mexico 88220 USA
> > Office: +575-887-5517
> > Mobile: +210-863-6919
> > Fax: +575-887-5523
> > gv...@nckri.org
> > www.nckri.org
> >
> > UIS address
> > Titov trg 2
> > Postojna, 6230 Slovenia
> > www.uis-speleo.org
> >
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
> Groups "Southwestern Cavers of the National Speleological Society" group.
> > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
> an email to 

Re: [Texascavers] Caving vehicles

[Nico Escamilla]

Vw saveiro as well as the Chevrolet tornado are gutless, Ive driven both,
they're good for running errands and have decent fuel economy but thats it,
neither could ever be considered a caving vehicle unless your idea of
caving involves paved roads to the entrance like Palmito or Grutas de
Garcia. They're nothing but a small carr disguised as a pickup, in the case
of the Chevy its the Aveo platform with a pickup bed and the VW I believe
its the Polo/vento turned into a pick'em up truck or I could be wrong and
it could be the Gol platform... in any case, they both have tiny engines
aimed at fuel economy and thats it, the Chevy is geared lower which helps
with you put 500 kilos worth cattle feed or such in the bed, the tradeoff
is higher rpms at highway speeds.. Ground clearance is nothing to write
home about either.. I could go on and on, but that'd be as pointless as
most of Locklear's posts on this listserve since neither of them vehicles
is offered in the states cause they're little death boxes without airbags
or any such safety features.

Nico


Nico


Libre
de virus. www.avast.com

<#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>

El vie., 7 de jun. de 2019 7:37 PM, David  escribió:

> I saw the Volkwagen in the link below on the highway in Houston today, or
> something very similar to it.
>
>
>
> http://an-review.weebly.com/uploads/7/8/3/9/78391004/new-saveiro-2018-2_orig.jpg
>
> I think it had Mexican plates.
>
> Somebody should get one for Walt.
>
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[Texascavers] Tiny caving vehicles

[David]

Thank you Nico, that was a excellent response to my post.

Like most of my post, I do not know diddly about what I am talking about.

If it were a Toyota and had legroom and headroom for a 6 foot 300 pound
quasi-caver with a bad back, I would have to get one and give up my
gas-guzzling Sequoia.

D.L.
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Re: [Texascavers] Tiny caving vehicles

[Nico Escamilla]

Convert your Sequoia to LPG, not sure what the price or availability of lpg
is in Texas but here is about one third of the cost of gasoline and you can
find it pretty much anywhere, the conversion pays for itself the more you
drive, and perhaps you may even  get a tax cut or some sort of fiscal
stimulus for going green,


Libre
de virus. www.avast.com

<#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>

On Sat, Jun 8, 2019 at 12:01 PM David  wrote:

> Thank you Nico, that was a excellent response to my post.
>
> Like most of my post, I do not know diddly about what I am talking about.
>
> If it were a Toyota and had legroom and headroom for a 6 foot 300 pound
> quasi-caver with a bad back, I would have to get one and give up my
> gas-guzzling Sequoia.
>
> D.L.
> ___
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> Texascavers@texascavers.com | Archives:
> http://www.mail-archive.com/texascavers@texascavers.com/
> http://lists.texascavers.com/listinfo/texascavers
>
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