[tw5] Random tiddler viewer tiddler

[A Gloom]

Why?  Why not?

Based off the random filter idea of SS found at TW-Scripts...

It is a tiddler designed to be used in the story river as the main focus 
(for reading), so I haven't seen any issues with it being triggered by 
other wiki activity that would cause a tiddler refresh and a new random 
tiddler display (since it wouldn't be open during any editing).  The 
tiddler gets opened by a button with a tm-navigate message in the top or 
sidebar. The two buttons in the tiddler itself cause a new random tiddler 
to display by writing "Next poem" to a field ( zzdatesort ) of the tiddler 
which it is transcluded in the buttons text, causing a refresh of the 
tiddler and triggering the random filter of the list widget controlling the 
random tiddler display.


\define randpoem()
<$set name=r1 value=<>>
<$set name=r2 filter="[splitregexp:title[]rest[]join[]]" >
<$set name=nth filter="[tag[*poem]count[]multiplydivide[100]ceil[]]">
<$list filter="[tag[*poem]nth]">
<$view field="title"/>
<$transclude field="text" mode="block"/>




\end
<$button set="!!zzdatesort" setTo="Next poem" 
>{{!!zzdatesort}}
<>
<$button set="!!zzdatesort" setTo="Next poem" >{{!!zzdatesort}}

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[tw5] tiddlywiki structured like https://ibnishak.github.io/Timimi/

[Sapphireslinger]

Does anyone know how can I get a tiddlywiki structured 
like https://ibnishak.github.io/Timimi/ ?

As a last resort I realize I could download the Timini tiddlywiki and 
deconstruct and reconstruct it, but is there a theme(?) I can apply, or a 
blank wiki I can start with, that would do the same thing?

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[tw5] Building a list of tabs dynamically in a performant manner

[Soren Bjornstad]

Hi all,

I want to determine what tabs of the Reference Explorer in my Zettelkasten 
to show on a template, such that if there aren't any results on that tab, 
the tab doesn't appear at all. The results of the tab are produced based on 
a filter (of course), so I figured I would also determine whether the tab 
appears by running a filter. The filter is stored in a field in the tab 
tiddler.

That is, I have a series of tiddlers with a certain tag (say *Tab*), and 
each of these tiddlers contains a filter in some field (say *condition*). 
For each Tiddler tagged Tab, if and only if the filter Tiddler!!condition, 
run with the current tiddler as input, has more than zero results, I want 
to display the tab.

I came up with the following:

<$set name="tabList" value={{{ [tag[Tab]] 
:reduce[subfilter{!!condition}thenaddprefix[ 
]addprefix] }}}>
<$macrocall $name="tabs" tabsList=<>/>


This produces the correct result (well, as long as there are no spaces in 
the titles of the tiddlers tagged *Tab*; I'm OK assuming that since there 
indeed aren't any). The problem is that it is horrendously slow to run all 
these filters. On my dev machine it is tolerable, but this is a machine 
specced for serious processing power. On my MacBook Air it now takes 1–2 
seconds to open a new tiddler, even without anything currently open!

Probably I am just asking TW to do too much on the fly here, but before I 
start rethinking the project too hard, can anyone think of obvious 
optimizations I might be missing here? The filters involved are moderately 
complex (the basic pattern for each is to gather together links[], 
backlinks[], and tagging[] for the story tiddler, then filter some things 
out of that using + and !*operator*[]'s).

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[tw5] Re: Incremental note-taking (article/discussion)

[TW Tones]

David et al..

Just a quick point while some may find " Myers-Briggs" useful for 
stimulating discussion about the diversity of people, it actually has being 
shown to have no basis in science or research, in fact the opposite, it is 
positively wrong in many respects. I know this as a fact from multiple 
sources and experts, but just like the concepts of "we only use 10% of our 
brain" or people are "left or right brained" they are simple urbane myths 
with no support in fact. I have also seen good evidence for "learning 
styles" and NLP (Neuro linguistic Programming) to also be total "hogwash". 
Although all of these ideas can stimulate thinking, it must be remembered 
that they are merely useful myths.

It is not that I want to argue this fact, there are resources out there if 
you look, I simple want to raise this as a counter position.

Some related quotes

“If I were to remain silent, I'd be guilty of complicity.”
― Albert Einstein

“Always have something to say. The man who has something to say and who is 
known never to speak unless he has, is sure to be listened to.”
― Dale Carnegie

Regards
Tones
On Tuesday, 20 July 2021 at 07:15:18 UTC+10 David Gifford wrote:

>
> Hi Si
>
> I read this the other day but didn't have time to comment. Now I am done 
> getting ready for our trip tomorrow and I have a moment to breathe. My 
> thoughts:
>
> 1. Fascinating that this is the *opposite* of Evergreen notes, which is 
> all the rage now.
> 2. I think it would make more sense to allow overwriting notes, but take a 
> moment to think things through in the moment: might I need this version's 
> info later? Like Tones said, a combination approach. There could be 
> academic fields or professions where tracking the development of one's 
> thoughts is pretty important. But probably most people would feel fine 
> adding to or updating a note.
> 3. It would be interesting to know the personality types (whether using 
> Myers-Briggs or OCEAN) that gravitate toward certain notetaking tools. This 
> person seems like he could be an OCD type, feeling the need to have all 
> information organized thoroughly.
> 4. The article seems also to be pre-release propaganda for the Idea Flow 
> product. Probably best just to evaluate Idea flow when it becomes available 
> for preview. Maybe seeing it work will give us an idea on how to implement 
> in a useful way.
> On Thursday, July 15, 2021 at 2:18:48 PM UTC-5 Si wrote:
>
>> I just came across this post: https://thesephist.com/posts/inc/, and it 
>> challenges a lot of my own views on effective note-taking practices, so I 
>> thought it was worth sharing here.
>>
>> The author advocates for a kind of chronological system, where as a rule 
>> notes are never updated after they are made, meaning that they retain a 
>> fixed position in time. It kind of reminded me of Soren's random thoughts: 
>> https://randomthoughts.sorenbjornstad.com/
>>
>> Anyway this approach seems completely counter to my current approach to 
>> note-taking, where I want my notes to represent ideas that I am building 
>> over time with little regard to where or when they originally came from.
>>
>> I'm not particularly convinced, but I'm curious if anyone here has any 
>> thoughts? Do you see any advantages to this approach? Disadvantages? Do you 
>> think it could gel with the zettelkasten philosophy, or are they polar 
>> opposites?
>>
>> Just interested in hearing other peoples thoughts.
>>
>

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Re: [tw5] Re: Just the UI of tiddlywiki

[TW Tones]

All,

With a long history in IT the best synchronisation platform I ever came 
across was Novel's E-Directory, the competitor to Microsoft "Active 
Directory". Whist it was primarily for directory services users, 
permissions etc... its underlying architecture was something I expected to 
take over the world, but sadly other factors diminished its influence. It 
was quite capable of synchronising even data. Within Edirectory, most of 
the difficult problems had being solved, including update issues if a copy 
of the directory when offline to others but still provisioned local 
services (and local changes). As a systematic or conceptual thinker I got a 
lot from E-directory and are saddened this technology seems to have being 
underutilised. It would be sad if it was trapped inside some copywrite law 
given Novel was always fighting (and winning) over the copywrite lord of 
Microsoft (at the time). 

Such a synchronised solution should be a cloud service, on which you can 
build anything including  tiddlers that makeup a tiddlywiki. Then all 
solutions would be inherently synchronised and multi-user, multi-location 
and internet redundant.

My Grandfather was an engineer in Radio, making the first every remote 
control toy in Australia for my dad, and his book towards the end of his 
career demonstrated how very often good ideas are lost in time and are only 
sometimes rediscovered or redeveloped. Perhaps it is my "late stage career" 
in IT that I am starting to see such examples proliferate as well. Many of 
these ideas are reinvented multiple times as if totally new. 

Regards
Tones

On Tuesday, 20 July 2021 at 07:29:13 UTC+10 Álvaro wrote:

> Joshua, there is the Fluid framework for collaborative web applications. 
> Although you surely know it. https://github.com/microsoft/FluidFramework
>
> El lunes, 19 de julio de 2021 a las 18:53:50 UTC+2, Stobot escribió:
>
>> I'm excited to hear about any new efforts on multi-user Joshua! I'm sure 
>> very hard, but game changing functionality for team TiddlyWiki usage!! I 
>> continue to try and use BOB for this, but the reconnect process is so 
>> spotty that it's difficult to get traction. 
>>
>> On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 7:14:25 AM UTC-4 ludwa6 wrote:
>>
>>> Hard problem indeed, @Joshua, in domains where there needs be one 
>>> definitive source of truth... But in any problem space where there is room 
>>> for different versions of truth (the case in many applications of TW tech), 
>>> perhaps it needn't be so hard?  
>>>
>>> Without knowing which sub-species of the multiplayer problem you are 
>>> busy solving, i will say that i for one am these days more interested in 
>>> the problem-space where different versions of truth are respected & 
>>> included (or TRANScluded, as the case may be) than i am in the space where 
>>> one version must win out over all others.  
>>>
>>> For example: ii think Ward Cunningham was wise to sidestep all that 
>>> backstage ugliness of Wikipedia's "Consensus Engine" in developing his 
>>> Smallest 
>>> Federated Wiki 
>>> model.  
>>> (THAT in fact is my dream for how this TW multiverse eventually develops 
>>> some navigable wormholes between its many dimensions <8-)
>>>
>>> /walt
>>>
>>> On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 4:24:00 AM UTC+1 joshua@gmail.com wrote:
>>>
 I am getting very close to a "multiplayer" solution. It's definitely 
 one of the "Hard Problems": 
 https://gigaom.com/2009/05/10/why-sync-is-so-difficult/

 Best,
 Joshua Fontany

 On Friday, July 16, 2021 at 5:59:57 AM UTC-7 ludwa6 wrote:

> @PMario: just to say thanks (again!) for sharing another treasure of 
> the TW world -TiddlyWeb API Explorer 
>  in this case. 
> As per my post to this other thread 
> ,  it opened my 
> eyes to the possibility of an OpenAPI Explorer in TW -and i'd love to 
> know 
> what you think about that, either in that other thread or via DM (this 
> one's really not about that).
>
> On this topic, i can only say: i share Xavier's interest in the idea 
> of connecting TW as front end to a backend server with muli-user / 
> multi-edit capability.  Of course that old problem of edit conflict 
> avoidance/ resolution would need to be solved, but i have trouble 
> accepting 
> that as a real stopper in this day -although from what i gather (from 
> email exchange with dev Chris Dent), TiddlyWeb is not likely to be the 
> place where such functionality will emerge.   If there be some other 
> place 
> to look for solutions, it'd be great if someone could share info about 
> that 
> here!
>
> /walt
>
>
> On Wednesday, July 14, 2021 at 1:51:49 PM UTC+1 PMario wrote:
>
>> On Wednesday, July 14, 2021 at 1:38:46 PM UTC+2 

[tw5] Re: RFC: Building a macro solution for top-to-botton

[TW Tones]

Eric,

Thanks for sharing that solution. 

Given the objective of this thread, are you suggesting the top-to-bottom" 
tools should include a history tab or navigation?

Regards
Tones

On Tuesday, 20 July 2021 at 07:05:37 UTC+10 Eric Shulman wrote:

> On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 1:03:12 PM UTC-7 springer wrote:
>
>> I wonder whether it would be possible to get the best of both worlds: 
>> allow multiple tiddlers in the story view, but "go back" to most recently 
>> active place in the story-river (other open tiddler in which most recent 
>> click happened if possible, or most recently opened from sidebar if not) 
>>
>
> Give this a try:
> http://tiddlytools.com/InsideTW/#TiddlyTools%2FHistory
> which adds a "History" command button to the tiddler toolbar.
>
> To install, just grab the tiddler's title, then drag-and drop it into your 
> document.  Although the interaction doesn't exactly match your wish list 
> (it uses a popup dialog and has no keyboard control... yet), it *does* make 
> it much easier to jump around in the Story view without having to manually 
> scroll back to where you were.  There's also these two extra toolbar 
> buttons that bypass the the popup dialog and simply navigate to the 
> corresponding tiddler with just one click.
> http://tiddlytools.com/InsideTW/#TiddlyTools%2FHistory%2FPrevious
> http://tiddlytools.com/InsideTW/#TiddlyTools%2FHistory%2FNext
>
> enjoy,
> -e
>

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[tw5] Re: RFC: Building a macro solution for top-to-botton

[TW Tones]

Springer,

Thanks for that insight. I built a separate tool called focus tiddler ie 
the tiddler with user focus, it included something like Erics History tab, 
but also as I mentioned in the original post allow us "navigate to the last 
opened or edited tiddler". In my (as yet unpublished) focus tiddler 
solution (not that I was proposing here) I had a viewToolbar button (could 
be in edit as well) to override the last opened or edited tiddler, that is 
make any tiddler in the story the focused tiddler. Your feed back makes me 
ask if perhaps allow selecting secondary tiddler as say the "focused work 
tiddler" and that what ever the navigation activity "the last opened or 
edited tiddler", that it would be easy to return to the "focused work 
tiddler". ie the one where one is taking notes or reading to manage your 
work flow (eg syllabus or class notes).

I too use the classic story view as a rule, finding the others frustrating, 
as a result I know little about their use. 

My learnings from your reply include

   - Your desire to go back - I will look at incorporating that.
  - the history tab helps here.
  - I wonder the best way to select the tiddler to go back to (not just 
  the last)
   - Getting keyboard shortcuts for any navigational component )inc top and 
   bottom story and sidebar)
  - I would like to add a keyboard short cut to wikitext buttons I 
  define - not sure how yet.
   - Would it be important to reopen a  "focused work tiddler" if closed?
  - Then you could close all, display something then return.
   - Perhaps use a modifier to a shortcut to open/reopen a  "focused work 
   tiddler" for edit, 

In closing, my focused tiddler method will go some way to meeting your 
requirement, using the history tab will help even further, but you need 
that tab displayed on the sidebar. The history tab is refreshed each Wiki 
session (reload), this is something to do before a "class or presentation" 
because you can easily return to a tiddler you opened during the session, 
the list is limited to those you have opened or edited which is helpful.

Regards
Tones

On Tuesday, 20 July 2021 at 06:03:12 UTC+10 springer wrote:

> Tones,
>
> For "top to bottom": The most useful navigational add-ins, for my 
> use-cases, are keyboard-driven. When desired tiddlers are scrolled out of 
> view *and* this feels like an especially distracting obstacle (say, because 
> I'm teaching, and wish to resume the prior discussion after jumping to a 
> tangent), having to coordinate with the cursor is half the battle. 
>
> For various reasons, the "classic" story view (rather than pop or zoomin) 
> is what I usually choose... but I wonder whether it would be possible to 
> get the best of both worlds: allow multiple tiddlers in the story view, but 
> "go back" to most recently active place in the story-river (other open 
> tiddler in which most recent click happened if possible, or most recently 
> opened from sidebar if not) when I close something? That's probably beyond 
> what you're developing, but just one related hankering.
>
> -Springer
>
> On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 9:44:22 AM UTC-4 TW Tones wrote:
>
>>
>> Folks,
>>
>> I just wanted to share that as I happen to be under a "stay at home" 
>> order in Sydney because of a covid-19 D strain outbreak, I have being 
>> focusing on some tiddlywiki tools development. I have one large project, 
>> but while working on that it spawns a lot of little tools, born from the 
>> innovation and my experience using tiddlywiki a lot, that tiddlywiki always 
>> inspires in me.
>>
>> I thought I would issue an RFC or "request for comment" on my little 
>> project called "top to bottom"
>>
>> I am designing a set of tools so you can easily navigate from the top to 
>> bottom, also bottom to top, of the story with a single click, also to the 
>> top of the side bar if you have a long one. It also uses a little trick to 
>> ensure the last tiddler (especially if little) appears at the top of the 
>> page if you navigate to it (rather than appearing at the bottom with 
>> previous tiddler above it.
>>
>> These seem trivial but they can improve your work flow and navigation 
>> speed if you have a number of tiddlers open.
>>
>> However this is where the request for comment comes in, can you suggest 
>> any related features I could include so the macros are even more useful and 
>> fit into the title top-to-bottom.
>>
>> Please let me know if you have a desire for other related features
>>
>> Finally shall I include the ability to navigate to the last opened or 
>> edited tiddler no matter where is is in the story.
>>
>> Post script, I would love some help generating a library in which to 
>> publish my tools, I have perhaps hundreds, I have not yet published.
>>
>> Regards
>> Tones/Tony
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>

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[tw5] Re: Incremental note-taking (article/discussion)

[Charlie Veniot]

On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 6:15:18 PM UTC-3 David Gifford wrote:

> ...
>  
>
3. It would be interesting to know the personality types (whether using 
> Myers-Briggs or OCEAN) that gravitate toward certain notetaking tools. This 
> person seems like he could be an OCD type, feeling the need to have all 
> information organized thoroughly.
>

That could easily need a dedicated Google Group.  I find that kind of stuff 
wildly interesting.

Could be OCD, could be ADHD (attention-regulation disorder), could be so 
many things or mix of things ...

Could even be just a matter of continuously tweaking to get it to the right 
cognitive place (i.e. it mirrors current knowledge and comprehension, and 
getting it organized jst right makes everything still in the brain 
instantly coalesce at the mere sight of both the information bread crumbs 
and the organization of the information bread crumbs.)


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[tw5] Re: OpenAPI Explorer in TW

[PMario]

Hi Walt,

After I did send my last post, I did find the new docs for version 2 of 
farmOS. I can see your dilemma 
 now. 

The question is, do you want to explore the V2 API or the V1.x API. It 
seems they are fundamentally different. 

-mario

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Re: [tw5] Re: Just the UI of tiddlywiki

[Álvaro]

Joshua, there is the Fluid framework for collaborative web applications. 
Although you surely know it. https://github.com/microsoft/FluidFramework

El lunes, 19 de julio de 2021 a las 18:53:50 UTC+2, Stobot escribió:

> I'm excited to hear about any new efforts on multi-user Joshua! I'm sure 
> very hard, but game changing functionality for team TiddlyWiki usage!! I 
> continue to try and use BOB for this, but the reconnect process is so 
> spotty that it's difficult to get traction. 
>
> On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 7:14:25 AM UTC-4 ludwa6 wrote:
>
>> Hard problem indeed, @Joshua, in domains where there needs be one 
>> definitive source of truth... But in any problem space where there is room 
>> for different versions of truth (the case in many applications of TW tech), 
>> perhaps it needn't be so hard?  
>>
>> Without knowing which sub-species of the multiplayer problem you are busy 
>> solving, i will say that i for one am these days more interested in the 
>> problem-space where different versions of truth are respected & included 
>> (or TRANScluded, as the case may be) than i am in the space where one 
>> version must win out over all others.  
>>
>> For example: ii think Ward Cunningham was wise to sidestep all that 
>> backstage ugliness of Wikipedia's "Consensus Engine" in developing his 
>> Smallest 
>> Federated Wiki 
>> model.  
>> (THAT in fact is my dream for how this TW multiverse eventually develops 
>> some navigable wormholes between its many dimensions <8-)
>>
>> /walt
>>
>> On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 4:24:00 AM UTC+1 joshua@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>> I am getting very close to a "multiplayer" solution. It's definitely one 
>>> of the "Hard Problems": 
>>> https://gigaom.com/2009/05/10/why-sync-is-so-difficult/
>>>
>>> Best,
>>> Joshua Fontany
>>>
>>> On Friday, July 16, 2021 at 5:59:57 AM UTC-7 ludwa6 wrote:
>>>
 @PMario: just to say thanks (again!) for sharing another treasure of 
 the TW world -TiddlyWeb API Explorer 
  in this case. 
 As per my post to this other thread 
 ,  it opened my 
 eyes to the possibility of an OpenAPI Explorer in TW -and i'd love to know 
 what you think about that, either in that other thread or via DM (this 
 one's really not about that).

 On this topic, i can only say: i share Xavier's interest in the idea of 
 connecting TW as front end to a backend server with muli-user / multi-edit 
 capability.  Of course that old problem of edit conflict avoidance/ 
 resolution would need to be solved, but i have trouble accepting that as a 
 real stopper in this day -although from what i gather (from email 
 exchange with dev Chris Dent), TiddlyWeb is not likely to be the place 
 where such functionality will emerge.   If there be some other place to 
 look for solutions, it'd be great if someone could share info about that 
 here!

 /walt


 On Wednesday, July 14, 2021 at 1:51:49 PM UTC+1 PMario wrote:

> On Wednesday, July 14, 2021 at 1:38:46 PM UTC+2 somen...@gmail.com 
> wrote:
> ...
>
>> I will look into the code but it's a pitty to be TW2. Perhaps someone 
>> could point to me where is the code of the UI in the code of official 
>> tiddlywiki5. 
>>
>
> Hi Xavier,
>
> I think there is a bit of a misunderstanding how TiddlyWiki works. ... 
> TiddlyWiki is a self-contained single file wiki. ... No server is needed 
> other than for serving a 
> single file resource. 
>
> TLDR;
> I think it would be good, if you explain a bit closer what you want to 
> do. 
>
> --
>
> If you open tiddlywiki.com it's served from a github page as a single 
> 6MByte index.html file. ... Since github does server side compression 
> only 
> about 2Mbyte are sent to the client. 
>
> Everything you see UI wise is rendered on the client. ... It would be 
> the same experience if I would send you myWiki.hmtl by e-mail. 
>
> If I "permalink" to eg: https://tiddlywiki.com/#HelloThere  the 
> browser will open the HelloThere tiddler, because the whole content is 
> already in the client. No server is involved, the core code "catches" the 
> URI fragment and displays the tiddler.
>
> -
>
> A TiddlyWeb server will also "only" create a single resource if you 
> request https: //your-uri/index.html ... It will build the html file 
> server 
> side and send it as 1 file, that contains code, UI and data to the 
> client. 
>
> The advantage of TiddlyWeb is, that you also have some API routes that 
> will let you request recipes, bags and single tiddlers, without any TW UI 
> as text or JSON. There is a 

[tw5] Re: OpenAPI Explorer in TW

[PMario]

On Thursday, July 15, 2021 at 6:10:22 PM UTC+2 ludwa6 wrote:

The problem is: the farmOS system  i use for 
> operational record-keeping is undergoing a major upgrade to version 2.0; 
> this presents a data migration challenge for me & the agronomist i'm 
> working with that would be greatly facilitated by an API Explorer.
>

I don't understand this. ... As far as I know, Drupal which is used as a 
backend for farmOS uses a database to store all the values. ... The "data 
migration" which is needed between different application versions should be 
done on the database level and not on the "user level". 

There may be new or different API options, but they need to be documented, 
otherwise an API explorer can't be created, because nobody would know how 
the different URLs need to look like. .. 

 

>   Good news is: farmOS has an OpenAPI that can be easily explored using this 
> open-source farmOS.py library  -by 
> anyone with adequate python chops, that is.  If only that were me!  But 
> really: wouldn't it be so much nicer to explore the API using something 
> like that TiddlyWeb API Explorer -a python project, as it happens.
>

There seems to be an farmOS.js, which would probably be easier to use with 
TW. 
 
-mario

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[tw5] Re: Incremental note-taking (article/discussion)

[David Gifford]

Hi Si

I read this the other day but didn't have time to comment. Now I am done 
getting ready for our trip tomorrow and I have a moment to breathe. My 
thoughts:

1. Fascinating that this is the *opposite* of Evergreen notes, which is all 
the rage now.
2. I think it would make more sense to allow overwriting notes, but take a 
moment to think things through in the moment: might I need this version's 
info later? Like Tones said, a combination approach. There could be 
academic fields or professions where tracking the development of one's 
thoughts is pretty important. But probably most people would feel fine 
adding to or updating a note.
3. It would be interesting to know the personality types (whether using 
Myers-Briggs or OCEAN) that gravitate toward certain notetaking tools. This 
person seems like he could be an OCD type, feeling the need to have all 
information organized thoroughly.
4. The article seems also to be pre-release propaganda for the Idea Flow 
product. Probably best just to evaluate Idea flow when it becomes available 
for preview. Maybe seeing it work will give us an idea on how to implement 
in a useful way.
On Thursday, July 15, 2021 at 2:18:48 PM UTC-5 Si wrote:

> I just came across this post: https://thesephist.com/posts/inc/, and it 
> challenges a lot of my own views on effective note-taking practices, so I 
> thought it was worth sharing here.
>
> The author advocates for a kind of chronological system, where as a rule 
> notes are never updated after they are made, meaning that they retain a 
> fixed position in time. It kind of reminded me of Soren's random thoughts: 
> https://randomthoughts.sorenbjornstad.com/
>
> Anyway this approach seems completely counter to my current approach to 
> note-taking, where I want my notes to represent ideas that I am building 
> over time with little regard to where or when they originally came from.
>
> I'm not particularly convinced, but I'm curious if anyone here has any 
> thoughts? Do you see any advantages to this approach? Disadvantages? Do you 
> think it could gel with the zettelkasten philosophy, or are they polar 
> opposites?
>
> Just interested in hearing other peoples thoughts.
>

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Re: [tw5] Re: Introducing: the Subsume plugin.

[scot]

Thank you for quick reply Brian.
i will give it a try.

Kind Regards,
Scot
On Monday, 19 July 2021 at 21:25:50 UTC+1 Brian Radspinner wrote:

> If you overwrite the shadow tiddler *$:/plugins/giffmex/subsume/macro/* 
> with the following: 
>
> \relink subsume tid
> \define subsume(tid:"" *field:"text"*) <$view 
> tiddler="$tid$" field="title"/><$link 
> to="$tid$">* class="indent1"><$transclude tiddler="$tid$" *field=$field$* 
> mode="block"/>
>
> ...you can then specify a field to display besides text, but text will be 
> the default if you leave it off. Example:
>
> <$list filter="[collection[foo]sort[title]]">
> <$macrocall $name=subsume tid=<> field="f1"/>
> 
> On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 1:00:04 PM UTC-7 scot wrote:
>
>> Thanks @ David Gifford for another great tool.
>>
>> Hello @Brian Radspinner,
>> Can you tell me how to expand the filter to include additional tiddler 
>> fields other than title.
>> e.g. {{!!f1}}
>>
>> The example below doesn't work.
>>
>> <$list filter="[object-type[task]sort[title]]">
>>
>> <$macrocall $name=subsume tid=<>/>
>> {{!!f1}}
>> 
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Scot
>> On Monday, 19 July 2021 at 13:09:31 UTC+1 David Gifford wrote:
>>
>>> Wow, nice to wake up to find a question and someone already answered it! 
>>> Thanks Brian
>>>
>>> On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 1:10:30 AM UTC-5 Sapphireslinger wrote:
>>>
 Brian, thank you so much! It works!

 On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 10:50:59 AM UTC+8 Brian Radspinner wrote:

> @sapphireslinger give this a try:
>
> <$list filter="[collection[foo]sort[title]]">
> <$macrocall $name=subsume tid=<>/>
> 
>
> On Sunday, July 18, 2021 at 7:35:56 PM UTC-7 Sapphireslinger wrote:
>
>> David, thank you so much for this Subsume plugin. May I ask how to 
>> use it in a list filter?
>>
>> This works:
>>
>> <$list filter="[collection[foo]sort[title]]">
>> <$details summary={{!!title}}>
>> <$transclude field="text" mode="block"/>
>> 
>> 
>>
>> This does not work:
>>
>> <$list filter="[collection[foo]sort[title]]">
>> <$subsume summary={{!!title}}>
>> <$transclude field="text" mode="block"/>
>> 
>> 
>>
>> Nor does this:
>>
>> <$list filter="[collection[foo]sort[title]]">
>> <>
>> 
>> On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 9:06:23 AM UTC+8 stan...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>> David, I'm here looking at Control Panel -> Keyboard Shortcuts and I 
>>> think we are saying the same thing after all.   
>>> Thanks,
>>> Stan
>>>
>>> On Sunday, July 18, 2021 at 2:38:59 PM UTC-4 David Gifford wrote:
>>>
 Hi Stan

 Walt's screenshot tells me that Streams and Subsume are in separate 
 sections. Not so much integrated as juxtaposed. 
 Subsume is edited in edit mode and appears above in view mode.
 Streams is edited in view mode and appears below in view mode.

 Unfortunately I don't know anything about keybindings. If you mean 
 keyboard shortcuts, yes, Control Panel > Keyboard shortcuts, see the 
 last 
 three items. 

 *autolist-newline* Add a newline and list markup if in a list Enter 

 *autolist-indent* Indent a line in a list Tab 

 *autolist-unindent* Unindent a line in a list shift-Tab 

 That is most likely the problem! Even so, that is strange, since 
 Streams and Noteline are in different contexts (view vs edit). Feel 
 free to 
 tweak Notelines to your needs, with other keyboard shortcuts or 
 whatnot. 
 Blessings,

 David Gifford
 Mexico team leader, Mexico City

 *Resonate Global Mission*
 *Engaging People. Embracing Christ.*
 A Ministry of the Christian Reformed Church
 resonateglobalmission.org


 On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 12:08 PM stan...@gmail.com <
 stan...@gmail.com> wrote:

> My problem seems not to be from the integration of Subsume and 
> Streams.  I was using David's Notelines 2 as the base Tiddlywiki and 
> if I 
> add Streams, but not Subsume, I get the same behavior - a  does 
> not 
> create a new block.  
>
> In any event, I used Subsume this weekend to write an article.  
> How nice it was it write modularly, in a manner that made sense and 
> was 
> perfectly efficient.  
>
> David, do you have any idea what in Notelines 2 might be the 
> offending keybinding?
> Thanks, in advvance,
> Stan
>
>
> On Sunday, July 18, 2021 at 9:48:45 AM UTC-4 stan...@gmail.com 
> wrote:
>
>> I am looking at Walt's posting below and wondering how he got 
>> Subsume to work with Streams.   I had a wiki with Streams and added 
>> 

[tw5] Re: RFC: Building a macro solution for top-to-botton

[Eric Shulman]

On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 1:03:12 PM UTC-7 springer wrote:

> I wonder whether it would be possible to get the best of both worlds: 
> allow multiple tiddlers in the story view, but "go back" to most recently 
> active place in the story-river (other open tiddler in which most recent 
> click happened if possible, or most recently opened from sidebar if not) 
>

Give this a try:
http://tiddlytools.com/InsideTW/#TiddlyTools%2FHistory
which adds a "History" command button to the tiddler toolbar.

To install, just grab the tiddler's title, then drag-and drop it into your 
document.  Although the interaction doesn't exactly match your wish list 
(it uses a popup dialog and has no keyboard control... yet), it *does* make 
it much easier to jump around in the Story view without having to manually 
scroll back to where you were.  There's also these two extra toolbar 
buttons that bypass the the popup dialog and simply navigate to the 
corresponding tiddler with just one click.
http://tiddlytools.com/InsideTW/#TiddlyTools%2FHistory%2FPrevious
http://tiddlytools.com/InsideTW/#TiddlyTools%2FHistory%2FNext

enjoy,
-e

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Re: [tw5] Artwork for v5.2.0

[Jeremy Ruston]

> Although I haven't done any further design work, I did replace the existing 
> green "tw-mask" graphic with a variant sitting on my desktop that represents 
> my "lightest and leanest" graphic attempt, coming in at 10K, and pasted 
> below. For what it's worth, I see 20 candidates, rather than 18, though some 
> are fairly redundant. I'm happy to tweak the gallery site 
> (https://tw-logo-contest.tiddlyhost.com/) to display only your winnowed batch 
> on the HelloThere tiddler, assuming everyone's ok with that proposal. 

Thank you, I will also transfer the images over to Google Forms, which I have 
previously used for voting. Hopefully tomorrow, and I'll make a new post 
announcing the voting.

Many thanks,

Jeremy



> 
> -Springer
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 8:11:12 AM UTC-4 jeremy...@gmail.com wrote:
>> As is the way of these things, it took a little longer to get v5.2.0 ready 
>> for release, but now I think we’re ready to run the voting part of the 
>> competition, and close the competition to new submissions.
>> 
>> Thank you to everyone who has entered. The results are impressive, and the 
>> discussion here has been interesting, and I hope will bear fruit in other 
>> projects in the future.
>> 
>> There are currently 18 entries listed at 
>> https://tw-logo-contest.tiddlyhost.com, a lot more than we’ve had before.
>> 
>> In some cases we’ve got some very similar variants which risks splitting the 
>> vote for a design.
>> 
>> So, unless anybody has a better suggestion, I will choose my preferred 
>> variant of each design as I prepare the voting form.
>> 
>> Best wishes
>> 
>> Jeremy
>> 
>> 
 On 2 Jul 2021, at 01:45, TW Tones  wrote:
 
>>> All especially those with competition entries,
>>> 
>>> Love all this work, wish I had these image design skills. Whatever wins it 
>>> would be nice to collect the final submissions (and previous ones) as 
>>> collateral people building a wiki could use, on there home tiddler, as 
>>> icons, favicons (sometimes), Wiki or tiddler backgrounds, or images 
>>> especially when demonstrating a feature of that release.
>>> 
>>> When you drag and drop a tiddler to a valid location you see a mouse 
>>> pointer and a little box with a plus, on my browsers at least. Perhaps 
>>> stamping your design with this would promote the drag features of the new 
>>> version. I suggest a different color just to stop people confusing with 
>>> their own mouse pointer.
>>> 
>>> Regards
>>> Tones
>>> 
>>> 
> On Wednesday, 30 June 2021 at 07:30:50 UTC+10 james.w@gmail.com wrote:
> I meant @springer, not whoever skinner is :)
> 
>> On Tuesday, 29 June 2021 at 22:29:33 UTC+1 James Anderson wrote:
>> Hi Frank,
>> 
>> I asked skinner to remove the alts, I was just playing on the same idea 
>> and didn't want to flood the list of choices.
>> 
>> Thanks,
>> James
>> 
>>> On Tuesday, 29 June 2021 at 21:03:12 UTC+1 f.brunsb...@gmail.com wrote:
>>> Dear all,
>>> 
>>> @springer: 
>>> Really cool your last picture ... and now in RGB style like the picture 
>>> of James "chroma-b-alt.png"... By the way, 
>>> I'm missing some pictures on tw-logo-contest.tiddlyhost.com What's 
>>> going on?
>>> 
>>> @James.W: Have I mentioned that I like your RGB series? I also like the 
>>> spirit of "emoji-field-title.png". 
>>> There might be more hints of new features swimming in the background ...
>>> 
>>> 
>>> My favourites so far are (excluding my pictures) and without ranking:
>>> 3D twisted version white.png (springer)
>>> dark-fields.png (springer)
>>> json-file-icon-semi-alpha.png (Mohammad)
>>> chroma-b-alt.png (James W)
>>> emoji-field-title.png (James W)
>>> and even if its shine is slowly fading:
>>> iamdar-1.png (IAmDarthMole)
>>> 
>>> I agree with Jeremy, perhaps such a contest would be useful for an 
>>> advertising banner. For a simple release number, the effort is great, 
>>> because unfortunately it will soon be replaced again. An advertising 
>>> banner, if without a number, can at least be used for longer.
>>> 
>>> A fixed scheme (e.g. logo on the left side, release number on the right 
>>> side, colours fixed in advance) and ... instead an advertising banner 
>>> on "HelloThere" in the background? I would, I like that.
>>> 
>>> Here for this competition I would have liked something like an end 
>>> date, a deadline. Perhaps also a maximum number of inputs.
>>> As I see it, the many beautiful pictures, only a small number of people 
>>> have created. More outdoor advertising for such actions is needed. This 
>>> in turn generates more "word of mouth". More people, more ideas, 
>>> finished faster. 
>>> 
>>> I will not post any new pictures now. Not that I don't enjoy it. But I 
>>> don't get to do anything else.
>>> However, I am happy to accept 

Re: [tw5] Re: Introducing: the Subsume plugin.

[Brian Radspinner]

If you overwrite the shadow tiddler *$:/plugins/giffmex/subsume/macro/* 
with the following: 

\relink subsume tid
\define subsume(tid:"" *field:"text"*) <$view 
tiddler="$tid$" field="title"/><$link 
to="$tid$">*<$transclude tiddler="$tid$" *field=$field$* 
mode="block"/>

...you can then specify a field to display besides text, but text will be 
the default if you leave it off. Example:

<$list filter="[collection[foo]sort[title]]">
<$macrocall $name=subsume tid=<> field="f1"/>

On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 1:00:04 PM UTC-7 scot wrote:

> Thanks @ David Gifford for another great tool.
>
> Hello @Brian Radspinner,
> Can you tell me how to expand the filter to include additional tiddler 
> fields other than title.
> e.g. {{!!f1}}
>
> The example below doesn't work.
>
> <$list filter="[object-type[task]sort[title]]">
>
> <$macrocall $name=subsume tid=<>/>
> {{!!f1}}
> 
>
> Thanks,
> Scot
> On Monday, 19 July 2021 at 13:09:31 UTC+1 David Gifford wrote:
>
>> Wow, nice to wake up to find a question and someone already answered it! 
>> Thanks Brian
>>
>> On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 1:10:30 AM UTC-5 Sapphireslinger wrote:
>>
>>> Brian, thank you so much! It works!
>>>
>>> On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 10:50:59 AM UTC+8 Brian Radspinner wrote:
>>>
 @sapphireslinger give this a try:

 <$list filter="[collection[foo]sort[title]]">
 <$macrocall $name=subsume tid=<>/>
 

 On Sunday, July 18, 2021 at 7:35:56 PM UTC-7 Sapphireslinger wrote:

> David, thank you so much for this Subsume plugin. May I ask how to use 
> it in a list filter?
>
> This works:
>
> <$list filter="[collection[foo]sort[title]]">
> <$details summary={{!!title}}>
> <$transclude field="text" mode="block"/>
> 
> 
>
> This does not work:
>
> <$list filter="[collection[foo]sort[title]]">
> <$subsume summary={{!!title}}>
> <$transclude field="text" mode="block"/>
> 
> 
>
> Nor does this:
>
> <$list filter="[collection[foo]sort[title]]">
> <>
> 
> On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 9:06:23 AM UTC+8 stan...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> David, I'm here looking at Control Panel -> Keyboard Shortcuts and I 
>> think we are saying the same thing after all.   
>> Thanks,
>> Stan
>>
>> On Sunday, July 18, 2021 at 2:38:59 PM UTC-4 David Gifford wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Stan
>>>
>>> Walt's screenshot tells me that Streams and Subsume are in separate 
>>> sections. Not so much integrated as juxtaposed. 
>>> Subsume is edited in edit mode and appears above in view mode.
>>> Streams is edited in view mode and appears below in view mode.
>>>
>>> Unfortunately I don't know anything about keybindings. If you mean 
>>> keyboard shortcuts, yes, Control Panel > Keyboard shortcuts, see the 
>>> last 
>>> three items. 
>>>
>>> *autolist-newline* Add a newline and list markup if in a list Enter 
>>>
>>> *autolist-indent* Indent a line in a list Tab 
>>>
>>> *autolist-unindent* Unindent a line in a list shift-Tab 
>>>
>>> That is most likely the problem! Even so, that is strange, since 
>>> Streams and Noteline are in different contexts (view vs edit). Feel 
>>> free to 
>>> tweak Notelines to your needs, with other keyboard shortcuts or 
>>> whatnot. 
>>> Blessings,
>>>
>>> David Gifford
>>> Mexico team leader, Mexico City
>>>
>>> *Resonate Global Mission*
>>> *Engaging People. Embracing Christ.*
>>> A Ministry of the Christian Reformed Church
>>> resonateglobalmission.org
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 12:08 PM stan...@gmail.com <
>>> stan...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
 My problem seems not to be from the integration of Subsume and 
 Streams.  I was using David's Notelines 2 as the base Tiddlywiki and 
 if I 
 add Streams, but not Subsume, I get the same behavior - a  does 
 not 
 create a new block.  

 In any event, I used Subsume this weekend to write an article.  How 
 nice it was it write modularly, in a manner that made sense and was 
 perfectly efficient.  

 David, do you have any idea what in Notelines 2 might be the 
 offending keybinding?
 Thanks, in advvance,
 Stan


 On Sunday, July 18, 2021 at 9:48:45 AM UTC-4 stan...@gmail.com 
 wrote:

> I am looking at Walt's posting below and wondering how he got 
> Subsume to work with Streams.   I had a wiki with Streams and added 
> Subsume; when I went to add content using Streams, the carriage 
> return  
> would just position the cursor in the next line in the same block, 
> rather 
> than create a new block.  I assume that there is a keybinding that is 
> overwritten somewhere, but I just don't know where to start 

[tw5] Re: RFC: Building a macro solution for top-to-botton

[springer]

Tones,

For "top to bottom": The most useful navigational add-ins, for my 
use-cases, are keyboard-driven. When desired tiddlers are scrolled out of 
view *and* this feels like an especially distracting obstacle (say, because 
I'm teaching, and wish to resume the prior discussion after jumping to a 
tangent), having to coordinate with the cursor is half the battle. 

For various reasons, the "classic" story view (rather than pop or zoomin) 
is what I usually choose... but I wonder whether it would be possible to 
get the best of both worlds: allow multiple tiddlers in the story view, but 
"go back" to most recently active place in the story-river (other open 
tiddler in which most recent click happened if possible, or most recently 
opened from sidebar if not) when I close something? That's probably beyond 
what you're developing, but just one related hankering.

-Springer

On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 9:44:22 AM UTC-4 TW Tones wrote:

>
> Folks,
>
> I just wanted to share that as I happen to be under a "stay at home" order 
> in Sydney because of a covid-19 D strain outbreak, I have being focusing on 
> some tiddlywiki tools development. I have one large project, but while 
> working on that it spawns a lot of little tools, born from the innovation 
> and my experience using tiddlywiki a lot, that tiddlywiki always inspires 
> in me.
>
> I thought I would issue an RFC or "request for comment" on my little 
> project called "top to bottom"
>
> I am designing a set of tools so you can easily navigate from the top to 
> bottom, also bottom to top, of the story with a single click, also to the 
> top of the side bar if you have a long one. It also uses a little trick to 
> ensure the last tiddler (especially if little) appears at the top of the 
> page if you navigate to it (rather than appearing at the bottom with 
> previous tiddler above it.
>
> These seem trivial but they can improve your work flow and navigation 
> speed if you have a number of tiddlers open.
>
> However this is where the request for comment comes in, can you suggest 
> any related features I could include so the macros are even more useful and 
> fit into the title top-to-bottom.
>
> Please let me know if you have a desire for other related features
>
> Finally shall I include the ability to navigate to the last opened or 
> edited tiddler no matter where is is in the story.
>
> Post script, I would love some help generating a library in which to 
> publish my tools, I have perhaps hundreds, I have not yet published.
>
> Regards
> Tones/Tony
>
>
>
>
>
>

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Re: [tw5] Re: Introducing: the Subsume plugin.

[scot]

Thanks @ David Gifford for another great tool.

Hello @Brian Radspinner,
Can you tell me how to expand the filter to include additional tiddler 
fields other than title.
e.g. {{!!f1}}

The example below doesn't work.

<$list filter="[object-type[task]sort[title]]">

<$macrocall $name=subsume tid=<>/>
{{!!f1}}


Thanks,
Scot
On Monday, 19 July 2021 at 13:09:31 UTC+1 David Gifford wrote:

> Wow, nice to wake up to find a question and someone already answered it! 
> Thanks Brian
>
> On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 1:10:30 AM UTC-5 Sapphireslinger wrote:
>
>> Brian, thank you so much! It works!
>>
>> On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 10:50:59 AM UTC+8 Brian Radspinner wrote:
>>
>>> @sapphireslinger give this a try:
>>>
>>> <$list filter="[collection[foo]sort[title]]">
>>> <$macrocall $name=subsume tid=<>/>
>>> 
>>>
>>> On Sunday, July 18, 2021 at 7:35:56 PM UTC-7 Sapphireslinger wrote:
>>>
 David, thank you so much for this Subsume plugin. May I ask how to use 
 it in a list filter?

 This works:

 <$list filter="[collection[foo]sort[title]]">
 <$details summary={{!!title}}>
 <$transclude field="text" mode="block"/>
 
 

 This does not work:

 <$list filter="[collection[foo]sort[title]]">
 <$subsume summary={{!!title}}>
 <$transclude field="text" mode="block"/>
 
 

 Nor does this:

 <$list filter="[collection[foo]sort[title]]">
 <>
 
 On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 9:06:23 AM UTC+8 stan...@gmail.com wrote:

> David, I'm here looking at Control Panel -> Keyboard Shortcuts and I 
> think we are saying the same thing after all.   
> Thanks,
> Stan
>
> On Sunday, July 18, 2021 at 2:38:59 PM UTC-4 David Gifford wrote:
>
>> Hi Stan
>>
>> Walt's screenshot tells me that Streams and Subsume are in separate 
>> sections. Not so much integrated as juxtaposed. 
>> Subsume is edited in edit mode and appears above in view mode.
>> Streams is edited in view mode and appears below in view mode.
>>
>> Unfortunately I don't know anything about keybindings. If you mean 
>> keyboard shortcuts, yes, Control Panel > Keyboard shortcuts, see the 
>> last 
>> three items. 
>>
>> *autolist-newline* Add a newline and list markup if in a list Enter 
>>
>> *autolist-indent* Indent a line in a list Tab 
>>
>> *autolist-unindent* Unindent a line in a list shift-Tab 
>>
>> That is most likely the problem! Even so, that is strange, since 
>> Streams and Noteline are in different contexts (view vs edit). Feel free 
>> to 
>> tweak Notelines to your needs, with other keyboard shortcuts or whatnot. 
>> Blessings,
>>
>> David Gifford
>> Mexico team leader, Mexico City
>>
>> *Resonate Global Mission*
>> *Engaging People. Embracing Christ.*
>> A Ministry of the Christian Reformed Church
>> resonateglobalmission.org
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 12:08 PM stan...@gmail.com  
>> wrote:
>>
>>> My problem seems not to be from the integration of Subsume and 
>>> Streams.  I was using David's Notelines 2 as the base Tiddlywiki and if 
>>> I 
>>> add Streams, but not Subsume, I get the same behavior - a  does not 
>>> create a new block.  
>>>
>>> In any event, I used Subsume this weekend to write an article.  How 
>>> nice it was it write modularly, in a manner that made sense and was 
>>> perfectly efficient.  
>>>
>>> David, do you have any idea what in Notelines 2 might be the 
>>> offending keybinding?
>>> Thanks, in advvance,
>>> Stan
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sunday, July 18, 2021 at 9:48:45 AM UTC-4 stan...@gmail.com 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 I am looking at Walt's posting below and wondering how he got 
 Subsume to work with Streams.   I had a wiki with Streams and added 
 Subsume; when I went to add content using Streams, the carriage return 
  
 would just position the cursor in the next line in the same block, 
 rather 
 than create a new block.  I assume that there is a keybinding that is 
 overwritten somewhere, but I just don't know where to start looking.  

 In any case, my first use of Subsume is a grand success.  I was 
 writing sections of an article and encapsulating then using the 
 extraction 
 tool.  Now, if only I could solve the  problem...

 Thanks,
 Stan

 On Saturday, July 17, 2021 at 11:39:42 AM UTC-4 ludwa6 wrote:

> @Dave: see bottom of attached screenshot for the two "References" 
> widgets.  Yours is folded, but when opened reveals a filter widget, 
> with 
> list of referenced tids, as you know... While the References table 
> from 
> Shiraz is partially displayed a bottom. 
> Does this help?  

Re: [tw5] Artwork for v5.2.0

[springer]

Jeremy and all,

Although I haven't done any further design work, I did replace the existing 
green "tw-mask" graphic with a variant sitting on my desktop that 
represents my "lightest and leanest" graphic attempt, coming in at 10K, and 
pasted below. For what it's worth, I see 20 candidates, rather than 18, 
though some are fairly redundant. I'm happy to tweak the gallery site 
(https://tw-logo-contest.tiddlyhost.com/) to display only your winnowed 
batch on the HelloThere tiddler, assuming everyone's ok with that proposal. 

-Springer



[image: mask-tw-flat.png]

On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 8:11:12 AM UTC-4 jeremy...@gmail.com wrote:

> As is the way of these things, it took a little longer to get v5.2.0 ready 
> for release, but now I think we’re ready to run the voting part of the 
> competition, and close the competition to new submissions.
>
> Thank you to everyone who has entered. The results are impressive, and the 
> discussion here has been interesting, and I hope will bear fruit in other 
> projects in the future.
>
> There are currently 18 entries listed at 
> https://tw-logo-contest.tiddlyhost.com, a lot more than we’ve had before.
>
> In some cases we’ve got some very similar variants which risks splitting 
> the vote for a design.
>
> So, unless anybody has a better suggestion, I will choose my preferred 
> variant of each design as I prepare the voting form.
>
> Best wishes
>
> Jeremy
>
>
> On 2 Jul 2021, at 01:45, TW Tones  wrote:
>
> All especially those with competition entries,
>
> *Love all this work, wish I had these image design skills. *Whatever wins 
> it would be nice to collect the final submissions (and previous ones) as 
> collateral people building a wiki could use, on there home tiddler, as 
> icons, favicons (sometimes), Wiki or tiddler backgrounds, or images 
> especially when demonstrating a feature of that release.
>
> When you drag and drop a tiddler to a valid location you see a mouse 
> pointer and a little box with a plus, on my browsers at least. Perhaps 
> stamping your design with this would promote the drag features of the new 
> version. I suggest a different color just to stop people confusing with 
> their own mouse pointer.
>
> Regards
> Tones
>
>
> On Wednesday, 30 June 2021 at 07:30:50 UTC+10 james.w@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> I meant @springer, not whoever skinner is :)
>>
>> On Tuesday, 29 June 2021 at 22:29:33 UTC+1 James Anderson wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Frank,
>>>
>>> I asked skinner to remove the alts, I was just playing on the same idea 
>>> and didn't want to flood the list of choices.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> James
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, 29 June 2021 at 21:03:12 UTC+1 f.brunsb...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>
 Dear all,

 *@springer: *
 Really cool your last picture ... and now in RGB style like the picture 
 of James "chroma-b-alt.png"... By the way, 
 I'm missing some pictures on tw-logo-contest.tiddlyhost.com What's 
 going on?

 *@James.W: *Have I mentioned that I like your RGB series? I also like 
 the spirit of "emoji-field-title.png". 
 There might be more hints of new features swimming in the background ...


 My favourites so far are (excluding my pictures) and without ranking:

- 3D twisted version white.png (springer)
- dark-fields.png (springer)
- json-file-icon-semi-alpha.png (Mohammad)
- chroma-b-alt.png (James W)
- emoji-field-title.png (James W)

 and even if its shine is slowly fading:

- iamdar-1.png (IAmDarthMole)


 I agree with Jeremy, perhaps such a contest would be useful for an 
 advertising banner. For a simple release number, the effort is great, 
 because unfortunately it will soon be replaced again. An advertising 
 banner, if without a number, can at least be used for longer.

 A fixed scheme (e.g. logo on the left side, release number on the right 
 side, colours fixed in advance) and ... instead an advertising banner on 
 "HelloThere" in the background? I would, I like that.

 Here for this competition I would have liked something like an end 
 date, a deadline. Perhaps also a maximum number of inputs.
 As I see it, the many beautiful pictures, only a small number of people 
 have created. More outdoor advertising for such actions is needed. This in 
 turn generates more "word of mouth". More people, more ideas, finished 
 faster. 

 I will not post any new pictures now. Not that I don't enjoy it. But I 
 don't get to do anything else.
 However, I am happy to accept requests for changes. Also who would like 
 to have the original files (is SVG) may contact me.

 When it comes to the vote for the best picture (if there is such a 
 thing), I'll be there again.

 So have fun.  Frank

 springer schrieb am Dienstag, 29. Juni 2021 um 20:14:36 UTC+2:

> With a tip of the hat to IAmDarthMole, I've been thinking 

[tw5] Re: Incremental note-taking (article/discussion)

[Si]

Thanks for the thoughtful replies everyone! I'm definitely in agreement 
with all that has been said.

>>> sorry if my end-of-day (i.e. tired!) response came off as dismissive. 

@walt Not at all!

>>> i think what we want in a note-taking system is not to *replicate* the 
human brain, but rather to *Augment* our intelligence. 

Yes I often think about this. Many tools claim to 'mimic the way humans 
think' or something, but its not obvious to me that this is necessarily. We 
should seek to understand how we think of course, but so that we can build 
tools that *interact* with our minds, not imitate them. For example, we 
didn't improve our ability to travel quickly over long distances by 
mimicking bipedalism.
On Friday, 16 July 2021 at 16:00:26 UTC+1 ludwa6 wrote:

> @Soren: I appreciate the nuanced understanding you bring to this topic. 
>
> @Si: sorry if my end-of-day (i.e. tired!) response came off as 
> dismissive.  I have since read the subject article with due attention, and 
> while i appreciate the author's perspective, i must agree w/ Soren that it 
> is not generalisable to the level of how all human brains work. Tho i am no 
> neuroscientist, i resonate strongly with the exceptions Soren points out, 
> especially in his 2nd paragraph.  The time dimension can be a powerful key 
> to recall, but so can space quite independent of time (yeah, i know: 
> space/time is one dimension, but not in the human brain -this at least IS a 
> generalisable principle) and other factors in our sensory apparatus -all of 
> which i would lump into the category of CONTEXT. 
>
> That's my take on one (#4) in the author's list of 4 "big ideas" for 
> problem-solving in this domain.  As to the 3, i must say:
>
>1. "Captured ideas are better than missed ones." YES -agree strongly.
>2. "Adding new ideas is better than updating old ones."  NO 
>-definitely not for me, mate.  I'm with Gandhi on this one -and Soren, if 
> i 
>understand him right [*]
>3. "Ideas that can’t be recalled are worse than useless."  EXACTLY! 
>They actually impede access to the useful ideas -which is why point 2 
> above 
>is so wrong, from my POV.
>
> Note [*]:  Now from a practical perspective: Does updating notes mean we 
> must sacrifice important history?  Clearly not -as various projects (Git 
> diffs, Wikipedia history, Internet Archive, etc.) prove. Are such solutions 
> good enough? You'll never get everyone to agree on any one as a canonical 
> solution to the problem.  For my purposes: a periodic push to Github, with 
> a reasonably descriptive comment after every *significant* development, 
> is good enough... But that's just me.  If we're talking about 
> "mission-critical" code, that's another matter, but not in the scope of 
> "note-taking," i would say (tho if we're talking about lab notes that must 
> eventually serve as evidence in a legal dispute over IP... Let's just not 
> go there :-)
>
> Final thought: Invoking the wisdom of Soren yet again -i.e. memory updates 
> itself over time, while retaining traces- i think what we want in a 
> note-taking system is not to *replicate* the human brain, but rather to 
> *Augment* our intelligence.  For all the talk about AI and the 
> existential risks attending to it, i'm going all-in on the idea that IA 
> (Intelligence Augmentation) is the best shot we have at ensuring that the 
> inevitable tech progression from narrow AI -> AGI -> "The Singularity" does 
> not necessarily mean the end of humankind.  It may however mean we must 
> reconcile ourselves to the idea of our progeny being post-human (whatever 
> that means)... But, enough said about that for now :-)
>
> /walt
> On Friday, July 16, 2021 at 2:43:24 PM UTC+1 Soren Bjornstad wrote:
>
>> I think the author's first principle contradicts the article: it says 
>> that "good notes should behave like memory." But actual human memory is 
>> *not* immutable, not even close; memories are changed somewhat every 
>> time we recall them. So it seems to me that a system that actually matched 
>> memory would update over time, but also retain some traces of previous 
>> versions.
>>
>> On the topic of "time is essential to how we remember," at least for me 
>> it depends on the *type* of information. If it is naturally 
>> autobiographical, or there was a particularly salient moment at which I 
>> learned the information, or it happened during a particular project or 
>> class, sure. When the thoughts are more abstract and developing over time, 
>> I absolutely cannot remember a thing about the time I had them or added to 
>> them, nor is that information particularly relevant.
>>
>> As I recall, Ted Nelson talked about adding a time dimension to 
>> hypertext, where you could easily go back and forth between different 
>> versions and see exactly what has changed in a graphical manner. Google 
>> Docs and Git both kind of do this, but I don't think they've figured out 
>> all the possibilities here...you 

Re: [tw5] Re: Just the UI of tiddlywiki

[Stobot]

I'm excited to hear about any new efforts on multi-user Joshua! I'm sure 
very hard, but game changing functionality for team TiddlyWiki usage!! I 
continue to try and use BOB for this, but the reconnect process is so 
spotty that it's difficult to get traction. 

On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 7:14:25 AM UTC-4 ludwa6 wrote:

> Hard problem indeed, @Joshua, in domains where there needs be one 
> definitive source of truth... But in any problem space where there is room 
> for different versions of truth (the case in many applications of TW tech), 
> perhaps it needn't be so hard?  
>
> Without knowing which sub-species of the multiplayer problem you are busy 
> solving, i will say that i for one am these days more interested in the 
> problem-space where different versions of truth are respected & included 
> (or TRANScluded, as the case may be) than i am in the space where one 
> version must win out over all others.  
>
> For example: ii think Ward Cunningham was wise to sidestep all that 
> backstage ugliness of Wikipedia's "Consensus Engine" in developing his 
> Smallest 
> Federated Wiki 
> model.  
> (THAT in fact is my dream for how this TW multiverse eventually develops 
> some navigable wormholes between its many dimensions <8-)
>
> /walt
>
> On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 4:24:00 AM UTC+1 joshua@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> I am getting very close to a "multiplayer" solution. It's definitely one 
>> of the "Hard Problems": 
>> https://gigaom.com/2009/05/10/why-sync-is-so-difficult/
>>
>> Best,
>> Joshua Fontany
>>
>> On Friday, July 16, 2021 at 5:59:57 AM UTC-7 ludwa6 wrote:
>>
>>> @PMario: just to say thanks (again!) for sharing another treasure of the 
>>> TW world -TiddlyWeb API Explorer 
>>>  in this case. 
>>> As per my post to this other thread 
>>> ,  it opened my 
>>> eyes to the possibility of an OpenAPI Explorer in TW -and i'd love to know 
>>> what you think about that, either in that other thread or via DM (this 
>>> one's really not about that).
>>>
>>> On this topic, i can only say: i share Xavier's interest in the idea of 
>>> connecting TW as front end to a backend server with muli-user / multi-edit 
>>> capability.  Of course that old problem of edit conflict avoidance/ 
>>> resolution would need to be solved, but i have trouble accepting that as a 
>>> real stopper in this day -although from what i gather (from email 
>>> exchange with dev Chris Dent), TiddlyWeb is not likely to be the place 
>>> where such functionality will emerge.   If there be some other place to 
>>> look for solutions, it'd be great if someone could share info about that 
>>> here!
>>>
>>> /walt
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, July 14, 2021 at 1:51:49 PM UTC+1 PMario wrote:
>>>
 On Wednesday, July 14, 2021 at 1:38:46 PM UTC+2 somen...@gmail.com 
 wrote:
 ...

> I will look into the code but it's a pitty to be TW2. Perhaps someone 
> could point to me where is the code of the UI in the code of official 
> tiddlywiki5. 
>

 Hi Xavier,

 I think there is a bit of a misunderstanding how TiddlyWiki works. ... 
 TiddlyWiki is a self-contained single file wiki. ... No server is needed 
 other than for serving a 
 single file resource. 

 TLDR;
 I think it would be good, if you explain a bit closer what you want to 
 do. 

 --

 If you open tiddlywiki.com it's served from a github page as a single 
 6MByte index.html file. ... Since github does server side compression only 
 about 2Mbyte are sent to the client. 

 Everything you see UI wise is rendered on the client. ... It would be 
 the same experience if I would send you myWiki.hmtl by e-mail. 

 If I "permalink" to eg: https://tiddlywiki.com/#HelloThere  the 
 browser will open the HelloThere tiddler, because the whole content is 
 already in the client. No server is involved, the core code "catches" the 
 URI fragment and displays the tiddler.

 -

 A TiddlyWeb server will also "only" create a single resource if you 
 request https: //your-uri/index.html ... It will build the html file 
 server 
 side and send it as 1 file, that contains code, UI and data to the client. 

 The advantage of TiddlyWeb is, that you also have some API routes that 
 will let you request recipes, bags and single tiddlers, without any TW UI 
 as text or JSON. There is a query language with which you can do server 
 side search. 

 The TW UI is about 2100 elements. If you download empty.html form 
 tiddlywiki.com you can open the *$:/ControlPanel : Info : Basic* : tab 
 and have a look a the "*Number of shadow tiddlers*": 2088 ... Most of 
 them are responsible for the TW js core and 

[tw5] Two problems with macro: displaying and refreshing

[Misterel85]

Hi,
I'm back to work on a TiddlyWiki to manage my collection of drama 
exercises, but I came across 2 problems with displaying their sources and 
refreshing that display.

Problem #1:

My 'exercises' tiddlers all refer to a 'SourceDisplay' macro to show the 
sources.
If I use a field to trigger the macro to show or hide the sources, they 
appear in 'Exercise1' tiddler, but not in 'Exercise2'. If I paste 
<> in the text field of each of the Exercise 
tiddlers, it works fine.
I suppose something like 'qualify' might solve the trick, but I don't know 
how to use it. Perhaps any of you has a better solution to suggest anyway, 
but I can make do with copying-pasting the macro call.

Problem #2 (more serious to me):
I changed the contents and title of tiddler "source1" to a more realistic 
name ('Dramaction' here) and contents and updated the the fields 
accordingly.

I made 4 dummy source tiddlers. When I deleted the 'ref_source1' field in 
'Exercise1' and replaced it with a 'ref_dramaction' field, I also noticed 
that there were now 4 sources in the list instead of 3. One line is blank, 
which I suppose is the ghost of 'source1', without any data, of course, 
since that content doesn't exist any more. It's as if old 'source1' data 
wasn't purged, or TW still expected that content to exist alongside the new 
'dramaction' content. It also happens every time I delete one of those 
fields.

Also, when I delete the 'ref_source1' field in 'Exercise2', the list of 
sources gets updated in 'Exercise1', but not in Exercise2, which showed the 
same problem as in the previous paragraph.

Thanks in advance for your help.


Here is the link to a MWE you can download, to see what I mean:

https://u.pcloud.link/publink/show?code=XZmdnCXZmtUJk3s4tCfxvYwlXQmYnXrL8RJV

And below is the macro I am talking about:

```
\define SourceDisplay(prefix:"")
<$set name="fieldCount" filter="[fields[]prefix[$prefix$]count[]]">
<$text text={{{ [match[0]then[Pas de ]else] }}} />
<$text text={{{ [!match[1]then[sources :]else[source :]]  }}} />



<$list filter="[fields[]prefix[$prefix$]sort[title]]" variable="fieldName">

<$transclude field=<>/>




\end
```

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[tw5] RFC: Building a macro solution for top-to-botton

[TW Tones]

Folks,

I just wanted to share that as I happen to be under a "stay at home" order 
in Sydney because of a covid-19 D strain outbreak, I have being focusing on 
some tiddlywiki tools development. I have one large project, but while 
working on that it spawns a lot of little tools, born from the innovation 
and my experience using tiddlywiki a lot, that tiddlywiki always inspires 
in me.

I thought I would issue an RFC or "request for comment" on my little 
project called "top to bottom"

I am designing a set of tools so you can easily navigate from the top to 
bottom, also bottom to top, of the story with a single click, also to the 
top of the side bar if you have a long one. It also uses a little trick to 
ensure the last tiddler (especially if little) appears at the top of the 
page if you navigate to it (rather than appearing at the bottom with 
previous tiddler above it.

These seem trivial but they can improve your work flow and navigation speed 
if you have a number of tiddlers open.

However this is where the request for comment comes in, can you suggest any 
related features I could include so the macros are even more useful and fit 
into the title top-to-bottom.

Please let me know if you have a desire for other related features

Finally shall I include the ability to navigate to the last opened or 
edited tiddler no matter where is is in the story.

Post script, I would love some help generating a library in which to 
publish my tools, I have perhaps hundreds, I have not yet published.

Regards
Tones/Tony





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Re: [tw5] Artwork for v5.2.0

[Jeremy Ruston]

As is the way of these things, it took a little longer to get v5.2.0 ready for 
release, but now I think we’re ready to run the voting part of the competition, 
and close the competition to new submissions.

Thank you to everyone who has entered. The results are impressive, and the 
discussion here has been interesting, and I hope will bear fruit in other 
projects in the future.

There are currently 18 entries listed at https://tw-logo-contest.tiddlyhost.com 
, a lot more than we’ve had before.

In some cases we’ve got some very similar variants which risks splitting the 
vote for a design.

So, unless anybody has a better suggestion, I will choose my preferred variant 
of each design as I prepare the voting form.

Best wishes

Jeremy


> On 2 Jul 2021, at 01:45, TW Tones  wrote:
> 
> All especially those with competition entries,
> 
> Love all this work, wish I had these image design skills. Whatever wins it 
> would be nice to collect the final submissions (and previous ones) as 
> collateral people building a wiki could use, on there home tiddler, as icons, 
> favicons (sometimes), Wiki or tiddler backgrounds, or images especially when 
> demonstrating a feature of that release.
> 
> When you drag and drop a tiddler to a valid location you see a mouse pointer 
> and a little box with a plus, on my browsers at least. Perhaps stamping your 
> design with this would promote the drag features of the new version. I 
> suggest a different color just to stop people confusing with their own mouse 
> pointer.
> 
> Regards
> Tones
> 
> 
> On Wednesday, 30 June 2021 at 07:30:50 UTC+10 james.w@gmail.com wrote:
> I meant @springer, not whoever skinner is :)
> 
> On Tuesday, 29 June 2021 at 22:29:33 UTC+1 James Anderson wrote:
> Hi Frank,
> 
> I asked skinner to remove the alts, I was just playing on the same idea and 
> didn't want to flood the list of choices.
> 
> Thanks,
> James
> 
> On Tuesday, 29 June 2021 at 21:03:12 UTC+1 f.brunsb...@gmail.com <> wrote:
> Dear all,
> 
> @springer: 
> Really cool your last picture ... and now in RGB style like the picture of 
> James "chroma-b-alt.png"... By the way, 
> I'm missing some pictures on tw-logo-contest.tiddlyhost.com 
>  What's going on?
> 
> @James.W: Have I mentioned that I like your RGB series? I also like the 
> spirit of "emoji-field-title.png". 
> There might be more hints of new features swimming in the background ...
> 
> 
> My favourites so far are (excluding my pictures) and without ranking:
> 3D twisted version white.png (springer)
> dark-fields.png (springer)
> json-file-icon-semi-alpha.png (Mohammad)
> chroma-b-alt.png (James W)
> emoji-field-title.png (James W)
> and even if its shine is slowly fading:
> iamdar-1.png (IAmDarthMole)
> 
> I agree with Jeremy, perhaps such a contest would be useful for an 
> advertising banner. For a simple release number, the effort is great, because 
> unfortunately it will soon be replaced again. An advertising banner, if 
> without a number, can at least be used for longer.
> 
> A fixed scheme (e.g. logo on the left side, release number on the right side, 
> colours fixed in advance) and ... instead an advertising banner on 
> "HelloThere" in the background? I would, I like that.
> 
> Here for this competition I would have liked something like an end date, a 
> deadline. Perhaps also a maximum number of inputs.
> As I see it, the many beautiful pictures, only a small number of people have 
> created. More outdoor advertising for such actions is needed. This in turn 
> generates more "word of mouth". More people, more ideas, finished faster. 
> 
> I will not post any new pictures now. Not that I don't enjoy it. But I don't 
> get to do anything else.
> However, I am happy to accept requests for changes. Also who would like to 
> have the original files (is SVG) may contact me.
> 
> When it comes to the vote for the best picture (if there is such a thing), 
> I'll be there again.
> 
> So have fun.  Frank
> 
> springer schrieb am Dienstag, 29. Juni 2021 um 20:14:36 UTC+2:
> With a tip of the hat to IAmDarthMole, I've been thinking for a while that 
> one logo-version that *deserves* to exist is a version that takes that json 
> mobius image posing as a zero, and makes it fit in seamlessly with the other 
> numbers. 
> 
> I like that anyone who knows about the JSON logo will "get it" but others 
> will just see a 3D-typography effect, plus drag-and-drop. As a flat png, it 
> comes in at 19K, less than I feared for a fancy set of bezier curves and 
> gradients.
> 
> I hope IAmDarthMole takes this as a constructive collaboration! I'm happy to 
> split the pile of prize money. :P
> 
> -Springer
> 
> 
> 
> On Tuesday, June 15, 2021 at 1:34:57 PM UTC-4 iamdar...@gmail.com <> wrote:
> Here a third attempt, less small things. Hopefully those that remain won't be 
> too obscure/hard to see. I wasn't able to really think of any other way to 
> 

Re: [tw5] Re: Introducing: the Subsume plugin.

[David Gifford]

Wow, nice to wake up to find a question and someone already answered it! 
Thanks Brian

On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 1:10:30 AM UTC-5 Sapphireslinger wrote:

> Brian, thank you so much! It works!
>
> On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 10:50:59 AM UTC+8 Brian Radspinner wrote:
>
>> @sapphireslinger give this a try:
>>
>> <$list filter="[collection[foo]sort[title]]">
>> <$macrocall $name=subsume tid=<>/>
>> 
>>
>> On Sunday, July 18, 2021 at 7:35:56 PM UTC-7 Sapphireslinger wrote:
>>
>>> David, thank you so much for this Subsume plugin. May I ask how to use 
>>> it in a list filter?
>>>
>>> This works:
>>>
>>> <$list filter="[collection[foo]sort[title]]">
>>> <$details summary={{!!title}}>
>>> <$transclude field="text" mode="block"/>
>>> 
>>> 
>>>
>>> This does not work:
>>>
>>> <$list filter="[collection[foo]sort[title]]">
>>> <$subsume summary={{!!title}}>
>>> <$transclude field="text" mode="block"/>
>>> 
>>> 
>>>
>>> Nor does this:
>>>
>>> <$list filter="[collection[foo]sort[title]]">
>>> <>
>>> 
>>> On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 9:06:23 AM UTC+8 stan...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>
 David, I'm here looking at Control Panel -> Keyboard Shortcuts and I 
 think we are saying the same thing after all.   
 Thanks,
 Stan

 On Sunday, July 18, 2021 at 2:38:59 PM UTC-4 David Gifford wrote:

> Hi Stan
>
> Walt's screenshot tells me that Streams and Subsume are in separate 
> sections. Not so much integrated as juxtaposed. 
> Subsume is edited in edit mode and appears above in view mode.
> Streams is edited in view mode and appears below in view mode.
>
> Unfortunately I don't know anything about keybindings. If you mean 
> keyboard shortcuts, yes, Control Panel > Keyboard shortcuts, see the last 
> three items. 
>
> *autolist-newline* Add a newline and list markup if in a list Enter 
>
> *autolist-indent* Indent a line in a list Tab 
>
> *autolist-unindent* Unindent a line in a list shift-Tab 
>
> That is most likely the problem! Even so, that is strange, since 
> Streams and Noteline are in different contexts (view vs edit). Feel free 
> to 
> tweak Notelines to your needs, with other keyboard shortcuts or whatnot. 
> Blessings,
>
> David Gifford
> Mexico team leader, Mexico City
>
> *Resonate Global Mission*
> *Engaging People. Embracing Christ.*
> A Ministry of the Christian Reformed Church
> resonateglobalmission.org
>
>
> On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 12:08 PM stan...@gmail.com  
> wrote:
>
>> My problem seems not to be from the integration of Subsume and 
>> Streams.  I was using David's Notelines 2 as the base Tiddlywiki and if 
>> I 
>> add Streams, but not Subsume, I get the same behavior - a  does not 
>> create a new block.  
>>
>> In any event, I used Subsume this weekend to write an article.  How 
>> nice it was it write modularly, in a manner that made sense and was 
>> perfectly efficient.  
>>
>> David, do you have any idea what in Notelines 2 might be the 
>> offending keybinding?
>> Thanks, in advvance,
>> Stan
>>
>>
>> On Sunday, July 18, 2021 at 9:48:45 AM UTC-4 stan...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>> I am looking at Walt's posting below and wondering how he got 
>>> Subsume to work with Streams.   I had a wiki with Streams and added 
>>> Subsume; when I went to add content using Streams, the carriage return 
>>>  
>>> would just position the cursor in the next line in the same block, 
>>> rather 
>>> than create a new block.  I assume that there is a keybinding that is 
>>> overwritten somewhere, but I just don't know where to start looking.  
>>>
>>> In any case, my first use of Subsume is a grand success.  I was 
>>> writing sections of an article and encapsulating then using the 
>>> extraction 
>>> tool.  Now, if only I could solve the  problem...
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Stan
>>>
>>> On Saturday, July 17, 2021 at 11:39:42 AM UTC-4 ludwa6 wrote:
>>>
 @Dave: see bottom of attached screenshot for the two "References" 
 widgets.  Yours is folded, but when opened reveals a filter widget, 
 with 
 list of referenced tids, as you know... While the References table 
 from 
 Shiraz is partially displayed a bottom. 
 Does this help?  
 Also: This also shows what a Streams hierarchy looks like -below 
 the HR that separates it from the several Subsume widgets above.  
 That's 
 the best i can do to answer your up-thread request for a view of my 
 workflow... But, as described in text of that tiddler, there is no 
 good way 
 at present to bring a Streams hierarchy into a single tiddler -not 
 without 
 some code magic that i don't know how to do yet!


> -- 
>> You 

Re: [tw5] Re: Just the UI of tiddlywiki

[ludwa6]

Hard problem indeed, @Joshua, in domains where there needs be one 
definitive source of truth... But in any problem space where there is room 
for different versions of truth (the case in many applications of TW tech), 
perhaps it needn't be so hard?  

Without knowing which sub-species of the multiplayer problem you are busy 
solving, i will say that i for one am these days more interested in the 
problem-space where different versions of truth are respected & included 
(or TRANScluded, as the case may be) than i am in the space where one 
version must win out over all others.  

For example: ii think Ward Cunningham was wise to sidestep all that 
backstage ugliness of Wikipedia's "Consensus Engine" in developing his Smallest 
Federated Wiki 
model.  
(THAT in fact is my dream for how this TW multiverse eventually develops 
some navigable wormholes between its many dimensions <8-)

/walt

On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 4:24:00 AM UTC+1 joshua@gmail.com wrote:

> I am getting very close to a "multiplayer" solution. It's definitely one 
> of the "Hard Problems": 
> https://gigaom.com/2009/05/10/why-sync-is-so-difficult/
>
> Best,
> Joshua Fontany
>
> On Friday, July 16, 2021 at 5:59:57 AM UTC-7 ludwa6 wrote:
>
>> @PMario: just to say thanks (again!) for sharing another treasure of the 
>> TW world -TiddlyWeb API Explorer 
>>  in this case. 
>> As per my post to this other thread 
>> ,  it opened my 
>> eyes to the possibility of an OpenAPI Explorer in TW -and i'd love to know 
>> what you think about that, either in that other thread or via DM (this 
>> one's really not about that).
>>
>> On this topic, i can only say: i share Xavier's interest in the idea of 
>> connecting TW as front end to a backend server with muli-user / multi-edit 
>> capability.  Of course that old problem of edit conflict avoidance/ 
>> resolution would need to be solved, but i have trouble accepting that as a 
>> real stopper in this day -although from what i gather (from email 
>> exchange with dev Chris Dent), TiddlyWeb is not likely to be the place 
>> where such functionality will emerge.   If there be some other place to 
>> look for solutions, it'd be great if someone could share info about that 
>> here!
>>
>> /walt
>>
>>
>> On Wednesday, July 14, 2021 at 1:51:49 PM UTC+1 PMario wrote:
>>
>>> On Wednesday, July 14, 2021 at 1:38:46 PM UTC+2 somen...@gmail.com 
>>> wrote:
>>> ...
>>>
 I will look into the code but it's a pitty to be TW2. Perhaps someone 
 could point to me where is the code of the UI in the code of official 
 tiddlywiki5. 

>>>
>>> Hi Xavier,
>>>
>>> I think there is a bit of a misunderstanding how TiddlyWiki works. ... 
>>> TiddlyWiki is a self-contained single file wiki. ... No server is needed 
>>> other than for serving a 
>>> single file resource. 
>>>
>>> TLDR;
>>> I think it would be good, if you explain a bit closer what you want to 
>>> do. 
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> If you open tiddlywiki.com it's served from a github page as a single 
>>> 6MByte index.html file. ... Since github does server side compression only 
>>> about 2Mbyte are sent to the client. 
>>>
>>> Everything you see UI wise is rendered on the client. ... It would be 
>>> the same experience if I would send you myWiki.hmtl by e-mail. 
>>>
>>> If I "permalink" to eg: https://tiddlywiki.com/#HelloThere  the browser 
>>> will open the HelloThere tiddler, because the whole content is already in 
>>> the client. No server is involved, the core code "catches" the URI fragment 
>>> and displays the tiddler.
>>>
>>> -
>>>
>>> A TiddlyWeb server will also "only" create a single resource if you 
>>> request https: //your-uri/index.html ... It will build the html file server 
>>> side and send it as 1 file, that contains code, UI and data to the client. 
>>>
>>> The advantage of TiddlyWeb is, that you also have some API routes that 
>>> will let you request recipes, bags and single tiddlers, without any TW UI 
>>> as text or JSON. There is a query language with which you can do server 
>>> side search. 
>>>
>>> The TW UI is about 2100 elements. If you download empty.html form 
>>> tiddlywiki.com you can open the *$:/ControlPanel : Info : Basic* : tab 
>>> and have a look a the "*Number of shadow tiddlers*": 2088 ... Most of 
>>> them are responsible for the TW js core and UI. The whole TW UI is built 
>>> using TW wikitext and tiddlers. 
>>>
>>> -mario
>>>
>>

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[tw5] Re: OpenAPI Explorer in TW

[ludwa6]

Yes @Joshua : that one did catch my eye -and, now that you mention it, i 
can see how much overlap there is between this particular problem space, 
and the one that TW eBooks app solves.  In both cases, it's about using TW 
to load and browse these long docs (whether eBook or API endpoint), and 
then leverage TW's magic powers of annotating, transcluding w/ backlinks, 
etc. 

In fact: seeing as how OpenAPI standard is delivering content in JSON 
format, which is native to TW core, this one should be a breeze for TW5 to 
handle, right?   After all: we're not talking here about full CRUD 
interactions w/ a db (i mean: Post, Get, Put, Delete) via API;  i just want 
to use it to browse my app's API, so i can understand & annotate it.  
Perhaps my naive (i.e. non-dev) user perspective is overly simplistic, but 
still, the question remains: is this an ugly problem or a juicy opportunity?

Bottom line: If anyone here sees this as either an opportunity they can see 
themselves solving, or else a problem that they see as too hard for some 
technical reason, i would love to hear more about it!

/walt
On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 4:18:40 AM UTC+1 joshua@gmail.com wrote:

> Hi walt,
>
> A french ebook company worked with Jeremy to develop plugins that allow 
> you to dynamically render only the text that is "onscreen", and also allows 
> you to highlight a section of text & leave annotations attached to that 
> highlight.
>
> See: https://groups.google.com/g/tiddlywiki/c/_VLufc4Svp8/m/jALzYZ09BAAJ
>
> Have fun.
> Best,
> Joshua F
>
> On Thursday, July 15, 2021 at 9:10:22 AM UTC-7 ludwa6 wrote:
>
>> Catching up on TW news (busy times down here on the farm!), i was 
>> rewarded by yet another serendipitous find in this little gem from Mario 
>> , 
>> with an embedded link to the TiddlyWeb API Explorer 
>>  -what looks on the 
>> face of it like just the solution to the biggest problem i've got sitting 
>> on my desk right now. 
>>
>> The problem is: the farmOS system  i use for 
>> operational record-keeping is undergoing a major upgrade to version 2.0; 
>> this presents a data migration challenge for me & the agronomist i'm 
>> working with that would be greatly facilitated by an API Explorer.  Good 
>> news is: farmOS has an OpenAPI that can be easily explored using this 
>> open-source farmOS.py library  -by 
>> anyone with adequate python chops, that is.  If only that were me!  But 
>> really: wouldn't it be so much nicer to explore the API using something 
>> like that TiddlyWeb API Explorer -a python project, as it happens.
>>
>> So following Mario's pointer, i reached out to developer Chris Dent, who 
>> confirmed: not only is interface written in TW Classic, it is moreover >7 
>> years old now, and he has had nothing to do w/ it (or TW, for that matter) 
>> in the years since (typical story of funding having run out).  Finally: 
>> code being targeted to the TiddlyWeb API itself -which uses the same 
>> OpenAPI standard, but is a very different data model- it's a project that 
>> the developer has no capacity to take on right now. Still: source code 
>> is online  and available for anyone to run 
>> with. 
>>
>> All that being said: i'm just captivated by the notion of using TW5 as 
>> the ultimate OpenAPI Explorer.  In such a front end, one might not only 
>> browse, but also mark-up and annotate such a typically complex document, 
>> writing & sharing comments & scripts in a most digestible & reusable form. 
>>
>> So while i believe the developer that this would be no trivial 
>> undertaking, i am sufficiently intrigued by the possibility that i have to 
>> tap this collected wisdom here just to ask: Do you think like me that TW5 
>> would make a very good OpenAPI Explorer? Whether using any of this code or 
>> some other language, i'd just like to know if this is a likely prospect, or 
>> just my wishful thinking, over-estimating the synergy between these 
>> softwares.  ?
>>
>> /walt
>>
>

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Re: [tw5] Re: Introducing: the Subsume plugin.

[Sapphireslinger]

Brian, thank you so much! It works!

On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 10:50:59 AM UTC+8 Brian Radspinner wrote:

> @sapphireslinger give this a try:
>
> <$list filter="[collection[foo]sort[title]]">
> <$macrocall $name=subsume tid=<>/>
> 
>
> On Sunday, July 18, 2021 at 7:35:56 PM UTC-7 Sapphireslinger wrote:
>
>> David, thank you so much for this Subsume plugin. May I ask how to use it 
>> in a list filter?
>>
>> This works:
>>
>> <$list filter="[collection[foo]sort[title]]">
>> <$details summary={{!!title}}>
>> <$transclude field="text" mode="block"/>
>> 
>> 
>>
>> This does not work:
>>
>> <$list filter="[collection[foo]sort[title]]">
>> <$subsume summary={{!!title}}>
>> <$transclude field="text" mode="block"/>
>> 
>> 
>>
>> Nor does this:
>>
>> <$list filter="[collection[foo]sort[title]]">
>> <>
>> 
>> On Monday, July 19, 2021 at 9:06:23 AM UTC+8 stan...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>> David, I'm here looking at Control Panel -> Keyboard Shortcuts and I 
>>> think we are saying the same thing after all.   
>>> Thanks,
>>> Stan
>>>
>>> On Sunday, July 18, 2021 at 2:38:59 PM UTC-4 David Gifford wrote:
>>>
 Hi Stan

 Walt's screenshot tells me that Streams and Subsume are in separate 
 sections. Not so much integrated as juxtaposed. 
 Subsume is edited in edit mode and appears above in view mode.
 Streams is edited in view mode and appears below in view mode.

 Unfortunately I don't know anything about keybindings. If you mean 
 keyboard shortcuts, yes, Control Panel > Keyboard shortcuts, see the last 
 three items. 

 *autolist-newline* Add a newline and list markup if in a list Enter 

 *autolist-indent* Indent a line in a list Tab 

 *autolist-unindent* Unindent a line in a list shift-Tab 

 That is most likely the problem! Even so, that is strange, since 
 Streams and Noteline are in different contexts (view vs edit). Feel free 
 to 
 tweak Notelines to your needs, with other keyboard shortcuts or whatnot. 
 Blessings,

 David Gifford
 Mexico team leader, Mexico City

 *Resonate Global Mission*
 *Engaging People. Embracing Christ.*
 A Ministry of the Christian Reformed Church
 resonateglobalmission.org


 On Sun, Jul 18, 2021 at 12:08 PM stan...@gmail.com  
 wrote:

> My problem seems not to be from the integration of Subsume and 
> Streams.  I was using David's Notelines 2 as the base Tiddlywiki and if I 
> add Streams, but not Subsume, I get the same behavior - a  does not 
> create a new block.  
>
> In any event, I used Subsume this weekend to write an article.  How 
> nice it was it write modularly, in a manner that made sense and was 
> perfectly efficient.  
>
> David, do you have any idea what in Notelines 2 might be the offending 
> keybinding?
> Thanks, in advvance,
> Stan
>
>
> On Sunday, July 18, 2021 at 9:48:45 AM UTC-4 stan...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> I am looking at Walt's posting below and wondering how he got Subsume 
>> to work with Streams.   I had a wiki with Streams and added Subsume; 
>> when I 
>> went to add content using Streams, the carriage return  would just 
>> position the cursor in the next line in the same block, rather than 
>> create 
>> a new block.  I assume that there is a keybinding that is overwritten 
>> somewhere, but I just don't know where to start looking.  
>>
>> In any case, my first use of Subsume is a grand success.  I was 
>> writing sections of an article and encapsulating then using the 
>> extraction 
>> tool.  Now, if only I could solve the  problem...
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Stan
>>
>> On Saturday, July 17, 2021 at 11:39:42 AM UTC-4 ludwa6 wrote:
>>
>>> @Dave: see bottom of attached screenshot for the two "References" 
>>> widgets.  Yours is folded, but when opened reveals a filter widget, 
>>> with 
>>> list of referenced tids, as you know... While the References table from 
>>> Shiraz is partially displayed a bottom. 
>>> Does this help?  
>>> Also: This also shows what a Streams hierarchy looks like -below the 
>>> HR that separates it from the several Subsume widgets above.  That's 
>>> the 
>>> best i can do to answer your up-thread request for a view of my 
>>> workflow... 
>>> But, as described in text of that tiddler, there is no good way at 
>>> present 
>>> to bring a Streams hierarchy into a single tiddler -not without some 
>>> code 
>>> magic that i don't know how to do yet!
>>>
>>>
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