[tw] Re: favicon in tiddlywiki5.x

[Kevin Waite]

uh actually that is 'base64 MyFavicon.ico > favicon.txt'  but it 
DOES work, setting type to image/x-icon so thank you for this!

On Wednesday, April 15, 2015 at 5:02:27 AM UTC-5, Backslash wrote:
>
> Hi,
> just to enhance documentation after spending some hours to understand how 
> favicon works.
> In this tiddler:
> http://tiddlywiki.com/#Setting%20a%20favicon
> You could add following lines to explain better how to add a favicon 
> (tested on chrome 42 and firefox 37 on linux platform):
>
> Already formatted for tiddliwiki
>
>
> * Search for favicon in search bar on right side and open or create 
> $:/favicon.ico
> * convert your image (16x16) in base64, in linux just type in cli:
> ```
> your_image_filename.ico base64 > favicon.txt
> ```
>
> * again in tiddler $:/favicon.ico in plaintext first copy the content of 
> favicon.txt (the base64 img) and then set the content type to "ico format 
> icon file image/x-icon)
> *save
>
>
> best regards 
>

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Re: [tw] Re: favicon in tiddlywiki5.x

[Tobias Beer]

Hi Hegart,

I wouldn't think of the current process as "permission based". It's simply 
the way things are managed atm, that is by Jeremy himself.

As for "wiki-wiki", try to decouple TiddlyWiki itself from the actual 
website introducing it, e.g. imagining that tiddlywiki.com wasn't actually 
running on TiddlyWiki itself. Traditionally both have been interwoven, so 
one could expectat that working with the official presentation would be 
just as simple as working with a local copy. Well, it isn't quite the same 
process. ^_^

The current process surely is nothing high-speed, but it has its merits...

   - Jeremy does an excellent job of assuring content quality and integrity
   - problems with merging content for new features for the next release 
   are avoided
   - which would otherwise complicate the release process, trying to avoid 
  content edits being overwritten
   
A more community driven process might be speedier at the ramp up but would 
come with risks with respect to both of the above. Personally, I would 
advocate the same process, but decoupled from actual TW release. That way, 
content updates could be refreshed maybe once a day, or even just once a 
week, whereas release content — both release components and documentation — 
would be merged and updated during release rollout. The longer the release 
cycles might be(come), the more this is a favorable approach.

An entirely community-driven documentation process (and platform) would 
surely require vigilant and rigorous moderation so as to avoid things 
becoming all too bloated, chaotic, redundant, amateurish... and all that 
jazz.

— tb

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[tw] Re: favicon in tiddlywiki5.x

[Evolena]

The issue with being able to directly edit the TW5.com is that, unlike 
other wikis systems, the TW core is also editable, so anyone could break 
it, or worse. So the moderation is far more important than content-only 
moderation.

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Re: [tw] Re: favicon in tiddlywiki5.x

[Jeremy Ruston]

We manage the TiddlyWiki source code and build process on GitHub, like most
open source projects. We also manage the documentation as thought it were
part of the software. That's not terrible: it's pretty useful to keep the
core reference documentation under tight control to make it easier to try
to improve and assure the quality and reliability. The downside is that the
barriers to participation through GitHub are pretty high, requiring the
ability to use both GitHub and the Node.js configuration of TiddlyWiki.

It would be great to start using an online collaborative system to which
the broad community can contribute, starting with community documentation
and eventually moving the reference documentation there too. One issue is
that I am personally not keen to take the entire responsibility for a
community collaboration space as I do for the TiddlyWiki code itself;
managing a shared wiki is an onerous task and I'm not confident that I've
the bandwidth to be the best person to do it. I'm thinking particularly of
the issues around spam and community standards of behaviour.

We faced the same challenges with TiddlyWiki Classic. At first we used an
instance of MediaWiki, and then we migrated to the TiddlySpace-based
tiddlywiki.org that you see today.

For TiddlyWiki5, my goal is to use federation features, as previously
discussed. In a nutshell, very similar to Erwan's experiments: a process
for registering wikis that participate in the community federation, and
conventions for marking tiddlers as being comments directed to other users,
or threaded into shared conversations. The main technical requirement is
the ability for any participant to trigger a rebuild of the static files
that are served to visitors. I'm hoping to use Amazon Lambda for that.

Finally, I should say that there are two particular problems with content
updates at the moment:

* The TW5 release cycle has slowed down. Partly that's a natural
consequence of its maturity, and partly its because I've been much busier
with my dayjob over the last few months
* I accidentally broke the ability for me to push content updates
independently of updates to the core code :( Hopefully, post-5.1.10 I'll
resume being able to push content updates every few days

Best wishes

Jeremy.



On Tue, Sep 15, 2015 at 10:18 AM, Evolena 
wrote:

> The issue with being able to directly edit the TW5.com is that, unlike
> other wikis systems, the TW core is also editable, so anyone could break
> it, or worse. So the moderation is far more important than content-only
> moderation.
>
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Re: [tw] Re: favicon in tiddlywiki5.x

[Hegart Dmishiv]

Wow, such a lot to think about here, thanks to everyone who replied. I 
appreciate the situation as it is now, and the fact that the documentation 
for TiddlyWiki 5 is running on an instance of TiddlyWiki 5 software itself, 
so there needs to be permission-based control. I just look at what is 
available in the way of documentation for TW Classic and wish there was 
that level/quality of documentation available for TW5 now. Like Wikipedia 
wasn't born overnight, no doubt it took quite some time for the TWC 
documentation to arrive in the state that it's in now on tiddlywiki.org. So 
I understand that the TW5 documentation will also take some time to be as 
"polished" as the TWC docs. However, it seems to me like a circular 
problem, that the documentation for TW5 isn't up to scratch because there 
might not be enough people contributing to it yet, but to get more people 
contributing you need more people using the TW5 software, and to get more 
people using it, there needs to be good documentation in place to support 
them as they learn how to use it.

I don't have answers, just more questions, sorry. I'm not a developer, and 
can't realistically contribute to the coding of the project. All power to 
you smart people who are working on improving the codebase and bringing us 
the Tiddlyverse. I can, however, contribute to the documentation of TW5 
now, thanks to Jeremy and Mario encouraging me to learn about GitHub. I'll 
do what I can to contribute there, as I learn more about using TW5. I just 
wish it were easier to do, and with more instant gratification, as in, 
being able to see the fruits of my labours immediately. I'm not asking for 
an increased release cycle rate, I don't want to put any undue pressure on 
anyone. This is a labour of love for all concerned, anyway. We're all 
volunteers here, AFAIK.

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[tw] Re: favicon in tiddlywiki5.x

[PMario]

On Monday, September 14, 2015 at 5:29:56 AM UTC+2, Hegart Dmishiv wrote:
>
> Thanks, this was really helpful, as the official documentation didn't 
> mention this at all. I was trying to use a standard text/vnd.tiddlywiki 
> tiddler with the contents *[img[./images/favicon.ico]]* to display the 
> favicon, and couldn't work out why it wasn't working properly even when I 
> changed it to an image/x-icon type. In the official TW5 documentation, 
> neither Setting a favicon  
> nor ContentType  mention converting 
> to base64 at all. I would update the documentation myself, except that it 
> currently requires a pull request with GitHub to do that, and that's not a 
> skill I have mastered yet.
>

Just in case you want to try it. It's relatively easy. .. And we are really 
happy to get help with the documentation. Especially from new users. ... It 
turns out that "newbie" questions fade away, when users get more advanced 
;) So feedback from new folks is most valuable!

Have a look at: 
http://tiddlywiki.com/#Improving%20TiddlyWiki%20Documentation  There are 3 
videos, that I created some time ago. They are about 7 minutes long (each) 
... So just give it a shot. You can't do anything wrong. Just improve your 
skills and help the community ;)

have fun!
mario

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Re: [tw] Re: favicon in tiddlywiki5.x

[Jeremy Ruston]

Hi Hegart

I don't think that the original instructions from Backslash are correct.
You do not need to manually base-64 encode images. Here's the steps I would
recommend:

* Import your favicon image in .ICO or .PNG format
* Rename it to $:/favicon.ico

I think the confusion around base 64 encoding arose because the body of
images are encoded that way when they are stored in tiddlers. But the
conversion happens automatically.

Best wishes

Jeremy.





On Mon, Sep 14, 2015 at 12:52 PM, PMario  wrote:

> On Monday, September 14, 2015 at 5:29:56 AM UTC+2, Hegart Dmishiv wrote:
>>
>> Thanks, this was really helpful, as the official documentation didn't
>> mention this at all. I was trying to use a standard text/vnd.tiddlywiki
>> tiddler with the contents *[img[./images/favicon.ico]]* to display the
>> favicon, and couldn't work out why it wasn't working properly even when I
>> changed it to an image/x-icon type. In the official TW5 documentation,
>> neither Setting a favicon 
>> nor ContentType  mention converting
>> to base64 at all. I would update the documentation myself, except that it
>> currently requires a pull request with GitHub to do that, and that's not a
>> skill I have mastered yet.
>>
>
> Just in case you want to try it. It's relatively easy. .. And we are
> really happy to get help with the documentation. Especially from new users.
> ... It turns out that "newbie" questions fade away, when users get more
> advanced ;) So feedback from new folks is most valuable!
>
> Have a look at:
> http://tiddlywiki.com/#Improving%20TiddlyWiki%20Documentation  There are
> 3 videos, that I created some time ago. They are about 7 minutes long
> (each) ... So just give it a shot. You can't do anything wrong. Just
> improve your skills and help the community ;)
>
> have fun!
> mario
>
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Re: [tw] Re: favicon in tiddlywiki5.x

[Hegart Dmishiv]

On Tuesday, September 15, 2015 at 2:17:53 AM UTC+12, Jeremy Ruston wrote:
>
> There are two ways to import files using the single HTML file 
> configuration:
>
> * Locate the "import" button in the "Tools" tab of the sidebar (the icon 
> is a paperclip)
>

Ah, thanks. That really wasn't obvious at all. No mention of it in the 
documentation, and even if I had noticed that button in the list, there is 
nothing to show that it can be used for importing images. I probably saw it 
and dismissed it as a way to import tiddlers, which no doubt it can also do.
 

> * Drag and drop a file from your file explorer into the TiddlyWiki browser 
> window
>

I try to avoid drag and drop where possible. I'm on a laptop with minimal 
screen real estate, and moving windows around to try to drag from one to 
the other is a nuisance.

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Re: [tw] Re: favicon in tiddlywiki5.x

[Hegart Dmishiv]

On Tuesday, September 15, 2015 at 12:49:01 AM UTC+12, Jeremy Ruston wrote:
>
> * Import your favicon image in .ICO or .PNG format
>

Sorry, what exactly do you mean by "import" here? I'm looking at 
http://tiddlywiki.com/#Images 
in WikiText and I see nothing there about having to import an image, and 
neither does http://tiddlywiki.com/#ExternalImages. I don't understand how 
to import an image, other than with the base64 example by Backslash.

Comparing this to my previous experience with MediaWiki software, I would 
normally be trying to upload the image to the wiki server, which I 
understand that I don't need to do here with TiddlyWiki. But there doesn't 
seem to be an "Import" button or option anywhere.

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Re: [tw] Re: favicon in tiddlywiki5.x

[Jeremy Ruston]

Hi Hegart

Sorry, what exactly do you mean by "import" here? I'm looking at
http://tiddlywiki.com/#Images
> in WikiText and I see nothing there about having to import an image, and
> neither does http://tiddlywiki.com/#ExternalImages. I don't understand
> how to import an image, other than with the base64 example by Backslash.
>

There are two ways to import files using the single HTML file configuration:

* Locate the "import" button in the "Tools" tab of the sidebar (the icon is
a paperclip)
* Drag and drop a file from your file explorer into the TiddlyWiki browser
window

In either case, you should see an $:/Import tiddler that allows you to
review the pending imports before clicking to complete the import

There's some documentation at http://tiddlywiki.com/#ImportTiddlers but it
doesn't say much more than the above.

Best wishes

Jeremy.


>
> Comparing this to my previous experience with MediaWiki software, I would
> normally be trying to upload the image to the wiki server, which I
> understand that I don't need to do here with TiddlyWiki. But there doesn't
> seem to be an "Import" button or option anywhere.
>



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Re: [tw] Re: favicon in tiddlywiki5.x

[Jeremy Ruston]

Hi Mat


> Pull requests are also accepted via TiddlySpot! I.e you can set up a
> TiddlySpot and upload your edited TW to there and announce it to Jeremy.
> IMO this is much simpler.
>

Well, it's only simpler for the submitter! It's quite a lot of work for me.
I've done it in the past when people have wanted to submit translations but
don't know how to do so with GitHub. It makes sense for things like that,
but for minor tweaks I'm in a much better position to accept pull requests.
For example, this one by Hegart is the kind of thing that it might be
reasonable even for relative beginners to do via GitHub:

https://github.com/Jermolene/TiddlyWiki5/pull/1935

Best wishes

Jeremy.





>
>
>1. You go to http://tiddlyspot.com/ and register a new tiddlyspot.
>When get the confirmation that it is created and it shows a link to it
>- don't click it yet! No problem if you do, but you then come to the
>default verrsion which is TW classic.
>2. Regardless if you did click the link or not, you now wish to upload
>your modified TW to to *overwrite *that new tiddlyspot. This is done
>via your modified TWs Controlpanel under tab "Saving".
>3. After you've uploaded, now you click that confirmation link... (or
>reload the TW classic) so you see you new TW5 that is your pull request.
>
>
> Actually, I'm hoping this could be much simplified so that you can create
> a new TiddlySpot and upload in one go, directly from any TW. I'll post
> about this soon, but I've written on it
> 
> in TWaddle.
>
>
> The issue I found was with editing the document in a text editor without
>> the benefit of a preview function or WYSIWYG editing. Editing a wiki should
>> not be so difficult.
>
>
> Might my SideEditor be of help?
>
>
>
> <:-)
>
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Re: [tw] Re: favicon in tiddlywiki5.x

[Jeremy Ruston]

Hi Hegart

On Mon, Sep 14, 2015 at 4:13 PM, Hegart Dmishiv 
wrote:

> The issue I found was with editing the document in a text editor without
> the benefit of a preview function or WYSIWYG editing. Editing a wiki should
> not be so difficult.
>

You may find it easier to use TiddlyWiki in the client-server
configuration. I do most of my documentation editing by running
./bin/serve.sh and opening 127.0.0.1:8080 in a browser.

Best wishes

Jeremy.


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[tw] Re: favicon in tiddlywiki5.x

[Mat]

On Monday, September 14, 2015 at 5:13:13 PM UTC+2, Hegart Dmishiv wrote:
>
> [...] fork the repo and create my first pull request. I must say that it 
> isn't as easy as it looks. I could follow your directions quite fine, and 
> navigating the GitHub interface itself wasn't a problem. 
>
 
Pull requests are also accepted via TiddlySpot! I.e you can set up a 
TiddlySpot and upload your edited TW to there and announce it to Jeremy. 
IMO this is much simpler.


   1. You go to http://tiddlyspot.com/ and register a new tiddlyspot. 
   When get the confirmation that it is created and it shows a link to it - 
   don't click it yet! No problem if you do, but you then come to the default 
   verrsion which is TW classic.
   2. Regardless if you did click the link or not, you now wish to upload 
   your modified TW to to *overwrite *that new tiddlyspot. This is done via 
   your modified TWs Controlpanel under tab "Saving".
   3. After you've uploaded, now you click that confirmation link... (or 
   reload the TW classic) so you see you new TW5 that is your pull request.
   

Actually, I'm hoping this could be much simplified so that you can create a 
new TiddlySpot and upload in one go, directly from any TW. I'll post about 
this soon, but I've written on it 

 
in TWaddle.


The issue I found was with editing the document in a text editor without 
> the benefit of a preview function or WYSIWYG editing. Editing a wiki should 
> not be so difficult. 


Might my SideEditor be of help?



<:-) 

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[tw] Re: favicon in tiddlywiki5.x

[Hegart Dmishiv]

On Monday, September 14, 2015 at 11:52:51 PM UTC+12, PMario wrote:

> Just in case you want to try it. It's relatively easy. .. And we are 
> really happy to get help with the documentation. Especially from new users. 
> ... It turns out that "newbie" questions fade away, when users get more 
> advanced ;) So feedback from new folks is most valuable!
>
> Have a look at: 
> http://tiddlywiki.com/#Improving%20TiddlyWiki%20Documentation  There are 
> 3 videos, that I created some time ago. They are about 7 minutes long 
> (each) ... So just give it a shot. You can't do anything wrong. Just 
> improve your skills and help the community ;)
>

Thanks Mario, I've watched the first of your videos and followed along to 
fork the repo and create my first pull request. I must say that it isn't as 
easy as it looks. I could follow your directions quite fine, and navigating 
the GitHub interface itself wasn't a problem. The issue I found was with 
editing the document in a text editor without the benefit of a preview 
function or WYSIWYG editing. Editing a wiki should not be so difficult. 
Editing a wiki through text documents on GitHub is really not a good 
solution, and I look forward to seeing how the upcoming 
Tiddlyverse/federation can improve on this situation.

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Re: [tw] Re: favicon in tiddlywiki5.x

[Hegart Dmishiv]

On Tuesday, September 15, 2015 at 3:28:38 AM UTC+12, Jeremy Ruston wrote:
>
> You may find it easier to use TiddlyWiki in the client-server 
> configuration. I do most of my documentation editing by running 
> ./bin/serve.sh and opening 127.0.0.1:8080 in a browser.
>

Um, from what little I understand, the *./bin/serve.sh* file you mentioned 
is a shell script located in a ./bin folder somewhere, which is a relative 
address (because it starts with a dot). But relative to where? I tried to 
find it using *which serve.sh* but it doesn't appear to be on my computer 
anywhere. Sorry, I really am a beginner here. 

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Re: [tw] Re: favicon in tiddlywiki5.x

[RichardWilliamSmith]

Hi Hegart,

Your edit is in the 
repo: https://github.com/Jermolene/TiddlyWiki5/tree/master/editions/tw5.com 
- it should first appear in the prerelease 
at http://tiddlywiki.com/prerelease/ when that gets re-built and then will 
become part of the official release next time jeremy releases a version.

Regards,
Richard

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Re: [tw] Re: favicon in tiddlywiki5.x

[Hegart Dmishiv]

On Tuesday, September 15, 2015 at 12:17:42 PM UTC+12, RichardWilliamSmith 
wrote:
>
> Hi Hegart,
>
> Your edit is in the repo: 
> https://github.com/Jermolene/TiddlyWiki5/tree/master/editions/tw5.com - 
> it should first appear in the prerelease at 
> http://tiddlywiki.com/prerelease/ when that gets re-built and then will 
> become part of the official release next time jeremy releases a version.
>
> Regards,
> Richard
>


Hi Richard,

Thanks for explaining that. Gosh, how inefficient! I'm sure there's huge 
benefit to the development team in doing it that way, but from the 
perspective of an end user it doesn't seem like a good way of organising 
community-contributed documentation. I guess it does allow the developers 
to have a governance role over the documentation for their product, 
ensuring that nothing slips in that is inaccurate (or worse), but there is 
overwhelming support these days for crowd-sourcing, and relying on the 
community to regulate itself, rather than a strict, permission-based 
procedure like this. Also, allowing the community to regulate itself tends 
to enhance the end-user's feeling of personal ownership, responsibility 
for, and pride in the project.

Sure, any member of the TW community can no doubt go ahead and create their 
own community-contributed documentation. With the open-source licensing 
agreements in place, they can probably seed their own documentation project 
from the official documentation source initially, too. This, however, would 
lead to the situation (and probably has already) addressed in this 
discussion on the TiddlyWikiDev forums 
.

The only solution I can see is, roll on the Tiddlyverse/federation, so that 
TW wikis, including the TiddlyWiki project documentation itself, can be 
contributed to and updated in real time. After all, that is the very 
definition of a wiki.

“The term 'wiki' comes from the Hawaiian phrase, 'wiki wiki,' which means 
> 'super fast.'” - Dictionary.com 
> 
>
 
Would you call the procedure that you've described above, of waiting for a 
whole new version to come out, as being "super fast"?

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Re: [tw] Re: favicon in tiddlywiki5.x

[Hegart Dmishiv]

On Tuesday, September 15, 2015 at 4:06:26 AM UTC+12, Jeremy Ruston wrote:
>
> For example, this one by Hegart is the kind of thing that it might be 
> reasonable even for relative beginners to do via GitHub:
>
> https://github.com/Jermolene/TiddlyWiki5/pull/1935
>

Speaking of which, we went through that process last night, I forked the 
repo, committed a change, and made a pull request, and you merged my change 
(I think that's the right language to use for all this), but I still don't 
see my changes reflected on http://tiddlywiki.com/#Spelling. Where did my 
edit go?

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[tw] Re: favicon in tiddlywiki5.x

[Hegart Dmishiv]

Thanks, this was really helpful, as the official documentation didn't 
mention this at all. I was trying to use a standard text/vnd.tiddlywiki 
tiddler with the contents *[img[./images/favicon.ico]]* to display the 
favicon, and couldn't work out why it wasn't working properly even when I 
changed it to an image/x-icon type. In the official TW5 documentation, 
neither Setting a favicon  
nor ContentType  mention converting to 
base64 at all. I would update the documentation myself, except that it 
currently requires a pull request with GitHub to do that, and that's not a 
skill I have mastered yet.

On Wednesday, April 15, 2015 at 10:02:27 PM UTC+12, Backslash wrote:
>
> Hi,
> just to enhance documentation after spending some hours to understand how 
> favicon works.
> In this tiddler:
> http://tiddlywiki.com/#Setting%20a%20favicon
> You could add following lines to explain better how to add a favicon 
> (tested on chrome 42 and firefox 37 on linux platform):
>
> Already formatted for tiddliwiki
>
>
> * Search for favicon in search bar on right side and open or create 
> $:/favicon.ico
> * convert your image (16x16) in base64, in linux just type in cli:
> ```
> your_image_filename.ico base64 > favicon.txt
> ```
>
> * again in tiddler $:/favicon.ico in plaintext first copy the content of 
> favicon.txt (the base64 img) and then set the content type to "ico format 
> icon file image/x-icon)
> *save
>
>
> best regards 
>

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[tw] Re: favicon in tiddlywiki5.x

[Mat]

The way I do it, I use some drawing software to create a 16x16px image and 
then just dragn'drop import it, and then rename it to $:/favicon.ico.

:-)

On Wednesday, April 15, 2015 at 12:02:27 PM UTC+2, Backslash wrote:

 Hi,
 just to enhance documentation after spending some hours to understand how 
 favicon works.
 In this tiddler:
 http://tiddlywiki.com/#Setting%20a%20favicon
 You could add following lines to explain better how to add a favicon 
 (tested on chrome 42 and firefox 37 on linux platform):

 Already formatted for tiddliwiki


 * Search for favicon in search bar on right side and open or create 
 $:/favicon.ico
 * convert your image (16x16) in base64, in linux just type in cli:
 ```
 your_image_filename.ico base64  favicon.txt
 ```

 * again in tiddler $:/favicon.ico in plaintext first copy the content of 
 favicon.txt (the base64 img) and then set the content type to ico format 
 icon file image/x-icon)
 *save


 best regards 


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