Re: [time-nuts] Got 60HZ?
I'm sure that the spectral purity that you obtain by first multiplying and then integer dividing is far better that using any fractional division, moreover if you are not multiplying by a big number :)And not need to use too much weird circuitry if you use as I mention a microcontroller that integrates it along with a programmable timer that can be used to divide it. Also, the jitter and noise from the PLL multiplication is reduced by the division (the resulting 60Hz would not be so bad, believe me - I've use a similar technique for generating square or PWM-modulated signals in the kHz range. In that cases jitter were not an important parameter so I did not measured it, but the resulting signals were quite clean). Cs sources are rare and expensive, and Rb sources are more common, mainly due to the price and size of the physics package. The Rb lamp is a quite simple and small device, but a Cs tube is rather more complex, big and difficult to manufacture. Although this could change in the future - there has been several publications (reflected on this forum) about micro-miniature Cs sources. Best regards, Javier El 11/12/2010 07:11, Michael Poulos escribió: Javier Herrero wrote: It seems that we're all trying to find the most obstuse way to obtain 60Hz from 10MHz since the division is not integer... why not simply multiply the 10MHz input signal by 3 and feed the resulting 30MHz signal to any suitable divider by 50 chain? the result will be nice, spectrally pure and even 50.000% duty cycle :). To multiply the frequency means weird RF circuitry to start off. If you start off with the 10 million HZ and divide, you only get better as any phase jitter gets lost in the division. As you divide far enough, the phase jitter gets to those leap pulse jitters. To design around the problem of Rb (my bad about Rb versus Ru) movements you have to have a second one ready to start once the original goes bad. This will occur with a cesium movement, like a good Agilent 5071A cesium movement every bit as well A fun question is why Rb movements are so common but Cs movements are rare and expensive. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. -- Javier HerreroEMAIL: jherr...@hvsistemas.com Chief Technology Officer HV Sistemas S.L. PHONE: +34 949 336 806 Los Charcones, 17 FAX: +34 949 336 792 19170 El Casar - Guadalajara - Spain WEB: http://www.hvsistemas.com ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Systron Donner 100A pulse generator
Hi, can any of you help me, I need a manual with schematic or just the schematic for this device. The timing is done with a tunnel diode, and to be able to repaire the unit a schematic would help a lot! Please help, if you can. Alf Pousar OH2QM ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Systron Donner 100A pulse generator
Alf, Some time ago I scanned my copy and uploaded to a couple of sites being Didier's http://www.ko4bb.com/Manuals/09%29_Misc_Test_Equipment/Systron_Donner_100A_Pulse_Generator_Service_Manual.pdf one of them. I can send you directly a later revision (of my pdf edition with correct page numbering, not a manual revision). It is about 2.8 Mb. Regards, Ignacio EB4APL El 11/12/2010 16:02, Alf Pousar escribió: Hi, can any of you help me, I need a manual with schematic or just the schematic for this device. The timing is done with a tunnel diode, and to be able to repaire the unit a schematic would help a lot! Please help, if you can. Alf Pousar OH2QM ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Z3801A/58503A Help
I recently purchased a Z3801A/58503A off of E-bay from Yixunhk in Hong Kong. The unit arrived quickly and was complete with antenna, power supply and some software. It is a nice kooking package with an HP case much like the HP3805. The first problem was that the case was marked as requiring a 38-60 volt power supply which seems to be the common power supply for the Z3801A. The power supply that came with the unit was a 24 volt power supply. After a lot a research and help from several members of time-nuts I deduced that the vendor had changed out the power board in the unit and that it did in face run on 24 volts. In trouble shooting the unit I found several loose screws which were likely affecting the operation of the unit. After I got it going I noticed that the EFC voltage plots were jumping all over the place and about every 24 hours it would drop out of lock because the EFC could no longer keep the oscillator in spec. More trouble shooting revealed that the power to the outer oven was never coming on. There is an output on pin 10 of the cpu that turns on the outer oven and this output was never going active. Some additional research found that others have had a like problem and that by pulling up the input to the outer oven circuitry they were able to get the cpu to reset and work normally. When I pulled up the input to the oven it worked normally but the cpu would never reset. I have had numerous E-mail with Yixunhk and he has been of no help. It will cost $200 to return the unit to Hong Kong. If anyone has any suggestions I would like to hear them. In the meantime based on my experience I would think twice or more about doing business with Yixunhk. He advertised the unit as fully functional and claims that it was fully tested. This problem was not caused by shipping damage and any tech with experience on this type of equipment should have recognized the problem. Sorry about the long ramble but I thought my experience might help someone else. Jerry ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] 3586A HQ PDF Manual available -optimization-
I'm just reporting what is printed on the Data Professionals website. -Chuck Harris J. Forster wrote: There was a lot of discussion about whether the company actually bought the rights and/or whether the seller, in fact, owned the rights, , or just some filing cabinets of hard copy manuals. FWIW, -John Press Release October 2008 Data Professionals of Pleasanton California has purchased the Copyrights and existing inventory of all legacy Heathkit product documentation from Heath Company of Benton Harbor Michigan for an undisclosed amount. The new company will make copies of the original legacy manuals available to the marketplace via its web site and through eBay and PayPal. -Chuck Harris ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Software defined spectrum analyzer
Hi, John, Do you have any experience with it? Not too long ago I was in the need to do some conducted EMC measurements in the range of 30Hz to 100MHz, with a quite low maximum requirements, and I found that my current probe and HP8566B combination was not good enough to conduct them (due to filter resolution in the low side and to noise factor in the high side...). At the end, we contracted an external laboratory for doing these measurements usign an RS ESU-40 measurement receiver. Do you know how good would this unit perform as a measurement receiver? Regards, Javier El 11/12/2010 04:21, John Miles escribió: It's neat -- not a substitute for the big HP iron, but still a very capable tool. The first few they sold were less expensive, but I think it's still a nice piece of gear for $1K. Good bang:buck ratio. -- john, KE5FX -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com]on Behalf Of Geraldo Lino de Campos Sent: Friday, December 10, 2010 5:14 PM To: time-nuts@febo.com Subject: [time-nuts] Software defined spectrum analyzer I found this device on the net. It seems quite capable for the price. Does anyone have experience with it, or the previous version? http://www.signalhound.com/ Geraldo gera...@decampos.net ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. -- Javier HerreroEMAIL: jherr...@hvsistemas.com Chief Technology Officer HV Sistemas S.L. PHONE: +34 949 336 806 Los Charcones, 17 FAX: +34 949 336 792 19170 El Casar - Guadalajara - Spain WEB: http://www.hvsistemas.com ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Z3801A/58503A Help
I have purchased a couple of Tbolts from Yixunhk and they have arrived very quickly and operated properly. In fact, while the power supplies were obviously long in the tooth, the 'bolts, themselves (the red label ones), looked absolutely brand new. Nary a scuff or scratch and spotless. I guess it is a crapshoot with these guys. Bill On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 10:45 AM, Jerry jreed...@cox.net wrote: I recently purchased a Z3801A/58503A off of E-bay from Yixunhk in Hong Kong. The unit arrived quickly and was complete with antenna, power supply and some software. It is a nice kooking package with an HP case much like the HP3805. The first problem was that the case was marked as requiring a 38-60 volt power supply which seems to be the common power supply for the Z3801A. The power supply that came with the unit was a 24 volt power supply. After a lot a research and help from several members of time-nuts I deduced that the vendor had changed out the power board in the unit and that it did in face run on 24 volts. In trouble shooting the unit I found several loose screws which were likely affecting the operation of the unit. After I got it going I noticed that the EFC voltage plots were jumping all over the place and about every 24 hours it would drop out of lock because the EFC could no longer keep the oscillator in spec. More trouble shooting revealed that the power to the outer oven was never coming on. There is an output on pin 10 of the cpu that turns on the outer oven and this output was never going active. Some additional research found that others have had a like problem and that by pulling up the input to the outer oven circuitry they were able to get the cpu to reset and work normally. When I pulled up the input to the oven it worked normally but the cpu would never reset. I have had numerous E-mail with Yixunhk and he has been of no help. It will cost $200 to return the unit to Hong Kong. If anyone has any suggestions I would like to hear them. In the meantime based on my experience I would think twice or more about doing business with Yixunhk. He advertised the unit as fully functional and claims that it was fully tested. This problem was not caused by shipping damage and any tech with experience on this type of equipment should have recognized the problem. Sorry about the long ramble but I thought my experience might help someone else. Jerry ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Z3801A/58503A Help
Jerry wrote: I deduced that the vendor had changed out the power board in the unit * * * When I pulled up the input to the oven it worked normally but the cpu would never reset Did the original power supply send a reset pulse to the CPU (not uncommon), which the current supply doesn't? Best regards, Charles ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Got 60HZ?
The original question referred to a good squaring chip. Then we veered off into other ways to coax chips into delivering 60 Hz from 10 MHz. At the time, I thought there must be a way to buy European 50 Hz synchronous clocks, or digital clocks that use the line frequency. Here's an electromechanical solution. You'll need a small low voltage DC motor with good bearings, a disk that fits on the motor shaft that has been drilled or etched with two concentric circles of tiny holes, two light source and detector pairs to get pulses from the holes, PLL circuitry, and an amplifier to drive the motor. One circle of holes generates a frequency that can be phase locked to a standard your choice. The other circle generates a frequency that is a binary multiple of 60 Hz. 120 Hz is enough for a square wave output. A higher frequency is required to approximate a sine wave. For extra credit, add a copper disk to the motor shaft. Make one or more electromagnets so that the copper disk passes through the gap. Run the DC motor from a regulated voltage that makes the frequencies about 1% high. Arrange the PLL to drive the electromagnets to regulate the motor speed using the counter field generated in the copper disk. See if the copper disk can be made thin enough to also have the circles of holes. In return for some mechanical skills, you can avoid strange chips and arduous programming. Bill Hawkins -Original Message- From: Michael Poulos Sent: Wednesday, December 08, 2010 10:14 PM To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: [time-nuts] Got 60HZ? Recently I bought a Efratom Ru frequency standard from eBay and a frequency divider chip that makes 1MHZ,100KHZ,25KHZ,10KHZ,100HZ and a 1HZ output. Today I thought of a way to make a nice 60HZ so you can use a mains-powered clock for the display (using amplifier and transformer wired backwards). But, now you'll need 60HZ. A European has it easy with 50HZ as you use a BASIC Stamp or Arduino to divide the 100HZ output. But for 60HZ I came up with a solution: You set up the Arduino to take the 10KHZ from the divider chip and program it to count off 83 pulses to flip an output. But wait! Unless you add a leap count every 3 flips of the output, it'll run fast. Assume at the start the Arduino output starts high then turns low: (83+83+84+83+83+84)*20 = 10,000 pulses = one second H__L__H__L__H__L Every output cycle and a half the voltage swing is a little over 1 percent longer because of the leap count. This means that the distortion adds a slight inaccuracy, not enough to upset New Year's revelers. But if you want a better 60HZ, try using the 100KHZ: (833+833+834+833+833+834)*20 = one second You see where this is going with leap counts. The ultimate of course is one really good Arduino and (after a hex inverter to amplify it) take the straight 10MHZ and apply this leap count technique: (8+8+83334+8+8+83334)*20 = one really accurately made 60HZ = one nice second, just the thing for a Nixie clock. :) Now, what is a good hex inverter to take the 10 million HZ of my rubidiom movement to feed a frequency divider chip (and later Arduino)? It needs to take the .5 of a volt sinewave and squarewave it and in a normal 14 pin DIP (breadboardable) package. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Got 60HZ?
Ahh, the tone wheel. make it a shaped slot, lamp and LDR and you can have a sinewave. Add a second sensor on an arm pivoted at the center of rotation and you have variable phase. A lot of early aircraft test signal (VOR / ILS) generators used this technique. metal disks and eddy current sensors were more common than optical. There was also the Hammond organ. If you want 50Hz clocks try ebay.co.uk or amazon.co.uk etc. Or I can supply for a small commisson ;-) Robert G8RPI. --- On Sat, 11/12/10, Bill Hawkins b...@iaxs.net wrote: From: Bill Hawkins b...@iaxs.net Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Got 60HZ? To: 'Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement' time-nuts@febo.com Date: Saturday, 11 December, 2010, 18:29 The original question referred to a good squaring chip. Then we veered off into other ways to coax chips into delivering 60 Hz from 10 MHz. At the time, I thought there must be a way to buy European 50 Hz synchronous clocks, or digital clocks that use the line frequency. Here's an electromechanical solution. You'll need a small low voltage DC motor with good bearings, a disk that fits on the motor shaft that has been drilled or etched with two concentric circles of tiny holes, two light source and detector pairs to get pulses from the holes, PLL circuitry, and an amplifier to drive the motor. One circle of holes generates a frequency that can be phase locked to a standard your choice. The other circle generates a frequency that is a binary multiple of 60 Hz. 120 Hz is enough for a square wave output. A higher frequency is required to approximate a sine wave. For extra credit, add a copper disk to the motor shaft. Make one or more electromagnets so that the copper disk passes through the gap. Run the DC motor from a regulated voltage that makes the frequencies about 1% high. Arrange the PLL to drive the electromagnets to regulate the motor speed using the counter field generated in the copper disk. See if the copper disk can be made thin enough to also have the circles of holes. In return for some mechanical skills, you can avoid strange chips and arduous programming. Bill Hawkins -Original Message- From: Michael Poulos Sent: Wednesday, December 08, 2010 10:14 PM To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: [time-nuts] Got 60HZ? Recently I bought a Efratom Ru frequency standard from eBay and a frequency divider chip that makes 1MHZ,100KHZ,25KHZ,10KHZ,100HZ and a 1HZ output. Today I thought of a way to make a nice 60HZ so you can use a mains-powered clock for the display (using amplifier and transformer wired backwards). But, now you'll need 60HZ. A European has it easy with 50HZ as you use a BASIC Stamp or Arduino to divide the 100HZ output. But for 60HZ I came up with a solution: You set up the Arduino to take the 10KHZ from the divider chip and program it to count off 83 pulses to flip an output. But wait! Unless you add a leap count every 3 flips of the output, it'll run fast. Assume at the start the Arduino output starts high then turns low: (83+83+84+83+83+84)*20 = 10,000 pulses = one second H__L__H__L__H__L Every output cycle and a half the voltage swing is a little over 1 percent longer because of the leap count. This means that the distortion adds a slight inaccuracy, not enough to upset New Year's revelers. But if you want a better 60HZ, try using the 100KHZ: (833+833+834+833+833+834)*20 = one second You see where this is going with leap counts. The ultimate of course is one really good Arduino and (after a hex inverter to amplify it) take the straight 10MHZ and apply this leap count technique: (8+8+83334+8+8+83334)*20 = one really accurately made 60HZ = one nice second, just the thing for a Nixie clock. :) Now, what is a good hex inverter to take the 10 million HZ of my rubidiom movement to feed a frequency divider chip (and later Arduino)? It needs to take the .5 of a volt sinewave and squarewave it and in a normal 14 pin DIP (breadboardable) package. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Got 60HZ?
El 11/12/2010 19:57, Robert Atkinson escribió: If you want 50Hz clocks try ebay.co.uk or amazon.co.uk etc. Or I can supply for a small commisson ;-) mmm... perhaps I can also supply, but left-hand drive instead of right-hand drive ;) Regards, Javier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Systron Donner 100A pulse generator
I used to build and test these in the early 70's when I worked for Systron-Donner Limited, in Leamington Spa, UK. We were the UK subsidiary. They also had similar facilities in Paris and Munich. Good old days!! Rob Kimberley -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf Of EB4APL Sent: 11 December 2010 3:45 PM To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Systron Donner 100A pulse generator Alf, Some time ago I scanned my copy and uploaded to a couple of sites being Didier's http://www.ko4bb.com/Manuals/09%29_Misc_Test_Equipment/Systron_Donner_100A_P ulse_Generator_Service_Manual.pdf one of them. I can send you directly a later revision (of my pdf edition with correct page numbering, not a manual revision). It is about 2.8 Mb. Regards, Ignacio EB4APL El 11/12/2010 16:02, Alf Pousar escribió: Hi, can any of you help me, I need a manual with schematic or just the schematic for this device. The timing is done with a tunnel diode, and to be able to repaire the unit a schematic would help a lot! Please help, if you can. Alf Pousar OH2QM ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Systron Donner 100A
Thank you Ignacio for the FB link and thanks to Didier who provided the site, FB! 73, Alf ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Software defined spectrum analyzer
Hi Don. I'm ultra curious of how they did it. How did they covered the full BW they have. Did you looked inside, or did they sent a block diagram? (...I was born curious... it is not a new symptom!) Luis Cupido. ct1dmk. Don Latham wrote: I have one of the original analyzers, and I'm quite satisfied with it. Note that there is a set of drivers so that the device can be used as, say an SDR. There's also a nice USB power meter available from Mini-Circuits for about $700, although I do not have one. Don - Original Message - From: Geraldo Lino de Campos gera...@decampos.net To: time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Friday, December 10, 2010 6:13 PM Subject: [time-nuts] Software defined spectrum analyzer I found this device on the net. It seems quite capable for the price. Does anyone have experience with it, or the previous version? http://www.signalhound.com/ Geraldo gera...@decampos.net ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Got 60HZ?
Have one of those FAA signal generators of vacuum tube vintage. There's a selector switch for about a dozen frequencies that mechanically moves the light detector to the right track. The eddy current brake was used in a synchro system to adjust the speed of the control transformer shaft, which generated the three-phase signal for rotating the antenna and all of the radar display sweeps. The electromagnet is quite large. A Hammond tone wheel might get you eight octaves of harmonics, or 2**8. No need for decayed dividers and their reset tricks, just straight flip-flops, all the way down. Bill Hawkins -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com] On Behalf Of Robert Atkinson Sent: Saturday, December 11, 2010 12:57 PM To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Got 60HZ? Ahh, the tone wheel. make it a shaped slot, lamp and LDR and you can have a sinewave. Add a second sensor on an arm pivoted at the center of rotation and you have variable phase. A lot of early aircraft test signal (VOR / ILS) generators used this technique. metal disks and eddy current sensors were more common than optical. There was also the Hammond organ. If you want 50Hz clocks try ebay.co.uk or amazon.co.uk etc. Or I can supply for a small commisson ;-) Robert G8RPI. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Software defined spectrum analyzer
Luis Cupido wrote: Hi Don. I'm ultra curious of how they did it. How did they covered the full BW they have. Did you looked inside, or did they sent a block diagram? (...I was born curious... it is not a new symptom!) Luis Cupido. ct1dmk. the manual is on the website.. some clues Intermediate frequencies of 2.9 MHz and 10.7 MHz are used for all frequencies. An RF input signal near these frequencies may generate spurious responses and degrade the performance of the image rejection algorithm. Chapter 5 of the manual has the whole block diagram.. basically it's a 240kHz wide sampler, with a single/double conversion front end and a bunch of switches. They do some clever signal processing in software too, by stepping the LO and combining FFTs... ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Software defined spectrum analyzer
Hi Luis:I, too, am curious. But I haven't opened it yet. I suspect something like an FPGA feeding a fast a/d somewhere in the 50-70 MHz range. That is, a decomposition. There may be a synthesized LO and mixer to get to the 50 MHz. The info on the website says or used to say something about an sdr modified to act as a spectrum analyzer. One of the things I like about the device that played a part in my purchase is the availability of a 10 MHz reference input. as a good time-nut that shows some serious engineering attention to accuracy. Don Luis Cupido Hi Don. I'm ultra curious of how they did it. How did they covered the full BW they have. Did you looked inside, or did they sent a block diagram? (...I was born curious... it is not a new symptom!) Luis Cupido. ct1dmk. Don Latham wrote: I have one of the original analyzers, and I'm quite satisfied with it. Note that there is a set of drivers so that the device can be used as, say an SDR. There's also a nice USB power meter available from Mini-Circuits for about $700, although I do not have one. Don - Original Message - From: Geraldo Lino de Campos gera...@decampos.net To: time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Friday, December 10, 2010 6:13 PM Subject: [time-nuts] Software defined spectrum analyzer I found this device on the net. It seems quite capable for the price. Does anyone have experience with it, or the previous version? http://www.signalhound.com/ Geraldo gera...@decampos.net ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. -- Neither the voice of authority nor the weight of reason and argument are as significant as experiment, for thence comes quiet to the mind. R. Bacon If you don't know what it is, don't poke it. Ghost in the Shell Dr. Don Latham AJ7LL Six Mile Systems LLP 17850 Six Mile Road POB 134 Huson, MT, 59846 VOX 406-626-4304 www.lightningforensics.com www.sixmilesystems.com ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Software defined spectrum analyzer
Hi Don. I'm ultra curious of how they did it. How did they covered the full BW they have. Did you looked inside, or did they sent a block diagram? (...I was born curious... it is not a new symptom!) Page 27 of their manual at http://www.signalhound.com/manual.pdf has a block diagram. The first LO for VHF and up is the ADF4350 wideband synth (138 MHz-4.4 GHz, -86 dBc/Hz @ 10 kHz at 3.3 GHz). Baseband processing is done with an AD9864 IF digitizer. The ADF4007 is used as a secondary divider for the ADF4350 output, as part of their image-rejection scheme. -- john, KE5FX ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Software defined spectrum analyzer
I don't have a lot of experience with it, having bought it mostly for amusement and to see what was inside, but it does live up to its specs as far as I could tell. If your measurement was somehow limited by the 8566B's 10 Hz resolution bandwidth or its highpass response above 100 Hz, then the Signal Hound would be an improvement. It's a very competent measurement receiver for narrowband signals. -- john, KE5FX -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com]on Behalf Of Javier Herrero Sent: Saturday, December 11, 2010 9:26 AM To: time-nuts@febo.com Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Software defined spectrum analyzer Hi, John, Do you have any experience with it? Not too long ago I was in the need to do some conducted EMC measurements in the range of 30Hz to 100MHz, with a quite low maximum requirements, and I found that my current probe and HP8566B combination was not good enough to conduct them (due to filter resolution in the low side and to noise factor in the high side...). At the end, we contracted an external laboratory for doing these measurements usign an RS ESU-40 measurement receiver. Do you know how good would this unit perform as a measurement receiver? Regards, Javier El 11/12/2010 04:21, John Miles escribió: It's neat -- not a substitute for the big HP iron, but still a very capable tool. The first few they sold were less expensive, but I think it's still a nice piece of gear for $1K. Good bang:buck ratio. -- john, KE5FX -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com]on Behalf Of Geraldo Lino de Campos Sent: Friday, December 10, 2010 5:14 PM To: time-nuts@febo.com Subject: [time-nuts] Software defined spectrum analyzer I found this device on the net. It seems quite capable for the price. Does anyone have experience with it, or the previous version? http://www.signalhound.com/ Geraldo gera...@decampos.net ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. -- Javier HerreroEMAIL: jherr...@hvsistemas.com Chief Technology Officer HV Sistemas S.L. PHONE: +34 949 336 806 Los Charcones, 17 FAX: +34 949 336 792 19170 El Casar - Guadalajara - Spain WEB: http://www.hvsistemas.com ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] TrueTime DC468 sat clock simulator is working well
Hello to the group. The GOES satellite simulator is packaged and working. The package is a card board box. Good enough for the next week of the test run. I have a business trip so could not put it into a real box. But the system syncs to GPS and then sets the DC468 after about 3 minutes. The dc468 makes sure numbers of sentences are correct before displaying the time. Then I resync on any hour ending in 2. Just a number I picked. You could resync every 10 minutes if you wanted. It simply does not drift a lot over 24 hours, My plan is to let it burn in for the next week. If all is ok will have to put documentation together and then find a home for the information to live at. This will include the two programs that make it all work. The GOES encoder and the 100 Hz clock generator. Regards Paul WB8TSL ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] TrueTime DC468 sat clock simulator is working well
Paul, I would be happy to host your project at to-way.com Had K7MLR Sent from my Samsung Captivate(tm) on ATT paul swed paulsw...@gmail.com wrote: Hello to the group. The GOES satellite simulator is packaged and working. The package is a card board box. Good enough for the next week of the test run. I have a business trip so could not put it into a real box. But the system syncs to GPS and then sets the DC468 after about 3 minutes. The dc468 makes sure numbers of sentences are correct before displaying the time. Then I resync on any hour ending in 2. Just a number I picked. You could resync every 10 minutes if you wanted. It simply does not drift a lot over 24 hours, My plan is to let it burn in for the next week. If all is ok will have to put documentation together and then find a home for the information to live at. This will include the two programs that make it all work. The GOES encoder and the 100 Hz clock generator. Regards Paul WB8TSL ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Software defined spectrum analyzer
Good to know. Yes, for that measurements the required limits were quite low (21dBuA from 10MHz to 100MHz), and in that case the noise factor of the 8566B were limiting (well... one could scan that range with narrower bandwidths but would end taking ages). For the 30Hz frequency, the limit was higher (I don't remember the exact value), but the 0Hz spur leakage through the 10Hz filter was high enough to be over the measurement limit (the EMC probe was a Solar 6247-1 clamp that has an horrendous attenuation at that range, like all probes of that kind). Since I also had not too much time available for experimenting, we ended conducting the tests in a nearby laboratory, where we also conducted the EMC tests for CE compliance. We were also near the limit of their ESU-40 and their FFC clamp probes... but at least we had some dBs of margin to measure. Next time, it would be the perfect excuse to buy one of these toys for amusement also :) Best regards, Javier El 12/12/2010 01:25, John Miles escribió: I don't have a lot of experience with it, having bought it mostly for amusement and to see what was inside, but it does live up to its specs as far as I could tell. If your measurement was somehow limited by the 8566B's 10 Hz resolution bandwidth or its highpass response above 100 Hz, then the Signal Hound would be an improvement. It's a very competent measurement receiver for narrowband signals. -- john, KE5FX -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com]on Behalf Of Javier Herrero Sent: Saturday, December 11, 2010 9:26 AM To: time-nuts@febo.com Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Software defined spectrum analyzer Hi, John, Do you have any experience with it? Not too long ago I was in the need to do some conducted EMC measurements in the range of 30Hz to 100MHz, with a quite low maximum requirements, and I found that my current probe and HP8566B combination was not good enough to conduct them (due to filter resolution in the low side and to noise factor in the high side...). At the end, we contracted an external laboratory for doing these measurements usign an RS ESU-40 measurement receiver. Do you know how good would this unit perform as a measurement receiver? Regards, Javier El 11/12/2010 04:21, John Miles escribió: It's neat -- not a substitute for the big HP iron, but still a very capable tool. The first few they sold were less expensive, but I think it's still a nice piece of gear for $1K. Good bang:buck ratio. -- john, KE5FX -Original Message- From: time-nuts-boun...@febo.com [mailto:time-nuts-boun...@febo.com]on Behalf Of Geraldo Lino de Campos Sent: Friday, December 10, 2010 5:14 PM To: time-nuts@febo.com Subject: [time-nuts] Software defined spectrum analyzer I found this device on the net. It seems quite capable for the price. Does anyone have experience with it, or the previous version? http://www.signalhound.com/ Geraldo gera...@decampos.net ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. -- Javier HerreroEMAIL: jherr...@hvsistemas.com Chief Technology Officer HV Sistemas S.L. PHONE: +34 949 336 806 Los Charcones, 17 FAX: +34 949 336 792 19170 El Casar - Guadalajara - Spain WEB: http://www.hvsistemas.com ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. -- Javier HerreroEMAIL: jherr...@hvsistemas.com Chief Technology Officer HV Sistemas S.L. PHONE: +34 949 336 806 Los Charcones, 17 FAX: +34 949 336 792 19170 El Casar - Guadalajara - Spain WEB: http://www.hvsistemas.com ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Isolated input oscilloscopes
A little off topic, but needed for a time-nutty application: 4 channel scope with isolated inputs that is affordable. I have a 2 channel Tek THS730A. The Tek TPS2014 is rather pricey. Does anybody know of something affordable? ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Software defined spectrum analyzer
Don Latham wrote: Hi Luis:I, too, am curious. But I haven't opened it yet. I suspect something like an FPGA feeding a fast a/d somewhere in the 50-70 MHz range. That is, a decomposition. There may be a synthesized LO and mixer to get to the 50 MHz. The info on the website says or used to say something about an sdr modified to act as a spectrum analyzer. One of the things I like about the device that played a part in my purchase is the availability of a 10 MHz reference input. as a good time-nut that shows some serious engineering attention to accuracy. Don I'm going to guess much simpler inside.. Essentially a programmable receiver like the Icom PCR1000, but with better bandwidth, running into a pair of 192kHz ADCs, for which easy USB interfacing is available. The question is really what does the 4GHz LO in the front look like? It's almost certainly some sort of VCO PLL scheme, probably with multiple VCOs. But, do they use a DDS? Probably not... They probably have a fast PLL that settles quickly so they step through in 100 kHz steps or so. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Software defined spectrum analyzer
The Signal Hound is an interesting gadget. It's far more portable than my HP 8594E! And yes, the 10 MHz ref input on the back does help; without an external reference it does tend to wander around. Their website says they've replaced the original model with a rev B which adds a preamp and also temperature compensation. They were saying over the summer they'd have a tracking gen option as well, but I don't see it. The tricks they use (sorry, advanced digital signal processing techniques), such as shifting the LO around and watching what a signal of interest does to determine if it's real or not makes some fundamental assumptions about the signal of interest, such as that it's more or less the same during the multiple passes with different LO values. If the signal of interest doesn't play by those assumptions, all bets are off. The website says that, if you're trying to measure wide bw signals, 20 MHz or wider (such as 802.11g, 802.11n), or hoppers (bluetooth?) you have to throw it into a mode where it only does high-side mixing. 73 bob k6rtm ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Software defined spectrum analyzer
On 12/12/2010 02:31 AM, jimlux wrote: Don Latham wrote: Hi Luis:I, too, am curious. But I haven't opened it yet. I suspect something like an FPGA feeding a fast a/d somewhere in the 50-70 MHz range. That is, a decomposition. There may be a synthesized LO and mixer to get to the 50 MHz. The info on the website says or used to say something about an sdr modified to act as a spectrum analyzer. One of the things I like about the device that played a part in my purchase is the availability of a 10 MHz reference input. as a good time-nut that shows some serious engineering attention to accuracy. Don I'm going to guess much simpler inside.. Essentially a programmable receiver like the Icom PCR1000, but with better bandwidth, running into a pair of 192kHz ADCs, for which easy USB interfacing is available. The question is really what does the 4GHz LO in the front look like? It's almost certainly some sort of VCO PLL scheme, probably with multiple VCOs. But, do they use a DDS? Probably not... They probably have a fast PLL that settles quickly so they step through in 100 kHz steps or so. Two VCOs covering 1-2.2 GHz could through mixing and selecting between sum and difference output filters (i.e. lowpass and highpass) cover that without too much difficulty. Except for the highest end, there is a degree of freedom in setting the oscillators to their individual frequency which naturally could be used to avoid bad frequencies to leak into the IF for instance. Cheers, Magnsu ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Software defined spectrum analyzer
Tks, folks. I saw the diagram on the manual, albeit a bit too simplified but ok, indeed we can have an idea. For LO I suspect that might be one of those clock generators IC with VCO + PLL plus a a lot of programmable dividers and really would match the simplified diagram they have As for the digital part I have no idea, but would not be surprised of that very simplistic single chip approach sound card chip and an USB micro to feed the control bits to the PLL chip... It may well be a very very simple thing hardware wise. ...hence, I'm still curious ;-) Luis Cupido. jimlux wrote: Don Latham wrote: Hi Luis:I, too, am curious. But I haven't opened it yet. I suspect something like an FPGA feeding a fast a/d somewhere in the 50-70 MHz range. That is, a decomposition. There may be a synthesized LO and mixer to get to the 50 MHz. The info on the website says or used to say something about an sdr modified to act as a spectrum analyzer. One of the things I like about the device that played a part in my purchase is the availability of a 10 MHz reference input. as a good time-nut that shows some serious engineering attention to accuracy. Don I'm going to guess much simpler inside.. Essentially a programmable receiver like the Icom PCR1000, but with better bandwidth, running into a pair of 192kHz ADCs, for which easy USB interfacing is available. The question is really what does the 4GHz LO in the front look like? It's almost certainly some sort of VCO PLL scheme, probably with multiple VCOs. But, do they use a DDS? Probably not... They probably have a fast PLL that settles quickly so they step through in 100 kHz steps or so. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Software defined spectrum analyzer
Magnus Danielson wrote: On 12/12/2010 02:31 AM, jimlux wrote: Two VCOs covering 1-2.2 GHz could through mixing and selecting between sum and difference output filters (i.e. lowpass and highpass) cover that without too much difficulty. Except for the highest end, there is a degree of freedom in setting the oscillators to their individual frequency which naturally could be used to avoid bad frequencies to leak into the IF for instance. C Yeah.. but there's a whole raft of inexpensive PLL chips with multiple VCOs on them to cover wide ranges (e.g. all cell, mobile data, and WLAN bands).. I'll bet they're using one of them. If a chip exists with VCOs that does the job, that's going to be cheaper and easier than any sort of add/subtract/mix/divide scheme. This is an example of a new class of lab instruments.. you pay for the hard part (the RF design and performance) and software takes care of the rest, and since software has almost zero reproduction cost For today, there's probably a significant value added in the software, so it might not be free... but over time, that will change. And, if it works out nicely, standardized interfaces (like 50 ohms or resistor color codes) will evolve, so the same software will work with a $500 inexpensive widget or a $10,000 high performance widget from Agilent. There will always be a market for software tailored to a specific market/need (like standards or regulatory compliance) that will cost, but for generic functions (like a power spectrum) that will probably be free, or close to it. I wonder if there's an interface for this for my iPad? ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Software defined spectrum analyzer
El 12/12/2010 03:41, jimlux escribió: This is an example of a new class of lab instruments.. you pay for the hard part (the RF design and performance) and software takes care of the rest, and since software has almost zero reproduction cost And the hard part is also less expensive - older signal generators used impressive attenuators since the output accuracy depended heavily on them, newer ones uses not-so-good ones whose characteristics are compensated by the software (compare the attenuator in a RS SMFP with the one inside a Marconi 2945) For today, there's probably a significant value added in the software, so it might not be free... but over time, that will change. I hope so :) And, if it works out nicely, standardized interfaces (like 50 ohms or resistor color codes) will evolve, so the same software will work with a $500 inexpensive widget or a $10,000 high performance widget from Agilent. Not sure about. As we are seeing, Agilent, Tek and others are trying hard to make their instrumentation to be obsolescent, unmaintainable and unusable in timescales as short as they can, to force replacement. Those nice instruments running windows are basically door stops if they fail once the manufacturer has decided to stop maintaining them. And they are not exactly unexpensive. They will avoid as hard as they can that you can use and old software with a new instrument, and viceversa. There will always be a market for software tailored to a specific market/need (like standards or regulatory compliance) that will cost, but for generic functions (like a power spectrum) that will probably be free, or close to it. I wonder if there's an interface for this for my iPad? In the Signal Hound web page they mention the availability of a free API... this is also what has attracted me, because of the posibility to write custom software for those specific needs. So perhaps an interface for your iPad could be written ;) Regards, Javier -- Javier HerreroEMAIL: jherr...@hvsistemas.com Chief Technology Officer HV Sistemas S.L. PHONE: +34 949 336 806 Los Charcones, 17 FAX: +34 949 336 792 19170 El Casar - Guadalajara - Spain WEB: http://www.hvsistemas.com ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Isolated input oscilloscopes
Any particular bandwidth requirement? Storage or computer interface? Analog? Digital? What's your price range? On Sat, Dec 11, 2010 at 6:25 PM, Mark Sims hol...@hotmail.com wrote: A little off topic, but needed for a time-nutty application: 4 channel scope with isolated inputs that is affordable. I have a 2 channel Tek THS730A. The Tek TPS2014 is rather pricey. Does anybody know of something affordable? ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Data Professionals Press Release
List, Wrote: Data Professionals of Pleasanton California has purchased the Copyrights and existing inventory of all legacy Heathkit product documentation from Heath Company of Benton Harbor Michigan for an undisclosed amount. The new company will make copies of the original legacy manuals available to the marketplace via its web site and through eBay and PayPal. Considering that the Heath Company has been out of business for say, 30 years or so, this “California Business Plan” shows that you momma was right in telling you not to ingest illegal substances. I suppose their next bright idea is to buy rights from Ford for the Edsel. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Isolated input oscilloscopes
Mark, Wrote: A little off topic, but needed for a time-nutty application: 4 channel scope with isolated inputs that is affordable. I have a 2 channel Tek THS730A. The Tek TPS2014 is rather pricey. Does anybody know of something affordable? If all you are looking for is isolation from ground, a TEK 7904 series using an isolation transformer might work if the size isn’t a problem. TEK also makes a differential input plug IIRK. I’ve bought several. Usually about $200 to $300 on epay. Plug-in modules can be found dirt cheap if you lurk. Even dead modules are good for hardware parts. Contact me off list if you’d like more info. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] Newbie to Group. Questions Datum ExacTime 9390-6000
(I apologize if this is a dupe, I used wrong e-mail account previously) Hi I am a lurker, finally signed onto the group. Some of this are probably dumb questions, but I figured this group was the best source of the info! Thanks to a NASA auction, I bought for very cheap, a Datum (Symmetricom) ExacTime 9390-6000 sn 4185. Very clean and unused looking. Technical trivia: Upon first powering it up, I find coordinates that per Google Earth show it was last operated in Irvine Calfornia at an office park on Parker near Toledo Rd! The unit has a label for the SPACEHAB (Astrotech) project, likely was part of ground testing by some contractor. I was able to power up and by using a cobbled up coax connection to a cheapo Garmin GA27 antenna, I was able to acquire 4 satellites tracking and get lock. I have weak signal here due to trees so had to do a cold boot and wait about 4 hours to get lock. Inside I find a TCXO. And it appears, an Oncore receiver is the heart of this unit. 1) I read that there is a firmware problem with leap seconds. Mine appears to display UTC accurately (compared to atomic wall clock) and GPS has about a 14 or 15 second offset (Normal I think?). 2) I would like to retrofit a Rb oscillator, can this be done, whats involved? Parts needed, cables, programming? 3) Where can I find schematic, service manuals and parts list for the retrofit? 4) Is this a useful unit? Is it functionally an accurate device? I don't see much discussion about it. 5) There is an option in the J3 area consisting of J3c a D style connector and J3f a BNC connector. What is this option? 6) Can I determine the available and fitted options from the menu? Should I assume that if the menu says it can output 100 KHz or 1 KHz etc, it can do this? 7) It appears to have an event counter for comparing an external oscillator with the internal. Is this correct? 8) Can the event counter, discipline an external oscillator through a voltage? 9) The receive signal level units are confusing, is this a level relative to noise floor? 10) Although tracking and locked, the screen flashes DOING GPS CORRECTIONS periodically. Is this normal? Any hints or tips to using this unit? My needs are to provide reference for the HSO in my HP-8920B and to provide precise timing and phase for some radio projects. Thanks in advance -- Joe Leikhim Leikhim and Associates Communications Consultants Oviedo, Florida www.Leikhim.com jleik...@leikhim.com 407-982-0446 WWW.LEIKHIM.COM ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Data Professionals Press Release
1. It is unclear whether they actually bought the rights from the real owner who actually had clear title, or just a pile of HC manuals. 2. If they do not have clear title to the manuals, any copyrights to the scanned version is invalid. They can only copyright new material they have added. -John = List, Wrote: Data Professionals of Pleasanton California has purchased the Copyrights and existing inventory of all legacy Heathkit product documentation from Heath Company of Benton Harbor Michigan for an undisclosed amount. The new company will make copies of the original legacy manuals available to the marketplace via its web site and through eBay and PayPal. Considering that the Heath Company has been out of business for say, 30 years or so, this âCalifornia Business Planâ shows that you momma was right in telling you not to ingest illegal substances. I suppose their next bright idea is to buy rights from Ford for the Edsel. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Data Professionals Press Release
Perry wrote: Considering that the Heath Company has been out of business for say, 30 years or so, this California Business Plan shows that you momma was right in telling you not to ingest illegal substances. I suppose their next bright idea is to buy rights from Ford for the Edsel. Intellectual property rights do not just evaporate or return to the public domain when a company disappears -- SOMEONE owns them (often someone who bought the assets of the company, perhaps for less than a penny on the dollar). I have no idea whether Data Professionals bought anything from anybody -- or if they did, whether the seller really owned active copyrights, and if so, what exactly they owned. There is an infinity of possibilities, and the only certainty would be the judgment of a court deciding a lawsuit. What we appear to have is someone claiming to hold the rights, and threatening enforcement. Folks can either accept the claim, defy the threat and invite a lawsuit, or bring a preemptive action for declaratory relief -- i.e., make Data Professionals prove that they own the rights. Not likely that anyone who wants to host free downloads will undergo the expense of being the test case (but if you are willing, please be our guest -- otherwise, please stop throwing bombs of ignorance). Best regards, Charles ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
[time-nuts] DJVU and PDF
List, I’ve been trying to do a little desktop publishing on the side for 25 years and have learned a lot mostly by trial and lots of errors. I was first multiple sand-bagged by MS. Either going to a new operating system or changing to a newer version of word changed the format of completed documents. (I couldn’t afford a Mac.) When I retired in 2001 I started re-doing service manuals for Boatanchor receivers and related equipment. I found that trying to use DJVU a total PITB. It has become totally obsolete because of lack of support and the quantum leaps in computer technology do not now require minimalist graphics files. Also other well supported competing graphics formats were developed. I had a modest photo-editing program that came with my HP scanner and that worked so-so, but it was free. Then I got a copy of Acrobat 5 after version 6 came out and it expanded by a magnitude of what I was able to do. Besides creating PDF’s, I found I could take a non-encrypted PDF and both extract the pictures and the text separately. For OCR work the program that came with my HP scanner was sufficient. With the $100 Photoshop 6 program I took another quantum leap up for my B/W pictures. Now I can change from lossy compression format to a loss-less one, edit and then when finished go to a more compressed format. Now there are several free or low cost PDF file making programs on the internet. There are also free PDF readers that are quicker, less bloated, and hacker free. So what I do is create my documents in MS word and then convert them to PDF’s. I tried the free Open Office but the word processor did not have an un-do function (which I ALWAYS need) that I could find. So it seems to me that the only cheap practical archival our time nuts ifo is to use the PDF format. Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Software defined spectrum analyzer
Jim: Indeed. I've a very small collection of USB instruments so far, but it's definitely the way of the future for me. I have an older scope from link instruments, the signal hound, and will construct one of the very simple component bridges ( uses a dual op amp and a couple of resistors and the sound card). As I mentioned, there's a good power meter from Mini-circuits, and the ham radio QEX periodical has some designs for a VNA albeit not at microwave frequenies... All use the computer as most of the software and display. Note that a simple EEpc used is now about $250 and can run most of this stuff. I'd really like to have some '80's Hp stuff, but the buy it now folks have sucked up all the bargains, and for me time is important. Don - Original Message - From: jimlux jim...@earthlink.net To: Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement time-nuts@febo.com Sent: Saturday, December 11, 2010 7:41 PM Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Software defined spectrum analyzer Magnus Danielson wrote: On 12/12/2010 02:31 AM, jimlux wrote: Two VCOs covering 1-2.2 GHz could through mixing and selecting between sum and difference output filters (i.e. lowpass and highpass) cover that without too much difficulty. Except for the highest end, there is a degree of freedom in setting the oscillators to their individual frequency which naturally could be used to avoid bad frequencies to leak into the IF for instance. C Yeah.. but there's a whole raft of inexpensive PLL chips with multiple VCOs on them to cover wide ranges (e.g. all cell, mobile data, and WLAN bands).. I'll bet they're using one of them. If a chip exists with VCOs that does the job, that's going to be cheaper and easier than any sort of add/subtract/mix/divide scheme. This is an example of a new class of lab instruments.. you pay for the hard part (the RF design and performance) and software takes care of the rest, and since software has almost zero reproduction cost For today, there's probably a significant value added in the software, so it might not be free... but over time, that will change. And, if it works out nicely, standardized interfaces (like 50 ohms or resistor color codes) will evolve, so the same software will work with a $500 inexpensive widget or a $10,000 high performance widget from Agilent. There will always be a market for software tailored to a specific market/need (like standards or regulatory compliance) that will cost, but for generic functions (like a power spectrum) that will probably be free, or close to it. I wonder if there's an interface for this for my iPad? ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] DJVU and PDF
On 12/12/2010, Perry Sandeen sandee...@yahoo.com wrote: List, ... So what I do is create my documents in MS word and then convert them to PDF’s. I tried the free Open Office but the word processor did not have an un-do function (which I ALWAYS need) that I could find. So it seems to me that the only cheap practical archival our time nuts ifo is to use the PDF format. Regarding Open Office Writer, did you look in the Edit menu as Undo, CTRL+Z, is the first item. Regards, Steve Regards, Perrier ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there. -- Steve Rooke - ZL3TUV G8KVD The only reason for time is so that everything doesn't happen at once. - Einstein ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Software defined spectrum analyzer
On Dec 11, 2010, at 7:07 PM, Javier Herrero jherr...@hvsistemas.es wrote: And, if it works out nicely, standardized interfaces (like 50 ohms or resistor color codes) will evolve, so the same software will work with a $500 inexpensive widget or a $10,000 high performance widget from Agilent. Not sure about. As we are seeing, Agilent, Tek and others are trying hard to make their instrumentation to be obsolescent, unmaintainable and unusable in timescales as short as they can, to force replacement. Those nice instruments running windows are basically door stops if they fail once the manufacturer has decided to stop maintaining them. And they are not exactly unexpensive. They will avoid as hard as they can that you can use and old software with a new instrument, and viceversa. Then manufacturers will rise up to meet the need. Think of all the smallish RF equipment companies out there. Arbiter for type 4 power meters, maury, etc... There will always be a market for software tailored to a specific market/need (like standards or regulatory compliance) that will cost, but for generic functions (like a power spectrum) that will probably be free, or close to it. I wonder if there's an interface for this for my iPad? In the Signal Hound web page they mention the availability of a free API... this is also what has attracted me, because of the posibility to write custom software for those specific needs. So perhaps an interface for your iPad could be written ;) I'm a bit cynical about that... There's been quite a few inexpensive SDRs out there that were planning a useful API, but it never materialized. But yes, it is interesting. As is the USRP... ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
Re: [time-nuts] Software defined spectrum analyzer
On Dec 11, 2010, at 10:14 PM, Don Latham d...@montana.com wrote: Jim: Indeed. I've a very small collection of USB instruments so far, but it's definitely the way of the future for me. I have an older scope from link instruments, the signal hound, and will construct one of the very simple component bridges ( uses a dual op amp and a couple of resistors and the sound card). As I mentioned, there's a good power meter from Mini-circuits, and the ham radio QEX periodical has some designs for a VNA albeit not at microwave frequenies... I think it would be possible to build a microwave front end for, say the tentec tapr VNA. A nice quiet synthesized LO, etc ___ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.
