subject:"\[TruthTalk\]"

Some you know as members of TT. Others have been named. And still others will remain unnamed -- people who would have no meaning to you. Not to be left out of the mix are Christ and Paul..in that order. Christ the author and finisher. Paul - the patient and courageous theologian. The mediation of the revelation of Christ continues to this day, but certainly , Paul is the beginning of this mediation.Christianity would be exactly as it is now, without Paul,and we can say amen to this if we believe that Christianity is what it is today by the design and will of God in Christ . if not Pual, then there would be another. And so, you will know what I do not mean to say when I write these words, "I cannot imagine what The Faith would be likeapart from Paul's contribution." All that I consider "mentoring" centers around the teachings of Christ
, personally, and as He revealed them to Paul and the others. Everything. What is noteworthy about that statement is this: my appreciation of these last two is no different in my life than for any on TruthTalk.

Salute to you all.

No time remaining for new discussions.

John David Smithson
Out !!!

-- Original message -- From: Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Maybe then you could tell us about the men that Mentored you?[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

This, of course, is not the truth. You already know what I do. Now, because your memory is no longer than your brain stem means nothing to me. You ask only to cause trouble. But go tothe archives and look it up.

The bean count still belongs to the Lord.
jd

-- Original message -- From: Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED]
I only compare because we all know you do nothing.
That is why you can't say anything.No one is trying to draw attention to themselves just trying to draw attention to one who talks a big talk then when called on it backs down because that is what it is JUST TALK.
0[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Christ's mentoring is what made the 12 apostles the force they were. Let's see-- that's 12 divided by three (years) and a 100 years later , they tell me there was somewhere around 6 million Christians. But make fun of it if you will.

Part of mentoring (read:discipleship) is the giving up of self. It is the carnal mind that makes a game out of sharing the gospel and comparing "success" landmarks.
It is Christ's example that really matters, here -- not mine nor yours.

the comparisons have been made. You ignored them then -- you would do soagain if agreed to play this very immature game. What shall we call this game? "My Sword is bigger than yours?" If we are to pray in our closets -- surely our ministries are not for the purpose of attracting attention to self. I will pray that you move away from self as you continue doing what every you do "for the Lord." After all -- the head count belongs to the Lord for He is the one who adds to His assemblage.

-- Original message -- From: Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED]
You Mentor but have No one that you have mentored.
Impressive.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

maybe God is trying to tell you something, Kevin. The "x" in the box is probably not what you had in mind.

-- Original message -- From: Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Blab-away for as little as 1¢/min. Make PC-to-Phone Calls using Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.

New Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Call regular phones from your PC for low, low rates.

Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Make PC-to-Phone Calls to the US (and 30+ countries) for 2¢/min or less.

Re: [TruthTalk] Saying Goodbye

2006-03-27 Thread David Miller

Continuing with my farewell impressions...

There have been some past members of TruthTalk that deserve mention.  Slade 
and Kay Henson as well as their friend Jeff Powers were always pointing us 
toward our Hebraic roots.  It was an interesting blend of traditionalism in 
regards to the written word of Scripture and yet liberal social philosophy. 
Kay's interest in social reform and her work with the messed up children's 
legal system in Florida will remain in my prayers.  Glenn Tabor will be 
remembered for his passion toward basic foundations of Christianity.  Glenn 
had a knack for bringing out a lot of discussion from people who differed 
from him.  He always carried a pastor's care for everyone on the list, yet 
he was zealous toward ideology that conformed to traditional Christian 
beliefs.  Laura Hamm likewise will be remembered in my heart as someone who 
stimulated thinking and was not afraid to jump into waters unknown.  She had 
an ability to hear and seemed very able to represent the foot washing 
Baptists from time to time.  Michael Douglas will always be close to my 
heart as a firm believer to communing with the Lord in prayer.  His dialogue 
about praying against storms and calamities will not easily be forgotten. 
He brought to the forum practical considerations for the spiritually 
inclined. Michael was not content with ideology and philosophy, but 
ulitmately concerned with where the rubber meets the road in spiritual 
matters.  His life of faith will always be a constant inspiration to my 
spirit.  Jonathan Hughes will be remembered as a passionate person for truth 
without any fluff.  Ideologically on the other side from me, his challenges 
to my mindset and working philosophical paradigms encouraged and promoted 
thinking.  Caroline Wong will be remembered for being well informed and able 
to raise issues that I would typically otherwise consider mundane.

Terry Clifton will always have a special place in my heart.  In many ways, 
when he was here, he was the resident TruthTalk elder.  He served as a 
conservative anchor, always the calm voice of reason when things became 
tumultuous.  Terry had a knack for being understanding yet unswayed away 
from the Biblical no-nonsense perspective of truth.

More to come later...

David Miller

--
Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know 
how you ought to answer every man.  (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org

If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL 
PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed.  If you have a friend who wants to 
join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.

Re: [TruthTalk] Saying Goodbye

2006-03-27 Thread David Miller

Continuing with my farewell impressions...

Although John Smithson is a rather emotional person with whom I have butted 
heads concerning over-generalizations and stereotypic expressions, I have 
appreciated John's keen interest in theology and philosophy.  He has 
ventured into areas which others on TruthTalk would not.  By doing so, John 
has opened up avenues of thought and reflection which would otherwise have 
been stagnant.  John was never afraid of a good brawl and often moved topics 
on TruthTalk into fisticuffs.  I appreciated such opportunities as a way to 
dig deeper into issues, furthering a reductionistic method of breaking down 
subjects into smaller parts for analysis.  I will always have fond thoughts 
about his passion for issues that were usually on the periphery of my 
thinking.

Kevin Deegan has been a great contributor, always great with links and 
information about almost any issue.  Kevin's breath of reading comes across 
loud and clear, but more than just being well read, he has expressed a 
passion for truth.  He takes a hard line stance that is helpful to others 
willing to give a thorough study of a particular issue.  While Kevin is 
quick to quip, he also exhibits a patience to keep ploughing along with 
difficult subjects.  I think I will remember Kevin's patience more than the 
actual information he has posted.  May God grant me the ability to stick 
with it like Kevin does, to present God's truth, despite what the detractors 
might offer.  I also cannot sign off without mentioning my admiration for 
Kevin's sacrifice and diligence toward preaching the Word of God to those 
outside the churches of Jesus Christ.  Such will always continue to inspire 
me.

Carroll Dean Moore will be best remembered for his no-nonsense seriousness 
with which he approaches life and the Word of God.  I will remember Dean's 
passion and loyalty toward what he perceives to be the right path.  When I 
think of Dean, I tend to remember the passage from 1 Peter 5:8, Be sober, 
be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh 
about, seeking whom he may devour.  Thank you Dean.

Ruben Israel Chavez will be remembered for his always uplifting preaching 
reports.  I stand in awe of the sacrifice he makes as he travels around the 
country and the world, preaching the Truth of Christ to those who are 
unchurched.  Ruben also has taken time to joust with us from time to time, 
and to explain his thinking about issues of importance.  Ruben is a constant 
model of being a preacher of the Word and not just a student.  Such will 
always be in my mind.

Charles Perry Locke has been a gentlemen among gentlemen.  He is passionate 
about truth and at the same time well mannered and filled with common sense 
I appreciate Perry's sacrifice in helping moderate the list for a long time. 
In posts, he has perhaps been among the most patient.  When I have been very 
dense in hearing him on a point, he would take the time to spell it out 
clearly until I got it.  Many others would have simply made fun of me and 
gone on to other issues.  Not Perry.  I will always cherish his 
longsuffering and clear, logical mind.

Gary Ottoson... I will always remember him as Mr. Abbreviation.  Gary's 
presence has raised the intellectual level a notch or two on TruthTalk. 
While many of his posts were difficult to decipher for some, and nearly 
impossible for the uneducated, he did at times come up with gems that 
provoked further discussion.  Gary was a constant reminder to TruthTalk that 
poets have something to say among those who wish to talk about truth.  Gary 
also has a steadfastness to him that has been inspirational.

Judy Taylor has been a rock for the unadulterated truth.  Her adherence to 
Scripture without any contamination from the thoughts of men will always be 
in the back of my mind.  In my tendency toward curiosity about many ideas 
and subjects, Judy has been that firm but gentle reminder of where my feet 
need to be firmly planted.  Her strength of character and great love for God 
has been an inspiration for me, and will continue to be an inspiration to me 
for years to come.  One cannot come into contact with such a person and not 
remember her when times of trials and persecution come because of the Word 
of God.  Thank you Judy for being Judy.  You are greatly loved.

Linda Shields, well, Linda is Izzy... a fiesty cat.  I have learned to 
appreciate her passion and independence of spirit.  In a day when many 
Christians are generally somewhat reticent to declare political 
affiliations, Linda would boldly proclaim her Republican affiliation as 
quickly as she would her love for Jesus Christ.  She often shared 
interesting articles and established points that were overlooked by her 
detractors but heard by others.  Linda often tag teamed with Judy as if in a 
wrestling tournament.  Linda's adherence to truth despite what others say 
has been encouraging and helpful in the dialectic

RE: [TruthTalk] More Goodbyes from our house to yours

2006-03-27 Thread ShieldsFamily









Thank you so much for the photos of your
beautiful self and family. I agree with JD; our kids outdo us to the max!
I cant help crying right now, realizing that this is really
goodbye. I dearly love you all, Izzy











From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Judy Taylor
Sent: Monday, March 27, 2006 10:37
AM
To: truthtalk@mail.innglory.org
Subject: [TruthTalk] More Goodbyes
from our house to yours





Just had to get into the images if only
a little - judyt

RE: [TruthTalk] More Goodbyes from our house to yours


Write with special thoughts and "whats happenin" amy time. 

God Bless. 

-- Original message -- From: "ShieldsFamily" [EMAIL PROTECTED] 






Thank you so much for the photos of your beautiful self and family. I agree with JD; our kids outdo us to the max! I cant help crying right now, realizing that this is really goodbye. I dearly love you all, Izzy





From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Judy TaylorSent: Monday, March 27, 2006 10:37 AMTo: truthtalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: [TruthTalk] More Goodbyes from our house to yours

Just had to get into the images if only a little - judyt

[TruthTalk] Saying Goodbye

2006-03-27 Thread Judy Taylor





Thank you for these thoughts David; you seem to have 
apprehended everyone's
specialness. I am, like Iz, already missing 
everyone even before the Lists
final demise - after all I did spend many a day with 
all of you and you will be
missed 

I'll need to get used to coffee without Lance 
now... Thanks Lance for the update 
re your Mom.

judyt


From: "David Miller" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Continuing with my farewell impressions...

Although John Smithson is a rather emotional person with whom I have butted 
heads concerning over-generalizations and stereotypic expressions, I have 
appreciated John's keen interest in theology and philosophy. He has 
ventured into areas which others on TruthTalk would not. By doing so, 
John has opened up avenues of thought and reflection which would otherwise 
have been stagnant. John was never afraid of a good brawl and often 
moved topics on TruthTalk into fisticuffs. I appreciated such 
opportunities as a way to dig deeper into issues, furthering a 
reductionistic method of breaking down subjects into smaller parts for 
analysis. I will always have fond thoughts about his passion for 
issues that were usually on the periphery of my thinking.

Kevin Deegan has been a great contributor, always great with links and 
information about almost any issue. Kevin's breath of reading comes 
across loud and clear, but more than just being well read, he has expressed 
a passion for truth. He takes a hard line stance that is helpful to 
others willing to give a thorough study of a particular issue. While 
Kevin is quick to quip, he also exhibits a patience to keep ploughing along 
with difficult subjects. I think I will remember Kevin's patience more 
than the actual information he has posted. May God grant me the 
ability to stick with it like Kevin does, to present God's truth, despite 
what the detractors might offer. I also cannot sign off without 
mentioning my admiration for Kevin's sacrifice and diligence toward 
preaching the Word of God to those outside the churches of Jesus 
Christ. Such will always continue to inspire me.

Carroll Dean Moore will be best remembered for his no-nonsense seriousness 
with which he approaches life and the Word of God. I will remember 
Dean's passion and loyalty toward what he perceives to be the right 
path. When I think of Dean, I tend to remember the passage from 1 
Peter 5:8, "Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a 
roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour." Thank you 
Dean.

Ruben Israel Chavez will be remembered for his always uplifting preaching 
reports. I stand in awe of the sacrifice he makes as he travels around 
the country and the world, preaching the Truth of Christ to those who are 
unchurched. Ruben also has taken time to joust with us from time to 
time, and to explain his thinking about issues of importance. Ruben is 
a constant model of being a preacher of the Word and not just a 
student. Such will always be in my mind.

Charles Perry Locke has been a gentlemen among gentlemen. He is 
passionate about truth and at the same time well mannered and filled with 
common sense I appreciate Perry's sacrifice in helping moderate the list for 
a long time. In posts, he has perhaps been among the most patient. 
When I have been very dense in hearing him on a point, he would take the 
time to spell it out clearly until I got it. Many others would have 
simply made fun of me and gone on to other issues. Not Perry. I 
will always cherish his longsuffering and clear, logical mind.

Gary Ottoson... I will always remember him as Mr. Abbreviation. 
Gary's presence has raised the intellectual level a notch or two on 
TruthTalk. While many of his posts were difficult to decipher for some, and 
nearly impossible for the uneducated, he did at times come up with gems that 
provoked further discussion. Gary was a constant reminder to TruthTalk 
that poets have something to say among those who wish to talk about 
truth. Gary also has a steadfastness to him that has been 
inspirational.

Judy Taylor has been a rock for the unadulterated truth. Her 
adherence to Scripture without any contamination from the thoughts of men 
will always be in the back of my mind. In my tendency toward curiosity 
about many ideas and subjects, Judy has been that firm but gentle reminder 
of where my feet need to be firmly planted. Her strength of character 
and great love for God has been an inspiration for me, and will continue to 
be an inspiration to me for years to come. One cannot come into 
contact with such a person and not remember her when times of trials and 
persecution come because of the Word of God. Thank you Judy for being 
Judy. You are greatly loved.

Linda Shields, well, Linda is Izzy... a fiesty cat. I have learned to 
appreciate her passion and independence of spirit. In a day when many 
Christians are generally somewhat reticent to declare political 
affiliations, Linda would boldly pro

Re: [TruthTalk] TT w/o a moderator

2006-03-27 Thread Kevin Deegan

David,Since TT has been w/o a Moderator, it seems to have done just fine.  Why not just keep the list up w/o one?Breaking up is just so hard to do.
		New Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Call regular phones from your PC for low, low rates.

Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism





interesting --perhapswhile yer curled upfondlingmyow 
myow,try to juxtapose your inadvertant underlying insightto 
the real point:



"but Am. conservative Muslim theory ain't really 
their fault: 'either get our new WalMarts opened on time in Baghdad 
or face us blowin' you to (the other) hell (we're 
financing')]"




  ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote:
  








..Wal-Mart? 
..they dont pay enough or give enough benefits to those POOR people who 
work there so SAD!

Re: [TruthTalk] TT w/o a moderator




interesting


On Mon, 27 Mar 2006 17:06:54 -0800 (PST) 
Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  ||
  TT..w/o a Moderator..[has] done just 
  fine..
  ||

Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism





.. it ain't that prettyat 
all

On Mon, 27 Mar 2006 19:17:57 -0700 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  
  ||
  
  
  
  "but Am. conservative Muslim theory ain't really 
  their fault: 'either get our new WalMarts opened on time in 
  Baghdad or face us blowin' you to (the other) hell (we're 
  financing')]"

[TruthTalk] I Hope I'm Not too Late...

2006-03-27 Thread Christine Miller

I just wanted to say one last time that it has been such a joy getting  to know you all. I praise God for your wisdom and passion. Here's a picture of me grinning ear-to-ear with my mom on Broadway a  couple of months ago. My father babysat all of my sisters back home  while we two girls painted the town red! I love you all. -Christine
		Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls.  Great rates starting at 1/min.

Re: [TruthTalk] Broken Cisterns

2006-03-27 Thread Kevin Deegan

Broken CisternsJeremiah 2:13 saysFor my people have committed two evils; they have forsaken me the fountain of living waters, and hewed them out cisterns, broken cisterns that can hold no water.Jesus promises that "whosoever drinketh of the water that i shall give him shall never thirst." Jesus is that living water, and he provides the way, the truth and the life. His water is life itself. Eternal life in heaven WITH Jesus and victory on Earth IN Jesus. Christian, are you in victory? Or are you still drinking from broken cisterns?Let us lay aside every weight, and the sin that doth so easily beset us and let us run with patience the race that is set before us, LOOKING UNTO JESUS the author and finisher of our faith(Hebrews 12:1-2)Are you looking unto JESUS? Or are you Weighed down still? (Turn your TV off, perhaps.) Turn your eyes upon Jesus.And for now, check out some Charles Spurgeon. (while keeping your eyes on Jesus still!) (if you can walk and chew gum at the same time, I think you can grasp that!)The famous preacher, Charles Spurgeon once wrote: "Men are in a restless pursuit after satisfaction in earthly things. They will exhaust themselves in the deceitful delights of sin, and, finding them all to be vanity and emptiness, they will become very perplexed and disappointed. But they will still continue their fruitless search."Though wearied, they still stagger forward under the influence of spiritual madness, and though there is no result to be reached except that of everlasting disappointment, yet they press forward. They have no forethought for their eternal state; the present hour absorbs them. They turn to another and another of earth's broken cisterns, hoping to find water where not a drop was ever discovered yet.An anonymous student adds, "Madness is an apt description of the continual pursuit of feeding the flesh, is it not? I once heard someone say that the definition of insanity is to continually do the same thing
over and over expecting different results each time. Is that not what we did in our days in Egypt? Did we not continue to look back to being in slavery, feeling guilty and unfulfilled every single time, yet thinking that maybe the next attempt would fill up the emptiness inside us? I know that's what I did for years and it truly was madness to think I could find true lasting satisfaction in this way." If you have always been in victory, Praise God! If you used to be in victory, return to GOD. If you never had the victory, get a hold of GODKeep reaching for the victory!FYI, Remember why it's important to have a clean
testimony! "But when he saw the multitudes, he was moved with compassion on them"..."The harvest truly is plenteous but the labourers are few.'" ---Matthew 9:36-37Jesus came to seek and save that which was lost. No one can serve two masters. Are you bowing to Jesus Christ, or the god of this world? Do you love the things that God loves (his word, his people, sharing his truths, righteousness, preaching the gospel, teaching all nations) or do you love the patterns of this world? (is GOD your hobby and hobbies your god? Pro sports, things, consumerism, the lust of the eyes, the lust of the flesh and the pride of life.) What drives you? What controls you? What moves you? What excites you? My prayer is that all of us will be able to honestly say JESUS CHRIST! Serving GOD! Reaching the LOST! It's hard to have compassion when we are in bondage to sin. It's hard to
want to see people saved when we are yielded to the devil. It's hard to hear the voice of God when we listen to the cravings of the flesh.We don't need to be perfect, but a Christian should progressively want to move toward the light. If you are in regular sin, and aren't bothered by it, what makes you think you are saved? If you are not in sin, and aren't witnessing and don't have a burden for the lost, what makes you think you are saved?It's time to do more for God. My heart breaks when I see us not broken over lost souls, when I see us not broken over how many see salvation as a license to sin. God will not be mocked. Please search your hearts, please seek his face, and please humble yourself and cry out to him to set you on fire, and to use you while there's still time left.March is almost over, 2006 is 25% down, and life is but a vapor. Time is Marching on and we lose an hour next
week. Resurrection Sunday is coming up, when Jesus rose from the dead DEFEATING DEATH. God's love of the word and his hatred of sin met in one supreme divine moment. Spring is now on us, a time of renewal. The days will shine brighter---will our lives shine brighter as well??? Let's make today the day to get right with God. Let's admit we are lukewarm, let's admit that we have forsaken our first love, let's admit we've forgotten what it was like when we first were saved. Amen?

Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. PC-to-Phone calls for ridiculously low rates.

Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism






On Mon, 27 Mar 2006 19:17:57 -0700 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  
  ..perhapswhile yer curled 
  upfondlingmyow myow..
  
  ..re-consideryour role in 
  repentance,even somerock starsaren't adverse to it, 
  e.g.,
  
  
  
  "_sitting_ under my blue sky of 
  deceptionthe colors run every time it rainswrought brought forth 
  fashioned from inceptionmy own hands and i take all the blame
  refrain:
  as the light goes outdarkness 
  with her bated breathwaits out on periphery of the camp firedecadence 
  and violence we do best
  burned out face down in the 
  gutterlowest point i could find to ground zeroroll back alibis and 
  skies are crushingdo we paint with much too black a brush
  rock and roll what is it any 
  moreyouth profound or profane to endurepassion in the back seat or at 
  the foot of the crossgoing going gone and finally lost" Bill Mallonee (BMI) 
©1997

Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism






On Mon, 27 Mar 2006 19:41:19 -0700 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  
  .. it ain't that prettyat 
  all
  
  On Mon, 27 Mar 2006 19:17:57 -0700 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  writes:
  

||



"but Am. 
conservative Muslim theory ain't really their fault: 
..



"Tweedle-dee Dum and Tweedle-dee 
DeeThey're throwing knives into the treeTwo big bags of dead man's 
bonesGot their noses to the grindstones

Living in the Land of NodTrustin' their 
fate to the Hands of GodThey pass by so silentlyTweedle-dee Dum and 
Tweedle-dee Dee

Well, they're going to the country, they're 
gonna retireThey're taking a streetcar named DesireLooking in the window 
at the pecan pieLot of things they'd like they would never 
buy

Neither one gonna turn and runThey're 
making a voyage to the sun"His Master's voice is calling me,"Says 
Tweedle-dee Dum to Tweedle-dee Dee

Tweedle-dee Dee and Tweedle-dee DumAll 
that and more and then someThey walk among the stately treesThey know 
the secrets of the breeze

Tweedle-dee Dum said to Tweedle-dee 
Dee"Your presence is obnoxious to me."They're like babies sittin' on a 
woman's kneeTweedle-dee Dum and Tweedle-dee Dee

Well, the rain beating down on my 
windowpaneI got love for you and it's all in vainBrains in the pot, 
they're beginning to boilThey're dripping with garlic and olive 
oil

Tweedle-dee Dee - he's on his hands and his 
kneesSaying, "Throw me somethin', Mister, please.""What's good for you 
is good for me,"Says Tweedle-dee Dum to Tweedle-dee 
Dee

Well, they're living in a happy 
harmonyTweedle-dee Dum and Tweedle-dee DeeThey're one day older and a 
dollar shortThey've got a parade permit and a police 
escort

They're lying low and they're makin' 
hayThey seem determined to go all the wayThey run a brick and tile 
companyTweedle-dee Dum and Tweedle-dee Dee

Well a childish dream is a deathless 
needAnd a noble truth is a sacred creedMy pretty baby, she's lookin' 
aroundShe's wearin' a multi-thousand dollar gown

Tweedle-dee Dee is a lowdown, sorry old 
manTweedle-dee Dum, he'll stab you where you stand"I've had too much of 
your company,"Says, Tweedle-dee Dum to Tweedle-dee 
Dee"
B Dylan :: Copyright © 2001 Special Rider Music

Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism




ftr, particDaveH--* = an 
influentialphrase (to me)fromthe title of a Warren Zevon 
song,the best rendition of it iv'e heardby the Pixies with Zevon's 
son Jordanafter Warren's relatively recent death--on the Zevon 
post-mortemCD 'Enjoy Every Sandwich' (indeed:)



On Mon, 27 Mar 2006 19:55:51 -0700 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  
  
  On Mon, 27 Mar 2006 19:41:19 -0700 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: 
  

* .. it ain't that 
prettyat all

Re: [TruthTalk] I Hope I'm Not too Late...




the pic isn't visible here, any chance 
you'd re-send it as an attachment to an email? thx

On Mon, 27 Mar 2006 18:45:37 -0800 (PST) Christine Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  I just wanted to say one last time that it has been such a joy getting to 
  know you all. I praise God for your wisdom and passion. Here's a 
  picture of me grinning ear-to-ear with my mom on Broadway a couple of months 
  ago. My father babysat all of my sisters back home while we two girls painted 
  the town red! I love you 
  all. -Christine
  
  
  Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great 
  rates starting at 1¢/min.

Re: [TruthTalk] I Hope I'm Not too Late...

2006-03-27 Thread Judy Taylor




Christine, I can't see the picture - Must be my Norton 
spam blocker or something, is there another
way you could send it? Have really enjoyed you. 
Thanks for beinga blessing to us on TT - judyt

On Mon, 27 Mar 2006 18:45:37 -0800 (PST) Christine Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  I just wanted to say one last time that it has been such a joy getting to 
  know you all. I praise God for your wisdom and passion. Here's a 
  picture of me grinning ear-to-ear with my mom on Broadway a couple of months 
  ago. My father babysat all of my sisters back home while we two girls painted 
  the town red! I love 
  you all. -Christine
  
  
  Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great 
  rates starting at 1¢/min.

Re: [TruthTalk] I Hope I'm Not too Late...


Ditto Judy's comments from me
jd

-- Original message -- From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] 

Christine, I can't see the picture - Must be my Norton spam blocker or something, is there another
way you could send it? Have really enjoyed you. Thanks for beinga blessing to us on TT - judyt

On Mon, 27 Mar 2006 18:45:37 -0800 (PST) Christine Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

I just wanted to say one last time that it has been such a joy getting to know you all. I praise God for your wisdom and passion. Here's a picture of me grinning ear-to-ear with my mom on Broadway a couple of months ago. My father babysat all of my sisters back home while we two girls painted the town red! I love you all. -Christine


Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1¢/min.

Re: [TruthTalk] I Hope I'm Not too Late...


well, if you all are going to quit because I came on line -- I'll just lurk.

jd

-- Original message -- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Ditto Judy's comments from me
jd

-- Original message -- From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] 

Christine, I can't see the picture - Must be my Norton spam blocker or something, is there another
way you could send it? Have really enjoyed you. Thanks for beinga blessing to us on TT - judyt

On Mon, 27 Mar 2006 18:45:37 -0800 (PST) Christine Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

I just wanted to say one last time that it has been such a joy getting to know you all. I praise God for your wisdom and passion. Here's a picture of me grinning ear-to-ear with my mom on Broadway a couple of months ago. My father babysat all of my sisters back home while we two girls painted the town red! I love you all. -Christine


Talk is cheap. Use Yahoo! Messenger to make PC-to-Phone calls. Great rates starting at 1¢/min.

Re: [TruthTalk] I Hope I'm Not too Late...




 


(lol)

On Tue, 28 Mar 2006 04:32:20 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  well, if you all are going to quit because I came on line -- 
  I'll just lurk.
  
  jd
  
  ||

Re: [TruthTalk] BIBLES not korans

http://www.hyperhistory.net/apwh/bios/b4macarthurd.htmGeneral MacArthur used American and Australian forces to coordinate an attack which led to the Japanese surrender. The day of the surrender Brigadier General MacArthur became Supreme Commander of the Allied Forces and was promoted to General of the Army, a five-star general. MacArthur occupied Japan to help rebuild its governmental system. A devout Episcopalian, MacArthur said to a visiting group of evangelicals that "Japan is a spiritual vacuum. If you do not fill it with Christianity, it will be filled with Communism. Send me 1,000 missionaries." He asked U.S. missionary societies to send "Bibles, Bibles and more Bibles.http://www.danielpipes.org/comments/30551 It is a shame that
incarcerated Jihadists are not given Bibles, because one Islamist, Tawfik Hamid, said that what made him eventually reject extremist beliefs was his having read Matthew 5:7-9: Before leaving college, he carried two boxes of books -- all espousing jihad -- into his yard. He poured gasoline over the pile and set it on fire. A healed mind, he felt, could rise only from the ashes of hate. While he watched the blaze, he remembered reading the Bible on his own in high school, and the words that had so moved him. "Blessed are the merciful, for they will be shown mercy. "Blessed are the pure in heart, for they will see God." "Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called sons of God." Nutt, Amy Ellis. "What Makes a Terrorist?" newhousenews.com, 23 Dec 2005, http://www.newhousenews.com/archive/nutt122305.html Other similar ex-terrorists include Walid Shoebat, Zak Anani and Ibrahim Abadallah. Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Is this what we are fighting for?I talked to a returning GI, who is a Christian.He told me he was praying for fellowship with another Christian. Orders or whatever keep the Christians from displaying such offensivematerials as crosses. In addition it is against policy to talk tolocals about such subjects as Christianity.He said the Chaplains office only has Korans, could this be true?http://www.danielpipes.org/blog/535Man has to Sue to get a Bible! While Koran is easily obtained.US Gov't Fights in court to KEEP BIBLE
OUT!US Gov't SOP for "handling the Koran in manner signaling respect andreverence"http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,158704,00.htmlLOL - US military attempts to preserve the tender sensibilities ofterrorists?Is this a separation of Church State issue?Why NO Respect/Reverence fo our Bible?http://www.thedailystar.net/magazine/2005/12/04/international.htmhttp://www.boston.com/news/world/articles/2003/11/07/limits_put_on_new_muslim_chaplain/--- ShieldsFamily <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>wrote: From WorldNetDaily.com: Rome, 22 March (AKI) - Abdul Rahman, the man condemned to death for having abandoned Islam, is just one of many Afghanis who decide to convert to Christianity, but most are forced to do so secretly, argues Arab Christian author Camille Eid. In an interview with Adnkronos International (AKI) Eid, author of "The Christians who come from Islam", said
during a recent trip to Afghanistan he met many similar cases. "They are Christians who have sprung out of nowhere and it's unclear how they have decided by themselves to convert" he added. The US, Italy, Germany and Canada have all expressed concern over the fate of Rahman who converted to Christianity 16 years ago. "I also spoke to a priest who had passed through Kabul and he said he was amazed that women sitting on the ground at the local market saw he was a foreigner and a Christian, by the cross he was wearing, and attracted his attention to them by making a sign of the cross with their fingers. He was convinced that they were trying to send him a coded message" said Eid, a Lebanese Maronite who lives in Italy. According to the author, Abdul Rahman is not the first Afghan
citizen to have been sentenced to death for apostasy since the fall of the Taliban regime. "The Islamic Taliban militias who still control entire areas of the country issued a statement in June 2004 in which they referred to a death sentence handed down to an Afghan converted to Christianity, Moulawi Asad Allah."__Do You Yahoo!?Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com __Do You Yahoo!?Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com --"Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man." (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.orgIf you do not want to receive posts
from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Make PC-to-Phone Calls to the US (and 30+ countries) for

Re: [TruthTalk] Noah Webster

2006-03-26 Thread ttxpress






On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 17:46:50 -0500 Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  Really up on social justice huh..?
  ||
  
  whateverrings true
  
  
"Sweet brother, if I do not sleep My eyes are flowers on your tomb 
And if I cannot eat my bread My fasts shall live like willows where 
you died If in the heat I find no water for my thirst My thirst 
shall turn to springs for you, poor traveler 
Come, in your labor find a resting place And in my sorrows lay your 
head Brother, take my life and bread And buy yourself a better bed 
Take my breath and take my death Buy yourself a better rest beneath 
the bells of Gethsemani 
When all the men of war are killed And flags have fallen into dust 
Your cross and mine will tell men still He died on each for both of 
us That we might become the brothers of God And learn to know the 
Christ of burnt men 
And the children are ringing the bells of Gethsemani 
For in the wreckage of your April Christ lies slain He weeps in the 
ruins of my spring The money of whose tears shall fall Into your 
weak and friendless hand And buy you back to your own land 
The silence of whose tears shall fall Like bells upon your alien tomb 
Hear them and come, they call you home And the children are ringing 
the bells of Gethsemani 
Yes, if they had been there They would have taken that crown of 
thorns from his hair And stayed for a while in that place of despair 
Ah, but what do I see, my brother is there And he's ringing the 
bells of Gethsemani"
(Music by Joan Baez, Words by Thomas Merton) 
© 1981 Gabriel Earl Music (ASCAP)

Re: [TruthTalk] Noah Webster

2006-03-26 Thread ttxpress






On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 17:46:50 -0500 Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  Really up on social justice huh..?
  
  
  
  whatever rings 
  true
  
"Sweet brother, if I do not sleep My eyes are flowers on 
your tomb And if I cannot eat my bread My fasts shall live like 
willows where you died If in the heat I find no water for my thirst 
My thirst shall turn to springs for you, poor traveler 
Come, in your labor find a resting place And in my sorrows 
lay your head Brother, take my life and bread And buy yourself a 
better bed Take my breath and take my death Buy yourself a better 
rest beneath the bells of Gethsemani 
When all the men of war are killed And flags have fallen 
into dust Your cross and mine will tell men still He died on each 
for both of us That we might become the brothers of God And learn to 
know the Christ of burnt men 
And the children are ringing the bells of Gethsemani 
For in the wreckage of your April Christ lies slain He 
weeps in the ruins of my spring The money of whose tears shall fall 
Into your weak and friendless hand And buy you back to your own land 

The silence of whose tears shall fall Like bells upon your 
alien tomb Hear them and come, they call you home And the children 
are ringing the bells of Gethsemani 
Yes, if they had been there They would have taken that 
crown of thorns from his hair And stayed for a while in that place of 
despair Ah, but what do I see, my brother is there And he's ringing 
the bells of Gethsemani" 
(Music by Joan Baez, Words by Thomas Merton) 
© 1981 Gabriel Earl Music (ASCAP)

Re: [TruthTalk] Noah Webster




I think it's a "right back atcha" thing - for years I 
would go over there and hear much lamenting about
what Americans had bought; do you know an American 
Company now owns the all Australian
delicious spread called Vegemite?

On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 23:45:33 -0800 (PST) Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
writes:

  I've just learned that 
  Australia is investing workers 
  retirement funds in US Real Estate
  
  They just bought the 
  New York Thruway. Does that mean I need a passport, now?From: 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  On Behalf Of Judy 
  TaylorThanks for this 
  Kevin
  


Proof of the pudding is always in 
the eating.

I've just learned that 
Australia is investing workers 
retirement funds in US Real Estate also

So Lance and his prophet don't have 
a whole lot of support from "down under" 
either



On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 09:20:31 -0800 (PST) Kevin 
Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
writes:

  
  Lance says Canada will not suffer the same fate at the 
  USA. 
  
  
  
  
  Ah
  
  Ah
  
   AH 
  CHOO!
  
  
  
  excuse me
  
  
  
  348,000 New York jobs are supported by 
  Canada-U.S. trade 
  
  Total CanadaU.S. merchandise trade: $411 billion 
  
  
  CanadaU.S. trade supported 5.2 million 
  U.S. jobs 
  
  
  More people traveled between Canada and NY in 2004 than any other 
  U.S. state 
  
  
  14,500,000 vehicles crossed the Canada-U.S. border 
  at the four Niagara crossings last year, accounting for 34% of all traffic 
  that crossed into Ontario 
  
  
  
  
  ROTFL
  
  With this many US Jobs gone, could CanaDUH 
  rebound? 
  
  
  
  http://www.2ontario.com/welcome/coca_401.asp
  
  Seeing that a FULL 84% of CanaDUHs exports are US 
  
  
  Calculator 
  please
  
  That leaves 16%, can CanaDUH's economy survive on 
  16% of its present exports?
  
  Remember that the Total export/imports of 
  canada represents a FULL 2/3rds 
  of their GDP!
  
  SIZE does 
  matter!
  
  
  
  Thanks for the add'l example of mindless 
  parroting.
  
  Don't you just HATE 
  Ignorance?
  
  I guess it is better than letting it go to 
  waste.
  
  Lance Muir 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote:
  

The 'prophet' (take note, 
David) said otherwise in November. Canada will not suffer the same fate at 
the USA. Size does matter but, 
it's not the only thing that 
matters.

  
  - Original Message 
  - 
  
  From: 
  Judy Taylor 
  
  
  To: 
  TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org 
  
  
  Sent: 
  March 25, 2006 08:03
  
  Subject: 
  Re: [TruthTalk] Noah Webster
  
  
  
  Don't worry 
  Lance, if the USA 
  implodes - Canada 
  and Europe will go with it - at 
  present when the
  
  US sneezes the 
  rest of the world catch a cold. Such envy and jealousy from the 
  North ... Goodness gracious!
  
  
  
  
  
  From: 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance 
  MuirMost on TT will live to 
  see the implosion of the USA. At 
  what point will you declare bankruptcy. You don't have the option of 
  moving out of your old house and into a new 
  one.
  

  


From: ShieldsFamily 








http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noah_Webster



As a teacher, he had come to dislike 
American elementary schools. They could be overcrowded, with up 
to seventy children of all ages crammed into one-room 
schoolhouses, poorly staffed with untrained teachers, and 
poorly equipped with no desks and unsatisfactory textbooks which 
came from England. Webster 
thought that Americans should learn from American books, so he 
began writing a three volume compendium, A Grammatical Institute of the 
English Language. The work consisted of a speller 
(published in 1783), a grammar 
(published in 1784), and a reader 
(publishe

Re: [TruthTalk] Noah Webster




Thomas Merton and Joan Baez?? - O good gracious, you're 
sinking Gary, and fast.

On Sun, 26 Mar 2006 01:33:29 -0700 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  
  
  On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 17:46:50 -0500 Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
writes:
  
Really up on social justice huh..?



whatever rings 
true

  "Sweet brother, if I do not sleep My eyes are flowers on 
  your tomb And if I cannot eat my bread My fasts shall live like 
  willows where you died If in the heat I find no water for my thirst 
  My thirst shall turn to springs for you, poor traveler 
  Come, in your labor find a resting place And in my 
  sorrows lay your head Brother, take my life and bread And buy 
  yourself a better bed Take my breath and take my death Buy 
  yourself a better rest beneath the bells of Gethsemani 
  When all the men of war are killed And flags have fallen 
  into dust Your cross and mine will tell men still He died on each 
  for both of us That we might become the brothers of God And learn 
  to know the Christ of burnt men 
  And the children are ringing the bells of Gethsemani 
  For in the wreckage of your April Christ lies slain He 
  weeps in the ruins of my spring The money of whose tears shall fall 
  Into your weak and friendless hand And buy you back to your own 
  land 
  The silence of whose tears shall fall Like bells upon 
  your alien tomb Hear them and come, they call you home And the 
  children are ringing the bells of Gethsemani 
  Yes, if they had been there They would have taken that 
  crown of thorns from his hair And stayed for a while in that place of 
  despair Ah, but what do I see, my brother is there And he's 
  ringing the bells of Gethsemani" 
  (Music by Joan Baez, Words by Thomas Merton) 
  © 1981 Gabriel Earl Music (ASCAP)

[TruthTalk] Truth and Freedom (some food for thought)





Truth and freedom go hand in hand, but truth 
will produce freedom only as it is walked in. This ought to be self-evident. We 
can know something is true, but if we fail to walk in it, what good is it? Its 
value to us is worthless unless it is walked in.
Freedom and truth come to those who press on. 
Freedom, the kind of freedom that God is involved in bringing us into, comes 
progressively, not all at once. These are lessons from the Days of Unleavened 
Bread. It took the Israelites seven days to get to and across the Red Sea. It 
took them another forty years to get into their own land, into their 
inheritance, the Promised Land.
Their freedom was progressive. There was a 
time when it began, but if they had never continued on the way, they would never 
have had their own land, never have had their inheritance, never have been free. 

This is a large part of the object lesson: We 
have to continue. If we continue, then we will truly be a disciple. We will 
understand the truth, and the truth will make usfree. The truth of God 
shows us the real values of life because it shows us what we are to give our 
life to.

RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism









Pretty close! J











From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kevin Deegan
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2006
10:15 PM
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Fw:
Williams on Creationism







Izzy





PS She was driving a nicer car than I have;
but then so does everyone. -) 



































ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:







Oh, how the Libs LOVE demeaning Wal-Mart!
How very predictable you would bring it up. And what is your PROBLEM with
Wal-Mart? Oh, they dont pay enough or give enough benefits to those POOR
people who work there; so SAD! My book club (SLU Womens Club) read some
libs expose on Wal-Mart and they were all up in arms about how they
refuse to shop there. A few months later which merchant allowed us to
solicit funds for our SLU Hospital Auxiliary at their doors? You guessed it,
Wal-Mart! Did they boycott that; no way, Baby! So, while I was
there soliciting donations I noticed this young female Wal-Mart employee on her
cellphone trying to get someone to come and pick her up because she locked her
keys in her car; obviously with no luck. So when it was time for me to
leave I said Come on, Ill give you a ride home. While we were
driving to her apartment we were talking, and she told me that she (around age
24) had full custody of four children (her sisters, brothers, nephews in some
combination). She is raising them as a single woman, while attending
classes at the U of Mo in STL on a psychology degree, while volunteering part
time at a local hospital and working part time cleaning houses and part time at
Wal-Mart. I asked What do you think about how Wal-Mart treats its
employees? She said Oh its so wonderful working there. They
treat us all SO well. And if it werent for my benefits there I
could never dream of taking care of my kids! So stick that in your pipe
and puff on it. Izzy PS She was driving a nicer car than I have;
but then so does everyone. -) 



















From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2006
11:07 AM
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw:
Williams on Creationism















myth[the writer'sa blamer with
an evidentfeminist' bias,butAm. conservativeMuslim
theoryain't really their fault: 









'eitherget our new WalMarts opened on
timein Baghdad orface
usblowin'youto (the other) hell (we're financing')]



















||





















We wouldnt be HAVING a problem with
Muslims if we hadnt thrown God out of the government and schools a long
time ago! (duh) 











||

















Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Make
PC-to-Phone Calls to the US
(and 30+ countries) for 2¢/min or less.

Re: [TruthTalk] Noah Webster

I think it's a "right back atcha" thing Is that so? Well, how do you like the fact that some American Company bought the rights to all those Paul Hogan movies?Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think it's a "right back atcha" thing - for years I would go over there and hear much lamenting about what Americans had bought; do you know an American Company now owns the all Australian delicious spread called Vegemite?On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 23:45:33 -0800 (PST) Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:I've just learned that Australia is investing workers retirement funds in US Real EstateThey just bought the New York Thruway. Does that mean I need a passport, now?From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Judy TaylorThanks for this KevinProof of the pudding is always in the eating.I've just learned that Australia is investing workers retirement funds in US Real Estate
alsoSo Lance and his prophet don't have a whole lot of support from "down under" eitherOn Sat, 25 Mar 2006 09:20:31 -0800 (PST) Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Lance says Canada will not suffer the same fate at the USA. AhAh AH CHOO!excuse me348,000 New York jobs are supported by Canada-U.S. trade Total CanadaU.S. merchandise trade: $411 billion CanadaU.S. trade supported 5.2 million U.S. jobs More people traveled between Canada and NY in 2004 than any other U.S. state 14,500,000 vehicles crossed the Canada-U.S. border at the four Niagara crossings last year, accounting for 34% of all traffic that crossed into Ontario ROTFLWith this many US Jobs gone, could CanaDUH rebound? http://www.2ontario.com/welcome/coca_401.aspSeeing that a FULL 84% of CanaDUHs exports are US Calculator pleaseThat leaves 16%, can CanaDUH's economy survive on 16% of its present exports?Remember that the Total export/imports of canada represents a FULL 2/3rds of their GDP!SIZE does matter!Thanks for the add'l example of mindless parroting.Don't you just HATE Ignorance?I guess it is better than letting it go to waste.Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The 'prophet' (take note, David) said otherwise in November. Canada will not suffer the same fate at the USA. Size does matter but, it's not the only thing that matters. - Original Message - From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: March 25, 2006 08:03Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Noah WebsterDon't worry Lance, if the USA implodes - Canada and Europe will go with it - at present when theUS sneezes the rest of the world catch a cold. Such envy and jealousy from the North ... Goodness
gracious!From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance MuirMost on TT will live to see the implosion of the USA. At what point will you declare bankruptcy. You don't have the option of moving out of your old house and into a new one.From: ShieldsFamily http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noah_WebsterAs a teacher, he had come to dislike American elementary schools. They could be overcrowded, with up to seventy children of all ages crammed into one-room schoolhouses, poorly staffed with untrained teachers, and poorly equipped with no desks and unsatisfactory textbooks which came from England. Webster thought that Americans should learn from American books, so he began writing a three volume compendium, A Grammatical Institute of the English Language. The work consisted of a speller (published in 1783), a grammar (published in 1784), and a reader (published in 1785). His goal was to provide a uniquely American, Christ-centered approach to training children.The speller was originally entitled The First Part of the Grammatical Institute of the English Language. The title was changed in 1786 to The American Spelling Book, and again in 1829 to The Elementary Spelling Book. Most people called it the "Blue-Backed Speller" because of its blue cover, and for the next one hundred years, Webster's book taught children
how to read, spell, and pronounce words. It was the most popular American book of its time; by 1861, it was selling a million copies per year, and its royalty of less than one cent per copy was enough to sustain Webster in his other endeavors. Even Ben Franklin used Webster's book to teach his granddaughter how to read.Noah was generally known to be Christian. It is reported that Noah Websters 1828 American Dictionary contains the greatest number of Biblical definitions given in any reference volume. Webster considered "education useless without the Bible.""In my view, the Christian religion is the most important and one of the first things in which all children, under a free government ought to be instructed...No truth is more evident to my mind than that the Christia

RE: [TruthTalk] Truth and Freedom (some food for thought)









Keep on keeping on, Jude! iz











From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Judy Taylor
Sent: Sunday, March 26, 2006 5:33
AM
To: truthtalk@mail.innglory.org
Subject: [TruthTalk] Truth and
Freedom (some food for thought)







Truth and freedom go hand in hand, but truth will produce
freedom only as it is walked in. This ought to be self-evident. We can know
something is true, but if we fail to walk in it, what good is it? Its value to
us is worthless unless it is walked in.

Freedom and truth come to those who press on. Freedom,
the kind of freedom that God is involved in bringing us into, comes
progressively, not all at once. These are lessons from the Days of Unleavened
Bread. It took the Israelites seven days to get to and across the Red Sea. It took them another forty years to get into
their own land, into their inheritance, the Promised Land.

Their freedom was progressive. There was a time when it
began, but if they had never continued on the way, they would never have had their
own land, never have had their inheritance, never have been free. 

This is a large part of the object lesson: We have to
continue. If we continue, then we will truly be a disciple. We will understand
the truth, and the truth will make usfree. The truth of God shows us the
real values of life because it shows us what we are to give our life to.

RE: [TruthTalk] Noah Webster


Who is Gary Olson?

-- Original message -- From: "ShieldsFamily" [EMAIL PROTECTED] 








LOL! So true as to be hilarious. iz





From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Judy TaylorSent: Saturday, March 25, 2006 3:04 PMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgCc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] Noah Webster


What was dualistic about that comment Gary Olson? It is world affairs that's all...

You are truly weird, strange, weird ... Why do you truncate what ppl write and insert your 

own comments - ultimately making it appear the person said something they did not.

Oh I understand - you do the same with God's Words. O' the shame of it.



On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 13:33:31 -0700 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:


more evidenceof jt's implicit dualism



On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 12:49:07 -0500 Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:


[while eschatological] Proof of the pudding is always in the eating...[is'nt] Australia..investing workers retirement funds in[biblically questionable] Real Estate also[?]

Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

The liberals have some kind of Papist FIXATION that their Opinion should affect your Opinion! Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Opinion??? Oh well!! "So what is man whose breath is in his nostril??" I will "ditto" Izzy - There is just one that matters to me and it is not yours JD On Sun, 26 Mar 2006 02:18:30 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:Judy -- I do know what you believe.Let me make something clear since our time together is
quickly coming to an end. "Carnal" applies to you, IMO, because of what I see as a reliance on your own brand of intellectualism. As a result, you own the most unusual collection of theological opinions I have ever seen. On the good side, you are one of the most imaginative theologians I know something I actually respect. It is what I see in Barth and the others. what is most difficult is your attitude during a discussion. You simply do not know how to disagree without the personal assault. On other forums, I am not nearly as aggressive as I am here -- but there simply is no other way to be when in the presence of you, Linda, Kev and even David (at times). I know that you will not agree with any of my view expressed above -- but most of what I have said is, IMO, a good report of you.
Finally, if your posts do not tell us what you believe, your purpose for writing is suspect. Since I can read, I do know what you believe. jd-- Original message -- From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] I know enough to recognize the real when I see it and so do my BSF buddies You JD, don't know what I believe, nor can you evaluate my BSF buddies Quit being so presumptuous, it is not a godly traitOn Sun, 26 Mar 2006 00:26:45 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:Refer to Matt 28 19ff and Mark 16:15 ff -- and stop prestending that you alone understand scripture. Your BSF buddies do not think much of your theology, that is for sure. jdFrom: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] "preach the gospel" and "make disciples/" Aberrent theologiesmake little cookie cutter disciples just like Lance and Bill Only Jesus' Words make disciples that look like HimOn Sat, 25 Mar
2006 23:46:52 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:Results that combine both commands, "preach the gospel" and "make disciples/" jd-- Original message -- From: Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] Results? #3 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Three kinds of evangelism present on this list. 1.. Drive-bye or protest evangelismKevin , Dean, David (often but not always)2. Tower of power
evangelism -- where the saint does her best work at home and not in the real world.3. Mentor evangelism (Lance , Bill and others)We don't agree, Judy, because the paradigm for evangelism is not the same. you in your home and me in my world, where I live, where people see me everyday. -- Original message -- From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] If there are christian teachers in the system (and there are) who must teach theories of evolution that they do not believe. What's wrong with teaching the other side also even if there are unbelievers teaching it There are also unbelievers in different churches these days teaching all kinds of things. The student has the responsibility to search it out for themselves.On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 12:32:49 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:What's scary is that you think the solution is to have an antagonistic educator "teach" what he does not believe -- you thinking, of course, that he will do so without commentary that thoroughly negates the purpose of this compromise. In the real world, Linda, you simply cannot construct a model in which this will work to our (the Christian church -- whose address do we use , again ??) favor. In fact, to get all the warring factions to agree, the stateent on creationism would
be so watered down as to be really meaningless. From: "ShieldsFamily" [EMAIL PROTECTED] Scary to the max. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2006 6:14 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org; TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism Of course. But that is not really the issue. -- Original message -- From: "ShieldsFamily" [EMAIL PROTECTED] So IYO it is better to have secular folk teaching untruth than truth. I see. izzyFrom: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2006 5:46 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org; TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism It's not what is taught (for me and in this case) so much as it is WHO TEACHES THEM. You wa

Re: [TruthTalk] Noah Webster




I didn't know about it - but it wouldn't bother 
Australians; they are not pleased with Paul Hogan ... mainly
because he got carried away with celebrity and left his 
wife and mother of his five children Noela to
marry the girl in his first movie. He lives in 
California most of the time now and is not the "unsophisticated"
steel rigger he once was.

On Sun, 26 Mar 2006 05:24:44 -0800 (PST) Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
writes:

  I think it's a "right back atcha" thing 
  
  Is that so? 
  Well, how do you like the fact that some American Company bought the 
  rights to all those Paul Hogan movies?Judy Taylor 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
  

I think it's a "right back atcha" thing - for years 
I would go over there and hear much lamenting about
what Americans had bought; do you know an American 
Company now owns the all Australian
delicious spread called Vegemite?

On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 23:45:33 -0800 (PST) Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
writes:

  I've just learned that 
  Australia is investing workers 
  retirement funds in US Real Estate
  
  They just bought 
  the New York Thruway. Does that mean I need a passport, now?From: 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Judy 
  TaylorThanks for this 
  Kevin
  


Proof of the 
pudding is always in the eating.

I've just learned 
that Australia is investing 
workers retirement funds in US Real Estate 
also

So Lance and his 
prophet don't have a whole lot of support from "down under" 
either



On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 09:20:31 -0800 (PST) Kevin 
Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
writes:

  
  Lance says 
  Canada will not 
  suffer the same fate at the USA. 
  
  
  
  
  Ah
  
  Ah
  
   AH 
  CHOO!
  
  
  
  excuse me
  
  
  
  348,000 New York jobs are supported by 
  Canada-U.S. trade 
  
  Total CanadaU.S. merchandise trade: $411 
  billion 
  
  CanadaU.S. trade supported 5.2 million 
  U.S. jobs 
  
  
  More people traveled between 
  Canada and NY in 
  2004 than any other U.S. state 
  
  
  14,500,000 vehicles crossed the Canada-U.S. 
  border at the four Niagara crossings last year, accounting for 34% of 
  all traffic that crossed into Ontario 
  
  
  
  
  ROTFL
  
  With this many US Jobs gone, could CanaDUH 
  rebound? 
  
  
  
  http://www.2ontario.com/welcome/coca_401.asp
  
  Seeing that a FULL 84% of CanaDUHs exports are 
  US 
  
  Calculator 
  please
  
  That leaves 16%, can CanaDUH's economy survive 
  on 16% of its present exports?
  
  Remember that the Total export/imports of 
  canada represents a FULL 
  2/3rds of their GDP!
  
  SIZE does 
  matter!
  
  
  
  Thanks for the add'l example of 
  mindless parroting.
  
  Don't you just HATE 
  Ignorance?
  
  I guess it is better than letting 
  it go to waste.
  
  Lance Muir 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote:
  

The 'prophet' (take 
note, David) said otherwise in November. Canada will not suffer the same fate 
at the USA. Size does matter 
but, it's not the only thing that 
matters.

  
  - Original Message 
  - 
  
  From: Judy Taylor 
  
  
  To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org 
  
  
  Sent: March 25, 2006 
  08:03
      
  Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Noah 
  Webster
  
  
  
  Don't worry 
  Lance, if the USA implodes - Canada and Europe will go with it - at present when 
  the
  
  US sneezes 
  the rest of the world catch a cold. Such envy and jealousy 
  from the North ... Goodness 
  gracious!
  
  
  
  
  
  From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance 
  MuirMost on TT will live

Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism


Can't make disciples without mentoring - it is impossible. Apparently you do not know this -- I'm guessing you don't do it or you wouldn't make fun of the idea. 

jd

jd

-- Original message -- From: Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Go ye into all the world and Mentor the Gospel!

Who have you mentored? Do you have any men?[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

tower power -- nothing much to report in terms of results. 

Protest-evangelism -- ditto.

Mentor evangeliism -- it is the method of historical record --- how he church grew from 12 to several million within its first 100 years of life. 

jd

-- Original message -- From: Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
So tell us about it.

Results?[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Results that combine both commands, "preach the gospel" and "make disciples/" 

jd

-- Original message -- From: Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Results? #3
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Three kinds of evangelism present on this list. 

1.. Drive-bye or protest evangelismKevin , Dean, David (often but not always)

2. Tower of power evangelism -- where the saint does her best work at home and not in the real world.

3. Mentor evangelism (Lance , Bill and others)

We don't agree, Judy, because the paradigm for evangelism is not the same.  you in your home and me in my world, where I live, where people see me everyday. 

-- Original message -- From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] 

If there are christian teachers in the system (and there are) who must teach theories of evolution that they
do not believe. What's wrong with teaching the other side also even if there are unbelievers teaching it
There are also unbelievers in different churches these days teaching all kinds of things. The student has
the responsibility to search it out for themselves.

On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 12:32:49 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

What's scary is that you think the solution is to have an antagonistic educator "teach" what he does not believe -- you thinking, of course, that he will do so without commentary that thoroughly negates the purpose of this compromise. In the real world, Linda, you simply cannot construct a model in which this will work to our (the Christian church -- whose address do we use , again ??) favor. In fact, to get all the warring factions to agree, the stateent on creationism would be so watered down as to be really meaningless. 
From: "ShieldsFamily" [EMAIL PROTECTED] 








Scary to the max. 





From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2006 6:14 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org; TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism


Of course. But that is not really the issue. 



-- Original message -- From: "ShieldsFamily" [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
So IYO it is better to have secular folk teaching untruth than truth. I see. izzy





From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2006 5:46 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org; TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism


It's not what is taught (for me and in this case) so much as it is WHO TEACHES THEM. You want the secular world to be responsible -- I don't. 



jd



-- Original message -- From: "ShieldsFamily" [EMAIL PROTECTED]  So, here we are, back to the fact that IF you believed something to be true  you would NOT want children to be taught about it. Can you see why some of  us aren't following your logic? iz   -Original Message-  From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir  Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2006 5:28 AM  To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org  Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism   IZ:No, I would not.- Original Message -  From: "ShieldsFamily" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 OM .C> To: <TRUTHTALK@MAIL.INNGLORY.ORG> Sent: March 25, 2006 06:14  ; Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism gt; Dodging the question, as usual. iz -Original Message-   From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]   [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir   Sent: Friday, March 24, 2006 4:54 PM   To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org   Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism It ain't true. It's a hyperbolic hypothetical, Iz. .   - Original Message -   From: "ShieldsFamily" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>  To: <TRUTHTALK@MAIL.INNGLORY.ORG>  Sent: March 24, 2006 17:16   Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism&
amp; amp;g t;   That wasn't the question; I asked whether IF you believe it were true,   you   would want it taught in schools. You said NO. Pathetic, eh? iz -Original Message-   From: [EMAIL PROTECTED

RE: [TruthTalk] Noah Webster









I love Crocodile Dundee because he says,
with a glint in his eye, Now THIS is a knife!  Life up your Bible
and say, Now THIS is the Word! It cuts to the quick and separates
the men from the boys! J iz











From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kevin Deegan
Sent: Sunday, March 26, 2006 7:25
AM
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Noah
Webster







I think it's a right back
atcha thing 











Is that so? 





Well, how do you like the fact that some American Company bought the
rights to all those Paul Hogan movies?

Judy Taylor
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:







I think it's a right back
atcha thing - for years I would go over there and hear much lamenting
about





what Americans had bought; do you know
an American Company now owns the all Australian





delicious spread called Vegemite?











On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 23:45:33 -0800 (PST) Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:







I've just learned that Australia
is investing workers retirement funds in US Real Estate











They just bought the New York Thruway. Does that mean I need a
passport, now?

From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Judy Taylor
Thanks for this
Kevin











Proof of the pudding is always in the
eating.









I've just learned that Australia
is investing workers retirement funds in US Real Estate also









So Lance and his prophet don't have a
whole lot of support from down under either



















On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 09:20:31 -0800 (PST) Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:











Lance says Canada will not suffer the
same fate at the USA. 



















Ah









Ah









 AH CHOO!



















excuse me



















348,000 New York jobs are
supported by Canada-U.S. trade 









Total CanadaU.S. merchandise trade: $411 billion 









CanadaU.S. trade supported 5.2 million U.S.
jobs 









More people traveled between Canada and NY in 2004 than
any other U.S.
state 









14,500,000 vehicles crossed the Canada-U.S. border at the four Niagara
crossings last year, accounting for 34% of all traffic that crossed into Ontario




















ROTFL









With this many US Jobs gone, could CanaDUH rebound? 



















http://www.2ontario.com/welcome/coca_401.asp









Seeing that a FULL 84% of CanaDUHs exports are US 









Calculator please









That leaves 16%, can CanaDUH's economy survive on 16% of its present
exports?









Remember that the Total export/imports of canada
represents a FULL 2/3rds of their GDP!









SIZE does matter!



















Thanks for the add'l example of mindless parroting.









Don't you just HATE Ignorance?









I guess it is better than letting it go to waste.










Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:











The 'prophet' (take note, David) said otherwise in November.
Canada
will not suffer the same fate at the USA.
Size does matter but, it's not the only thing that matters.











- Original Message - 









From: Judy Taylor










To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org










Sent: March 25, 2006
08:03









Subject: Re: [TruthTalk]
Noah Webster



















Don't worry Lance, if the USA implodes - Canada and Europe will go with it - at present when the









US sneezes the rest of the world catch a
cold. Such envy and jealousy from the North ... Goodness gracious!





























From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Lance Muir
Most on TT will live to see the implosion of the USA.
At what point will you declare bankruptcy. You don't have the option of moving
out of your old house and into a new one.

















From: ShieldsFamily






































http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noah_Webster



















As a teacher, he
had come to dislike American elementary schools. They could be overcrowded,
with up to seventy children of all ages crammed into one-room schoolhouses, poorly staffed with
untrained teachers, and poorly equipped with no desks and unsatisfactory
textbooks which came from England. Webster thought that Americans should learn from
American books, so he began writing a three volume compendium, A Grammatical Institute of the English Language.
The work consisted of a speller (published in 1783), a grammar
(published in 1784),
and a reader (published in 1785). His goal was to provide a uniquely American,
Christ-centered approach to training children.









The speller was originally entitled The First Part of the Grammatical Institute of the
English Language. The title was changed in 1786 to The American Spelling Book, and again in 1829 to The Elementary Spelling Book. Most people
called it the Blue-Backed Speller because of its blue cover, and
for the next one hundred years, Webster's book taught children how to read,
spell, and pronounce words. It was the most popular American book of its time

RE: [TruthTalk] Noah Webster









Who is Linda?











From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, March 26, 2006 7:29
AM
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org;
TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Noah
Webster







Who is Gary Olson?











-- Original message -- 
From: ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED]


LOL! So true as to be
hilarious. iz











From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Judy Taylor
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2006
3:04 PM
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Noah
Webster







What was dualistic about that comment
Gary Olson? It is world affairs that's all...





You are truly weird, strange, weird ...
Why do you truncate what ppl
write and insert your 





own comments - ultimately making it
appear the person said something they did not.





Oh I understand - you do the same with
God's Words. O' the shame of it.











On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 13:33:31 -0700 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:







more
evidenceof jt's implicit dualism











On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 12:49:07 -0500 Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:







[while eschatological] Proof of the pudding is always in the eating...[is'nt] Australia..investing
workers retirement funds in[biblically questionable] Real Estate also[?]

Re: [TruthTalk] Noah Webster




Your buddy JD, the one who sent you the baseball bat; 
apparently he was lucid
enough to accomplish that; the rest of the time he is 
obsessed by dualism.

On Sun, 26 Mar 2006 13:28:49 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  Who is Gary Olson?
  
  From: 
"ShieldsFamily" [EMAIL PROTECTED] 








LOL! So true 
as to be hilarious. iz





From: 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
On Behalf Of Judy 
Taylor

What was dualistic about that 
comment Gary Olson? It is world affairs that's 
all...

You are truly weird, strange, weird 
... Why 
do you truncate what ppl write and insert your 


own comments - ultimately making it 
appear the person said something they did 
not.

Oh I understand - you do the same 
with God's Words. O' the shame of 
it.



On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 13:33:31 -0700 [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
writes:

  
  more 
  evidenceof jt's implicit 
  dualism
  
  
  
  On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 12:49:07 -0500 Judy Taylor 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  writes:
  

[while 
eschatological] Proof of the pudding is always in the 
eating...[is'nt] Australia..investing workers 
retirement funds in[biblically 
questionable] Real Estate also[?]

RE: [TruthTalk] Noah Webster









He probably sent two bats!











From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Judy Taylor
Sent: Sunday, March 26, 2006 7:33
AM
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Noah
Webster







Your buddy JD, the one who sent you the
baseball bat; apparently he was lucid





enough to accomplish that; the rest of
the time he is obsessed by dualism.











On Sun, 26 Mar 2006 13:28:49 + [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:







Who is Gary Olson?












From: ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED]


LOL! So true as to be
hilarious. iz











From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Judy Taylor





What was dualistic about that comment
Gary Olson? It is world affairs that's all...





You are truly weird, strange, weird ...
Why do you truncate what ppl
write and insert your 





own comments - ultimately making it
appear the person said something they did not.





Oh I understand - you do the same with
God's Words. O' the shame of it.











On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 13:33:31 -0700 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:







more
evidenceof jt's implicit dualism











On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 12:49:07 -0500 Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:







[while eschatological] Proof of the pudding is always in the eating...[is'nt] Australia..investing
workers retirement funds in[biblically questionable] Real Estate also[?]

Re: [TruthTalk] Truth and Freedom (some food for thought)


Good post -- as far as it goes. What you leave out is this: they never fully arrived !!! God remained patient. Kinda like it is right now. 

jd

-- Original message -- From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] 


Truth and freedom go hand in hand, but truth will produce freedom only as it is walked in. This ought to be self-evident. We can know something is true, but if we fail to walk in it, what good is it? Its value to us is worthless unless it is walked in.
Freedom and truth come to those who press on. Freedom, the kind of freedom that God is involved in bringing us into, comes progressively, not all at once. These are lessons from the Days of Unleavened Bread. It took the Israelites seven days to get to and across the Red Sea. It took them another forty years to get into their own land, into their inheritance, the Promised Land.
Their freedom was progressive. There was a time when it began, but if they had never continued on the way, they would never have had their own land, never have had their inheritance, never have been free. 
This is a large part of the object lesson: We have to continue. If we continue, then we will truly be a disciple. We will understand the truth, and the truth will make usfree. The truth of God shows us the real values of life because it shows us what we are to give our life to.

Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

Not so JD.  that is Job ONE  1 CO 1:11 Be ye followers of me, even as I also am of Christ.Lets compare lists of "men" that follow. Since you are big on this is the way let us see how you walk in it.BTW just what things in you, do they follow?  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Can't make disciples without mentoring - it is impossible. Apparently you do not know this -- I'm guessing you don't do it or you wouldn't make fun of the idea. jdjd-- Original message -- From: Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED]   Go ye into all the world and Mentor the Gospel!Who have you mentored? Do you have any men?[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:tower power -- nothing much to report in terms of results. Protest-evangelism -- ditto.Mentor evangeliism -- it is the method of historical record --- how he church grew from 12 to several million within its first 100 years of life. jd-- Original message -- From: Kevin
 Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED]   So tell us about it.Results?[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Results that combine both commands, "preach the gospel" and "make disciples/" jd-- Original message -- From: Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED]   Results? #3  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Three kinds of evangelism present on this list. 1.. Drive-bye or protest evangelismKevin , Dean, David (often but not
 always)2. Tower of power evangelism -- where the saint does her best work at home and not in the real world.3. Mentor evangelism (Lance , Bill and others)We don't agree, Judy, because the paradigm for evangelism is not the same.  you in your home and me in my world, where I live, where people see me everyday. -- Original message -- From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] If there are christian teachers in the system (and there are) who must teach theories of evolution that they  do not believe. What's wrong with teaching the other side also even if there are
 unbelievers teaching it  There are also unbelievers in different churches these days teaching all kinds of things. The student has  the responsibility to search it out for themselves.On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 12:32:49 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:What's scary is that you think the solution is to have an antagonistic educator "teach" what he does not believe -- you thinking, of course, that he will do so without commentary that thoroughly negates the purpose of this compromise. In the real world, Linda, you simply cannot construct a model in which this will work to our (the Christian church -- whose address do we use , again ??) favor. In fact, to get all the warring
 factions to agree, the stateent on creationism would be so watered down as to be really meaningless.   From: "ShieldsFamily" [EMAIL PROTECTED]
   Scary to the max. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent:
 Saturday, March 25, 2006 6:14 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org; TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism  Of course. But that is not really the issue. -- Original message -- From: "ShieldsFamily" [EMAIL PROTECTED]   So IYO it is better to have secular folk teaching untruth than truth. I see. izzyFrom: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2006 5:46 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org; TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism 
 It's not what is taught (for me and in this case) so much as it is WHO TEACHES THEM. You want the secular world to be responsible -- I don't. jd-- Original message -- From: "ShieldsFamily" [EMAIL PROTECTED]  So, here we are, back to the fact that IF you believed something to be true  you would NOT want children to be taught about it. Can you see why some of  us aren't following your logic? iz   -Original Message-  From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir  Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2006 5:28 AM  To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org 
 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism   IZ:No, I would not.- Original Message -  From: "ShieldsFamily" <[EMAIL PROTECTED] .C OM> To: <TRUTHTALK@MAIL.INNGLORY.ORG> Sent: March 25, 2006 06:14  ; Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism gt; Dodging the question, as usual. iz -Original Message-   From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]   [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir   Sent: Friday, March 24, 2006 4:54 PM   To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org   Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism It ain't true. It's a hyperbolic hypothetical, Iz. .   - Original
 Message -   From: "ShieldsFamily&

Re: [TruthTalk] Noah Webster


Since you are right about everything else, you must be right about this. Sorry I asked. 

jd

-- Original message -- From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] 

Your buddy JD, the one who sent you the baseball bat; apparently he was lucid
enough to accomplish that; the rest of the time he is obsessed by dualism.

On Sun, 26 Mar 2006 13:28:49 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

Who is Gary Olson?

From: "ShieldsFamily" [EMAIL PROTECTED] 








LOL! So true as to be hilarious. iz





From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Judy Taylor

What was dualistic about that comment Gary Olson? It is world affairs that's all...

You are truly weird, strange, weird ... Why do you truncate what ppl write and insert your 

own comments - ultimately making it appear the person said something they did not.

Oh I understand - you do the same with God's Words. O' the shame of it.



On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 13:33:31 -0700 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:


more evidenceof jt's implicit dualism



On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 12:49:07 -0500 Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:


[while eschatological] Proof of the pudding is always in the eating...[is'nt] Australia..investing workers retirement funds in[biblically questionable] Real Estate also[?]

Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

And OH YEAH, JD  Be sure to list what the men you have "Mentored" are doing now.  Things like Full time missionaries, Pastors, Street Preachers,   or in your casewhatever it is that they DO and that you have mentored them up  onward to...[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Can't make disciples without mentoring - it is impossible. Apparently you do not know this -- I'm guessing you don't do it or you wouldn't make fun of the idea. jd-- Original message -- From: Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED]   Go ye into all the world and Mentor the
 Gospel!Who have you mentored? Do you have any men?[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:tower power -- nothing much to report in terms of results. Protest-evangelism -- ditto.Mentor evangeliism -- it is the method of historical record --- how he church grew from 12 to several million within its first 100 years of life. jd-- Original message -- From: Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED]   So tell us about it.Results?[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Results that combine both commands, "preach the gospel" and "make disciples/" jd-- Original message -- From: Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED]   Results? #3  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Three kinds of evangelism present on this list. 1.. Drive-bye or protest evangelismKevin , Dean, David (often but not always)2. Tower of power evangelism -- where the saint does her best work at home and not in the real world.3.
 Mentor evangelism (Lance , Bill and others)We don't agree, Judy, because the paradigm for evangelism is not the same.  you in your home and me in my world, where I live, where people see me everyday. -- Original message -- From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] If there are christian teachers in the system (and there are) who must teach theories of evolution that they  do not believe. What's wrong with teaching the other side also even if there are unbelievers teaching it  There are also unbelievers in different churches these days teaching all kinds of things. The student has  the responsibility to search it out for themselves.On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 12:32:49 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:What's scary is that you think the solution is to have an antagonistic educator "teach" what he does not believe -- you thinking, of course, that he will do so without commentary that thoroughly negates the purpose of this compromise. In the real world, Linda, you simply cannot construct a model in which this will work to our (the Christian church -- whose address do we use , again ??) favor. In fact, to get all the warring factions to agree, the stateent on creationism would be so watered down as to be really meaningless.   From: "ShieldsFamily" [EMAIL PROTECTED]   Scary to the max. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2006 6:14 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org; TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism  Of course. But that is not really the issue.
 -- Original message -- From: "ShieldsFamily" [EMAIL PROTECTED]   So IYO it is better to have secular folk teaching untruth than truth. I see. izzyFrom: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2006 5:46 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org; TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism  It's not what is taught (for me and in this case) so much as it is WHO TEACHES THEM. You want the secular world to be responsible -- I don't. jd-- Original message -- From: "ShieldsFamily" [EMAIL PROTECTED]  So, here we are, back to the fact that IF you believed something to be true  you would NOT want children to be taught about it. Can you see why some of  us aren't following your logic? iz   -Original Message-  From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir  Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2006 5:28 AM  To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org  Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism   IZ:No, I would not.- Original Message -  From: "ShieldsFamily"
 <[EMAIL PROTECTED] .C OM> To: <TRUTHTALK@MAIL.INNGLORY.ORG> Sent: March 25, 2006 06:14  ; Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism gt; Dodging the question, as usual. iz -Original Message-   From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]   [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir   Sent: Friday, March 24, 2006 4:54 PM   To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org   Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism It ain't true. It's a hyperbolic hypothetical, Iz. .   - Original Message -   From: "ShieldsFamily" <[EMAIL

RE: [TruthTalk] Invitation.









BTW, we didnt even notice until the
house was completeddid you see the cross on the front window? We will
outline it with little white lights this Christmas. izzy











From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of ShieldsFamily
Sent: Sunday, March 26, 2006 7:52
AM
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Subject: [TruthTalk] Invitation.





The new house. It has a dark green roof. Plenty of bedrooms. Every one
of you on TT (yes, even YOU, Gary!), come and visit us anytime, PLEASE!!! Izzy

I sent
these photos using Adobe(R) Photoshop(R) Elements 4.0. Find out more: http://www.adobe.com/photoshopelementswin

Re: [TruthTalk] Mentoring


		Blab-away for as little as 1¢/min. Make  PC-to-Phone Calls using Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.

Re: [TruthTalk] Noah Webster

Or, take your Bible and point to Him while saying 
'HE IS THE WORD'.

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  ShieldsFamily 
  To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org 

  Sent: March 26, 2006 08:33
  Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Noah 
  Webster

  I love Crocodile 
  Dundee because he says, with a glint in his eye, Now THIS is a knife! 
  Life up your Bible and say, Now THIS is the Word! It cuts to the quick and 
  separates the men from the boys! J 
  iz

  From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kevin DeeganSent: Sunday, March 26, 2006 7:25 
  AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] Noah 
  Webster

  I think it's a "right back atcha" 
  thing 

  Is that so? 

  Well, how do you like the fact that some American 
  Company bought the rights to all those Paul Hogan movies?Judy Taylor 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote:

I think it's a "right back atcha" 
thing - for years I would go over there and hear much lamenting 
about

what Americans had bought; do you 
know an American Company now owns the all 
Australian

delicious spread called 
Vegemite?

On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 23:45:33 -0800 (PST) Kevin 
Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
writes:

  I've just learned that 
  Australia 
  is investing workers retirement funds in US Real 
  Estate

  They just bought the New York Thruway. Does that 
  mean I need a passport, now?From: 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Judy 
  TaylorThanks for this Kevin

Proof of the 
pudding is always in the 
eating.

I've just learned 
that Australia 
is investing workers retirement funds in US Real Estate 
also

So Lance and his 
prophet don't have a whole lot of support from "down under" 
either

On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 09:20:31 -0800 (PST) Kevin 
Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
writes:

  Lance says 
  Canada will not 
  suffer the same fate at the USA. 

  Ah

  Ah

   AH 
  CHOO!

  excuse 
  me

  348,000 New 
  York jobs are supported 
  by Canada-U.S. trade 

  Total CanadaU.S. merchandise trade: $411 
  billion 

  CanadaU.S. trade supported 5.2 million 
  U.S. 
  jobs 

  More people traveled between 
  Canada and NY in 
  2004 than any other U.S. 
  state 

  14,500,000 vehicles crossed the Canada-U.S. 
  border at the four Niagara crossings last year, accounting for 34% of 
  all traffic that crossed into Ontario 

  ROTFL

  With this many US Jobs gone, could CanaDUH 
  rebound? 

  http://www.2ontario.com/welcome/coca_401.asp

  Seeing that a FULL 84% of CanaDUHs exports are 
  US 

  Calculator 
  please

  That leaves 16%, can CanaDUH's economy survive 
  on 16% of its present 
exports?

  Remember that the Total export/imports of 
  canada 
  represents a FULL 2/3rds of their 
  GDP!

  SIZE does 
  matter!

  Thanks for the add'l example of 
  mindless 
  parroting.

  Don't you just HATE 
  Ignorance?

  I guess it is better than letting 
  it go to waste.

  Lance Muir 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote:

The 'prophet' (take 
note, David) said otherwise in November. Canada will not 
suffer the same fate at the USA. 
Size does matter but, it's not the only thing that 
matters.

  - Original Message 
  - 

  From: Judy Taylor 

  T

RE: [TruthTalk] Noah Webster









Amen, Lance! Hoping all is well with you,
izzy











From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir
Sent: Sunday, March 26, 2006 8:06
AM
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Noah
Webster







Or, take your Bible and point to Him while saying 'HE IS THE
WORD'.







- Original Message - 





From: ShieldsFamily






To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org






Sent: March 26, 2006
08:33





Subject: RE: [TruthTalk]
Noah Webster









I love Crocodile Dundee because he says,
with a glint in his eye, Now THIS is a knife! Life up your
Bible and say, Now THIS is the Word! It cuts to the quick and
separates the men from the boys! J iz











From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Kevin Deegan
Sent: Sunday, March 26, 2006 7:25
AM
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Noah Webster







I think it's a right back
atcha thing 











Is that so? 





Well, how do you like the fact that some American Company bought the
rights to all those Paul Hogan movies?

Judy Taylor
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:







I think it's a right back
atcha thing - for years I would go over there and hear much lamenting
about





what Americans had bought; do you know
an American Company now owns the all Australian





delicious spread called Vegemite?











On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 23:45:33 -0800 (PST) Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:







I've just learned that Australia
is investing workers retirement funds in US Real Estate











They just bought the New York Thruway. Does that mean I need a
passport, now?

From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Judy Taylor
Thanks for this
Kevin











Proof of the pudding is always in the
eating.









I've just learned that Australia
is investing workers retirement funds in US Real Estate also









So Lance and his prophet don't have a
whole lot of support from down under either



















On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 09:20:31 -0800 (PST) Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:











Lance says Canada will not suffer the
same fate at the USA. 



















Ah









Ah









 AH CHOO!



















excuse me



















348,000 New York jobs are
supported by Canada-U.S. trade 









Total CanadaU.S. merchandise trade: $411 billion 









CanadaU.S. trade supported 5.2 million U.S.
jobs 









More people traveled between Canada and NY in 2004 than
any other U.S.
state 









14,500,000 vehicles crossed the Canada-U.S. border at the four Niagara
crossings last year, accounting for 34% of all traffic that crossed into Ontario




















ROTFL









With this many US Jobs gone, could CanaDUH rebound? 



















http://www.2ontario.com/welcome/coca_401.asp









Seeing that a FULL 84% of CanaDUHs exports are US 









Calculator please









That leaves 16%, can CanaDUH's economy survive on 16% of its present
exports?









Remember that the Total export/imports of canada
represents a FULL 2/3rds of their GDP!









SIZE does matter!



















Thanks for the add'l example of mindless parroting.









Don't you just HATE Ignorance?









I guess it is better than letting it go to waste.










Lance Muir
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:











The 'prophet' (take note, David) said otherwise in November.
Canada
will not suffer the same fate at the USA.
Size does matter but, it's not the only thing that matters.











- Original Message - 









From: Judy Taylor










To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org










Sent: March 25, 2006
08:03









Subject: Re: [TruthTalk]
Noah Webster



















Don't worry Lance, if the USA implodes - Canada and Europe will go with it - at present when the









US sneezes the rest of the world catch a
cold. Such envy and jealousy from the North ... Goodness gracious!





























From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Lance Muir
Most on TT will live to see the implosion of the USA.
At what point will you declare bankruptcy. You don't have the option of moving
out of your old house and into a new one.

















From: ShieldsFamily






































http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noah_Webster



















As a teacher, he
had come to dislike American elementary schools. They could be overcrowded,
with up to seventy children of all ages crammed into one-room schoolhouses, poorly staffed with
untrained teachers, and poorly equipped with no desks and unsatisfactory
textbooks which came from England. Webster thought that Americans should learn from
American books, so he began writing a three volume compendium, A Grammatical Institute of the English Language.
The work consisted of a speller (published in 1783), a grammar
(published in 1784),
and a reader (published in 1785). His goal was to provide a uniquely American,
Christ

Re: [TruthTalk] Izzy and Erin

It's good to see you, Iz. Good eyes! There's a real 
person in there.

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  ShieldsFamily 
  To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org 

  Sent: March 26, 2006 08:44
  Subject: [TruthTalk] Izzy and Erin

  With my beautiful stepdaughter, Erin, this week. 
  Izzy
  I sent 
  these photos using Adobe(R) Photoshop(R) Elements 4.0. Find out more: http://www.adobe.com/photoshopelementswin

Re: [TruthTalk] Invitation.

My goodness but it's striking. Many happy 
years.

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  ShieldsFamily 
  To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org 

  Sent: March 26, 2006 08:52
  Subject: [TruthTalk] Invitation.

  The new house. It has a dark green roof. Plenty of 
  bedrooms. Every one of you on TT (yes, even YOU, Gary!), come and visit us 
  anytime, PLEASE!!! Izzy
  I sent 
  these photos using Adobe(R) Photoshop(R) Elements 4.0. Find out more: http://www.adobe.com/photoshopelementswin

Re: [TruthTalk] Noah Webster




I spent some time at my mother's bedside reading, 
praying and talking. She has not opened her eyes.

thanks Iz,

Lance

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  ShieldsFamily 
  To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org 
  
  Sent: March 26, 2006 09:06
  Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Noah 
  Webster
  
  
  Amen, Lance! Hoping 
  all is well with you, izzy
  
  
  
  
  
  From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance MuirSent: Sunday, March 26, 2006 8:06 
  AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] Noah 
  Webster
  
  
  Or, take your Bible and point to 
  Him while saying 'HE IS THE WORD'.
  

- Original Message - 


From: ShieldsFamily 


To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org 


Sent: March 
26, 2006 08:33

Subject: RE: 
[TruthTalk] Noah Webster


I love Crocodile 
Dundee because he says, with a glint in his eye, Now THIS is a 
knife! Life up your Bible and say, Now THIS is the Word! It cuts to 
the quick and separates the men from the boys! J 
iz





From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kevin DeeganSent: Sunday, March 26, 2006 7:25 
AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] Noah 
Webster


I think it's a "right back atcha" 
thing 



Is that so? 

Well, how do you like the fact that some American 
Company bought the rights to all those Paul Hogan movies?Judy Taylor 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote:

  
  I think it's a "right back atcha" 
  thing - for years I would go over there and hear much lamenting 
  about
  
  what Americans had bought; do you 
  know an American Company now owns the all 
  Australian
  
  delicious spread called 
  Vegemite?
  
  
  
  On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 23:45:33 -0800 (PST) Kevin 
  Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  writes:
  

I've just learned 
that Australia 
is investing workers retirement funds in US Real 
Estate



They just bought the New York Thruway. Does that 
mean I need a passport, now?From: 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Judy 
TaylorThanks for this Kevin

  
  
  
  Proof of the 
  pudding is always in the 
  eating.
  
  
  I've just learned 
  that Australia 
  is investing workers retirement funds in US Real Estate 
  also
  
  
  So Lance and his 
  prophet don't have a whole lot of support from "down under" 
  either
  
  
  
  
  
  On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 09:20:31 -0800 (PST) Kevin 
  Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  writes:
  


Lance says 
Canada will not 
suffer the same fate at the USA. 






Ah


Ah


 AH 
CHOO!





excuse 
me





348,000 New 
York jobs are 
supported by Canada-U.S. trade 



Total CanadaU.S. merchandise trade: $411 
billion 


CanadaU.S. trade supported 5.2 million 
U.S. 
jobs 


More people traveled between 
Canada and NY in 
2004 than any other U.S. 
state 


14,500,000 vehicles crossed the Canada-U.S. 
border at the four Niagara crossings last year, accounting for 34% 
of all traffic that crossed into Ontario 






ROTFL


With this many US Jobs gone, could CanaDUH 
rebound? 





http://www.2ontario.com/welcome/coca_401.asp


Seeing that a FULL 84% of CanaDUHs exports 
are US 


Calculator 
please


That leaves 16%, can CanaDUH's economy 
survive on 16% of its present 
exports?


Remember that the Total export/imports of 
canada 
represents a FULL 2/

RE: [TruthTalk] Izzy and Erin









Whodathunkit???











From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir
Sent: Sunday, March 26, 2006 8:09
AM
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Izzy and
Erin







It's good to see you, Iz. Good eyes! There's a real person
in there.







- Original Message - 





From: ShieldsFamily






To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org






Sent: March 26, 2006
08:44





Subject: [TruthTalk] Izzy
and Erin









With my beautiful stepdaughter, Erin, this week. Izzy

I sent
these photos using Adobe(R) Photoshop(R) Elements 4.0. Find out more: http://www.adobe.com/photoshopelementswin

RE: [TruthTalk] Invitation.









Thanks. Visit soon!











From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir
Sent: Sunday, March 26, 2006 8:11
AM
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk]
Invitation.







My goodness but it's striking. Many happy years.







- Original Message - 





From: ShieldsFamily






To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org






Sent: March 26, 2006
08:52





Subject: [TruthTalk]
Invitation.









The new house. It has a dark green roof. Plenty of bedrooms. Every one
of you on TT (yes, even YOU, Gary!), come and visit us anytime, PLEASE!!! Izzy

I sent these
photos using Adobe(R) Photoshop(R) Elements 4.0. Find out more: http://www.adobe.com/photoshopelementswin

RE: [TruthTalk] Noah Webster









She is in Gods arms.  So glad she
has such a devoted son. iz











From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir
Sent: Sunday, March 26, 2006 8:14
AM
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Noah
Webster







I spent some time at my mother's bedside reading, praying
and talking. She has not opened her eyes.











thanks Iz,











Lance







- Original Message - 





From: ShieldsFamily






To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org






Sent: March 26, 2006
09:06





Subject: RE: [TruthTalk]
Noah Webster









Amen, Lance! Hoping all is well with you,
izzy











From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Lance Muir
Sent: Sunday, March 26, 2006 8:06
AM
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Noah
Webster







Or, take your Bible and point to Him while saying 'HE IS THE
WORD'.







- Original Message - 





From: ShieldsFamily






To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org






Sent: March 26, 2006
08:33





Subject: RE: [TruthTalk]
Noah Webster









I love Crocodile Dundee because he says,
with a glint in his eye, Now THIS is a knife! Life up your
Bible and say, Now THIS is the Word! It cuts to the quick and
separates the men from the boys! J iz











From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Kevin Deegan
Sent: Sunday, March 26, 2006 7:25
AM
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Noah
Webster







I think it's a right back
atcha thing 











Is that so? 





Well, how do you like the fact that some American Company bought the
rights to all those Paul Hogan movies?

Judy Taylor
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:







I think it's a right back
atcha thing - for years I would go over there and hear much lamenting
about





what Americans had bought; do you know
an American Company now owns the all Australian





delicious spread called Vegemite?











On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 23:45:33 -0800 (PST) Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:







I've just learned that Australia
is investing workers retirement funds in US Real Estate











They just bought the New York Thruway. Does that mean I need a
passport, now?

From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Judy Taylor
Thanks for this
Kevin











Proof of the pudding is always in the
eating.









I've just learned that Australia
is investing workers retirement funds in US Real Estate also









So Lance and his prophet don't have a
whole lot of support from down under either



















On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 09:20:31 -0800 (PST) Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:











Lance says Canada will not suffer the
same fate at the USA. 



















Ah









Ah









 AH CHOO!



















excuse me



















348,000 New York jobs are
supported by Canada-U.S. trade 









Total CanadaU.S. merchandise trade: $411 billion 









CanadaU.S. trade supported 5.2 million U.S.
jobs 









More people traveled between Canada and NY in 2004 than
any other U.S.
state 









14,500,000 vehicles crossed the Canada-U.S. border at the four Niagara
crossings last year, accounting for 34% of all traffic that crossed into Ontario




















ROTFL









With this many US Jobs gone, could CanaDUH rebound? 



















http://www.2ontario.com/welcome/coca_401.asp









Seeing that a FULL 84% of CanaDUHs exports are US 









Calculator please









That leaves 16%, can CanaDUH's economy survive on 16% of its present
exports?









Remember that the Total export/imports of canada
represents a FULL 2/3rds of their GDP!









SIZE does matter!



















Thanks for the add'l example of mindless parroting.









Don't you just HATE Ignorance?









I guess it is better than letting it go to waste.










Lance Muir
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:











The 'prophet' (take note, David) said otherwise in November.
Canada
will not suffer the same fate at the USA.
Size does matter but, it's not the only thing that matters.











- Original Message - 









From: Judy Taylor










To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org










Sent: March 25, 2006
08:03









Subject: Re: [TruthTalk]
Noah Webster



















Don't worry Lance, if the USA implodes - Canada and Europe will go with it - at present when the









US sneezes the rest of the world catch a
cold. Such envy and jealousy from the North ... Goodness gracious!





























From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Lance Muir
Most on TT will live to see the implosion of the USA.
At what point will you declare bankruptcy. You don't have the option of moving
out of your old house and into a new one.

















From: ShieldsFamily






































http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noah_Webster



















As a teacher, he
had come to dislike

Re: [TruthTalk] Truth and Freedom (some food for thought)




Of course they did - the two that made it that is 
(Joshua and Caleb) since they didn't return with an (evil) carnal 
report
along withall of the following generation who 
beganwith a fresh copy book.

On Sun, 26 Mar 2006 13:39:33 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  Good post -- as far as it goes. What you leave 
  out is this: they never fully arrived !!! God remained 
  patient. Kinda like it is right now. 
  
  jd
  
  From: 
Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] 

Truth and freedom go hand in hand, but 
truth will produce freedom only as it is walked in. This ought to be 
self-evident. We can know something is true, but if we fail to walk in it, 
what good is it? Its value to us is worthless unless it is walked 
in.
Freedom and truth come to those who press 
on. Freedom, the kind of freedom that God is involved in bringing us into, 
comes progressively, not all at once. These are lessons from the Days of 
Unleavened Bread. It took the Israelites seven days to get to and across the 
Red Sea. It took them another forty years to get into their own land, into 
their inheritance, the Promised Land.
Their freedom was progressive. There was a 
time when it began, but if they had never continued on the way, they would 
never have had their own land, never have had their inheritance, never have 
been free. 
This is a large part of the object lesson: 
We have to continue. If we continue, then we will truly be a disciple. We 
will understand the truth, and the truth will make usfree. The truth 
of God shows us the real values of life because it shows us what we are to 
give our life to.

Re: [TruthTalk] Izzy and Erin




Loved all of your photos Iz,
Beautifulfamily, lovely pets, gracious 
home. How about all those garages; I know that comes in 
handy.

  
  

From: ShieldsFamily 


To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org 


Sent: March 
26, 2006 08:44

Subject: 
[TruthTalk] Izzy and Erin


With my beautiful stepdaughter, Erin, this week. 
Izzy
I sent 
these photos using Adobe(R) Photoshop(R) Elements 4.0. Find out more: http://www.adobe.com/photoshopelementswin

Re: [TruthTalk] Noah Webster




I can empathize with you Lance, it was not that long 
ago for me. I do hope and pray she will
pull through so you can share some more days with 
her. Any official prognosis yet? jt

On Sun, 26 Mar 2006 09:14:08 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  I spent some time at my mother's bedside reading, 
  praying and talking. She has not opened her eyes.
  
  thanks Iz,
  
  Lance
  
From: ShieldsFamily 


Amen, Lance! Hoping 
all is well with you, izzy





From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance MuirSent: Sunday, March 26, 2006 8:06 
AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] Noah 
Webster


Or, take your Bible and point to 
Him while saying 'HE IS THE WORD'.

  
  - Original Message - 
  
  
  From: ShieldsFamily 
  
  
  To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org 
  
  
  Sent: March 
  26, 2006 08:33
  
  Subject: RE: 
  [TruthTalk] Noah Webster
  
  
  I love Crocodile 
  Dundee because he says, with a glint in his eye, Now THIS is a 
  knife! Life up your Bible and say, Now THIS is the Word! It cuts 
  to the quick and separates the men from the boys! J 
  iz
  
  
  
  
  
  From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kevin DeeganSent: Sunday, March 26, 2006 7:25 
  AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] Noah 
  Webster
  
  
  I think it's a "right back atcha" 
  thing 
  
  
  
  Is that so? 
  
  Well, how do you like the fact that some American 
  Company bought the rights to all those Paul Hogan 
  movies?Judy Taylor 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote:
  

I think it's a 
"right back atcha" thing - for years I would go over there and hear much 
lamenting about

what Americans had 
bought; do you know an American Company now owns the all 
Australian

delicious spread 
called Vegemite?



On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 23:45:33 -0800 (PST) Kevin 
Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
writes:

  
  I've just learned 
  that Australia 
  is investing workers retirement funds in US Real 
  Estate
  
  
  
  They just bought the New York Thruway. Does 
  that mean I need a passport, now?From: 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Judy 
  TaylorThanks for this Kevin
  



Proof of the 
pudding is always in the 
eating.


I've just 
learned that Australia 
is investing workers retirement funds in US Real Estate 
also


So Lance and 
his prophet don't have a whole lot of support from "down under" 
either





On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 09:20:31 -0800 (PST) 
Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
writes:

  
  
  Lance says 
  Canada will not 
  suffer the same fate at the USA. 
  
  
  
  
  
  
  Ah
  
  
  Ah
  
  
   AH 
  CHOO!
  
  
  
  
  
  excuse 
  me
  
  
  
  
  
  348,000 New 
  York jobs are 
  supported by Canada-U.S. trade 
  
  
  
  Total CanadaU.S. merchandise trade: $411 
  billion 
  
  
  CanadaU.S. trade supported 5.2 million 
  U.S. 
  jobs 
  
  
  More people traveled between 
  Canada and NY 
  in 2004 than any other U.S. 
  state 
  
  
  14,500,000 vehicles crossed the 
  Canada-U.S. border at the four Niagara crossings last year, 
  accounting for 34% of all traffic that crossed into Ontario 
  
  
  
  
  
  
  ROTFL
  
  
  With this many US Jobs gone, could CanaDUH 
  rebound?

RE: [TruthTalk] Izzy and Erin









After living in the city with NO garage
for five years I had a severe case of garage envy! Thanks. BTW,
my eyeballs were a bit red, having stayed up till 3:00 a.m. with Erin the night before. They returned to Colorado yesterday, and
tonight we are having eight couples from our church small group over
for pizza and to watch Tender Mercies with Robert Duval. (The
house is a wreck after playing with teenagers for a weekmust get busy!) izzy











From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Judy Taylor
Sent: Sunday, March 26, 2006 8:33
AM
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Izzy and
Erin







Loved all of your photos Iz,





Beautifulfamily, lovely pets,
gracious home. How about all those garages; I know that comes in handy.









From: ShieldsFamily






To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org






Sent: March 26, 2006
08:44





Subject: [TruthTalk] Izzy
and Erin









With my beautiful stepdaughter, Erin, this week. Izzy

I sent
these photos using Adobe(R) Photoshop(R) Elements 4.0. Find out more: http://www.adobe.com/photoshopelementswin

Re: [TruthTalk] Izzy and Erin

Iz:He won a much deserved oscar for his performance
in 'Tender Mercies'. I wish you all a wonderful evening. Lance

- Original Message -
From:
ShieldsFamily
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org

Sent: March 26, 2006 09:49
Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Izzy and
Erin

After living in the
city with NO garage for five years I had a severe case of garage envy!
Thanks. BTW, my eyeballs were a bit red, having stayed up till 3:00 a.m. with
Erin the night before. They returned to
Colorado
yesterday, and tonight we are having eight couples from our church small
group over for pizza and to watch Tender Mercies with Robert Duval.
(The house is a wreck after playing with teenagers for a weekmust get
busy!) izzy

From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf Of Judy
TaylorSent: Sunday, March
26, 2006 8:33 AMTo:
TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgCc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] Izzy and
Erin

Loved all of your photos
Iz,

Beautifulfamily, lovely pets,
gracious home. How about all those garages; I know that comes in
handy.

From: ShieldsFamily

To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org

Sent: March
26, 2006 08:44

Subject:
[TruthTalk] Izzy and Erin

With my beautiful stepdaughter, Erin, this week.
Izzy
I
sent these photos using Adobe(R) Photoshop(R) Elements 4.0. Find out more:
http://www.adobe.com/photoshopelementswin

[TruthTalk] America 100 years ago vs today.


 
 Those were the days! 
  
  
  THE YEAR 1905 
  This will boggle your mind, I know it did mine! 
  The year is 1905. 
  One hundred years ago. 
  What a difference a century makes! 
  
  
  Here are some of the U.S. statistics for the Year 1905 : 
  
  The average life expectancy in the U.S. was 47 years. 
  
  Only 14 percent of the homes in the U.S. had a bathtub. 
  
  Only 8 percent of the homes had a telephone. 
  
  A three-minute call from Denver to New York City cost eleven dollars. 
  
  There were only 8,000 cars in the U.S., and only 144 miles of paved 
 roads. 
  
  The maximum speed limit in most cities was 10 mph. 
  
  Alabama, Mississippi, Iowa, and Tennessee were each more heavily 
 populated than California. 
  
  With a mere 1.4 million people, California was only the 21st most 
 populous state in the Union. 
  
  The tallest structure in the world was the Eiffel Tower! 
  
  The average wage in the U.S. was 22 cents per hour. 
  
  The average U.S. worker made between $200 and $400 per year .. 
  
  A competent accountant could expect to earn $2000 per year, 
  
  
  a dentist $2,500 per year, 
  
  a veterinarian between $1,500 and $4,000 per year, and 
  
  a mechanical engineer about $5,000 per year. 
  
  More than 95 percent of all births in the U.S. took place at home .. 
  
  Ninety percent of all U.S. doctors had no college education. 
  
  Instead, they attended so-called medical schools, many of which were 
 condemned in the press and by the government as substandard. 
  
  Sugar cost four cents a pound. 
  
  Eggs were fourteen cents a dozen. 
  
  Coffee was fifteen cents a pound. 
  
  Most women only washed their hair once a month, and used borax or egg 
 yolks for shampoo. 
  
  Canada passed a law that prohibited poor people from entering into 
 their country for any reason. 
  
  Five leading causes of death in the U.S. were: 
  1. Pneumonia and influenza 
  
  2. Tuberculosis 
  3. Diarrhea 
  
  4. Heart disease 
  
  5. Stroke 
  
  The American flag had 45 stars. 
  
  Arizona, Oklahoma, New Mexico, Hawaii, and Alaska hadn't been admitted 
 to the Union yet. 
  
  The population of Las Vegas, Nevada, was only 30!!! 
  
  Crossword puzzles, canned beer, and ice tea hadn't been invented yet. 
  
  There was no Mother's Day or Father's Day. 
  
  Two out of every 10 U.S. adults couldn't read or write. 
  
  Only 6 percent of all Americans had graduated from high school. 
  
  Marijuana, heroin, and morphine were all available over the counter at 
 the local corner drugstores. 
  Back then pharmacist said, Heroin clears the complexion, gives 
 buoyancy to the mind, regulates the stomach and bowels, and is, in fact,
a 
 perfect guardian of health. (Shocking!) 
  
  Eighteen percent of households in the U.S. had at least one full-time 
 servant or domestic help. 
  
  There were about 230 reported murders in the entire U.S. 
  
  And I forwarded this from someone else without typing it myself, and 
 sent it to you in a matter of seconds! 
  Try to imagine what it may be like in another 100 years. 
  
  It staggers the mind.



--
Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know 
how you ought to answer every man.  (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org

If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL 
PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed.  If you have a friend who wants to 
join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.

Re: [TruthTalk] Mentoring


maybe God is trying to tell you something, Kevin. The "x" in the box is probably not what you had in mind. 

jd

-- Original message -- From: Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 


Blab-away for as little as 1¢/min. Make PC-to-Phone Calls using Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.

Re: [TruthTalk] Noah Webster


I trust you know that many are in prayer for you and yours. 

John

-- Original message -- From: "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] 







I do know that with a thankful heart, Iz. Lance

- Original Message - 
From: ShieldsFamily 
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org 
Sent: March 26, 2006 10:11
Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Noah Webster


I must take a moment to copy some comforting words that I was reading this week to Erin from The Spiritual World by Sadhu Sundar Singh:

One day while I was praying alone, I suddenly found myself surrounded by a great concourse of spirit beings, or I might say that as soon as my spiritual eyes were opened I found myself bowed in the presence of a considerable company of saints and angels. At first I was somewhat abashed, when I saw their bright and glorious state and compared with them my own inferior quality. But I was at once put at ease by their real sympathy and love-inspired friendliness. I had already had the experience of the peace of the presence of God in my life, but the fellowship with these saints added a new and wonderful joy to me. As we conversed together I received from them answers to my questions relating to my difficulties about many problems that puzzled me. My first inquiry was about what happens at the time of dying and about the state of the soul after death. To this (question) 
they answered, Death is like sleep. There is no pain in the passing over, usually. As an exhausted man is overcome by deep sleep, so comes the sleep of death to man. Death comes so suddenly to many, that it is only with great difficulty that they realize that they have left the material world and entered this world of spirits. Bewildered by the many new and beautiful things that they see around them, they imagine that they are visiting some country or city of the physical world, which they have not seen before. It is only when they have been more fully instructed, and realize that their spiritual body is different from their former material body, that they allow that they have, in fact, been transferred from the material world to the realm of spirits..Usually at the time of death the body gradually loses its power of feeling. It has no pain, but is simply overcome by a sense of drowsiness.
 Evil spirits can injure only those in the world who are in like nature to themselves, and then they can do it only to a limited extent. They can, indeed, trouble the righteous, but not without Gods permission. God sometimes does give to satan and his angels permission to tempt and persecute His people, that they may emerge from the trial stronger and better, as when He allowed satan to persecute His servant Job. But from such a trial there is gain rather than loss to the believer. The dying of a believer is frequently the opposite of what happens with an unbeliever. He is often extremely happy, for he sees angels and saintly spirits coming to welcome him. Then, too, his loved ones, who have died before, are permitted to attend his deathbed and to conduct his soul to the spiritual world. On entering the world of spirits he at once feels at
 home, for not only are his friends about him, but while in the world he had long been preparing himself for this Home by his trust in God and fellowship with Him.
 Another saint said, To conduct the souls of men from the world is the work of angels. Usually the Christ reveals Himself in the spiritual world to each one in degrees of glory differing in intensity according to the state of each souls spiritual development. But in some cases He Himself comes to a deathbed to welcome His servant, and in love dries his tears, and leads him into Paradise. As a child born into the world finds everything provided for its wants, so does the soul, on entering the spiritual world, find all its wants supplied.

Lance, you know we are all praying for a peaceful passing for your dear Mother. Izzy





From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance MuirSent: Sunday, March 26, 2006 8:46 AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] Noah Webster


I do recall that it was not long ago for you, Judy. The prognosis is that she will not pull through. We've left DNR instructions but continue to pray.



thanks,



Lance


- Original Message - 

From: Judy Taylor 

To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org 

Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org 

Sent: March 26, 2006 09:34

Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Noah Webster



I can empathize with you Lance, it was not that long ago for me. I do hope and pray she will

pull through so you can share some more days with her. Any official prognosis yet? jt



On Sun, 26 Mar 2006 09:14:08 -0500 "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:


I spent some time at my mother's bedside reading, praying and talking. She has not opened her eyes.



thanks Iz,



Lance


From: ShieldsFamily 


Amen, Lance! Hoping all is well with you, izzy





From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mai

Re: [TruthTalk] Mentoring

You Mentor but have No one that you have mentored.   Impressive.  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:maybe God is trying to tell you something, Kevin. The "x" in the box is probably not what you had in mind. jd-- Original message -- From: Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED]   Blab-away for as little as 1¢/min. Make PC-to-Phone Calls using
 Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. 
		Blab-away for as little as 1¢/min. Make  PC-to-Phone Calls using Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.

Re: [TruthTalk] Rare and beautiful

http://www.butterflyalphabet.com/bp2.htm  http://www.sciencenewsforkids.org/articles/20051116/Feature1.aspShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:   Subject: FW: Rare and beautiful  
		New Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Call regular phones from your PC for low, low rates.

Re: [TruthTalk] Mentoring


Christ's mentoring is what made the 12 apostles the force they were. Let's see-- that's 12 divided by three (years) and a 100 years later , they tell me there was somewhere around 6 million Christians. But make fun of it if you will. 

Part of mentoring (read:discipleship) is the giving up of self. It is the carnal mind that makes a game out of sharing the gospel and comparing "success" landmarks.
It is Christ's example that really matters, here -- not mine nor yours. 

the comparisons have been made. You ignored them then -- you would do soagain if agreed to play this very immature game. What shall we call this game? "My Sword is bigger than yours?" If we are to pray in our closets -- surely our ministries are not for the purpose of attracting attention to self. I will pray that you move away from self as you continue doing what every you do "for the Lord." After all -- the head count belongs to the Lord for He is the one who adds to His assemblage. 

jd

-- Original message -- From: Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
You Mentor but have No one that you have mentored. 
Impressive.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

maybe God is trying to tell you something, Kevin. The "x" in the box is probably not what you had in mind. 

jd

-- Original message -- From: Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 


Blab-away for as little as 1¢/min. Make PC-to-Phone Calls using Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. 


Blab-away for as little as 1¢/min. Make PC-to-Phone Calls using Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.

Re: [TruthTalk] Piece

Found this on a Anarchist site. They are for "piece" so were in the Peace march Oct 2005,but they attacked us with sticks. Thiswas before they escalated.  PS 120:7 I am for peace: but when I speak, they are for war  Blab-away for as little as 1¢/min. Make PC-to-Phone Calls using Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.   Blab-away for as little as 1¢/min. Make PC-to-Phone Calls using Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.
		New Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Call regular phones from your PC for low, low rates.

Re: [TruthTalk] Mentoring

The bean count still belongs to the Lord.
jd

-- Original message -- From: Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED]
You Mentor but have No one that you have mentored.
Impressive.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

maybe God is trying to tell you something, Kevin. The "x" in the box is probably not what you had in mind.

-- Original message -- From: Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Blab-away for as little as 1¢/min. Make PC-to-Phone Calls using Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.

New Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Call regular phones from your PC for low, low rates.

Re: [TruthTalk] Saying Goodbye

2006-03-26 Thread David Miller

I've been very busy over the weekend and not had time to check email.  I had 
hoped people would use the time to say their goodbyes, but I see many chose 
to keep their dialogue going.

As I had mentioned, I hoped to send some impressions about TruthTalk 
members.  So, I begin now.

One of the TruthTalk members who I have appreciated the most is Dave Hansen. 
Why?  Well, most of my interaction with Mormons over the years has been 
rather superficial.  Virtually anytime I have gotten into discussions on a 
substantial level in person with Mormons, the door to future dialogue has 
closed after a few meetings.  I know Kevin indicates having a greater 
success in this area, and I don't know why the difference, but most of my 
doors always close down.  With DaveH on TruthTalk, I have been able to 
explore more about Joseph Smith and the teachings of Mormonism more than 
just about anywhere else.  Blaine has also contributed, as well as a few 
others, including Dave's nephew.  The bottom-line is that my knowledge and 
understanding of his religion is much greater now than it was before 
TruthTalk.  I realize that there will be some TruthTalk members who think 
that all such knowledge is vain and that it might be foolish for me to spend 
time learning it.  I don't see it that way.  The reasons it is beneficial 
are too numerous for me to enumerate right now, so I will at this time 
simply say thank you to our Mormon participants on TruthTalk.  Although I am 
probably more contrary to the religious establishment of Mormonism than I 
have ever been before, I have appreciated the opportunity to hear your 
perspective and engage you in dialogue.  As I have explained in the past, 
the biggest smoking gun for me in regards to your religion is the Book of 
Abraham and the manuscripts we have which Joseph Smith claimed to translate. 
Another big issue for me is the polygamy of Joseph Smith and the fragmented 
nature of Mormonism after Joseph Smith's departure.

Thank you Dave for many years of dialogue and for the several books you have 
sent me in the past.  I will not forget you.  I will continue to pray for 
you.  Surely you are ingrained in your religion and your relationships in 
your religion will likely keep you there, but I will continue to pray that 
the Lord open your eyes to the true nature of his church.

David Miller


- Original Message - 
From: David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: TruthTalk TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: Friday, March 24, 2006 11:34 AM
Subject: [TruthTalk] Saying Goodbye


Well, it is Friday.  Time to say our goodbyes.

I will leave the list up through the weekend to give time for lurkers to
catch up and perhaps make their final post.  Please bring the other
conversations to a close and focus on saying your final farewells.  I will
start with this one, but I plan to send some more posts where I talk about
past members of TruthTalk and some of my impressions, for good or for bad.
In this post, I want to talk about TruthTalk in general.

In my opinion, much of the difficulty of TruthTalk these last several years
has been related to a problem described by the proverb, FAMILIARITY BREEDS
CONTEMPT.  I have seen this same phenomena in home churches too.  When a
small group of people become so thoroughly familiar with each other that
much of what others would say become somewhat predictable, people become
more free to speak their mind and tend to focus more upon faults than
strengths in the other person.  Marriages often illustrate this same
difficulty.  The time frame for this seems to start at around 4 years, and
within 10 years, it becomes rather entrenched.  Those groups that tend to be
focused upon itself exhibit more of this tendency than groups that tend to
reach out and pull in fresh people.

On TruthTalk, there was a time when that polarizing of groups became rather
noticeable.  There came to be the liberals versus the conservatives, which
eventually turned into the liberals versus the fundamentalists.  When this
first came to light, I questioned the group whether we should encourage this
kind of sectarian dialogue.  Several on the list thought it was natural
human nature and fine not only to allow it but encourage it.  Interestingly,
some of those most outspoken for this perspective are no longer on the list.
My personal judgment in hindsight is that any kind of sectarianism like this
is counter productive for good discussion.  What happens is that people
speak more from bias and emotion rather than engage in a teamwork of
discovery.  People tended to work harder on putting the other side in their
place rather than trying to hear whether or not there was even a grain of
truth in what was being said.

Overall, I have appreciated TruthTalk very much.  It has been a source of
motivation for me to study issues that I might otherwise have left
untouched.  My heart has been warmed by many who have posted here, and my
mind has been enriched with a diversity of viewpoints to consider

Re: [TruthTalk] Saying Goodbye

2006-03-26 Thread David Miller

Continuing with my farewell impressions...

Although Bill Taylor only recently came onto TruthTalk and our interaction 
was rather limited,  I have to say that much of his discussions with me have 
left an impact.  While his mindset of the Incarnation and how that impacts 
evangelism is very different from my own, I see the grain of truth in his 
thinking and have incorporated elements of it in how I approach evangelism. 
I realize that saying this may be incomprehensible to some on TruthTalk, 
maybe even raise red flags of alarm, but it is very true nonetheless.  Jesus 
did indeed die for the sins of the whole world, and part of our message to 
others is what are they doing about that fact.  What is their response?

Some other ways that I have appreciated Bill is simply observing his 
theological training and manner of communicating.  Some names dropped by him 
and others like Lance Muir also have blessed me in directing me toward 
further reading and study along theological lines.  While some on TruthTalk 
question the value of such, I consider it all part of our culture and an 
area of formal training that I have lacked. Therefore, I have appreciated 
Lance and Bill in bringing to the table names and works in a framework with 
which I have been unfamiliar.

Lance too has effected me positively in several ways.  We approach truth 
differently.  Lance takes a much more holisitic approach and is altogether 
people oriented.  His criticism of my reductionism and orientation toward 
dictum has not gone unnoticed.  It has heightened some of my appreciation 
for the Biblical approach to the person of Jesus Christ.  After all, the 
entire gospel is centered more on the person of Christ than it is his 
teaching and sayings.  This is not to say that I have forsaken the teaching 
of Christ altogether, but rather that I have appreciated aspects of Lance 
which bring attention back toward the person of Christ and even each other 
as people.  Lance sees truth through people more than through expressions 
and teaching.  I have learned to appreciate that about him, and to recognize 
its Biblical nature.  I only wish we had more time to explore it on 
TruthTalk in a way that would have been mutually edifying.

Lance also brought me into touch with Debbie.  Although my interaction with 
Debbie has been rather limited, I have appreciated her writing ability and 
feel blessed to have been touched by her life.  Debbie at times is able to 
hear and see past her own mindset, and other times she is able to forcefully 
articulate a viewpoint that can be quite convincing.  Like Lance, she 
appreciates the personal over the wrangling of words, and that is refreshing 
and brings a different focus at times when such is needed.

I had hoped to finish my impressions by this weekend, but too much has been 
going on.  Last night we held a Strings Concert here at my home where all 
five of my children performed.  More than 80 people attended.  Then today we 
had church here at my home late into the evening.  One of the students at UF 
has taken up preaching now too... great praise report...  he preached for 
the first time last Friday and plans to continue carrying that torch every 
Friday.  He has drawn many other students in this move of God that is 
happening at the University of Florida.  We had praise reports of two people 
healed of cancer this week at church... lots of things happening.  So, 
please forbear with me if I extend TruthTalk yet another day so I can finish 
saying my goodbyes.  I guesss there is not much I can say to get everyone to 
stop posting dialogue and to say their goodbyes, so I will finish mine as 
soon as I can and then take down the list.  God bless you all.  My prayers 
are with you Lance and your mother during this time.  Please let us know if 
she was a believer in Jesus Christ.  Thanks.

David Miller 

--
Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know 
how you ought to answer every man.  (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org

If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL 
PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed.  If you have a friend who wants to 
join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.

[TruthTalk] Saying Goodbye

I have avoided saying goodbye because I hate goodbyes.  In real life I
always tell someone, upon parting, that we don't have to say goodbye now
because we'll do that tomorrow.  Then I make sure to avoid that final
goodbye.  As much as I am sick of TT's squabbling and insulting and
straining at gnats, I will truly miss each and every one of you.  I have
been on TruthTalk for about as long as it has been going, I guess, with a
few drop outs to regroup.  I won't specify each one of you because I would
surely leave someone out, but you have all had an impact on my life and my
heart.  I feel like I know you each in a very personal way, and I've shared
my real self, for better or for worse, hoping that my transparency will be
used by God in spite of myself to bless you.  I apologize for every feeling
I have injured, for every too-harsh word, and for using my understanding of
truth at times like a sledgehammer.  But please know that my life will
always carry an imprint of yours, even those of you with whom I have most
disagreed.  I'm hoping that now and then you will send an email and tell me
hello.  Maybe we could all be better friends apart from this intense venue
on TT.  Maybe we could just talk about things not quite so important, and in
so doing, let Jesus shine through more clearly.  

Above all, I wish to thank you my dear, beloved David Miller, for so kindly
providing this meeting place for us.  If it weren't for your vision and
patience I would never have had the chance to meet Judy, and Lance, and J.D.
Smithson, and Dean, and Kevin, Gary, Perry, Blaine, Dave Hansen, Debbie,
Bill, Jonathan, and SO many others.  My life would have been poorer for the
loss. 

David, in spite of being routinely misunderstood and mistreated you have
remained faithful, steadfast, generous, longsuffering, and the most loving
person I have ever encountered.  I know you will not be out of my life
completely, but I'll probably never again have the advantage of sitting at
your feet and gleaning wisdom as it falls from your keyboard. From you I
have learned the most important lesson that no one else has ever taught me;
that I am free from sin and no longer a slave to it, and that love is simply
all that matters. How I thank you for that.  I hope to live up to the
example you have given me.  And, as I said, I hope to meet and greet each
one of you from TruthTalk on the other side.  I truly love you, and I miss
you already. Go with Jesus, and be very blessed.

Izzy


--
Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know 
how you ought to answer every man.  (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org

If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL 
PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed.  If you have a friend who wants to 
join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.

Re: [TruthTalk] Creationism




Of course it is; JC is the Word of God isn't 
He?
Everytime God speaks - He speaks Truth - and every time 
it is God the Word - JC
Let God be true and every man a liar

On Fri, 24 Mar 2006 21:10:15 -0700 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  then Truth ain't 
  JC
  
  put yet another 
  way, the notionmouthedisbeyond falseness, it is implicitly 
  untrue as is a lie,M'am
  
  
  On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 01:05:59 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
  

As..we turn Genesis into a statement...
jt: 
..it's 'a statement of TRUTH'

Re: [TruthTalk] Dominion




More accurately - the lack of understanding is just 
plain obdurance in those too full
of themselves and their own opinions to yeild to the 
source of understanding all Truth.

On Fri, 24 Mar 2006 22:00:03 -0700 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  ..also,perceptively: 
   "The Lack of 
  understanding is just laziness of thought and lack of effort."
  
  On Fri, 24 Mar 2006 21:23:04 -0700 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
  
bullseye; v 
understandable, Bro!

On Fri, 24 Mar 2006 18:30:28 -0800 (PST) Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
writes:

  Fits the legal definition of LibelJudy Taylor 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 
  

||
..you are out there Lance, possiblyin the 
next orbit to Gary.

Re: [TruthTalk] Smithson goes on and on and on

Interpretation/interpolation/speculation re:Genesis leads one to that 
which one has just witnessed over the last week or so.

    - Original Message - 

  From: 
  David 
  Miller 
  To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org 

  Sent: March 23, 2006 17:01
  Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams 
  on Creationism

  I don't know why you are getting so emotional over this.

  I think that when God spoke, in many situations, it took some time 
  for what he said to take place. For example, if he spoke for the 
  land masses to divide from the water, it took less than a minute to say 
  it, but hours for the land and water to do what he said.He 
  also may have been involved in other ways that we don't understand right 
  now. Do you see it differently? It does not have anything to 
  do with resting for the next day.

  David Miller

    - Original Message - 
    From: 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org 
; TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org 

Sent: Thursday, March 23, 2006 4:36 
PM
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: 
Williams on Creationism

David !! Honestly, this is one of the sorriest posts 
you have ever written. First, an atheist mocks God and I am no 
atheist. 

Secondly, the reason you are confused with what I said (144 hours 
of time to speak the words of creation that took only 26 seconds to 
actually speak) is rather simple -- you have somehow lost 
the context of my statement. My comments go the the notion that 
"day" is not a 24 hour period. To say that it is 
metaphorical doesnot mean that God did not create the 
world and even in the sequence depicted -- at least not to 
me. Such an admission , on my part, does not mean that I 
believe the Genesis account to be "scientific" as we understand that 
term , today. Look -- do you really believe that 
God worked so hard in His creation activity that he needed a 24 hour 
period of time to rest up !!!?? And "rest up " for 
what? Com'on David, this is impossible. 

jd

-- 
  Original message -- From: "David Miller" 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 

  Are you mocking the concept that God created the world through 
  faith and speaking? What does how long it takes for him to speak 
  words have to do with how long it took for the world to come into 
  being? I don't understand your point.

      David Miller

- Original Message - 
From: 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org 
; TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org 

Sent: Wednesday, March 22, 2006 
5:29 PM
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: 
Williams on Creationism

So which fundamentalist version of creation do you 
support. That A  E were spirit people. A 6000 
year date or a 10,000 or an "unknown" e.t. ? The 
version that says it took God 144 hours to speak words that 
canbe spoken in 24 seconds !!! I just 
did it in 24 big ones !! including a drink of 
water because my mouth was getting dry. 

Consensus has NOTHING to do with !! Rad Fundies 
cannot agree on much of anything. Which version goes 
into the school system ??? We are still waiting??

jd

-- 
  Original message -- From: Kevin Deegan 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  Don't you get it JT?
  TRUTH is found in CONSENSUS!
  The opinions of Men are the key.Judy Taylor 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

So?
There isn't a single fiew of the whole 
church that is agreed upon
by the whole church either. What 
does that prove? judyt

On Wed, 22 Mar 2006 01:27:56 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
writes:

  Perhaps the Bishop has the same concerns I 
  do. I know this -- 
  there isn't a single view of creationism that is agreed 
  upon by the whole church. 

  jd

  -- 
Original message -- From: "David Miller" 
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: [TruthTalk] Creationism




Big problem JD; the "biblical message" is something 
other than what you have been proffering on TT so far
So why not just admit that you counsel using your own 
theology and that the results belong to you also?. 

jt: How about a statement of 
TRUTH communicated by the author of TRUTH then? 

JD: That is exactly what I am saying. I 
counsel others as time permits. I use the biblical message in my 
work. That does not mean the Bible is a counseling manual !! Neither 
is it a science book. But if you don't get what I am saying in the 
above, just move on. It does not appear that you do get what I 
have said.

On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 01:05:59 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  

  What do I believe about Genesis? 
  Did you read any of my posts? 
  Sciencehas no answers to our confusion, our bondage, our need 
  for community andan  innate 
  longing to live beyond what we see.As 
  soon as we turn Genesis into a statement of science, we lessen its 
  value to the human spirit. 
  
  How about a statement of TRUTH communicated by 
  the author of TRUTH then? That is exactly what I am saying. I counsel 
  others as time permits. I use the biblical message in my work. 
  That does not mean the Bible is a counseling manual !! Neither is it 
  a science book. But if you don't get what I am saying in the 
  above, just move on. It does not appear that you do get 
  what I have said.  
  
  What do I get from reading those first three chapters? 
  That God is in control -- not that He is SOMEHOW in 
  control - but that He is IN FACT in control. He is 
  my creator. I am in His image. 
  
  He is your Creator but you are not in His image 
  unless you have been totally conformed to the image of 
  Christ already - in fact, not in theory 
  only. Your attitude to His Law would belie that. 
  Adam and Eve were not created with the 
  nature of Christ as their mainstay !! Just JudySpeak and 
  nothing more. 
  
  And even when I fall, He continues to hover over and round 
  me. It tells me that I was created for others -- 
  my wife, my children and the world in which I live.
  
  The first three chapters of Genesis tells you all 
  of the above? Where?
  Take your Bible, open it to the first 
  pages of Genesis, lean over until your nose is nearly touching those pages 
  and BAM !!!, YOU WILL SEE IT. 
  
  
  It tells me I am responsible for much of my actions. Work 
  is a curse because I must be responsible !!
  
  Newsflash!! You are responsible for ALL of 
  your thoughts as well as your actions. No kidding. 
  
  I and my wife are one 
  becauseGodthought this to be the case from 
  the beginning. and REST 
  has as much a place in the coming and goings of man as 
  work. That's what I get out of this Genesis 
  account.Whilesome of you only see a debate 
  
  
  You and your wife are one flesh; the Lord would 
  like to be One spirit with you JD Done deal, Judge Judy . beginning many years 
  ago. 
  
  Do you know the best way of dealing with a child - in my case 
  an older son -- who comes home announcing that he no longer believes 
  in the bible??!! IGNORE that comment and continue to be a witness , 
  using, at times, the very book that he rejects. DO NOT, repeat, DO 
  NOT challenge him/her to a debate. You will not win, if your version 
  of :winning" is to bring that child to say "Iwas wrong, Dad, and you were 
  right again." He won't do it. But if you ignore 
  the challenge, and give biblical presentations that make sense to 
  the way he is living his life -- the objection vanishes into 
  thin air. Theory? Nope. It worked on both of 
  my older boys - the lawyer and the doctor. But I 
  digress with some free advice. 
  
  The long and short of the lesson is this -- make the 
  Bible THE battle ground and you will lose the war 
  !!! Present the Bible as something that offers life in 
  the Spirit of God in the Christ of God and you have a winner. 
  
  
  jd

Re: [TruthTalk] Divine Contingent Order




Why? What do they do for you?
It's all about him, his thoughts, his opinions, the 
movies he sees, etc. etc.

On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 01:09:26 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  :-) I shall miss these pithy responses. jd
  
  From: 
"Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] 

After reading you, I'm inclined toward a 
YES!

  From: Kevin Deegan 
  Was it a BIG 
  Bang?Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote: 
  



When one seeks to apply the latter onto the 
former one is simply stymied. In failing to apprehend this one bangs 
one's head against the proverbial wall.
  
  
  Blab-away for as little as 1¢/min. Make PC-to-Phone 
  Calls using Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.

RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

Dodging the question, as usual.  iz

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir
Sent: Friday, March 24, 2006 4:54 PM
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

It ain't true. It's a hyperbolic hypothetical, Iz.

.
- Original Message - 
From: ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: March 24, 2006 17:16
Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

 That wasn't the question; I asked whether IF you believe it were true, you
 would want it taught in schools.  You said NO.  Pathetic, eh? iz

 -Original Message-
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir
 Sent: Friday, March 24, 2006 3:49 PM
 To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

 David you are like so right, man! familiaritycontempt...were those the
 words? Probably got it comin'.

 Actually Lady Iz, I prefer that untruth NOT be taught in schools (i.e.
 creationism)

 - Original Message - 
 From: ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
 Sent: March 24, 2006 16:35
 Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

 So you prefer that untruth be taught in schools.  That's all that's left.
 Pathetic IMO.  izzy

 -Original Message-
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir
 Sent: Friday, March 24, 2006 3:25 AM
 To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

 Still no.

 - Original Message - 
 From: ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
 Sent: March 23, 2006 23:04
 Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

 If you thought it was true would you want it taught in schools, Lance?
 JD?
 izzy

 -Original Message-
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir
 Sent: Thursday, March 23, 2006 3:32 PM
 To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

 David:Is that all you were meaning to say concerning RW? If that's it
 then,
 I'm with RW on this one. I don't think it should be taught in schools
 either.

 - Original Message - 
 From: David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
 Sent: March 23, 2006 15:04
 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

 The CNN report:  Asked if creationism should be taught in schools,
 Williams
 said: I don't think it should, actually. No, no.

 So how have I mischaracterized him?

 David Miller

 - Original Message - 
 From: Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
 Sent: Wednesday, March 22, 2006 10:41 AM
 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

 David:YIKES!! You mischaracterize both Williams and his position. 
 DOUBLE
 YIKES!! I know that you will continue to do so. You are truly trapped,
 David. You've bound yourself with your own theology (not, as you
 believe,
 Scripture). Your teachers will one day answer for what they've done to
 you
 and, what you now do to others.Yikes! Yikes! Yikes (that'd be triple
 yikes)
 - Original Message - 
 From: David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
 Sent: March 22, 2006 10:25
 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

 Lance wrote:
 If Williams is a 'liberal loonie' then
 you are a 'sectarian loonie' , David.

 I'm sectarian only in the sense that the holy and the profane ought to
 be
 separate.  I am not sectarian within the group of those who have
 submitted
 unto Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior.

 Lance wrote:
 He is a brother in Christ who believes
 differently than you on some matters.
 Now, if that makes him what you say
 then, that makes you what I say.

 He is not a liberal loony for believing differently from me.  The
 moniker
 was offered because of his statement about how acknowledgement of our
 Creator did not belong in schools.  He made an irrational statement,
 assuming that CNN reported him accurately.  If he is a brother in
 Christ,
 then I expect to hear a retraction or clarification made soon as other
 believers correct him.  If he is not a brother in Christ, then he will
 continue to support the working of iniquity that seeks to remove the
 acknowledgment of God our Creator from the schools.  What he said was
 very
 damaging to our society, to believers who want to acknowledge God the
 Creator in their study of origins.  To think that science and the
 acknowledgement of God are incompatible is expected from scientists 
 but
 not
 from theologians, and certainly not from the Right Reverend Doctor
 Rowland
 Williams, Archbishop of Canterbury.

 David Miller

 --
 Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you 
 may
 know how you ought to answer every man.  (Colossians 4:6)
 http://www.InnGlory.org

 If you do not want to receive posts from

Re: [TruthTalk] Creationism




myth (apparently JCs compadre Peter 
(e.g.)could tell fromvarious Synoptic conversations inc the one in 
Matt 17thatMoseswasn't a liar; 
also,JC himself, 
whoneverwrote aword ofMoses' Pentateuchusually 
refered to it as to Scripture,by definition true,referring only to 
its author:Moses)


On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 04:16:18 -0500 Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  
  ..Let God be true 
  and every man a liar
  
  --
  for ref:
  
  On Fri, 24 Mar 2006 21:10:15 -0700 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
  
..[jt's] 
notion ['JC is Truth']..isbeyond falseness, it is 
implicitly untrue as is a lie,M'am


On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 01:05:59 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  
  As..we turn Genesis into a statement...
  jt: 
  ..it's 'a statement of TRUTH'

[TruthTalk] Fw: Goodbye, and thanks for all the ichthys

2006-03-25 Thread Lance Muir

- Original Message - 
From: Debbie Sawczak 
To: 'Lance Muir' 
Sent: March 24, 2006 21:02
Subject: Goodbye, and thanks for all the ichthys

I was 
afraid this was too long, but David's leisurely post has given me courage to 
blather a little, like the parting guest who suddenly becomes talkative in the 
doorway. 

I’m glad for the time I spent on 
TT, even 
though I left. I did learn stuff, especially early on as I 
encounteredsomeideas for the first time;certain posts, especially at the beginning, 
opened windows for me. Even some of themore 
plodding discussionswere an occasion for clarifying my own thinking 
or, alternatively, fuzzifying it if it was 
a little too sharp! And that may have been 
the best benefit of TT. 

I remember being surprised at the 
very beginning by the aggressiveness—a newish 
thing for me among believers even though I’ve moved in a wide variety of 
Christian circles. The exposure wasn’t all bad--it made me a bit more assertive and 
thicker-skinned, and forced me to recognize how easily I can be provoked to 
snarkiness myself. ButI often felt sad 
after an exchange. Sometimes, on the other hand, I was completely taken aback by 
the generosity and affirmation in people's responses. So I hope 
thatifthe experience has made me less naive aboutthe behaviour 
of Christians, it hasn't gone so far as to make me cynical.I still think I 
might havemisunderstood the culture of TT...I'mnot very astute that 
way.

I’ve seen something of the serious 
limitations of e-mail, and yet I feel like I’ve met real people. Ifound 
every character on TT interesting and memorable, 
and enjoyed the different ‘flavours’ and the occasional anecdotal 
glimpses into people’s lives. I'dlove to meet you all face to face. In 
the eschaton if not before!

Thank you, Lance, for introducing me to TT and encouraging me to participate--anact sobeautifully typical ofyou.But I especially want to thank 
David:you relentlessly engaged everybody, no matter 
how intractable, and even at your crazy-makingest you had the best manners of all--or at least made the best show of 
manners! J To me, the act of keeping this forumso wide open as long as you did, and the latitude 
you have given people to be themselves, show abroadnessabove and beyond your wordsthat 
commands my 
respect.

Just 
to irritate some of you, I was going to finish with an excerpt quoting 
Bonhoeffer on how we reflect Christ to each other, from the chapter I've just 
finished working on in Victor's book. Instead, here's something less lofty, 
which for me is a kind of parable for TT:

I'm watching my husbandgently heaveour sleeping 
youngest son up from the living room couch where he has repaired in frustration 
at his brother's endless,irritating 
snores. He had taken his pillow and blankets thereafter incrementally severe degrees of poking and bedshaking had failed to correct his 
brother's breathing. But now hefalls 
forward into his dad's arms, willingly allows himself to be moved, and wakes 
up as he is conducted by hands on his shoulders back to his ownbed. He crawls in beneath the bunk of his 
brother who snores impenitently on, and settles 
back to sleep. This is repeated twoor three times a week, but is 
always forgotten in the morning, and neitherbrother will tolerate talk of separate 
bedrooms.

Open hands, everybody, and Jude 24 
 25.

Love
Debbie

--No virus found in this outgoing message.Checked by AVG 
Free Edition.Version: 7.1.385 / Virus Database: 268.3.1/291 - Release Date: 
3/24/2006

RE: [TruthTalk] Smithson goes on and on and on









Wow; quite a memorable story, jd. Thanks,
iz















From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]







Since TT is almost over - one more story. My oldest
daughter came to me as a14 year old with her first job. Her boss
was an atheist. She tried to convert him and got beat up in the
process. Dad, how do I defend inspiration to
Bruce? 











Julie, you don't even try. Do this --
explain to him that all of the writers of the New Testament scriptures were
murdered for their beliefsand then ask him, 'Bruce, don't you think
you should at least examine what it was they died for ?





He told her he was prepared for any response but that one
!!That opened a door that was slammed shut two weeks later in his
drowning death at the lake. Was there light in life because of that
talk? I like to think there was. 











jd

RE: [TruthTalk] Canadian Thought Police on the march









Isnt that the truth? We sold our
100 year old house, for one thing, because we realized that the renovations would
never be finished.  As soon as you started to repair one thing it led to
another and another.  The whole house needed to be replaced one thing after
another! So we built new.  What an analogy of the difference between religion
and being born again of the Holy Spirit. izzy











From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Judy Taylor
Sent: Friday, March 24, 2006 6:05
PM
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Canadian
Thought Police on the march







There is no such thing as a
renovated heart Lance; more misunderstanding which makes me wonder





about you and your SS conversion.
It is a new heart; the old has passed away - all things become new.











On Fri, 24 Mar 2006 08:06:30 -0500 Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:







My critique of this would be similar to your own. Granted
that a civil society is an improvement on an uncivil one. Granted that a moral
society is an improvement on an immoral one. Granted that some attempt to
govern their lives by the so-called 'golden rule' or, by the ten commandments.
These also offer up a social improvement on that which opposes the foregoing.











Please, please tell me Kevin, Judy, David and Iz that the
genuine 'renovation of the heart' would/should include all of the above? I do
believe that some of y'all have things ass backwards with that upon which you
focus (signage wise and all).







- Original Message - 





From: Kevin
Deegan 





To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org






Sent: March 24, 2006
07:54





Subject: Re: [TruthTalk]
Canadian Thought Police on the march

















The Canadian Guanatamo 





Better be careful with your social context on the INET Lance!





Are you hating an identifiable group?





And your comments on FUNDIES have hurt me, I understand it
as an attack on me  multiple groups of my friends. ; )





Do you have the telE for the Tribunal?











Justice in Canaduh





http://www.pressaction.com/news/weblog/full_article/petersen02272005/





passed his second year of incarceration without charge





Zündel was denied the right to cross-examine his accusers or to know
all the evidence against him.





Zündel stated that all his alleged crimes are Internet-related











Canadian Human Rights Commission The truth in
some absolute sense really plays no role.
Rather, it is the social context in which the message
is delivered and heard which will determine the effect that the communication
will have on the listener. It is not the truth or falsity
per se that will evoke the emotion but rather how it is understood
by the recipient.

Kevin Deegan
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:







Don't look now but Canada is
changing - Group Think





Gary North would be proud
of you folks.





He tried to bring in New
Geneva and by the looks of it you folks have actually suceeded!











Robert Martin,professor of
constitutional law at the University
of Western Ontario Canada now is a
totalitarian theocracy. I see this as a country ruled today by what I would
describe as a secular state religion [of political correctness]. Anything that
is regarded as heresy or blasphemy is not
tolerated.











Be careful there have been Inquisitions against
professors who attack American Foriegn policy. Hope you do not get turned in,
for your thoughts!











You Cant Say That
Canadian thought police on the march.





By David E. Bernstein 











I've had the good fortune of
spending this past month on the road promoting my new book about how
anti-discrimination laws are eroding civil liberties. At the end of a recent
talk about the book, an audience member asked whether I believe that freedom of
_expression_ is really at risk in the United States from laws meant to
aid women and minorities. The heart of my response is, Look at what's
happening in Canada.
If we don't watch out, we're next.





The decline of freedom of _expression_ in Canada began with seemingly minor
and





understandable speech restrictions. In 1990, the Canadian supreme court
upheld the conviction of James Keegstra, a public-high-school teacher, for
propagating Holocaust denial and anti-Semitic views to his public high-school
students, despite repeated warnings from his superiors to stop. Keegstra was
convicted of the crime of willfully promoting hatred against an
identifiable group, which carries a penalty of up to two years in jail.
Criminalizing hate speech, the court stated, was a reasonable
restriction on _expression_, and it therefore passed constitutional muster.





Two years later, the same court held that obscenity laws are unconstitutional
to the extent they criminalize material based on sexual content alone. However,
any degrading or dehumanizing depiction of sexual activity 
including material that the First Amendment would

Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

2006-03-25 Thread Lance Muir

IZ:No, I would not.

- Original Message - 
From: ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: March 25, 2006 06:14
Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

Dodging the question, as usual.  iz

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir
Sent: Friday, March 24, 2006 4:54 PM
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

It ain't true. It's a hyperbolic hypothetical, Iz.

.
- Original Message - 
From: ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: March 24, 2006 17:16
Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

That wasn't the question; I asked whether IF you believe it were true, 
you

would want it taught in schools.  You said NO.  Pathetic, eh? iz

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir
Sent: Friday, March 24, 2006 3:49 PM
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

David you are like so right, man! familiaritycontempt...were those 
the

words? Probably got it comin'.

Actually Lady Iz, I prefer that untruth NOT be taught in schools (i.e.
creationism)

- Original Message - 
From: ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: March 24, 2006 16:35
Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

So you prefer that untruth be taught in schools.  That's all that's 
left.

Pathetic IMO.  izzy

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir
Sent: Friday, March 24, 2006 3:25 AM
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

Still no.

- Original Message - 
From: ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: March 23, 2006 23:04
Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

If you thought it was true would you want it taught in schools, Lance?
JD?
izzy

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir
Sent: Thursday, March 23, 2006 3:32 PM
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

David:Is that all you were meaning to say concerning RW? If that's it
then,
I'm with RW on this one. I don't think it should be taught in schools
either.

- Original Message - 
From: David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: March 23, 2006 15:04
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

The CNN report:  Asked if creationism should be taught in schools,
Williams
said: I don't think it should, actually. No, no.

So how have I mischaracterized him?

David Miller

- Original Message - 
From: Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: Wednesday, March 22, 2006 10:41 AM
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

David:YIKES!! You mischaracterize both Williams and his position.
DOUBLE
YIKES!! I know that you will continue to do so. You are truly trapped,
David. You've bound yourself with your own theology (not, as you
believe,
Scripture). Your teachers will one day answer for what they've done to
you
and, what you now do to others.Yikes! Yikes! Yikes (that'd be triple
yikes)
- Original Message - 
From: David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: March 22, 2006 10:25
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

Lance wrote:

If Williams is a 'liberal loonie' then
you are a 'sectarian loonie' , David.

I'm sectarian only in the sense that the holy and the profane ought 
to

be
separate.  I am not sectarian within the group of those who have
submitted
unto Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior.

Lance wrote:

He is a brother in Christ who believes
differently than you on some matters.
Now, if that makes him what you say
then, that makes you what I say.

He is not a liberal loony for believing differently from me.  The
moniker
was offered because of his statement about how acknowledgement of our
Creator did not belong in schools.  He made an irrational statement,
assuming that CNN reported him accurately.  If he is a brother in
Christ,
then I expect to hear a retraction or clarification made soon as 
other
believers correct him.  If he is not a brother in Christ, then he 
will

continue to support the working of iniquity that seeks to remove the
acknowledgment of God our Creator from the schools.  What he said was
very
damaging to our society, to believers who want to acknowledge God the
Creator in their study of origins.  To think that science and the
acknowledgement of God are incompatible is expected from scientists
but
not
from theologians, and certainly not from the Right Reverend Doctor
Rowland
Williams, Archbishop of Canterbury.

David Miller

--
Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you
may
know how you

RE: [TruthTalk] Canadian Thought Police on the march









Matthew
11:12
 From the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of heaven
suffers violence, and violent men
take it by force.











From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, March 24, 2006 8:36
PM
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org;
TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Cc: Kevin Deegan
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Canadian
Thought Police on the march







I was responding to this jewel: violent thinking is not violent action 
 And who gets elected to be the thought
police anyway? 











-- Original message -- 
From: Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
If I am talking like Hill  North
it must be a typo or More Likely a Parity Error on your end!

[EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote: 



No one's talking about thought police, Kev. If
you want to talk like Hill and North - expect the rest of us who
listen to you to think you are of the same ilk, denials not
withstanding. That's all I am saying. 























jd











-- Original message -- 
From: Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 

 violent thinking is not violent action 
 And who gets elected to be the thought police anyway? 
 
 --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 
 
  IFO can accept this self-characterization. But when your words sound 
  like North's or Paul Hill's, they allow others to see a similarity in

  your thoughts as compared to the violent thinking of those named 
  above. 
  
  jd 
  
  -- Original message -- 
  From: Kevin Deegan 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>  
   First you accuse me of being Gary North and then you tell me you

  agree 
   with my critique of his philosophy? (see your post below) 
   Which is it Lance? I do not understa nd such behavior it seems 
   irrational to me. 
   
   I absolutely am not a ROMAN Papist. 
   
   Seems to me the Canadian Gov't is on a witch hunt the likes of 
   MccarthyISM. 
   The State of Canada has become the Potentate on a hunt for
illegal 
   thoughts and will enFORCE by threat of law and public censure. 
   Only diff McCarthy was right the US had been infiltrated! 
   
   The only force I believe in is the Force of God's words. 
   You have the right to believe anything you want and I have the 
  right to 
   violently disagree with words NO SWORDS! 
   
   --- Lance Muir wrote: 
   
Did you know that 'he' will not repeat that infamous line
no 
  matter 
who asks? 

So, K evin, I undertake to write more than 1 line and, you
do what 
  you 
do so well; simply give up a smart-ass reply. It's little
wonder 
  that 
SPers are not well received either in Salt Lake
or, anywhere 
  else! 
- Original Message - 
From: Kevin Deegan 
    To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org

Sent: March 24, 2006 08:15 
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Canadian Thought Police on the
march 


Are you talking to me, Gary North? 

Lance Muir wrote: 
My critique of this would be similar to your own. Granted
that a 
civil society is an improvement on an uncivil one. Granted
that a 
  
moral society is an improvement on an immoral one...
Granted that 
  gt; ; some 
attempt to govern their lives by the so-called 'golden
rule' or, 
  by 
the ten commandments. These also offer up a social
improvement on 
  
that which opposes the foregoing. 

Please, please tell me Kevin, Judy, David and Iz that the
genuine 
  
'renovation of the heart' would/should include all of the
above? 
  I do 
believe that some of y'all have things ass backwards with
that 
  upon 
which you focus (signage wise and all). 
- Original Message - 
From: Kevin Deegan 
    To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org

Sent: March 24, 2006 07:54 
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Canadian Thought Police on the
march 


 BR gt;The Canadian Guanatamo 
Better be careful with your social context on the INET
Lance! 
Are you hating an identifiable group? 
And your comments on FUNDIES have hurt me, I
understand it as 
an attack on me  multiple groups of my friends. ; ) 
Do you have the telE for the Tribunal? 

Justice in Canaduh 


  http://www.pressaction.com/news/weblog/full_article/petersen02272005/

  
passed his second year of incarceration without charge 
Zündel was denied the right to cross-examine his accusers
or to 
know all the evidence against him. 
Zündel stated that all his alleged crimes are
Internet-related 

Canadian Human Rights Commission The trut h in some
absolute 
sense really plays no role. Rather, it is the social
context in 
  which 
the message is delivered and heard which will determine the

  effect 
that the communication will have on the listener. It is not
the 
  truth 
or falsity per se that will evoke the emotion but rather
how it 
  is 
understood by the recipient. 

Kevin Deegan wrote: 
Don't look now but Canada is ch

Re: [TruthTalk] Smithson goes on and on and on

xamine what it was they died for ?"
He told her he was prepared for any response but that one !!That opened a door that was slammed shut two weeks later in his drowning death at the lake. Was there light in life because of that talk? I like to think there was. 

jd






-- Original message -- From: "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] 

Interpretation/interpolation/speculation re:Genesis leads one to that which one has just witnessed over the last week or so.

- Original Message - 

From: David Miller 
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org 
Sent: March 23, 2006 17:01
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

I don't know why you are getting so emotional over this.

I think that when God spoke, in many situations, it took some time for what he said to take place. For example, if he spoke for the land masses to divide from the water, it took less than a minute to say it, but hours for the land and water to do what he said.He also may have been involved in other ways that we don't understand right now. Do you see it differently? It does not have anything to do with resting for the next day.

David Miller

----- Original Message - 
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org ; TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org 
Sent: Thursday, March 23, 2006 4:36 PM
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

David !! Honestly, this is one of the sorriest posts you have ever written. First, an atheist mocks God and I am no atheist. 

Secondly, the reason you are confused with what I said (144 hours of time to speak the words of creation that took only 26 seconds to actually speak) is rather simple -- you have somehow lost the context of my statement. My comments go the the notion that "day" is not a 24 hour period. To say that it is metaphorical doesnot mean that God did not create the world and even in the sequence depicted -- at least not to me. Such an admission , on my part, does not mean that I believe the Genesis account to be "scientific" as we understand that term , today. Look -- do you really believe that God worked so hard in His creation activity that he needed a 24 hour period of time to rest up !!!?? And "rest up " for what? Com'on David, this is impossible. 

jd

-- Original message -- From: "David Miller" [EMAIL PROTECTED] 

Are you mocking the concept that God created the world through faith and speaking? What does how long it takes for him to speak words have to do with how long it took for the world to come into being? I don't understand your point.

David Miller

- Original Message - 
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org ; TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org 
Sent: Wednesday, March 22, 2006 5:29 PM
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

So which fundamentalist version of creation do you support. That A  E were spirit people. A 6000 year date or a 10,000 or an "unknown" e.t. ? The version that says it took God 144 hours to speak words that canbe spoken in 24 seconds !!! I just did it in 24 big ones !! including a drink of water because my mouth was getting dry. 

Consensus has NOTHING to do with !! Rad Fundies cannot agree on much of anything. Which version goes into the school system ??? We are still waiting??

jd

-- Original message -- From: Kevin Deegan [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Don't you get it JT?
TRUTH is found in CONSENSUS!
The opinions of Men are the key.Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


So?
There isn't a single fiew of the whole church that is agreed upon
by the whole church either. What does that prove? judyt

On Wed, 22 Mar 2006 01:27:56 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

Perhaps the Bishop has the same concerns I do. I know this -- 
there isn't a single view of creationism that is agreed upon by the whole church. 

jd



-- Original message -- From: "David Miller" [EMAIL PROTECTED] 



John wrote:
 The world in which we live would reject 
 any mention of God in the evolutionary process, 
 IMO. But creationism in the schools? Could 
 that not be considered the beginnings of a fanatical 
 fundamentalist take-over of the culture? 
ROTFLOL. I sure hope youwere being facetious on purpose.

John wrote:
 But to allow a mere statement that suggests God 
 is somehow in control as the Creator(?) If this 
 could be presented into the secular system of 
 education without it being coopted by the fundies 
 -- go for it. But I doubt that it can. What a shame 
 that radical fundamentalism within Christiandom forces 
 the Body to dismiss a perfectly wonderful opportunity 
 to introduce the Creator to others. 
In case you did not notice,the fundamentalists are notcausing the acknowledgement of our Creator to be forbidden inschools. It is the liberal loonies like thisArchbishop of Canterbury who are doing this.

David Miller




Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Make PC-to-Phone Calls to the US (and 30+ countries) for 2¢/min or less.

Re: [TruthTalk] Creationism




myth (feminists' rhetoric) 




  ||
  
  On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 ..Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
writes:
  

..Let God be true 
and every man a liar
  -
  
  ..Funny 
  how some guys take a false assumption to the extreme, hey Judy? 
  iz

Re: [TruthTalk] Creationism


I rest my case !! And a fourth post (of the morning) that is absolutely content free  talk about "substance abuse !!" that is what goes on in your your posts. 

jd

-- Original message -- From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] 

Big problem JD; the "biblical message" is something other than what you have been proffering on TT so far
So why not just admit that you counsel using your own theology and that the results belong to you also?. 

jt: How about a statement of TRUTH communicated by the author of TRUTH then? 

JD: That is exactly what I am saying. I counsel others as time permits. I use the biblical message in my work. That does not mean the Bible is a counseling manual !! Neither is it a science book. But if you don't get what I am saying in the above, just move on. It does not appear that you do get what I have said.

On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 01:05:59 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 


What do I believe about Genesis? Did you read any of my posts? 
Sciencehas no answers to our confusion, our bondage, our need for community andan  innate longing to live beyond what we see.As soon as we turn Genesis into a statement of science, we lessen its value to the human spirit. 

How about a statement of TRUTH communicated by the author of TRUTH then? That is exactly what I am saying. I counsel others as time permits. I use the biblical message in my work. That does not mean the Bible is a counseling manual !! Neither is it a science book. But if you don't get what I am saying in the above, just move on. It does not appear that you do get what I have said.  

What do I get from reading those first three chapters? That God is in control -- not that He is SOMEHOW in control - but that He is IN FACT in control. He is my creator. I am in His image. 

He is your Creator but you are not in His image unless you have been totally conformed to the image of 
Christ already - in fact, not in theory only. Your attitude to His Law would belie that. Adam and Eve were not created with the nature of Christ as their mainstay !! Just JudySpeak and nothing more. 

And even when I fall, He continues to hover over and round me. It tells me that I was created for others -- my wife, my children and the world in which I live.

The first three chapters of Genesis tells you all of the above? Where?
Take your Bible, open it to the first pages of Genesis, lean over until your nose is nearly touching those pages and BAM !!!, YOU WILL SEE IT. 

It tells me I am responsible for much of my actions. Work is a curse because I must be responsible !!

Newsflash!! You are responsible for ALL of your thoughts as well as your actions. No kidding. 

I and my wife are one becauseGodthought this to be the case from the beginning. and REST has as much a place in the coming and goings of man as work. That's what I get out of this Genesis account.Whilesome of you only see a debate 

You and your wife are one flesh; the Lord would like to be One spirit with you JD Done deal, Judge Judy . beginning many years ago. 

Do you know the best way of dealing with a child - in my case an older son -- who comes home announcing that he no longer believes in the bible??!! IGNORE that comment and continue to be a witness , using, at times, the very book that he rejects. DO NOT, repeat, DO NOT challenge him/her to a debate. You will not win, if your version of :winning" is to bring that child to say "Iwas wrong, Dad, and you were right again." He won't do it. But if you ignore the challenge, and give biblical presentations that make sense to the way he is living his life -- the objection vanishes into thin air. Theory? Nope. It worked on both of my older boys - the lawyer and the doctor. But I digress with some free advice. 

The long and short of the lesson is this -- make the Bible THE battle ground and you will lose the war !!! Present the Bible as something that offers life in the Spirit of God in the Christ of God and you have a winner. 


jd

Re: [TruthTalk] Divine Contingent Order


z

-- Original message -- From: Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] 

Why? What do they do for you?
It's all about him, his thoughts, his opinions, the movies he sees, etc. etc.

On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 01:09:26 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

:-) I shall miss these pithy responses. jd

From: "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] 

After reading you, I'm inclined toward a YES!

From: Kevin Deegan 
Was it a BIG Bang?Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: 




When one seeks to apply the latter onto the former one is simply stymied. In failing to apprehend this one bangs one's head against the proverbial wall.


Blab-away for as little as 1¢/min. Make PC-to-Phone Calls using Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.

RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: Goodbye, and thanks for all the ichthys









Snarkiness I like that. Blessing, Debbie,
to you and yours. Ill miss your beautiful writing talent. izzy











From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2006
5:24 AM
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Subject: [TruthTalk] Fw: Goodbye,
and thanks for all the ichthys













- Original Message - 



From: Debbie Sawczak 





To: 'Lance Muir'






Sent: March 24, 2006
21:02





Subject: Goodbye, and thanks
for all the ichthys













I was afraid this was too long, but
David's leisurely post has given me courage to blather a little, like the
parting guest who suddenly becomes talkative in the doorway. 



Im glad for the time I spent on TT, even
though I left. I did learn stuff, especially early on as I
encounteredsomeideas for the first time;certain posts,
especially at the beginning, opened windows for me. Even some of themore
plodding discussionswere an occasion for clarifying my own thinking or,
alternatively, fuzzifying it if it was a little too sharp! And that may have
been the best benefit of TT. 



I remember being surprised at the very
beginning by the aggressivenessa newish thing for me among believers even
though Ive moved in a wide variety of Christian circles. The exposure wasnt
all bad--it made me a bit more assertive and thicker-skinned, and forced me to
recognize how easily I can be provoked to snarkiness myself. ButI often
felt sad after an exchange. Sometimes, on the other hand, I was completely
taken aback by the generosity and affirmation in people's responses. So I hope
thatifthe experience has made me less naive aboutthe
behaviour of Christians, it hasn't gone so far as to make me cynical.I
still think I might havemisunderstood the culture of TT...I'mnot
very astute that way.



Ive seen something of the serious
limitations of e-mail, and yet I feel like Ive met real people. Ifound
every character on TT interesting and memorable, and enjoyed the different
flavours and the occasional anecdotal glimpses into peoples lives.
I'dlove to meet you all face to face. In the eschaton if not before!



Thank you, Lance, for introducing me to
TT and encouraging me to participate--anact sobeautifully typical
ofyou.But I especially want to thank David:you relentlessly
engaged everybody, no matter how intractable, and even at your crazy-makingest
you had the best manners of all--or at least made the best show of manners! J To me, the act of
keeping this forumso wide open as long as you did, and the latitude you
have given people to be themselves, show abroadnessabove and beyond
your wordsthat commands my respect.



Just to irritate some of you, I was going
to finish with an excerpt quoting Bonhoeffer on how we reflect Christ to each
other, from the chapter I've just finished working on in Victor's book.
Instead, here's something less lofty, which for me is a kind of parable for TT:



I'm watching my husbandgently
heaveour sleeping youngest son up from the living room couch where he has
repaired in frustration at his brother's endless,irritating snores. He
had taken his pillow and blankets thereafter incrementally severe degrees
of poking and bedshaking had failed to correct his brother's breathing. But now
hefalls forward into his dad's arms, willingly allows himself to be
moved, and wakes up as he is conducted by hands on his shoulders back to his
ownbed. He crawls in beneath the bunk of his brother who snores
impenitently on, and settles back to sleep. This is repeated twoor three
times a week, but is always forgotten in the morning, and neitherbrother
will tolerate talk of separate bedrooms.



Open hands, everybody, and Jude 24 
25.



Love

Debbie







--
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.1.385 / Virus Database: 268.3.1/291 - Release Date: 3/24/2006

RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

So, here we are, back to the fact that IF you believed something to be true
you would NOT want children to be taught about it.  Can you see why some of
us aren't following your logic? iz

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2006 5:28 AM
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

IZ:No, I would not.

- Original Message - 
From: ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: March 25, 2006 06:14
Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

 Dodging the question, as usual.  iz

 -Original Message-
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir
 Sent: Friday, March 24, 2006 4:54 PM
 To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

 It ain't true. It's a hyperbolic hypothetical, Iz.

 .
 - Original Message - 
 From: ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
 Sent: March 24, 2006 17:16
 Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

 That wasn't the question; I asked whether IF you believe it were true, 
 you
 would want it taught in schools.  You said NO.  Pathetic, eh? iz

 -Original Message-
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir
 Sent: Friday, March 24, 2006 3:49 PM
 To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

 David you are like so right, man! familiaritycontempt...were those 
 the
 words? Probably got it comin'.

 Actually Lady Iz, I prefer that untruth NOT be taught in schools (i.e.
 creationism)

 - Original Message - 
 From: ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
 Sent: March 24, 2006 16:35
 Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

 So you prefer that untruth be taught in schools.  That's all that's 
 left.
 Pathetic IMO.  izzy

 -Original Message-
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir
 Sent: Friday, March 24, 2006 3:25 AM
 To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

 Still no.

 - Original Message - 
 From: ShieldsFamily [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
 Sent: March 23, 2006 23:04
 Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

 If you thought it was true would you want it taught in schools, Lance?
 JD?
 izzy

 -Original Message-
 From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lance Muir
 Sent: Thursday, March 23, 2006 3:32 PM
 To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

 David:Is that all you were meaning to say concerning RW? If that's it
 then,
 I'm with RW on this one. I don't think it should be taught in schools
 either.

 - Original Message - 
 From: David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
 Sent: March 23, 2006 15:04
 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

 The CNN report:  Asked if creationism should be taught in schools,
 Williams
 said: I don't think it should, actually. No, no.

 So how have I mischaracterized him?

 David Miller

 - Original Message - 
 From: Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
 Sent: Wednesday, March 22, 2006 10:41 AM
 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

 David:YIKES!! You mischaracterize both Williams and his position.
 DOUBLE
 YIKES!! I know that you will continue to do so. You are truly trapped,
 David. You've bound yourself with your own theology (not, as you
 believe,
 Scripture). Your teachers will one day answer for what they've done to
 you
 and, what you now do to others.Yikes! Yikes! Yikes (that'd be triple
 yikes)
 - Original Message - 
 From: David Miller [EMAIL PROTECTED]
 To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
 Sent: March 22, 2006 10:25
 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Williams on Creationism

 Lance wrote:
 If Williams is a 'liberal loonie' then
 you are a 'sectarian loonie' , David.

 I'm sectarian only in the sense that the holy and the profane ought 
 to
 be
 separate.  I am not sectarian within the group of those who have
 submitted
 unto Jesus Christ as their Lord and Savior.

 Lance wrote:
 He is a brother in Christ who believes
 differently than you on some matters.
 Now, if that makes him what you say
 then, that makes you what I say.

 He is not a liberal loony for believing differently from me.  The
 moniker
 was offered because of his statement about how acknowledgement of our
 Creator did not belong in schools.  He made an irrational statement,
 assuming that CNN reported him accurately.  If he is a brother in
 Christ,
 then I expect to hear a retraction or clarification made soon as 
 other
 believers correct him.  If he is not a brother in Christ, then he 
 will
 continue to support the working of iniquity that seeks to remove

Re: [TruthTalk] Creationism




..mutual mouthymale 
mashing

On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 04:32:50 -0700 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  myth (feminists' rhetoric) 
  
  
  
  
||

On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 ..Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
writes:

  
  ..Let God be 
  true and every man a liar
-

..Funny 
how some guys take a false assumption to the extreme, hey Judy? 
iz

RE: [TruthTalk] Creationism









Wow; now we are accused of being feminists.
LOL! iz











From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2006
5:33 AM
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk]
Creationism







myth (feminists' rhetoric) 



















||











On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 ..Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:







..Let God be true and every man a liar







-











..Funny how some guys take a false
assumption to the extreme, hey Judy? iz

Re: [TruthTalk] Divine Contingent Order




(good nite--thx for the subtle 
reminder:)

On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 11:34:25 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  z
  
  -- 
Original message -- From: Judy Taylor 
[EMAIL PROTECTED] 

Why? What do they do for you?
It's all about him, his thoughts, his opinions, the 
movies he sees, etc. etc.

On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 01:09:26 + [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

  :-) I shall miss these pithy responses. 
  jd
  
  From: 
"Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] 

After reading you, I'm inclined toward a 
YES!

  From: Kevin Deegan 
  Was it a BIG 
  Bang?Lance Muir [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  wrote: 
  



When one seeks to apply the latter onto 
the former one is simply stymied. In failing to apprehend this one 
bangs one's head against the proverbial 
  wall.
  
  
  Blab-away for as little as 1¢/min. Make PC-to-Phone 
  Calls using Yahoo! Messenger with Voice.

Re: [TruthTalk] Fw: Goodbye, and thanks for all the ichthys


Amen and thank you. 

John

-- Original message -- From: "Lance Muir" [EMAIL PROTECTED] 




- Original Message - 
From: Debbie Sawczak 
To: 'Lance Muir' 
Sent: March 24, 2006 21:02
Subject: Goodbye, and thanks for all the ichthys


I was afraid this was too long, but David's leisurely post has given me courage to blather a little, like the parting guest who suddenly becomes talkative in the doorway. 

Im glad for the time I spent on TT, even though I left. I did learn stuff, especially early on as I encounteredsomeideas for the first time;certain posts, especially at the beginning, opened windows for me. Even some of themore plodding discussionswere an occasion for clarifying my own thinking or, alternatively, fuzzifying it if it was a little too sharp! And that may have been the best benefit of TT. 

I remember being surprised at the very beginning by the aggressivenessa newish thing for me among believers even though Ive moved in a wide variety of Christian circles. The exposure wasnt all bad--it made me a bit more assertive and thicker-skinned, and forced me to recognize how easily I can be provoked to snarkiness myself. ButI often felt sad after an exchange. Sometimes, on the other hand, I was completely taken aback by the generosity and affirmation in people's responses. So I hope thatifthe experience has made me less naive aboutthe behaviour of Christians, it hasn't gone so far as to make me cynical.I still think I might havemisunderstood the culture of TT...I'mnot very astute that way.<
/FONT>

Ive seen something of the serious limitations of e-mail, and yet I feel like Ive met real people. Ifound every character on TT interesting and memorable, and enjoyed the different flavours and the occasional anecdotal glimpses into peoples lives. I'dlove to meet you all face to face. In the eschaton if not before!

Thank you, Lance, for introducing me to TT and encouraging me to participate--anact sobeautifully typical ofyou.But I especially want to thank David:you relentlessly engaged everybody, no matter how intractable, and even at your crazy-makingest you had the best manners of all--or at least made the best show of manners! J To me, the act of keeping this forumso wide open as long as you did, and the latitude you have given people to be themselves, show abroadnessabove and beyond your wordsthat commands my respect.

Just to irritate some of you, I was going to finish with an excerpt quoting Bonhoeffer on how we reflect Christ to each other, from the chapter I've just finished working on in Victor's book. Instead, here's something less lofty, which for me is a kind of parable for TT:

I'm watching my husbandgently heaveour sleeping youngest son up from the living room couch where he has repaired in frustration at his brother's endless,irritating snores. He had taken his pillow and blankets thereafter incrementally severe degrees of poking and bedshaking had failed to correct his brother's breathing. But now hefalls forward into his dad's arms, willingly allows himself to be moved, and wakes up as he is conducted by hands on his shoulders back to his ownbed. He crawls in beneath the bunk of his brother who snores impenitently on, and sett
les back to sleep. This is repeated twoor three times a week, but is always forgotten in the morning, and neitherbrother will tolerate talk of separate bedrooms.

Open hands, everybody, and Jude 24  25.

Love
Debbie

--No virus found in this outgoing message.Checked by AVG Free Edition.Version: 7.1.385 / Virus Database: 268.3.1/291 - Release Date: 3/24/2006

Re: [TruthTalk] Creationism




..yer Words iz yer bond(age) 
Babe

On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 05:38:47 -0600 "ShieldsFamily" [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
writes:

  
  Wow; now we are 
  accused of being feminists. LOL! iz
  
  
  
  
  
  From: 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  On Behalf Of 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2006 5:33 
  AMTo: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.orgSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] 
  Creationism
  
  
  myth (feminists' rhetoric) 
  
  
  
  
  
  

||



On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 ..Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
writes:

  
  ..Let God be true and every man a 
  liar

-



..Funny how some 
guys take a false assumption to the extreme, hey Judy? 
iz

[TruthTalk]









From WorldNetDaily.com:

Rome, 22 March (AKI) - Abdul Rahman,
the man condemned to death for having abandoned Islam, is just one of many
Afghanis who decide to convert to Christianity, but most are forced to do so
secretly, argues Arab Christian author Camille Eid. In an interview with
Adnkronos International (AKI) Eid, author of The Christians who come from
Islam, said during a recent trip to Afghanistan he met many similar
cases. They are Christians who have sprung out of nowhere and it's unclear
how they have decided by themselves to convert he added. The US, Italy, Germany
and Canada
have all expressed concern over the fate of Rahman who converted to
Christianity 16 years ago. 

I also spoke to a priest who had passed through Kabul and he said he was amazed that women
sitting on the ground at the local market saw he was a foreigner and a
Christian, by the cross he was wearing, and attracted his attention to them by
making a sign of the cross with their fingers. He was convinced that they were
trying to send him a coded message said Eid, a Lebanese Maronite who
lives in Italy.

According to the author, Abdul Rahman is not the first Afghan citizen to have
been sentenced to death for apostasy since the fall of the Taliban regime. 

The Islamic Taliban militias who still control entire areas of the
country issued a statement in June 2004 in which they referred to a death
sentence handed down to an Afghan converted to Christianity, Moulawi Asad
Allah.

RE: [TruthTalk] Creationism









Mealy mouthed male.











From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2006
5:37 AM
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk]
Creationism







..mutual mouthymale mashing











On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 04:32:50 -0700 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:







myth (feminists' rhetoric) 



















||











On Sat, 25 Mar 2006 ..Judy Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:







..Let God be true and every man a liar







-











..Funny how some guys take a false
assumption to the extreme, hey Judy? iz

[TruthTalk] Lack of Sleep Led to Dinosaurs' Demise