[libreoffice-users] Re: Opening Files in Writer
Hi Keith: As I understand things, it is, in fact, possible to see a listing of the files on an unmounted drive - it just isn't possible to open them. What is *supposed* to happen is that Writer will automatically mount the drive when you elect to open a file on that drive (assuming the drive is not already mounted of course) - this is the behavior of the other LibreOffice Apps (such as Calc, for instance) and can easily be demonstrated. It turns out that the behavior I was describing was, in fact, a bug, as you can see from the responses posted by the developer earlier in this thread. Windows, of course, does mount everything it can find at boot. My objection was not so much that the drives got mounted, but in the way the drives mounted in that way were presented in Nautilus (like second class citizens, but placed more prominently than the Ubuntu drives with unmount buttons and so forth). After far more searching on the web than I would have expected, I've subsequently discovered how to accomplish this to my satisfaction, however, and I now have MOST of the drives auto-mount when Ubuntu starts up. The one exception is the Windows root drive, since I wish to preclude the possibility of accidentally using that drive while in Ubuntu. When you think about it, that's also how Windows works (it doesn't see or recognize the Ubuntu root drive because it doesn't know about ext-type formats). But thanks for thinking of me - the idea that someone could bring up a problem in Illinois to a group of users in Australia is something that probably wouldn't happen in the Windows world. ... and, of course, G'Day to you and your mates as well. -- View this message in context: http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/Opening-Files-in-Writer-tp4006889p4009587.html Sent from the Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com. -- For unsubscribe instructions e-mail to: users+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-users] Re: Opening Files in Writer
Hi :) Mounting it at boot relies on the Ntfs partition not stuffing-up. If it stuffs up then the boot-up gets quite grumbly and unhappy, particularly fstab. It's better to use your file-browser to bookmark certain folders on the Ntfs and then try those bookmarks after boot-up is over and the machien has settled down. Regards from Tom :) From: Keith Bainbridge keithrbaugro...@gmail.com To: users@global.libreoffice.org Sent: Thursday, 27 September 2012, 11:28 Subject: Re: [libreoffice-users] Re: Opening Files in Writer On Tue, 25 Sep 2012 22:35:33 +0200 Ferry Toth ft...@telfort.nl wrote: When I start Writer (in Ubuntu), and choose File|Open, I am able to see and select files on the NTFS drives, but when I select one to open, Writer simply disappears. G'day All. I was at a LUG last night and raised this with a couple of the more knowledgeable members. They agreed that it is not possible to see the file in the file|open browser if the partition is not mounted. Is it possible that you are opening the file from the recent files listing? We then threw around your objection to auto mounting the partition. Seems to us that windows will mount it at boot, so why are you resisting mounting it at boot? All the best Regards Keith Bainbridge PO Box 324 BELMONT Vic 3216 Australia +61 (0)408 522 706 keith.bainbridge.3...@gmail.com -- For unsubscribe instructions e-mail to: users+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- For unsubscribe instructions e-mail to: users+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-users] Re: Opening Files in Writer
Hi :) It's fairly unlikely that you would accidentally save or use things from a Windows drive (really an Ntfs partition on a drive but Windows calls partitions drives in order to dumb things down so that even all us stupid users can understand. They aren't being patronising at all. It's just that they are superior. So, a drive that has multiple partitions starts being really confusing) If your Windows partitions are not mounted as /home /home/username/Documents or anything like that then to access the drive would take deliberate effort. You would probably notice. Also the folder structure is radically different on Windows. Everything is My Documents or Tim's Documents and folders such as My Pictures are inside My Documents (or Tim's or whoever) adding an extra unnecessary layer in the folder structure. In GnuLinux the structure tends to be less hierarchical. Mounting an Ntfs partition is usually fairly easy. Just click on the Places menu or open any folder. Usually there is a pane down the left-hand-side showing Places (including all your bookmarked folders) rather than the folder-tree. Windows tends to show something similar now but their one is less useful so people tend to ignore it or remove it. Partitions tend to appear in there. It helps if those partitions have labels such as Windows drive otherwise it says things like 1.56843 Tb File-system or something equally meaningless. However, i think i agree with mounting it at boot-up. DEFINITELY back-up or just create a copy of fstab BEFORE editing it and make sure you can use a LiveCd if things go wrong. Fstab is an unusually pedantic file and freaks out a bit too easily sometimes in which case you'll want to copy the back-up over the top of your edited one. It is a text-file so it's reasonably easy to edit. Regards from Tom :) From: CVAlkan fobe...@enteract.com To: users@global.libreoffice.org Sent: Thursday, 27 September 2012, 13:44 Subject: [libreoffice-users] Re: Opening Files in Writer Hi Keith: As I understand things, it is, in fact, possible to see a listing of the files on an unmounted drive - it just isn't possible to open them. What is *supposed* to happen is that Writer will automatically mount the drive when you elect to open a file on that drive (assuming the drive is not already mounted of course) - this is the behavior of the other LibreOffice Apps (such as Calc, for instance) and can easily be demonstrated. It turns out that the behavior I was describing was, in fact, a bug, as you can see from the responses posted by the developer earlier in this thread. Windows, of course, does mount everything it can find at boot. My objection was not so much that the drives got mounted, but in the way the drives mounted in that way were presented in Nautilus (like second class citizens, but placed more prominently than the Ubuntu drives with unmount buttons and so forth). After far more searching on the web than I would have expected, I've subsequently discovered how to accomplish this to my satisfaction, however, and I now have MOST of the drives auto-mount when Ubuntu starts up. The one exception is the Windows root drive, since I wish to preclude the possibility of accidentally using that drive while in Ubuntu. When you think about it, that's also how Windows works (it doesn't see or recognize the Ubuntu root drive because it doesn't know about ext-type formats). But thanks for thinking of me - the idea that someone could bring up a problem in Illinois to a group of users in Australia is something that probably wouldn't happen in the Windows world. ... and, of course, G'Day to you and your mates as well. -- View this message in context: http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/Opening-Files-in-Writer-tp4006889p4009587.html Sent from the Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com. -- For unsubscribe instructions e-mail to: users+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- For unsubscribe instructions e-mail to: users+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
[libreoffice-users] Re: Opening Files in Writer
Thanks for the comments. As for Windows' folder organization (Also the folder structure is radically different on Windows.) , I can only say NOT ON MY MACHINE! This whole puerile concept of My this and My that is, in my humble opinion, rather bone-headed and makes a number of unwarranted assumptions about the many varied uses of a computer. This is precisely why I have several Windows partitions that I have carried over to Ubuntu. For example, if you have projects or hobbies that you wish to keep organized such as (to name a few of mine) Genealogy, Development, and Photography, does it make sense to have subdirectories/folders for each of these projects under My Documents, My Pictures and so forth, or to have (in my case) entire partitions devoted to each project (which, by the way makes for much easier backups, since I tend to work on one subject for a time to the exclusion of the others)? In my case, under Genealogy, I have subfolders for record images that I've scanned or otherwise obtained (My Pictures just seems like a lame, inaccurate, and vague description although that's where the file extension suggests to Windows it should be dumped), documents I've written, photographs I've taken in cemeteries and other places of interest around the world (would this be My Pictures-2 in Windows parlance?). There are many, many subfolders under this one subject, and I sure don't want to intermingle these files with my financial records, PL/SQL code, Music files, etc. etc. So, I very early on attempted to ignore Windows' mandated structure (even My Downloads, which I keep segregated so that I don't need to sift through various utility installation programs to locate German census sheets from the mid-nineteenth century and so forth). I think it's nice that they attempt to help the user get organized, but I find that they're just simply not that good at that themselves, so I'd rather not have their help. My Music is another lame and vague category. I have, as I guess most folks do, a collection of music that I listen to on the computer (e.g. mp3's and such), but I also have a collection of music scores (some of my own - MuseScore is a terrific program by the way - and many by my pals J.S.Bach and Charles-Valentin Alkan that I have obtained in order to attempt some greater understanding of their particular genius). Music is, of course, a nice generic description of each of these two groups of files, but doesn't at all help distinguish them, and I certainly don't wish to intermingle them. I now realize this has degenerated into a discussion that's way off topic, and more appropriate for some other forum (and for that I apologize), but - this whole wish to get things organized in a way that makes sense to me and is convenient from a file management standpoint is what started this whole discussion. I'm only sorry that Ubuntu seems to have been a little infected by this Windows approach, although they are much nicer about it (Windows howls like crazy each time I attempt to thwart its control over what even Microsoft calls (MY documents). Again, apologies for the rant, and have a great day. -- View this message in context: http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/Opening-Files-in-Writer-tp4006889p4009687.html Sent from the Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com. -- For unsubscribe instructions e-mail to: users+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-users] Re: Opening Files in Writer
On Thu, 27 Sep 2012 15:11:43 +0100 (BST) Tom Davies tomdavie...@yahoo.co.uk wrote: Mounting it at boot relies on the Ntfs partition not stuffing-up. If it stuffs up then the boot-up gets quite grumbly and unhappy, particularly fstab. G'day Tom, The NTFS mounting process must haved deteriorated since I used it. I don't recall such problems when I had to use ntfs-3g only a couple of years ago. Or are you talking about the difficulties when people unplug a USB device without unmounting it? Regards Keith Bainbridge PO Box 324 BELMONT Vic 3216 Australia +61 (0)408 522 706 keith.bainbridge.3...@gmail.com -- For unsubscribe instructions e-mail to: users+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-users] Re: Opening Files in Writer
On Thu, 27 Sep 2012 05:44:19 -0700 (PDT) CVAlkan fobe...@enteract.com wrote: As I understand things, it is, in fact, possible to see a listing of the files on an unmounted drive - it just isn't possible to open them. G'day I'll have to test this somehow - another time though. Regards Keith Bainbridge PO Box 324 BELMONT Vic 3216 Australia +61 (0)408 522 706 keith.bainbridge.3...@gmail.com -- For unsubscribe instructions e-mail to: users+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
[libreoffice-users] Re: Opening Files in Writer
Mas, Jay: Thanks for the responses; I'll add info to have the drives mounted at boot time for the time being. After further experiments, however, I believe more strongly that the behavior I describe qualifies as a Bug. Here's why: A) If one attempts the exact same sequence of file loading with Calc, the behavior is exactly what anyone would reasonably expect. Specifically, if after confirming in Nautilus that a specfic partition is NOT mounted, you open Calc and then go through the File|Open sequence on the unmounted partition, the file is loaded with no problem. If you then return to Nautilus, you will see that the partition is now mounted. So, at the very least, there is an inconsistency between the operation of Calc and Writer. B) To further illustrate why the behavior I describe is user-hostile, load Writer normally, and then (by any means) load a few documents that reside on a normally-mounted partition. If you then choose to open a file that resides on an unmounted partition, Writer still disappears as I described, as do the other documents that were open. When restarting Writer, the documents are all waiting for recovery, of course, but you can see where an unsuspecting user's stress level might rise. C) Last, but not least, presenting a File not found or similar message would seem much more appropriate than simply shutting down the application. But, the helpful approach would be to mount the drive and load the file - just as Calc does. So, being new to Ubuntu and the world of open source, I'm not sure how to go about reporting this officially and would appreciate a quick tutorial. Thanks again ... -- View this message in context: http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/Opening-Files-in-Writer-tp4006889p4006989.html Sent from the Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com. -- For unsubscribe instructions e-mail to: users+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-users] Re: Opening Files in Writer
I went to my dual boot system and attempted to duplicate the issue under version 3.5. When I attempted to open a ntfs file the file manager in Ubuntu automount the partition without any problem. The file also loaded. Now to compare apples to apples I am going to force upgrade my version to the latest libreoffice version 3.6 . I will report back shortly Mas On Wed, Sep 12, 2012 at 7:09 AM, CVAlkan fobe...@enteract.com wrote: Mas, Jay: Thanks for the responses; I'll add info to have the drives mounted at boot time for the time being. After further experiments, however, I believe more strongly that the behavior I describe qualifies as a Bug. Here's why: A) If one attempts the exact same sequence of file loading with Calc, the behavior is exactly what anyone would reasonably expect. Specifically, if after confirming in Nautilus that a specfic partition is NOT mounted, you open Calc and then go through the File|Open sequence on the unmounted partition, the file is loaded with no problem. If you then return to Nautilus, you will see that the partition is now mounted. So, at the very least, there is an inconsistency between the operation of Calc and Writer. B) To further illustrate why the behavior I describe is user-hostile, load Writer normally, and then (by any means) load a few documents that reside on a normally-mounted partition. If you then choose to open a file that resides on an unmounted partition, Writer still disappears as I described, as do the other documents that were open. When restarting Writer, the documents are all waiting for recovery, of course, but you can see where an unsuspecting user's stress level might rise. C) Last, but not least, presenting a File not found or similar message would seem much more appropriate than simply shutting down the application. But, the helpful approach would be to mount the drive and load the file - just as Calc does. So, being new to Ubuntu and the world of open source, I'm not sure how to go about reporting this officially and would appreciate a quick tutorial. Thanks again ... -- View this message in context: http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/Opening-Files-in-Writer-tp4006889p4006989.html Sent from the Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com. -- For unsubscribe instructions e-mail to: users+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- -- Masekela Walls Web Security Analyst | Senior Server Administrator Powserve.com / Gemini ISP Networks -- For unsubscribe instructions e-mail to: users+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
Re: [libreoffice-users] Re: Opening Files in Writer
I confirmed this is a bug with Writer 3.6 and 3.6.1 . A bug ticket has been opened under https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=54827 Feel free to add your name to the cc list to be updated once the issue has been resolved. Thanks for bringing this up. Mas On Wed, Sep 12, 2012 at 5:01 PM, Mas tier3supp...@gmail.com wrote: I went to my dual boot system and attempted to duplicate the issue under version 3.5. When I attempted to open a ntfs file the file manager in Ubuntu automount the partition without any problem. The file also loaded. Now to compare apples to apples I am going to force upgrade my version to the latest libreoffice version 3.6 . I will report back shortly Mas On Wed, Sep 12, 2012 at 7:09 AM, CVAlkan fobe...@enteract.com wrote: Mas, Jay: Thanks for the responses; I'll add info to have the drives mounted at boot time for the time being. After further experiments, however, I believe more strongly that the behavior I describe qualifies as a Bug. Here's why: A) If one attempts the exact same sequence of file loading with Calc, the behavior is exactly what anyone would reasonably expect. Specifically, if after confirming in Nautilus that a specfic partition is NOT mounted, you open Calc and then go through the File|Open sequence on the unmounted partition, the file is loaded with no problem. If you then return to Nautilus, you will see that the partition is now mounted. So, at the very least, there is an inconsistency between the operation of Calc and Writer. B) To further illustrate why the behavior I describe is user-hostile, load Writer normally, and then (by any means) load a few documents that reside on a normally-mounted partition. If you then choose to open a file that resides on an unmounted partition, Writer still disappears as I described, as do the other documents that were open. When restarting Writer, the documents are all waiting for recovery, of course, but you can see where an unsuspecting user's stress level might rise. C) Last, but not least, presenting a File not found or similar message would seem much more appropriate than simply shutting down the application. But, the helpful approach would be to mount the drive and load the file - just as Calc does. So, being new to Ubuntu and the world of open source, I'm not sure how to go about reporting this officially and would appreciate a quick tutorial. Thanks again ... -- View this message in context: http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/Opening-Files-in-Writer-tp4006889p4006989.html Sent from the Users mailing list archive at Nabble.com. -- For unsubscribe instructions e-mail to: users+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted -- -- Masekela Walls Web Security Analyst | Senior Server Administrator Powserve.com / Gemini ISP Networks -- -- Masekela Walls Web Security Analyst | Senior Server Administrator Powserve.com / Gemini ISP Networks -- For unsubscribe instructions e-mail to: users+h...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
