Re: [libreoffice-users] Re: LEBRE VERSION STILL

[Peter Nikolic]

On Thu, 5 Nov 2015 18:25:23 +0100
Gabriele Ponzo  wrote:

> 2015-11-05 17:20 GMT+01:00 Ken Springer :
> 
> > I don't have money to pay to have it fixed (one of the reasons I
> > try to use open source/free software),
> >
> 
> That should be the last reason to choose Open Source Software… I can
> understand it, since it was the same for me in the far 90's, but
> sooner or later you should go deeper and try understanding the
> principles behind OSS.
> 
> I'm not anyone's beta tester.   
> >
> > So you'd want a perfect product, without paying money nor time to
> > commit
> somehow (just like beta testing or translating or whatever else
> commitment)?
> 
> 
> > Which is why I've just started trying FreeOffice from Softmaker.
> > Do I know for a fact it will do what I need?  No, that's why I'm
> > trying it out.   If FreeOffice doesn't do it, there are others
> > to try.   :-)
> >
> 
> Well, maybe you'll find a free "product" that suites your needs,
> possibly not open, so that you'll be locked in its own encoding cage.
> 
> Please respect people of the community and avoid insulting with your
> requirements about taking without giving anything back.
> ---
> Gabriele Ponzo
> 

+1 ...


PG ..


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Re: [libreoffice-users] Re: LEBRE VERSION STILL

[Charles-H. Schulz]

Hello Ken,

Le 05.11.2015 11:24, Ken Springer a écrit :

On 11/5/15 12:12 AM, toki wrote:

On 05/11/2015 04:24, Ken Springer wrote:

While some bug may be deemed trivial by the devs or some system, that 
bug may not be trivial to the user.


That is why individuals and organization purchase Tier 3 support
contracts. It does matter if the software is FLOSS, or non-FLOSS, the
only way to ensure that issues that the user considers to be serious
flaws/bugs, is by either fixing the issue themselves, or paying 
somebody

to fix the issue.


Or by going elsewhere, using someone else's product.  :-)



Of course, especially given that LibreOffice is not a product but a 
community. A product comes with warranties and things such as support 
contract. It also comes with a price tag. That being said, nobody's 
working for free; do you? Using someone else's products will require 
them at some point to purchase something (a license, a support contract, 
etc.)


Cheers,

Charles.

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Re: [libreoffice-users] Re: LEBRE VERSION STILL

[Charles-H. Schulz]

Just for the general information of the list, professional support is 
available for LibreOffice: 
https://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/professional-support/
... As well as what this list and other channels are used for, community 
support:  https://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/community-support/


Best,

Charles.


Le 05.11.2015 16:36, jorge a écrit :

Hi all:

As I understand LO has an area of support buying it,... I'm not sure.
Or someone here can give him support trying agree price in a private
way ... try to help him if someone has time and knowledge; is my
suggestion.

LO has Merchandise, hansn't it ? What is their funtion if not sell
something ?

Regards,

Jorge Rodríguez




El jue, 05-11-2015 a las 11:49 +0100, Charles-H. Schulz escribió:

Hello Ken,

Le 05.11.2015 11:24, Ken Springer a écrit :
> On 11/5/15 12:12 AM, toki wrote:
>> On 05/11/2015 04:24, Ken Springer wrote:
>>
>>> While some bug may be deemed trivial by the devs or some system, that
>>> bug may not be trivial to the user.
>>
>> That is why individuals and organization purchase Tier 3 support
>> contracts. It does matter if the software is FLOSS, or non-FLOSS, the
>> only way to ensure that issues that the user considers to be serious
>> flaws/bugs, is by either fixing the issue themselves, or paying
>> somebody
>> to fix the issue.
>
> Or by going elsewhere, using someone else's product.  :-)
>

Of course, especially given that LibreOffice is not a product but a
community. A product comes with warranties and things such as support
contract. It also comes with a price tag. That being said, nobody's
working for free; do you? Using someone else's products will require
them at some point to purchase something (a license, a support 
contract,

etc.)

Cheers,

Charles.



--
Atentamente,

Jorge Rodríguez



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Re: [libreoffice-users] Re: LEBRE VERSION STILL

[Gabriele Ponzo]

2015-11-05 17:20 GMT+01:00 Ken Springer :

> I don't have money to pay to have it fixed (one of the reasons I try to
> use open source/free software),
>

That should be the last reason to choose Open Source Software… I can
understand it, since it was the same for me in the far 90's, but sooner or
later you should go deeper and try understanding the principles behind OSS.

I'm not anyone's beta tester.   
>
> So you'd want a perfect product, without paying money nor time to commit
somehow (just like beta testing or translating or whatever else commitment)?


> Which is why I've just started trying FreeOffice from Softmaker.  Do I
> know for a fact it will do what I need?  No, that's why I'm trying it out.
>If FreeOffice doesn't do it, there are others to try.   :-)
>

Well, maybe you'll find a free "product" that suites your needs, possibly
not open, so that you'll be locked in its own encoding cage.

Please respect people of the community and avoid insulting with your
requirements about taking without giving anything back.
---
Gabriele Ponzo

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Re: [libreoffice-users] Re: LEBRE VERSION STILL

[jorge]

Hi all:

As I understand LO has an area of support buying it,... I'm not sure.
Or someone here can give him support trying agree price in a private
way ... try to help him if someone has time and knowledge; is my
suggestion.

LO has Merchandise, hansn't it ? What is their funtion if not sell
something ?

Regards,

Jorge Rodríguez

 


El jue, 05-11-2015 a las 11:49 +0100, Charles-H. Schulz escribió:
> Hello Ken,
> 
> Le 05.11.2015 11:24, Ken Springer a écrit :
> > On 11/5/15 12:12 AM, toki wrote:
> >> On 05/11/2015 04:24, Ken Springer wrote:
> >> 
> >>> While some bug may be deemed trivial by the devs or some system, that 
> >>> bug may not be trivial to the user.
> >> 
> >> That is why individuals and organization purchase Tier 3 support
> >> contracts. It does matter if the software is FLOSS, or non-FLOSS, the
> >> only way to ensure that issues that the user considers to be serious
> >> flaws/bugs, is by either fixing the issue themselves, or paying 
> >> somebody
> >> to fix the issue.
> > 
> > Or by going elsewhere, using someone else's product.  :-)
> > 
> 
> Of course, especially given that LibreOffice is not a product but a 
> community. A product comes with warranties and things such as support 
> contract. It also comes with a price tag. That being said, nobody's 
> working for free; do you? Using someone else's products will require 
> them at some point to purchase something (a license, a support contract, 
> etc.)
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Charles.
> 

-- 
Atentamente,

Jorge Rodríguez


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Re: [libreoffice-users] Re: LEBRE VERSION STILL

[toki]

On 05/11/2015 10:24, Ken Springer wrote:
> Or by going elsewhere, using someone else's product.  :-)


All software has bugs.
The issue is whether one wants to use the software whose bugs one knows,
(which is why I use something that the developers specifically proclaim
is not suitable for use as an email client, despite being marketed as
such, to read my email(^1))  or software whose bugs one does not know.

^1: Two different software developers for this not-an-email-client have
assured me that even if the patch to convert it to an email client were
submitted, it would be rejected on principle,because the software is
emphatically not an email client.)

jonathon


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Re: [libreoffice-users] Re: LEBRE VERSION STILL

[Cley Faye]

2015-11-05 1:28 GMT+01:00 Ken Springer :

> If you want to go head to head with with MS or Corel, then you'll have to
> fix the problems your uses have with the program.


​It's been pointed out already, and I'll reproduce it here:

If this is a bug your options are:
> 1. Fix it yourself;
> 2. Pay for a fix;
> 3. Find a friend/family member to fix it;
> 4. Wait patiently until a volunteer *chooses* to fix it.

​
​Really, as with any opensource project, every resource is finite,
including dev time. What get prioritized by the main devs is (in no
particular order, this is a general remark not specific to LibreOffice)
bugs affecting a very large part of the userbase, trivial issues to fix
(those are rare!), and things that devs are interested in. This also mean
that problems users have with the program do get fixed (just check the
bugtracker).

Beyond that, asking for an opensource project to dedicate resources to fix
a minor issue that is unnoticed by almost everyone (or, in the case of this
thread, something that is not even a bug in LibreOffice) is not reasonable.
If one encounter a particularly nasty issue and can't raise interest in it,
there are companies that can fix them for a price. It have happened before,
and I don't doubt that it will continue to happen.

Note that I'm not even touching the subject of those big corporations
reactivity with minor issues; commercial products might have more
ressources, but I'm sure there's a fair number of minor bugs that have left
some users disgruntled ;)

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Re: [libreoffice-users] Re: LEBRE VERSION STILL

[toki]

On 05/11/2015 04:24, Ken Springer wrote:

> While some bug may be deemed trivial by the devs or some system, that bug may 
> not be trivial to the user.

That is why individuals and organization purchase Tier 3 support
contracts. It does matter if the software is FLOSS, or non-FLOSS, the
only way to ensure that issues that the user considers to be serious
flaws/bugs, is by either fixing the issue themselves, or paying somebody
to fix the issue.

jonathon


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