Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] National Museum, New Delhi
Hey, I might be able to help you out identifying the work. What info do you need on these? On Wed, Jun 29, 2011 at 2:42 PM, Yann Forget yan...@gmail.com wrote: Hello, Do we have an official contact with the National Museum, New Delhi? There are interesting documents there which could add valuable information to Wikipedia and Commons, but they are copyrighted. Could we get a permission? In addition, I need some help for identifying some images: http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:King_and_his_army,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Rama_and_the_monkey_army,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Krishna_and_gopis,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Embroidery,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Sculpture,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Pottery,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg Thanks, Yann ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l -- Noopur Raval Student Arts and Aesthetics Jawaharlal Nehru University, New Delhi Ph: 9650567690 ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] National Museum, New Delhi
Yann, these images should be licensed as being in public domain as of now. How come you have claimed copyright? Warm regards, User:AshLin -- On Wed, Jun 29, 2011 at 2:42 PM, Yann Forget yan...@gmail.com wrote: Hello, Do we have an official contact with the National Museum, New Delhi? There are interesting documents there which could add valuable information to Wikipedia and Commons, but they are copyrighted. Could we get a permission? In addition, I need some help for identifying some images: http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:King_and_his_army,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Rama_and_the_monkey_army,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Krishna_and_gopis,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Embroidery,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Sculpture,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Pottery,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg Thanks, Yann ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] National Museum, New Delhi
On 29 June 2011 15:00, Ashwin Baindur ashwin.bain...@gmail.com wrote: Yann, these images should be licensed as being in public domain as of now. How come you have claimed copyright? Because he took them? Thank you. Best, Gautam http://social.prathambooks.org/ ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] National Museum, New Delhi
We have many people who scan images from books, etc. In those cases we give copyright as applicable, as public domain if they are old. Is the case different in case we take photos from art? Warm regards, Ashwin Baindur -- On Wed, Jun 29, 2011 at 3:01 PM, Gautam John gau...@prathambooks.orgwrote: On 29 June 2011 15:00, Ashwin Baindur ashwin.bain...@gmail.com wrote: Yann, these images should be licensed as being in public domain as of now. How come you have claimed copyright? Because he took them? Thank you. Best, Gautam http://social.prathambooks.org/ ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] National Museum, New Delhi
On 29 June 2011 15:15, Ashwin Baindur ashwin.bain...@gmail.com wrote: We have many people who scan images from books, etc. In those cases we give copyright as applicable, as public domain if they are old. Is the case different in case we take photos from art? Very much! A picture of the Mona Lisa is copyrightable. Even if the painting of the Mona Lisa is out of copyright. ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] National Museum, New Delhi
HmmI guess the choice is personal here - copyrightable captures that well. And if a copyright is chosen, perhaps sweat of the brow reasoning applies? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sweat_of_the_brow). anyways, the license chosen in this case is not restrictive. On 29-Jun-2011, at 11:46 AM, Gautam John gau...@prathambooks.org wrote: On 29 June 2011 15:15, Ashwin Baindur ashwin.bain...@gmail.com wrote: We have many people who scan images from books, etc. In those cases we give copyright as applicable, as public domain if they are old. Is the case different in case we take photos from art? Very much! A picture of the Mona Lisa is copyrightable. Even if the painting of the Mona Lisa is out of copyright. ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] National Museum, New Delhi
Hello, 2011/6/29 Ashwin Baindur ashwin.bain...@gmail.com: Yann, these images should be licensed as being in public domain as of now. How come you have claimed copyright? The policy is that photos of 3D work of art are copyritable. I changed the license for 2D work of art. Warm regards, User:AshLin Best regards, Yann ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] National Museum, New Delhi
Hello, 2011/6/29 Noopur noopur.ra...@gmail.com: Hey, I might be able to help you out identifying the work. What info do you need on these? More complete description, date, etc. Thanks for your help, Yann On Wed, Jun 29, 2011 at 2:42 PM, Yann Forget yan...@gmail.com wrote: Hello, Do we have an official contact with the National Museum, New Delhi? There are interesting documents there which could add valuable information to Wikipedia and Commons, but they are copyrighted. Could we get a permission? In addition, I need some help for identifying some images: http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:King_and_his_army,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Rama_and_the_monkey_army,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Krishna_and_gopis,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Embroidery,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Sculpture,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Pottery,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg Thanks, Yann -- Noopur Raval Student Arts and Aesthetics Jawaharlal Nehru University, New Delhi Ph: 9650567690 ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] National Museum, New Delhi
Noopur, please clarify about the difference between a camera photograph and a scanned photograph. I am not clear how a photograph automatically gains the status of a work of art, unless this is a legal definition and is not meant to be analysed from an 'artistic' point of view. On Wed, Jun 29, 2011 at 3:30 PM, Yann Forget yan...@gmail.com wrote: Hello, 2011/6/29 Noopur noopur.ra...@gmail.com: Hey, I might be able to help you out identifying the work. What info do you need on these? More complete description, date, etc. Thanks for your help, Yann On Wed, Jun 29, 2011 at 2:42 PM, Yann Forget yan...@gmail.com wrote: Hello, Do we have an official contact with the National Museum, New Delhi? There are interesting documents there which could add valuable information to Wikipedia and Commons, but they are copyrighted. Could we get a permission? In addition, I need some help for identifying some images: http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:King_and_his_army,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Rama_and_the_monkey_army,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Krishna_and_gopis,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Embroidery,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Sculpture,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Pottery,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg Thanks, Yann -- Noopur Raval Student Arts and Aesthetics Jawaharlal Nehru University, New Delhi Ph: 9650567690 ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l -- Vickram Fool On The Hill http://communicall.wordpress.com ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] National Museum, New Delhi
Hello, 2011/6/29 Noopur noopur.ra...@gmail.com: Hey, I might be able to help you out identifying the work. What info do you need on these? Here is an example with complete information: http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Vishnu_holding_lotus_flowers,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg Regards, Yann On Wed, Jun 29, 2011 at 2:42 PM, Yann Forget yan...@gmail.com wrote: Hello, Do we have an official contact with the National Museum, New Delhi? There are interesting documents there which could add valuable information to Wikipedia and Commons, but they are copyrighted. Could we get a permission? In addition, I need some help for identifying some images: http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:King_and_his_army,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Rama_and_the_monkey_army,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Krishna_and_gopis,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Embroidery,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Sculpture,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Pottery,_National_Museum,_New_Delhi.jpg Thanks, Yann ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] National Museum, New Delhi
On Wednesday 29 June 2011 03:16 PM, Gautam John wrote: Very much! A picture of the Mona Lisa is copyrightable. Even if the painting of the Mona Lisa is out of copyright. I normally would hold that this is so, and have done so for years. However, given the recent interpretations by the Delhi High Court of the Supreme Court decision in EBC v. Modak, I'm not so sure any more. I think it is now arguable that a plain photograph that is meant to merely be a representation of the underlying painting is not original, lacking skill and judgment (or modicum of creativity, based on which test you believe EBC v. Modak lays down as the test for 'originality').[1] I doubt any court would grant a scanner copyright over unedited scans. Regards, Pranesh [1]: While it is not arguable whether EBC v. Modak (INSC) lays down exercise of skill and judgment as the test for originality or modicum of creativity, it is very clear that it squarely rejects the older sweat of the brow test. -- Pranesh Prakash Programme Manager Centre for Internet and Society W: http://cis-india.org | T: +91 80 40926283 signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] National Museum, New Delhi
On Wednesday 29 June 2011 03:20 PM, Vickram Crishna wrote: It's an interesting point. A photograph of a piece of art or heritage cannot logically* claim copyright, but what about a picture of a friend standing in front of said piece of art/heritage? That is, undoubtedly, copyrightable (and hence, copyrighted as per our law). -- Pranesh Prakash Programme Manager Centre for Internet and Society W: http://cis-india.org | T: +91 80 40926283 signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] National Museum, New Delhi
On 29 June 2011 17:49, Pranesh Prakash pran...@cis-india.org wrote: Very much! A picture of the Mona Lisa is copyrightable. Even if the painting of the Mona Lisa is out of copyright. I normally would hold that this is so, and have done so for years. However, given the recent interpretations by the Delhi High Court of the Supreme Court decision in EBC v. Modak, I'm not so sure any more. I stand corrected. Thanks Pranesh. So the answer is now It depends? :D I doubt any court would grant a scanner copyright over unedited scans. Agreed. ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
[Wikimediaindia-l] National Museum in Delhi
Hello, I visited the National Museum in Delhi today and I have discovered that it contains a huge collection of arts which would be very interesting to have in Wikimedia Commons. I have a decent camera and a tripod, and I could spend some time taking photographs there, if the museum would allow. Would it be possible to contact them officially, either Hisham or someone from Wikimedia India? Regards, Yann ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] National Museum in Delhi
Hi Liam, 2011/3/10 Liam Wyatt liamwy...@gmail.com: Hi Yann, There is no shortage of museums that have huge collections of great stuff to photograph! :-) But yes, it would be good to get more Indian cultural heritage onto Wikimedia. According to the museum's website http://www.nationalmuseumindia.gov.in/ you can enter for 300rupees and are allowed to take photos for a further 300rupee fee. Presumably therefore, if you do buy this ticket, that means their policies allow people to take photos inside. I can't confirm this and it would be good if you would check for yourself so as to avoid any confrontations. I do not personally have any contacts at that museum and directly coordinating GLAM outreach relationships is not something that the Wikimedia Foundation can achieve. It is up to the local communities (and especially the chapters) to work out their best plans. I can help when necessary but we don't have any official capacity to contact anyone - we're just Wikimedians after all :-) Relatedly, I am working on the concept of the GLAM Ambassador who would have some kind of formal backing so they could get access to institutions, but this is a very young idea still. In the mean time I would suggest that, if you can confirm if they DO allow photography, that you go ahead and do it - but make sure that you also add their record/accession/item record number to the metadata when you upload it so that it can be tracked back to their catalogue. If they do NOT allow photography then it will be a longer process to form a relationship with them to either have them donate their own images or allow Wikimedians in for a specific photography event. Well, there are several problems with that. 1. In order to make good photographs, a tripod will be necessary. I doubt they will allow that for the usual fees. 2. Seeing the size of the museum, many days will be needed to take good photographs (not snapshots) of a sizeable portion of the museum. At 300 Rs. each, it would be expensive for me. Actually I might not need to pay that much, as I am a resident in India, and I am entitled to the Indian fees. 3. For some items, there might copyright issues to publish the resulting images under a free license. Sincerely, -Liam Regards, Yann wittylama.com/blog Peace, love metadata On 9 March 2011 16:44, Yann Forget yan...@gmail.com wrote: Hello, I visited the National Museum in Delhi today and I have discovered that it contains a huge collection of arts which would be very interesting to have in Wikimedia Commons. I have a decent camera and a tripod, and I could spend some time taking photographs there, if the museum would allow. Would it be possible to contact them officially, either Hisham or someone from Wikimedia India? Regards, Yann ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] National Museum in Delhi
Hi Yann and Liam: I'm trying to figure out a way to check on this but being based in Bangalore is a little bit of a limitation. I might be in Delhi early next week and am happy to drop by the Museum and speak with them. Unless, of course, there is someone in Delhi who can help as well, please? Thank you. Best, Gautam http://social.prathambooks.org/ ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] National Museum in Delhi
Hi Yann, I spoke with a friend who has been to the museum before. And then another journalist with FrenchTV is acquainted with you and your work with Ekta Parishad. On Thu, Mar 10, 2011 at 11:26 AM, Yann Forget yan...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Liam, 2011/3/10 Liam Wyatt liamwy...@gmail.com: Hi Yann, Well, there are several problems with that. 1. In order to make good photographs, a tripod will be necessary. I doubt they will allow that for the usual fees. The National Museum permits the use of tripods on Mondays (for no extra charge) and for other days a request for permission has to be filed with the administration. 2. Seeing the size of the museum, many days will be needed to take good photographs (not snapshots) of a sizeable portion of the museum. At 300 Rs. each, it would be expensive for me. Actually I might not need to pay that much, as I am a resident in India, and I am entitled to the Indian fees. The differentiation is between Indian and foreign nationals, therefore you will be required to pay the usual fees for foreigners. This is for still photography only. 3. For some items, there might copyright issues to publish the resulting images under a free license. Please speak to Mr. Grover in the administration. Apparently, they have some conditions with regard to publication of pictures taken in the museum. Every picture should be tagged with Courtesy: National Museum, New Delhi and three copies of the published work must be placed with the museum. Gautam, are there restrictions by copyright law on publishing pictures of art-work available in publicly-accessible galleries? [We did have a discussion on this with Pranesh at the last Bangalore Wikipedia meetup]. Yours sincerely, anirudh ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
Re: [Wikimediaindia-l] National Museum in Delhi
Hi Anirudh, 2011/3/10 Anirudh Bhati anirudh...@gmail.com: Hi Yann, I spoke with a friend who has been to the museum before. And then another journalist with FrenchTV is acquainted with you and your work with Ekta Parishad. Yeah, she called me this morning! ;o) On Thu, Mar 10, 2011 at 11:26 AM, Yann Forget yan...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Liam, 2011/3/10 Liam Wyatt liamwy...@gmail.com: Hi Yann, Well, there are several problems with that. 1. In order to make good photographs, a tripod will be necessary. I doubt they will allow that for the usual fees. The National Museum permits the use of tripods on Mondays (for no extra charge) and for other days a request for permission has to be filed with the administration. Oh, that's great! 2. Seeing the size of the museum, many days will be needed to take good photographs (not snapshots) of a sizeable portion of the museum. At 300 Rs. each, it would be expensive for me. Actually I might not need to pay that much, as I am a resident in India, and I am entitled to the Indian fees. The differentiation is between Indian and foreign nationals, therefore you will be required to pay the usual fees for foreigners. This is for still photography only. No, I have a P.I.O. card, and I only pay the Indian fees when visiting places. 3. For some items, there might copyright issues to publish the resulting images under a free license. Please speak to Mr. Grover in the administration. Apparently, they have some conditions with regard to publication of pictures taken in the museum. Every picture should be tagged with Courtesy: National Museum, New Delhi and three copies of the published work must be placed with the museum. Ok, noted. The museum has a very interesting exhibition on history of Indian alphabets, with diagrams which would be absolutely great for Wikipedia. Gautam, are there restrictions by copyright law on publishing pictures of art-work available in publicly-accessible galleries? [We did have a discussion on this with Pranesh at the last Bangalore Wikipedia meetup]. Yours sincerely, anirudh Best regards, Yann ___ Wikimediaindia-l mailing list Wikimediaindia-l@lists.wikimedia.org https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediaindia-l
