Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Fw: WikiConference 2013 Speakers

2013-01-20 Thread WereSpielChequers
The part of the Geograph that we've imported so far is indeed
overwhelmingly low res - they lifted their file size a little before the
large batch imports were done, but some high res images were in those
batches and subsequent smaller scale imports from the Geograph have
included some very high res images. I suspect that a large proportion of
the million plus Geograph images that we've yet to import will be fairly
high resolution.

The categorisation needed backlog of Geograph images is now down to circa
700,000 and will have dipped quite a bit further by September when the next
WLM runs. However apart from churches, piers, war memorials, hill forts and
some castles the bulk of the geograph categorisation has been to village or
town level - so we are probably in much the same state that we were in last
year. Any photogenic listed building that can be photographed from the road
and is within a congenial drive of a decent real ale pub will have been
photographed by geographers. Especially if it is thatched or has Llamas in
the next field (
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Llamas_and_alpacas_in_the_United_Kingdomdemonstrates
that according to frequency on Commons both species are
clearly of UK origin).

As for the idea that Geographers are hardy folk who only take exterior
shots and never enter buildings; Well a search on Commons for stained glass
Norfolk gets 1,124 hits whilst a search for stained glass gets only 40,114,
so one English county accounts for 3% of our global coverage of stained
glass.

In our recent photo-adding session
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:WereSpielChequers/image_adding we got
some newbies and not so newbies to add images to articles on Wikipedia and
we found that most articles which lack an image but have a UK geocode can
already be illustrated from Commons. The main exception being nature
reserves - (my theory being they don't allow cars or serve real ale). Of
course there may be lots of notable buildings that are sufficiently
unfashionable not to have either articles or images despite having a Listed
status.

So I'm not convinced that WLM would give us images for articles that
already exist but lack images, though it could give us new photographers,
show that we are taking part in a global wiki event, and help kickstart
articles on important but uncommercial buildings. All that in my view makes
it worthwhile to do, but with the precaution that I proposed last year - we
need to advise people that we may already have images, possibly
uncategorised ones of the monument in question, and if they want to be the
first to load an image of a particular building they first need to check
whether we already have it.

WSC








On 16 January 2013 16:55, HJ Mitchell hjmitch...@ymail.com wrote:

 Huge dents have been made in the Geograph backlog since last year, thanks
 mainly to changes in HotCat and Cat-a-lot on Commons and the dedication of
 WereSpielChequers and others. Geograph is fantastic, but it has surprising
 gaps and the images are all low-res, so there's definitely room for
 Geogrpah and WLM to peacefully co-exist.

 Harry Mitchell
 http://enwp.org/User:HJ
 Phone: 024 7698 0977
 Skype: harry_j_mitchell

   --
 *From:* Andrew Gray andrew.g...@dunelm.org.uk
 *To:* HJ Mitchell hjmitch...@ymail.com; UK Wikimedia mailing list 
 wikimediauk-l@lists.wikimedia.org
 *Sent:* Wednesday, 16 January 2013, 16:49

 *Subject:* Re: [Wikimediauk-l] WikiConference 2013 Speakers

 As I recall, the objections were in part that we have most of this
 material already on Commons (via Geograph), but badly organised. I
 don't know if that's changed, or if we've got a better idea of what's
 out there...

 - Andrew.

 On 16 January 2013 16:45, HJ Mitchell hjmitch...@ymail.com wrote:
  Well we have a list of Grade I listed buildings in every county. I'm
 sure it
  would be easy enough to have a bot do the same for Grade II* and
 Scheduled
  Ancient Monuments, and that gives us a ready-made target list. How much
 more
  organisation is needed, beyond creating the necessary project pages on
 the
  relevant wikis and getting the word out?
 
  Harry Mitchell
  http://enwp.org/User:HJ
  Phone: 024 7698 0977
  Skype: harry_j_mitchell
 
  
  From: Thomas Morton morton.tho...@googlemail.com
  To: UK Wikimedia mailing list wikimediauk-l@lists.wikimedia.org
  Sent: Wednesday, 16 January 2013, 16:31
  Subject: Re: [Wikimediauk-l] WikiConference 2013 Speakers
 
  Excellent suggestions, thanks, I will look into it.
 
  A WLM speaker would be great... last year it was mentioned, but only as a
  plea for someone to step forward and organise the UK effort.
 
  I looked into what it would take but it seems a larger job than I'd have
  time for given my other committements - is there noone from the GLAM
 side of
  things who can take it on??
 
  Tom
 
 
  On 15 January 2013 21:11, Lodewijk lodew...@effeietsanders.org wrote:
 
  If the UK would be 

Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Fw: WikiConference 2013 Speakers

2013-01-20 Thread Thomas Morton
Can someone give me a quick overview of how geograph works and how the
images are taken?

I ask this because a number of images from my home town are poor quality,
and incomplete (I can locate less than 5 notable buildings photographed in
the town, when the real number is circa 20-30).

When I say poor quality I don't necessarily mean low res etc. but of poor
photographic quality; for example a monument in the centre of the town is
photographed from about half a mile away across the roofs of several
buildings (although you can drive/walk right past it...).

Tom
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[Wikimediauk-l] Mail Server Migration: UPDATE

2013-01-20 Thread Thomas Morton
All,

In 30 minutes the main mail server migration will begin; your email inboxes
(if you have them :)) will be inaccessible for around an hour as I confirm
the migration was successful  get the processes running.

Mail sent to wikimedia and wikiconferences addresses during this time will
be recieved, but not processed. They will be processed once I have
confirmed the validity of the migration.

Mailing lists (not this one; the board, office and conference, etc.) will
be inaccessible for about 2-3 hours depending on how quickly I can confirm
this stage of the migration/

Tom
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[Wikimediauk-l] state of qrpedia

2013-01-20 Thread rupert THURNER
hi,

what is the current status of qrpedia? is at already recommended to
use it again in wikiland?

rupert.

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Fw: WikiConference 2013 Speakers

2013-01-20 Thread Roger Bamkin
Firstly - Good summary WSC

Geograph is basically a wiki for images. You take a picture. You load it to
Geograph and specify where the item is and where you were standing when you
took it. The picture is then looked over by someone to check its not a
picture of your thumb. THe picture is categorised in a way similar to
commons. Points are awarded based on the rarity of the picture (no one has
taken a picture there before). The site attracts a lot of happy snappers
and people who like to get points. Its a great idea and its worked. YOu may
not find a great picture of extly what you want .. but then there are
lots of pictures still to load and lots that require better categorisation.
On the latter - there has been a lot of improvement. If you compare it to
panaramio which is Googles tool for getting people to donate geotagged
images then Id say that the quality is not as good but the quantity of
images is much better by Geograph. I look at images on Google Earth for
Morocco and there is an occasional picture of maybe one settlement in 6.

However I agree with WSC's final para (as well) and although it would have
been nice to see Geograph run across the world, it appears that WLM has the
brand and momentum. (And their prizes are impressive).

HTT
R

On 20 January 2013 13:51, Thomas Morton morton.tho...@googlemail.comwrote:

 Can someone give me a quick overview of how geograph works and how the
 images are taken?

 I ask this because a number of images from my home town are poor quality,
 and incomplete (I can locate less than 5 notable buildings photographed in
 the town, when the real number is circa 20-30).

 When I say poor quality I don't necessarily mean low res etc. but of
 poor photographic quality; for example a monument in the centre of the town
 is photographed from about half a mile away across the roofs of several
 buildings (although you can drive/walk right past it...).

 Tom

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Victuallers Ltd
01332 702993
0758 2020815
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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] state of qrpedia

2013-01-20 Thread rupert THURNER
would it be possible to reveal the main obstacles why this is not yet settled?

On Sun, Jan 20, 2013 at 5:14 PM, Roger Bamkin victuall...@gmail.com wrote:
 Well thats a timely question. A deal was agreed in July with the UK board's
 representative and their Chief Exec and a contract was drawn up. Before
 Christmas the UK board said that they wanted to re-negotiate and wanted to
 create a new contract. As you can iimagine this was disappointing and we did
 not want to go through that process again. The board has recently agreed
 that it will endeavor to create a binding deal and they have delegated two
 board members to restart the process.

 However, QRpedia remains available for anyone to use and we have projects
 including those in Australia, France, Spain, Gibraltar, Germany, India,
 Estonia and Tunisia, These will continue to be supported for ever at no
 cost.

 Hope that helps

 On 20 January 2013 14:58, rupert THURNER rupert.thur...@gmail.com wrote:

 hi,

 what is the current status of qrpedia? is at already recommended to
 use it again in wikiland?

 rupert.

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 Wikimedia UK mailing list
 wikimediau...@wikimedia.org
 http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l
 WMUK: http://uk.wikimedia.org




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 Victuallers Ltd
 01332 702993
 0758 2020815
 Google+:Victuallers
 Skype:Victuallers1
 Flickr:Victuallers2

 ___
 Wikimedia UK mailing list
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 WMUK: http://uk.wikimedia.org


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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] state of qrpedia

2013-01-20 Thread Roger Bamkin
We've been ready to get something in order for some time now and the
difficulties, which I am not that clear on, seem to be on the WMUK side

Roger

On 20 January 2013 17:38, rupert THURNER rupert.thur...@gmail.com wrote:

 would it be possible to reveal the main obstacles why this is not yet
 settled?

 On Sun, Jan 20, 2013 at 5:14 PM, Roger Bamkin victuall...@gmail.com
 wrote:
  Well thats a timely question. A deal was agreed in July with the UK
 board's
  representative and their Chief Exec and a contract was drawn up. Before
  Christmas the UK board said that they wanted to re-negotiate and wanted
 to
  create a new contract. As you can iimagine this was disappointing and we
 did
  not want to go through that process again. The board has recently agreed
  that it will endeavor to create a binding deal and they have delegated
 two
  board members to restart the process.
 
  However, QRpedia remains available for anyone to use and we have projects
  including those in Australia, France, Spain, Gibraltar, Germany, India,
  Estonia and Tunisia, These will continue to be supported for ever at no
  cost.
 
  Hope that helps
 
  On 20 January 2013 14:58, rupert THURNER rupert.thur...@gmail.com
 wrote:
 
  hi,
 
  what is the current status of qrpedia? is at already recommended to
  use it again in wikiland?
 
  rupert.
 
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  wikimediau...@wikimedia.org
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  --
  Roger Bamkin
  Victuallers Ltd
  01332 702993
  0758 2020815
  Google+:Victuallers
  Skype:Victuallers1
  Flickr:Victuallers2
 
  ___
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  wikimediau...@wikimedia.org
  http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l
  WMUK: http://uk.wikimedia.org
 

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 WMUK: http://uk.wikimedia.org




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01332 702993
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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Fw: WikiConference 2013 Speakers

2013-01-20 Thread WereSpielChequers
Thanks Roger,

Both Geograph and Wiki Loves Monuments have established that people like
photography contests, and they are willing to take images and release them
under open licenses. I'd also add that enough of the images are good that
it is worth sifting through the many that aren't.

Geograph is very much focussed on the UK and Eire, though I think they may
be extending to Germany. They definitely aren't global but then neither is
the UK chapter. WLM started in the Netherlands and has now extended to
dozens of countries, but not yet the UK.

WLM is a Wikimedia initiative from one of our fellow chapters, and I'd
agree that means a presumption that we should take part, and that we'd be
welcome participants. The Geograph is a completely separate entity and my
only attempt to contact them has not been responded to after some months (I
emailed them about a probable copyright anomaly). But their licensing is
fully compatible with ours.

The Geograph runs a points based system which started off with the idea of
getting a photo of every square kilometer of the UK, Yes they really do
have images as banal as a bit of driftwood on the shingle that forms the
only dry land in one particular grid square. They've subsequently extended
that model to allow various other ways to get points for subsequent picture
in the same square km. I have whinged slightly here about their poor
coverage of nature reserves, but I'd really like to see the UK chapter
approach them and say Here is a list of Wikipedia articles that lack
images, would you be willing to add them to Geograph and offer Geograph
points for photographing them? And while we are talking would your members
like a dual load option so that they can also load their images onto
commons?

Where the Geograph outscores WLM is that they aren't time limited, some of
their photographers have uploaded images from decades ago, and they cover
the same object in different seasons. I think that makes them more
compatible with Wikipedia, September foliage can hide some of the features
we want to photograph, winter snow can highlight earthworks and other
archaeology, past events are best illustrated with old photos, and
waterfalls in particular are much better illustrated with minigalleries
showing winter spate next to summer trickles.

I've taken part in some of the discussions about the future of WLM, and
there is a realisation that it will need to change as we run out of
monuments in some countries, But they do seem very wedded to the idea of it
being a September competition, and I find that very limiting.

My preference would be that we follow both tracks, there is no guarantee
that WLM would want to collaborate with us, but if they did the benefits
would be great for us both - and why not run WLM in cooperation with the
Geograph?

WSC



On 20 January 2013 16:52, Roger Bamkin victuall...@gmail.com wrote:

 Firstly - Good summary WSC

 Geograph is basically a wiki for images. You take a picture. You load it
 to Geograph and specify where the item is and where you were standing when
 you took it. The picture is then looked over by someone to check its not a
 picture of your thumb. THe picture is categorised in a way similar to
 commons. Points are awarded based on the rarity of the picture (no one has
 taken a picture there before). The site attracts a lot of happy snappers
 and people who like to get points. Its a great idea and its worked. YOu may
 not find a great picture of extly what you want .. but then there are
 lots of pictures still to load and lots that require better categorisation.
 On the latter - there has been a lot of improvement. If you compare it to
 panaramio which is Googles tool for getting people to donate geotagged
 images then Id say that the quality is not as good but the quantity of
 images is much better by Geograph. I look at images on Google Earth for
 Morocco and there is an occasional picture of maybe one settlement in 6.

 However I agree with WSC's final para (as well) and although it would have
 been nice to see Geograph run across the world, it appears that WLM has the
 brand and momentum. (And their prizes are impressive).

 HTT
 R

 On 20 January 2013 13:51, Thomas Morton morton.tho...@googlemail.comwrote:

 Can someone give me a quick overview of how geograph works and how the
 images are taken?

 I ask this because a number of images from my home town are poor quality,
 and incomplete (I can locate less than 5 notable buildings photographed in
 the town, when the real number is circa 20-30).

 When I say poor quality I don't necessarily mean low res etc. but of
 poor photographic quality; for example a monument in the centre of the town
 is photographed from about half a mile away across the roofs of several
 buildings (although you can drive/walk right past it...).

 Tom

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Fw: WikiConference 2013 Speakers

2013-01-20 Thread Andrew Gray
On 20 January 2013 19:16, WereSpielChequers werespielchequ...@gmail.com wrote:
 Where the Geograph outscores WLM is that they aren't time limited, some of
 their photographers have uploaded images from decades ago, and they cover
 the same object in different seasons. I think that makes them more
 compatible with Wikipedia, September foliage can hide some of the features
 we want to photograph, winter snow can highlight earthworks and other
 archaeology, past events are best illustrated with old photos, and
 waterfalls in particular are much better illustrated with minigalleries
 showing winter spate next to summer trickles.

Isn't WLM also non-time-limited? They have to be *submitted* to the
contest (and Commons) in  a specific month, but older images are still
acceptable - see for example the Israeli winner, which was taken in
the winter of 1992.

http://blog.wikimedia.org/2012/11/29/wiki-loves-monuments-2012-the-israeli-finalists/

-- 
- Andrew Gray
  andrew.g...@dunelm.org.uk

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] state of qrpedia

2013-01-20 Thread WereSpielChequers
Hi Roger, thanks for that update. Would I be correct in understanding that
you are intending to retain the QRpedia website and presumably brand? If so
presumably we will need a new brand for our QR codes and should stop using
the term QRpedia except when referring to the site currently used to
generate QR codes?


WSC


On 20 January 2013 18:08, Roger Bamkin victuall...@gmail.com wrote:

 We've been ready to get something in order for some time now and the
 difficulties, which I am not that clear on, seem to be on the WMUK side

 Roger


 On 20 January 2013 17:38, rupert THURNER rupert.thur...@gmail.com wrote:

 would it be possible to reveal the main obstacles why this is not yet
 settled?

 On Sun, Jan 20, 2013 at 5:14 PM, Roger Bamkin victuall...@gmail.com
 wrote:
  Well thats a timely question. A deal was agreed in July with the UK
 board's
  representative and their Chief Exec and a contract was drawn up. Before
  Christmas the UK board said that they wanted to re-negotiate and wanted
 to
  create a new contract. As you can iimagine this was disappointing and
 we did
  not want to go through that process again. The board has recently agreed
  that it will endeavor to create a binding deal and they have delegated
 two
  board members to restart the process.
 
  However, QRpedia remains available for anyone to use and we have
 projects
  including those in Australia, France, Spain, Gibraltar, Germany, India,
  Estonia and Tunisia, These will continue to be supported for ever at no
  cost.
 
  Hope that helps
 
  On 20 January 2013 14:58, rupert THURNER rupert.thur...@gmail.com
 wrote:
 
  hi,
 
  what is the current status of qrpedia? is at already recommended to
  use it again in wikiland?
 
  rupert.
 
  ___
  Wikimedia UK mailing list
  wikimediau...@wikimedia.org
  http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l
  WMUK: http://uk.wikimedia.org
 
 
 
 
  --
  Roger Bamkin
  Victuallers Ltd
  01332 702993
  0758 2020815
  Google+:Victuallers
  Skype:Victuallers1
  Flickr:Victuallers2
 
  ___
  Wikimedia UK mailing list
  wikimediau...@wikimedia.org
  http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l
  WMUK: http://uk.wikimedia.org
 

 ___
 Wikimedia UK mailing list
 wikimediau...@wikimedia.org
 http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l
 WMUK: http://uk.wikimedia.org




 --
 Roger Bamkin
 Victuallers Ltd
 01332 702993
 0758 2020815
 Google+:Victuallers
 Skype:Victuallers1
 Flickr:Victuallers2

 ___
 Wikimedia UK mailing list
 wikimediau...@wikimedia.org
 http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l
 WMUK: http://uk.wikimedia.org


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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] state of qrpedia

2013-01-20 Thread Roger Bamkin
Good question - I wonder whether that's what WMUK are considering?

Roger

On 20 January 2013 20:07, WereSpielChequers werespielchequ...@gmail.comwrote:

 Hi Roger, thanks for that update. Would I be correct in understanding that
 you are intending to retain the QRpedia website and presumably brand? If so
 presumably we will need a new brand for our QR codes and should stop using
 the term QRpedia except when referring to the site currently used to
 generate QR codes?


 WSC



 On 20 January 2013 18:08, Roger Bamkin victuall...@gmail.com wrote:

 We've been ready to get something in order for some time now and the
 difficulties, which I am not that clear on, seem to be on the WMUK side

 Roger


 On 20 January 2013 17:38, rupert THURNER rupert.thur...@gmail.comwrote:

 would it be possible to reveal the main obstacles why this is not yet
 settled?

 On Sun, Jan 20, 2013 at 5:14 PM, Roger Bamkin victuall...@gmail.com
 wrote:
  Well thats a timely question. A deal was agreed in July with the UK
 board's
  representative and their Chief Exec and a contract was drawn up. Before
  Christmas the UK board said that they wanted to re-negotiate and
 wanted to
  create a new contract. As you can iimagine this was disappointing and
 we did
  not want to go through that process again. The board has recently
 agreed
  that it will endeavor to create a binding deal and they have delegated
 two
  board members to restart the process.
 
  However, QRpedia remains available for anyone to use and we have
 projects
  including those in Australia, France, Spain, Gibraltar, Germany, India,
  Estonia and Tunisia, These will continue to be supported for ever at no
  cost.
 
  Hope that helps
 
  On 20 January 2013 14:58, rupert THURNER rupert.thur...@gmail.com
 wrote:
 
  hi,
 
  what is the current status of qrpedia? is at already recommended to
  use it again in wikiland?
 
  rupert.
 
  ___
  Wikimedia UK mailing list
  wikimediau...@wikimedia.org
  http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l
  WMUK: http://uk.wikimedia.org
 
 
 
 
  --
  Roger Bamkin
  Victuallers Ltd
  01332 702993
  0758 2020815
  Google+:Victuallers
  Skype:Victuallers1
  Flickr:Victuallers2
 
  ___
  Wikimedia UK mailing list
  wikimediau...@wikimedia.org
  http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l
  WMUK: http://uk.wikimedia.org
 

 ___
 Wikimedia UK mailing list
 wikimediau...@wikimedia.org
 http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l
 WMUK: http://uk.wikimedia.org




 --
 Roger Bamkin
 Victuallers Ltd
 01332 702993
 0758 2020815
 Google+:Victuallers
 Skype:Victuallers1
 Flickr:Victuallers2

 ___
 Wikimedia UK mailing list
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 WMUK: http://uk.wikimedia.org



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01332 702993
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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Fw: WikiConference 2013 Speakers

2013-01-20 Thread Roger Bamkin
We gave a prize to Geograph as Wiki of the year - they should respond to us
if we use the right address

On 20 January 2013 19:29, Andrew Gray andrew.g...@dunelm.org.uk wrote:

 On 20 January 2013 19:16, WereSpielChequers werespielchequ...@gmail.com
 wrote:
  Where the Geograph outscores WLM is that they aren't time limited, some
 of
  their photographers have uploaded images from decades ago, and they cover
  the same object in different seasons. I think that makes them more
  compatible with Wikipedia, September foliage can hide some of the
 features
  we want to photograph, winter snow can highlight earthworks and other
  archaeology, past events are best illustrated with old photos, and
  waterfalls in particular are much better illustrated with minigalleries
  showing winter spate next to summer trickles.

 Isn't WLM also non-time-limited? They have to be *submitted* to the
 contest (and Commons) in  a specific month, but older images are still
 acceptable - see for example the Israeli winner, which was taken in
 the winter of 1992.


 http://blog.wikimedia.org/2012/11/29/wiki-loves-monuments-2012-the-israeli-finalists/

 --
 - Andrew Gray
   andrew.g...@dunelm.org.uk

 ___
 Wikimedia UK mailing list
 wikimediau...@wikimedia.org
 http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l
 WMUK: http://uk.wikimedia.org




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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Mail Server Migration: UPDATE

2013-01-20 Thread jon . davies
Ta Tom. Good job. See you tomorrow. Jon
Sent using BlackBerry® from Orange

-Original Message-
From: Thomas Morton morton.tho...@googlemail.com
Sender: wikimediauk-l-boun...@lists.wikimedia.org
Date: Sun, 20 Jan 2013 20:49:37 
To: wikimediauk-l@lists.wikimedia.orgwikimediauk-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Reply-To: UK Wikimedia mailing list wikimediauk-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Subject: Re: [Wikimediauk-l] Mail Server Migration: UPDATE

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Re: [Wikimediauk-l] state of qrpedia

2013-01-20 Thread Andy Mabbett
On 20 January 2013 20:07, WereSpielChequers werespielchequ...@gmail.com wrote:
 Would I be correct in understanding that you are intending to retain the
 QRpedia website and presumably brand? If so presumably we will need a new
 brand for our QR codes and should stop using the term QRpedia except when
 referring to the site currently used to generate QR codes?

Given how well-known - and respected - that name has become, that
would be a terribly retrograde step.

--
Andy Mabbett
@pigsonthewing
http://pigsonthewing.org.uk

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