Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality bandwidth providers

[Garrett Shankle]

 High PPS with small packet size and inefficient wireless frame use. Although 
frame aggregation resolves this for the most part. Or if you are running a high 
over-subscription ratio and can't handle the continuous traffic it generates. 
We were troubled by it at one point but those days are long gone.


  Nothing has really changed on that front, wireless providers were always 
allowed "legitimate means" to implement QoS. How that was interpreted is beyond 
me.



  And it won't be simple to target torrent traffic in particular with the 
modern techniques that mask torrent traffic as standard web traffic. Not to 
mention that legitimate systems now use torrent traffic to deliver updates. 
That's a real can of worms to open up now.



 In my opinion it's not our concern what customers do with their bandwidth 
until someone with a badge or a gavel says otherwise.


We give our customers the internet, the whole internet, and nothing but the 
internet.


Garrett Shankle

Wireless Administrator

Virginia Broadband LLC





From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org <wireless-boun...@wispa.org> on behalf of 
Adair Winter <ada...@amarillowireless.net>
Sent: Friday, December 15, 2017 10:23:53 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality  bandwidth providers

Torrent traffic is less than 1% of our network traffic. It's never been a big 
deal for us like it probably once was.

On Fri, Dec 15, 2017 at 9:19 AM, Dan Thompson 
<d...@peakenetbroadband.com<mailto:d...@peakenetbroadband.com>> wrote:
Why do you want to be able to throttle torrent users specifically?


 On Wed, 13 Dec 2017 12:04:43 -0500 
r...@triadwireless.net<mailto:r...@triadwireless.net> wrote 

I want to be able to throttle torrent users. Beyond that, I don't think it will 
affect us much in areas of high-competition.

Rory

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org<mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org> 
[mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org<mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org>] On 
Behalf Of Seth Mattinen
Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2017 6:57 PM
To: wireless@wispa.org<mailto:wireless@wispa.org>
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

On 12/10/17 2:44 PM, Chadwick Wachs wrote:
> What are the current thoughts on the effects of net neutrality being
> over turned on our bandwidth providers? I understand how the cable and
> DSL companies may react but as a small WISP, I've been thinking this
> will have little impact on us and our customers (since we don't intend
> on changing our policies) but I may not be thinking about the bigger
> picture enough. Perhaps my bandwidth and upstream fiber providers will
> raise rates or charge premium fees for fast lanes to middle mile access.


Nothing. It wasn't mayhem in the decades before 2015 and it won't suddenly 
become a problem now. The big guys are always going to try some crap until 
someone calls them on it, "net neutrality" or not.

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Adair Winter
VP, Network Operations / Co-Owner
Amarillo Wireless | 806.316.5071
C: 806.231.7180
http://www.amarillowireless.net<http://www.amarillowireless.net/>
[https://docs.google.com/a/amarillowireless.net/uc?id=0B-KeaiwIRBHEQl9leFFvVjZuWmc=download]<http://www.amarillowireless.net>


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Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

[Rory Conaway]

It’s the DCMA notices. CenturyLink and Cox are clamping down on that.  Hotels 
are our biggest issue.

Rory

From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf 
Of Kris McElroy
Sent: Friday, December 15, 2017 9:04 AM
To: WISPA General List <wireless@wispa.org>
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

I would agree with Adair, Torrent is a non-issue for us.  We have seen more 
complaints from Windows Update and Xbox Live Updates impacting customers 
connections, meaning they call in and say “I am paying for 20 Meg service and 
when I run a speed test I am only seeing 2 Meg Down or wny is my Netflix 
buffering”.  We go and look and they will have a windows update running in the 
background taking 18-19 Meg of their connection up and you have to explain that 
to them, same way with Xbox accept all our gamers have our 50 Meg plan and it 
will chew up 30 to 40 Meg downloading an update or game.  Luckily, we can 
manage this with our Procera now so we don’t hear from customers as much.

Kris McElroy



From: <wireless-boun...@wispa.org<mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org>> on behalf 
of Mike Hammett <wispawirel...@ics-il.net<mailto:wispawirel...@ics-il.net>>
Reply-To: WISPA General List <wireless@wispa.org<mailto:wireless@wispa.org>>
Date: Friday, December 15, 2017 at 9:51 AM
To: WISPA General List <wireless@wispa.org<mailto:wireless@wispa.org>>
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

Fair how?


-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions<http://www.ics-il.com/>
[mage removed by sender.]<https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>[mage removed by 
sender.]<https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb>[mage 
removed by 
sender.]<https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions>[mage 
removed by sender.]<https://twitter.com/ICSIL>
Midwest Internet Exchange<http://www.midwest-ix.com/>
[mage removed by sender.]<https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix>[mage removed by 
sender.]<https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange>[mage 
removed by sender.]<https://twitter.com/mdwestix>
The Brothers WISP<http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/>
[mage removed by sender.]<https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>[mage 
removed by sender.]<https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg>

From: "Vance Shipley" <van...@sigscale.com<mailto:van...@sigscale.com>>
To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org<mailto:wireless@wispa.org>>
Sent: Friday, December 15, 2017 9:43:31 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers
Because it's the fair thing to do. As a neighbour I would greatly appreciate it.

On Dec 15, 2017 21:05, "Mike Hammett" 
<wispawirel...@ics-il.net<mailto:wispawirel...@ics-il.net>> wrote:
Why?


-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions<http://www.ics-il.com/>
[mage removed by sender.]<https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>[mage removed by 
sender.]<https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb>[mage 
removed by 
sender.]<https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions>[mage 
removed by sender.]<https://twitter.com/ICSIL>
Midwest Internet Exchange<http://www.midwest-ix.com/>
[mage removed by sender.]<https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix>[mage removed by 
sender.]<https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange>[mage 
removed by sender.]<https://twitter.com/mdwestix>
The Brothers WISP<http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/>
[mage removed by sender.]<https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>[mage 
removed by sender.]<https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg>
____
From: "Rory Conaway" <r...@triadwireless.net<mailto:r...@triadwireless.net>>
To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org<mailto:wireless@wispa.org>>
Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 11:04:43 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

I want to be able to throttle torrent users.  Beyond that, I don't think it 
will affect us much in areas of high-competition.

Rory

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org<mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org> 
[mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org<mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org>] On 
Behalf Of Seth Mattinen
Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2017 6:57 PM
To: wireless@wispa.org<mailto:wireless@wispa.org>
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

On 12/10/17 2:44 PM, Chadwick Wachs wrote:
> What are the current thoughts on the effects of net neutrality being
> over turned on our bandwidth providers? I understand how the cable and
> DSL companies may react but as a small WISP, I've been thinking this
>

Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality bandwidth providers

[Jared Brown]

Life isn't fair and you are not entitled to your oversubscription ratios. 

 

I'm fine with lower cost plans that have higher contention during peak hours, as long as it's clearly and fairly disclosed. 

 

I'm not fine with plans being advertised as XX Mbps, flatrate and no data caps and then not delivering. A consumer should have a reasonable expectation of getting about XX Mbps, even during peak hours, if they subscribe to a XX Mbps plan. As such, the consumer using what they paid for is in no way any form of abuse. 

 

Jared

 

Sent: Friday, December 15, 2017 at 8:35 PM
From: "Darin Steffl" <darin.ste...@mnwifi.com>
To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org>
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality  bandwidth providers


Dan,
 

You have to understand if you're selling a residential internet package, it is NOT dedicated. There has to be some oversubscription allowed for the ISP to make a profit. If every sub we had used their plan 24/7 and expected the speed to always be there and not dip down, we wouldn't make money and would shutdown.

 

So yes, it is wrong and hurts an ISP if customers use and expect to max out their connection all the time but specifically during the evening peak. That's where it matters most.

 

If customers always want their bandwidth then they need to pay more to upgrade backhaul, ap's, etc. If they're OK with slightly slower speeds during peak but enough to still stream and not feel slow, then prices can remain level. 

 

Power companies issue peak time alerts during the summer and winter to prevent brownouts or congestion in our terms. And they specifically state in their newsletter that if people don't reduce their power demands during their peak times, rates are going to increase as it costs more to handle that load. 


 
On Dec 15, 2017 12:07 PM, "Vance Shipley" <van...@sigscale.com> wrote:




On Dec 15, 2017 23:29, "Dan Thompson" <d...@peakenetbroadband.com> wrote:



How is using what you pay for abuse?  In both instances described, the customer is using a large chunk of their bandwidth, but not using more than the plan alots. 





 

Fallacy. Imagine your local "all you can eat" buffet  charges $10 for lunch which you really enjoy and find good value. One day a Sumo wrestling school opens next door and the new customers eat them out every hour. Next week lunch is $20 but you're eating the same thing. 

 

You are not paying equally when you are part of the top percentile of bandwidth consumers.

 

 


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Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality bandwidth providers

[Jared Brown]

I counter your claims of fallacy with my own claim of bad analogy. The restaurant business is nothing like the ISP business, where critical inputs have lower and lower unit costs each year, the seller sets the rate of service and consumption has well know diurnal usage patterns. 

 

However, what we have here is purely a business model problem, not a consumer over usage problem. Even the heaviest of consumers are only using the service as advertised. If you can't deal with that, don't use terms like "flatrate", "X Mbps", "no data caps", etc. in your marketing and service plans. 

 

As as they say, live by the sword, die by the sword. 

 

Jared

 


Sent: Friday, December 15, 2017 at 8:07 PM
From: "Vance Shipley" <van...@sigscale.com>
To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org>
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality  bandwidth providers




On Dec 15, 2017 23:29, "Dan Thompson" <d...@peakenetbroadband.com> wrote:


How is using what you pay for abuse?  In both instances described, the customer is using a large chunk of their bandwidth, but not using more than the plan alots. 




 

Fallacy. Imagine your local "all you can eat" buffet  charges $10 for lunch which you really enjoy and find good value. One day a Sumo wrestling school opens next door and the new customers eat them out every hour. Next week lunch is $20 but you're eating the same thing. 

 

You are not paying equally when you are part of the top percentile of bandwidth consumers.

 

 

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Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality bandwidth providers

[Darin Steffl]

Dan,

You have to understand if you're selling a residential internet package, it
is NOT dedicated. There has to be some oversubscription allowed for the ISP
to make a profit. If every sub we had used their plan 24/7 and expected the
speed to always be there and not dip down, we wouldn't make money and would
shutdown.

So yes, it is wrong and hurts an ISP if customers use and expect to max out
their connection all the time but specifically during the evening peak.
That's where it matters most.

If customers always want their bandwidth then they need to pay more to
upgrade backhaul, ap's, etc. If they're OK with slightly slower speeds
during peak but enough to still stream and not feel slow, then prices can
remain level.

Power companies issue peak time alerts during the summer and winter to
prevent brownouts or congestion in our terms. And they specifically state
in their newsletter that if people don't reduce their power demands during
their peak times, rates are going to increase as it costs more to handle
that load.

On Dec 15, 2017 12:07 PM, "Vance Shipley"  wrote:

> On Dec 15, 2017 23:29, "Dan Thompson"  wrote:
>
> How is using what you pay for abuse?  In both instances described, the
> customer is using a large chunk of their bandwidth, but not using more than
> the plan alots.
>
>
> Fallacy. Imagine your local "all you can eat" buffet  charges $10 for
> lunch which you really enjoy and find good value. One day a Sumo wrestling
> school opens next door and the new customers eat them out every hour. Next
> week lunch is $20 but you're eating the same thing.
>
> You are not paying equally when you are part of the top percentile of
> bandwidth consumers.
>
>
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>
>
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Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

[Josh Luthman]

Lucky you!!!


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Fri, Dec 15, 2017 at 1:10 PM, Seth Mattinen  wrote:

> On 12/15/17 09:40, Josh Luthman wrote:
> > Do you not have a DMCA contact?  I get these things daily and I have a
> > pretty small customer count with a geographic that I would suspect is
> > minimally using Bittorrent.
> >
>
>
> Not daily, no. Maybe once or twice a month for me.
>
> ~Seth
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Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

[Seth Mattinen]

On 12/15/17 09:40, Josh Luthman wrote:
> Do you not have a DMCA contact?  I get these things daily and I have a 
> pretty small customer count with a geographic that I would suspect is 
> minimally using Bittorrent.
> 


Not daily, no. Maybe once or twice a month for me.

~Seth
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Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality bandwidth providers

[Vance Shipley]

On Dec 15, 2017 23:29, "Dan Thompson"  wrote:

How is using what you pay for abuse?  In both instances described, the
customer is using a large chunk of their bandwidth, but not using more than
the plan alots.


Fallacy. Imagine your local "all you can eat" buffet  charges $10 for lunch
which you really enjoy and find good value. One day a Sumo wrestling school
opens next door and the new customers eat them out every hour. Next week
lunch is $20 but you're eating the same thing.

You are not paying equally when you are part of the top percentile of
bandwidth consumers.
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Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

[Tim Cailloux]

I talked to a reporter on Net Neutrality yesterday, and this is one of
the things I highlighted, as a scenario in which an ISP could help
customers after Title II no longer applied.  Like, "I know your Internet
stinks right now; it's your XBox updates and your Windows updates, and
that's the reason you can't stream Netflix.  I can't manage traffic
priorities during peak hours for you."
I had a customer call for support because their PS4 was uploading and
saturating their upstream.  We ended the call with all electronics in
his house in a pile in the living room to prove that it was one of his
devices and not my service.
tim
 
--
Tim Cailloux
t...@southern-internet.com
(404) 406-9911


On Fri, Dec 15, 2017, at 12:55, Vance Shipley wrote:
> Good story. This is the stuff that people don't understand. Policy
> enforcement is good for everyone, including the enforcee! Net
> neutrality, as imagined by it's staunch supporters, is a really bad
> idea. They imagine it's about "big corporate" stifling competition and
> innovation but the very real everyday impact of real "neutrality"
> would be normal people suffering poor service so the geeky few could
> pay less for their consumption and no back pressure on abuse.> 
> 
> On Dec 15, 2017 21:34, "Kris McElroy"
> <kmcel...@threesixtycomm.net> wrote:>> I would agree with Adair, Torrent is a 
> non-issue for us.  We have
>> seen more complaints from Windows Update and Xbox Live Updates
>> impacting customers connections, meaning they call in and say “I am
>> paying for 20 Meg service and when I run a speed test I am only
>> seeing 2 Meg Down or wny is my Netflix buffering”.  We go and look
>> and they will have a windows update running in the background taking
>> 18-19 Meg of their connection up and you have to explain that to
>> them, same way with Xbox accept all our gamers have our 50 Meg plan
>> and it will chew up 30 to 40 Meg downloading an update or game.
>> Luckily, we can manage this with our Procera now so we don’t hear
>> from customers as much.>> __ __


>> Kris McElroy


>> __ __


>> __ __


>> __ __


>> *From: *<wireless-boun...@wispa.org> on behalf of Mike Hammett 
>> <wispawireless@ics-
>> il.net> *Reply-To: *WISPA General List <wireless@wispa.org> *Date:
>> *Friday, December 15, 2017 at 9:51 AM *To: *WISPA General List
>> <wireless@wispa.org> *Subject: *Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality &
>> bandwidth providers>> __ __


>> Fair how?


>>
>>
>> -
>>  Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions[1] mage removed by
>>  sender.mage removed by sender.mage removed by sender.mage removed by
>>  sender. Midwest Internet Exchange[2] mage removed by sender.mage
>>  removed by sender.mage removed by sender. The Brothers WISP[3] mage
>>  removed by sender.mage removed by sender.>> 
>> *From: *"Vance Shipley" <van...@sigscale.com> *To: *"WISPA General
>> List" <wireless@wispa.org> *Sent: *Friday, December 15, 2017 9:43:31
>> AM *Subject: *Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers>> Because 
>> it's the fair thing to do. As a neighbour I would greatly
>> appreciate it.>> __ __


>> On Dec 15, 2017 21:05, "Mike Hammett" <wispawirel...@ics-il.net>
>> wrote:>>> Why?


>>>
>>>
>>> -
>>>  Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions[4] mage removed by
>>>  sender.mage removed by sender.mage removed by sender.mage removed
>>>  by sender. Midwest Internet Exchange[5] mage removed by sender.mage
>>>  removed by sender.mage removed by sender. The Brothers WISP[6] mage
>>>  removed by sender.mage removed by sender.>>> 
>>> *From: *"Rory Conaway" <r...@triadwireless.net> *To: *"WISPA General
>>> List" <wireless@wispa.org> *Sent: *Wednesday, December 13, 2017
>>> 11:04:43 AM *Subject: *Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth
>>> providers
>>>
>>>  I want to be able to throttle torrent users.  Beyond that, I don't
>>>  think it will affect us much in areas of high-competition.
>>>
>>>  Rory
>>>
>>>  -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org 
>>> [mailto:wireless-
>>>  boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Seth Mattinen Sent: Tuesday,
>>>  December 12, 2017 6:57 PM To: wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re:
>>>  [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers
>>>
>>>  On 12/10/17 2:44 PM, Chadwick Wachs wrote:
>>>  > What are the 

Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality bandwidth providers

[Dan Thompson]

How is using what you pay for abuse?  In both instances described, the customer 
is using a large chunk of their bandwidth, but not using more than the plan 
alots.  

 On Fri, 15 Dec 2017 12:55:10 -0500 van...@sigscale.com wrote 

Good story. This is the stuff that people don't understand. Policy enforcement 
is good for everyone, including the enforcee! Net neutrality, as imagined by 
it's staunch supporters, is a really bad idea. They imagine it's about "big 
corporate" stifling competition and innovation but the very real everyday 
impact of real "neutrality" would be normal people suffering poor service so 
the geeky few could pay less for their consumption and no back pressure on 
abuse.


On Dec 15, 2017 21:34, "Kris McElroy" <kmcel...@threesixtycomm.net> wrote:
I would agree with Adair, Torrent is a non-issue for us.  We have seen more 
complaints from Windows Update and Xbox Live Updates impacting customers 
connections, meaning they call in and say “I am paying for 20 Meg service and 
when I run a speed test I am only seeing 2 Meg Down or wny is my Netflix 
buffering”.  We go and look and they will have a windows update running in the 
background taking 18-19 Meg of their connection up and you have to explain that 
to them, same way with Xbox accept all our gamers have our 50 Meg plan and it 
will chew up 30 to 40 Meg downloading an update or game.  Luckily, we can 
manage this with our Procera now so we don’t hear from customers as much.

 

Kris McElroy

 

 

 

From: <wireless-boun...@wispa.org> on behalf of Mike Hammett 
<wispawirel...@ics-il.net>
Reply-To: WISPA General List <wireless@wispa.org>
Date: Friday, December 15, 2017 at 9:51 AM
To: WISPA General List <wireless@wispa.org>
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

 

Fair how?



-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions

Midwest Internet Exchange

The Brothers WISP


From: "Vance Shipley" <van...@sigscale.com>
To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org>
Sent: Friday, December 15, 2017 9:43:31 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

Because it's the fair thing to do. As a neighbour I would greatly appreciate it.

 

On Dec 15, 2017 21:05, "Mike Hammett" <wispawirel...@ics-il.net> wrote:

Why?



-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions

Midwest Internet Exchange

The Brothers WISP


From: "Rory Conaway" <r...@triadwireless.net>
To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org>
Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 11:04:43 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

I want to be able to throttle torrent users.  Beyond that, I don't think it 
will affect us much in areas of high-competition.

Rory

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf 
Of Seth Mattinen
Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2017 6:57 PM
To: wireless@wispa.org
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

On 12/10/17 2:44 PM, Chadwick Wachs wrote:
> What are the current thoughts on the effects of net neutrality being 
> over turned on our bandwidth providers? I understand how the cable and 
> DSL companies may react but as a small WISP, I've been thinking this 
> will have little impact on us and our customers (since we don't intend 
> on changing our policies) but I may not be thinking about the bigger 
> picture enough. Perhaps my bandwidth and upstream fiber providers will 
> raise rates or charge premium fees for fast lanes to middle mile access.


Nothing. It wasn't mayhem in the decades before 2015 and it won't suddenly 
become a problem now. The big guys are always going to try some crap until 
someone calls them on it, "net neutrality" or not.

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Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

[Vance Shipley]

Good story. This is the stuff that people don't understand. Policy
enforcement is good for everyone, including the enforcee! Net neutrality,
as imagined by it's staunch supporters, is a really bad idea. They imagine
it's about "big corporate" stifling competition and innovation but the very
real everyday impact of real "neutrality" would be normal people suffering
poor service so the geeky few could pay less for their consumption and no
back pressure on abuse.


On Dec 15, 2017 21:34, "Kris McElroy" <kmcel...@threesixtycomm.net> wrote:

> I would agree with Adair, Torrent is a non-issue for us.  We have seen
> more complaints from Windows Update and Xbox Live Updates impacting
> customers connections, meaning they call in and say “I am paying for 20 Meg
> service and when I run a speed test I am only seeing 2 Meg Down or wny is
> my Netflix buffering”.  We go and look and they will have a windows update
> running in the background taking 18-19 Meg of their connection up and you
> have to explain that to them, same way with Xbox accept all our gamers have
> our 50 Meg plan and it will chew up 30 to 40 Meg downloading an update or
> game.  Luckily, we can manage this with our Procera now so we don’t hear
> from customers as much.
>
>
>
> Kris McElroy
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From: *<wireless-boun...@wispa.org> on behalf of Mike Hammett <
> wispawirel...@ics-il.net>
> *Reply-To: *WISPA General List <wireless@wispa.org>
> *Date: *Friday, December 15, 2017 at 9:51 AM
> *To: *WISPA General List <wireless@wispa.org>
> *Subject: *Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers
>
>
>
> Fair how?
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/>
> [image: mage removed by sender.] <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>[image:
> mage removed by sender.]
> <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb>[image:
> mage removed by sender.]
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions>[image:
> mage removed by sender.] <https://twitter.com/ICSIL>
> Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/>
> [image: mage removed by sender.] <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix>[image:
> mage removed by sender.]
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange>[image: mage
> removed by sender.] <https://twitter.com/mdwestix>
> The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/>
> [image: mage removed by sender.]
> <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>[image: mage removed by sender.]
> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg>
> --
>
> *From: *"Vance Shipley" <van...@sigscale.com>
> *To: *"WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org>
> *Sent: *Friday, December 15, 2017 9:43:31 AM
> *Subject: *Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers
>
> Because it's the fair thing to do. As a neighbour I would greatly
> appreciate it.
>
>
>
> On Dec 15, 2017 21:05, "Mike Hammett" <wispawirel...@ics-il.net> wrote:
>
> Why?
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/>
> [image: mage removed by sender.] <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>[image:
> mage removed by sender.]
> <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb>[image:
> mage removed by sender.]
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions>[image:
> mage removed by sender.] <https://twitter.com/ICSIL>
> Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/>
> [image: mage removed by sender.] <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix>[image:
> mage removed by sender.]
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange>[image: mage
> removed by sender.] <https://twitter.com/mdwestix>
> The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/>
> [image: mage removed by sender.]
> <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>[image: mage removed by sender.]
> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg>
> --
>
> *From: *"Rory Conaway" <r...@triadwireless.net>
> *To: *"WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org>
> *Sent: *Wednesday, December 13, 2017 11:04:43 AM
> *Subject: *Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers
>
> I want to be able to throttle torrent users.  Beyond that, I don't think
> it will affect us much in areas of high-competition.
>
> Rory
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] O

Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

[Josh Luthman]

Do you not have a DMCA contact?  I get these things daily and I have a
pretty small customer count with a geographic that I would suspect is
minimally using Bittorrent.


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Fri, Dec 15, 2017 at 12:38 PM, Seth Mattinen  wrote:

> On 12/13/17 9:04 AM, Rory Conaway wrote:
> > I want to be able to throttle torrent users.  Beyond that, I don't think
> it will affect us much in areas of high-competition.
>
>
> I don't really see torrents as a major thing anymore, not like what it
> used to be anyway.
> ___
> Wireless mailing list
> Wireless@wispa.org
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
___
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Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

[Seth Mattinen]

On 12/13/17 9:04 AM, Rory Conaway wrote:
> I want to be able to throttle torrent users.  Beyond that, I don't think it 
> will affect us much in areas of high-competition.


I don't really see torrents as a major thing anymore, not like what it 
used to be anyway.
___
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Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

[Kris McElroy]

I would agree with Adair, Torrent is a non-issue for us.  We have seen more 
complaints from Windows Update and Xbox Live Updates impacting customers 
connections, meaning they call in and say “I am paying for 20 Meg service and 
when I run a speed test I am only seeing 2 Meg Down or wny is my Netflix 
buffering”.  We go and look and they will have a windows update running in the 
background taking 18-19 Meg of their connection up and you have to explain that 
to them, same way with Xbox accept all our gamers have our 50 Meg plan and it 
will chew up 30 to 40 Meg downloading an update or game.  Luckily, we can 
manage this with our Procera now so we don’t hear from customers as much.

Kris McElroy



From: <wireless-boun...@wispa.org> on behalf of Mike Hammett 
<wispawirel...@ics-il.net>
Reply-To: WISPA General List <wireless@wispa.org>
Date: Friday, December 15, 2017 at 9:51 AM
To: WISPA General List <wireless@wispa.org>
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

Fair how?


-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions<http://www.ics-il.com/>
[mage removed by sender.]<https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>[mage removed by 
sender.]<https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb>[mage 
removed by 
sender.]<https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions>[mage 
removed by sender.]<https://twitter.com/ICSIL>
Midwest Internet Exchange<http://www.midwest-ix.com/>
[mage removed by sender.]<https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix>[mage removed by 
sender.]<https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange>[mage 
removed by sender.]<https://twitter.com/mdwestix>
The Brothers WISP<http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/>
[mage removed by sender.]<https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>[mage 
removed by sender.]<https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg>

From: "Vance Shipley" <van...@sigscale.com>
To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org>
Sent: Friday, December 15, 2017 9:43:31 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers
Because it's the fair thing to do. As a neighbour I would greatly appreciate it.

On Dec 15, 2017 21:05, "Mike Hammett" 
<wispawirel...@ics-il.net<mailto:wispawirel...@ics-il.net>> wrote:
Why?


-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions<http://www.ics-il.com/>
[mage removed by sender.]<https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>[mage removed by 
sender.]<https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb>[mage 
removed by 
sender.]<https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions>[mage 
removed by sender.]<https://twitter.com/ICSIL>
Midwest Internet Exchange<http://www.midwest-ix.com/>
[mage removed by sender.]<https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix>[mage removed by 
sender.]<https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange>[mage 
removed by sender.]<https://twitter.com/mdwestix>
The Brothers WISP<http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/>
[mage removed by sender.]<https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>[mage 
removed by sender.]<https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg>
____________
From: "Rory Conaway" <r...@triadwireless.net<mailto:r...@triadwireless.net>>
To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org<mailto:wireless@wispa.org>>
Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 11:04:43 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

I want to be able to throttle torrent users.  Beyond that, I don't think it 
will affect us much in areas of high-competition.

Rory

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org<mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org> 
[mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org<mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org>] On 
Behalf Of Seth Mattinen
Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2017 6:57 PM
To: wireless@wispa.org<mailto:wireless@wispa.org>
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

On 12/10/17 2:44 PM, Chadwick Wachs wrote:
> What are the current thoughts on the effects of net neutrality being
> over turned on our bandwidth providers? I understand how the cable and
> DSL companies may react but as a small WISP, I've been thinking this
> will have little impact on us and our customers (since we don't intend
> on changing our policies) but I may not be thinking about the bigger
> picture enough. Perhaps my bandwidth and upstream fiber providers will
> raise rates or charge premium fees for fast lanes to middle mile access.


Nothing. It wasn't mayhem in the decades before 2015 and it won't suddenly 
become a problem now. The big guys are always going to try some crap until 
someone calls them on it, "net neutrality" or not.

___
Wireless 

Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

[Mike Hammett]

Fair how? 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 

- Original Message -

From: "Vance Shipley" <van...@sigscale.com> 
To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org> 
Sent: Friday, December 15, 2017 9:43:31 AM 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers 


Because it's the fair thing to do. As a neighbour I would greatly appreciate 
it. 


On Dec 15, 2017 21:05, "Mike Hammett" < wispawirel...@ics-il.net > wrote: 




Why? 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 



From: "Rory Conaway" < r...@triadwireless.net > 
To: "WISPA General List" < wireless@wispa.org > 
Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 11:04:43 AM 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers 

I want to be able to throttle torrent users. Beyond that, I don't think it will 
affect us much in areas of high-competition. 

Rory 

-Original Message- 
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto: wireless-boun...@wispa.org ] On 
Behalf Of Seth Mattinen 
Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2017 6:57 PM 
To: wireless@wispa.org 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers 

On 12/10/17 2:44 PM, Chadwick Wachs wrote: 
> What are the current thoughts on the effects of net neutrality being 
> over turned on our bandwidth providers? I understand how the cable and 
> DSL companies may react but as a small WISP, I've been thinking this 
> will have little impact on us and our customers (since we don't intend 
> on changing our policies) but I may not be thinking about the bigger 
> picture enough. Perhaps my bandwidth and upstream fiber providers will 
> raise rates or charge premium fees for fast lanes to middle mile access. 


Nothing. It wasn't mayhem in the decades before 2015 and it won't suddenly 
become a problem now. The big guys are always going to try some crap until 
someone calls them on it, "net neutrality" or not. 

___ 
Wireless mailing list 
Wireless@wispa.org 
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless 
___ 
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Wireless@wispa.org 
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless 


___ 
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Wireless@wispa.org 
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless 




___ 
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Wireless@wispa.org 
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless 

___
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Wireless@wispa.org
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Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

[Adair Winter]

we see very little DMCA notices anymore. Maybe 2-4 a month. of those that
come it they seem to be from people using Kodi to "stream" and they have no
idea what is actually happening in the background.

On Fri, Dec 15, 2017 at 9:42 AM, Josh Luthman <j...@imaginenetworksllc.com>
wrote:

> Damn DMCA notices!
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340 <(937)%20552-2340>
> Direct: 937-552-2343 <(937)%20552-2343>
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> On Dec 15, 2017 10:34 AM, "Mike Hammett" <wispawirel...@ics-il.net> wrote:
>
>> Why?
>>
>>
>>
>> -
>> Mike Hammett
>> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/>
>> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
>> <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb>
>> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions>
>> <https://twitter.com/ICSIL>
>> Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/>
>> <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix>
>> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange>
>> <https://twitter.com/mdwestix>
>> The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/>
>> <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>
>> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg>
>> --
>> *From: *"Rory Conaway" <r...@triadwireless.net>
>> *To: *"WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org>
>> *Sent: *Wednesday, December 13, 2017 11:04:43 AM
>> *Subject: *Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers
>>
>> I want to be able to throttle torrent users.  Beyond that, I don't think
>> it will affect us much in areas of high-competition.
>>
>> Rory
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
>> Behalf Of Seth Mattinen
>> Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2017 6:57 PM
>> To: wireless@wispa.org
>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers
>>
>> On 12/10/17 2:44 PM, Chadwick Wachs wrote:
>> > What are the current thoughts on the effects of net neutrality being
>> > over turned on our bandwidth providers? I understand how the cable and
>> > DSL companies may react but as a small WISP, I've been thinking this
>> > will have little impact on us and our customers (since we don't intend
>> > on changing our policies) but I may not be thinking about the bigger
>> > picture enough. Perhaps my bandwidth and upstream fiber providers will
>> > raise rates or charge premium fees for fast lanes to middle mile access.
>>
>>
>> Nothing. It wasn't mayhem in the decades before 2015 and it won't
>> suddenly become a problem now. The big guys are always going to try some
>> crap until someone calls them on it, "net neutrality" or not.
>>
>> ___
>> Wireless mailing list
>> Wireless@wispa.org
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>> ___
>> Wireless mailing list
>> Wireless@wispa.org
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>>
>> ___
>> Wireless mailing list
>> Wireless@wispa.org
>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>>
>>
> ___
> Wireless mailing list
> Wireless@wispa.org
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
>


-- 

Adair Winter
VP, Network Operations / Co-Owner
Amarillo Wireless | 806.316.5071
C: 806.231.7180
http://www.amarillowireless.net
<http://www.amarillowireless.net>
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Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

[Vance Shipley]

Because it's the fair thing to do. As a neighbour I would greatly
appreciate it.

On Dec 15, 2017 21:05, "Mike Hammett" <wispawirel...@ics-il.net> wrote:

> Why?
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/>
> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
> <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb>
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions>
> <https://twitter.com/ICSIL>
> Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/>
> <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix>
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange>
> <https://twitter.com/mdwestix>
> The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/>
> <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>
> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg>
> --
> *From: *"Rory Conaway" <r...@triadwireless.net>
> *To: *"WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org>
> *Sent: *Wednesday, December 13, 2017 11:04:43 AM
> *Subject: *Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers
>
> I want to be able to throttle torrent users.  Beyond that, I don't think
> it will affect us much in areas of high-competition.
>
> Rory
>
> -----Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> Behalf Of Seth Mattinen
> Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2017 6:57 PM
> To: wireless@wispa.org
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers
>
> On 12/10/17 2:44 PM, Chadwick Wachs wrote:
> > What are the current thoughts on the effects of net neutrality being
> > over turned on our bandwidth providers? I understand how the cable and
> > DSL companies may react but as a small WISP, I've been thinking this
> > will have little impact on us and our customers (since we don't intend
> > on changing our policies) but I may not be thinking about the bigger
> > picture enough. Perhaps my bandwidth and upstream fiber providers will
> > raise rates or charge premium fees for fast lanes to middle mile access.
>
>
> Nothing. It wasn't mayhem in the decades before 2015 and it won't suddenly
> become a problem now. The big guys are always going to try some crap until
> someone calls them on it, "net neutrality" or not.
>
> ___
> Wireless mailing list
> Wireless@wispa.org
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> ___
> Wireless mailing list
> Wireless@wispa.org
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
>
> ___
> Wireless mailing list
> Wireless@wispa.org
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
>
___
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Wireless@wispa.org
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Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

[Josh Luthman]

Damn DMCA notices!

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Dec 15, 2017 10:34 AM, "Mike Hammett" <wispawirel...@ics-il.net> wrote:

> Why?
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/>
> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
> <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb>
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions>
> <https://twitter.com/ICSIL>
> Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/>
> <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix>
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange>
> <https://twitter.com/mdwestix>
> The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/>
> <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>
> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg>
> --
> *From: *"Rory Conaway" <r...@triadwireless.net>
> *To: *"WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org>
> *Sent: *Wednesday, December 13, 2017 11:04:43 AM
> *Subject: *Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers
>
> I want to be able to throttle torrent users.  Beyond that, I don't think
> it will affect us much in areas of high-competition.
>
> Rory
>
> -----Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> Behalf Of Seth Mattinen
> Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2017 6:57 PM
> To: wireless@wispa.org
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers
>
> On 12/10/17 2:44 PM, Chadwick Wachs wrote:
> > What are the current thoughts on the effects of net neutrality being
> > over turned on our bandwidth providers? I understand how the cable and
> > DSL companies may react but as a small WISP, I've been thinking this
> > will have little impact on us and our customers (since we don't intend
> > on changing our policies) but I may not be thinking about the bigger
> > picture enough. Perhaps my bandwidth and upstream fiber providers will
> > raise rates or charge premium fees for fast lanes to middle mile access.
>
>
> Nothing. It wasn't mayhem in the decades before 2015 and it won't suddenly
> become a problem now. The big guys are always going to try some crap until
> someone calls them on it, "net neutrality" or not.
>
> ___
> Wireless mailing list
> Wireless@wispa.org
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
> ___
> Wireless mailing list
> Wireless@wispa.org
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
>
> ___
> Wireless mailing list
> Wireless@wispa.org
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
>
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Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

[Mike Hammett]

Why? 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 

- Original Message -

From: "Rory Conaway" <r...@triadwireless.net> 
To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org> 
Sent: Wednesday, December 13, 2017 11:04:43 AM 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers 

I want to be able to throttle torrent users. Beyond that, I don't think it will 
affect us much in areas of high-competition. 

Rory 

-Original Message- 
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf 
Of Seth Mattinen 
Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2017 6:57 PM 
To: wireless@wispa.org 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers 

On 12/10/17 2:44 PM, Chadwick Wachs wrote: 
> What are the current thoughts on the effects of net neutrality being 
> over turned on our bandwidth providers? I understand how the cable and 
> DSL companies may react but as a small WISP, I've been thinking this 
> will have little impact on us and our customers (since we don't intend 
> on changing our policies) but I may not be thinking about the bigger 
> picture enough. Perhaps my bandwidth and upstream fiber providers will 
> raise rates or charge premium fees for fast lanes to middle mile access. 


Nothing. It wasn't mayhem in the decades before 2015 and it won't suddenly 
become a problem now. The big guys are always going to try some crap until 
someone calls them on it, "net neutrality" or not. 

___ 
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Wireless@wispa.org 
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless 
___ 
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Wireless@wispa.org 
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless 

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Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality bandwidth providers

[Adair Winter]

Torrent traffic is less than 1% of our network traffic. It's never been a
big deal for us like it probably once was.

On Fri, Dec 15, 2017 at 9:19 AM, Dan Thompson <d...@peakenetbroadband.com>
wrote:

> Why do you want to be able to throttle torrent users specifically?
>
>
>  On Wed, 13 Dec 2017 12:04:43 -0500 * r...@triadwireless.net
> <r...@triadwireless.net> * wrote 
>
> I want to be able to throttle torrent users. Beyond that, I don't think it
> will affect us much in areas of high-competition.
>
> Rory
>
> -Original Message-
> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
> Behalf Of Seth Mattinen
> Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2017 6:57 PM
> To: wireless@wispa.org
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers
>
> On 12/10/17 2:44 PM, Chadwick Wachs wrote:
> > What are the current thoughts on the effects of net neutrality being
> > over turned on our bandwidth providers? I understand how the cable and
> > DSL companies may react but as a small WISP, I've been thinking this
> > will have little impact on us and our customers (since we don't intend
> > on changing our policies) but I may not be thinking about the bigger
> > picture enough. Perhaps my bandwidth and upstream fiber providers will
> > raise rates or charge premium fees for fast lanes to middle mile access.
>
>
> Nothing. It wasn't mayhem in the decades before 2015 and it won't suddenly
> become a problem now. The big guys are always going to try some crap until
> someone calls them on it, "net neutrality" or not.
>
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>
>
>
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>
>


-- 

Adair Winter
VP, Network Operations / Co-Owner
Amarillo Wireless | 806.316.5071
C: 806.231.7180
http://www.amarillowireless.net
<http://www.amarillowireless.net>
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Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality bandwidth providers

[Dan Thompson]

Why do you want to be able to throttle torrent users specifically?

 On Wed, 13 Dec 2017 12:04:43 -0500 r...@triadwireless.net wrote 

I want to be able to throttle torrent users. Beyond that, I don't think it will 
affect us much in areas of high-competition. 

Rory 

-Original Message- 
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf 
Of Seth Mattinen 
Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2017 6:57 PM 
To: wireless@wispa.org 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers 

On 12/10/17 2:44 PM, Chadwick Wachs wrote: 
> What are the current thoughts on the effects of net neutrality being 
> over turned on our bandwidth providers? I understand how the cable and 
> DSL companies may react but as a small WISP, I've been thinking this 
> will have little impact on us and our customers (since we don't intend 
> on changing our policies) but I may not be thinking about the bigger 
> picture enough. Perhaps my bandwidth and upstream fiber providers will 
> raise rates or charge premium fees for fast lanes to middle mile access. 


Nothing. It wasn't mayhem in the decades before 2015 and it won't suddenly 
become a problem now. The big guys are always going to try some crap until 
someone calls them on it, "net neutrality" or not. 

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Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

[Rory Conaway]

I want to be able to throttle torrent users.  Beyond that, I don't think it 
will affect us much in areas of high-competition.

Rory

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf 
Of Seth Mattinen
Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2017 6:57 PM
To: wireless@wispa.org
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

On 12/10/17 2:44 PM, Chadwick Wachs wrote:
> What are the current thoughts on the effects of net neutrality being 
> over turned on our bandwidth providers? I understand how the cable and 
> DSL companies may react but as a small WISP, I've been thinking this 
> will have little impact on us and our customers (since we don't intend 
> on changing our policies) but I may not be thinking about the bigger 
> picture enough. Perhaps my bandwidth and upstream fiber providers will 
> raise rates or charge premium fees for fast lanes to middle mile access.


Nothing. It wasn't mayhem in the decades before 2015 and it won't suddenly 
become a problem now. The big guys are always going to try some crap until 
someone calls them on it, "net neutrality" or not.

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Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

[Seth Mattinen]

On 12/10/17 2:44 PM, Chadwick Wachs wrote:
> What are the current thoughts on the effects of net neutrality being 
> over turned on our bandwidth providers? I understand how the cable and 
> DSL companies may react but as a small WISP, I've been thinking this 
> will have little impact on us and our customers (since we don't intend 
> on changing our policies) but I may not be thinking about the bigger 
> picture enough. Perhaps my bandwidth and upstream fiber providers will 
> raise rates or charge premium fees for fast lanes to middle mile access.


Nothing. It wasn't mayhem in the decades before 2015 and it won't 
suddenly become a problem now. The big guys are always going to try some 
crap until someone calls them on it, "net neutrality" or not.

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Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

[Chadwick Wachs]

That was part of my "assumption" but every time I make an assumption
I'm hoping to see a resurgence in smaller ISPs as a result of repealing net
neutrality.

On Dec 10, 2017 3:50 PM, "Mike Hammett" <wispawirel...@ics-il.net> wrote:

> Net Neutrality never applied to anything other than mass-market
> consumer-facing services.
>
>
>
> -
> Mike Hammett
> Intelligent Computing Solutions <http://www.ics-il.com/>
> <https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL>
> <https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb>
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions>
> <https://twitter.com/ICSIL>
> Midwest Internet Exchange <http://www.midwest-ix.com/>
> <https://www.facebook.com/mdwestix>
> <https://www.linkedin.com/company/midwest-internet-exchange>
> <https://twitter.com/mdwestix>
> The Brothers WISP <http://www.thebrotherswisp.com/>
> <https://www.facebook.com/thebrotherswisp>
> <https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXSdfxQv7SpoRQYNyLwntZg>
> ----------
> *From: *"Chadwick Wachs" <c...@auwireless.net>
> *To: *wireless@wispa.org
> *Sent: *Sunday, December 10, 2017 4:44:34 PM
> *Subject: *[WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers
>
> What are the current thoughts on the effects of net neutrality being over
> turned on our bandwidth providers? I understand how the cable and DSL
> companies may react but as a small WISP, I've been thinking this will have
> little impact on us and our customers (since we don't intend on changing
> our policies) but I may not be thinking about the bigger picture enough.
> Perhaps my bandwidth and upstream fiber providers will raise rates or
> charge premium fees for fast lanes to middle mile access.
>
> How far reaching could this go? My hope was there is more competition in
> data centers for bandwidth so we won't see the games the last mile (cable &
> telco) providers might play with customers and content providers.
>
> ___
> Wireless mailing list
> Wireless@wispa.org
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
>
> ___
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> Wireless@wispa.org
> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
>
>
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Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

[Mike Hammett]

Net Neutrality never applied to anything other than mass-market consumer-facing 
services. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 

Midwest Internet Exchange 

The Brothers WISP 

- Original Message -

From: "Chadwick Wachs" <c...@auwireless.net> 
To: wireless@wispa.org 
Sent: Sunday, December 10, 2017 4:44:34 PM 
Subject: [WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers 


What are the current thoughts on the effects of net neutrality being over 
turned on our bandwidth providers? I understand how the cable and DSL companies 
may react but as a small WISP, I've been thinking this will have little impact 
on us and our customers (since we don't intend on changing our policies) but I 
may not be thinking about the bigger picture enough. Perhaps my bandwidth and 
upstream fiber providers will raise rates or charge premium fees for fast lanes 
to middle mile access. 


How far reaching could this go? My hope was there is more competition in data 
centers for bandwidth so we won't see the games the last mile (cable & telco) 
providers might play with customers and content providers. 
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[WISPA] Net neutrality & bandwidth providers

[Chadwick Wachs]

What are the current thoughts on the effects of net neutrality being over
turned on our bandwidth providers? I understand how the cable and DSL
companies may react but as a small WISP, I've been thinking this will have
little impact on us and our customers (since we don't intend on changing
our policies) but I may not be thinking about the bigger picture enough.
Perhaps my bandwidth and upstream fiber providers will raise rates or
charge premium fees for fast lanes to middle mile access.

How far reaching could this go? My hope was there is more competition in
data centers for bandwidth so we won't see the games the last mile (cable &
telco) providers might play with customers and content providers.
___
Wireless mailing list
Wireless@wispa.org
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