[Zope] Length of a list (was: [Zope] How does one display document count of a folder?)
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: > I am using a script to display the contents of a folder, but I > wonder how I might display a document count of the dtml > documents in a folder? You want to get the length of a list, in your case the return value of "objectIds". This is a FAQ: you use "_.len()" or (insided a dtml-in) "". Dieter ___ Zope maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
[Zope] Modification Posts to the list (was: [Zope] Import from file via management-interface)
Hi Tino (and other potential patch posters), if possibly, you should not post complete source modules to the list. Instead, you should use either context or uniform differences to the source. Such a difference file is called a patch. Patches have considerable advantages over the complete source: * they are much smaller * they can (usually) be applied to more than one version * they show directly what has been changed, this is essential for a decision whether or not to trust the changes. I will never install any source modules posted to the list. Usually, I will not even look at them. Patches can be created with the "diff" utility. This is a "standard" unix program (i.e. installed on any Unix system). There is an improved GNU version, which is also available for Win/32. There are other Windows implementations for "diff". Patches are applied with the "patch" utility. Again, there is a GNU version, and surely there are versions for Win/32. Dieter ___ Zope maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
[Zope] Object from Object Id (was: [Zope] Get help about variable and entity of Zope.)
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: >With DTML,I define a variable AA, and let AA equal a object's ID, > HOW can I get the object's property through the variable AA? Maybe > need a function? > Need your help? > > I want to express as : > (Name=1)"> You have an object ID (in your AA variable) and you want to get the object accessible through this object ID. This is an FAQ: you use "_.getitem()" in your case "_.getitem(AA)". Dieter ___ Zope maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] locale and Splitter.c on FreeBSD - where is the bug ?
Aleksander Salwa writes: > > Some time ago I had a problem with locales on FreeBSD. > > On all machines I'm working on, 'char' is signed. > On Linux/x86, isalpha and others works fine with positive and negative > values of national characters. (For example, one polish character is > '\xc6', what can be evaluated as unsigned 198, or signed -58.) > But on FreeBSD/x86 these functions work only with values >127. > Because 'char' is signed, it needs casting to work with national > characters. > > Now, the question is: is it a bug in Splitter.c or in FreeBSD system > libraries ? (or misconfigured system) Probably in the FreeBSD library, because not only "Splitter.c" uses "char" for strings but almost all C modules I know of. Nevertheless, you patch to "splitter" should be welcome as it solves a usability problem on FreeBSD systems. Put it into the collector (URL:http://classic.zope.org/Collector). You may file a problem report to the FreeBSD maintainers in parallel. Dieter ___ Zope maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
[Zope] Changing list elements (was: [Zope] 2d list manipulation)
Tim Russell writes: > 2 dimensional list access and modification of elements > I can easily access the value of > an element using: > > > > However, the difficulty comes when trying to change the value of one of > these elements There is no easy and safe way to do it in DTML (because a list does not have a method to replace a list element. If interested in a hack, you may look at the list methods "remove" and "insert"). The easiest thing is to write an external (or Python) method. Dieter ___ Zope maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
[Zope] Re: Modification Posts to the list (was: [Zope] Import from file viamanagement-interface)management-interface)
Hi Dieter, Dieter Maurer wrote: > > Hi Tino (and other potential patch posters), > > if possibly, you should not post complete source modules > to the list. Instead, you should use either context > or uniform differences to the source. Such a difference file is > called a patch. Yes. I know that ;-) (Beside the file size, which was really wrong to send to the list, you can of course diff the post with your version to get the changes) Regards Tino ___ Zope maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
[Zope] Best way to handle SQL update with variable number of fields?
Hello, I'm creating a number of ZSQL methods to insert, update and delete records from several Oracle tables. Everything is working fine with the insert forms (creating new records) and the delete (of course). However, the best way to do the * update * without locking the user into a *very* rigid format is eluding me.. The problem - I would like to populate the form with the existing values and then allow the user to change the ones they want to. Some of the fields in the database are empty and it will always be that way. The length of the update statement will change. Nomatter how I do it, I am having problems with the commas. What is the best way to build the necessary logic into the form? Is there a sample in a product or a How-to somewhere that I can look at? I am assuming I need to create a list externally in a method and use that to determine the comma placement. Is that the "correct" direction? Or is there a better way.. Thank you, Chris Beaumont [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Zope maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
[Zope] [HELP] Duplicated Ids?
I removed a product from Control_Panel/Products by checking the checkbox of that item and clicked "delete" button below. While I tring to reimport that product , zope (2.2.1) complains about "Duplicated Ids". Can anyone give a hand? Thanks a lot. Iap, Singuan http://y2fun.com ___ Zope maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] Looking for Zope vs. Others at-a-glance comparison
Jason Cunliffe wrote:
> What's missing?
For example, everything with Java (e.g. Apple WebObjects) or
Perl (e.g. Mason).
There is a good overview of Content Management Systems at
http://www.camworld.com/cms/
> For each of above I'd like to fill in the following:
>
> {'name':"", 'features':{},'pro':[],
> 'con':[] }
That's a bit difficult to do because we don't know what you
want to do with a CMS/web application platform. Manila, for
instance, is a nice end-user weblog application but not a
replacement for a real web app server.
> If was more adept in DTML was I could put up a comparative poll page though
> I suspect most here would respond like you Nils.
I'm only an innocent Computer Science student who still thinks
that in Real Life (tm) outside university you research competing
solutions before selecting a product :-)
Anyone else seeing the parallel to software mentioned in Douglas
Adams' "Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency"?
Cheers,
Nils
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (preferred)
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[Zope] Emacs and dtml-mode +/-
HI, I have installed the dtml-mode that provided http://www.zope.org/Members/alburt under Debian potato, emacs20 and psgml it work so nice but i have a little question, and i don't know if it is possible to resolve, consider the following html code: Check out that i can not insert a tag inside the tag, ok what i want to know (if there is any dtd guru here) is: there is posible to define a rule in this dtd to see that the is inside a select and it shows as a correct element the tag? I know it cat be done by using brutal force but i want to be "politically correct". Another question? Thats anybody know about a "html indenter" i mean something like the program indent avaialable under Linux ? for html? i know emacs indent but i have to press the on each line, or i'm missing some macro? It would be nice that this program can run under zope to show the html code generated beautifully for debug reasons, dont you think so? and desactivate it under a production environment. Well that's all folks, Bye, -- Nestor A. Diaz Ingeniero de Desarrollo Engendro - Comercio Electronico sobre Linux Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - WWW: http://www.engendro.com ___ Zope maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
RE: [Zope] keeping Java Servlets session ids based on url rewriti ng
Thanks for the clarifications... > We use servlets for java to java com between applets and the > server. Inside, the servlets communicates to C++ based servers for > objects and events. Servlet sessions are used to help ensure > validation > for the object and event servers. User database is also stored in the > object repository. Getting the session id for the servlet back into > Zope (I was going to store it in a SQLSession object.) was the reason > for preserving the ; from a response redirect generated by > servlet. All pages with applets would be written with the servlet > session ID as a parameter. We were going to use https for anything > with session ids in them so they can not be sniffed for. OK, I think I understand... you need to keep using the servlets-style URL-rewriting because you serve Java applets that make use of sessionids, and you may want to serve these from Zope. I've done a little poking around in ZPublisher's HTTPRequest.py and BaseRequest.py and I don't think that's where the ';*' gets stripped. I can't find *where* it gets stripped. It must be possible to make Zope de-ignore things split on a ";", but right now I can't find out where to do so. > I had not decided if the user database exchange would be done by using > the client as a relay with user info emedded in > user,md5-password-signature components in the session id response > redirect or some Zope to JServ direct handshaking using > ZPatterns-based Membership. Yet another alternative would be the swig > Python interface directly to the object server and Zpatterns. >From what little I know about Java servlets, I believe it keeps all the session objects in separate files within a directory on servlet's server's filesystem. Are they in an opaque format? Are they named with the sessionid? Maybe you could let Zope peek at these. > > Hope this helps clarifys things.. > > Albert Boulanger > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > - > ___ Zope maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
[Zope] Testing out new versions of XXX (in this case, WorldPilot)
What is the best way to test out new versions of Products without breaking an existing setup? Should I simply "version" the current working version, then install new stuff to test, etc, or is there any easy way to have products "ORIGINAL" and "ORIGINAL-2" (which is what I'd prefer, for stability comparisons) (in this case, I'm curious about the palm-syncing features of WP 1.1alpha for our home server, but can't afford to break our current WWW-based email access...?) Or should I just copy Data.fs and manually revert in case of accident? Advice appreciated! best, -tony -- A.J. RossiniRsrch. Asst. Prof. of Biostatistics BlindGlobe Networks (home/default) [EMAIL PROTECTED] UW Biostat/Center for AIDS Research [EMAIL PROTECTED] FHCRC/SCHARP/HIV Vaccine Trials Net [EMAIL PROTECTED] CFAR: M/F: 206-731-3647 (fax=3694) | Email is far better than phone FHCRC: Tu/W: 206-667-7025 (fax=4812) | Voicemail is pretty sketchy UW: Th: 206-543-1044 (fax=3286) | Change last 4 digits of phone for fax ___ Zope maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] keeping Java Servlets session ids based on url rewriti ng
I've done a little poking around in ZPublisher's HTTPRequest.py and BaseRequest.py and I don't think that's where the ';*' gets stripped. I can't find *where* it gets stripped. It must be possible to make Zope de-ignore things split on a ";", but right now I can't find out where to do so. Um from looking at the code I think it may be Zserver not Zpublisher doing it. I think there is code which set up the CGI env vars at Zpublisher pick em up and works with them, so it is the code that sets those GCI vars that is dropping it. Isn't it tru that if you use APACHE, they are set by APACHE and is you use Zserver w/o frontending it with APACHE something in Zserver has to be setting them? Regards, Albert ___ Zope maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
RE: [Zope] keeping Java Servlets session ids based on url rewriti ng
> Um from looking at the code I think it may be Zserver not Zpublisher > doing it. I think there is code which set up the CGI env vars at > Zpublisher pick em up and works with them, so it is the code that sets > those GCI vars that is dropping it. Isn't it tru that if you use > APACHE, they are set by APACHE and is you use Zserver w/o frontending > it with APACHE something in Zserver has to be setting them? That sounds reasonable. I'd imagine it would have something to do with PATH_INFO, PATH_TRANSLATED, or SCRIPT_NAME. Have you looked for calls to the Python cgi module in ZServer? I might start by looking for it trying to assign these environment variables to see what it does. Sorry I can't give you any more specifics. ___ Zope maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] Looking for Zope vs. Others at-a-glance comparison
Hi Nils
thanks for your reply
> > What's missing?
>
> For example, everything with Java (e.g. Apple WebObjects) or
> Perl (e.g. Mason).
[doh] Java..Right [see what using zope does to one ? ;-)
> There is a good overview of Content Management Systems at
>
> http://www.camworld.com/cms/
Excellent. Thanks very much for this.
and supplying a magic_phrase = 'Content Management System'
> > For each of above I'd like to fill in the following:
> >
> > {'name':"", 'features':{},'pro':[],
> > 'con':[] }
>
> That's a bit difficult to do because we don't know what you
> want to do with a CMS/web application platform. Manila, for
> instance, is a nice end-user weblog application but not a
> replacement for a real web app server.
Yes of course not.
But imagine one meets up with a small group of experienced people who have
all been working around Content Management Systems, are in Zope and are
tracking the developments both potential and RealWorld(tm). The you ask them
ok to get started can please resume for me zope and alternative systems
according you whatever priorities/experiences you wish. That conversation is
_not_ going to read like a research document. It is going be opinionated,
informed, direct and typically subjectively prioritized.. and damn helpful
I agree about Manila.
pros = ['good idea', 'great community', 'cool interesting RealWorld sites',
'designer-savvy', 'very user friendly' ]
cons = ['mac/win only', 'does not scale well to become 'real' web app
server', etc..]
What is very impressive is that it has focused on some real end user need
and answered that in large part. Zope could learn a lot from Manila.
[Zopefish etc]. Mostly Zope imho is just plain damn ugly out of the box...
like some ghost from the 70s - zero graphics sense.. it s a bitch to make a
decventlooking page in zope when it shouldn't be, not one nice looking zope
site I have visited yet vs. all those nice looking nice reading Weblogs.
Why?? Well Zope is very cool and powerful adn full of potential but try to
use it and even seasoned programmers become unraveled in obfuscated syntax,
etc etc.
I love what Zope represents, what it _can_ do, but I do not like what I see
people actually doing with it. This continues to bother me and I keep my eye
on where the alternatives are going for much the same reasons. Jeff Shelton
has been putting up great service with his ZopeNewbies page. Not an accident
that he is running it on Manila - because Manila makes it easy to set this
stuff up and keep it going. Zope does not.
In part the difference are that Manila attracts a more aesthetically
[visually] aware crowd than Zope. Zope is geeky and damn proud of it. Zope
rocks but there are no rocking zope sites that I can tell. Please correct me
if I am wrong.
[yes I am Awaiting some real news about CBS etc]
But look at the 'Case Studies' page..
It is not even titled 'Sites using Zope'
instead "The following are a list of case studies in which Zope provided the
solution."
Reading between the lines it does not inspire great confidence. Nor does
there appear to
Is the problem with the tool the technology or the users??
It is not an either or question - its a synergy issue.. But Zope does
nothing to encourage one alas nor do the examples out there, [yet].
Imagine if the home page at www.zope.org was built using Manila?
I'll bet it would be more dynamic more readable, more fun, more useful that
it is now. Even having a damn calendar to browse through developments, news
adn changes would be good. Not to mention the decidedly dead and strange
style and links. What a shame. But it does not stop me loving what is cool
about zope or trying to use it.
But as soon as more Manila-like Zope comes along I am likely going to jump
ship, because Zope is expensive to run. I am not talking about the free
price, I am talking about the counter-intuitive chaotically undocumented
nature of Zope.
And that costs developer time wickedly..Yes I know it is changing and
improving and I am holding on and hanging in there, hoping a) it improves
and b) I improve..
> > If was more adept in DTML was I could put up a comparative poll page
though
> > I suspect most here would respond like you Nils.
>
> I'm only an innocent Computer Science student who still thinks
> that in Real Life (tm) outside university you research competing
> solutions before selecting a product :-)
Of course you are right in this respect. We did that and
For-what-we-wanted-to-do, Zope met the most important criteria. But our
Project proposal was written and given the initial green light over 1 year
ago. It was an experiment to use zope then , and the experiment is still
running.
In brief I continue to be very impressed by portable import/export features
of Zope.
But we have elected to use External Methods to bypass lack-of-confidence and
some of the headaches we experienced doing things with DTML. We like the
resultant stretegy as it play sto both our own strengths and Zope's
strengths we think.
Re: [Zope] keeping Java Servlets session ids based on url rewriting
Hmmm.. can you take a step back and restate the problem more generally? What is the goal? We use servlets for java to java com between applets and the server. Inside, the servlets communicates to C++ based servers for objects and events. Servlet sessions are used to help ensure validation for the object and event servers. User database is also stored in the object repository. Getting the session id for the servlet back into Zope (I was going to store it in a SQLSession object.) was the reason for preserving the ; from a response redirect generated by servlet. All pages with applets would be written with the servlet session ID as a parameter. We were going to use https for anything with session ids in them so they can not be sniffed for. I had not decided if the user database exchange would be done by using the client as a relay with user info emedded in user,md5-password-signature components in the session id response redirect or some Zope to JServ direct handshaking using ZPatterns-based Membership. Yet another alternative would be the swig Python interface directly to the object server and Zpatterns. Hope this helps clarifys things.. Albert Boulanger [EMAIL PROTECTED] - ___ Zope maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
[Zope] Creating a new Role equivalent to Manager?
I want to create a Role (myRole) for an object which is equivalent to the Manager Role, basically kust with a different name. How do I (via python) say that myRole is equivalent? Something similar to this: self._addRole( 'myRole', InheritPermissionsFromManager() ) Thanks, kh ___ Zope maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
RE: [Zope] Best way to handle SQL update with variable number of fields?
I'm trying to understand exactly what you mean. I have some ZSQL Methods
that have an empty (INSERT INTO site_location VALUE('New York', '')) value
in them. For the above I use: INSERT INTO site_location VALUE(, ). Can you
provided your ZSQL Methods so we can understand better?
Troy Farrell
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 9/10/00 4:33 AM
Subject: [Zope] Best way to handle SQL update with variable number of
fields?
Hello,
I'm creating a number of ZSQL methods to insert, update and delete
records from several Oracle tables. Everything is working fine with
the insert forms (creating new records) and the delete (of course).
However, the best way to do the * update * without locking the user
into a *very* rigid format is eluding me..
The problem - I would like to populate the form with the existing
values and then allow the user to change the ones they want to. Some
of the fields in the database are empty and it will always be that
way. The length of the update statement will change.
Nomatter how I do it, I am having problems with the commas. What is
the best way to build the necessary logic into the form? Is there a
sample in a product or a How-to somewhere that I can look at?
I am assuming I need to create a list externally in a method and use
that to determine the comma placement. Is that the "correct"
direction? Or is there a better way..
Thank you,
Chris Beaumont
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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[Zope] Re: 2d list manipulation
OK, figured it out. About the only way I can see to do it in DTML is this: This command happens to increment the value at col[index1][index2], and this strategy allows any operation to be done on the value. It appears to be quite fast as well, so I'm content. --Tim ___ Zope maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
RE: [Zope] Looking for Zope vs. Others at-a-glance comparison
Completely calm and friendly opinions follow... > [Zopefish etc]. Mostly Zope imho is just plain damn ugly out of > the box... > like some ghost from the 70s - zero graphics sense.. it s a > bitch to make a > decventlooking page in zope when it shouldn't be, not one nice > looking zope > site I have visited yet vs. all those nice looking nice reading Weblogs. > Why?? Well Zope is very cool and powerful adn full of potential but try to > use it and even seasoned programmers become unraveled in > obfuscated syntax, > etc etc. I don't think it's any more difficult to create an attractive (graphics-wise) site in Zope than it is with PHP or ASP or plain old Apache-served HTML files. Quite honestly, I'm not qualified to do it with any tool. :-) I get the feeling that a lot of people expect Zope to design sites for them. Maybe they're expecting too much. Or maybe I'm expecting too little??? Or maybe it's that most of the people using Zope today (like me) are not pretty-site designers, but people that want a powerful tool to manage the most important part of a site...content. > I love what Zope represents, what it _can_ do, but I do not like > what I see > people actually doing with it. This continues to bother me and I > keep my eye > on where the alternatives are going for much the same reasons. > Jeff Shelton > has been putting up great service with his ZopeNewbies page. Not > an accident > that he is running it on Manila - because Manila makes it easy to set this > stuff up and keep it going. Zope does not. Zope is not to blame for what people have done with it on the visual side. Content is far more important than visual appeal. I see too many companies (many of my clients) ignoring this and focusing way too much on layout, placement of images, colors, cute JavaScript menus and other fancy stuff. I'm not saying these things are not at all important. Browsing an unattractive, sloppily layed out site with lots of useful information is annoying and distracting. But it's *far* better than browsing a fancy, "attractive" site that has nothing to offer other than sparse information, pretty images and slow viewing time. > In part the difference are that Manila attracts a more aesthetically > [visually] aware crowd than Zope. Zope is geeky and damn proud of it. Zope > rocks but there are no rocking zope sites that I can tell. Please > correct me > if I am wrong. > [yes I am Awaiting some real news about CBS etc] > But look at the 'Case Studies' page.. > > It is not even titled 'Sites using Zope' > instead "The following are a list of case studies in which Zope > provided the > solution." > Reading between the lines it does not inspire great confidence. Nor does > there appear to > > Is the problem with the tool the technology or the users?? > It is not an either or question - its a synergy issue.. But Zope does > nothing to encourage one alas nor do the examples out there, [yet]. It's the site designers. Zope isn't designed for assistance in creating attractive sites. It's designed for creating manageable sites. It's completely up to the designers to make it attractive, using tools designed to do so. Zope (in my experience) does nothing to limit the ability to make a site attractive, but it does do buckets for increasing manageability. > Imagine if the home page at www.zope.org was built using Manila? > I'll bet it would be more dynamic more readable, more fun, more > useful that > it is now. Even having a damn calendar to browse through > developments, news > adn changes would be good. Not to mention the decidedly dead and strange > style and links. What a shame. But it does not stop me loving what is cool > about zope or trying to use it. I'm comfortable that the zope.org developers will agree that their site is not the greatest thing on earth, esp. when it comes to prettiness. It is, however, consistent, easy to use, informative, and provides some nice real world examples of Zope's power. Using any of the already available calendar-like products for Zope, DC could easily create a calendar to browse through stuff. Again, it's not a limitation of Zope, the developers just didn't do it. > But we have elected to use External Methods to bypass > lack-of-confidence and > some of the headaches we experienced doing things with DTML. We like the > resultant stretegy as it play sto both our own strengths and Zope's > strengths we think. Perhaps your use of External Methods is because you should not have been trying it in DTML in the first place. I have seen so many times DTML used for things it just wasn't designed to do. After all, it's not a programming language. External Methods, Python Methods, ZSQL Methods and all the other methods are there for a reason. To each its own purpose. > So may question is was not: > - "What comparisons should I have made 12-18 months ago?", > but rather: > - "What is presently the state of play in Zope vs. Other Alternatives ?" I rant about the powers of Zo
[Zope] Partnership with B2B EMerging?
Hi guys or girls, I'd like to know if you are interested to partner with me, for the construction of B2B Emerging, at B2BEmerging.com. I would need someone technical, for Zope. I'm enthusiast and I put all my effort toward B2B Emerging. I invite you to read this site, it's a wonderful concept, with a marketing, a new marketplace. I have no limit, I think B2B Emerging could become the Amazon of the B2B. That's my goal. Of course it will be hard, that's why I wanted to create that project, but we learn when we have problems. I could do the site lonely, but to be alone, it's so hard. With someone to talk, it would be more interesting and more special. I want to partner with someone, I'm searching Mister B2B Emerging, a warrior, someone strong enough to understand that it could become the number one platform for businesses around the world. B2B Emerging is in the middle of Ventro and B Central. We could discuss about the partnership, I'm wide open. I want to change this world with this business, are you ready, I am. Very truly yours, <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><> Jonathan Desp Chairman and CEO, Atomasoft Inc. Matter will become software http://www.atomasoft.com/jonathan <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><> ___ Zope maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
[Zope] Re: Partnership with B2B EMerging?
oh I forgot, my email is [EMAIL PROTECTED], if you want to contact me, no problem. by phone too, just ask me. - Original Message - From: "Jonathan Desp" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "zope zope zope" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Sunday, September 10, 2000 10:08 PM Subject: Partnership with B2B EMerging? > Hi guys or girls, > > I'd like to know if you are interested to partner with me, for the > construction of B2B Emerging, at B2BEmerging.com. I would need someone > technical, for Zope. I'm enthusiast and I put all my effort toward B2B > Emerging. I invite you to read this site, it's a wonderful concept, with a > marketing, a new marketplace. I have no limit, I think B2B Emerging could > become the Amazon of the B2B. That's my goal. Of course it will be hard, > that's why I wanted to create that project, but we learn when we have > problems. I could do the site lonely, but to be alone, it's so hard. With > someone to talk, it would be more interesting and more special. I want to > partner with someone, I'm searching Mister B2B Emerging, a warrior, someone > strong enough to understand that it could become the number one platform for > businesses around the world. > > B2B Emerging is in the middle of Ventro and B Central. We could discuss > about the partnership, I'm wide open. I want to change this world with this > business, are you ready, I am. > > Very truly yours, > > <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><> > Jonathan Desp > Chairman and CEO, Atomasoft Inc. > Matter will become software > http://www.atomasoft.com/jonathan > <><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><><> > ___ Zope maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] Looking for Zope vs. Others at-a-glance comparison
> Completely calm and friendly opinions follow... yes thanks.. > I don't think it's any more difficult to create an attractive > (graphics-wise) site in Zope than it is with PHP or ASP or plain old > Apache-served HTML files. Quite honestly, I'm not qualified to do it with > any tool. :-) I get the feeling that a lot of people expect Zope to design > sites for them. Maybe they're expecting too much. Or maybe I'm expecting > too little??? Or maybe it's that most of the people using Zope today (like > me) are not pretty-site designers, but people that want a powerful tool to > manage the most important part of a site...content. I agree absolutely that Zope is on level with PHP, ASP apacheHTML in terms of ease. My point is that Zope allows one to create powerful highlevel functionality at many levels, wrapping, hiding, abstracting, reusing, modularizing things which potentially could allow graphic designers to jump in and do great work. But out of the box it does not and for perhaps cultural reasons will not..Zope is largely based on reusable templates, and chunks of 'smart-html' better known as DTML. What Manila has done is to provide some reasonable default templates for getting useful site development work done 'out of the box' - they have provided a structure template, and well defined access to changing the obvious things people want to change. Perhaps the only product which does for Zope is Squishdot.. and I think that largely explains why most Zope sites are Squishdot or modified squishdot sites. I do not believe it is content vs. style.. I really think it is a matter of Zope programmers working with graphics and web site interface designers to create some much more accessible site templates. I fear that without these Zope will be missing a great opportunity to extend itself into RealWorld web applications. It _has_ the capability but lacks the real benefits in the zope community 2-way dialogue between content managers and content presenters. The point of view is wonderful, but rather one sided. > Zope is not to blame for what people have done with it on the visual side. > Content is far more important than visual appeal. I see too many companies > (many of my clients) ignoring this and focusing way too much on layout, > placement of images, colors, cute JavaScript menus and other fancy stuff. > I'm not saying these things are not at all important. Browsing an > unattractive, sloppily layed out site with lots of useful information is > annoying and distracting. But it's *far* better than browsing a fancy, > "attractive" site that has nothing to offer other than sparse information, > pretty images and slow viewing time. Yes and Yes. But be careful not to ignore the implications that the medium is [part of] the message. Style _is_ part of the content. Depends on who and what your audience is. In so far as websites are [virtual] places, the look and feel of the environment does matter. Where people get carried away to either extreme they will surely fall off those edges. The invisible server-side aspects of sites will only be visible as experienced functionality by end users. But the visible client-side is all they will ever touch. yin and yang. How they fit together is where the magic lies. It takes a diversity of talents and perspectives to make this work. Content not style is a great mantra - but it leads to content without style [and vice versa] and who wants that? I did not say it had to be complex or excessive.. Less is more and much harder to design often. The problem is that to achieve good minimal design requires a lot of iterations. People are looking for new interface paradigms and also better tools to allow them to find them, and subsequently explore them when they do. This means tools with the flexibility of zope but not in it its present state of awareness. > It's the site designers. Zope isn't designed for assistance in creating > attractive sites. It's designed for creating manageable sites. It's > completely up to the designers to make it attractive, using tools designed > to do so. Zope (in my experience) does nothing to limit the ability to make > a site attractive, but it does do buckets for increasing manageability. Yes. I quite agree..But why are there no attractive Zope sites? My argument is that zope does nothing to HELP one's ability to make a site attractive. Actually it does limit one's ability. for example look at even the syntax for making an image object borderless? it aunt obvious.. and it could/should be part of the image object properties --or how about a rollover button.. Yes that is a JavaScript problem perhaps, but what about including that as a BASIC feature of modern websites. But imagine if that alone was made easier by zope. Navigation bar objects would be another big plus. Or how about a web page 'Table object' which made allowed one rapidly to group and include other zope object in a useful and productive way. This is not gratuitous
Re: [Zope] Testing out new versions of XXX (in this case, WorldPilot)
"A.J. Rossini" wrote: > > What is the best way to test out new versions of Products without > breaking an existing setup? Should I simply "version" the current > working version, then install new stuff to test, etc, or is there any > easy way to have products "ORIGINAL" and "ORIGINAL-2" (which is what > I'd prefer, for stability comparisons) > > (in this case, I'm curious about the palm-syncing features of WP > 1.1alpha for our home server, but can't afford to break our current > WWW-based email access...?) > > Or should I just copy Data.fs and manually revert in case of accident? > > Advice appreciated! Personally, I duplicate the site, and do testing on the secondary site. -- Do not meddle in the affairs of sysadmins, for they are easy to annoy, and have the root password. ___ Zope maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
[Zope] newbie dtml-if/expr ?
(zope-2.1.6, rh6-linux) How come I can't do this: ...or other obvious (e.g. (extra) (parenthesized)) variations thereupon, but the following seem to work: ... ...or this... ... ...or even worse, this... ... Can't seem to find the answer in the zqr or dtml reference... what am I missing here? Hopefully there's a simple answer. :) Many thanks, -Dan ___ Zope maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] Looking for Zope vs. Others at-a-glance comparison
Ron yes +thanks for paying keen attention here.. > > What Manila has done is to provide some reasonable default templates for > > getting useful site development work done 'out of the box' - they have > > provided a structure template, and well defined access to changing the > > obvious things people want to change. > > I see. Having higher level drop-in Web sites, IMO, is a job for add-on Zope > products that could be created by DC or the community to meet various needs > (as in Squishdot like projects). As the Zope community grows, I have no > doubt that more add-on products for "Web sites in a can" will pop up. Exactly. My concern is to get the right kind of discussion going because it is going to need some differnt kinds of minds to work together. > I can only guess that most Zope users are either not designers or are so > filled with awe over its power that they forget to put effort into beauty. > :-) I think Zope lends itself more to the programmer and content provider > types, and leaves the designer with nothing special to desire. I don't say > that in a bad way, but Zope isn't a design tool, so designers have no > special interest in learning to use it. As Zope makes its way into more > businesses with design teams, pretty design will make its way into more Zope > sites. Problem is am not sure Zopie will make its way into more businesses wiht design teams if it is such a pain in the $# to get sites sketched out. A really valuable feature which Zope could offer is Site-Sketching You do the back of napkin whiteboard 'design' of the main site architecture hierharchy functioning. Now you need to map it out in 'dummy' mode so everyone can get to work playing with it and working on the bits they are all best at. You know you are going to make changes and so you want to benfit from object abstraction from the get go You know in house team and design [visual + code] will force changes not to mention clients.. Then start throwing database at it - look and feel vs. satabase search menchaisms etc. This can be expensive time consumign stuff.. things people need to apply samrt reusable components to.. but which also allow them to get down very fingraoned and adjust = zope I think there is a big demand for this kind of up and running toolset. A zope folder full images or navigation widgets or search form elements are the type of things yu want to do a single copy paste or import on. I am a designer who has a special interest in learning to use. I do not see many other tools with this potential, but in its present state and my present programming skills, I am still a little short of being able to take Zope where I see it can go on my own. I hope this changes soon.. > My understanding is that DC has been putting so much of their resources into > the Zope core, much needed documentation, and probably their consulting > business, that their own Web site has been left with a lower priority. I > don't fault them for that. I think they've done a great job at > prioritizing. Granted. The price is right and there is some hairy stuff under the hood. I just hope DC can step back a bit more from time to time to see where they fit in from other perspectives also. I realize their income comes from consulting. They could apply their expertise [or others] to package off useful stuff for a reasonable price. Zope products coudl be very cost efefctive all around - those with teh time and skills can develope their own. Perhaos you are right adn it is still a little early yet.. maybe next year.. > > And if you select yes you will get 'index_html' and 'acl_users' included.. > > THIS is the entry point I am talking about > > The 'Add a Folder' page needs to offer more so that it can default to the > > immediate bones of a useful site, methods and links. The irony to > I think the "bones of a useful site" belong in a different object than a > Folder, though I agree that specialized products/objects for canned sites > would be a nice addition to the Zope products list, whether from DC or the > community. Yes. How about : - 'Add Bones object' - 'Add Navigation Object' - Add Styles object' - 'Add Report Object' - 'Add WebSite Object' Any one else interested to go further with this? kind regards - Jason ___ Zope maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
[Zope] Input for Chinese Characters
Hi all! Now that I have managed to display Chinese characters, i'm stuck with my next problem. How do i input Chinese characters into Zope? Thanx in advance to all of ya! Later, amoebia VCN - The Leader In Corporate Communication Solutions Visit our website at http://www.vcn.com.my. or http://www.vcnlinux.com ___ Zope maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] newbie dtml-if/expr ?
Daniel Chudnov wrote: > > (zope-2.1.6, rh6-linux) > > How come I can't do this: > > > > > Your problem is probably related to namespaces and aquisition. Aquisition is best monster you'll ever meet. What you're calling can't find var1 & var2. You could use the -with tag in most cases (see DMTL Guide & ZQR). I found reading these helped... http://www.zope.org/Members/Hoekstra/ChangingZopeContexts http://www.zope.org/Documentation/How-To/AdvancedDTML http://www.zope.org/Members/chrisw/showaq http://www.zope.org/Members/cybertad/how_to/working_with_tree ...then I read almost the entire mailing list archives, then all of the HowTos Just kidding, it's not that bad. Now you're ready for: http://www.zope.org/Members/jim/Info/IPC8/AcquisitionAlgebra/siframes.htm (but I bet the talk was better than just the slides ). HTH, -- Tim Cook -- Cook Information Systems | Office: (901) 884-4126 8am-5pm CDT * Specializing in Open Source Business Systems * FreePM Project Coordinator http://www.freepm.org OSHCA Founding Supporter http://www.oshca.org ___ Zope maillist - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://lists.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
