Re: FW: [agi] Lamarck Lives!(?)

2008-12-11 Thread Terren Suydam
After talking to an old professor of mine, it bears mentioning that epigenetic mechanisms such as methylation and histone remodeling are not the only means of altering transcription. A long established mechanism involves phosphorylation of transcription factors in the neuron (phosphorylation

Re: FW: [agi] Lamarck Lives!(?)

2008-12-11 Thread Eric Burton
It's all a big vindication for genetic memory, that's for certain. I was comfortable with the notion of certain templates, archetypes, being handed down as aspects of brain design via natural selection, but this really clears the way for organisms' life experiences to simply be copied in some form

Re: FW: [agi] Lamarck Lives!(?)

2008-12-11 Thread Richard Loosemore
Eric Burton wrote: It's all a big vindication for genetic memory, that's for certain. I was comfortable with the notion of certain templates, archetypes, being handed down as aspects of brain design via natural selection, but this really clears the way for organisms' life experiences to simply

Re: FW: [agi] Lamarck Lives!(?)

2008-12-11 Thread Eric Burton
You can see though how genetic memory encoding opens the door to acquired phenotype changes over an organism's life, though, and those could become communicable. I think Lysenko was onto something like this. Let us hope all those Soviet farmers wouldn't have just starved! ;3 On 12/11/08, Matt

Re: FW: [agi] Lamarck Lives!(?)

2008-12-11 Thread Matt Mahoney
--- On Thu, 12/11/08, Eric Burton brila...@gmail.com wrote: You can see though how genetic memory encoding opens the door to acquired phenotype changes over an organism's life, though, and those could become communicable. I think Lysenko was onto something like this. Let us hope all those

Re: FW: [agi] Lamarck Lives!(?)

2008-12-11 Thread Eric Burton
I don't think that each inheritor receives a full set of the original's memories. But there may have *evolved* in spite of the obvious barriers, a means of transferring primary or significant experience from one organism to another in genetic form... we can imagine such a thing given this news!

Re: FW: [agi] Lamarck Lives!(?)

2008-12-11 Thread Terren Suydam
specifically and technically about *mechanisms* (even if extremely unlikely) and you're not wasting anyone's time. Terren --- On Thu, 12/11/08, Eric Burton brila...@gmail.com wrote: From: Eric Burton brila...@gmail.com Subject: Re: FW: [agi] Lamarck Lives!(?) To: agi@v2.listbox.com Date

Re: FW: [agi] Lamarck Lives!(?)

2008-12-11 Thread Matt Mahoney
--- On Thu, 12/11/08, Eric Burton brila...@gmail.com wrote: I don't think that each inheritor receives a full set of the original's memories. But there may have *evolved* in spite of the obvious barriers, a means of transferring primary or significant experience from one organism to another

Re: FW: [agi] Lamarck Lives!(?)

2008-12-11 Thread Eric Burton
I don't know how you derived the value 10^4, Matt, but that seems reasonable to me. Terren, let me go back to the article and try to understand what exactly it says is happening. Certainly that's my editorial's crux On 12/11/08, Matt Mahoney matmaho...@yahoo.com wrote: --- On Thu, 12/11/08, Eric

Re: FW: [agi] Lamarck Lives!(?)

2008-12-11 Thread Eric Burton
Ok. We think we're seeing short-term memories forming in the hippocampus and slowly turning into long-term memories in the cortex, says Miller, who presented the results last week at the Society for Neuroscience meeting in Washington DC. It certainly sounds like the genetic changes are limited

Re: FW: [agi] Lamarck Lives!(?)

2008-12-11 Thread Terren Suydam
to help your cause, either... and that's coming from someone who believes that psychedelics can be valuable, if used properly. Terren --- On Thu, 12/11/08, Eric Burton brila...@gmail.com wrote: From: Eric Burton brila...@gmail.com Subject: Re: FW: [agi] Lamarck Lives!(?) To: agi@v2.listbox.com

Re: FW: [agi] Lamarck Lives!(?)

2008-12-11 Thread Matt Mahoney
--- On Thu, 12/11/08, Eric Burton brila...@gmail.com wrote: I don't know how you derived the value 10^4, Matt, but that seems reasonable to me. Terren, let me go back to the article and try to understand what exactly it says is happening. Certainly that's my editorial's crux A simulation of

Re: FW: [agi] Lamarck Lives!(?)

2008-12-11 Thread Eric Burton
I've actually got a pretty solid grasp on the underpinnings of this stuff, Terren. I was agreeing with you: memory formation via gene modification may be only endemic. Probably not all or the reproductive cells have their nuclei written to by every, or any, given stimulus. Yet, there are arguments