Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Re: testing collective punishment
=== = = OFFICIAL IMPERIAL STATEMENT = = === I will not perform any actions that would unfairly benefit BlogNomic players coming from an Agoran invasion. However, if it is decided that one of us should take over BlogNomic and declare an Agora-themed dynasty during the dynasty of whoever wins the First Dynasty of Trigon, I would be willing to assist in the overthrow. -- Trigon, Emperor of BlogNomic On 2/17/19 6:51 AM, Timon Walshe-Grey wrote: Trigon is the current Emperor of BlogNomic, so depending on how corruptible e is we may have an in... More seriously, the office of "Ambassador" (to other nomics) that apparently used to be a thing is mildly interesting: https://www.mail-archive.com/agora-official@agoranomic.org/msg06285.html (repealed here: https://www.mail-archive.com/agora-official@agoranomic.org/msg07140.html) -twg ‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐ On Sunday, February 17, 2019 7:20 AM, Cuddle Beam wrote: It would’ve been pretty easy to win last dynasty with a coordinated team (wealth was pretty unambiguous from the start in the form of Clues: Emperor-given info on a series of data a la Cluedo; wealth could be easy shared because you just needed to know it. Unsurprisingly, a team of two players won.) This dynasty isnt as obvious unfortunately but a teaming up/planning to pool into a single person is very often super strong anyways. On Sun, 17 Feb 2019 at 07:45, Gaelan Steele g...@canishe.com wrote: Consider me interested. Gaelan On Feb 16, 2019, at 10:33 PM, Cuddle Beam cuddleb...@gmail.com wrote: We could just win it in the normal way next time and declare an Agora theme... On Sun, 17 Feb 2019 at 01:32, Ørjan Johansen oer...@nvg.ntnu.no wrote: My reading justifies the Agoran invasion better. Greetings, Ørjan. On Sat, 16 Feb 2019, Aris Merchant wrote: I rather hoped the “mutatis mutandis” was implied. -Aris On Sat, Feb 16, 2019 at 4:27 PM Ørjan Johansen oer...@nvg.ntnu.no wrote: On Fri, 15 Feb 2019, Aris Merchant wrote: BlogNomic almost actually passed something like that once. We sent someone over to caution them that such an unfortunate plan would result in an Agoran invasion (okay, ais actually did it sua sponte, but my version sounds better). Wait, BlogNomic legislated that Agora would be destroyed? I don't think that works. Greetings, Ørjan. -Aris On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:56 PM Madeline j...@iinet.net.au wrote: Obviously, I'm just talking in hypotheticals. On 2019-02-16 09:55, Aris Merchant wrote: No one is doing anything that has any meaningful chance of destroying Agora. If there’s a bug in your mechanism, the stakes go from it being broken to the game dying permanently. -Aris On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:52 PM Madeline j...@iinet.net.au wrote: "If this Rule's power exceeds 4.0, then all other rules notwithstanding, Agora is destroyed." (Would any other rule need to actually change for such a clause to work if an outside Power 3 rule is adjusting its power?) On 2019-02-16 09:47, D. Margaux wrote: Love it. You could have a separate power 3 rule that (1) changes the power of the Ritual rule and (2) causes itself to be repealed when the Ritual rule is repealed. And I’d love to see the power of the Ritual rule increase, too, if the Rule is left unappeased... and maybe increase at a higher rate than it can be decreased? On Feb 15, 2019, at 5:12 PM, Kerim Aydin ke...@uw.edu wrote: Actually I've been pondering something even fancier, like every time it's appeased it decreases in Power and the Power is linked to the Consent required. Or something. (of course you can't increase power in the same way). On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:08 PM D. Margaux < dmargaux...@gmail.com> wrote: Any chance we can have it repeal with Agoran Consent or something more than notice? Or is that excessive? :-) On Feb 15, 2019, at 3:41 PM, Kerim Aydin ke...@uw.edu wrote: Actually, one more time. Empty sacrifices are meaningless. I withdraw my proposal, The Ritual. I submit the following proposal, Ritual Sacrifice, AI-1: Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following text: Any player CAN perform The Ritual by paying a fee of 7 Coins, thus appeasing this Rule for a single instant. This Rule MUST be appeased at least once in every Agoran week. If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 successive Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause it to repeal itself) with Notice. On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 12:12 PM Kerim Aydin ke...@uw.edu wrote: I withdraw the proposal I recently submitted, quoted below. I submit the following Proposal, The Ritual, AI-1: Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following text: Any player CAN perform The Ritual by announcement, thus appeasing this Rule for a single instant.
Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Re: testing collective punishment
On Sun, 2019-02-17 at 14:12 -0800, Gaelan Steele wrote: > What if both nomics passed (matching) minigames themed around “combat > with the other nomic”? We could write in rules to give the winning > nomic dictatorship over the losing one, or just do it for bragging > rights. Both BlogNomic and Agora would be very averse to being dictated over by a nomic that hasn't proven it respects the integrity/existence of the other. Actually, Agora normally only gets annoyed with BlogNomic when it does something that looks potentially self-destructive. I'd like to think they'd do the same for us (but they probably wouldn't notice). -- ais523
Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Re: testing collective punishment
What if both nomics passed (matching) minigames themed around “combat with the other nomic”? We could write in rules to give the winning nomic dictatorship over the losing one, or just do it for bragging rights. Whatever the theme, I am very much in favor of inter-nomic interaction. Gaelan > On Feb 17, 2019, at 12:27 PM, ais...@alumni.bham.ac.uk wrote: > > On Sun, 2019-02-17 at 11:27 -0800, Kerim Aydin wrote: >> So we did this before. I think ais523 led it, but several of us registered >> and tried to drive a win, with the intent that the next dynasty be an Agoran >> one. (nothing more invasive, but we called it an invasion for fun). > > Assuming this was the event I'm thinking of, I was playing both sides. > I think it in was my interest for people at Agora to assume I was > leading it, though, but I could see it would predictably lead to > discontent from BlogNomic's point of view so I wasn't particularly > intending for it to succeed. > > The only sensible way to have workable cross-nomic interplay between > BlogNomic and Agora, as far as I can see, would be for BlogNomic to > invade Agora (rather than the other way round). Then we'd be justified > in retaliating. > > -- > ais523 >
Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Re: testing collective punishment
On Sun, 2019-02-17 at 11:27 -0800, Kerim Aydin wrote: > So we did this before. I think ais523 led it, but several of us registered > and tried to drive a win, with the intent that the next dynasty be an Agoran > one. (nothing more invasive, but we called it an invasion for fun). Assuming this was the event I'm thinking of, I was playing both sides. I think it in was my interest for people at Agora to assume I was leading it, though, but I could see it would predictably lead to discontent from BlogNomic's point of view so I wasn't particularly intending for it to succeed. The only sensible way to have workable cross-nomic interplay between BlogNomic and Agora, as far as I can see, would be for BlogNomic to invade Agora (rather than the other way round). Then we'd be justified in retaliating. -- ais523
Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Re: testing collective punishment
So we did this before. I think ais523 led it, but several of us registered and tried to drive a win, with the intent that the next dynasty be an Agoran one. (nothing more invasive, but we called it an invasion for fun). It really pissed everyone off over there. They united against us and we lost, and it was Not Fun in that they didn't take to the spirit of it, just got mad. This was even though a good percentage of the participants were regulars over there. That's how these things tend to go (the crossfighting with B-Nomic was the same way) so I'm personally not keen in participating. On 2/17/2019 5:51 AM, Timon Walshe-Grey wrote: Trigon is the current Emperor of BlogNomic, so depending on how corruptible e is we may have an in... More seriously, the office of "Ambassador" (to other nomics) that apparently used to be a thing is mildly interesting: https://www.mail-archive.com/agora-official@agoranomic.org/msg06285.html (repealed here: https://www.mail-archive.com/agora-official@agoranomic.org/msg07140.html) -twg ‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐ On Sunday, February 17, 2019 7:20 AM, Cuddle Beam wrote: It would’ve been pretty easy to win last dynasty with a coordinated team (wealth was pretty unambiguous from the start in the form of Clues: Emperor-given info on a series of data a la Cluedo; wealth could be easy shared because you just needed to know it. Unsurprisingly, a team of two players won.) This dynasty isnt as obvious unfortunately but a teaming up/planning to pool into a single person is very often super strong anyways. On Sun, 17 Feb 2019 at 07:45, Gaelan Steele g...@canishe.com wrote: Consider me interested. Gaelan On Feb 16, 2019, at 10:33 PM, Cuddle Beam cuddleb...@gmail.com wrote: We could just win it in the normal way next time and declare an Agora theme... On Sun, 17 Feb 2019 at 01:32, Ørjan Johansen oer...@nvg.ntnu.no wrote: My reading justifies the Agoran invasion better. Greetings, Ørjan. On Sat, 16 Feb 2019, Aris Merchant wrote: I rather hoped the “mutatis mutandis” was implied. -Aris On Sat, Feb 16, 2019 at 4:27 PM Ørjan Johansen oer...@nvg.ntnu.no wrote: On Fri, 15 Feb 2019, Aris Merchant wrote: BlogNomic almost actually passed something like that once. We sent someone over to caution them that such an unfortunate plan would result in an Agoran invasion (okay, ais actually did it sua sponte, but my version sounds better). Wait, BlogNomic legislated that Agora would be destroyed? I don't think that works. Greetings, Ørjan. -Aris On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:56 PM Madeline j...@iinet.net.au wrote: Obviously, I'm just talking in hypotheticals. On 2019-02-16 09:55, Aris Merchant wrote: No one is doing anything that has any meaningful chance of destroying Agora. If there’s a bug in your mechanism, the stakes go from it being broken to the game dying permanently. -Aris On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:52 PM Madeline j...@iinet.net.au wrote: "If this Rule's power exceeds 4.0, then all other rules notwithstanding, Agora is destroyed." (Would any other rule need to actually change for such a clause to work if an outside Power 3 rule is adjusting its power?) On 2019-02-16 09:47, D. Margaux wrote: Love it. You could have a separate power 3 rule that (1) changes the power of the Ritual rule and (2) causes itself to be repealed when the Ritual rule is repealed. And I’d love to see the power of the Ritual rule increase, too, if the Rule is left unappeased... and maybe increase at a higher rate than it can be decreased? On Feb 15, 2019, at 5:12 PM, Kerim Aydin ke...@uw.edu wrote: Actually I've been pondering something even fancier, like every time it's appeased it decreases in Power and the Power is linked to the Consent required. Or something. (of course you can't increase power in the same way). On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:08 PM D. Margaux < dmargaux...@gmail.com> wrote: Any chance we can have it repeal with Agoran Consent or something more than notice? Or is that excessive? :-) On Feb 15, 2019, at 3:41 PM, Kerim Aydin ke...@uw.edu wrote: Actually, one more time. Empty sacrifices are meaningless. I withdraw my proposal, The Ritual. I submit the following proposal, Ritual Sacrifice, AI-1: Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following text: Any player CAN perform The Ritual by paying a fee of 7 Coins, thus appeasing this Rule for a single instant. This Rule MUST be appeased at least once in every Agoran week. If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 successive Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause it to repeal itself) with Notice. On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 12:12 PM Kerim Aydin ke...@uw.edu wrote: I withdraw the proposal I recently submitted, quoted below. I submit the following Proposal, The Ritual, AI-1: Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following
Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Re: testing collective punishment
OK I overlooked the “more seriously (...)” lmao. Sorry for getting so heated up. Yeah, having Ambassadors again would be cool. Aside from BN there are two active Discord nomics right now, Infinite Nomic (on the which I made a win happen after months of play on the same day I joined, I’m pretty proud lf that lol) and Now We Nomic, could be curious to try. On Sun, 17 Feb 2019 at 16:09, Cuddle Beam wrote: > Trigon might want to but any late thematic changes now to their dynasty > would heavily rely on the current players to pass, and I suspect that a > sudden Agora takeover would be met with more snickering than we can deal > with and would fail. > > There’s a lot more social power and percieved legitimacy in an Ascencion > Adress and instating an Agora theme that way. > > Heck, its how anyone imposes the theme they want. It’s how things are > supposed to be. It’s how we can put an Agora theme without needing to > resort to play Palpatine or twist moustaches deviously. > > Just winning the game as usual! > > On Sun, 17 Feb 2019 at 14:51, Timon Walshe-Grey wrote: > >> Trigon is the current Emperor of BlogNomic, so depending on how >> corruptible e is we may have an in... >> >> More seriously, the office of "Ambassador" (to other nomics) that >> apparently used to be a thing is mildly interesting: >> >> https://www.mail-archive.com/agora-official@agoranomic.org/msg06285.html >> >> (repealed here: >> https://www.mail-archive.com/agora-official@agoranomic.org/msg07140.html) >> >> -twg >> >> >> ‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐ >> On Sunday, February 17, 2019 7:20 AM, Cuddle Beam >> wrote: >> >> > It would’ve been pretty easy to win last dynasty with a coordinated team >> > (wealth was pretty unambiguous from the start in the form of Clues: >> > Emperor-given info on a series of data a la Cluedo; wealth could be easy >> > shared because you just needed to know it. Unsurprisingly, a team of two >> > players won.) >> > >> > This dynasty isnt as obvious unfortunately but a teaming up/planning to >> > pool into a single person is very often super strong anyways. >> > >> > On Sun, 17 Feb 2019 at 07:45, Gaelan Steele g...@canishe.com wrote: >> > >> > > Consider me interested. >> > > Gaelan >> > > >> > > > On Feb 16, 2019, at 10:33 PM, Cuddle Beam cuddleb...@gmail.com >> wrote: >> > > > We could just win it in the normal way next time and declare an >> Agora >> > > > theme... >> > > > On Sun, 17 Feb 2019 at 01:32, Ørjan Johansen oer...@nvg.ntnu.no >> wrote: >> > > > >> > > > > My reading justifies the Agoran invasion better. >> > > > > Greetings, >> > > > > Ørjan. >> > > > > On Sat, 16 Feb 2019, Aris Merchant wrote: >> > > > > >> > > > > > I rather hoped the “mutatis mutandis” was implied. >> > > > > > -Aris >> > > > > > On Sat, Feb 16, 2019 at 4:27 PM Ørjan Johansen >> oer...@nvg.ntnu.no >> > > > > > wrote: >> > > > > > >> > > > > > > On Fri, 15 Feb 2019, Aris Merchant wrote: >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > BlogNomic almost actually passed something like that once. >> We sent >> > > > > > > > someone >> > > > > > > > over to caution them that such an unfortunate plan would >> result in an >> > > > > > > > Agoran invasion (okay, ais actually did it sua sponte, but >> my version >> > > > > > > > sounds better). >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > Wait, BlogNomic legislated that Agora would be destroyed? I >> don't >> > > > > > > think >> > > > >> > > > > > > that works. >> > > > > > > Greetings, >> > > > > > > Ørjan. >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > -Aris >> > > > > > > > On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:56 PM Madeline j...@iinet.net.au >> wrote: >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > Obviously, I'm just talking in hypotheticals. >> > > > > > > > > On 2019-02-16 09:55, Aris Merchant wrote: >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > No one is doing anything that has any meaningful chance >> of >> > > > > > > > > > destroying >> > > > >> > > > > > > > > > Agora. If there’s a bug in your mechanism, the stakes >> go from it >> > > > > > > > > > being >> > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > broken to the game dying permanently. >> > > > > > > > > > -Aris >> > > > > > > > > > On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:52 PM Madeline >> j...@iinet.net.au >> > > > > > > > > > wrote: >> > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > "If this Rule's power exceeds 4.0, then all other >> rules >> > > > > > > > > > > notwithstanding, >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > Agora is destroyed." >> > > > > > > > > > > (Would any other rule need to actually change for >> such a clause to >> > > > > > > > > > > work >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > if an outside Power 3 rule is adjusting its power?) >> > > > > > > > > > > On 2019-02-16 09:47, D. Margaux wrote: >> > > > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Love it. >> > > > > > > > > > > > You could have a separate power 3 rule that (1) >> changes the power >> > > > > > > > > > > > of >> > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > the >> > > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > Ritual rule and (2) causes itself to be repealed when >> the Ritual >> > >
Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Re: testing collective punishment
Trigon might want to but any late thematic changes now to their dynasty would heavily rely on the current players to pass, and I suspect that a sudden Agora takeover would be met with more snickering than we can deal with and would fail. There’s a lot more social power and percieved legitimacy in an Ascencion Adress and instating an Agora theme that way. Heck, its how anyone imposes the theme they want. It’s how things are supposed to be. It’s how we can put an Agora theme without needing to resort to play Palpatine or twist moustaches deviously. Just winning the game as usual! On Sun, 17 Feb 2019 at 14:51, Timon Walshe-Grey wrote: > Trigon is the current Emperor of BlogNomic, so depending on how > corruptible e is we may have an in... > > More seriously, the office of "Ambassador" (to other nomics) that > apparently used to be a thing is mildly interesting: > > https://www.mail-archive.com/agora-official@agoranomic.org/msg06285.html > > (repealed here: > https://www.mail-archive.com/agora-official@agoranomic.org/msg07140.html) > > -twg > > > ‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐ > On Sunday, February 17, 2019 7:20 AM, Cuddle Beam > wrote: > > > It would’ve been pretty easy to win last dynasty with a coordinated team > > (wealth was pretty unambiguous from the start in the form of Clues: > > Emperor-given info on a series of data a la Cluedo; wealth could be easy > > shared because you just needed to know it. Unsurprisingly, a team of two > > players won.) > > > > This dynasty isnt as obvious unfortunately but a teaming up/planning to > > pool into a single person is very often super strong anyways. > > > > On Sun, 17 Feb 2019 at 07:45, Gaelan Steele g...@canishe.com wrote: > > > > > Consider me interested. > > > Gaelan > > > > > > > On Feb 16, 2019, at 10:33 PM, Cuddle Beam cuddleb...@gmail.com > wrote: > > > > We could just win it in the normal way next time and declare an Agora > > > > theme... > > > > On Sun, 17 Feb 2019 at 01:32, Ørjan Johansen oer...@nvg.ntnu.no > wrote: > > > > > > > > > My reading justifies the Agoran invasion better. > > > > > Greetings, > > > > > Ørjan. > > > > > On Sat, 16 Feb 2019, Aris Merchant wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > I rather hoped the “mutatis mutandis” was implied. > > > > > > -Aris > > > > > > On Sat, Feb 16, 2019 at 4:27 PM Ørjan Johansen > oer...@nvg.ntnu.no > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Fri, 15 Feb 2019, Aris Merchant wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > BlogNomic almost actually passed something like that once. > We sent > > > > > > > > someone > > > > > > > > over to caution them that such an unfortunate plan would > result in an > > > > > > > > Agoran invasion (okay, ais actually did it sua sponte, but > my version > > > > > > > > sounds better). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Wait, BlogNomic legislated that Agora would be destroyed? I > don't > > > > > > > think > > > > > > > > > > > that works. > > > > > > > Greetings, > > > > > > > Ørjan. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -Aris > > > > > > > > On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:56 PM Madeline j...@iinet.net.au > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Obviously, I'm just talking in hypotheticals. > > > > > > > > > On 2019-02-16 09:55, Aris Merchant wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No one is doing anything that has any meaningful chance > of > > > > > > > > > > destroying > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Agora. If there’s a bug in your mechanism, the stakes go > from it > > > > > > > > > > being > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > broken to the game dying permanently. > > > > > > > > > > -Aris > > > > > > > > > > On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:52 PM Madeline > j...@iinet.net.au > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "If this Rule's power exceeds 4.0, then all other rules > > > > > > > > > > > notwithstanding, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Agora is destroyed." > > > > > > > > > > > (Would any other rule need to actually change for such > a clause to > > > > > > > > > > > work > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if an outside Power 3 rule is adjusting its power?) > > > > > > > > > > > On 2019-02-16 09:47, D. Margaux wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Love it. > > > > > > > > > > > > You could have a separate power 3 rule that (1) > changes the power > > > > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ritual rule and (2) causes itself to be repealed when > the Ritual > > > > > > > > > > > rule > > > > > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > repealed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > And I’d love to see the power of the Ritual rule > increase, too, > > > > > > > > > > > > if > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rule is left unappeased... and maybe increase at a > higher rate > > > > > > > > > > > than > > > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > be decreased? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Feb
Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Re: testing collective punishment
Trigon is the current Emperor of BlogNomic, so depending on how corruptible e is we may have an in... More seriously, the office of "Ambassador" (to other nomics) that apparently used to be a thing is mildly interesting: https://www.mail-archive.com/agora-official@agoranomic.org/msg06285.html (repealed here: https://www.mail-archive.com/agora-official@agoranomic.org/msg07140.html) -twg ‐‐‐ Original Message ‐‐‐ On Sunday, February 17, 2019 7:20 AM, Cuddle Beam wrote: > It would’ve been pretty easy to win last dynasty with a coordinated team > (wealth was pretty unambiguous from the start in the form of Clues: > Emperor-given info on a series of data a la Cluedo; wealth could be easy > shared because you just needed to know it. Unsurprisingly, a team of two > players won.) > > This dynasty isnt as obvious unfortunately but a teaming up/planning to > pool into a single person is very often super strong anyways. > > On Sun, 17 Feb 2019 at 07:45, Gaelan Steele g...@canishe.com wrote: > > > Consider me interested. > > Gaelan > > > > > On Feb 16, 2019, at 10:33 PM, Cuddle Beam cuddleb...@gmail.com wrote: > > > We could just win it in the normal way next time and declare an Agora > > > theme... > > > On Sun, 17 Feb 2019 at 01:32, Ørjan Johansen oer...@nvg.ntnu.no wrote: > > > > > > > My reading justifies the Agoran invasion better. > > > > Greetings, > > > > Ørjan. > > > > On Sat, 16 Feb 2019, Aris Merchant wrote: > > > > > > > > > I rather hoped the “mutatis mutandis” was implied. > > > > > -Aris > > > > > On Sat, Feb 16, 2019 at 4:27 PM Ørjan Johansen oer...@nvg.ntnu.no > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > On Fri, 15 Feb 2019, Aris Merchant wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > BlogNomic almost actually passed something like that once. We sent > > > > > > > someone > > > > > > > over to caution them that such an unfortunate plan would result > > > > > > > in an > > > > > > > Agoran invasion (okay, ais actually did it sua sponte, but my > > > > > > > version > > > > > > > sounds better). > > > > > > > > > > > > Wait, BlogNomic legislated that Agora would be destroyed? I don't > > > > > > think > > > > > > > > > that works. > > > > > > Greetings, > > > > > > Ørjan. > > > > > > > > > > > > > -Aris > > > > > > > On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:56 PM Madeline j...@iinet.net.au wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Obviously, I'm just talking in hypotheticals. > > > > > > > > On 2019-02-16 09:55, Aris Merchant wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > No one is doing anything that has any meaningful chance of > > > > > > > > > destroying > > > > > > > > > > > > Agora. If there’s a bug in your mechanism, the stakes go from > > > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > > being > > > > > > > > > > > > > > broken to the game dying permanently. > > > > > > > > > -Aris > > > > > > > > > On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:52 PM Madeline j...@iinet.net.au > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > "If this Rule's power exceeds 4.0, then all other rules > > > > > > > > > > notwithstanding, > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Agora is destroyed." > > > > > > > > > > (Would any other rule need to actually change for such a > > > > > > > > > > clause to > > > > > > > > > > work > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > if an outside Power 3 rule is adjusting its power?) > > > > > > > > > > On 2019-02-16 09:47, D. Margaux wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Love it. > > > > > > > > > > > You could have a separate power 3 rule that (1) changes > > > > > > > > > > > the power > > > > > > > > > > > of > > > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Ritual rule and (2) causes itself to be repealed when the > > > > > > > > > > Ritual > > > > > > > > > > rule > > > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > repealed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > And I’d love to see the power of the Ritual rule > > > > > > > > > > > increase, too, > > > > > > > > > > > if > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Rule is left unappeased... and maybe increase at a higher > > > > > > > > > > rate > > > > > > > > > > than > > > > > > > it > > > > > > > > > > > > can > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > be decreased? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Feb 15, 2019, at 5:12 PM, Kerim Aydin ke...@uw.edu > > > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > Actually I've been pondering something even fancier, > > > > > > > > > > > > like every > > > > > > > > > > > > time > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > it's appeased it decreases in Power and the Power is > > > > > > > > > > > > linked to > > > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Consent required. Or something. (of course you can't > > > > > > > > > > > > increase > > > > > > > > > > > > power > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > in the same way). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:08 PM D. Margaux < > > > > > > > > > > > > > dmargaux...@gmail.com> > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Re: testing collective punishment
It would’ve been pretty easy to win last dynasty with a coordinated team (wealth was pretty unambiguous from the start in the form of Clues: Emperor-given info on a series of data a la Cluedo; wealth could be easy shared because you just needed to know it. Unsurprisingly, a team of two players won.) This dynasty isnt as obvious unfortunately but a teaming up/planning to pool into a single person is very often super strong anyways. On Sun, 17 Feb 2019 at 07:45, Gaelan Steele wrote: > Consider me interested. > > Gaelan > > > On Feb 16, 2019, at 10:33 PM, Cuddle Beam wrote: > > > > We could just win it in the normal way next time and declare an Agora > > theme... > > > > On Sun, 17 Feb 2019 at 01:32, Ørjan Johansen wrote: > > > >> My reading justifies the Agoran invasion better. > >> > >> Greetings, > >> Ørjan. > >> > >> On Sat, 16 Feb 2019, Aris Merchant wrote: > >> > >>> I rather hoped the “mutatis mutandis” was implied. > >>> > >>> -Aris > >>> > >>> On Sat, Feb 16, 2019 at 4:27 PM Ørjan Johansen > >> wrote: > >>> > On Fri, 15 Feb 2019, Aris Merchant wrote: > > > BlogNomic almost actually passed something like that once. We sent > someone > > over to caution them that such an unfortunate plan would result in an > > Agoran invasion (okay, ais actually did it sua sponte, but my version > > sounds better). > > Wait, BlogNomic legislated that Agora would be destroyed? I don't > think > that works. > > Greetings, > Ørjan. > > > -Aris > > > > On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:56 PM Madeline wrote: > > > >> Obviously, I'm just talking in hypotheticals. > >> > >> On 2019-02-16 09:55, Aris Merchant wrote: > >>> No one is doing anything that has any meaningful chance of > destroying > >>> Agora. If there’s a bug in your mechanism, the stakes go from it > >> being > >>> broken to the game dying permanently. > >>> > >>> -Aris > >>> > >>> On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:52 PM Madeline > wrote: > >>> > "If this Rule's power exceeds 4.0, then all other rules > notwithstanding, > Agora is destroyed." > (Would any other rule need to actually change for such a clause to > work > if an outside Power 3 rule is adjusting its power?) > > On 2019-02-16 09:47, D. Margaux wrote: > > Love it. > > > > You could have a separate power 3 rule that (1) changes the power > >> of > >> the > Ritual rule and (2) causes itself to be repealed when the Ritual > >> rule > is > repealed. > > And I’d love to see the power of the Ritual rule increase, too, > if > the > Rule is left unappeased... and maybe increase at a higher rate > than > >> it > >> can > be decreased? > >> On Feb 15, 2019, at 5:12 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: > >> > >> Actually I've been pondering something even fancier, like every > >> time > >> it's appeased it decreases in Power and the Power is linked to > the > >> Consent required. Or something. (of course you can't increase > power > >> in the same way). > >> > >>> On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:08 PM D. Margaux < > >> dmargaux...@gmail.com> > wrote: > >>> Any chance we can have it repeal with Agoran Consent or > something > >> more > than notice? Or is that excessive? :-) > On Feb 15, 2019, at 3:41 PM, Kerim Aydin > wrote: > > Actually, one more time. Empty sacrifices are meaningless. > > I withdraw my proposal, The Ritual. > > I submit the following proposal, Ritual Sacrifice, AI-1: > > > > > Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the > >> following > text: > > Any player CAN perform The Ritual by paying a fee of 7 > Coins, > thus appeasing > this Rule for a single instant. This Rule MUST be > >> appeased > >> at > least once > in every Agoran week. > > If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 > successive > Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule > (cause > it > >> to > repeal itself) with Notice. > > > > > > > > On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 12:12 PM Kerim Aydin > wrote: > > > > I withdraw the proposal I recently submitted, quoted below. > > > > I submit the following Proposal, The Ritual, AI-1: > > > > >
Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Re: testing collective punishment
Consider me interested. Gaelan > On Feb 16, 2019, at 10:33 PM, Cuddle Beam wrote: > > We could just win it in the normal way next time and declare an Agora > theme... > > On Sun, 17 Feb 2019 at 01:32, Ørjan Johansen wrote: > >> My reading justifies the Agoran invasion better. >> >> Greetings, >> Ørjan. >> >> On Sat, 16 Feb 2019, Aris Merchant wrote: >> >>> I rather hoped the “mutatis mutandis” was implied. >>> >>> -Aris >>> >>> On Sat, Feb 16, 2019 at 4:27 PM Ørjan Johansen >> wrote: >>> On Fri, 15 Feb 2019, Aris Merchant wrote: > BlogNomic almost actually passed something like that once. We sent someone > over to caution them that such an unfortunate plan would result in an > Agoran invasion (okay, ais actually did it sua sponte, but my version > sounds better). Wait, BlogNomic legislated that Agora would be destroyed? I don't think that works. Greetings, Ørjan. > -Aris > > On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:56 PM Madeline wrote: > >> Obviously, I'm just talking in hypotheticals. >> >> On 2019-02-16 09:55, Aris Merchant wrote: >>> No one is doing anything that has any meaningful chance of destroying >>> Agora. If there’s a bug in your mechanism, the stakes go from it >> being >>> broken to the game dying permanently. >>> >>> -Aris >>> >>> On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:52 PM Madeline wrote: >>> "If this Rule's power exceeds 4.0, then all other rules notwithstanding, Agora is destroyed." (Would any other rule need to actually change for such a clause to work if an outside Power 3 rule is adjusting its power?) On 2019-02-16 09:47, D. Margaux wrote: > Love it. > > You could have a separate power 3 rule that (1) changes the power >> of >> the Ritual rule and (2) causes itself to be repealed when the Ritual >> rule is repealed. > And I’d love to see the power of the Ritual rule increase, too, if the Rule is left unappeased... and maybe increase at a higher rate than >> it >> can be decreased? >> On Feb 15, 2019, at 5:12 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: >> >> Actually I've been pondering something even fancier, like every >> time >> it's appeased it decreases in Power and the Power is linked to the >> Consent required. Or something. (of course you can't increase power >> in the same way). >> >>> On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:08 PM D. Margaux < >> dmargaux...@gmail.com> wrote: >>> Any chance we can have it repeal with Agoran Consent or something >> more than notice? Or is that excessive? :-) On Feb 15, 2019, at 3:41 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: Actually, one more time. Empty sacrifices are meaningless. I withdraw my proposal, The Ritual. I submit the following proposal, Ritual Sacrifice, AI-1: Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the >> following text: Any player CAN perform The Ritual by paying a fee of 7 Coins, thus appeasing this Rule for a single instant. This Rule MUST be >> appeased >> at least once in every Agoran week. If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 successive Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause it >> to repeal itself) with Notice. > On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 12:12 PM Kerim Aydin wrote: > > I withdraw the proposal I recently submitted, quoted below. > > I submit the following Proposal, The Ritual, AI-1: > > Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following > text: > > Any player CAN perform The Ritual by announcement, thus appeasing > this Rule for a single instant. This Rule MUST be appeased >> at least once > in every Agoran week. > > If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 successive > Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule >> (cause >> it to > repeal itself) with Notice. > >
Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Re: testing collective punishment
My reading justifies the Agoran invasion better. Greetings, Ørjan. On Sat, 16 Feb 2019, Aris Merchant wrote: I rather hoped the “mutatis mutandis” was implied. -Aris On Sat, Feb 16, 2019 at 4:27 PM Ørjan Johansen wrote: On Fri, 15 Feb 2019, Aris Merchant wrote: BlogNomic almost actually passed something like that once. We sent someone over to caution them that such an unfortunate plan would result in an Agoran invasion (okay, ais actually did it sua sponte, but my version sounds better). Wait, BlogNomic legislated that Agora would be destroyed? I don't think that works. Greetings, Ørjan. -Aris On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:56 PM Madeline wrote: Obviously, I'm just talking in hypotheticals. On 2019-02-16 09:55, Aris Merchant wrote: No one is doing anything that has any meaningful chance of destroying Agora. If there’s a bug in your mechanism, the stakes go from it being broken to the game dying permanently. -Aris On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:52 PM Madeline wrote: "If this Rule's power exceeds 4.0, then all other rules notwithstanding, Agora is destroyed." (Would any other rule need to actually change for such a clause to work if an outside Power 3 rule is adjusting its power?) On 2019-02-16 09:47, D. Margaux wrote: Love it. You could have a separate power 3 rule that (1) changes the power of the Ritual rule and (2) causes itself to be repealed when the Ritual rule is repealed. And I’d love to see the power of the Ritual rule increase, too, if the Rule is left unappeased... and maybe increase at a higher rate than it can be decreased? On Feb 15, 2019, at 5:12 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: Actually I've been pondering something even fancier, like every time it's appeased it decreases in Power and the Power is linked to the Consent required. Or something. (of course you can't increase power in the same way). On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:08 PM D. Margaux wrote: Any chance we can have it repeal with Agoran Consent or something more than notice? Or is that excessive? :-) On Feb 15, 2019, at 3:41 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: Actually, one more time. Empty sacrifices are meaningless. I withdraw my proposal, The Ritual. I submit the following proposal, Ritual Sacrifice, AI-1: Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following text: Any player CAN perform The Ritual by paying a fee of 7 Coins, thus appeasing this Rule for a single instant. This Rule MUST be appeased at least once in every Agoran week. If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 successive Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause it to repeal itself) with Notice. On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 12:12 PM Kerim Aydin wrote: I withdraw the proposal I recently submitted, quoted below. I submit the following Proposal, The Ritual, AI-1: Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following text: Any player CAN perform The Ritual by announcement, thus appeasing this Rule for a single instant. This Rule MUST be appeased at least once in every Agoran week. If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 successive Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause it to repeal itself) with Notice. On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 7:44 AM Kerim Aydin wrote: I submit the following Proposal, The Ritual, AI-1: Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following text: Any player CAN perform The Ritual by announcement. In order to appease this Rule, at least one player MUST perform The Ritual in every Agoran week. If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 successive Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause it to repeal itself) with Notice.
Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Re: testing collective punishment
I rather hoped the “mutatis mutandis” was implied. -Aris On Sat, Feb 16, 2019 at 4:27 PM Ørjan Johansen wrote: > On Fri, 15 Feb 2019, Aris Merchant wrote: > > > BlogNomic almost actually passed something like that once. We sent > someone > > over to caution them that such an unfortunate plan would result in an > > Agoran invasion (okay, ais actually did it sua sponte, but my version > > sounds better). > > Wait, BlogNomic legislated that Agora would be destroyed? I don't think > that works. > > Greetings, > Ørjan. > > > -Aris > > > > On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:56 PM Madeline wrote: > > > >> Obviously, I'm just talking in hypotheticals. > >> > >> On 2019-02-16 09:55, Aris Merchant wrote: > >>> No one is doing anything that has any meaningful chance of destroying > >>> Agora. If there’s a bug in your mechanism, the stakes go from it being > >>> broken to the game dying permanently. > >>> > >>> -Aris > >>> > >>> On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:52 PM Madeline wrote: > >>> > "If this Rule's power exceeds 4.0, then all other rules > notwithstanding, > Agora is destroyed." > (Would any other rule need to actually change for such a clause to > work > if an outside Power 3 rule is adjusting its power?) > > On 2019-02-16 09:47, D. Margaux wrote: > > Love it. > > > > You could have a separate power 3 rule that (1) changes the power of > >> the > Ritual rule and (2) causes itself to be repealed when the Ritual rule > is > repealed. > > And I’d love to see the power of the Ritual rule increase, too, if > the > Rule is left unappeased... and maybe increase at a higher rate than it > >> can > be decreased? > >> On Feb 15, 2019, at 5:12 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: > >> > >> Actually I've been pondering something even fancier, like every time > >> it's appeased it decreases in Power and the Power is linked to the > >> Consent required. Or something. (of course you can't increase > power > >> in the same way). > >> > >>> On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:08 PM D. Margaux > wrote: > >>> Any chance we can have it repeal with Agoran Consent or something > >> more > than notice? Or is that excessive? :-) > On Feb 15, 2019, at 3:41 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: > > Actually, one more time. Empty sacrifices are meaningless. > > I withdraw my proposal, The Ritual. > > I submit the following proposal, Ritual Sacrifice, AI-1: > > > > Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following > text: > > Any player CAN perform The Ritual by paying a fee of 7 > Coins, > thus appeasing > this Rule for a single instant. This Rule MUST be appeased > >> at > least once > in every Agoran week. > > If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 > successive > Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause > it > >> to > repeal itself) with Notice. > > > > > > > On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 12:12 PM Kerim Aydin > wrote: > > > > I withdraw the proposal I recently submitted, quoted below. > > > > I submit the following Proposal, The Ritual, AI-1: > > > > > > Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the > following > > text: > > > >Any player CAN perform The Ritual by announcement, thus > appeasing > >this Rule for a single instant. This Rule MUST be > appeased > >> at > least once > >in every Agoran week. > > > >If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 > successive > >Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause > >> it to > >repeal itself) with Notice. > > > > > > > >> On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 7:44 AM Kerim Aydin > wrote: > >> > >> > >> > >> I submit the following Proposal, The Ritual, AI-1: > >> > > > >> Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the > following > >> text: > >> > >>Any player CAN perform The Ritual by announcement. In > >> order > to > >>appease this Rule, at least one player MUST perform The > Ritual in > >>every Agoran week. > >> > >>If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 > >>
Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Re: testing collective punishment
On Fri, 15 Feb 2019, Aris Merchant wrote: BlogNomic almost actually passed something like that once. We sent someone over to caution them that such an unfortunate plan would result in an Agoran invasion (okay, ais actually did it sua sponte, but my version sounds better). Wait, BlogNomic legislated that Agora would be destroyed? I don't think that works. Greetings, Ørjan. -Aris On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:56 PM Madeline wrote: Obviously, I'm just talking in hypotheticals. On 2019-02-16 09:55, Aris Merchant wrote: No one is doing anything that has any meaningful chance of destroying Agora. If there’s a bug in your mechanism, the stakes go from it being broken to the game dying permanently. -Aris On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:52 PM Madeline wrote: "If this Rule's power exceeds 4.0, then all other rules notwithstanding, Agora is destroyed." (Would any other rule need to actually change for such a clause to work if an outside Power 3 rule is adjusting its power?) On 2019-02-16 09:47, D. Margaux wrote: Love it. You could have a separate power 3 rule that (1) changes the power of the Ritual rule and (2) causes itself to be repealed when the Ritual rule is repealed. And I’d love to see the power of the Ritual rule increase, too, if the Rule is left unappeased... and maybe increase at a higher rate than it can be decreased? On Feb 15, 2019, at 5:12 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: Actually I've been pondering something even fancier, like every time it's appeased it decreases in Power and the Power is linked to the Consent required. Or something. (of course you can't increase power in the same way). On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:08 PM D. Margaux wrote: Any chance we can have it repeal with Agoran Consent or something more than notice? Or is that excessive? :-) On Feb 15, 2019, at 3:41 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: Actually, one more time. Empty sacrifices are meaningless. I withdraw my proposal, The Ritual. I submit the following proposal, Ritual Sacrifice, AI-1: Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following text: Any player CAN perform The Ritual by paying a fee of 7 Coins, thus appeasing this Rule for a single instant. This Rule MUST be appeased at least once in every Agoran week. If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 successive Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause it to repeal itself) with Notice. On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 12:12 PM Kerim Aydin wrote: I withdraw the proposal I recently submitted, quoted below. I submit the following Proposal, The Ritual, AI-1: Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following text: Any player CAN perform The Ritual by announcement, thus appeasing this Rule for a single instant. This Rule MUST be appeased at least once in every Agoran week. If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 successive Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause it to repeal itself) with Notice. On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 7:44 AM Kerim Aydin wrote: I submit the following Proposal, The Ritual, AI-1: Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following text: Any player CAN perform The Ritual by announcement. In order to appease this Rule, at least one player MUST perform The Ritual in every Agoran week. If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 successive Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause it to repeal itself) with Notice.
Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Re: testing collective punishment
On 2/16/2019 9:52 AM, James Cook wrote: On the one hand, I am inclined to vote against it --- will it encourage people to be selective about which rules they follow? What's interesting to me about this is that it's a collective decision - as long as one person follows it, everyone is following it. I'm really curious about the dynamics of that. On the other, I wouldn't be sad if it passed, and will reluctantly egg it on with this suggestion: "The Ritual MUST be performed by at least seven different players in every Agoran week." (and lower the fee). Another complication I thought of is a variable fee, making it harder and harder to perform The Ritual as the ruleset expects more and more to keep it appeased.
DIS: Re: BUS: Re: testing collective punishment
On Sat, 16 Feb 2019 at 17:04, Kerim Aydin wrote: > Ok, hopefully last time! > > I withdraw the proposal Ritual Sacrifice from the pool. > > I submit the following proposal, Ritual Sacrifice, AI-1: > > > Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following > text: > > Any player CAN perform The Ritual by paying a fee of 7 Coins. > The Ritual MUST be performed at least once in every Agoran week. > If The Ritual was performed at least once in the previous Agoran > week, then the Ruleset is Appeased. > > If the Ruleset is appeased, then any player CAN banish this rule > (cause it to repeal itself) with N Agoran Consent, where N is the > maximum of 1.0 and 10/(B+1), rounded up to the nearest 0.1, and B > is the number of weeks that the Ruleset has been continuously > appeased at the moment of banishment. This sounds fun! On the one hand, I am inclined to vote against it --- will it encourage people to be selective about which rules they follow? I would certainly think twice about acting to make sure this rule is followed. (Agora is a game ... wherein Persons, acting in accordance with the Rules) On the other, I wouldn't be sad if it passed, and will reluctantly egg it on with this suggestion: "The Ritual MUST be performed by at least seven different players in every Agoran week." (and lower the fee).
Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Re: testing collective punishment
BlogNomic almost actually passed something like that once. We sent someone over to caution them that such an unfortunate plan would result in an Agoran invasion (okay, ais actually did it sua sponte, but my version sounds better). -Aris On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:56 PM Madeline wrote: > Obviously, I'm just talking in hypotheticals. > > On 2019-02-16 09:55, Aris Merchant wrote: > > No one is doing anything that has any meaningful chance of destroying > > Agora. If there’s a bug in your mechanism, the stakes go from it being > > broken to the game dying permanently. > > > > -Aris > > > > On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:52 PM Madeline wrote: > > > >> "If this Rule's power exceeds 4.0, then all other rules notwithstanding, > >> Agora is destroyed." > >> (Would any other rule need to actually change for such a clause to work > >> if an outside Power 3 rule is adjusting its power?) > >> > >> On 2019-02-16 09:47, D. Margaux wrote: > >>> Love it. > >>> > >>> You could have a separate power 3 rule that (1) changes the power of > the > >> Ritual rule and (2) causes itself to be repealed when the Ritual rule is > >> repealed. > >>> And I’d love to see the power of the Ritual rule increase, too, if the > >> Rule is left unappeased... and maybe increase at a higher rate than it > can > >> be decreased? > On Feb 15, 2019, at 5:12 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: > > Actually I've been pondering something even fancier, like every time > it's appeased it decreases in Power and the Power is linked to the > Consent required. Or something. (of course you can't increase power > in the same way). > > > On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:08 PM D. Margaux > >> wrote: > > Any chance we can have it repeal with Agoran Consent or something > more > >> than notice? Or is that excessive? :-) > >> On Feb 15, 2019, at 3:41 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: > >> > >> Actually, one more time. Empty sacrifices are meaningless. > >> > >> I withdraw my proposal, The Ritual. > >> > >> I submit the following proposal, Ritual Sacrifice, AI-1: > >> > >> > >> Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following > >> text: > >> > >>Any player CAN perform The Ritual by paying a fee of 7 Coins, > >> thus appeasing > >>this Rule for a single instant. This Rule MUST be appeased > at > >> least once > >>in every Agoran week. > >> > >>If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 successive > >>Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause it > to > >>repeal itself) with Notice. > >> > >> > >> > >> > >>> On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 12:12 PM Kerim Aydin wrote: > >>> > >>> I withdraw the proposal I recently submitted, quoted below. > >>> > >>> I submit the following Proposal, The Ritual, AI-1: > >>> > >> > >>> Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following > >>> text: > >>> > >>>Any player CAN perform The Ritual by announcement, thus > >> appeasing > >>>this Rule for a single instant. This Rule MUST be appeased > at > >> least once > >>>in every Agoran week. > >>> > >>>If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 successive > >>>Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause > it to > >>>repeal itself) with Notice. > >>> > >>> > >> > On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 7:44 AM Kerim Aydin wrote: > > > > I submit the following Proposal, The Ritual, AI-1: > > >> > Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following > text: > > Any player CAN perform The Ritual by announcement. In > order > >> to > appease this Rule, at least one player MUST perform The > >> Ritual in > every Agoran week. > > If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 > successive > Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause > it > >> to > repeal itself) with Notice. > > > >> > >> > >
Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Re: testing collective punishment
Sounds cool but it’s not destructive enough. It should blow up ourselves too and all avocados IRL. On Fri, 15 Feb 2019 at 23:52, Madeline wrote: > "If this Rule's power exceeds 4.0, then all other rules notwithstanding, > Agora is destroyed." > (Would any other rule need to actually change for such a clause to work > if an outside Power 3 rule is adjusting its power?) > > On 2019-02-16 09:47, D. Margaux wrote: > > Love it. > > > > You could have a separate power 3 rule that (1) changes the power of the > Ritual rule and (2) causes itself to be repealed when the Ritual rule is > repealed. > > > > And I’d love to see the power of the Ritual rule increase, too, if the > Rule is left unappeased... and maybe increase at a higher rate than it can > be decreased? > > > >> On Feb 15, 2019, at 5:12 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: > >> > >> Actually I've been pondering something even fancier, like every time > >> it's appeased it decreases in Power and the Power is linked to the > >> Consent required. Or something. (of course you can't increase power > >> in the same way). > >> > >>> On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:08 PM D. Margaux > wrote: > >>> > >>> Any chance we can have it repeal with Agoran Consent or something more > than notice? Or is that excessive? :-) > >>> > On Feb 15, 2019, at 3:41 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: > > Actually, one more time. Empty sacrifices are meaningless. > > I withdraw my proposal, The Ritual. > > I submit the following proposal, Ritual Sacrifice, AI-1: > > > > Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following > text: > > Any player CAN perform The Ritual by paying a fee of 7 Coins, > thus appeasing > this Rule for a single instant. This Rule MUST be appeased at > least once > in every Agoran week. > > If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 successive > Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause it to > repeal itself) with Notice. > > > > > > > On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 12:12 PM Kerim Aydin wrote: > > > > I withdraw the proposal I recently submitted, quoted below. > > > > I submit the following Proposal, The Ritual, AI-1: > > > > > > > Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following > > text: > > > > Any player CAN perform The Ritual by announcement, thus > appeasing > > this Rule for a single instant. This Rule MUST be appeased at > least once > > in every Agoran week. > > > > If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 successive > > Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause it to > > repeal itself) with Notice. > > > > > > > > >> On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 7:44 AM Kerim Aydin wrote: > >> > >> > >> > >> I submit the following Proposal, The Ritual, AI-1: > >> > > >> > >> Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following > >> text: > >> > >> Any player CAN perform The Ritual by announcement. In order > to > >> appease this Rule, at least one player MUST perform The > Ritual in > >> every Agoran week. > >> > >> If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 successive > >> Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause it > to > >> repeal itself) with Notice. > >> > >> > > >> > >
Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Re: testing collective punishment
Obviously, I'm just talking in hypotheticals. On 2019-02-16 09:55, Aris Merchant wrote: No one is doing anything that has any meaningful chance of destroying Agora. If there’s a bug in your mechanism, the stakes go from it being broken to the game dying permanently. -Aris On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:52 PM Madeline wrote: "If this Rule's power exceeds 4.0, then all other rules notwithstanding, Agora is destroyed." (Would any other rule need to actually change for such a clause to work if an outside Power 3 rule is adjusting its power?) On 2019-02-16 09:47, D. Margaux wrote: Love it. You could have a separate power 3 rule that (1) changes the power of the Ritual rule and (2) causes itself to be repealed when the Ritual rule is repealed. And I’d love to see the power of the Ritual rule increase, too, if the Rule is left unappeased... and maybe increase at a higher rate than it can be decreased? On Feb 15, 2019, at 5:12 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: Actually I've been pondering something even fancier, like every time it's appeased it decreases in Power and the Power is linked to the Consent required. Or something. (of course you can't increase power in the same way). On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:08 PM D. Margaux wrote: Any chance we can have it repeal with Agoran Consent or something more than notice? Or is that excessive? :-) On Feb 15, 2019, at 3:41 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: Actually, one more time. Empty sacrifices are meaningless. I withdraw my proposal, The Ritual. I submit the following proposal, Ritual Sacrifice, AI-1: Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following text: Any player CAN perform The Ritual by paying a fee of 7 Coins, thus appeasing this Rule for a single instant. This Rule MUST be appeased at least once in every Agoran week. If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 successive Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause it to repeal itself) with Notice. On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 12:12 PM Kerim Aydin wrote: I withdraw the proposal I recently submitted, quoted below. I submit the following Proposal, The Ritual, AI-1: Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following text: Any player CAN perform The Ritual by announcement, thus appeasing this Rule for a single instant. This Rule MUST be appeased at least once in every Agoran week. If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 successive Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause it to repeal itself) with Notice. On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 7:44 AM Kerim Aydin wrote: I submit the following Proposal, The Ritual, AI-1: Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following text: Any player CAN perform The Ritual by announcement. In order to appease this Rule, at least one player MUST perform The Ritual in every Agoran week. If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 successive Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause it to repeal itself) with Notice.
Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Re: testing collective punishment
No one is doing anything that has any meaningful chance of destroying Agora. If there’s a bug in your mechanism, the stakes go from it being broken to the game dying permanently. -Aris On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:52 PM Madeline wrote: > "If this Rule's power exceeds 4.0, then all other rules notwithstanding, > Agora is destroyed." > (Would any other rule need to actually change for such a clause to work > if an outside Power 3 rule is adjusting its power?) > > On 2019-02-16 09:47, D. Margaux wrote: > > Love it. > > > > You could have a separate power 3 rule that (1) changes the power of the > Ritual rule and (2) causes itself to be repealed when the Ritual rule is > repealed. > > > > And I’d love to see the power of the Ritual rule increase, too, if the > Rule is left unappeased... and maybe increase at a higher rate than it can > be decreased? > > > >> On Feb 15, 2019, at 5:12 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: > >> > >> Actually I've been pondering something even fancier, like every time > >> it's appeased it decreases in Power and the Power is linked to the > >> Consent required. Or something. (of course you can't increase power > >> in the same way). > >> > >>> On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:08 PM D. Margaux > wrote: > >>> > >>> Any chance we can have it repeal with Agoran Consent or something more > than notice? Or is that excessive? :-) > >>> > On Feb 15, 2019, at 3:41 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: > > Actually, one more time. Empty sacrifices are meaningless. > > I withdraw my proposal, The Ritual. > > I submit the following proposal, Ritual Sacrifice, AI-1: > > > > Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following > text: > > Any player CAN perform The Ritual by paying a fee of 7 Coins, > thus appeasing > this Rule for a single instant. This Rule MUST be appeased at > least once > in every Agoran week. > > If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 successive > Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause it to > repeal itself) with Notice. > > > > > > > On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 12:12 PM Kerim Aydin wrote: > > > > I withdraw the proposal I recently submitted, quoted below. > > > > I submit the following Proposal, The Ritual, AI-1: > > > > > > > Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following > > text: > > > > Any player CAN perform The Ritual by announcement, thus > appeasing > > this Rule for a single instant. This Rule MUST be appeased at > least once > > in every Agoran week. > > > > If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 successive > > Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause it to > > repeal itself) with Notice. > > > > > > > > >> On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 7:44 AM Kerim Aydin wrote: > >> > >> > >> > >> I submit the following Proposal, The Ritual, AI-1: > >> > > >> > >> Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following > >> text: > >> > >> Any player CAN perform The Ritual by announcement. In order > to > >> appease this Rule, at least one player MUST perform The > Ritual in > >> every Agoran week. > >> > >> If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 successive > >> Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause it > to > >> repeal itself) with Notice. > >> > >> > > >> > >
Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Re: testing collective punishment
"If this Rule's power exceeds 4.0, then all other rules notwithstanding, Agora is destroyed." (Would any other rule need to actually change for such a clause to work if an outside Power 3 rule is adjusting its power?) On 2019-02-16 09:47, D. Margaux wrote: Love it. You could have a separate power 3 rule that (1) changes the power of the Ritual rule and (2) causes itself to be repealed when the Ritual rule is repealed. And I’d love to see the power of the Ritual rule increase, too, if the Rule is left unappeased... and maybe increase at a higher rate than it can be decreased? On Feb 15, 2019, at 5:12 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: Actually I've been pondering something even fancier, like every time it's appeased it decreases in Power and the Power is linked to the Consent required. Or something. (of course you can't increase power in the same way). On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:08 PM D. Margaux wrote: Any chance we can have it repeal with Agoran Consent or something more than notice? Or is that excessive? :-) On Feb 15, 2019, at 3:41 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: Actually, one more time. Empty sacrifices are meaningless. I withdraw my proposal, The Ritual. I submit the following proposal, Ritual Sacrifice, AI-1: Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following text: Any player CAN perform The Ritual by paying a fee of 7 Coins, thus appeasing this Rule for a single instant. This Rule MUST be appeased at least once in every Agoran week. If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 successive Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause it to repeal itself) with Notice. On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 12:12 PM Kerim Aydin wrote: I withdraw the proposal I recently submitted, quoted below. I submit the following Proposal, The Ritual, AI-1: Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following text: Any player CAN perform The Ritual by announcement, thus appeasing this Rule for a single instant. This Rule MUST be appeased at least once in every Agoran week. If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 successive Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause it to repeal itself) with Notice. On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 7:44 AM Kerim Aydin wrote: I submit the following Proposal, The Ritual, AI-1: Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following text: Any player CAN perform The Ritual by announcement. In order to appease this Rule, at least one player MUST perform The Ritual in every Agoran week. If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 successive Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause it to repeal itself) with Notice.
Re: DIS: Re: BUS: Re: testing collective punishment
Actually I've been pondering something even fancier, like every time it's appeased it decreases in Power and the Power is linked to the Consent required. Or something. (of course you can't increase power in the same way). On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 2:08 PM D. Margaux wrote: > > Any chance we can have it repeal with Agoran Consent or something more than > notice? Or is that excessive? :-) > > > On Feb 15, 2019, at 3:41 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: > > > > Actually, one more time. Empty sacrifices are meaningless. > > > > I withdraw my proposal, The Ritual. > > > > I submit the following proposal, Ritual Sacrifice, AI-1: > > > > > > Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following > > text: > > > > Any player CAN perform The Ritual by paying a fee of 7 Coins, > > thus appeasing > > this Rule for a single instant. This Rule MUST be appeased at least > > once > > in every Agoran week. > > > > If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 successive > > Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause it to > > repeal itself) with Notice. > > > > > > > > > >> On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 12:12 PM Kerim Aydin wrote: > >> > >> I withdraw the proposal I recently submitted, quoted below. > >> > >> I submit the following Proposal, The Ritual, AI-1: > >> > >> > >> Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following > >> text: > >> > >> Any player CAN perform The Ritual by announcement, thus appeasing > >> this Rule for a single instant. This Rule MUST be appeased at least > >> once > >> in every Agoran week. > >> > >> If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 successive > >> Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause it to > >> repeal itself) with Notice. > >> > >> > >> > >>> On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 7:44 AM Kerim Aydin wrote: > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> I submit the following Proposal, The Ritual, AI-1: > >>> > >>> > >>> Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following > >>> text: > >>> > >>> Any player CAN perform The Ritual by announcement. In order to > >>> appease this Rule, at least one player MUST perform The Ritual in > >>> every Agoran week. > >>> > >>> If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 successive > >>> Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause it to > >>> repeal itself) with Notice. > >>> > >>> > >>>
DIS: Re: BUS: Re: testing collective punishment
Any chance we can have it repeal with Agoran Consent or something more than notice? Or is that excessive? :-) > On Feb 15, 2019, at 3:41 PM, Kerim Aydin wrote: > > Actually, one more time. Empty sacrifices are meaningless. > > I withdraw my proposal, The Ritual. > > I submit the following proposal, Ritual Sacrifice, AI-1: > > > Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following > text: > > Any player CAN perform The Ritual by paying a fee of 7 Coins, > thus appeasing > this Rule for a single instant. This Rule MUST be appeased at least > once > in every Agoran week. > > If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 successive > Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause it to > repeal itself) with Notice. > > > > >> On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 12:12 PM Kerim Aydin wrote: >> >> I withdraw the proposal I recently submitted, quoted below. >> >> I submit the following Proposal, The Ritual, AI-1: >> >> >> Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following >> text: >> >> Any player CAN perform The Ritual by announcement, thus appeasing >> this Rule for a single instant. This Rule MUST be appeased at least >> once >> in every Agoran week. >> >> If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 successive >> Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause it to >> repeal itself) with Notice. >> >> >> >>> On Fri, Feb 15, 2019 at 7:44 AM Kerim Aydin wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> I submit the following Proposal, The Ritual, AI-1: >>> >>> >>> Create a Rule entitled "The Ritual", Power-0.5, with the following >>> text: >>> >>> Any player CAN perform The Ritual by announcement. In order to >>> appease this Rule, at least one player MUST perform The Ritual in >>> every Agoran week. >>> >>> If this rule has been appeased by The Ritual in 5 successive >>> Agoran weeks, then any player CAN banish this rule (cause it to >>> repeal itself) with Notice. >>> >>> >>>
